Mid/Side Processing Explained, Featuring John Matthews from Tukan Studios

In this episode, we'll be demystifying mid/side processing with some help from ‪@johnmatthews8435‬ from Tukan Studios, and also learning a bit about how his JS: Goniometer plugin works!
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[@kellypeterson2625]

I like your "I don't really know what I'm talkin' sbout about" someone as knowledgeable as you not being afraid to acknowledge that demonstrates your integrity. And it's probably that very attitude that is helped you learn everything you have. Acknowledging one's own ignorance-on a given topic- is the beginning of knowledge.

[@LetsTalkAboutReaper]

I'm definitely a fan of learning, and not so much a fan of pretending to know everything 🤓

[@wenglish1968]

I'm still going to have to re-watch this a few times, but it already makes far more sense.

[@elmolewis9123]

Excellent presentation.

[@uhhuu]

Wow - thank you! You made it clear really well.

[@markoburrows]

Gentlemen, I want to thank you for this. I have been in the dark over Mid/Side forever, until this concise, well thought out and well presented video came to my attention. Both Myk and John operate very professional and entertaining channels that I have had the pleasure of subscribing to for some time. The co-operation videos that You have produced have both been excellent and this latest video will help my efforts to record and produce myself so much. thank you again...

[@nersonangelo]

I love these guys haha...

[@mageprometheus]

Thanks, Myk. One thing to remember is that mid/side processing isn't perfect. The mid is calculated by adding left and right so it includes the sides. (Mid=(L+R)/2) while the side is the difference where the mids null out. (Side=(L-R)/2) So processing the side doesn't affect the mids but processing the mids does affect the sides. The de-encode is just L=(Mid+Side) where the right part of the side is out of phase to the original (the -R above) and R=(Mid-Side) so the right part of the side is now in phase and the left part of the side is out of phase. Getting the sides away from the mid is the hard part else we could have 3 channels and do perfect mid only, right side, left side processing and just sum them at the end. 😄 This is the kind of stuff to keep you awake at night.

[@LetsTalkAboutReaper]

🤯🧠

[@johnmatthews8435]

Sorry to say that, but that's not completely correct. The side signal is processed hopefully regardless of the polarity. So both channels (L & R) have the same about of change when processing the side signal. You can see it like this: The mid-signal is the "sound information" while the side-signal is the "stereo-amount" information. It's a rough description, but I think you know what I mean.

[@mageprometheus]

@@johnmatthews8435 I understand, side processing id fine. Imagine a 1k 3dB boost on the mid, which is after all just a mono sum of left and right, mid and side. Subtracting the side later doesn't 'fix' the problem. It works out on paper and in practice.

[@johnmatthews8435]

​@@mageprometheus Exactly. You boost 1k +3dB on the mid-channel. So your mono information will get stronger there, not the stereo information. That's exactly what it is about. Imagine boosting the side-channel the same way. Now the stereo information will be boosted in the same way, while the mono signal stays the same. :) (And trust me, the left channel will not be louder then, just because of the +/- thing. Because if the mid-signal is negative, the right channel would be louder then)

[@tomleader7054]

I think it is useful to think of mis and side as sum and difference and yes it can be difficult to get your head around. I still sometimes have to visualise the fader layout on the console used when decoding a mid/side recording to keep my head straight.

[@TokkanFX]

A brilliant tutorial, thank you both.

[@eduserra]

Nice and precise. Thanks John and Myk.

[@danielpisera]

Excelente explicación!!!!

[@LDdrums20]

Love all the latest collabs around John's plugins

[@NickLeonard]

excellent explanation! I also didn't understand M/S processing correctly, so this is very useful!

[@vandorb12]

This really helps! I use a similar scope program to check phase and mono compatibility on my mixes, but never thought it was more about mid/side.

[@maplefoxx6285]

This was a great video thanks! trick I learned along the way is using Mid Side EQ instead of Stereo imaging. Stereo widening plugins can cause weird fx you might not barely hear but are there in the mix. I learned this trick from an Andrew Schepps video. He uses it to widen the mix. It is in the video on here where he explains how to use Schepps 73 plugin. It is some good tips. Thanks again! and thanks for the discord community! If i could ask for videos it would be more about how to get Bass and guitar to fit in a heavier mix. My weak points are mixing guitar and bass properly.

[@RolandDeschain1]

I always see Mid/Side as a big part of an EQ and had no clue what it was about. I'll definitely be looking more into it. And Tukan plug-ins are outstanding. There are some that I prefer to my Waves stuff.

[@ProgressiveSoundAudio]

You've confused me! lol The initial statement of Centre and Side processing 'isn't true' was then followed up by an example of a Mid/Side processing which affects the 'Centre and Sides', well Mid/Mono and Sides is probably a better way of explaining. M/S processing is created by duplicating signals and inverting the phase of one of them to create the M/S image so you have control of the Mid and Side of the source, so for the layman it could be perceived as processing the 'Centre and Sides' independently, although it's not completely accurate, especially in a Mastering context which is why you really have to consider phasing issues. Another thing to consider is when you duplicate a source and pan one left and one right you will achieve phase cancellation (I believe this is the right term) and thus create a mono signal. Take a rhythm guitar track for instance, record it in mono and duplicate it, pan one hard right and one hard left and you have a mono signal, which is why you have to double or quad track guitars to achieve stereo separation. It's an interesting concept which is commonly used in Mastering to Mono Bass, add stereo width etc but is certainly not an easy concept to fathom 👍

[@LetsTalkAboutReaper]

Oh, I'm all kinds of confused 🤣 I made a follow up video this morning showing what lead to my initial confusion, which is something to the effect of expecting a certain "area" of sound to be affected in a certain way using mid/side processing and it not doing what I expected. It's only a couple of minutes long, perhaps it'll spark more conversation on the topic

[@ProgressiveSoundAudio]

@@LetsTalkAboutReaper I've just dropped a comment which I hope may help, or confuse the matter further!!! Definitely in need of more coffee!!

[@battmanvonrichtoven]

So I went looking for your bus compressor John and I couldn’t find it. Is this new or am I just a ding batt?

[@MonkeyBars1]

I feel more confused now 🤨

[@LetsTalkAboutReaper]

It's a deep topic

[@nafawi7965]

Vu metered !!???