Massive 500x500 Territory War - Marble Race

[@lostmarbles2d]

What do you think of this territory wars format? Would you like to see more like this in future?

[@scourge213]

Love the idea, but this particular battle, for me, has problems. In other battles, the offense works as defense as well. Here the marbles can go "in the wrong" direction and be "stuck" there for way too long. Combined with the blocky design that forces drill-like attack patterns, the defense of a player feels inconsistent. Also, the marbles got stuck. Maybe don't block, but instead teleport the marbles around? Great job otherwise!

[@objectsupr9970]

Yes, one thing though, add a teleportation square that sends marbles to the nearest non sector area inside sectors that encompass most of it to prevent from marbles getting stuck like that blue marble

[@objectsupr9970]

@@scourge213 I'd have to agree, maybe make marbles only able to gain X territory and then have a 1 second cool down and maybe instead of impassable sectors make marbles gain velocity in them, and to prevent super speed marbles, make them slow down to normal speeds in non-sector areas

[@lokihogan6216]

@@objectsupr9970 bouncing off of this idea I think that when a square is formed it should check for marbles that might have gotten stuck and then teleport them to the home square where they won’t collide with any of the squares until they are in an open area

[@objectsupr9970]

@@lokihogan6216 Yeah that sounds go- wait a second Did you really have to say bouncing off of this idea?

[@kevinchen3424]

greens comeback was so fun to watch it had such a slow start and almost died at the start because blue was dominating

[@khangvouc3024]

Yo I am team green, always.

[@KalijahAnderson]

Would love to see more of this, but I suggest balls telport to the other side of blocks instead of getting stuck. Also, losing home square is far too easy in this version. Not sure how to fix the defense issue though.

[@lostmarbles2d]

Thanks! In the next version, I've changed to circular sectors and made a few other balance things. This evens out the spread of balls a bit better instead of having them "drill" in a single direction. Antistuck is now also working better. I've seen several viewers suggest teleports, I will maybe try that in a later version.

[@tristanmitchell1242]

Instead of having a "home" sector, make it so that a color is eliminated if it has 0 sectors, excepting at the start of the game.

[@KalijahAnderson]

@@tristanmitchell1242 If you did that you would also need to lose balls as sectors are lost otherwise you would get down to a few sectors and the balls would be too tight a defense to defeat.

[@lostmarbles2d]

@@tristanmitchell1242 The problem with that is that it would never be able to happen once you have more than a few balls. The smaller your territory becomes, the more likely it becomes for a marble to hit and convert other territory. So this would only work in conjunction with another mechanic that removes marbles.

[@tristanmitchell1242]

@@lostmarbles2d You already have the thresholds. Just have it so you get a marble when you pass the threshold, and lose the marble when you get below said threshold.

[@RubenGarcia-pt8tp]

I’m usually not a fan of territory wars but I did enjoy this one! Specially that blue ball just chilling in the side lol

[@lostmarbles2d]

Thanks! Blue is too cool for war :P

[@PradeepKumar-uh7zq]

@@lostmarbles2d true fix that bug dough and add deferent structures :p

[@Mr_Moi25]

Blue : **gain secters** That one blue marble : "Door stuck, door stuck, please, i dare you"

[@nieshmiesh]

not to be picky but to be picky, it's "I beg you" not "I dare you" sorry

[@Mr_Moi25]

@@nieshmiesh i wasn't good with english back then, but thanks for correcting me :)

[@sharmaynegunn1118]

Green had a fantastic strategy at the start Can't conquer the home base if it doesn't exist

[@furbyfubar]

Feels like elimination shouldn't be for losing your home sector, but rather for not holding an entire sector at the same time. If that would go for too long, make the requirement for number of squares held go up over time, or require half a square per ball (rounded down).

[@LAMCHAKFUNG]

This is the classic territory wars ;)!But with more improvements!

[@aarondillon5986]

My boy green with the clutch save and a HUGE comeback

[@neverknewitbefore]

Bro, green is the entire definition of a come back story, rooting for him sence second 1

[@TT55_STS525]

Green at the beggining - i don't need home

[@marcohueber5130]

The idea is good, but there are several problems that need rebalancing, mainly marbles that get completely stuck, and defense issues, like what's the point of having a lot of marbles if most of them are far, far away from the enemy base and your base is so defensless that even a color with a single ball can easily kill you? Also what happens if a player is never able to obtain a home base? It becomes completely unkillable? Finally a grid of 500 x 500 seems a little too big, many times it seems a color might get a square, but there is that one unconquered pixel that's impossible to see that makes it take that much longer to get a square

[@lostmarbles2d]

Thanks for the great feedback! For the new video, I'm trying circular sectors, which seems t have resolved many of these issues. However I do want to maintain some level of "one ball being able to kill a player" as that randomness provides comeback potential when one player is far behind. The balance just needs to be fine-tuned quite a bit, I agree in the current version it swings too far on one side, with the additional territory being more of a disadvantage. Originally I was aiming for a 1000x1000 grid (because number go big), but I agree that even 500x500 is a bit too big. For this format I think I'll try something a bit smaller first to see if we can find a sweet spot. I think the only way I can feasibly do a 1000x1000 grid is if I can figure out how to use compute shaders so that the graphics card can do the work instead of the CPU!

[@ehenare1]

Was rooting for green the whole time, their comeback was rly cool to see. Thought their slow start and difficulty setting up a home sector would have hampered them.

[@phdtobe]

Don’t know why, but I always root for blue to win. 🤔

[@JamesTDG]

Man, blue held more, but green had more where it was needed, that was crazy

[@paulochon7692]

I love the mini infos in the bottom, it's a really good idea, you should keep it.

[@lostmarbles2d]

Thanks for the feedback! I will use them where I can :)

[@Astra_A_Star]

One of blue's balls is just watching and not helping 😂

[@lostmarbles2d]

You have no idea how much time I spent trying to fix those issues, and it ends up happening every time I record :(

[@Astra_A_Star]

@@lostmarbles2d oof sorry about that

[@objectsupr9970]

Great, but needs refining, I have some coffe because you'll need it to fix the bugs

[@lostmarbles2d]

Please send it post-haste :)

[@tomsmith5584]

Good, but the colors need to start further apart. This will allow them to build up a defensive perimeter and less time expanding into uncontested territory.

[@lostmarbles2d]

Thanks for the suggestion! I will try that in a future video.

[@speedy01247]

Great defense from green, they started off on the wrong foot, but we're able to keep up the fight long enough to get blue in the end.

[@trinityy-7]

the only reason blue lost is one got stuck unfair battle

[@LAMCHAKFUNG]

green wins! Starts off weak, but end up winning!

[@Mar.Tin11]

This format changes everything! Totally Epic! :)

[@lostmarbles2d]

Thanks!

[@michaelmetcalfe639]

Should have a way to force balls out of being stuck in a box. Blue didn't really have full access to the balls it was supposed to have.

[@lostmarbles2d]

There is an anti stuck mechanic, however blue's ball managed to somehow oscillate in a gap where it shouldn't have been able to, so it didn't match the anti stuck condition. In the next video I have improved the anti stuck detection, and there aren't any issues as far as I can see. Thanks for the feedback!

[@michaelmetcalfe639]

@@lostmarbles2d cool can't wait to see the next one

[@Luigicat11]

Blue was just gunning right for Yellow's home and would not stop, and Yellow wouldn't do a darn thing to defend. Boy do I feel bad for anyone who was rooting for Yellow.

[@Dtuojcxr]

"If you don't have a home, you can't lose" © Early Green

[@bonkser]

7:39 did blue just get a sector with green territory in it

[@lostmarbles2d]

That's a bug - thanks for catching it!

[@randomgeography3190]

the blue marble was having fun than the res

[@lukaskai1234]

This was so cool! i hope you keep this gamemode instead of going back to only multiply and release. i really liked the introduction at the beginning, i think the thumbnails at the left of the text add a lot to the quality of the video. only complain i have is that the marbles sometimes get stuck. to solve this, i thought of a solution which would be something like 1) make marbles spawn inside the most recent BLOCK instead of the home BLOCK of their team colour 2) making newly spawned marbles go through BLOCKS until it touches a team coloured *square* 3) give newly spawned marbles a slight "boost" in speed that launches them the opposite way the BLOCK was created. that way, if marble(1) generates a new BLOCK by hitting a square, marble(2) will appear INSIDE the newly generated BLOCK and immediately move towards the spot marble(1) was when the BLOCK was created. when marble(2) gets OUT OF THE BLOCK, it will behave like normal and start bouncing off of blocks like everyone else

[@lostmarbles2d]

Thank you! That's the idea - I intend to make videos of multiple game modes and to create new variants. I've just been focusing on Multiply or Release up until now because of its popularity and relative ease of making adjustments. You would not believe how much time I've spent trying various methods of preventing stuck marbles. The antistuck in this current video only really had that one slip up with the blue marble - and that was just because it somehow managed to oscillate in place even though it was completely stuck. Not sure how that works. I've been testing another method at the moment, hopefully it would work well. I did try point number 1 early on, the issue I had with that is that marbles would tend to venture too far away from the home base and leave it undefended. So I changed to spawning always on the home base to provide that defense.

[@lukaskai1234]

@@lostmarbles2d besides the blue marble issue, there is a green marble stuck at 8:38 on it's home base. that's mostly why i suggested point 2 and 3, but i can see why marbles defending the base is important. i'm glad you are trying out new gamemodes and different ways of making them. do you have any plans on returning to the "push the block" game mode? i thought that one was pretty cool, since it had no music and only sound effects. also, the stats at the end of it were a very unique addition

[@lostmarbles2d]

@@lukaskai1234 I didn't mention the green one because it did eventually get unstuck correctly :P I do plan to return to the "push the block" series, however probably removing the sound effects and rather using music. Originally when I started this channel, my intention was to only use sound effects. But my channel only started growing when I decided to follow the popular formats (multiply or release with music), so that is what I am currently focusing on mainly, to keep the channel growing. Originally I also had lots of ideas of stats at the end of the game (I do reporting in my full time job so I find it quite enjoyable), but it was taking a lot of time and most people don't seem to care. But I'm glad you mentioned it, I might revisit having more stats again. It's just tough to balance time spent on things like that versus spending it on creating new game modes. I"m aiming to do another push the block early next month, maybe week 1 or 2 of January.

[@nunyobusiness835]

green cheated. blue shoulda had that

[@jiqci]

Strategy: don't get any sectors so you can't get eliminated

[@asmodeojung]

Yellow: screw our base, let's attack!

[@Phoenix_stern]

Good Job! I hope more will come soon

[@lostmarbles2d]

Thanks! More definitely to come :)

[@Decon7]

Very clutch game, didn't expect that

[@noolcool4058]

Nice

[@Eeesrandomstuffs]

If this was a game, players would just cheese by not making a home sector

[@Ukiyowo]

Mikan would never do this to us.

[@leechesg]

Feels strange because the more sectors you have, the weaker you get. Sure, it's nice in theory, but if one color starts tunneling through another's sectors, it literally can't be stopped since the sectors are solid

[@TheUltimateRare]

clearly had some bugs to work out. balls got stuck between caught zones.

[@Mr_Fluffy_Paws]

Talk about an underdog

[@frostaylan7390]

i like your grown up as a channel i remember then you had only ~200 subs great job in a few time you won't even be able to answer all the comments

[@lostmarbles2d]

Unfortunately I think you're right... I'm already struggling to keep up :(

[@Devotee_of_void]

Blue would have won if not the stucking of balls

[@thuyho2229]

Cool

[@180Ranmafan]

This content is bizarrely fascinating. Are there connections to game theory?

[@lostmarbles2d]

As I understand it, game theory has to do with decision making between two or more rational actors / players. These videos are just about random actions, so not really any space for rational decision making.

[@180Ranmafan]

​@@lostmarbles2d That makes a lot of sense! I have some ideas about what else you could include for the statistics and some ideas on further analysis if you're interested. I am new to this whole 'marble race' thing but I'm not seeing other channels do much analysis either even though it seems like there's a lot of mathematical potential. It just kinda piqued my interest.

[@lostmarbles2d]

@@180Ranmafan I'm definitely interested in that! I'm also relatively new to it myself. I discovered this genre over a month ago, and I think you describe it best: it's bizarrely fascinating. What sort of analysis did you have in mind?

[@lostmarbles2d]

@@180Ranmafan I've been pondering this a bit more and remembered a channel called "Primer", which has some videos covering aspects of game theory, and all of the videos are simulations. So perhaps it would be possible for me to implement something like that!

[@180Ranmafan]

@@lostmarbles2d Primer is a great example! Observing behavior to create hypothesis and seeing how it shakes out after many generations. His work tends to showcase natural selection and evolution--I think yours could do that with some changes, but I do think it would make your job pretty complicated. Ok, so, analysis. I was just making a few observations about the nature of this territory wars game. Certain properties gave significant advantages such as 1:20, Blue has an expansion-focused pointy setup in comparison to more round neighbors. By 2:30 we see why--Triangles cause extra "hits" near the tip, which favor expansion, and also as the ball bounces back at shallow angles through the triangle, it widens, increasing the chance of securing a sector, which, because it creates a new base of the triangle, it tightens the territory and further expands the triangle. I think that some of the effect comes from the same place as "Buffon's needle problem" which shows that you can estimate pi based on the ratio of randomly rotated needles which happen to intersect with a line. In your case, intersections are collisions which cause the territory expansion. This, because of the "random" bouncing(read: random rotating trajectory) should have some relationship with Pi which is cool. So those triangular sections help, but does anything detract? Well, round territory offers the most average expansion and defense. But appears to have the slowest Territory growth. We can sort of compare this to economics? The GDP of a particular color is a function of how efficiently its balls can bounce. Sectors, usually add to this efficiency by locking territory, but there is significant danger. 4:30 Blue locks two of his own balls. His producers can no longer make territory and it drastically drops his efficiency. There's plenty more observations to be made and conjectures to be solved but since this is basically an idle video it makes it nice to ponder. So additional statistics might be able to passively showcase that like: Avg. Efficiency-- production(of territory) per ball per second. This will track the economy of each color. Efficiency--on a per-ball basis, it would be nice to know which balls in which circumstances lead to better output.(Trapped? Low efficiency. Small Triangle? High efficiency. At least that's my hypothesis.) Having a graph of Avg efficiency over the course of the match, we should be able to analyse how and which events lead to serious corrections in the graph etc. Sorry for the text wall lol

[@bradonhoover3002]

Man, blue got screwed over so many times

[@alexandredesouza3692]

Great way to make maps

[@rl645]

LOL, these balls which get stuck between the tiles sometimes. Reminds me of when I was a sperm-cell. Eventually I made it.

[@violetijzerman8414]

great content for sure!!

[@lostmarbles2d]

Thank you!

[@rowelladesquitado1155]

yay my colour won

[@ngarcia103]

By the way... you know how, when you roll over a video's thumbnail, it gives you a little preview of what the video looks like? When you do that with this video, the last place finisher is spoiled. I don't know if you know how to fix that, but...

[@lostmarbles2d]

I wish I knew :( It seems like they've been slowly rolling out a new miniplayer function that plays videos on hover, but from the start. Maybe that will solve the problem.

[@Phoenix_stern]

Can you add some walls pls?

[@lostmarbles2d]

I tried some walls early in development but they didn't work so great. Might try again after all the adjustments I've been making.

[@dizont]

Loveitttt

[@henrystickmin8812]

Blue is stuck

[@mollymarble8002]

Lost marbles why u try to make green always win every vid you make green always win

[@lostmarbles2d]

Oh? I thought yellow mostly won?

[@Phoenix-uy9jl]

Do this again but with 1000x1000 grid and more teams like purple, orange, or black

[@lostmarbles2d]

I've done a 8-player battle royale, to be released in a few days. Not 1000x1000 though. My PC is not strong enough to handle that with how I've coded this. I need to learn how to use computer shaders which should be able to help me with that.

[@Phoenix-uy9jl]

@@lostmarbles2d you made me subscribe with notifications on because I want to see that! 1+ subscriber

[@umm-j2w]

I Hate @@Phoenix-uy9jl

[@Phoenix-uy9jl]

@@umm-j2w man this community is so caring and positive

[@quocnguyenanh2803]

raw yrotirret 005x005 evissam

[@Guardian_squirrel]

bruh was not 1 for sal the house :v

[@maf6768]

Gren

[@maf6768]

Ye

[@makarpashnyak9478]

bop

[@phuclambui7828]

Where your video

[@blarg539]

Pretty weak programming that balls got stuck in their sectors

[@AnnalenaKrohn]

@@blarg539 Hm, if you'd watch his newest vid, you'd see that he's pretty talented. How sad that there are only haters with no experiences on youtube...

[@hmzh5824]

the waffle house has found its new host