Making H2SO4 from Sulfates and HCl

[@DrSpooglemon]

This is genius. With only pool acidifier and table salt I can make all the H2SO4 and HCL I need. [I don't need that much]

[@DrSAM69]

The reaction equilibrium normally leans heavily towards sulfates and HCl as a product, in fact a common way to make HCl is to treat chlorides with H2SO4. From what I understand this method tricks this equilibrium since NaCl falls out of solution while the sulphate is more soluble and since the extra Na+ & Cl- ions solution give a common-ion effect the solubility of NaCl decreases even more. I bet the HCl must be very concentrated for this to work though.

[@DrSAM69]

Judging by the solubility values this likely won't work with espom salts but it shoud work really well with ammonium sulfate, a common fertilizer.

[@EdwardTriesToScience]

Yep, you can force many reactions that normally wouldn't be favorable by making one of the products precipitate out, in fact you can make sulfuric acid from a sulfate and oxalic acid

[@Berghiker]

It will even work with 30% HCL.

[@pkalpha3]

This is a very good and informative video. I have been working on using similar reagents to produce sulfuric acid and have come up with several ways. Now that I saw your video I would like to give it a go but also I will be doing a few tweaks to increase efficiency to this technique. Ill definately mention you and give you credits because I probably would still be sitting for weeks until I would somehow figure this out. Great content!

[@gresmaster2279]

This is really cool i have a lot of NaSO4 because its a byproduct of a explosive i make

[@satina1169]

It feels like every hobby chemist has or used to have this 10€ hotplate 😄 does the job very well though

[@alexslab.4875]

Thanks alot!. Im my country sulfuric acid drain cleaner is banned, so this will help me!

[@noodlesoup2281]

Great video 👍

[@snoowbrigade]

So calcium sulfate would be a terrible sulfate salt to use in this reaction since calcium chloride is much more water soluble than calcium sulfate is. Would that make calcium sulfate a good salt to make HCl in this manner? Could you switch the sulfate and chloride between KCl and CaSO4 to create KSO4 which then would create sulfuric acid in the reaction in the video? Ugh, I got good grades in chemistry at school, too bad we didn't learn much.

[@Iodine_53]

Thanks a lot!

[@soppingclam]

dextroamphetamine would include the removal of H2SO4 and introducing hydrochloric acid. I assume among other things

[@ae-bd5gr]

Can a similar method be used to make HNO3 from HCL and KNO3? At 40C The potassium chloride is already a lot less soluble than the nitrate, and due to the low boiling point of both acids (in comparison to the one of Sulfuric Acid), i think they can be distilled quite easily.

[@Julian-wp8sc]

i’ve heard you won’t be able to separate the HCl from HNO3 once completed

[@Sultan.Mahmod]

Thanks 👍

[@Berghiker]

Does the heat of the glass joint not melt the teflon tape?

[@corrosivechemistry]

Teflon has a melting point of 327°C. Even when molten the viscosity is verry high and it won't flow easily. It it is genarally considered to be usable up to at least 200°C without any signs of degradation. At 200°C pyrolysis is detectable but noticeable deterioration starts at around 260°C. At 350°C it start to decompose with full pyrolysis reached at 400°C.

[@Berghiker]

You can make it without using a 2 cell permeable membrane cell.

[@dire_prism]

Could you explain what drives the direction of the reaction, since it's usually in th other direction - creating HCl from NaCl and NaHS04.

[@corrosivechemistry]

The driving force here is that the reaction stays in equalibrium so all that HCl + NaHSO4 and NaCl + H2SO4 all exist next to each other and when the NaCl is crystalised and filtered out it cannot react back. This only works when the Chloride salt is less soluble then the sulfate, otherwise it would push in the other direction.

[@dire_prism]

@@corrosivechemistry ah yeah I get it now - it's the rather low solubility of NaCl, particularly in an excess of Cl- ions. Similar to how strong acids can be made with oxalic acid and calcium salts.

[@Berghiker]

It would have been nice if you had a little more patience and let the concentrated acid cool down to room temperature before adding it to the paper. Hot acid is always more effective.

[@DrSpooglemon]

Is the yellow color from elemental sulphur? I got a bit of yellow at the start and a lot of spent matches and egg smells which I presume to be sulphur, sulphur dioxide and hydrogen sulphide respectively. Is this side reactions or could it be impurities in the NaHSO4?

[@corrosivechemistry]

Those are most likely impurities in the NaHSO4, mine already smells like that in its powder Form, however if you heat it too much (in excess of 300°C) it will produce SO3 and convert to the pyrosulphate Form. I actually explored this reaction too, but it wasn't really feasible to produce sulphuric acid. The yellow color is also probably iron instead of elemental Sulphur. You could test for iron by the thiocyanate Methode.

[@ابوالليل-ث4م]

Hello, is it possible to use ammonium sulfate instead of sodium sulfate?

[@حس_ين]

اي تقدر

[@Gamiecode]

Can 10% hcl work

[@vahagnmelikyan2906]

How can I redissolve lead sulfate from lead acid battery to revive it? I read somewhere it says you have to remove the acid and add distilled water and use electrolysis (charge the battery) using 5amp. But I also read somewhere that to redissolve crystals you jave to add more concentration of sulfuric acid... So which o e is correct? Can I add hot water maybe?

[@michaelwonner6067]

Why not heating Sodium Bisulfate until SO3 is liberated? Maybe a suggestion for a next Video….

[@turtleteam54]

Hello from France, nice and éducative vidéo. Do you think that you can do the same SODIUM HYDROGENOSULFATE TO SULFURIC ACID, but using electrolyse way ? Regards.

[@corrosivechemistry]

Thank you, I'm actually working on this, but the biggest problem is the membrane, there is not really a good and easy option for the home chemist, I'll finish the video as soon as possible.

[@turtleteam54]

@@corrosivechemistry Hello, thanks for the answer. I trust you will do a good and nice job. I have some interesting documents about Hydrogenosulfate to sulfuric acid for you, but this is in french... Did you have a mail adress ?

[@soppingclam]

Have you tried changing Dextroamphetamine Sulfate (dextro isomer of the compound d,l-amphetamine sulfate) into Amphetamine Hydrochloride or methamphetamine Hydrochloride. To me it seems as though, they started with the d,l amp and though many prcocess changed it to dexto. -> I have made many compounds but tehre is something im doing wrong just by using the 5mg tablets. If I can't do this using my own calculations and perform it in the lab I fail my final course. Help please... or just call me an idiot for not working it out

[@zwiebacktoast8349]

Which concentration has your HCL ?

[@freigeist5161]

Mach doch mal ein Video über konzentrieren von Salz und Salpetersäure.Gute Abflussreiniger wie pure Salz oder Schwefelsäure sind seit 21 für Privatleute ja verboten,Schwefelsäure kann man durch kochen konzentrieren stinkt aber sehr,um Urinstein und Verstopfungen ohne den Gestank zu lösen käme dann nur Salzsäure in Frage,die man aber über kochen nicht konzentrieren kann.

[@Ex-fk4nr]

Can these be used as car battery acid

[@Berghiker]

When I heated 500ml of clean 38% battery acid to 380 deg C, it never boiled, it only steamed. Why is that? I ended up with 190ml of 94.5% H2SO4. Also, 1.285g per ml on the lable equates to 70.2% acid, not 38%. I don't understand why that is. Can you please explain? I did this outside on a hotplate and had no foil covering the beaker.

[@alexa.davronov1537]

You can't concentrate sulfuric acid beyond certain level.

[@TheFireGoose]

I assume that cause sulfuric acid has a boiling point of around 300c it prevents water from coming to a full rolling boil. Also 1.285g/ml is what 38% is not 70%, perhaps there was some confusion in your calculation.

[@MirekNovak007]

Thanks. 🌚

[@snoowbrigade]

why wouldn't this reaction work for nitrates to create nitric acid?

[@ae-bd5gr]

Thats exactly what im wondering, using potassium nitrate and HCl.

[@SodiumInteresting]

Make fuming nitric acid by heating dry sodium bisulfate with dry calcium nitrate. HNO2 will distill over to a collection vessel

[@vlosyros52]

Do you think that Magnesium Sulfate would work with this method ?

[@snoowbrigade]

since magnesium sulfate is less soluble than magnesium chloride magnesium sulfate should not work or work poorly for this reaction if sulfuric acid is desired.

[@immadamir]

Can I do these same steps with the Ferric Sulphate salt? Or do I have to change the process? I want to make H2SO4 from Fe2(SO4)3, what should I do? I will be burning the ferric salt, so I am wondering if I can produce H2SO4 from the SO3 that will be released. Thank you for the help.

[@TheRecho]

You can make H2SO4 directly from the iron salt. When heated really much, it will decompose into ironoxides, SO3 and some water as well. The later two combine, forming H2SO4. This is the oldest way to make sulfuric acid

[@immadamir]

@@TheRecho Is SO3 highly soluble in water? Do I have to shower water on the gas or do I directly release it inside a chamber containing water?

[@TheRecho]

@@immadamir You just have to distill. There will be water vapour as well as SO3. But to answer your question. Yes, SO3 is very 'soluble' in water. It reacts with water, as you know, to form H2SO4.

[@immadamir]

@@TheRecho I have read that it is an exothermic reaction. Does this changes if I use only tap water?

[@TheRecho]

@@immadamir No. It will still produce a lot of heat.

[@sumanmesta806]

can we make it from gypsum chalk (CaSO4) and hcl which makes cacl and hso4

[@corrosivechemistry]

Unfortunately not, the whole reason why this works is because the chloride is less solvable then the sulfate, but calcium sulfate is basically insoluble, therefore it will not Form H2SO4

[@Berghiker]

In which cell is the acid formed? Anode or cathode cell?

[@kastonmurrell6649]

If run in a two compartment cell, the acid would form on the anode side. Your negatively charged sulfate would be attracted to the positively charged anode.

[@jadentonkin466]

wow thank you so much but how can hydrogen displace sodium or is it the other way around sodium displaces hydrogen this saved me 30 dollars from buying an addition funnel i was gona use nurd rages metabisulfate oxidiser method also this uses cheaper chemicals thanks

[@corrosivechemistry]

Thank you, the hydrogen in the HCl displaces the Na in the NaHSO4, and by cooling it down the Na and the Cl precipitate as Sodium chloride, but you won't get all out, thats the downside of this method, the Sulfuric acid will be contaminated with salt, but for dirty reactions where a little NaCl doesn't matter this is a cheap way to make A little H2SO4

[@jadentonkin466]

@@corrosivechemistry but hydrogen has a lower reactivity

[@私エンターテイナーです]

Can we use potassium sulphate/k2S04?

[@Pyrokartoffel]

Yes

[@TheCaptainLulz]

I live where you can buy 92% for drain unclogging so I wont be using this. But its still useful in case that changes. Thanks.

[@corrosivechemistry]

Yeah, if you have access to sulfuric acid then this process definitely isn't needed, I can buy it as a 10% solution for pool acidification which I just have to boil down and maybe distill. But it's interesting that this process is possible.

[@alexa.davronov1537]

Is there any explanation behind this process? What's the reactions exactly? How do they work?

[@yukoro828]

Idk why but my distillation results turned purple reddish has any one an explanation?

[@zwiebacktoast8349]

Can this work also with H3PO4 ?

[@vincentgamboa4621]

No

[@Martin-lg3yn]

So i can use calcium sulfate right?

[@corrosivechemistry]

No unfortunately not, calcium sulfate is extremely insoluble, and the driving force of this reaction Is that the sulfate salt is more soluble then the chloride.

[@xaybiz]

So 3 moles of HCL for evey mol of NaHSO3?

[@corrosivechemistry]

Kind of, in this case the exact stoichiometric ratio isn't important, but having a lot of excess HCl present is. This will drive down the solubility of the NaCl due to the common ion effect, but also ensure that there is enough H+ available to push the reaction forward.

[@xaybiz]

@@corrosivechemistry thanks

[@ftyuiijhvyui1056]

i dont know why im here also can anyone tell me what this can do?

[@Berghiker]

Making H2SO4 electrolytically, you have to boil of about 98% of the water afterwards to get concentrated acid. That's a big downside to that method. It's better to buy battery acid and boil of 60% of the water (Battery acid 38%)or use the method like you do in this video although it's a longer method.

[@عبدالرحمن-ن1ح8ض]

What do you think of ammonium sulfate? I have an idea to add sodium hydroxide to convert it to sodium sulfate and then I do an experiment but the concentration of Hcl is 15. I don't know if anything will happen.😊

[@Berghiker]

Why didn't you just skip the boiling process and just do the distillation instead?

[@corrosivechemistry]

Because the real reaction happens while cooling the mixture. When the NaCl falls out of solution the sulfuric acid is left behind. And I only boil it to ensure a complete mixing of the chemicals before crystalising. But while your crystals are forming there still has to be a lot of HCl present so you can only destill after you have removed the crystals by decanting or filtering. Otherwise you will just be producing HCl again since it will boil off instead of forming NaCl and sulfuric acid.

[@Berghiker]

@@corrosivechemistry So you are obviously using stoichiometric amounts of HCL and NaHSO4 so that they will all be used up, right?

[@Linus-nq2op]

@@Berghiker I think you need more HCl to displace the equilibrium to the H2SO4 side.

[@Berghiker]

I made H2SO4 electrolytically by electrolysis using a platinum anode and it took no longer than 7 hours. It will never get completely clear like water. The solution will remain a very light green color and is around 51 to 56% H2SO4. If you continue any longer, the color will not get any clearer and the acid itsef will start to evaporate which is a waste.

[@corrosivechemistry]

Did you make it like you said in your other comment without a separation between cells? If so please elaborate, it is possible with copper sulfate as the electrolyte, but not with NaHSO4 at least not that I'm aware of. Also I'm pretty sure it wont evaporate like you said, the boiling point of sulfuric acid is around 300C and before reaching the azeotrope of around 98% you'll be boiling of water actually increasing the concentration.

[@Berghiker]

@@corrosivechemistry I used copper sulphate 40g in 100ml water. No seperation. I haven't boiled down the acid yet. Very corrosive fumes were given off from the electrolysis as it was extremely hot running at 7 amps! the fumes then condensed on the outer glass covering over the beaker and ended up on the table and some in the air.

[@misslive92]

Bro. how I make 98%concentrate h2so4 using Na2so4 and hcl ? Please reply me bro.

[@Strobie_one]

Please re render the video with much much higher gain on your microphone. The meters should be hovering over 0db (unity) Also make sure you have panned the audio to both left and right