Infrared vs space heater: How warm does it feel

[@nathanlucas6465]

When I was at school, the workshops had those ir heaters over the workbenches. They didnt want to use conventional heaters as the dust extractor system would effectively change the air in the workshop every 3 or 4 minutes

[@Ostap1974]

So when will we see a project of human tracking that automatically turns the heater towards you when you move around?

[@glennburrow4364]

You just beat me to the comment

[@warpman74]

Haha, I thought the same thing!

[@anullhandle]

Yeah I was thinking opencv and some steppers or a pixy2

[@knucklecorn]

Thought about this too even when watching the last video about the IR-heater. The Raspberry Pi with Matthias' motion capture program and a servo.

[@GrainHopper]

Made out of Lego!

[@dscrive]

I've occasionally used heat lamps above my bench to keep my hands and tools warm while the rest of me was bundled up. Works pretty well.

[@sephalon1]

Mount it upside down from the ceiling on a computer-controlled swivel, get motion sensors, and use your Matthias Magic to write software to have it track you as you move about that corner of the shop.

[@EmmanuelEspino]

or have it read your mind so that it can preheat that corner a few seconds before you arrive

[@crystalsoulslayer]

Alternatively, he could do a collab with Michael Reeves. Then it would not only track him around the shop, it would shoot energy drink at him whenever he closed his eyes. That's not really Matthias's style, though. Maybe it should shoot wood glue at him instead.

[@whirled_peas]

@@crystalsoulslayer hahahaha I don't think that would be advertiser-friendly

[@RAPXZibit]

he already did it kzbin.info/www/bejne/bJyuZKt8Zrd4ftE

[@Petertronic]

First Technology Connections, then EEVBlog, now Matthias making videos about space heaters :)

[@sharedinventions]

Similar thing happened, when Matthias fixed his fan. :)

[@johnroberts3500]

lkeas

[@mark314158]

A cheap curtain - pull across to isolate heated area?

[@52Ford]

Good idea. I'm sure he could make a good video about the wooden curtain track, too.

[@johncasey5594]

I live in Canada and have a back porch that is uninsulated and unheated. I bought a couple of those 1,500 watt infrared heaters and placed them above each of the recliners in my back porch. I can turn one on for a couple minutes, go out and I am toasty. I love them. It doesn't matter if I decide to go out there for 15 minutes or 2 hours, I only pay for the heating I use.

[@52Ford]

A propane radiant heater would work well in that space. When it's really cold out, I use a propane heater with box fan a few feet above it to circulate the warm air. It works really well and in my experience, they don't use much propane. Plus, they're really nice when the power goes out. If you do end up getting one, don't for get to buy a carbon monoxide detector and leave a window cracked when it's running.

[@broccolihart1]

Oh shizz! I didnt know it was the legend i was watching . Good to see you again my man....i still have your wood workhorse design you uploaded years ago.

[@dylanreischling4151]

At 1:14 I notice a radiator connector type thing on the wall, why wouldn’t you just use that? Inefficient? Or maybe broken?

[@jenkinseric2]

I used halogen work lights, heat and light together

[@stla9805]

That is exactly my idea as well! Halogen lamps (500 W) are wonderful warm and you get an awful lot of light for free. LED isn't always the best choice (you can trust me - as an engineer I worked for OSRAM!)

[@ColtonBlumhagen]

@@jnimitzch4738 Halogens get WAY hotter than incandescents.

[@JPWack]

I used to make that joke "halogens are just like the sun", they even power up some solar panels!

[@jkbrown5496]

If your working localized, you can put some radiant heat barrier on the wall opposite the heater on the other side of you to reflect back on you which will decrease the front/back differential making it feel more comfortable.

[@LarsSveen]

I was surprised at how well those dish heaters work to warm a whole room. That's all I had to warm up a basement room, so I plugged it in and left it for a few hours. The room was probably around 45F when I plugged it in, and when I came back it was very comfortable at around 65F.

[@jimgeelan5949]

I love the pile of dewalt tools on the floor in the background 😂😂😂😂

[@woodrookie9132]

Would there be a benefit to pointing it at a large tool or wall to have it radiate the heat out and lift the ambient temp in the room?

[@wisenber]

Looks great for winter time epoxy curing!

[@arifali6762]

You can add insulation on floor. Also you can create a small room by adding couple insulated walls if needed to reduce cost of heating.

[@LoganHenry]

Growing up in a mechanic shop, we always placed the large equipment and workbenches under the radiant heaters. Most practically, an infrared heater's job is to heat objects (like those boxes, or work tables) and allow the heat they've absorbed to warm the room.

[@RobertL78]

We have one of the infrared heaters aimed at one part of the couch at night. In the morning, that is where all of the cats are piled up. They definitely prefer that to a regular space heater.

[@aarondavid826]

10-15 push-ups every 15 minutes keeps me toasty in the winter

[@anthonybrock9435]

Good one, laddie.

[@tonybaggett1984]

DIY wooden heater coming up. This should be interesting!

[@villeqq4789]

It's called a fire

[@tonybaggett1984]

Ville QQ that’s the joke!

[@dragoscoco2173]

Not to mention that the EU would consider that a renewable energy source and count it to the official statistic.

[@6stringsandapick]

A more insulated space will take less time and energy to heat up. Might have a higher upfront expense, but would be comfy cozy for sure.

[@seigeengine]

Yes, and that makes sense inside of a house. It doesn't make much sense in a space you use less often, and don't care about heating when you're not using it.

[@real_arbuckle]

That's what I did. I left the machines in the cold but, built an insulated wall around the bench. Now I have a warm place to sit or make coffee and more wall space in the garage.

[@patrickbush9526]

I just bought me a bunch of boxes that were already warmed up and put my coat on. Works great !

[@Funybudy]

Instead of human tracking, what about aiming it at a parabolic mirror and having it reflect to a much wider area? Similar to how it’s concentrating the infrared into the beam, you would disperse it when it gets to the desired area?

[@Blue_Azure101]

If you aim it towards the ceiling, the waves bounces and deflects around the room which will make the room feel warmer in general.

[@paulkolodner2445]

My impression is that having two of these heaters pointing at the same area from different directions, with both oscillating, would help with the problem of feeling warm on one side of your body and cold on the other as well as allowing you to move around a bit and not move out of the warm area.

[@randybartlett3042]

My first reaction: three of them (mounted from the ceiling and oscillating) could cover a pretty wide area. My 2nd reaction: partition off that area (say 1/4 of the total basement) to reduce the space to be heated. Then bringing a duct over there makes a little more sense. My 3rd reaction: pray for spring (and create some way to bring outside air in).

[@seigeengine]

The problem is if you spread it out too much, it's just a space heater again.

[@gregmislick1117]

You could mount the heater near the ceiling and have it shine down ultimately hitting the floor in the area you are working in, perhaps the absorbed heat would radiate back making the entire area feel just a little warmer... maybe....probably not enough BTU involved to make a difference.

[@anullhandle]

A heated jacket made with some insulated stranded stainless steel wire is pretty easy to coble together. Iirc beadalon is a brand name sold in craft stores. Way cheaper than the commercial jackets. Heat the sleeves and neck too. A good motorcycle one is about 90watts. So inside at 15c maybe 20 watts under a fleece jacket and pwm it down as required.

[@PhanactFJ]

This has been so informative, I appreciate your process, very well explained. Thank you

[@malcolmoxley1274]

heat travels up into the ceiling so why dont you get a tube of plastic put a fan on the end and hang it up so the fan blows the warm air back down to your feet,I know it means having a tube say six feet or more long but as its plastic it wouldn't hurt if you walked into it

[@nickjm37fordel1]

Does the wall register not work ? Maybe over time you could slowly drywall and insulate your ceiling ?

[@anxiousappliance]

I think it has a parabolic reflector specifically for focussing the beam.

[@tomdenny8507]

I use a parabolic infrared heater in my work shop and you are correct that moving about makes the heat feel more even. Mine is mounted to the ceiling in one corner and aimed at the center of my shop. As far as dust getting on it, ocaisionally I can smell hot wood but it isn't anything that I find objectionable and I seriously doubt enough dust will accumulate to be a fire hazard.

[@DownhillAllTheWay]

When the IR heater is oscillating, it spends a greater percentage of its time at each end of its travel than it does in the middle, where its sweep is the fastest. I imagine it is driven by a crank on the motor with a connecting rod to the heater head, giving a sinusoidal motion. Perhaps some improvement could be made by using a cam and follower instead of the crank - though, of course, it involves partly redesigning a manufactured product.

[@junkmail4613]

MW, Sounds like an interesting product for an educated audience. Too complex for many circumstances, but, say you were sandwiched between say 5 "following radiant heaters" well, might be quite comfortable. I am curious how much a commercial follower built into a commercial radiant heater, price reduced by mass production. a camera, pi, step servo, and the heater itself.

[@miedan21]

You should build a person tracker axis turning holder for the IR heater so that it follows you automatically around the room. I would use a motion tracker to start some code and then image tracking based on shadows that outputs to a step servo

[@danielallen2000]

I think one of the tool companies needs to send you a heated jacket!

[@Don.Challenger]

Do they cool in summer?

[@BlahBlahManYeah]

Looking forward for you building warm mats, using variety of traditional heated floor offerings, like infrared film and etc, I believe if you have heated mat to stand and work on next to bench or tool you wont be not much bothered by ambient temperature. Adding heating mag to each tool zone will be similar of adding personal dust extractor for each of your craft tools. Good luck and great video as always!

[@3rdwrldkid]

But the fair comparison would be 2 infrared heaters vs one room heater right? Because infrared heaters use half the electricity as a room heater?

[@dmalikovski]

Get a mini-split heat pump. 12000btu or 3.5kw that uses 900w. It will heat a lot better.

[@dw2843]

Aren't they expensive af.

[@hotrodhog2170]

I have often wondered if infrared heaters were better than regular space heaters. We heat our house with 4 space heaters and they perform fairly well. If you put some R-19 insulation standing up on top of that block wall in between the floor joists, that would help reduce any heat loss.

[@afterthetone]

Assuming the basement is below ground level, wold it not be possible to heat it fully with little loss? It would also heat the floor above.

[@rfnoise]

I insulated my workshop basement R19, love it, requires very little heating, upper level floor is warm, so bonus. Matthias has to be different, so I look forward to seeing an aluminimum covered sweater, which improves on the NASA standard space suit.

[@davelowe1977]

rfnoise Yes, insulation is the better solution.

[@David-eu1ms]

Have you thought about building a small radiator system?

[@deltekkie7646]

Is there a way you could add a wood heater to your basement? That is practically free. I realize there is work in gathering the wood and space for storing the wood to burn, but you have more even heat and no electricity required to create it. Just a thought.

[@smpb238]

so with it being iR could you put it in a box that is airtight and fireproof ish that would have IR compatible window in it. . also what about a heated carpet .... and or getting the next system up and put a bar of ir heating over your work stations.

[@dave597]

How do these compare to an oil filled heater or a radiator?

[@whosaidthat5236]

Must be nice to have a workshop that’s +13 in the winter... mine was -35 C most winter. Not much work got done

[@gregorywhite651]

If you plan on staying in New Brunswick long term you might want to look at getting a woodstove like at your old place.

[@Cadwaladr]

My shop stays about 16 degrees in the winter, and I wouldn't really want it any warmer than that. If I'm really moving around and working I'm quite happy in temperatures down to about -7.

[@nochanceofmyname6615]

Because you're rotund?

[@КонстантинОлшквский]

It is good to check formulas

[@sharedinventions]

With space heaters you heat the air. With infra read heater you heat body surface area and also wall surfaces. Walls will radiates back (some amount of the) heat, so overall, infrared heating can be more comfortable. (This is why wall heaters, ceiling coolers are the ultimate solutions for a modern building.)

[@senormetal]

Is there an opportunity to either modify the dish on the IR heater for a broader beam, or perhaps point it at a convex reflector to dissipate the heat across a larger are of the shop at lower intensity?

[@gominosensei2008]

theres also the pesky square law. twice as far away, you get 4 times less heat. with a broader beam that quickly becomes completely irrelevant.

[@BOCraftsman]

I use a ceramic heater. They are much more efficient on your energy cost and it also has a fan to move the air around. My shop is a odd shape but Similar to the size of the space you have. It warms it up nicely . Also, since heat rises, I’ll bet your loosing a lot of heat to the ceiling of your space.

[@relaxingnature2617]

It helps to have the radiant heater hit objects and then have a fan blowing a across the objects

[@paulkelly1702]

Would a common fan located behind/in front of the heater distribute the heat so as to warm a larger area?

[@eby6114]

This style of Heater is all I use. Save a ton of money and feel warmer. I do have multiple inferred heaters but generally one per room is sufficient. Can't use one at night in the same room too bright. So I use half the electric, feel warmer, saving money. Also it should be noted your warming things and the things give off the heat compared to warming the air and hot air rising loosing the heat faster.

[@chalfontcrew]

These heaters are great at heating objects and not the air, I use them to keep me warm in my workshop in the winter and it does so wonderfully, just put it behind you when you are working say on the lathe or milling machine, and aim it at your kidney area, as the kidneys are what warms your blood and you will feel all toasty and warm in just a few seconds, and there is a big bonus because it warm you and not the air it is so cheap to run, and because the air is not heated up the machinery in your workshop will not start to sweat and then rust. Therefore it's the perfect heater for the workshop.

[@gominosensei2008]

and build an open cv kidney tracker instead of a face tracker. then explain to the secret police that you are not an organ trafficker.

[@mrdiggie3321]

Is there an easy way to modify the focal range of the reflector to more evenly distribute the heat?

[@gustavomedrano3628]

what about energy wated? is it cheaper to use the dish?

[@englishjona6458]

You ever hear of the infrareds panels ?

[@recklessroges]

Use the cardboard boxes to create internal partitions to contain the heat?

[@yvindavlyp3243]

I use a gas heater for my garage. 15kW on full and use little gas on low settings. 30m2 and -10 C in the winter. 5 min and it is nice temp.

[@ahbushnell1]

hang them on the ceiling. We had gas IR heaters in a high bay. It worked.

[@veghatilla]

Very well made review, thank you!!

[@yehoshafat]

Get in on a tracking system? Sounds like a nice project

[@music-jn3wn]

do i see a dust filter system build for the I R heater in the near future?

[@JuanVargasCalderon]

excellent video , would not expect less from a canadian (cold experts)

[@johnnychang4233]

The thermal sensation is relative from a human point of sensing because it's mainly located on our skin. As long as we are well insulated and that makes us feel a temperarure differential just about what we have internally we feel comfortable that way. Also a radiant heat has it's concern in a wood workshop because from time to times use of flammable solvants.

[@bronsonstephens5799]

Put a sensor on it so it follows you while you move?

[@UltraRik]

Can you use a parabolic reflector to burn stuff with it?

[@pierrec1590]

This type of heater tends to burn dust off very quickly, so it smells a little bit when you turn it on. You just don't want the wood dust to accumulate on the reflector. Otherwise, you best bet is to insulate that basement with a 2" blue foam on the outside...

[@HalfMonty11]

There are lots of projects out there that make webcams follow motion. I wonder how hard it would be to use a cheap webcam and arduino and some servos to make this infrared heater change it's angle and follow you around the shop.

[@gominosensei2008]

the heaters are rather heavy. servos for them are not inexpensive.

[@CatSlinky]

You failed to mention the affect that heat reflecting off of the in-axis box had on the out-of-axis box. Taking that into account, you can actually increase the perceived warmth of an area by putting up two radiant barriers (e.g. two plywood panels) at either end of the heat lamp's oscillation. That way you will have the heat you feel from the IR as well as any heat reflected by the barriers.

[@Khellendros_]

A custom shallower dish to spread the heat is out of the equation?

[@kolilagephart3766]

When spending money for energy I like to get work as well as heat . Things that work well in a basement that can do this are freezer, air compresser, dehumidifier,and clothes drier. It is so hard to get a good heater and I don't like the in a kid zone on the floor so I use 250 amp ag brooder bulbs in the over head lighting and in lamps. A freezer can remove the humidity that basements always have if your remove the heaters in the drain pan.

[@carnright]

Yup I had clean mine from time to time.

[@xenochaosxc]

Why not a kerosene heater? Ventilation and expense?

[@djkommando]

Wonder if the IR heater would be helpful outside while working under a vehicle?

[@jonanderson5137]

Yes, even with wind. the only downside would be aiming it correctly if the head doesn't articulate enough.

[@bmoelly8123]

does the radiator heater under your workbench does it not work?

[@boutellejb]

In the garage, I wear heavy clothes, but my hands would suffer. One IR heater off the end of the bench, pointed across the benchtop work area keeps my hands plenty warm, even with the doors open.

[@waynenocton]

Any chance you could explain the e=0.95 thing? I bought a cheap infrared camera and have no clue, can research it but you are so good at explaining I thought I’d suggest it.

[@matthiasrandomstuff2221]

No. I have no idea what you are referring to

[@waynenocton]

Matthias Wandel 1:49 in, your temperature gun shows that, and mine has settings that you can vary that setting but don’t know what it does.

[@mowcius]

It refers to the emissitivity of the material you're trying to measure the temperature of. In theory you should change it, but if you're only trying to do a comparison between objects of the same material, the true temperature isn't very important. www.thermoworks.com/emissivity_table Most cheap IR thermometers have a default value of 0.95 and often cannot be changed.

[@saritsotangkur2438]

Could you build a tracking radiant heater?

[@saterry7984]

Hallo Matthias, mir ist aufgefallen, dass du bei der Temperaturmessung das epsilon (Emissionsgrad des zu messenden körpers) immer konstant gehalten hast. Das kann unter umständen zu fatalen messfehlern führen. Bei gleicher temperatur kann man für verschiedene epsilons teilweise über 50°C messfehler haben.

[@FlightSim2703]

Thanks very much for sharing the experiment, I always learne something from your channel , I was thinking to get one of these heater from Costco, Regards ☺👍👍

[@elindred]

Now you need a contraption which lets the heater track you around the room using lego and a camera.

[@briantaylor9266]

It might be interesting to test, in an entirely subjective way, whether the electric fan heater provides an equivalent local warming effect if you just stand in front of it like you seem to have to do with the radiant heater.

[@jonanderson5137]

They work on different principles. Electric fans heat air. Radiant heaters warm surfaces.

[@briantaylor9266]

@@jonanderson5137 I know that. But if you sit in front of a fan heater you get warmed. Subjectively, how does it compare to sitting in front of a radiant heater. Does it feel as warm, more warm, or less warm. Simple question, no science needed.

[@sween187]

Project. Hook up a motor and a infrared proximity sensor, get the heater to track you in your work space.

[@sween187]

Might not need the motor, cleaning it use a air compressor

[@answeris4217]

Try hitting your table saw with it. The table saw has a large cast iron slab and if you can get that to 26 degrees then it will radiant out much faster.

[@PunchingBabyZebras]

Where do u get ur wood scrap? Love u Matthias

[@pterodox123]

Does that baseboard heater behind your band saw work?

[@matthiasrandomstuff2221]

not hooked up.

[@gjack2008]

I’m assuming it is hydronic? Why not connect it and tie it in with your lights and a relay? That way when you are in the workshop with lights on the room can be heated to a comfortable set point. Then when you are done and shut the lights off it turns off.

[@fredbloggs5822]

Or just use a blow heater that's pointing in your general direction?

[@aserta]

I have one of those (for some reason i call it a solar lamp, no idea why), bigger. Best thing ever, BUT, it consumes a heap since it's an antique (uses those ceramic, European type plugs, since i'm from Europe).

[@Schnabeltier7I4]

Why not insulate the basement and install a propper heating solution?

[@matthiasrandomstuff2221]

basement IS insulated

[@stefantrethan]

You need to make a tracking system for the Ferkellampe.

[@NP-rh3dt]

Wow I got here really early. Morning Mattthias!

[@GeneraleRus]

About the infrared heater when it gets dusty: It smells bad. Especially it was put into storage and got somewhat humid during the rest of the year, the dust will stick and make it smells like someone got their hair burned!

[@jasonharrison25]

That happens to all space heaters. Well maybe not the oil filled ones

[@boxerjoe1314]

@@jasonharrison25 Happens to oil filled as well. I have to hit mine with a weak power washer in the summer and then let them air dry. Seems the only way to get the dust out between the fins as the dust is generally very tacky and sticky.

[@magicrobharv]

Great video Matt !

[@AndreBandarra1]

Probably impractical but first thing that came to mind was IR heater on servos and autotracking you around the shop :)