Floating Raft Hydroponics Update Dec 2012

[@Taleulah]

You never cease to amaze me with your energy and enthusiasm. You make me want to jump up in the middle of winter and run out and plant something...lol Thanks for sharing all that you do. God bless.

[@DigitalFoodDesert]

Bobby, I've been so impressed that I spent the money to buy 50# of fertilizer and pay the shipping. I have my first 8 net pots sprouting lettuce and under lights. You've inspired me to get the greenhouse ready to receive these and a bunch more buckets using this method. The B.A. Kratky papers have enough information for me to replicate his experiments, and your experiments gave me the spark to get it done. Since telling friends about it I've received numerous plastic tubs for these trials.

[@mhpgardener]

The corn was Hastings Prolific. I don't think it's available in any catalogs. I sent seeds to a lot of folks and have maybe just enough left for me to try and grow it again. Hopefully a few of the folks will have success and be able to share some next year.

[@mhpgardener]

Yes sir. All of the shows are archived for listening to at a later date. I'm doing my reading and video watching on the AP stuff. It sure does sound like fun. :)

[@mhpgardener]

I haven't decided on the setup yet, but the grow beds will only be about 12-16 inches deep. I'll cut the totes down to size. One tote will be the fish tank. I'll check out savko.

[@mhpgardener]

The larger panels droop a little bit, that's why I put a string across there. A support wire would be better. The plants are all that heavy. It's just a large span for 1 inch styrofoam. I wouldn't use wood in a situation where it's gonna be wet all the time. It's probably gonna warp.

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks. Supplemental lighting isn't really needed. A better option is to just make sure that I don't have the taller plants blocking the sunlight. I've pruned those tomatoes some more, to thin them out a bit. This will be my last run in this location. I'll move the raft setup to the other greenhouse once this lettuce makes.

[@mhpgardener]

Welcome back stranger ! One of the advantages to hydroponics is the fact that you're not using soil, so you don't have to worry about wearing those gloves. See, I didn't forget ! ;)

[@mhpgardener]

Hey Lazlo, it's a water soluble fertilizer. Anything granular is going to take too long to break down. Compost tea is good for plants, but I don't think it'll have enough nutrients to be a main fertilizer. It would make for an interesting experiment though. A cold frame should be fine for lettuce, just don't forget about opening the window on a warm day. Otherwise, you're gonna have some wilted lettuce. It wouldn't hurt to drop a few carrots seeds in there too.

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks Jason. I'm anxious to see how well the aquaponics deal really works. After seeing the growth of plants in a hydro setup, if I can get anything close to that with AP, I'll be plenty happy.

[@RobsAquaponics]

Some nice growth on the lettuce.. Doesn't look like the shade has done them much harm at all.. I'm sure you will do excellently with the aquaponics as you do with all your gardens Bobby.. Tar for the shout out too :D Think I will be watching your AP clips soon for inspiration ;) Have a great show today/tonight..

[@jmtnvalley]

Welcome to aquaponics. My wife and I started July 4 2012. I suggested starting small, but she put all engines ahead full. We build a 12' x 24' green house and put a 1000 gallon tank in it. We did start small with goldfish and 5 small grow beds. It took a while and a number of sacrificed goldfish, but the system stabilized. We now have quite a few grow beds and about 50 Tilapia. Last night we had salad completely from our green house. We read that tomatoes don't do well in aquaponics, but we have to disagree. They went nuts. broccoli, parsley, basil, chives, lettuce, green onions all do very well. Cabbage is having trouble, but cabbage doesn't do well in our conventional garden either. Good luck!

[@olensoifer9901]

Personally, I don't see why people try growing some plants anyway. Sure, if you're planning for the end of the world, or have lots of outside growing space, that's one thing. But, until the end comes, it just seems like a waste to grow things like potatoes, cabbage or corn. The first two are simply dirt cheap, and corn's yield is low, compared to the space & nutrients that it takes. It just seems like a waste of greenhouse space. The real issue that I see with aquaponics is that there's an abundance of nitrogen, but a shortage of some nutrients like potassium. Depending upon ground water components, calcium & iron could be in short supply also. The big problem I have is that there are too many people acting like experts on hydroponics...but they are really just home experimenters. They spew "gospel", but it's often just their guess.

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks. I'm anxious to see how it goes too. Raining today, so not much going on.

[@mhpgardener]

Thank you. College was never an option for me, so I'm earning my degree by trial and error. I hope to graduate some day. :)

[@mhpgardener]

Yes sir, I use Masterblend water soluble fertilzer, the tomato formula. For lettuce, I cut it back a bit, since they don't need as much fertilizer as tomatoes do. This formula isn't specifically for lettuce, but it's working out great.

[@mhpgardener]

I use a small utility pump. But you can dip it out, or even use a shop vac.

[@kevinkelly8444]

The Aztecs built floating seed beds on the lake that is now Mexico City. Although the rafts were filled with soil one would think the roots eventually reached the water. The beds were eventually planted in the soil but it is thought that the growing time was cut in half because of this method. Not quite what we are doing but pretty cool none the less.

[@M0D0C42]

Mine have emerged from the earth about two weeks ago and are only about 1/2" tall. I planted them October 16th. I should be harvesting them, but they are no where close to that. Was too hot before, now it's too cold. Sure glad you're getting some. I may try growing them in a container, indoors, next. Great show last night, buddy. God bless.

[@mhpgardener]

I use the same Masterblend fertilzer that I use for tomatoes. I've mentioned it a few times in videos. It's some good stuff, very easy to work with. You could set this up in your hoophouse and make plenty of lettuce.

[@superjv57]

Hi Bobby my name is Jason. I love your videos and look forward to them every weekend. I've been looking forward to you taking on aquaponics and I have no doubt you will make it a big success. Thanks for all your hard work!

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks.... and that's quite a compliment. I've seen Joe speak a few times in videos, and he's a very smart fella.

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks. We all have different growing situations. So I think it makes sense to try and test out multiple methods. I hope it goes well for you.

[@elainekain]

Thanks for the info! I'm in Minnesota, 'the land of 10,000 lakes' with a lot of smaller swamps and potholes - had one about 1/3 of an acre on the farm growing up, was the boundary to the neighbors - mucky bottom, no one ever found solid ground or depth, but it never dried up and the cows used it for drinking. In hindsight, run-off from a couple dozen cattle would be nitrogen-rich, but not the devastation of a factory farm. Well-water was high in iron -- may need to test water starting!

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks. I'm not familiar with the wool/cotton deal. But for seed starting, it sounds like it might work as long as the seeds aren't submersed in water.

[@GardenSoilDYI]

Thank you so much for the information, Its only been about a month since I found your videos on You Tube and they have been wonderful to watch, especially seeing what you can accomplish with HIS help. This last weekend I was able to build a Kratky system 2' x 4', but my will be in my basement under lights, until I can move it to my greenhouse at the end of February after it warms up. Thanks again I'm looking forward to the challenge.

[@mhpgardener]

I think I mentioned it in the Off Grid Hydroponics video. I know it was shown in the hydro lettuce videos a couple of times. It's just Masterblend 4-18-38, with Calcium Nitrate and Epsom salt....at a ratio of 10-10-5.... measured in grams. Thank you.

[@mhpgardener]

I'm hoping that AP turns out to be as simple as soil growing. Supposedly, once the beds are established, it's almost like planting in soil.

[@mhpgardener]

To start out, I'll catch some bream out of the pond. Next year, I'd like to get some channel cat fingerlings. Raising shiners and minnows sounds like a decent idea.

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks Rob. I've seen a lot of videos, but it's not the same as putting your hands on the pieces. I'll take it slow, and try to make sure what I'm doing is correct. Like any bit of info, I'll verify things from multiple soureces. And yes sir, even without full sun, the lettuce is coming along nicely.

[@mhpgardener]

I change after each crop is complete in this type of box. For the Dutch buckets, I try to change out the reservoir at least every 30 days. Thanks.

[@mhpgardener]

I was glad to see that my previous diagnosis was correct. The lettuce grows much better with its own kind. I'm not sure how many fish to put in there. I have a lot more studying to do. But my plan is to catch some bream from the pond and use them for this first test. And later on, if all goes well, I'd like to do some channel cats. Then I'd start stocking up on hushpuppie mix. :)

[@mhpgardener]

It depends on what size and what you're growing I guess. For most things, I'm using the 2 inch pots with rockwool cubes.

[@mhpgardener]

For sure, gotta have fish for the nitrates. There are lots of videos on IBC's, so I just need to iron out the specifics and round up the parts. I think it's gonna be pretty cool. But I'll take it slow, plenty of time to work on it this winter.

[@Sorren11]

looking forward to see how the aquaphonics experiment. Robert and Yvonne hardy that host the Countryside reunion in Indiana have started one and man are they trilled with it.

[@rmljr52]

Bobby, I built a passive raft and used the master blend fertilizer. It worked fine for my lettuce and peppers. However after a period of time my roots turned from nice and white to brown.

[@mhpgardener]

Yes...I'm using 2 inch net pots.

[@mhpgardener]

I've been doing some reading, and it's starting to make sense to me. Now it's just a matter of getting all of the parts together, and getting started.

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks. I've seen some people using the water from the fish tank in NFT setups. Kinda like a combination of HP and AP.

[@loislaney23]

Sure looking good, Bobby. Never a dull moment at your house. Always something going on. Very fun.

[@mhpgardener]

Yes sir. From what I've seen, painting them is recommended...something like an olive green. I could wrap them in black plastic, but I think its best to go ahead and get it done right to start with. I'll go back and watch some more videos, paying closer attention this time.

[@mhpgardener]

No sir, the only testing I do is when I eat. From what little I've seen on the subject, plastics are safe at normal temperatures. It is heat that brings out the bad stuff. I don't know for sure.

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks. This is head lettuce, but it can be picked a few leaves at a time. My plan is to prime and paint the IBC's, then put the frames back around them. We have a company of the road that has plenty of the totes, but they have dye in them and are darn near impossible to clean. Being able to put a liner inside should save companies quite a bit of money.

[@Aceman307]

I know you will make the aquaponics work for you. Good luck. I will try and listen in tonight.

[@mhpgardener]

LOL... it's just a little bit early for planting outside. But the way time flies, planting time will be here shortly. Thank you.

[@mhpgardener]

Cool...I'd like to see it. I think Kratky said tomatoes could be done. They just need a lot more water than the lettuce does. Let me know how it goes.

[@mhpgardener]

50# of fertilizer will grow a LOT of vegetables. I'm glad you read up on what Mr Kratky was doing. It was hard for me to believe at first, but it really works. As they say, seeing is believing. :)

[@mhpgardener]

I would start more seeds. And as soon as you see a seed start to sprout, get them under some lights. I use regular 4ft fluorescent shop lights. Leave them under the lights 24/7 for about a week. That should resolve the spindly stem problems. Then you'll be in good shape.

[@TheOntarioGardener]

Dang Bobby, The more I watch those hydro videos, the more likely I am gunna try it next year! I hope I can afford a hoop house and be able to grow in it. Nice job, once again!

[@mhpgardener]

I've priced some of the stock tanks, and they don't come cheap. That might have something to do with the popularity of IBC's. Long term, I'd like to have 4 x 8 beds from 2x12 lumber and pond liners. But that won't be cheap either.

[@mhpgardener]

I did post a video several months ago about building the boxes. It's called "Building New Boxes for Hydroponic Growing". Thanks.

[@mhpgardener]

Yes sir, I remember you. As expected, those fine misters clog easily. It takes a very good filter to run an aero setup.

[@mhpgardener]

I don't recall ever seeing cyprus plywood for sale around here. If it's priced like oak, it'll break the bank. The styrofoam works great, but it would be nice to have something with a bit more weight.

[@JonFrumTheFirst]

Interesting that you're the only one doing Kratky on KZbin. You're a pioneer, my friend.

[@mhpgardener]

It was 2 grams per gallon of water for the main fertilizer and calcium nitrate.

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks. I put the rockwool cubes right into the net cups with nothing else. Nice and simple. :)

[@19Photographer76]

When I was living in Florida and did something similar, cypress is the wood of choice to be submerge. It won't warp or break down. So, if you can get a little, that would work under the rafts.

[@mhpgardener]

The spacing varies, average is about 11 inches.

[@mhpgardener]

I'm not sure, still deciding. But the CHOP setup seems simplest, uses just one pump.

[@mhpgardener]

It was just a test comparing two different methods.

[@mhpgardener]

Thats a good idea. Blocking the light is important.

[@PetPrepper]

Great vid Bobby. Ohhhh and as always another great show Friday. Thanks for being you

[@mhpgardener]

I get a lot of comments about AP, so I tknow here is plenty of interest in it. I've seen some of the larger commercial setups and they are just way out of my league. I think going small and working my way up is the best route. Reservoir temps during July are still a concern, but I guess I'll cross that bridge when I get to it. I just watched one of Josh's videos, trying to watch another. He was doing good.

[@mhpgardener]

Most any type of lettuce seed will be fine. Just go with a variety that you like.

[@thorgecko707]

very nice setup. i will be building a 10x30 greenhouse this winter for aquaponics and hydroponics.

[@mhpgardener]

I am 100% certain that you can do Kratky's method indoors with artificial light. The key will be getting the right fertilizer. I'm confident that the Masterblend will work. Everything seems to do well with it. But there are plenty of other fertilizers on the market that could be used. I just don't have any experience with them.

[@imatelly]

im trying this with tomatoes right now. it seems to be working very well if it actualy works out ill be making a video out of the vids i keep taking. so far so good

[@mhpgardener]

Will do, I'll keep you in mind. Thanks.

[@mhpgardener]

Ambition...not enough ambition? You're running a commercial bakery in the house. Now that's what I call ambition. ;)

[@mhpgardener]

For me, different methods do better for different plants. For lettuce, the raft setups work great. But I wouldn't want to do tomatoes in them. I think the Dutch Buckets are much better for tomatoes. Thanks.

[@mhpgardener]

I use a 4-18-38 product that gets mixed with Calcium Nitrate and Epsom Salt to form a complete fertilizer.

[@dixcreative]

Legend !!! Love how you do this home style. Not buying plastic tubes from a shop

[@heckyes]

Pt1. Yea man, I totally feel ya. What climate region are you in? As for foggers. You've probably seen them before in those decorative misting fountains. There is a few different kind of foggers but the ones I'm referring to are low pressure and low power. They use the power of ultrasonic sound to pressurize water into vapour. Not as good as true aeroponic, but way less equipment and things to go wrong. The struggle with ultrasonic foggers is that they use ceramic discs to pull off the effect.

[@growing4fun]

Looking good, looking good. Can't wait for you aquaponic experiments.

[@mhpgardener]

On a large body of water, probably not too good. The nitrate levels would be too low. But if you had a small koi pond, your idea has potential. Assuming the fish didn't eat all of the roots. :)

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks April.... I'm curious myself just how it's going to turn out.

[@mhpgardener]

I use a water soluble hydroponic fertilizer, 4-18-38, from Masterblend or Chemgro.

[@mhpgardener]

That's interesting. I had someone else suggest a piece of copper wire. I reckon it wouldn't hurt to try.

[@mhpgardener]

If you're trying to save money, check Craigslist for used frames. I see them all the time. Thanks.

[@heckyes]

Pt2. These ceramic discs wear out very quickly in the high salinity of hydroponic solutions which often exceed 1000ppm in some cases (for heavy fruiting plants such as tomatoes). So the beauty of using ultrasonic foggers with Aquaponics is that the nutrients in Aquaponics are living enzymes and microbes and thus the salt content of the system is very low (I've had mine as low as 40ppm) which greatly extends the life of the ceramic discs used in the fogging application. Lots of possibilities...

[@mhpgardener]

I put a link in the description box for the fertilizer that I use.

[@mhpgardener]

The only thing I see people adding to AP systems is a bit of Seaweed fertilizer and some iron if they have a deficiency.

[@mhpgardener]

I would keep the cubes in a light place so that when they germinate, they don't get all leggy on you. A ph of 6 is fine.

[@timjturner]

Very nice lesson on the two methods....The lettuce did much better now than before...very interesting....I can't wait to see you get into the Aquaponics....those containers look like you are heading in the right direction....How many fish will you put into each container?? Thanks for sharing....

[@mhpgardener]

Yep, most of the big growers around here have a greenhouse specifically for starting plants.

[@selinas8039]

You have convinced me to convert my heavy soil deck planters into these. Maybe even in a greenhouse.

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks Lois. Indeed, I'm always getting into something around here. :)

[@alfredowen4034]

on a floating system I use black plastic around all gaps,taped on losely to seal out the sun light

[@mhpgardener]

I hope this works out. I'm more interested in the plant growth, but fresh fish for dinner once in awhile wouldn't be so bad. :)

[@mhpgardener]

Thank you mam. I was pretty well talked out after the show. I'm gonna have to find some guests pretty soon. :)

[@mhpgardener]

You can do it...I know you can. And probably with better results too. I wouldn't be at all surprised. :)

[@suprsleep]

Looks great bobby! You inspire many. Your the next Joe Saladin

[@mhpgardener]

I start everything from seed. Most of my lettuce seeds are purchased online from Johnny's Seeds.

[@mhpgardener]

Thanks bro. I picked some nice radishes this morning too. I couldn't help but wonder how yours were doing. ;)

[@ironhead41]

awesome.......do you dilute fertilizer in the water?

[@mhpgardener]

Rude? LOL...not at all. I got them for $100 each. I've seen them go for 125-150, so I thought it was fair price. I already had 2 of them, but they had other chemicals and I wasn't comfortable with using them for fish. The food grade are getting hard to find. I'd like to have a few more myself to hook up to the gutters.

[@hoopmanlaszlo]

Bobby, I forgot to tell you that I have the hoop house uncovered. I only left the skirt on it. I was thinking maybe grow the lettuces in a cold frame made of windows. What do you think?

[@DocScience2]

when you use the stationary raft, when the plants get heavy, does the styrofoam start to droop? If so, can you use plywood for the stationary raft ?

[@mhpgardener]

1.5 inch

[@abcdddiia]

As always Bobby, your videos are well thought out and educational. In this video, you showed 2 methods (1) airless with styrofoam boards sitting on the box edges, and (2) air stones -- with styrofoam floating on the water. I wonder if the hybrid approach works even better. How about letting the foam board sit on top of the box edges, and use air stones in the water. That way, sunlight can't get in from the edges, and there's air in the water all the time (even though you have proven that it is not required). is there a down side to this method?

[@mhpgardener]

There is no downside to your idea. I actually tried it one time and the lettuce did grow faster with the additional aeration.

[@jakemanshs]

Nothing better than the School of Hard Knocks!