Measuring Switch activation force for Mouse Microswitches (Kailh, Huano, Zippy, Omron, Razer)

[@toge64]

ENTS you're one of the mouse switch youtube GOATs. I've typed up timestamps for you as a small token of my appreciation for your content. 00:00:06 Omron D2FC-F-7N 00:00:35 TTC Gold Dustproof (30m) 00:00:58 TTC Silver 00:01:22 Omron D2FC-F-K(50M) 00:01:48 Zippy DF3-P1 00:02:22 Kailh GM 4.0 00:02:46 TTC Gold Non-dustproof 00:03:14 Huano Blue Shell Blue Dot 00:03:43 Huano Blue Shell Pink Dot/Powder Dot 00:04:03 Omron D2F-O1F (Japanese Omron) 00:04:31 Zippy DF3-P1L1 00:05:07 Kailh GM 8.0 00:05:48 Kailh GM 2.0 (with GM 2.0 stamped on the side) 00:06:17 Huano Blue Shell White Dot 00:06:44 Omron D2F-F-3-7 00:07:08 Omron D2FC-F-7N(G1) (From Logitech GPX Superlight) 00:07:35 Omron D2FC-F-7N(20M) (from Finalmouse Starlight-12) 00:08:09 TTC Gold Dustproof (80M) (from Pulsefire Haste) 00:08:50 Razer Optical V1 00:09:32 Razer Optical V2

[@entsfps]

thank you so much

[@_aiborie]

Thank you for the timestamps! 🙏

[@Caution40404]

This is the most helpful mouse switch test I've ever seen. Props to you and thanks!!

[@entsfps]

ty!

[@_aiborie]

Totally! The most constructive out there

[@xvtal]

Fucking perfect video. Calming music, great sound, great information. 10/10 would watch again

[@entsfps]

thank you!

[@creepy_3031]

I haven't seen anything as relaxing in a looooong time. Could watch this for hours. Thanks for the Spreadsheets man!

[@entsfps]

thank you bud!

[@sniperz123]

Not all heroes wear capes. Thank you for your service soldier 🙏

[@Ilegator]

What a nice, perfect video. Also, I loved that machine!! I just bought the Omron D2FC-F-7N(20M) as they seem to be the softest switches in the market.

[@entsfps]

ty

[@UnknownUser-qd9mi]

I thought so but it's different model. The lightest is (G1) code. I'm looking for the lightest switch bit I can't find D2FC-F-7N(G1) code but (OF) instead so does your switch that you mentioned is light press?

[@Ilegator]

@@UnknownUser-qd9mi the one i bought was absurdly soft. I had to switch back to TTC Gold and later to Kailth 8.0

[@UnknownUser-qd9mi]

@@Ilegator I'm a finger tip user so it might be perfect for me. The problem is many people says D2FC-F-K(50M) is more lighter and now I'm confused.

[@Ilegator]

@@UnknownUser-qd9mi if you get mine i warranty you it's soft enough lol

[@BradleyVrooman]

Good video, unit to unit variance is huge in a lot of switches so I tend to buy a pack of 10 or 20 just to get the force I'm looking for in that particular switch

[@karminipal4700]

Great video as always man! I love this Switch Actuation force test on the guage! Good to note on some switches are heavier than others even if they feel light.

[@entsfps]

thank you bud

[@igaodebh]

He has tendinitis in his finger, and know that your video helped me a lot, I know it can vary but thank you very much for your video. Você é incrível irmão salvou demais, um BR passou por aqui

[@nullifier_]

não tenho tendinite mas outro problema que dificulta jogar com mouses que tem o "click duro". comecei a procura e passei por aqui também

[@solarstar567]

awesome video with clear display of method and clear tactility and sound.

[@KinSaniTriGaming]

This video...has me feeling some type of way....1000% high quality content. *tears*

[@entsfps]

thank you so much!

[@DerNerdChannel]

I'd like to see a video like that for optical switches, since manufacturers/vendors don't give measurements for those either and you find those in noteworthy mice, too, e.g. inside the Pulsar X2V2 Mini.

[@mushiim8]

I can't stand heavy switches, thanks for this!

[@entsfps]

You're welcome!

[@Pandemonium088]

Im very surprised that the GM 8.0 is one of the ligther switches to click! They seem to require a lot of force for me!

[@mrsaul3709]

it's not just the switch but the entire assembly of the mouse itself that makes the difference.

[@Pandemonium088]

@@mrsaul3709 Used on an Orochi v2 compare vs stock switch.

[@mehdigamingtech3294]

@@Pandemonium088 there is big difference btw mouse with solid shell and mouse that separate btw clicks buttons and back cover example like razer orochi v2 and logitech g305

[@thedeegee1601]

They're harder than Omron D2FC-F-7N(20M) that's for sure.

[@weaka6664]

this my fav year by year : Primary Button : Huano Blue Shell Pink Dot (dustproof), TTC Gold 80M (Dustproof), Huano White Clear Transparant 100M (sweetspot @60-65gf) Side Button : TTC Gold Non-Dustproof, Huano Blue Shell White Dot, Kailh GM 2.0 (sweetspot @66-75gf) Encoder Scrollwheel : TTC Gold, Kailh Red

[@pmm_customs]

This is awesome.

[@tahzibentisaralindo7010]

this is just brilliant ❤

[@entsfps]

thank you!

[@altariastirlingite4509]

Most clickers have around the same activation force. For me, I focus more on click sound & the feel of the click.

[@andreytushev3852]

Thank you for this video

[@StrangerealStudios]

will you do video this again with releasing force measurements? i think it's one of the most overlooked when testing mouse switch. and it's a important critea when spamming clicks

[@Cubic_T]

Very useful！thank you man

[@Anti3D-0]

So that's where the metallic ping comes from on the superlight

[@Kevin_silvaaguiar]

I didn't like the clicks of the Superlight 2020, the main click has a hollow sound, I bought the Huano transparent Blue shell pink dot switch, I'm waiting for it to arrive to exchange, is this Huano with darker blue better or worse than the transparent one?

[@amit4rou]

Wow, I'm amazed by the effort of this video to go and measure the actuation forces on these switches.. I was wondering if you happen to have a Asus ROG micro switches and measure them too... It comes in ROG Keris mouse and few other... And those are hot swapable on these mice.. I also have a very cheap gaming mice which has a chinese omron and have a very high actuation force and I kinda like i, since it helps me land my headshots in csgo very accurately.. the mouse feet on that would get destroyed if I try to open it again on wanting to know which switches are in that.

[@DerNetteFette]

If that still helps: I got myself the same tension gauge from Aliexpress now to start my own measurements. Measured 2 red ROG Switches at 64gf each. A lot more consistent than Kailh 8's

[@_aiborie]

Thanks man! Helpful video

[@entsfps]

ty

[@sheleg4807]

Thank you so much!

[@sheikhtashdeedahmed2740]

Thanks for this detailed vid. Watched the whole thing. Please also suggest a durable 9mm encoder for Viper mini (to replace the stock with).

[@entsfps]

any kailh or ttc should be better than stock

[@sheikhtashdeedahmed2740]

@@entsfps hi ents, I think I tweeted to you some months back. I was too frustrated with the critical flaw of faulty encoder in every damn Viper mini on this earth. So instead of switching encoder and losing warranty, I upgraded to the DA V2. It almost fits my hand. I've spoken with a few DA V2 users who said they did not (yet) face the encoder issue, but if it does, then I think I'll send it for RMA and if after warranty period runs out, I'll maybe get the encoder changed. I've seen in a teardown review page of a DA V2 that this one in stock uses TTC 14 white core encoder. I hope there will be one available for me to change to if I ever want to replace. Thanks for your support all this time.

[@SC3Zero]

Hey, do you know how to adjust the leaf spring tension on a switch? Essentially, to make a lighter switch stiffer? I have some omrons on a g203 that I messed up and made too light, just trying to stiffen them up now. Thanks!

[@entsfps]

replace them

[@mehdigamingtech3294]

best switches is kailh 8.0

[@sheikhtashdeedahmed2740]

was looking for huano black shell white dot. Unfortunately not here. Only 5M rating. Lower end. Companies use them as side switches which are still fundamental though.

[@DerNerdChannel]

Can you make a video like that for the other switch types that are commonly used in mice? For example the quadratic ones they oftentimes use in middle mouse buttons or the low profile ones?

[@entsfps]

there's no way to know what specific manufacturer or spec all of those completely unlabeled switches are to even buy them, let alone test

[@DerNerdChannel]

@@entsfps dang, so that's why noone bothers to do it. I don't know what the matters is with all those manufacturers who would rather release 10000 mice instead of properly providing all specs of their products...

[@tanoargameplay7000]

what a beautiful video, which switch would you recommend me to put on my g pro x superlight I'm a call of duty player

[@entsfps]

one of these: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jJWQepSwpJqKadU&t=

[@mamorris23]

I'm kinda shocked that the Starlight-12's switches are the lightest. I figured they weren't because I was looking into changing the switches in my SL12 due to the stiffness of the clicks. I guess it's all because of the metal shell and can't be fixed.

[@entsfps]

correct, its the metal triggers making it so heavy

[@성이름-i2r6k]

Are kailh gm x and white sword the same switch?

[@supriadiramlan5545]

awesome vids

[@성이름-i2r6k]

What is the actuation force of the basic f-7n 20m? I'm looking for a switch lighter than the f-3-7

[@entsfps]

ents.win/switches

[@성이름-i2r6k]

@@entsfps Which should I focus on to see the click pressure, Operating Force or SuperDoughBoi Avg Force?

[@Yuukister]

Is there a difference between the Omron D2FC-F-7N and the Finalmouse Startlight-12 12X5C31 D2FC-F-7N (20M) ? I can see from the google sheet that the first omron is 68.5 g of force but SL-12 version is 41 g force.

[@entsfps]

theyre binned for finalmouse, no way to get those

[@Ayannnnnnn]

What do you think about the stiffness of the Razer Optical Gen 3 switches?

[@entsfps]

i like them

[@alphardestur5784]

Nice video. I'm looking for an advice, I'm currently using HTS + with blue shell pink dots. It feels a bit heavy for me, what Omron switch that you can recommend that is very light and spammable?

[@entsfps]

go for new huanos. way lighter. check my newer videos

[@alphardestur5784]

@@entsfps Are you referring to the transparent blue shell pink dots video?

[@alphardestur5784]

@@entsfps Oh you mean the blue shell green dots?

[@entsfps]

yep -- nearly the lightest switches ive ever tested, and they have an insane rating @@alphardestur5784

[@alphardestur5784]

@@entsfps I was supposed to order the green dots, as per the reviewer the green dot is much heavier than the white dot. Now I'm thorn which one is to buy haha. How about the d2f-01f? Isnt that good?

[@성이름-i2r6k]

Is there a difference in click pressure between Omron d2fc-f-7n 20m sl12 and Omron d2fc-f-7n 20m?

[@entsfps]

yes the sl12 are binned lighter

[@성이름-i2r6k]

​@@entsfpsWhat is the actuation force of the basic f-7n 20m? I'm looking for a switch lighter than the f-3-7

[@entsfps]

@@성이름-i2r6k ents.win/switches

[@mr_problem_0151]

wan to know Kailh 6*6*7.3mm square silent switch 😅

[@datthanh819]

i need your force gauge name?! Please

[@entsfps]

aliexpress "100g force tension gauge"

[@jac.c8105]

Doing God's work

[@entsfps]

ty

[@entsfps]

switch feeling is preference at the end of the day

[@jac.c8105]

@@entsfps Agree 100% man. Thanks for replying! What is your favourite might I ask?

[@entsfps]

@@jac.c8105 kailh gm2 for heavy or pink dot huano for light

[@jac.c8105]

@@entsfps Gotta try Pink dot Huano out next time then!

[@cancelik]

In the Viper Mini switch video, you ve said that Optical v2s are much more tactile compared to v1s, but here it looks like v1 has a thicker resistance spring, so it has more activation force and click sound?

[@jennyk9601]

How does the TTC gold 60M compare to the 30M?

[@entsfps]

heavier, more info at ents.win/switches

[@notTerabyte]

Hey Ents, have you got a set of Honeywell UX10c to test? Didn't notice it on your spreadsheet If you don't, it's kind of hard to get your hands on a set considering they're out of production

[@entsfps]

nope, cant find them anywhere for cheaper than $8/switch

[@cmarquais]

Maybe in the future professional testers will do the same as you. We have that for keyboards, next should the done for mouse

[@entsfps]

hope so!

[@cmarquais]

@@entsfps In fact i discovered 2 days ago, the website Rtings does that already since 6 months.

[@Khal1d]

well done

[@dno_zavr325]

what the soundtrack?

[@dsb007]

what brand ofwhat brand of scroll g pro wireless stock?

[@carlosgarciamuniz]

It would be nice to do the same but now with the latency times to see which ones are faster.

[@entsfps]

latency is determined by the debounce implementation of the mouse itself not the switch

[@carlosgarciamuniz]

@@entsfps Apart from that, there is not the same actuating distance between contacts, between an omron and a kailh to give an example. That is why the actuation time is not the same depending on the model of switch and independently of the electronics of the mouse.

[@georgepierre3594]

Your favorite 3 switches?

[@entsfps]

ents.win/faq

[@АбвгБвгд-г1ч]

why you try only 1 switch for one model? how do i know one model may have got different force

[@entsfps]

bc the video would be 10 hours long if i tested 25 of each switch. whats an acceptable sample size?

[@АбвгБвгд-г1ч]

@@entsfps in my opinion at least 3 switches for 1 model. and you can show not all tests

[@hulee6095]

Saw review on notsocommon sense about the starlight 12 and how you swapped the switches to gm8.0. he said that kailh 8.0 felt lighter than the stock switches but your scale says stock finalmouse switches are the lightest. What is your opinion on lightest switch to put in on the starlight12?

[@entsfps]

the end of the video talks about how switches behave and feel different once theyre in a mouse, and your example is exactly what i mean. the stock switches are light, but have no pretravel so require the user to overcome the full force of the *metal shell* at the very top, which makes them feel insanely heavy. its about 80g to click those once they are in the mouse. the lightest (and imo worst feeling switches) are ttc gold in the sl-12, look at my twitter to see some comparisons

[@MrShoniBare]

@@entsfps Why no one likes the TTC Golds ? Is there an important reason behind it (except the feeling of it since it's subjective) ? I know Turbobitbox doesn't like them either, but I'm really curious why :)

[@entsfps]

@@MrShoniBare generally regarded as a low quality switch, i like the 80m

[@MrShoniBare]

@@entsfps I wanna put some 30m or 60m ones on mine. Does it cause problems such as spring loosening or double click in long-term use like omrons? I've heard that they increase the production quality with the new batches, but I'm not sure.

[@entsfps]

@@MrShoniBare they should be better than regular omrons

[@Tk12038]

Does the razer viper mini use v2 or v1 ik dumb question but im dumb

[@entsfps]

old uses v1 new uses v2

[@Admixues]

Are the finalmemes binned to the lightest possible or is yours just a one off anomaly, and did that switch feel stiff or soft when it was in the mouse?.

[@entsfps]

wildly heavy in mouse

[@MrShoniBare]

Is there a big difference in between TTC Gold Dustproof 60m vs 30m ?

[@entsfps]

little more tactility

[@MrShoniBare]

@@entsfps Actuation force diff is not dramatic right ?

[@entsfps]

@@MrShoniBare certainly enough to notice

[@kaiser02.y]

Hey, could you tell me if it's possible to swap the side button's micro switches? I know that some mouses (probably the majority) have a minuscule micro switch, but I never saw someone changing them.

[@entsfps]

very bottom: ents.win/switch-replacement-form/

[@kaiser02.y]

@@entsfps good to know. Thanks for answering and researching.

[@entsfps]

@@kaiser02.y np, its the exact same procedure if the switches are directly on the pcb

[@AlexSosa_]

I thought every omron was much lighter than compared to Kailh GM 8.0 or am I missing something?

[@entsfps]

its just actuation force, not a force vs displacement graph which is more representative of the feeling of a switch the 40g finalmouse switches feel heavy bc there is no pretravel at all

[@milenski_411x]

wich switches do you preffer for gaming

[@entsfps]

huano blue shell pink dot

[@tinleo333]

@@entsfps vaxee is making people love the pink dot

[@turbobitbox]

@@tinleo333 in vaxee - huano black* shell pink dot. They are markedly different.

[@Caution40404]

@@turbobitbox The HUANO Black Shell Pink Dot also performs and feels great on XM1!

[@sniperz123]

Hi, can anyone tell me what that device is? And where to buy it?

[@entsfps]

100g dial tension gauge: amzn.to/4bGLXbq or www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832649964409.html

[@sniperz123]

@@entsfps ❤

[@sinneddragon]

Could you test the Honeywell UX10C switches?

[@entsfps]

can you link a place to buy them? i cant find any source

[@sinneddragon]

@@entsfps for some reason there's no sellers on AliExpress... Maybe supply issues?

[@entsfps]

@@sinneddragon that or honeywell cracking down on aliexpress, or its discontinued?

[@sinneddragon]

@@entsfps What do you think is the lightest switch?

[@sinneddragon]

@@entsfps Found some on newegg. www.newegg.com/p/2S7-01NT-03TN7?&ampcf=1

[@lostboy2637]

Teals go almost to 80g lol?

[@entsfps]

yep mfs heavy now

[@VicariousX]

@@entsfps I think there might be two different variants. The ones available from lethal gaming gear are listed at 60 grams and they felt much lighter than the reds in my gpw.

[@entsfps]

@@VicariousX those are old, do they have the writing on the side? my old ones were light and quiet as well

[@VicariousX]

@@entsfps Yep, although they only say GM2.0 in a large metallic font

[@DJaquithFL]

All this crap against Omron and people replacing those for Kailh. All I want and I would imagine all competitor gamers want is a hair trigger. Encoders there's a big difference especially if you switch weapons using it. Now I've got a bag full of a variety switches but none that I want.

[@entsfps]

a light switch with no pretravel is awful to use since your fingers rest on top of the triggers its almost impossible to not constantly click by accident

[@DJaquithFL]

@@entsfps .. I play Hardcore, one shot everything is in milliseconds, I want a switch that if I sneeze it clicks. The best switch I have is from my Logitech G502 that I slammed and now it's a hair trigger. Seriously, I've been thinking about transplanting it to my GPX Ultralight. - I'm Momba CoD on YT .. I'm 58 and I'm still a decent CoD player.

[@mehdigamingtech3294]

@Ents razer optical switches v3

[@entsfps]

not opening my new viper quite yet

[@yooanto9465]

Viper 8khz switch is lighter than normal viper .

[@entsfps]

shell design, should be using the v2 optical switch that's in everything else

[@tinleo333]

Great

[@entsfps]

thank you!

[@abcabcabc2014]

Do you know if zippy 60kk are 100% identical to steelseries zippy in Sensei Ten or Rival 3, they looks the similar but got different branding?

[@entsfps]

the P1L1 are the same switch but in a brands mice they may request a certain force range, so you may end up with a heavier to press switch vs the one in a steelseries mouse

[@abcabcabc2014]

@@entsfps but u haven't tested switch from sensei ten f.e., right?

[@entsfps]

@@abcabcabc2014 correct, just going of my experience with every mouse i've changed switches on

[@abcabcabc2014]

​@@entsfps got it, ty

[@DerNetteFette]

Can you measure the click force required for an assembled mouse the same way? I have constant pain in my right arm and been searching around since a long time for the mouse with the lightest clicks.

[@entsfps]

its different for every mouse switch combo -- i dont have the time or money to do that sadly. for arm pain try not clicking on the mouse, foot pedals, or clicking with the side buttons