Making an open source Warcraft 3 remake: how and why?

[@serijas737]

Seeing how the current gaming standard has become to make old games deprecated and unusable, cut off from servers or "reforged" in a way that they end up broken, I finally realize how important your service to the community is by creating an open source version of this old ass, yet legendary game.

[@StarStew]

War3 modders are some of the most unfathomably talented people around. Thanks for looking out for the community

[@aleksitjvladica.]

Thou art missing a full stop.

[@jeppe9821]

I've never seen a game recreation being as faithful as this before

[@kolbyevans8136]

Check out SWGemu, they've been rebuilding an mmo as an open source project for decades. Not saying this isn't cool, but just shouting out devs who have been pouring this love into a project like that for such a long time.

[@el33tkrew]

I think you did a great job explaining Warsmash

[@GhostRider-un9gm]

Lord Archimonde I admire you and respect you more than Blizzard. Thank you for making the Retera tool.

[@WastedDad]

In game dev tycoon, if you allow the players to mod your games, you get more fans and money…

[@Marmotus]

This was absolutely fascinating! You explained it very well and with a passion that really kept my interest. A thoroughly enjoyable two hours. You piqued the interest of my inner child who really wants to make cool custom maps. This looks very fun.

[@sdamer4609]

This is ... Amazing! Reforging a good game into a piece of unplayable crap was a huge mistake of Activision. And you're doing a great job to save it. Well done!

[@LogicalMayhem00]

Wow, this is the most nerdy niche content I can possibly imagine. I love it, you've got a subscriber❤ Finally the algorithm working for once

[@Rojanthal]

I second this little dog's comment.

[@tomsssss]

I have absolutely minimal programming experience and love wc3 and i watched this whole thing and you seem like a super talented dude and this is a really cool project! You need WTii or Grubby to get involved and make some crazy custom code maps for them hahaha, the potential here is so huge

[@TheShorka]

haha maybe we can make them play "push escape to play WoW" mode: kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZnylfX5ogrZ0ppI or a bigger build grid with 3x5 buttons: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fJDEoaBqoayYo6s If you've watched WTii play a 2D side scroller that looks like Mario as a map on Reforged, you'll know that the power to shut off Warcraft 3 and hack in a new game on Reforged is already almost there. The problem is for people who want to do stuff like 3x5 buttons and actually change Warcraft 3. That's much harder on Reforged, since they don't publish how War3 is made, and only copied the modding community hacks to break it and shoveled those into their Reforged UI mod APIs, or whatever.

[@danbrown2062]

Damn, this brings me back. Best of luck on your hobby. If I was less busy I’d totally contribute to this! Maybe I’ll contribute in a year or two. Thanks again for your passion.

[@deepstrasz]

Comprehensive and coherent. To think this is just for a hobby. Fascinating.

[@WoWReforged]

Looking forward for the this project. It would help me debugging my map if all JASS functions are available. Break points and watching all handles etc. would really help map makers. Could you implement the rectangle on the minimap next which shows your camera's position and boundaries? That would really help the orientation on the map.

[@JohnDoe-r6s]

Awesome project! Commenting just to help with the algorithm

[@RichardLofty]

Things that were made a year ago now don't work. Yet things made 20 years ago still work. That's why people are still loving original warcraft 3.

[@adrianomenconi6678]

In my opinion WC3 should be in Public domain after the disaster of reforged

[@fudencio]

extremely interesting video

[@fudencio]

this is legitimately so cool

[@TheShorka]

@@fudencio thanks

[@hristoborisov3713]

you are a legend man! thanks for the inspiring words and the work!

[@LogicalMayhem00]

This was a philosophy lesson, many gems ❤

[@nordgaren2358]

"You can't ever fix it" You can. It's just much harder. For example, Seamless Coop for Elden Ring fixed a bunch of networking stuff. But to do so, you have to RE the program and inject code, and it's not the most optimal way of doing things.

[@TotallyRandomizedEgg]

Genuinely inspiring. Thank you.

[@Regulus_V]

Doing the Lord's work with this. Kudos, and I for one will be following with keen interest.

[@Ziforigin]

This is indeed very inspiring. Thank you very much, I'll definitely check out Warsmash

[@augustday9483]

I love open source projects. Glad to still see passionate fans for Warcraft III.

[@nordmu]

Lets gooo! I'm grateful for your work.

[@channingzhang]

War3 was broken on Mac for a week. I found that what you did has true value.

[@zzzzzzz8473]

awesome ! thanks for the developments and for the preservation of the mod content with such parsers and opensource modular components . its bizarre there are so many good examples of the amazing mods leading to entire genres and favored games ( dota , counterstrike , battle royale ) , the impact on minecraft and skyrim is so clear , and yet so many games have no mod support or work against them .

[@lucasmence]

This is awesome! I can't wait for the next videos.

[@KingLich451]

I hope you chase this project until the end. The world deserves the perfect Warcraft 3 port.

[@estebansantamaria8729]

Amazing project!

[@reffa9333]

really fun to watch you modify the game, keep it up

[@HappyCucco.]

Yes, open source is the way to preserve and persevere as gamers!

[@vooshPOW]

Looks great, your hard work is much appreciated! As with all RTS games, the real crucial and challenging piece of work is the pathing of the units around the map and their interactions with their surroundings. What did you do about that?

[@TheShorka]

I copied the A* search algorithm from wikipedia, then hacked it a couple of times to apply to a larger number of cases. This is of course non-ideal. I am aware that I should change it to hierarchical annotated A* instead at some point in the future, but I did not yet. When it runs slowly, I just buy bigger hardware. A lot of my Warsmash videos are recorded on machines with 30 - 60 GB of RAM and an nVidia RTX 2080 Ti, so that I don't have to worry about writing code to have good performance. If we downscale and run it on the raspberry pi in this video, it doesn't even work at 1080p. If we compare that to Warcraft III which was capable of running fine on a pentium 4 in 2002 that only had 2 GB of ram, what I am doing is sort of a comical hackjob in that regard. But they had a small army of 40+ guys, and I am just a guy messing around on weekends.

[@kiSABREWULF007]

It will be cool if you could let this editor to load more different model formats too so more people can upload different custom maps with different graphic style. It can have the classic look but if someone decide to change he will have the option

[@OGStan01]

1:10:18 no idea how to engine works, so just shooting ideas around, but I'm just suggesting it based on how old the engine is and how stuff used to be done back then. If the life bar position is changing due to the animation I'd assume the animation is somehow affecting some sort of model bounding box size/position based on the character's animation graph. Unless there's some whacky animations that make the character move a hell of a lot farther from their physics collider, why not hack it up like we always do in game dev and actually display the hp bar relative to the physics collider bounding box instead of the character model's bounding box? Again, it's a suggestion is based on how old tech used to work in some engines/games with physics objects being static boxes that don't move during animations and character model bounding boxes being the only ones that might modify because of the animations.

[@FcSteezey]

Go in Retera !!!!

[@AiyaAdventures]

Have a good day. I need a 3 minute version haha. For the need w3 installed first pre-req, could you prompt battlenet login and download? Have you considered transpiler or compiler to webasm? Very cool to just focus on preservation.

[@hectorquispe4365]

Still Waiting Warsmash April Editor

[@EnuoAkatsuki]

Thoughts on the addition of third party stuff like YDWE/KK world editor to be part of the open-source?

[@TheShorka]

I do not have the power to open source other peoples' fan projects if they did not already publish their code, but if people use enhanced map editors to make w3x files then as it stands currently Warsmash is probably capable of running its emulation to play on those map files.

[@SoRusted]

great project btw

[@kiretoandslimglarus]

Hey Retera, is there a solution to unit formations for example if I make a unit 50 % smaller ,minus 50 % collision,minus 50% acquisition range but the formation stays the same and what it looks like is units walking in formation of what will look like in real life 7 meters apart witch is ridiculous ,is there a solution to this problem?

[@ZUNKEN123]

good video watched the full video

[@patrickstar1164]

Good deed

[@SoRusted]

woah it has a working server and everything

[@SvenS2]

I misread as "Making an open world Warcraft 3", and thought someone was making an MMO for war3, like how they did for SC2

[@poega123]

Nono theres no MMO version of warcraft

[@budderk1305]

comment for algorithm, cause important topic

[@greenfroggood2392]

I just randomly stumbled into this video and I'm not done watching it but about the point around the 33:00 mark, I say screw those people. Who cares. Warcraft 3 was the best game of all time and big part of it was the map editor allowing so much freedom and creativity. I don't need to tell any warcraft 3 fans why blizzard sucks, you already know it. I play new games and old games and I had 0 curiosity in dabbling with w3 reforged. Recently I had the nostalgia for w3 after many years and I played it again. The idea that things need to be constantly "upgrading" is silly, chess didn't change for centuries and is still around. There is comfort in some things staying the same in a rapidly changing world and there is nothing wrong with feeling that way, it means you are human. I also wanted to remark that you seem to have some kind of disdain for dota (my assumption) but I would argue that game was/is way more complex than w3. The idea that because you have less units it's dumbed down is very inaccurate and simple minded and I never liked that D measuring thing about two game modes that are very different from one another. I'm a w3 and a dota fan but even if you don't like dota as a game you should like it as a creative idea that sublimed beyond the shackles of blizzard into its own game, showing it can be done for other games. For example Legion TD is its own standalone game on steam too and it was a very popular map back in the days. I don't understand why to make a w3 open source remake if it's not to let new ideas be born out of it, but things are not as they were in pre-2010 era anymore. But I'll keep watching and wish you all the best, I share your passion for w3.

[@TheShorka]

Some of the Mobas that became their own games do not offer World Editor type programs, and so I typically did not play them very much. I am also somewhat lazy and stayed on Warcraft III map editor at times when other people chose to do other newer things. It is great that creators can learn what is necessary to make their own custom spinoff games, and hopefully that continues. However, one of the problems at least with trying to make custom content on Warcraft III is that it is almost easier to make a Dota clone on Warcraft 3 that it is to make a new and innovative, marginally different version of Warcraft III. There are preset limits such as every hero having 6 items or 5 hero skills that are time consuming and stupid to try to overcome, although surely some people have found workarounds to overcome them. This is the very arcane reason why a lot of time spent trying to make custom Warcraft III content leads to a desire to remake the program in open source. For people who want Dota or Legion TD to become its own game, that is already possible and they did that. But if I want to try playing Warcraft III where every hero character has 9 items instead of 6, even after twenty years this requires some insane hackery to accomplish. And that is despite the fact that there are some people who have literally made FPS games on Reforged. A lot of the code of Warcraft III can be turned off from inside a map, but isn't actually available to the map to customize. I played some really fun "Aeon" style hero corridor maps in 2004 or something, and I had a great time. But by the time I played the Dota map, it was already very much about memorizing that particular instance of the characters rather than the fun of heroes guiding minions down corridors while learning about new heroes on the fly and having new experiences or the possibility to create new experiences. Of course, at least twice in my life, I created basic maps of this kind on Warcraft III with some heroes guiding some automated minions as well. And each time I added new heroes, and three corridors of my own chosen shapes, and whatever. What inspires me is probably just as much antithetical to Reforged Versus Mode as it is to Dota. In one of the readmes on Warsmash, I think I noted somewhere for a while that one of the most likely outcomes of the project is that there will be people in a third world country playing a hacked version of Warsmash that can only load the one Dota map and no other map, forcing each other to duel within the confines of Warsmash Dota over who has the best memorization of the characters. I appreciate the reality that this might be the outcome, but it is not what I will personally choose to do with the system once I have a fully working remake that I can customize in many ways. What I will do will be more like this: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hnrXnK1pZ5pjkLs

man is he sitting or standing while he talks? amazing vid by the way

[@TheShorka]

standing :D you noticed

[@GregoryBastion]

Where would our game be without the map makers?

[@RyuDouro]

how you can make it open source if it is owned by blizzard? Since they made stupid reforge they been trying to coyright everything they touch, even the maps you make.

[@TheShorka]

They don't own the copyright of a game that I make in LibGDX, and the game simulation that I made on LibGDX does not provide anyone with the Warcraft III copyrighted art files.

[@RyuDouro]

@@TheShorka but they would own anything else that is not a empty husk, as in without any Warcraft copyright material, I mean is it possible to do anything good without Warcraft material?

[@TheShorka]

@@RyuDouro sure there are videos of me playing a game made on warsmash without warcraft 3 here on Hive: www.hiveworkshop.com/threads/future-of-warsmash-the-april-fuels.353274/#post-3624625

[@RyuDouro]

@@TheShorka programing wise amazing, but otherwise not really, warcraft assets have something in them. I wonder if a really smart programmer can bypass the copyright issues by using AI to make content which already somehow already bypasses some copyright issues,thus having the full power of a map editor like the warcraft editor, and based warcraft art generated by AI which not even the humans that made reforge could do, but an AI probably can easily. It sounds easy but no one did for some reason?

[@yusufserdaryucel6659]

If every feature was impemented in warsmash and is compatible with w3 maps, I'd play it even if it crashes more cause I'd know those crashes will be fixed and over time and it'd be probably more stable than warcraft 3.

[@TheShorka]

If I add a crash for every missing feature, then what's your rationale for not already doing this?

[@yusufserdaryucel6659]

@@TheShorka Cause I play w3 for custom maps, and chances are 99% arent gonna work at all if even vanilla hero skills arent implemented completely. There is obviously a break point and from the video it seems like what you have is still way too much in developing phase

[@PropZ_]

you legend, you'd properly be able to add custome races to the selection as well so we get more then 4 normal races for melee no?

[@TheShorka]

Done. See post here (this is accomplished by editing the true number of races in the game at the lowest level, not some facade): kzbin.info/www/bejne/hnrXnK1pZ5pjkLs

[@PropZ_]

@@TheShorka you are so good dude

[@luked002]

Warcraft 3 mobile version with LibGDX. You guys have phones right?

[@TheShorka]

Yeah, I tried that to see if I could make fun of Arclight Rumble, but it worked too well. It was just really easy to port Warsmash to Android since it's already running on LibGDX, and just took a couple of weekends. kzbin.info/www/bejne/pXabXneAZ6qbj9U So then I realized that if I actually published that, Activision would probably come after me, but for real. Like looking up at real power, and a gatekeeped Android world, and I realized I just didn't like it, so then I stopped doing that and moved away from it. Now I use a Purism phone, which does not run Android or iOS, and instead runs LibGDX desktop games directly. That means I can have that kind of thing, but if I make it, no one else can use it. So I don't threaten Google Android monopoly mind manipulation anymore.

[@xadion6866]

implement a disconnect failsafe and a reconnect feature. if you can do that for warsmash people will completely abandon the original game and flock onto your project. although people will additionally request a better correspondence between software and hardware, meaning a little fix to the lag and memory/cpu/gfx/network and generally the problems that the game inherently has. however that is left for later ofc. let me know your thoughts about this comment of mine on the next video if you can because im really interested in becoming a map creator under the circumstance of actually having the ability of giving the players of my map the capacity to combat a disconnect. try to segment videos under the categories of "to the point" video. and a different video regarding "explanation and thought process" video. this will make your content more targeted regarding on who wants to watch what. for me personally i dont care about the coding, but if i would, then i would prefer a more precise "this is this", and "that is that" quick situation without any missing details ofc situation. but this is just a minor criticism, ignore it as per the regard on whether you dont want to follow this pattern, or for any other reason. i dont want to be the online commenter to shut anyone's capacity of thought and negate his interest of what he does. this is a big feat that youve accomplished. try to use marketing tactics to push your channel. and damn it man, i cant stress it enough, we need better performance for the connection issues.

[@TheShorka]

To the extent that Warsmash emulates Warcraft III, there is a trigger event that fires when a player leaves the game (or is supposed to), and after that happens typically the units of the player who left the game might be given away to his allies, or something else, based on the custom map. So, if we are emulating Warcraft III, support of the existing API works against the feature you are asking for. Because if I disconnect from your game, and the game awards you my gold and lumber and units, and then you spend them up for a while, then what happens when I try to reconnect? Suddenly every custom map would need to support re-inserting a player in its trigger code. The only other solution, presumably, would be to not fire the "disconnect" trigger event to begin with, as if the lost player had never left. To do that you would probably want to freeze the game and show the "waiting for player(s)" popup dialog -- but now with the added feature that rather than waiting for their game to catch up, the player could restart their computer and rejoin the game if the people waiting on the dialog waited long enough. But at the moment, my multiplayer code is inspired by Warcraft III paradigms and is written by me at a low level, so it ends up doing parallel lock step simulations on each computer. Currently I did not program save games, nor any other system that freezes the contents of the game and passes them to another session, so I don't yet have the piece of code necessary for one computer to send to another where all the units are, to provide the other computer with the power to rejoin. These technology hurdles are in the way. Unlike Reforged, Warsmash gives us the power to sit and think and then WRITE UP A SOLUTION to solve all of them, if that is something we should choose to spend the time to do. But this would probably actually take a long time! It is quite possible that in the short term, I will not bother to do this, even though unlike Reforged my system gives us the option to do all this if we want.

[@xadion6866]

@@TheShorka thank you for the thoughtful reply. in another note, you most definitely have heard i suppose about the open source FSR technology that AMD has came up with, hopefully, could that tech be anywhere near to be implemented in the warsmash project (to be capable of)? ive personally seen it work despite my lack of computer science knowledge, i use it on a bad computer in world of warcraft and it raises the fidelity of my gameplay to much higher levels than before; fidelity in terms of frames ofc, image is not really the pursuit of this technology as i see it, because in the release paneling, the devs spoke about low tier hardware accessibility, which means the target audience for this tech is mainly people with low funds, and these people(us) value a smooth gameplay more so than fancy shadows and graphical quality. its outlandish how FSR stabilizes my frames in world of warcraft, and now that i have the opportunity to ask someone who knows about computer science, i wont let it go past me. i need to know how it may be capable of interacting with wc3 as well. thanks.

[@xadion6866]

excuse my english, my primary language is greek. but i like to fancy myself as a low tier english man. *tips the tall english hat*. ahhahaha

[@TheShorka]

@@xadion6866 I am not well versed in FSR, so if it operates outside of the game then I would imagine it would work on Warsmash the same as on any game. But I would imagine that in places where I use a non-ideal algorithm on Warsmash and if the bad algorithm blocks the CPU of the computer by spending a lot of time to compute information that we needed to deduce more quickly, generally we are not going to be able to get the solution to a math problem without solving it with the rules I provided. So if someone makes an automatic enhancer to make things faster, then if I make a mistake in my code that slows it down in order to fix that they would have to not even be running my code. Maybe they would have an AI predict what my code was going to do... That kind of technology probably is not far away, but it is outside the scope of what I am doing when I try to emulate an old video game in Java.

[@TheShorka]

About 5 years ago when somebody published a free program to do some AI upscaling, I used it to make some upscaled versions of the textures on Warcraft III. I traded playing Warsmash with that a few years ago here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jHXSqKCQdp1_adU I don't know if you have a 4K computer to watch that, but the upscaled textures on the trees and terrain and icons and stuff make it look closer to 4K while not really changing the visuals from the originals much. The UI around the outside used some stuff from Reforged because my converter crashed on the UI borders back in 2019, though, and I never bothered to fix it.

[@flameseeker4060]

could you make warsmash compatible with reforged, where you can play with players from reforged in melee but keep the ui and fps improvements?

[@CMKzzz]

Thats the dream.

[@spanch1bobr]

@@CMKzzz ih he had like a team or sth then it woudn't be a dream)

[@IZNT-0]

is there a discord

[@TheShorka]

Sure. discord.com/invite/ucjftZ7x7H Maybe later I should switch to Matrix or some other thing to promote freedom, but I didn't yet.

[@SoRusted]

the blizzard did this because of the copyrights. If blizzard was ever were to make custom maps again they would make the creators lose all rights to their creations anyway. They are not making that type of mistake again. The following starcraft 2 map maker was explicit with copyright stating that all rights belong to blizzard and only blizzard. The War3 custom maps were so successful, like the top custom maps gave birth to the entire new games genres like the tower defense and mobas, including dota2, league of legends. League of Legends lead to the entire inception Riot games. There is more to the story but essentially custom maps were super successful. Shit was insane... And the editor system is not that special. There is nothing too special about this map editor, except that it was well done and the graphics and game is fun and not too tiresome on the eyes and whatnot. You could play or build for hours on end I would be careful about the copyrights. Like dota2 still keep changing names of heroes and abilities to make it look like different game, and league of legends had to reinvent all of the heroes without using old concepts from both blizzard and dota

[@egyiptomi9659]

Will it support Linux?

[@TheShorka]

Already does. I play it on there very frequently. kzbin.info/www/bejne/f4iYnKSAhZWJicU

[@TheShorka]

yes but my comment linking an example video of this seems to have perhaps disappeared, perhaps the machine mind has no interest in allowing me the freedom to reply. Check the videos on my channel for tutorial of what you ask.

[@TheShorka]

Does anybody else see my comments that replied to this? Just curious

[@yusufserdaryucel6659]

@@TheShorka yes it is visible

[@greatbigeyeball]

Warcraft 3 is just The Sims for 40 year old men (and I like that)

[@lloyd011721]

now all you have to do is make it your own ip and just have it play like wc3 but better...

[@leonun]

23:45

[@smitty78749]

new reforged stuff just bad, fact

[@vladislav_artyukhov]

After It make Warcraft 4

[@urskrik6353]

The world is ripe with Greed.

[@DekayVods]

idk, as someone who played this game a lot as a kid, I kind of don't care to see the old models anymore. reforged doesn't look great but I largely prefer it to the blocky style of days past.

[@TheShorka]

I appreciate that this may be your opinion, and I have met many people through time who shared this opinion, but because this was my hobby prior to a top-down corporate strategy being invented to make you feel that way expressly so that it would not be possible to render the character models with any technology other than the game, accordingly I do not care much about your opinion. Of course, because Warsmash is open source, it remains possible for you Reforged the Warsmash if that is what you choose to do. I tried it (kzbin.info/www/bejne/Y4DEZJyFjpuqi5I), but it was extremely time consuming and kind of boring, and when I reached out to the PopcornFX website and asked if I could pay them for a license to their software to put in my open source projects, they said they expressly don't support open source projects. Even money can't defeat them. So, the inability to render Reforged particles out of game is extremely intentional in my opinion. Once you pass the high level node blocks in their binary format, on the inner node blocks even interpreting to make a parser for the binary data requires an application level understanding of the types; size is implicit on object type. Because of this, it is not possible to make a program that jumps past unknowns and incrementally build up a parser. It is meant to only work for the people who already have the insider knowledge of how to use it. So by design Reforged will forever be constrained to only render the spell effects and glow particles inside the game itself. This prohibits "View in 3D" before download on model files, and other modding systems, on top of prohibiting projects like Warsmash from using their art. This is bad for modding, and it is a technological reality and not a matter of subjective opinion. Similarly, in a few years when the Reforged servers shut down because it's packaged as a Battle.net live service rather than a CD game that offers a live service on the side, there will be a future date when Reforged dies but Warcraft III does not. At that time, either all Reforged mods will be unplayable or else they might be supported on a side project made by someone at Microsoft which would probably be there to prevent a few modders from getting mad but make it harder and harder to replay custom content. This could happen as soon as tomorrow if Microsoft decides that they want a new Warcraft III: Definitive Edition that runs on Starcraft 2 engine as the future of Warcraft 3. They could just shut off the Reforged servers and put their new game on Xbox Game Pass for a monthly fee. In reality, that is probably not going to happen anytime soon. But the fact remains that it _will eventually happen_. That is the nature of Reforged as a game that requires an online connection. Are you planning to come back here and hassle me to support your Reforged graphics on this technological ark that I have built for myself when your game is gone, even though those graphics were built expressly to stop me? Or do you just not care about the future?

[@dr.angerous]

That pathfinder really sucks

[@awesomechannel7713]

Tldr. The author is a nerd who refuses to acknowledge he represents a marginal minority of WC3 players who were forgotten on the Reforged announcement. So he decided to once and forever implement his engine that would help him enjoy the game further and enjoy it more. He puts great effort into that and has great progress.

[@TheShorka]

Curious. In what way am I refusing to accept that I represent a marginal minority? I'm not sure that I ever said I am necessarily a majority -- simply that a type of user for this game program exists who was left behind, and that I feel like making what I want so that it doesn't have to be that way (at least for me). I'm not sure that I am very interested in whether my interests are a minority or majority. I am of a mind that I should be allowed to have my interests whether other people like it or not.

[@KingLich451]

Have you seen how much people hate reforged? It literally killed warcraft 3, period.

[@TheShorka]

@@KingLich451 that's how i felt about reforged until it released, because I thought I was a rebellious minority at the time, wanting Reforged to be better when the rest of the world -- wow players, whatever -- would just accept it as it was. When they all flipped, and i realized that half the time the reasons they wanted to hate included like stuff that probably was my fault for being a part of war3 modding ecosystem for, I reversed my stance a bit. I don't really understand the mentality of anyone who thought that a WoW dealership would produce something better than Reforged. There's a lot of social media at work there. I don't play Warcraft 3 for other people, so other people choosing not to play it doesn't really kill it for me. Although, the insiders from Activision told me that Reforged met its financial targets, and Warcraft 3 player count increased as a result of Reforged, so they succeeded in the way the corporate overlords desired. I'd imagine your sense of frustration or that what I'm saying isn't true is most likely the result of social media.

[@_xano]

There is a guy named Synergy, and he remade whole w3 base campaign in sc2 engine. As sc2 is free to play, everyone can go and play it in arcade section. Sc2 have so much better engine, units are more responsible, move with proper pathing.

[@njdarda]

what does this have to do with anything that retera talks about?

[@_xano]

@@njdarda ehm „warcraft 3 remake”

[@njdarda]

@@_xano so you havent watched or understood this video

[@_xano]

@@njdarda I’m deaf so maybe you are right. I also cannot read, nor write

[@wiceorc5105]

I think you should just chill ur brain and migrate into starcraft II and start only seek fun of making maps (or models). Because it feels like reforged is just a dumbster and if the developers someday are able to fix that dumbster we might come back but as long as it happens i will just continue to use starcraft II that is the closest thing to warcraft IV we can have... Dont stop thought using java to make games its super cool.. propably make ur own project game or something..

[@TheShorka]

If Activision publishes the computer program that they used to convert all Warcraft 3 models to the Starcraft 2 format, so that the thousands or tends of thousands of custom Warcraft III models that already exist are then ported to the Starcraft 2 format in an automatic way, maybe I would consider this. Otherwise, if I want to throw the hobby I was doing for 18 years under the bus, I can just play Reforged, to be honest. I find modding Reforged, if I wanted to do it, to often be easier than modding Starcraft 2 is for me because it's a derivative work of the Frozen Throne source code and so a lot of the mannerisms work the same way. It's extremely inconceivable to me that the developers would be able to fix Reforged in my personal life, because I'm just selfish to a degree and I want the power to edit the game. If I want to have 3x3 inventory that can hold up to 9 items, or if I want a 3x5 command card with more buttons, I like to be able to modify whatever I want. Just as soon as Reforged would give me that, I would start wanting something more. Using an open source simulator means I can make any kind of modding that I like, and it does not come at the expense of goobers who want to pay Activision to play the versus mode. One issue we saw with Reforged was that if Activision takes suggestions from people like me to make the original game more modular, it can break the base game for people who don't care about details and then they all cry foul online. That's not hypothetical, they really did do that. I can provide a technical example if you're interested. So from my standpoint it it seems like it is literally better to be doing what I am doing than to use the official programs. But I am not religious about this, sometimes I still open the official programs to take a look. And, my project has the added side benefit of allowing some manner of maintenance for a style of game experience that might otherwise die out, like discussed in this video.

[@TheShorka]

Despite the above comment about my selfishness, and how it is unlikely that Activision could fix Reforged, I think that now that Microsoft owns Activision and so they have DRM built into Windows anyway it seems reasonable to me that they could patch Reforged to remove all DRM and make it into an EXE that launches on Windows similar to what Warcraft III was from 2009 to 2018, with no requirement for networking of any kind to start up -- and an easily hackable game data storage system where anybody can hack their client directly (like how MPQ ended up being for the modding community, although I appreciate in 2002 it wasn't meant to be that way). This would make Reforged as modifiable and maintainable for the custom game community as its predecessor, and so maybe it would deter my motivations. For example then I could finish the Warcraft III mod that I worked on for many years that has its own 3d menu screen and UIs and stuff, and perhaps make a Reforged based version. But their company has no incentive to give me that power to finish the project that I was working on for 15-18 years, so it seems easier to rewrite the entire game so that then I can get back to modding it and finish what I was working on.

[@wiceorc5105]

yeah but you did reverse engineer the program when you created ur program? and its forbidden by the original warcraft III eula.

[@TheShorka]

@@wiceorc5105 I made a program that looks like their program. Their program was made by smart people in a hurry writing some shoddy hacks, so I tried to write in the style of shoddy hacks made in a hurry, and it comes out looking similar. I did not spend the time to try to reverse binary of their code back to ASCII as the means to do this, since that would have been really boring. If Activision Microsoft feels that my project is forbidden by their Warcraft III eula, then they can ban me from the Warcraft III online play per the terms of the eula. At that point I would put the CD that is my property into my computer and probably play some Warsmash. Tough luck for Activision Microsoft. If they send me a court order preventing me from using their copyright assets that are on the CD that is my property, then I will make my own assets and play Warsmash with my own assets on GNU Linux.

[@wiceorc5105]

@@TheShorka why you did not want to help me to maintain project jenova wc3 server? we could have played all the old warcraft 3 custom maps with all the old models within patch 1.26a? i asked you 2 times to test that.. but no..