LS3 Hits 393cfm I Found the Issue The Internet Ports heads Part 8

I found out what was holding back the test head. I give information on what I found.

[@TurboJohn74]

The fact you're willing to help us learn and share new discoveries.... Priceless! Don't get rattled by the 12 trolls. The rest of us are immensely appreciative and thankful. Keep up the airflow Lord's work.

[@Garmoo5600]

Info like this is usually kept to the family

[@BillyP-49Chevy]

Well I'm glad if I miss something I just contact turbo John on his channel. Lol. All you guys help out, thank you.

[@Between2Turns]

Lessons learned while pounding your head on your workbench tend to stick around. I’m glad you found what was causing the inconsistencies you encountered. I also hope you realize the value in what you’re doing with this video series. Thank you.

[@theshed8802]

Hi Eric. I've been following this series with great interest, and loving it. I used to build a lot of Cleveland's years ago. Ford used to flycut the cylinder walls under the intake valve. I used to increase the size of that flycut as much as I dared because I always thought that it would improve airflow due to reduced valve shrouding. No science involved back then, no flow bench, just best guess by someone who didn't know a fraction of what he does now. Seeing this video really made me smile. Thanks for publishing it. Thanks for the time and effort that you put into making these. Many thanks from Perth, Western Australia. Regards Greg

[@terryenyart5838]

Excellent fillow-up Eric and should make everyone realize it's not just flow, but multiple factors that make or break engine performance. A head, port volume, port velocity, chamber size, chamber modifications, bore size, bore wall modifications, piston to chamber clearance, ring height, cam selection, cam timing, Intake type, compression ratio and more all need to be developed to get maximum efficiencies & performance. Great learning tool for everyone! Thank you Terry

[@FreakOlds]

Another educational video Eric. Thanks, I’m always open to learning more. Keep them coming 😃👍

[@WXSTANG]

Who would have thought bore size!? Crazy! Cool find my man!

[@Hjfvvdst]

Thank you for all the great information. It sure helps not to spend time discovering what someone else has spent time discovering, the good and bad. Again thanks a million

[@lukeboehmer5790]

I think this is the first video I’ve seen of yours…. You put out some good info… thanks for everything u do keep up the good work my man 👍👍👍

[@stevenbean9706]

some of the best are long gone joe mondello jake king was more of an engine builder but was amazing with heads bob glidden knew heads did a lot of his own stuff I spent a lot of money learning from joe mondello he offered courses and i took advantage ive been told i should have had many many more opportunities than i had but never pushed to put my name out there. i will tell you concentrating on just the ports is not the only thing an exceptional porter will look at ! you do very clean work which is why i like the channel. a head will also perform when other factors are added , coolant flow , oil flow , valvetrain geometry and weight reduction the list is long !

[@johnparrish9215]

Man, would I ever love those ports and chamber on a head that fits a 440 Mopar block.

[@stevemcinnis4794]

440s respond well with valve relieving the chamber's and cylinders.

[@jamest.5001]

I was wondering if anyone angle cut LS heads like they used to SBC heads, the dirt trackers would angle cut the piss out the heads, when stock heads had to be used, a few ran basically stock bottom ends, with the heads cut , raising compression to about 13:1+, who knows what they did, they were pushing stock parts about as far as they could go! I can't wait to see where this goes..

[@rustysausage69]

Keep in mind the stock valve angle of a SBC is 22 or 23 and 18 can be considered by some as a "race" angle, and the stock valve angle of the LS is 15 (12 for LS7) so its not very common since LS is (loosely speaking) a "factory race" small block chevy, but I digress. Trickflow/AFR/Blueprint engines offer LS heads in 12 and 13 degree, and there are "race" heads offered by MAST Motorsports and Frankenstein Engine Dynamics that are 8/10 degree.

[@BruceLee-xn3nn]

David Vizard has alot of info on just about everything. I bought his books YEARS ago.

[@wheels2199]

Thanks again for a great video and explanation on how and what you did. I can honestly say that I have learned more about cylinder heads buy watching your videos than any books or forums could ever teach me. I’d like to to send you my BBC heads if you are available and willing to take on more work. You are very humble and honest and I think that’s what puts you way above others in the Industry. Thanks again for taking the time. Eddie wheels 😬🧑🏻‍🦽👍.

[@WeingartnerRacing]

I can take those on not a big deal.

[@flinch622]

Thanks for the proof... I guess I always intuitively understood it was important to get combustion chamber edge to cylinder reasonably matched [avoiding a mushroom like fill situation], but those numbers are huge.

[@peterfairlane2065]

Great video ,I like them all . Lots of good info . And we all know that everyone is an expert behind the keyboard . High 5

[@AmirPomen]

I would like you see u weld up the combustion chamber and reshape it to be flush with small bore... So it doesnt have any ledge/lips stepping distrubting the airflow...

[@disolejunk]

I like the way you state it. And the Elite, they say engine too, not motor

[@disolejunk]

Because they know it's an engine under that head

[@robhudson6133]

Love your work have a great day Thankyou for your time

[@jonsetzer9556]

The AFR head has the intake valve location moved closer to the exhaust for that reason I think so that it works better on the smaller bore

[@jakewade7388]

Why do companies make their chambers larger than the bore size? You would think if it is called a LS3 head, the chamber would be no larger than 4.065

[@WeingartnerRacing]

It is Chinese so most of the time they don’t follow logic.

[@V8Lenny]

@@WeingartnerRacing but I think those heads are ordered from chinese by americans so they should know ?

[@bobgyetvai9444]

Use a offset dowl and move the head . Driverside forward , passenger side rearward . Free space not being used to help flow . Id gladly sacrifice some exhaust for intake gain .

[@BillyP-49Chevy]

So so true. I was racing ATVs two-stroke back in the day and had someone port my cylinders. Well my sponsor ripped apart my motor to work on the bottom end and he asked me who on earth did the cylinders cuz he had never seen anything like it in his life and he was very curious why my banshee ran like a four stroke....... It's the one you don't hear of are the ones that do incredible work. No offense to you sir.

[@robertbreese5952]

You should try a 4.065 bore or notch the top of the 4.030 bore adapter to see a more real world salutation to the chamber miss match

[@nurburgringdreaming2221]

Eric is alright.

[@timarnott4483]

Hey Eric, Tim here, ANGLE MILL THEM BITCHES!!.....i'm curious as hell to find your results......again, another EXCELLENT tech vid......(miss the racin stuff on a Sunday) but AWESOME nonetheless!!........know i have been a follower long enuf to know you wont devulge certain things (which u shudn't) and are humble enuf to say, "hey, i aint the best"........anybody that thinks you have it all figured out, is foolish......it takes MUCH more than folks realize to port/flow a head....1 more,:...THANK YOU for stating that flow isnt everything!!!......flow is needed, but there are other factors involved in creating a good head......TY Sir!!....BOY i dig ur channel..TY Sir again!!.....

[@robertjenkins6996]

Great video. I'm subscribed!

[@johnparrish9215]

Hey, give your Son a pat on the back from all of us.

[@WeingartnerRacing]

Will do thanks.

[@middleclassthrash]

Ls heads always be lookin at you like you just did something that left them shocked and horrified.

[@cjbert6790]

Yeah man, no matter how good the port is, in-line valve heads are always hampered by valve shrouding! It’s good that you figured it out before you ruined that great port.

[@johndienst3194]

Just wondering if you relieve the block like GM did with the 396. Granted they did it for valve to bore clearance but would it help this situation on a 4.030 bore ? Just a thought 💭

[@gavmorgan1846]

Hi Eric thanks so much for sharing . How does the small port short side pinch compare to the throat cross section , is it smaller , if so by much ? As always really looking forward to the next video.

[@stuffandjunkandthings364]

I would love to see how that head would react to a smaller intake valve (i realize that is not feasible- so i'm just thinking out loud here). Same port volume, just scaled down intake. My thought being that there would have to be a "happy place" wherein you gain high lift flow without sacrificing too much in the lower lift area. I know, I'm an idiot lol, no need to point it out. Also, Great to hear that in this age of "me me me", that teamwork and esprit de corps are still being taught. Congrats on your son's team.

[@ToddWright2]

There is a thread on Speedtalk that might interest you. Threat title: LS3 Carbed build. The builder coaxed 2 hp/ci using a bunch of stock parts and reduced the intake valve diameter while epoxy-filling the intake ports. It might be instructive.

[@stuffandjunkandthings364]

@@ToddWright2 Thank you. I will check that out

[@WeingartnerRacing]

Most of the time I’m all about larger intake valves but this might be a situation where smaller valves would be better. Better thing would be to move the intake valve over.

[@ts302]

Great work as always Eric! A few question about the valve shrouding issue -could one bias the port flow away from the cylinder wall -as suggested in another comment, if notching the top of the cylinder bore would help -same issues with cylinder wall shrouding on the exhaust valve flow With respect to the epoxy filled port -how high did you raise the short side -what is the relationship between the port's roof to floor-tapered or symmetrical Thank you Tony

[@shoominati23]

You might have to notch the bore or head just like Chrysler did on the Max Wedge engines

[@frankrenda2519]

good job eric .

[@almcroberts8366]

Why is your plate only an inch? I've seen some flow benches that the bore sleeve was like 4 to 6 inches deep. I also know that unshrouding a valve needs to be .100 minimum clearance. Seems like you really know what you're doing and like you've pointed out in this video we can always overlook things.

[@timtaylor6147]

So a smaller valve better shape port with attending smaller chamber that FITS THE BORE SIZE will make more power for any given lift So use a head that fits the bore ! Guys look at the notch on big Chevy and some Pontiac and scratch their head

[@th600mike3]

Can you do some chamber softening on the short side? Like soften it up to the edge of the bore? And flow this same head on a stock ls3 bore size? I have always been curious if chamber softening could help unshroud the valve. I know it reduces compression, but I just want to know. I figure you’re not interested in trying a small valve in there. I still would like to try a 2.1” intake.

[@cfmechanic]

This video is great. I have been asking how heads will flow on a larger bore. This is good news for me cuz my dragon slayers are on a 4.175 bore

[@johndienst3194]

Excellent observation sir. You are the best at sharing your discovery’s. Wondering what would happen if you soften them chambers ? Excellent video. 👍

[@natelsx]

Prob wont be seen but do you have any opinions on the trickflow 255 ? Im a head porter my self and after running a set of ported ls3 heads i splurged and bought some trickflows. Im wanting to mill them to get the compression up also. On a stock shortblock.

[@misterbutterfinger]

Eric, thank you for the insights, really appreciate the effort. The big block Chevy had notches carved into the cylinder bores where shrouding became more intrusive. Do you think these would help with some of the current platforms? Especially on smaller bore engines.

[@disfordiesel8219]

On your filled runner, how does it compare to an ls7 for height? From deck surface to the bottom of the port. I really like this series, Keep it going.

[@WeingartnerRacing]

I will check.

[@davidreed6070]

BBC's have that problem on the intake side, with the 4.31.bore size. I would bevel the cylinder above the ring landing. You bet you can.

[@WeingartnerRacing]

I can but I use this plate for heads that notching is not necessary so I don’t want to mess the plate up.

[@davidreed6070]

@@WeingartnerRacing no you would not notch your plate but I used to notch the block and it was noticeable

[@timtaylor6147]

So with limited bore spacing on LS offset bore the cylinders as much as possible the pin offset in that respect won't be a ton and you can get better intake flow with a larger valve Does Mast sell a LS head w moved intake valves ?

[@richardgutteridge2127]

Awesome work mate.

[@daveb1870]

So if you add say a .050 gasket then what happens?

[@Levisnteeshirt1]

Would an angle mill fix the shrouding ? To tilt the valve away from the cyl wall ? You answered my question on through the video ,, lol

[@Fatt-billy.racing]

If you look at Frankenstein ls3 heads they show to use a 4.060 plate so if you have a stock bore block you will not get the flow they say.

[@AndyGeesGarage]

Very interesting info. Now I’m going to run out to the garage and measure the bore size of my nee heads lol 🤦‍♂️never even considered that when I bought them DOH! Oh and here’s a dumb question …could you use a slightly smaller valve but one that will still seal on the seat to open up the clearance to the bore? Like jus skim a bit off the edge of the valve without making the seat too narrow.

[@benhowe2087]

I wonder if a smaller intake valve would work better on the smaller bore?

[@robertheymann5906]

Thanks professor

[@WeingartnerRacing]

No problem

[@davidreed6070]

I've noticed that, on BBC s I bevel the top of the bore. I wonder if an offset dowel to jog the head would be the cure.does the head need to go away from the intake side and up toward the intake manifold

[@Alexslo1k]

So how's the stock ls3 head? My car has an l76 which is ls3 heads on a 4.0 bore. I want to get my heads ported but now I'm curious if they are too bottle necked

[@almcroberts8366]

Why not just can't the valve as a whole? I mean plug the guide boss and drill it at an angle and then machine the seat to match,heck it would probably take only a few degrees for a big jump in flow.

[@johndevries8759]

Thanks for telling us the facts, also interesting that not all heads benefit from the larger bore size. One off topic question I have that maybe you can answer: after welding up a cylinder head to repair a dropped valve, do you have to heat treat it to get the material hardness back to stock? If so, who does this and how is it done? Thanks again.

[@jesslackey1003]

Would you consider taking the Quincy area out to turn one into an open chamber versus a closed chamber with a 155 bore

[@bdugle1]

More great info, thanks!

[@stephanekerouack6171]

When are they Gonna make oval guided intake valve

[@paytonmac5665]

Big Thanks

[@Apachefog]

So is there a solution to this or is it just get different heads with a narrower combustion chamber?

[@billythebake]

Are offset dowels available to fit the LS? Seems to me that you might pick up more on the intake than you lose on the exhaust...

[@rustysausage69]

You'd have to make them. Never seen or heard of it done or someone wanting it done. The LS3 head was not really designed for a bore less than 4.065", and depending on who you talk to, the shrouding "issues" of the large valves are gone with that bore or larger.

[@garyprice9895]

Offset dowels are easy to make and typically have .030" shift before the head bolt gets tough to to install/remove.. Great idea by the carfarmer!

[@cdshawn]

I see we both like Walmart brake clean

[@paulseabrook8179]

It would be interesting to know how much air is passed during the nanosecond the intake valve is opened?

[@V8Lenny]

A little bit more than cylinder volume if engine is done right.

[@paulseabrook8179]

@@V8Lenny at 6000 rpm, how long you think intake is open

[@V8Lenny]

@@paulseabrook8179 maybe 0.02 seconds ?

[@paulseabrook8179]

@@V8Lenny doesn't seem long enough to fill .7125 liter tube. (350 cu/in) watch video of valve train, that movement is quicker than you can blink.

[@V8Lenny]

@@paulseabrook8179 air is quick. Volumetric efficiency numbers can be as high as 127% , 20000rpm F1 engines were something like 124%

[@BillyP-49Chevy]

Eric Eric Eric, Mr. W. If you feel you have ruined those heads you can gladly ship them to me for my LS LQ4. Sure I would help you out and get them off the shelves to create space for you. 😊

[@WeingartnerRacing]

This head was given to a viewer years ago.

[@AWBElectrical]

Taking a step from what you were inferring, would it be safe to assume that the porting process for a port injected application is different to a carbureted application? Also in an manifold airflow limited engine would there be a good argument to fill the port in as long as the head does not become the limiting factor? Sorry, final question what is your camera and mic setup?

[@WeingartnerRacing]

There might be a sight difference but that is really dependent on where the injector is placed. I think the port size is dependent of rpm and engine size. I’m just using the. Mic from the phone.

[@AWBElectrical]

Thank you very much for the reply. Please don’t change the way you present your videos. I absolutely love your videos. They present in a raw, honest way which is lost with many people in today’s pc society.

[@yellowmalibudude]

Can’t beat a good fb toon

[@justinw6448]

I fucking love these videos!

[@CRUSHFACTORPC]

Yes use it on a larger bore

[@TheProchargedmopar]

Out of curiosity. what all formal training have you had that helped in getting you to the level you're currently at as a head porter? Or maybe what training do you feel was the most productive? 👍💪

[@jackwillson8099]

There only two school for hesd porting ,how too flow test! David vizard & joe Mondello & joe passed away some year back one week he can show you 45 years of tricks!

[@riflemanjim]

Do you really run many cams at 0.900" lift?

[@WeingartnerRacing]

Yes. .937

[@RyTrapp0]

@@WeingartnerRacing "I like my lift the way I like my lifters" LOL

[@evanarthur7535]

Does your fixture have a slight chamfer at the top to simulate the engine block bore chamfer?

[@WeingartnerRacing]

Very slight.

[@littlewarlock9361]

I have looked at your videos over and over to learn. With that being, what happened to your motors from the engine master's challenge? Did you ever put that 406 from engine master's challenge in any of your vehicles?

[@WeingartnerRacing]

The 406 was sold it went in a truck that ran low 11s. It’s in for a freshen up. The 540 went into the Camaro and ran 5.76 in 1/8th. The 477 was sold to Jose and it will not see a car for years if I was guessing.

[@samstewart4807]

sooooooooooo, why cnt you relocate the cyl. head on the block?

[@stevemcinnis4794]

Valve relief the cylinder or your plate and test.

[@zAvAvAz]

hahahahah yes the internet ports heads! lol. so cooL. Just redrill the intake valve tubes and point them as necessary. LoL. Just revise their valve angles for them and fix the whole entire heads! no biggy! LoL. Hey at that point the head would be 30% different and you could make a copy and sell a head design entierly by you. Hahahahahah. so cooL Eric.

[@jacobmoore1757]

Silly question .....what does a guy do about putting a head like ghis on a 5.3 that isn't a 4.0 bore?

[@Dane33781]

Does anyone in here know Walter Lester? He's a head porter I know in the Tampa Bay area.

[@bowsertownes]

Try offsetting the dowel hole??

[@jasongeorge8523]

Could you remove the valve guide and boss so it is not a restriction. Be very interested to see if it's worth the extra valve guide wear.

[@123nova87]

Can you please do dart pro1 215cc 2.05 intake and how much cfm of air you can get those up too ???

[@craigrowe9713]

Is the issue with the chamber why they picked up when you moved the inside?

[@jacksonbermingham2168]

How much does head temperature and intake manifold temp mess with flow obviously you want cold fuel and air charge but if your running 91

[@joshcarman2664]

I’ve never seen your camaro. Can you do a video on your cars?

[@joshcarman2664]

Your combinations and what class you like to race

[@WeingartnerRacing]

It’s in a couple of videos. It’s been a year since I took it out.

[@jacksonbermingham2168]

big noter obviously missed the moto of your channel .. it was inevitable that this would happen to be had . the face angles of the head will be intresting not so much the slanted head i find that maybe a huge was of time unless it for the speed way series where they cut down 350 chevs in to 4 cylinder engines

[@rbarger71]

Would using a head gasket more accurately simulate flow numbers vs none at all?

[@WeingartnerRacing]

I use a head gasket while flowing the head.

[@Giftied]

im assuming you want the chamber the same size as the bore or smaller than?

[@WeingartnerRacing]

Yes

[@johnmorris5834]

An Ls 3 has a 4.065 bore John Morris

[@WeingartnerRacing]

Yes I wish I had a 4.065 bore but at $600 for the adapters to flow it. I can’t justify the cost. The chambers measure 4.090 wide on this flowtek.

[@pacomccray4997]

Keep it going ....Dark Matter from YB 👍 Darin calls filling the runner and making it better a Max port... Eric filled the runner and saw 400 on a 3.9xx bore. Again 👍

[@killsalot78]

flow numbers are really what matters the most for performance. A poorly made cylinder head might have other complications like cooling issues, structural integrity, uncorrectable geometry, but these are not factors truly relating to performance per se. as a tuner flow is really all you should be caring about for the most part.

[@V8Lenny]

Dont think so , you can make a port that flows very big numbers on flowbench but runs like crap in real life.

[@killsalot78]

@@V8Lenny no, thats simply not how flow works. You can have a port that flows bad at low lift and great at high lift. This will affect the power curve but it doesn't affect what peak power will be. The entire flow range is what matters, engines are a simple reaction that depends on air and fuel. If you can suck more air/fuel into the cylinder, you get more power. flow is literally 1:1 with performance.

[@V8Lenny]

@@killsalot78 but flowbench numbers are not real world , not even close.

[@killsalot78]

​@@V8Lenny flow bench is assuming the optimal displacement, intake, exhaust, and valve lift/duration. Just like displacement is directly correlated to how much power is possible for an engine in natural aspiration, flow is directly correlated to how much power can be made. Yes, other factors can impact the total flow throughput, but a good flowing head is never a bad thing. I mean, we're talking about LS'es here, the two valve pushrod engines that lived two decades beyond any other, because of their head flow. Most manufacturers just use more valves to increase flow, but chevy went the harder route and optimized OEM head performance and it paid off. Flow is what actually matter for a head, flow might not be the most important thing for the whole engine.

[@V8Lenny]

@@killsalot78 yes, flow matters but flowbench can not show it. You can make too big ports and open up chambers and it flows big numbers on flowbench but runs like crap in real life.

[@CRUSHFACTORPC]

Notice how KZbin doesn't show you dislikes anymore.. I enjoyed KZbin for years but I will be ecstatic when they are replaced.

[@WeingartnerRacing]

You don’t need that dislike. There is no need for negative affirmation. I like the idea that if you don’t like something it is ok to just not do or say something. I guess because I lived in a time where people didn’t vocally complain about everything. You tube is not going anywhere for long content.

[@paulz2641]

David vizard is the best Bv

[@WeingartnerRacing]

No

[@jackwillson8099]

Lol so true remember get all the good flow numbers lol & the port speed was shit lol when first test on the bench this will happen , then you learn how too fix

[@bobstiegemeier223]

year 2014

[@timothybayliss6680]

Its almost like its worth having a 260cc intake port now.

[@laytonturpin6957]

What do I need to do, and what do you need for me to send my heads to you?

[@WeingartnerRacing]

Give me a call at 918-520-3480 and we can discuss things.

[@jaciduartedesantanaduarte1134]

Não entendo essa mzr

[@bigredracer7848]

50👍's up Eric

[@imnotahealthandsafetyperso4889]

Great video your soon be in 2022 lol