MAGES ON TOP! - Predecessor 1.2 Tier List

[@Hissingace110]

Damn, that final list is how a MOBA balance should look. Pred is definitely more balanced than Paragon ever was.

[@last-yakuza-8363]

Remember Deathcrawler on Grux ? My Crunch remembers 😢😔

[@Hissingace110]

@last-yakuza-8363 Remember 6 mini nukes on Murdock? 😂

[@TheJragon14]

@@Hissingace110remember dune winds Grim 🤣🤣🤣

[@michaelh878]

Kalahari and wraith are trash but I'm glad. They are extremely annoying to have either on your team or against.

[@TheJragon14]

@ both those heroes are just Timmy beaters.

[@jayfox3628]

Yins windburn ability needs cooldown reduction, it was originally designed to be ready in 4 secs or less Now level 1 is 11 seconds

[@Psychobum91932]

nah

[@hermanjohnson9180]

I was running a mage build on Phase and easily overwhelmed my opponents. As long as you do beam into flare, Phase does heavy damage while blinding all opponents. And when used correctly her beam is more consistent with stopping long range opponents than even Dekker's ball. It's not broken it's just powerful. I can't tell if it's because I'm using the character correctly or you just have to run a mage build. But yeah just go for damage on phase and she dominates.

[@aperal732]

Exactly...I main phase and build is hybrid!! I don't go full support with her

[@TheBlackWitness]

Can you do video of the top 5 in every lane?

[@fresh8178]

I think kallari should have been in one trick cause there’s no way

[@rudy2shoes]

I would argue rampage is in a very very strong position right now, especially early Also want to say I think you’ve come a long way as a KZbinr/streamer, loving your vids 👍

[@wilhelmmohan4605]

Kalari needs a big rework imo to be viable in fights and to farm properly. I find her to over reliant on specific items just to make her work, making it easier to build around her. She's also just extremely weak and is easy to counter in most of her ambushes. Overall trash tear atm

[@NunkyChuts]

I go more of an ADC build and do better. Assassins have no lifesteal and no big health bar so they just end up low health before ganks.

[@davidmorales7371]

I've argued on the Pred discord and youtube that Dekker is broken and needs a slight rework of some sort and people say I'm wrong, bad at the game or imply I don't know what I'm talking about. He said it and nobody bats an eye hahaha.

[@dillonrabon4462]

imo morigesh is so broken, i’ll pop off 20 kill games w her and get destroyed by opponent morigesh’s when im not playing her

[@tichawnsaunders5223]

Maybe at the end of the tier list can u quickly say what your dream team comp would be in the patch?

[@jaylengoat]

where should we find builds for most characters

[@thatboy3930]

Yin's positioning in team fights feels the best when you have enough space to react to enemy projectiles, but close enough so you can still poke. I do think she is the best jungler when it comes to invading the enemy jungle, her clear speed and mobility makes it so easy to put the opposing jungle behind early.

[@patjohnson7967]

Your idea for dekker is good but would open the door for so much trolling lmao, go ahead and let my carry say something smart imma cage his ass in there with enemies next gank 😂😂

[@ArienMng]

Hello ! I'm just a little mid gold player so maybe I don't know how to counter them but I think Skylar and Shinbi are really really strong. I agree that Shinbi doesn't have a kit that makes her super useful in a 5v5 but the fact that she has a TON of damage, while having a lot of lifesteal, a shield 2 dashes and a lock ult that can kill from a distance makes playing against her a hell. As for Skylar, she deals a lot of damage (like the other carries) but the fact that if she play with a support that stuns the carry, you can't stop her if she dives you, she's flying and has increased speed so it makes it really hard to hit her or stop her, and she has a beam which deals so much damage and is really hard to miss. Making her really hard to kill in lane and in teamfight while dealing the same amount of damage as the other carries. If someone has a way to counter them, please enlight my little gold brain. I do think that if your team is playing well you can counter them but in ranked where the level is kinda 'meh' these characters are too strong in my opinion.

[@khai3481]

Tb can do the job,you should be the agressor,muti makes grenades better,poke her with grenades and ulti,outfarm her,always keep your distance,you lose if you go close combat.

[@ArienMng]

@khai3481 Okay I'll try my best with TB if I go against a Skylar, thanks for the advice !

[@LuckyAce101]

One of the best patches, if not the best in preds history?

[@Ry-tr4xy]

This patch is fire

[@isaiahjohnson1191]

I don't understand his point on phase..... She's been one of the best supports since the early days of Paragon how can you just say she's trash and is in C maybe she could use some buffs in certain areas or nerves depending on what people are complaining about but I consider phase an A teir support if anything 100%

[@PinzoDunzo]

this game is not Paragon.

[@michaelh878]

A lot of her kit is just bad. Energy Lance is good for punishing enemy bad positioning. The pull is good for helping teammates bad positioning. Other characters have skills that are always doing something not just situationally. The blind could be useful or the enemy could get lucky and keep hitting your teammates despite the short blind. Think how much worse that is than stuns and knock ups.

[@Tsaphah_77]

I'm surprised at grux below Khai, as i usually feel like i do better as grux jungle over khai. But khai can effortlessly clear both jungles, making it feel similar to countess (at least for how i play them). But i don't play ranked, i'd need a team and polish out some bad habits i'd say.

[@bryandiaz1044]

“I’m just gonna go through alphabetical… Countess!” Aurora right now: 😐

[@n7jaeger974]

tried using yin in solo lane and yea she does struggle lol but she can be a strong split pusher after 2-3 items though her escape isnt as good as someone like shinbi

[@hermanjohnson9180]

When I tried her as long as you have Absolution (in some games you don't even need that if there isn't enough CC) and prioritize Windburn, Yin is unstoppable. The only two characters that even gave me issues were Sevarog and early game Terra. (By late game Terra just doesn't have the tools to stop Yin)

[@fanboy7718]

I think a good phase can carry games hmm maybe high ranked at diamond she's bad? Is this tierlist focused on ranked or scrims?

[@silvy7394]

Thats what I thought as a Phase main. As long as your phase is somewhat competent, and the rest of your team an deal damage, shes not a bad pick.

[@somethingidk8054]

phase definitely can't carry games above gold cause she has zero lane pressure and little damage

[@bullockm1826]

Sorry I’m a little late. But you’re still getting kissed, *MWAH*

[@MichaelRibisi-m4f]

I personally think Kira is at least A+ and Dock is an A I agree with everything else

[@juniormercier438]

Starts with alphabetical order but starts with countess and not Argus 😭

[@undead_numen]

His real name is Kwargus

[@teynryn831]

Belica might be buffed, doesn’t stop me from stomping her every match lol

[@ItsShooty]

I'm not a midlaner but Belica Support has been straight wins since the update also I main Phase and yeaahhhhhh she doesn't feel great right now. My other mains are Dekker, Argus, and Terra so this tier list pleases me greatly.

[@NunkyChuts]

Phase's kit is bad. The pull allows trolls and for bad players to truly screw the team. Being able to actively move your team around is a bad ability. The rest is fine but that pull is cheeks. Also every Phase plays behind you which isn't helpful when they push. Never play Phase again.

[@ItsShooty]

@NunkyChuts yeah I respected your opinion until the last sentence lmao. I've saved people from ganks and ultimates countless times with pull. And while she plays from behind, she's also meant to engage with energy lance which has the reach to do so. She's by no means a perfect character and she could use some work but "don't play her ever again" is laughably extreme and pretty cringe. But if it makes you feel better, I don't play her in Ranked anymore.

[@NunkyChuts]

@@ItsShooty She's cheeks.

[@WaterDependent]

Not me as a Phase and Kallari main watching this 👁️👄👁️ Why does Phase get so much hate? She's my favorite and fun to play with

[@michaelh878]

Because blind is annoying

[@GAnthho]

bro i love phase i am pretty good w her is just u like her or hate her

[@somethingidk8054]

she has zero lane pressure, her only notable use is last minute saves, which is annoying for the opponents and not useful in teamfights

[@xzingpopox]

Terra is definitely a one-trick, I think she gets diffed if you don't know how to play her. If you dodge her empowered Q (whichever is the 3 hit combo) you will literally win every trade. And it's super easy to dodge on top of that

[@nathanielnagano-deschamps7181]

Yeah I've been playing Terra a while, and I feel like she really struggles in a lot of match ups. I don't see her played anywhere so I'm suprised about this ranking. She just doesn't do enough damage at all points of the game imo, I feel like it's all weighted into her empowered Q. At this point I'm unsure if I build only defence or I start building around autoattacks bc the traditional Mutilator build feels really bad on her.

[@xzingpopox]

@nathanielnagano-deschamps7181 the best I've seen her used is by starting with her empowered E to bully early with the shield boost. I see the logic against the main tanks since they're CC heavy. Hit R and hope you do enough damage before the jungler shows up

[@TyroneRussell-qd8no]

Her axe should be a lob shot it doesn't go far 😂

[@michaelh878]

​​@@nathanielnagano-deschamps7181Her stun and slow is so useful in teamfights. Expecting her to do the same damage as a character with less cc makes no sense. I have been using tainted blade when I want more damage. She is a bit worse than steel in that respect but then you have the bonus of much better waveclear and much quicker stealing of enemy jungle.

[@nathanielnagano-deschamps7181]

@@michaelh878 her slow and root are really good for one target, but I think all around her shield bash is really the best aspect of her kit. But during laning phase, these are very big comitment abilities and once they are gone, I just get outtraded. The Cooldown for them are pretty long so pics like Shinbi, Qwang, Rictor, Zarus, Aurora are really tough imo. For off meta pics, she has great gap closers and CC so ofc she'll do well, but saying she's strong bc she can destroyer off meta pics is not saying much...

[@bryantcruz2320]

If sparrow managed to advance it is gg I would put it higher

[@coopermay2210]

Maybe this patch will finally be the end of every lobby banning Riktor/Steel in my plat/diamond games

[@GladimirGladimirovich]

Can yin reflect revenants obliterate? I was thinking it might be a good counter but im a casual scrub

[@BIGDDrome]

What is alc rod?

[@michaelh878]

Alchemical rod. It is a component leading to azure core. It gives some mana for each kill. I think most just get it at low levels then sell it when you stop having mana issues.

[@pineapple9489]

the dude sound hurt with what he wants done to dekker 😅 SI

[@gagehibbins3470]

Pinzo, you do not know about assasin serath build and it hurts. Malady into penumbra or deathstalker into nightfall into the one you didn't take. I shit you not she's the best jungle in the game with it

[@xtianpalke]

Lmaoooo Mori B tier? I just knew you were ass but this solidifies it 🤣🤣

[@PinzoDunzo]

if you think mori is good, you're in bronze

[@xtianpalke]

@ lmaoooo sounds like skill issues 😭😭

[@michaelh878]

She is just a worse version of countess. If she gets ahead she can really bully people around the map, but no escape and terrible in teamfights.

[@gameholder6296]

mage rev s+ tier

[@Jonatron503]

I really don’t think Dekker is THAT good. I’d put her one tier lower.i think the entire B tier is A tier but each character has specific scaling (Sparrow sucks early and can still dominate at the end). I’ve been playing phase as a carry and that’s more fun and beneficial than a simple support (but still match dependent since she can get ganked easily and depends on my support). So I’d place her as the C tier as well since she doesn’t really threaten me as an opponent. Kallari… I hate having her on my team! Such a selfish character that adds nothing to team fights and allows lanes to be over run. Her kit is interesting, but I don’t respect her and don’t want to have her as a teammate. She can hit hard, but I see her as an L for whichever team she’s on because they’re at a disadvantage.

[@silvy7394]

I used to play greystone, sometimes in offlane, but as of recently I cant find myself using him in offlane anymore. I just cannot deal damage fast enough and have no CC. If I go tank, I still somehow find myself lacking when I didnt before. I really wish they'd up his durability. His second life is a second life, not an extension of his health bar thats locked behind an ability like it currently is.

[@Terror_Rick]

Greystone is a solid jungler, I personally like a high life steal Greystone.

[@michaelh878]

How do you find playing him fun at all? Is it just that you can turn your brain off and get punished less than other characters?

[@Terror_Rick]

@@michaelh878 No, it's because I can get 12 kills and 0 deaths on low skill players like you.

[@michaelh878]

@@Terror_Rick sure, kid

[@Terror_Rick]

@@michaelh878 You know you've been played when your reply is "sure, kid." Lmaoooo 😂

[@deLunimary]

Why’s phase so shit? I don’t really see her a ton so I’m not too familiar with fighting her

[@NunkyChuts]

I'm guessing but I believe for him it's the ability to pull your teammates. It gives troll potential, and also just bad player potential to pull teammates into bad fights out of good etc. Since the idea is to pull out your teammates you have to play behind as well and having the supp behind the ADC is kinda like the Queen behind the King.

[@Genghiscarn]

All you had to said was “ I’m buns with kallari so I don’t like her.

[@somethingidk8054]

42% winrate btw maybe she's just not good

[@colinadkins3996]

Bruh I kill with phase

[@munchiez4993]

Crunch should get a cleanse

[@rue_pardox]

Kallari, bad. Khaimera, good. What?!

[@michaelh878]

Kallaris win rate is about 42%, Kaimera 54%.

[@mrcaptaingato2196]

I just want ranked with my 3-5 stacks

[@tyb2480]

i think phase is a b tier hero

[@Sami-ix7hx]

I think greystone is better than crunch and zarus.

[@guap2cold]

He is . Way better if you ask me

[@n7jaeger974]

yea fuckin right stop capping lol soon as your ult is down i get you run away crunch can non stop cc you with his combos barely letting grey do anything zarus can kill you with cage once your blink and ult is down

[@Benji_Fry]

@@guap2coldbesides his ult how is Grey better?

[@funwalkthroughs1285]

I just think Zarus ult is just so good in team fights he out weights greystone

[@Benji_Fry]

@ 100% the only reason people think grey is good is because of his ult

[@GladimirGladimirovich]

I used to think greystone was good and then i played a bunch of narbash solo. I saw lots of greystones and they kinda get clapped as long as you dont miss thunk