MACHINE SHOP TIPS #99 Aligning Lathe Centers TEST BAR METHOD tubalcain

Tubalcain aligns the centers on an ATLAS lathe using the "test bar method".

[@jimao22]

MrPete, you are an (inter)national treasure! Believe me, you are one to few millions on youtube with your extraordinary tutorials. I have a new milling machine and a new lathe and because I did not worked on something like this for more than 30 years, your videos helped me to fast forward learn back everything I forgot. Thank you for your kindness and your time! jimao (from Romania)

[@newstart49]

I wish I could teach as you do. It is truly a gift to be able to relate to the work and the people observing and learning at the same time and do it with a calm and easy to understand personality. When I am done watching your videos, I'm left with very few, if any, questions. I do believe you are becoming an icon for many.

[@KeithDDowning]

Thanks Tubalcain. I follow you and Keith Fenner regularly. Keep them coming.

[@billdlv]

That little holder you made for the dial indicator is a great idea. I would like to see a video how to make an accurate test bar, we don't have one. I was going to make one like you cast but instead weld larger pieces to a shaft. Thanks for the videos!

[@NOBOX7]

i sent that comment just before it popped in corner regarding paralax, thanks for the videos your info is gold, i would have never even thought to check a tale stock because im self tought

[@motormaker]

I agree Keith's videos and tech are top notch. There are also two videos by "basement shop guy" where he restores a 9inch south bend and a heavy 10. His lathe restorations are works of art.

[@JB-ol4vz]

Very well explained, I will be going down to my Storebro lathe to morrow morning. Thanks Mr.

[@not2fast4u2c]

I watch Keith and Shop Dog All their Videos are Great Thanks for mentioning Them !!! I've Watched Many of yours some several times

[@LLAHTI1]

Best most simple video on alignment ever!! Thanks

[@mrpete222]

Thanks

[@StanErvin-yo9vl]

​@@mrpete222 I put a lot of trust in a last word. Clean surfaces with a green Scotch Brite ™. And test without even cutting.

[@fall22123]

We made test bars in trade school. We turned ground them between centers on a cylindrical grinder. They had a larger diameter on each end and the ends had precision tapers ground on them for some reason. We had to inspect them on bench centers when we were done. They had to be perfectly straight and zero runout. To be honest, It's been in the bottom drawer of my toolbox all these years and I've only used it once or twice. I agree about Keith Fenner's page. He is really go at a lot of things.

[@MrGoosePit]

I've been enjoying myfordboy for quite awhile. Thanks for sharing the others with us. I will check them out promptly!

[@cut4weld]

Glad you endorse Keith Fenner. Between the two of you we see the theory and the actual job.

[@SlowEarl1]

glad to see you back love your informative videos.Thanks for taking the time to share your knowledge.

[@aryesegal1988]

Nice to see you're back with some more videos, Mr. Pete... :) Keep up the great work and thanks for all the information you're sharing with us..!

[@trainman4602]

Hi Pete Thanks for including me in with such great you tubers. I do enjoy making them. I enjoy doing machine work but I have some problems standing in front of the machine for long periods. Bad feet. I recently purchased a cnc lathe Yes I did in spite of my many comments about how I don’t like them. I really do and I do enjoy all the new technology. So, Many thanks again and I’ll make a point to visit you on my next trip west Sincerely Dave the Trainman4602

[@UnbeltedSundew]

Hehe I was just about to point out the camera parallax when your notation poped up. Thanks for the video :) I am among those that would like to see the test bar too.

[@199greg0]

Yes please for making a test bar. Many thanks for the videos Tubalcain

[@47marwynne]

Thanks for the video. I have a cheap Chinese lathe 9-20. I am not a machinist, just an ex electrician. It explains some problems I have been having. Going to do a check on my Chinese Lathe. Keep up the good! I also enjoyed the pulley video.

[@mrpete222]

Thanks Keith. I'm still working my way thru yours. Many of my early ones are short (before they allowed the long ones). You have tackled some repair jobs that are way beyond me--especially liked the JD one. Like your shop & your photography. Leep those chips flying. pete

[@steadyeddie7453]

Hi Mr Pete, for those who just purchased a used lathe I would suggest they indicate the headstocks dead center before even installing the test bar. Then add the test bar to put some pressure on the spindle and re-indicate the dead center by rotating the spindle to look for runout. This will indicate (pun intended) if there is a problem with the spindle, spindle bearings, or dead center. Without this test first, it may be as you would say " all for naught." Keep up the great videos.

[@Metalunique]

Thanx for sharin' this! Nothin' like learnin' from the old school!

[@gilgameshismist]

Myfordboy is a genius with metal casting, I really like his work. The other one I still have to check out.

[@dirtyharry793]

Thanks for the tip. I was just doing this today. Had to turn down my dead center and achieved 0.0005" TIR on my old 1942 10" Logan before I started with the test. The inside 3MT bore on the head stock only had < 0.0002" TIR. This is after 70 years! You can't beat old American technology. Can you show all how to make a lathe test bar? P.S. you are a great teacher! I am learning from you.

[@richardjantz7325]

Mr. Pete I know that I am very late to make a comment on this video of yours. You are very sharp at what you do. Now I have found a very fast way to align the tail stock with the lathe chuck at dead center totally without a test bar. I use an 5C er 40 collet chuck and in the tail stock I use a morse taper 3 end mill holder with a.500 dowel rod. Move the tail stock up to the 5c er40 collet chuck that has a 5c er 40 collet with a.500 hole dia., then adjust the tail stock screws until the dowel rod moves freely in and out of the hole with no interfearance. You will know when you hit dead center and feel absolutely nothing by moving the tail stock back and forth. Now then run a test piece and check your T.I.R. Now i was very shocked at the results when i put a test indacater on it and got a .0002 T.I.R. on the test piece!!!!

[@mrpete222]

Thank you very much, that is a great method

[@GK1918]

Im glad you like Keith Fenner who is not to far from me.

[@KeithFenner]

Hi Mr. Pete, Thank you for the special comments on the few channels at the beginning of your video and including my channel! I admit I have not watched all of your videos but rank your channel in the top of my favorites and respect your talents, not just craftsmanship, it’s also the depth of classroom facts you include in your videos. I had a couple requested videos, like flat belt lacing and need to review yours, before creating one myself. I think the test bar video idea is Cool! :)

[@geraldbeckham92]

I guess im asking the wrong place but does anybody know a tool to log back into an Instagram account?? I was dumb lost the login password. I appreciate any tricks you can offer me.

[@princetonlucian802]

@Gerald Beckham instablaster =)

[@geraldbeckham92]

@Princeton Lucian I really appreciate your reply. I found the site thru google and im waiting for the hacking stuff atm. I see it takes quite some time so I will get back to you later with my results.

[@geraldbeckham92]

@Princeton Lucian it worked and I now got access to my account again. I'm so happy! Thank you so much you saved my account!

[@princetonlucian802]

@Gerald Beckham glad I could help =)

[@jamcat62]

great vid. I appreciate you shareing your knowledge! I recently bought my 1st lathe. and will soon (hopefully) be making accurately cut parts, thanks to you and several others here. I don't recall where I first heard the phrase "KZbin University", but it's accurate for people that wish to learn a new skill. Or those who are willing to share theirs.

[@ChrisJB84]

Again thank you for all of your videos!!!

[@denstump4590]

You do really great videos! Thanks! I have watched most of them at least once and some several times. My shop is not set up yet so I can not use my mill or lathe yet but hopefully in a week or two I can.

[@Millstone_Firewood]

Thanks for another fantastic video! Please do a video on making a precision test bar.

[@daveharriman2756]

Hi Mr Pete, I guess having a completely accurately ground test bar, and adjusting to zero zero, it would negate indicating over the top of the bar, so this would make the work parallel when turned, thanks for making me think this one out!

[@WCC209]

This was very helpful for me

[@ericchilton3781]

i have an atlas and would love to see how to make a test bar......i also would like to see how to turn a morse taper on the tailstock method......thanks again for all the great videos............

[@Bassman73]

thanks just what i needed.

[@jjh1897]

I hadn't seen Benjamin's comment and realize that my question was similar and already answered...

[@SpatialGuy77]

Nice video Mr Pete. I have two questions. How do I adjust if my tail stock is 8 thou low? AND How do I accurately check the test bar is dead straight? Will rolling it on a granite surface plate pick up a 2 or 3 thou bend? Cheers, Michael 🇦🇺

[@mrpete222]

Yes--if centers are already perfectly aligned and its an accurate lathe. pete

[@jaysonapolona2052]

Mr pete , how about the Atlas 12 x 36 flat bed ? Do you encounter tightening of carriage when reaching headstock and tailstock then loosening when passing in the middle ? Im from philippines , Im a big fan 😊

[@BasementShopGuy]

Lyle - more Bridgeport videos, please... I'd love to see some videos on different types of milling operations. Or how about a nice project-based series using both the South Bend and Bridgeport? Something along the lines of your steam engine (from way back). Those videos are SO enjoyable to watch (in a world of crap TV programming).

[@dicksargent3582]

Love your videos,have watched everyone! Would really appreciate learning how to make an accurate test bar. Thanks Dick Sargent

[@edtoombs4527]

Great video, great course! Merry Christmas!

[@mrpete222]

And merry Christmas to you

[@boblewis5558]

Trick question & bet: try doing that on a Myford ML2 tailstock (original)!! ZERO chance ... No adjustment at all!

[@mrpete222]

You must use a collet or 4jaw---the holes need to be centerdrilled & trued with a tiny boring bar.

[@NOBOX7]

sir , you are awsome,,,, just wanted to remind you incase you forgot...

[@johnchisholm7350]

Great .! You nearly nailed my problem,but when I tighten my adjusters,the bloody centre piece swings! And on checking them they are offset from each other. (Poor engineering or what?). John

[@bailey3668]

Thank you brother

[@David-yg8tf]

A centering tool aligns both vertical and horizontal. Can be homemade (probably should be made since no one wants to sell it.) It's used with a homemade test bar. I'm not a machinist but a solver, so run.:) So, my center finder shows lathe is off vertically big-time. Horizontal can be adjust but not vertical. Haven't figure it out yet. A centering tool is amazing yet, simple to build but I don't know why people run from it.

[@marksinden4156]

+David - if the tailstock is LOW, you can shim it underneath to lift it. However, if it IS that far out, it's worth double-checking the lathe bed is not banana shaped end-to-end. A company I used to work for had a second-hand Myford ML7 and it had exactly that fault having become warped over the decades. We managed to shim the twist out of it eventually, but would have to have paid for a regrind of the bed to remove the banana shape.

[@NOBOX7]

ok i see you did mention camera angle

[@NOBOX7]

tell me , was i seeing a parrelax error wen you said your gage was at zero, the camera read slightly of, just wondering if yo caught that in editng

[@csmith2313]

Thank you for teaching me so much. I bought a huge turret lathe and a Bridgeport mill very cheap (barn find) and you taught me a lot. My friend told me there was a way to clean up lathe jaws to help them hold better. There is a gouge in one of the jaws and don't know how to repair it. Can you help us all with this problem? My lathe head is a Cushing 10" 3 jaw and I cant afford a four jaw yet but saving my up for it..

[@kerrywil1]

YES, Please make a test bar. thanks

[@cut4weld]

As for the set screws I found them at my local ACE store. They are out there.

[@ODMIJ084]

Thanks for uploading the video, there's just one thing wrong with the list of best "You-Tubers" Mr Pete222 is not at the top!. I would really like to see more of your videos, including how to make your own test bar. I would really like to see me about indicating work, in your V belt project you free handed the groves for the pulley could you show how to indicate the tool bit to a more specific and accurate dmisension from one end of a shaft/ pulley/ bushing. If you post the videos I'l watch them

[@Fresc222]

Yep, that would work.

[@gtty111]

Great Video! Thanks.

[@mrpete222]

THANK YOU!

[@GrussimoGarage]

Too funny. I subscribe to all but shopdogsam. I will check him out. Thanks Tubalcain!

[@mrpete222]

YES.

[@ShuffleSk8Ter]

? what if you do not have the bushing for the headstock taper? can i chuck up and turn a 60deg point and use that?..I am assuming that would be accurate......the other end of my test bar is MT4 for the tailstock....both ends are very accurately center drilled..as this is a real ground test bar for this specific purpose.. Thank you still love your vids!

[@MrSprocket2u]

he knows his stuff

[@Samsgarden]

He he. Small town in Illinois, talking about the girl with a mustache and the man with bad breath. Word travels fast in small towns! ;-)

[@jjh1897]

If a test bar cannot be obtained or afforded, would turning a length of round stock between centers, then indicating over its length or measuring the rod diameter at both ends (accounting the difference in dia.) provide similar results? Though after each indication and adjustment of the tailstock, another cut further reducing the rod diameter would be needed before indicating again, until the rod is true from end to end. I have never tried this method. Just a thought.

[@jallenc1111]

Mr. Pete I do no have a test bar, but wondered why I couldn't use a 1" chucking reamer that I do have. Mine measures .875 for about 7.25 inches (overall 10.25 including cutting edges.) I know this is a short distance, but the reamer I think is very true, it has very nice centers on each end, and it is a tool that I already have. Any thoughts on this idea would be great, as I have no formal training as a machinist. By the way my present lathe is the Craftsman counterpart to your Atlas.

[@francisasamoah9108]

Please l have lathe machine which do not go by threading chart.n

[@ch408w1]

Mr Pete... I am assuming that by saying putting in the chuck and drilling the center is not accurate enough... you suggest going back after center drilling.. and cutting the center @ 30 degrees like you show in another video ?? That seems to be the most accurate way

[@benjamincuningham]

Could you make a test bar and align your tailstock at the same time by making a cut from end to end and then measuring the diameter of each end? Or would that not be very accurate?

[@NOBOX7]

how often should we perform this test

[@djpaulk]

Hahahaaa ! Too right ! and yep,he also made me build an "electrolis" tank..

[@pwpollaccia]

I liked and subscribed,

[@mrpete222]

Thanks for watching!

[@richardkicklighter1202]

would a tool post be accurate enough? I don't have a lantern.

[@BCLSundayFunday]

Is it possible or necessary to align the tailstock height / vertically?

[@martynfrench7187]

The FIRST ESSENTIAL is to align the HEADSTOCK .❗The head must be aligned to the bed before touching the tailstock.

[@user-ie1zw5bn2c]

다이얼 테스트 인디케이터 네요...잘 봤습니다...감사합니다...^0^

[@bigb0r3]

What if the tailstock is high/low?

[@mclarpet]

Was the cross-eyed boy there ? What about vertical alignment ?

[@David-yg8tf]

Try a centering tool. Look for my other comment about this. Otherwise put the dail on top. Unless you're asking where is the vert. screw? eye- don't no.

[@mrpete222]

No--I think he passed away--he was very good.

[@nlawn1]

Hello mrpete, firstly I'm really enjoying your videos, great stuff and please keep them coming. Out of interest is this how you got your nick-name? wikipedia - Tom_Walshaw I have a copy of Workshop Practice by Tubal Cain. if you're intreuged there's an old copy on ebay; - Workshop Practice series no.5 All my best, Nick (uk)

[@mumbles552]

Are you the tubalcain from England who makes steam engines and writes books?

[@mrpete222]

My name is taken out of GENESIS---FIRST IRONMONGER. pete