Flux core penetration and the importance of settings

[@jimmywilson1388]

I’m loving all this flux core welding. Thanks for the videos and advice.

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

I problem, I am glad you are liking it. I am have atleast 4-5 more videos on it coming out in the next 10 days, then I will switch to uploading my MiG videos I have shot thus far 😀

[@plu5five]

Thankyou for the video! I just bought a Lincoln 90i FC Flux-vore welder and some Lincoln 211 035 wire and have been watching as many flux core vids as I can Your vids on it are Super Informative and I Appreciate it a Ton!!!🍻🍻🍻

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

No problem and congrats on getting a very useful little welder. You will be able to make a lot of stuff with it. The most important thing is to practice a bunch and focus on being as consistent and smooth as possible. Expect to fail a bunch but it won’t take long to be able to build some cool stuff 😀

[@plu5five]

@makingmistakeswithgreg i will! And Thankyou Again im Subscribed!

[@DePistolero]

I started welding and bought 200w hugong and welding only flux wire, what was anoying to me is that all gas mig welding machines have distinct cracking sound while mine sounds JUST like yours in the video... so this is very encouraging to me!!!! Also I run ventilator behind me so it blows away all the excess smoke and gasses... which is awesome... I think personally that flux is the future!!!

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

Flux core definitely has a distinct sound that I think is far better than the harsh mig sound. Some of that sound has to do with how the machine regulates voltage and inductance, but flux core is still more pleasant. I am honestly not a huge short circuit mig fan, I rather stick, tig, or flux core weld. Anyway, glad to hear you have a fan setup, keep the air clean and your lungs safe 😀👍.

[@ls2005019227]

What an awesome video! Thanks for taking the time to show folks & prove through cutting/etching what is possible. I agree with another commenter; FCAW has received a bad wrap from underpowered welders and those that were unaware of the polarity difference.....but certainly has a place for producing a quality result when used correctly. Thanks!

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

No problem 😀. Hopefully I can help people realize how beneficial flux core wire is on thicker steel, and how useful it actually is. Far easier to run vertical up than mig, better penetration on thicker material, and it does put some good looking welds. 😀

[@bobs12andahalf2]

Accidentally got into flux core because I got a cheapo mig and wanted to test it out before getting a bottle and regulator that would cost almost as much as the machine. Absolutely fell in love and never got round to setting it up for gas. Flux core is amazing.

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

Flux core definitely is. It has a bad rap for a lot of reasons (mainly because many people are inexperienced and don’t know how to run it). I honestly found it to be exceptional for general use and I tend to use to over short circuit mig for tons of jobs. It’s way easier to weld out of position, it makes really good looking welds, and it super convenient due to not needing a gas bottle.

[@ezelk1337]

Impressive job! Strong welds and they look great too.

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

Wanted to give a quick clarification: I dipped the plates in water between passes and let them further cool to room temp. Being quarter inch plates it could add 40min to the video production time to wait to air cool. This is acceptable for practice welds but should never be done on actual welds that serve a purpose. 😎

[@harryharris7663]

Brilliant video thanks Greg. I'm sold now on flux core...

[@IHoboJunk]

Love the channel Greg, subscribed for Bob. I dropped in for the Titanium 125 and have stayed watching for the quality content. The welding safety video was much appreciated, it kept me in the game, all the fumes were pushing me away from practicing. I'll make sure to send you my homework. Anyway you can make jig video down the line to practice different welding angles/positions we would encounter in the field? And maybe take the class out on a field trip for a repair or interview with fellow welders. I've gone on too long, thanks for everything, good karma to you and much success. 😊

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

Thanks much for the kind words. The safety end is a important aspect, and it surely is hard to be a hypocrite with it (easy to say hard to do lol). For me It’s so difficult for me to shoot videos and then voice dub over that I find it a hard balance to wear a respirator and teach. You will see me using my powered respirator welding hood in some videos coming up though, mostly where I don’t talk (just weld lol). I definitely will have to make a jig of some sort, I generally just tack stuff to my table, but that’s not the smartest for sure lol. I will see what I can do on a field trip, I have been turning down a ton of work like that for the sake of focusing on skills related videos, but I will make some calls and see what kind of fun stuff I can get involved in. I appreciate the idea and I will follow through with something 😀.

[@Cptnbond]

Regarding fumes, and safety. Flux core is much worse than stick fumes. Just saying. I'm always outside when using flux core. I also liked Greg's safety video - the best I have seen on this topic.

[@melgross]

I’ve always found it amusing that the Lincoln text, the standard, though written some time ago, says that a moderate amount of porosity isn’t important except in the minds of weld inspectors.

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

Haha that’s pretty funny. Moderate porosity would be hard to measure the actual strength/durability loss, but the way they said that is kind of like it doesn’t matter lol. You definitely don’t want it lol.

[@ropo772]

Great video and comparison. I've seen alot of talk about using it structurally and I'm impressed with the penetration. Thanks.

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

Thanks 😀. Flux core is talked down on because how many people (typically with AC output harbor freight 99$ welders) butcher welds with it. From a standpoint of strength the penetration will be more with flux core. Just wait until I do a comparison between short circuit MiG and flux core on 3/8th plate, that will be eye opening for sure lol .

[@massa-blasta]

@@makingmistakeswithgreg I think Jody Collier did a shocking comparison with regular flux core vs C02 shielded Mig and the C02 shield achieved greater penetration with less splatter once you set the machine right. This is for a 120v welder, the splatter comes at the higher voltages not achieved on 120v.

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

@@massa-blasta I have a feeling straight c02 would produce very good penetration on a smaller MiG welder, it’s pretty much your only shot when welding 1/4in plate with a small MiG machine. I have never ran straight c02 with MiG that I can recall, a lot of guys I know do it because they claim it’s cheaper. I will definitely have to test it.

[@skipwaelty3974]

Always informative and well executed. Thanks

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

You’re welcome 😀

[@andrewford80]

This is really interesting. I have only just started welding and thought I'd get under way with flux core and was pretty impressed with the appearance of the welds on the surface. It's good to hear that flux core isn't just a process for shit kicker projects :)

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

Flux core is definitely a very capable process. In practical testing it’s not quite as strong as normal mig but it’s close. It’s far easier to weld uphill with than many welding processes, it has excellent penetration, and it works far better outdoors than gas shielded mig. You can definitely build a ton of stuff with it. Just make sure to buy quality wire for stuff other than practice.

[@andrewford80]

@@makingmistakeswithgreg thanks for your advice!

[@mkearn724]

Nice video Greg. I was kinda curious to what the outcome would be. I wasn’t sure if the results would be as noticeable as they were, because it seemed as you jumped up in heat and feed it appeared as your stick out increased some. When I noticed that I figured the increase in heat was gonna kinda be counteracted. I was pretty impressed with the results. I’ve been runnin a lot of fluxcore and dualshield lately at work, and other than keeping the ln25 feeder running smoothly it’s been great. The amount of weld that gets put in is pretty wild

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

My stickout did increase some, primarily because I positioned myself and the camera in a manner that I couldn’t see what I was doing 😅. Part of it could also be the first few inches I had to base the stickout on the sound the arc made, which automatically made me favor a longer stickout as the setpoints increased. I also cut the plates a second time out of curiosity and the welds further down looked identical. Dual shield will generally hit even better penetration. Obviously human variability will play a role in penetration to a certain extent. It’s too bad that common people trash self shielded wire and often think dual shield is the same, because they are both solid processes that are very useful. What kind of stuff are you building with flux core?

[@mkearn724]

@@makingmistakeswithgreg at work recently I was running fluxcore to weld diagonal tube braces that are slotted in order to swallow gusset plates. Of course the torch slots were very “generous” to speed up the erecting process. Most of those called for 5/8 fillets, but they ended up being 3/4+ lmao. A lot of full pen moment connections also. I’m working on the new pgh international airport. The mock-up that I’m welding at the moment with 7018 root and dualshield fill n cap would blow your mind. Let’s just say, that the fabricator made some mistakes and I’m doing a test piece just to make sure that putting this much weld in will still be structurally sound. I was trying to remember which video it was where you mentioned your email address

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

@@mkearn724 [e-mail] . Sounds like a good time welding that up. I swear the kerf on a torch cut can be 1/4in + wide at times 😅. The old “I said a whole 3/4in wide, not 3/4 inch clearance on both sides” deal lol.

[@mkearn724]

@@makingmistakeswithgreg that’s exactly what the raising gang did, slot em big so they don’t have to fight em in, fuck the welders 🤣🤣

[@richardreynolds3597]

Another great video - Thank you!

[@peetky8645]

good video, informative and clear.

[@tallyman15]

More great information. I am thinking about getting a mig welder. Looking at Everlast cyclone 212. Should I master stick first?

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

Great question. Mig makes welding far easier for general work, and you will be able to put down better welds faster. However it isn’t the best to weld poor/rusty material, and it’s actually far harder to weld vertical up with than stick. If you do a lot of repair work stick is more useful. For making of stuff from new steel mig tends to be better.

[@williamthomas9463]

Very informative video. Thanks!

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

You’re welcome 😀.

[@massa-blasta]

Hearing Morning You Tubers always makes me feel like a Potato Head, but I enjoyed the video and have noted your settings. Did you cool the plate between passes, or just kept upping the wire-feed speed and voltage as the plate got hotter and hotter. 🤔

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

I cooled it to room temp between passes 😀.

[@markdeitchman8938]

two questions Greg: 1. did you use a sawzall to cut the pieces? or bandsaw or something else? I haven't rried the sawzall method yet, but I am tempted. your cut and etch turn out so good! 2. is this flux core gas-less welding process a short arc process, or a spray arc process? if it is spray arc, am I correct that you don't need as much voltage using gas-less fcaw to spray arc compared to using gmaw with spray arc? I find it interesting that gas-less fcaw can work with a lower voltage. ( I love your videos....very educational.)

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

I generally use a sawzall to cut them, with a Diablo carbide blade. I did a video showing it here kzbin.info/www/bejne/boHHYWSfpqijh80 . I have a dry cut saw but I don’t often use it for cutting welds. Simple carbide blade and sawzall works great. As far as flux core Gasless (fcaw-s) mode of transfer, it sort of is in its own category. The 3 hardwire modes are short arc/short circuit, globular, and spray. The determining factor is how the process functions, with spray having droplets smaller than the wire size. Self shielded flux core is closer to globular than spray in my opinion. If the wire is gas shielded dual shield and higher values are used it would be closer to spray. It’s easier to get flux core wire to function like spray arc than normal MiG because the actual metal in the wire is less on say .030 flux core than .030 hardwire. .030 flux core is hollow and full of flux that doesn’t deposit metal, so the effective metal to heat ratio is closer to .023 mig wire than .030. I actually did some research on this and the general consensus is it’s a form of globular transfer with normal self shielded wire. Which is arguably what stick welding is as well, it’s not short circuit and it’s not spray.

[@markdeitchman8938]

@@makingmistakeswithgreg thanks for explaining. good info.

[@peetky8645]

that fabshield looked awesome........sold

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

Honestly I generally buy Lincoln nr211 (because for some reason the fab shield is always out of stock around here) but I will be making a switch to the Hobart. Which is funny because I prefer Lincoln rods over all Hobart ones. Once I got the run in speed and burn back set on my welder it runs very consistent start to finish and the cleanness of everything is actually surprising. It’s also a multi pass capable wire just like nr211.

[@peetky8645]

@@makingmistakeswithgreg Zila mentioned the same - not fond of hobart consumables other than fabshield.

[@Cptnbond]

Hi Greg. Flux core does have kind of 'bad' reputations. When we're buying welding material, you often get comments like it's expensive, and why not use gas shielded wire - and they have not even asked which application I have in mind.

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

It is expensive in comparison to gas shielded wire but it does have more penetration, no need for shielding gas, and can be used outdoors without issue. It’s also easier to weld out of position with. Just wait until I compare the penetration of flux core on 3/8th plate to hardwire gas shielded MiG, that will be a eye opener for sure.

[@kleinbergers33]

Got your info. What heat setting 0r wattage should I use with .030 wire for thin panels.

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

Flux core is based on voltage and wire feed. Some wire welders don’t adjust based on these and instead adjust on values unique to the machine. You must find a chart for your machine if it uses something other than voltage and wire feed as settings, there is no way to directly correlate proprietary numbers to a standardized voltage and wire feed speed. For actual values 70-100 in/min wire feed and 13 to 14 volts would be a starting point.

[@tyrotrainer765]

Hi Greg, this is off topic but I hope you can help: I'm in the Philippines and it's easy to get 0.030 and 0.035 flux core but brands unknown in the west. I couldn't tell a good brand if I tripped over it because I'm new to this. Do you think cost is something to go by? Some generics are 2 dollars a kilo, others are 7 or 8 dollars. The cheap stuff seems OK, but that's to me; how can I tell rubbish from quality?

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

I can give you this advice. Flux core wire here in the states general comes in two types. One is called “E71T-GS” and the other is labeled as “E71T-11”. The price difference is 2-3 times as much for the t-11. There are differences, the -gs is not rated for multiple pass nor is it generally tested to meet certain welding codes. The -11 is fully tested to meet codes and rated for multi pass. What can happen with multi pass welds is the welding codes can become brittle. Double check the specs on the wire if possible, if one is -11 vs -gs that is why there is a price difference. Use -11 on critical stuff that needs strength and -gs for general use on things that don’t matter (fences, yard art, etc). Hopefully that helps you out 😀👍

[@tyrotrainer765]

@@makingmistakeswithgreg Many thanks! The machine came preloaded with 0.035 GS and I have just received some 0.030 -11, based on what I've read online. I'll be interested to see how the -11 shapes up; I've built a frame for a storm-drain cover using GS and I will continue the project tomorrow with -11. Cheers Greg.

[@kleinbergers33]

I am using flux core and blowing holes in sheet metal that is from 1929. What wattage should I use, ?

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

So with flux core on thin material you need to control heat input. The first thing you need to do is use .030 wire if you’re not. Second sheet metal is commonly welded with short welds or just spot welds. Due to the penetration of flux core, it can be tough to run low enough settings to get a weld that doesn’t blow a hole. Short circuit might with gas and .023 wire is far easier. However it should be doable with .030 wire. Higher end wire welders have adjustable settings (inductance, run in speed, spot timer, etc) to make it easier. If yours doesn’t have settings to adjust do a practice plate on steel the same thickness and focus on doing small spot welds. It should be doable with a bit of practice.

[@peetky8645]

did you quench between passes?

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

I dipped it and let it air cool to room temp. Not good for weld durability and grain structure 😂but effective at penetration testing. I actually shot a video looking at if there was a difference in quenching vs letting it cool via air on penetration. I found no measurable difference on the mild steel I use, so I scrapped the video lol. On any kind of heat treatable or higher carbon steels that would be a definite no go. I am getting setup to shoot a real solid guide on how to weld cast iron and in that video there won’t be one drop of water touching anything lol.

[@peetky8645]

@@makingmistakeswithgreg if you run out of subjects, i got a paperback book from the 70's from the james lincoln foundation that was essentially a trade school welding course book with like 200 different lessons. doing a video version of that source material would be cool.

[@buggyduggy2431]

Now do the same thing with mill scale left on the steel.

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

I did do that in a video or two. Milscale didn’t have a huge impact on penetration (much less than expected) but it definitely changed the look of the beads. I will be doing a test of a weld on millscale vs clean coming up to get a idea if a break test would have different results.

[@peetky8645]

do you ever use a respirator?

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

For the sake of the video no (but I probably should still). Off camera I have a air handling unit that pulls smoke out of the air though. I do have a powered air purifying respirator welding hood as well, I generally wear when I am not filming. You will see that in a upcoming video where I spend 3 hours tig welding a stainless artwork.

[@peetky8645]

@@makingmistakeswithgreg nice--i have been looking into making one of those, both an extractor and a personal positive pressure filtered air supply

[@TheOneAndOnlySame]

Flux core welding is a bit dirty, is not the prettiest but it's always ready, can be used anywhere, by all conditions and has tremendous penetration Exactly like my peanus.

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

Haha I don’t know about the last part but the first part is accurate. Just remember, don’t try to stick it out a small amount, or you’ll have holes. 😅

[@yurimodin7333]

I think FCAW gets a bad rap from all the junk $100 Harbor Freight Chicago Electric AC welders. Those things are awful since these wires are meant to run DCEP......also ppl using FCAW on the wrong polarity by mistake performs terrible.

[@makingmistakeswithgreg]

Yep, 100%. Good flux core wire run with proper settings looks just like a good stick weld, and is strong without a doubt.