March Core Update Analysis with Lily Ray (Ep. 334)

As we come to the end of the March 2024 Core update, many things have changed in the Google landscape, and it’s time to start looking at where we landed.
And to help you navigate these changes, we wanted to bring a guest that’s out in the trenches every day - Lily Ray 🔥
If you don’t know her from her work in a large SEO agency in New York, then you definitely know her as a prominent and very opinionated character in the industry - she shares a ton of interesting insights about SEO on social media, including a lot of original research.
In this episode, Lily and Gael get straight to it and cover many of the hottest topics in search right now, including:
👉 the visibility changes of pure content sites and how your business model may affect your visibility
👉 Reddit and Quora monopolizing search results and how long it may last
👉 HCU, and the divergence between Google’s guidelines and what we observe
👉 signals outside of the “traditional” that Google is giving a lot of importance to these days
We also take a look at specific examples - and they often break the rules - so don’t miss out on this one.
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A special thanks to our sponsors for this episode, the all-in-one SEO tool set, Ahrefs:
www.authorityhacker.com/recom...
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Looking for 100s of more episodes like these? Check out our main KZbin channel: / @authorityhacker
Or visit our podcast page: www.authorityhacker.com/podcast/
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More about Lily Ray
Twitter: / lilyraynyc
LinkedIn: / lily-ray-44755615
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Timestamps:
00:00 Intro
02:10 Unhelpful content in Google
04:11 Takeaways from the March Update
06:03 SERP features
07:05 Winner from the update
10:48 Similarities to ‘Penguin’
14:27 Unfairly hit by HCU
17:55 Chaotic vs. Templated content
21:01 Category bias?
22:12 Dangers of following the crowd
23:53 Google’s mixed communications
27:36 Business model as a ranking factor
31:25 Evolution of SEO
35:19 EEAT vs. Domain Authority
39:39 May(day) 5th
43:44 The consequences
45:55 Adapting to Google products
50:17 Impact of SGE
56:04 TL:DW

[@AuthorityHacker]

If you want to learn how to start and grow profitable authority sites today (that can adapt to Google's constant updates) visit The Authority Site System
👉 www.authorityhacker.com/free-training/

[@vitaliykolos]

I'm a huge fan of the TL;DR at the end of the video. Thanks a bunch for that, Gael! :)

[@leandrosantorsola684]

Thanks for the summary at the end! It actually helps to digest the key points of the video better.

[@user-is7es3vp1t]

22:39, 42:56 - On tech stack and content experience, one thing the big players do is constantly evolve their pages. Just look at top pages in Wayback machine - they evolve many times over a year. They continuously run A/B tests, look at data, conduct user interviews, etc, etc to improve their websites in a very scientific and data-driven way. It's a huge disadvantage if you are just using a standard WP theme with some SEO "tricks". To compete, we need to emulate their process rather than emulate their websites.

[@markototev]

The big issue is that while google rewards the big media corps for doing one thing, they give advice to "us" to do something else and that thing is rarely rewarded. Never if they are up against someone already established. At this point I think we need a tracker on Google leaders and their stock buys, especially when related to big media companies lol.

[@andrews749]

Agreed, however you post this like its "news" or in anyway recent. Alphabet's senior team have been doing this for decades - at this point! So its completely moot. They are immune from meaningful anti-trust (beyond fines) because they are deep state linked & part of the US national security apparatus.

[@CorinneSegura]

she's so vague i wonder what actions shes actually taking on her sites. i appreciate gael for actually taking a side and naming things to do

[@davidhill2199]

Good stuff, thank you. Nice convo and love that you circled back and gave some key takeaways at the end

[@Jacob-ev7zk]

Lily Ray is the only SEO expert that I am listening. She is right. Most people focus way to much on SEO. Everybody ask how to optimise a website for SEO. Nobody ask how to optimise a website to be the most helpful for users. Great Video! Belle vidéo (si l'accent est français)

[@lilyray]

Hey thanks 🙏🏽

[@danrykers1938]

Then you are an idiot, she said nothing this entire interview, Gael had to answer his own questions because she was only saying PC fluff

[@danrykers1938]

You really don't realize she said nothing of value in this entire interview and ducked Gael's questions the entire time? Man some of yall are easy to please

[@larry-ludwig]

lol Liliy can’t take legit criticisms against her work and blocks people like me. Best of luck taking her advice.

[@MadnessMotive-1428AZ]

This host is super insightful.

[@AuthorityHacker]

Thanks!

[@danrykers1938]

He had to be because the "expert" said nothing

[@empirebuildersllc8300]

I made a comment yesterday on one of Lily Ray's KZbin (YT) video's. I provided a YT video regarding Josh Karlin Tech Lead Manager @ Google Chrome talking about domain names, hosts names in relation to interest-based topics. There are a dozen + articles questioning this theory regarding host domain names by topics as an authority signal. These questions were raise as far back as 2021 by data scientist, not by SEO specialists. Ponder this, all the .co domain sales by topics has skyrocketed and right of the dot domain by topics. Lots of these domain are ranking really well in SERP in spite of the updates. The comment I made yesterday regarding this on Lily Ray's YT video was deleted. Now today domains are apart of the conversation. Thank you!

[@LinoWalker]

17:48 So, we shouldn't cover a broad range of topics, and we shouldn't niche down. So, as a small website, the only winning strategy is to not write any content at all, I guess. Whether we like it or not, SEO isn't a place for small publishers anymore. If you've got less than 30 DR, you won't be able to rank for anything, regardless of how much knowledge or experience you have in the niche.

[@larry-ludwig]

Lily is conflating domain authority with author authority. Reddit domain authority is high, but the authors on Reddit? I have no idea who they are and what their qualifications are other than that they were able to create an account and were upvoted by others. As if upvoting means the content itself is good or not manipulated.

[@michaele.stovall6364]

If what you're saying is true, google is a scam, as well as a snare and a racket

[@PaulGillooly1]

Here’s SEO in 2024 - make a site that could generate profit if all you did was run ads. Then and only then when you have a good enough product and unique market position begin SEO.

[@LinoWalker]

53:40 "People like to follow people" I think this is the main thing us SEOs have been missing (small publishers included). Google isn't the place people go to find fun, interesting content by people they'd like to follow. It hasn't been for at least a decade. People use Google purely for utility. And this used to be profitable. Nowadays, not so mich. This is why I think she's on to something when she talks about Discover, KZbin and social media. Because these are things AI can't really do yet (although in 8 or 10 years, things are going to be different). And as Gael says, if you have the right business model, you can definitely make it work.

[@SpookySkeletons]

yeah but only big publishers get into discover

[@EasyFoodDehydrating]

Good stuff - nice to meet you both here. You were recommended by a good friend I trust. Interesting take on SEO and I agree with what you're both talking about. Thanks!

[@Sunshine-Nina]

Nice interview, thank you 🔆🔆

[@PatriHernandez]

She's brilliant.

[@GregoryKristan]

Are we not going to talk about Reddit’s ipo? Talking about Reddit having EEAT is a wild take. It completely contradicts her misinformation message she said about 2016s election

[@infoinfo6653]

The whole interview is just filled with nonsens to be honest.

[@danrykers1938]

Ya the timing of 'crush all niche sites, give traffic to a few sites like Reddit, Reddit IPO's for billions, Google continues to crush search results in general' could be something to explore This was frankly a terrible interview though it wasn't Gael's fault, this is so common in 2024.... an 'expert' comes on and says nothing but because they call themselves an 'expert' all of the lemmings think they actually got some value

[@gabrielacovay]

Great interview with Lily, Gael. This was really insightful, and I love the timestamps! I don't think I've ever noticed those before, haha.

[@bryanshobbies]

I think we need to take a broader lens to what's going on in media in general. With the rise of these hyperbolic echo chambers that has politicized everything from beer to the clothes you wear and the food you eat, a lot of these older more established sites are going to, at least on the surface seem to be more balanced in their approach to information and I think that's why these sites are now being pushed closer to the top of search.

[@danrykers1938]

Meh, plenty of niche sites are written in a down the middle style without hyperbole and they are getting crushed too.... Google doesn't care about search results anymore, that is clear... they are putting in the minimum amount of effort possible and just ratcheting up how much backlinks matter as they pour all resources into AI because they know search is dying and will be dead soon

[@garitboothe3413]

I really liked Gael pushing back on Lily when she just spouts generic Google talking points. It was frustrating to hear her say, "Your website got hit because it sucks" like in 10 different ways, when in reality, Google just changed the rules about what they like. I have a website that got destroyed by each iteration of the HCU, including the March 5th update. I am beginning to see that the real culprit for this was that Google couldn't understand my business/entity, perhaps use of stock photos, and maybe just too many "best" and "review" articles. In 1 year we will probably have figured this out as an industry, and the answer most certainly won't be "make better content". Just as Penguin required different link building tactics, the world of AI and HCU probably requires smarter off-page SEO, understanding new ranking factors, and new tactics. But it's the same old game.

[@tungao2515]

Liked for the TLDW section :D

[@joowizard]

Does moving content to a new domain help fix an algorithm penalty? I heard it a couple of times in the video that people are doing it, but does it work? Are they redirecting or just content to a new site and do they change the content?

[@PaulVoorberg]

Good point on not getting your advise from the same sources as everybody else is, and implementing things the same way. It's so easy to identify spammy affiliate sites as a user, they're all over and the share many common visual characteristics. No need to even look at hosting and tech stack.

[@dan-miller]

So, stop listening to Authority Hacker, Diggity, and IS? :) By the way, excellent interview Gael.

[@PaulVoorberg]

​@@dan-millerNo, take what you learn as inspiration, not as a template to execute from verbatim. Most people want templated solutions though it seems, now seemingly paying the price for it.

[@AuthorityHacker]

I think it’s more about adding your own twist to things. Don’t just copy blindly. Learn, digest, then output something original inspired by what you learned.

[@danrykers1938]

@@AuthorityHacker Ya that worked awesome in 2022 and before, but what about now?

[@pmich8913]

@@AuthorityHackeragreed

[@JesusLeadershipTraining]

thanks guys

[@everythingverysmall]

It isn't consistent for travel bloggers. I have a new travel site for Africa from last year, where I wrote already tons of really personal experience from travelling to south Africa last year, even avoiding kruger park, for now, but visiting smaller parks and smaller places we drove through where tourists hardly come. I even talk about personal talks with locals and game reserve conservation. Took pictures and own videos of our glamping and all. My new site were indexed before the update, after the update it just got deindexed. How is that fair?

[@JesusLeadershipTraining]

you know I try to keep in mind....google makes decisions to what is best or most profitable for google, amazon did same thing couple of years ago buy cutting commisions....just a thought

[@paulotheurbanfarmer5982]

great video

[@MarcP5267]

What about linking like HARO links? Could the HC update affect haro links?

[@dhruvd8953]

53:41 damn, it scared the shit out of me

[@lilyray]

LOL sorry. That was my dog 🐶

[@MdAkashTube369]

Need a podcast about affiliate marketing 😣

[@l.a.jamiss1955]

I believe that Google updates its algorithms to enhance user-friendliness in search results; however, the latest update seems profoundly unfair. As a website creator specializing in game guides, I've developed over a dozen sites. Despite their unique and original content, created by my company's editors, Google's March update has led to a drastic traffic drop-over 60% of my sites now receive virtually no visitors. This includes one highly popular site that offered invaluable, exclusive gaming advice daily, but it too has suffered significantly. I think Google's revised algorithm has significant flaws and loopholes. Whether it involves AI, site layout, or SEO patterns is irrelevant. What matters should be the judgment based on "content". Yet, from what I observe, the current implementation is entirely unreasonable. Just like I am now using AI to help me make my grammar more fluid and not get in the way of the core meaning I am trying to convey.

[@JesusLeadershipTraining]

I do not know enough but does it benefit google to force us to diversify our traffic??

[@JesusLeadershipTraining]

is there anyone you suggest to follow to understand google better

[@JesusLeadershipTraining]

google discover

[@michaele.stovall6364]

By the time u understand google, another update will come

[@fkc2107]

Google is not giving me right search queries.

[@PedroFindz]

If this update is similar to other updates that, in your own words, sites can't recover from, why produce and sell a course that claims to help sites impacted by Google updates?

[@AuthorityHacker]

Because Core updates are very much recoverable and many are documented including in the course. It’s only the September 2023 HCU that hasn’t seen recoveries yet but given That it’s a site wide classifier, auditing your whole content is very likely to be the key to coming back when Google finally lets sites come back.

[@PedroFindz]

​@AuthorityHacker I haven't rewatched but didnt you say in the video this update as penguin vibes, and that no one recovered from penguin?

[@AuthorityHacker]

HCU is. Many sites that got hit by core updates in the past have recovered however and the process they used was often similar to what’s in the blueprint.

[@danrykers1938]

​@@AuthorityHacker Simple question, do you ever think the niche sites that got jumped by Reddit, Quora, Yelp, and the like will ever move above them again? Personally I don't.... this is a dead industry

[@rodenasabogados]

My law firm was hitted. Still no recovered. I don’t like eather HCU

[@peturpetrov7412]

What adaptation you are talking about? To see results from SEO takes time and effort and when the time comes Google brings some of those updates and we have to start over. Who can adapt in this case? Clearly the hit is only for small businesses!

[@SpookySkeletons]

My Takeaway as the owner of an information based website (with unique content) is: Stop right here, aye? SGE is going to steal content Google is playing unfair and preferring brands and forums over true insight. If you dont have a huge backlink profile you are doomed. In the future this gets exaggerated because they try to socialize Search. It can take years to recover a website. People that dont sell a product might be doomed from the start. Discover is getting more and more gatekept. So whats the deal in continuing and trying to improve??

[@danrykers1938]

'It can take years to recover a website' and will google search even be a thing by that time? People with brains are coming to your conclusions.... the lemmings never will

[@walderjavier8133]

Thanks for sharing!

[@Testing-pj8bh]

She says Reddit totally comply with Eeat concept? Come on!

[@lewis99170]

She’s talking about Reddit as a brand not the individual posts. You know what you’re getting when you click on a Reddit link and that may have its own inherent value to the searcher. Not that I necessarily agree with that being valuable but I think it’s important to make that distinction before taking her out of context.

[@Testing-pj8bh]

@@lewis99170 reddit as a brand serving content is trustworthiness? It has an intrinsic value for the user who is looking? yeah but should not be the first option in serps. Lets face it, the only reason reddit ranks is because the traffic it generates, not EEAT.

[@larry-ludwig]

@@lewis99170 But I thought the March update was on a per-page basis? Hint, it's not and site/brand matters a lot to Google.

[@junglestar]

All seos are bs

[@lewis99170]

@@junglestar someone needs a hug

[@lewis99170]

So basically I need to change my theme?

[@AuthorityHacker]

I don’t think it’s that simple but it may be a 1% correlation point

[@BibiTheLinkBuilder]

ahhhh not first

[@Mightyflynn77]

Great interview very valuable thanks

[@AuthorityHacker]

Our pleasure!

[@blackholesupersloth3276]

Lily knows nothing more than your typical SEO. It's all guess work.

[@lewis99170]

You’re way overestimating the typical SEO 😂 - Check out the SEO subreddit, it’s like being in a nightclub bathroom at 1am.

[@blackholesupersloth3276]

​@@lewis99170😂 Yeah, you're right. I was being stupid. She knows her stuff.

[@AuthorityHacker]

😂

[@danrykers1938]

She knows nothing more and says even less

[@syeedzeehan290]

Why don't you bring some real experts such as Carolyn Holzman or someone from SEO Fight Club?

[@brubblebam2737]

wpbeginner is still loosing massiv traffic!

[@danrykers1938]

That moment when you realize you are only 5 minutes into an interview with an "expert" who is giving zero value to your audience and is only saying PC fluff with no informational value so you have to start both asking and answering your own questions Feel for you on this one Gael... I woulda hung up on her Nothing has changed in the past half a year guys, this is still a dead industry, the longer you take to realize it the worse shape you will be in when you finally do Better off learning to build horse shoes, neither SEO nor horse shoes are worth your time these days but at least you can learn the horse shoes a whole lot quicker and move on to something better

[@hqrlock]

Good comment. What industry do you recommend though ?

[@danrykers1938]

@@hqrlock Honestly everything looks pretty grim, not trying to be a debbie downer just a realist The only thing I can really think to do as far as making decent money online goes is a YT channel but I hate that idea, not my personality type at all Not to mention the people who just wrecked our lives in the SERPs are the same people who own YT so its probably just a matter of time til YT goes downhill too

[@hqrlock]

@@danrykers1938 I feel you bro

[@articlewriting310]

This woman is insufferable. Does she even make her own sites or just “analyzes” them for her company for a wage ?

[@UglyAndTraveling]

I don't think any site has been recovered since the March core update 🙄