4 Wort Aeration Methods | exBEERiment

[@stillbald5827]

I would love to know the ratio of statistically significant to insignificant results from Brulosophy experiments. Almost all of the results I’ve seen are insignificant. Which I think is significant for some reason.

[@dahe8883]

Is brewing a good beer shear luck? Or is it an art like witchcraft vs science? The brewers art may come down to knowing what not to do, vs what to do. Can they test for mistakes instead of successes?

[@percepto77]

Writing this here and I have no idea if people will see it, but I've been thinking about this issue a lot. Each of these experiments only allow people to contribute one data point. You really should get two data points per person. If you are testing A vs. B, do AA vs. B and A vs. BB in your triangle tests. If each cup has 2 oz, that's only 12 oz (1 beer) worth of product people are tasting. Counterbalance the order people try the two versions (AAB and ABB). If you want to give people 2 beers, do the first round as I stated above, then reveal the manipulation and let them do it again. If you want to know if this method makes a difference, just look at the first round data vs. the data with two rounds. We know that olfaction is one of the most suggestible sensory modalities, so flavor (which includes both smell and taste) is highly suggestible, so knowing the exbeeriment manipulation should make a difference. I hope somebody tries this. Overall, I really appreciate these videos, but I think the methodology could be improved.

[@fdk7014]

That's because there are a lot of myths in home brewing.

[@vexy1987]

​@percepto77 Haha, yes! But this is entertainment, not rigorous science! If you're after rigour, you'd need a double-blind setup. Both the tasters and dispensers would have to be blinded to the nature of the experiment to avoid any bias, whether intentional or not. A proper experiment would also require a placebo group, in addition to control and experimental groups-it's important not to conflate the two. These sorts of experiments are quite time-consuming to set up, and you wouldn't be able to measure individual preferences since each participant would only be assigned to one group. I work in clinical research and have designed research protocols so it's obvious that these experiments are flawed, but alas still fund to watch.

[@BrewLogSC]

I read an article that was say that add O2 at 1 L/min was to fast. Slowing down the rate was the key. If you add O2 at too high of a rate, all you do is blow O2 out the top of fermenter. I started adding O2 at a much smaller rate and scale up time. This to me has made better beer overall. I currently add O2 at 500 ml/min for 1 min 24 sec. Ale.

[@liquidgold2735]

I run my hot wort out of my kettle through a double mesh fine strainer into a second kettle with my Jaded Hydra wort chiller. I then stir the living daylights out of the beer while chilling and then pour heartily into a fermenter once my beer is chilled. I feel that all these steps more than adequately oxygenate my wort as I've never had a beer not hit my expected final gravity, even big OG beers.

[@mb5o]

Agree. I simply pour heartily into the fermenter through a fine mesh once the beer is chilled. It has been working great for at least 30 years.

[@biralleebeerbrewing2373]

Most dry yeast manufacturers no longer suggest aerating prior to direct pitching (on first pitch) - but surprising to see these results for liquid yeast as well

[@keithpoolehomecoffeeroasti489]

Wondering if adding oxygen is a holdover from commercial breweries where they are repitching several generations and probably don't transfer much trub into fermenters. I think new yeast pitches (especially dry) and some trub helps at the homebrew level.

[@hikeandahalf]

It’s funny how many steps we all go through for you to prove it matters so little overall. If I transfer into a glass car boy I place the car boy on a skateboard first. Then aerating by mixing is super easy because of how it rocks back and forth. When using the clawhammer system I transfer my wort using their spray nozzle on the lid. This leaves it very bubbly

[@glleon80517]

I do not use pure oxygen, but rather room air from an aquarium pump delivered through a sanitary filter and 5 micron stone. I aerate the wort while I proof the yeast. Seems like an easy insurance policy for yeast health. It seems like if the aerated batch finished at lower gravity, some tasters would notice. Thanks, Martin!

[@DmitryShultz]

Isnt it more important for lager beer fermentation? So you need to brew pilsner and baltic porter/maybock not kolsh and imperial stout. Stout is also very forgiving beer, masks a lot of problems in the process.

[@cfrazier1977]

I think that O2 additions matter if you are using old or harvested yeast. Fresh yeast has the sterrols that they need were harvested do not and need to build them, i.e. they benefit from O2.

[@SeanEidge]

Did you get to test your hypothesis?

[@TheAlchemistsBrewery]

That being said, this is a good exbeeriment and what brulosophy is all about. I love it!

[@AM2PMReviews]

For mead, I tried something similar. I used my blender on one gallon with the wort with raisins to make it very aerated. It was very foamy. The other I just pitched it all in a gallon jug. The blended one had more access to sugar because the raisins were blended and the oxygen made it require a blowoff tube because it fermented fast with Kveik yeast. The normal one took longer and didn’t explode out the top. Flavor wise, they were very similar but the oxygenated one seems to be smoother and it did finish a little faster and slightly higher ABV. Overall, it doesn’t seem to matter too much because it just takes a little more time for that non-aerated one with that strong Kveik which likes to be stressed because it puts out the nice orange notes.

[@PainMaker0017]

I just brewed a stout with 1.084 OG that was supposed to ferment down to around 1.024. I mildly shook the fermenter for about 30 seconds after adding the yeast. I used Kveik Lutra dry yeast added directly to the wort. It finished in a couple days at 1.022. Fermentation was continuous and smooth. It just finished, so I haven’t tried it yet. I make 2.75 gallon batches. I use one packet of yeast. I only use the shake method with my beers. I’ve had stuck fermentations with high gravity beers in the past, but I’ve used different yeast.

[@dyyddson]

aeration is way more imporant with liquid yeasts, dry ones dont really need aeration. ur fine if dry yeasts suit you. This is no longer true if you make a starter out of a dry yeast, it loses the fatty acids that the manufacturer packs into them, and you should then use aeration (aeration = o2 from a bottle!) for best results.

[@mb5o]

I have been using Kveik for the last few years. It almost feels like cheating. I get great results regardless of the fermenting conditions.

[@dyyddson]

after watching the video: .... in theory. Haha LOL

[@craftbrewer5401]

How would olive oil work? It’s not soluble in beer, so how would it be accessible to the yeast. It will just hang around in a bloop on the surface. Or am I missing something?

[@wd6358]

For a while I couldn't get full attenuation on my beers. I bought an oxygenation kit and use it on every brew. Haven't had a problem since

[@donosborn]

I don't use pure O2 as much as I used to. With the amount of yeast cells that come in some of these yeast packs it does not seem to be as important as maybe it was years ago. I do have exceptions and that is for lagers that I'm cold fermenting or of course higher gravity beers. I feel like it's more important to have plenty of O2 in those situations.

[@troymc80]

@ 9:25 - If the recommended dosage is 1 mg / 25 billion cells (8 mg / 200 billion cells) 8 ml ist about 1000 times more than needed. Or did I misunderstand something?

[@tsimmons4730]

What would be the difference between pure oxygen and compressed air (would have to come from an oil free compressor and filtered) add to the wort?

[@raulromero6462]

So if I only fill the fermenter half way and live it like that for 3days before filling up the rest. Does that count has aired?

[@timwilson2241]

In my ales I add o2 through my carb stone simply as cheap insurance just like yeast nutrient. They always turn out just fine. However, adding o2 to my

[@tomwidauer8376]

The only aeration my beers get is them being poured from a cube on the bench, into a fermenter below. This creates a nice thick layer of foam, which is a sign of decent aeration. I also use overbuilt starters in order to set some yeast aside for later use.

[@NoMusiciansInMusicAnymore]

Wouldn't the yeast already have had a division given a starter was used?

[@richarddeeble09]

Aeration becomes critical if you are repitching yeast over multiple generations. Issues like diacetyl reuptake, acetaldehyde, speed of fermentation and attenuation are all going to be affected long term if you are serially repitching yeast without the right level of 02. It's not likely to be noticeable in an average strength wort using a fresh pitch of yeast. It's also a variable you can play with alongside pitching rate and temperature to influence flavour, especially in more expressive yeasts.

[@raulromero6462]

Or is the olive oil to cover the top so it doesn't get infected by air?

[@reddhotpoker3517]

Interesting. I actually fermented a batch in a keg that I had mistakenly purged with CO2 before transferring in the wort into it. I didn't realize until the next day when I transcribed my notes. It fermented out just fine with no off flavors. I don't even remember which beer it was because there was no noticeable quality difference.

[@marksoler7338]

Big time improvement. A beer judge friend once trashed my Belgian Ale because it tasted like bubble gum, and said I needed to make sure my yeast weren't struggling. He said to use oxygen and grow my yeast overnight in sone wort. Huge difference! I had previously thought "bubble gum" was normal. Now my Belgian ales are devoid of this off flavor. I reccomend a split batch experiment with a beer with yeast character. Go for a Belgian dubble with your Imperial "Dubble Tripple". You'll see! These experiments were with neutral yeasts.

[@damony1301]

I use a stainless stone on a fish tank aerator and let it run for 15ish minutes. No idea if it helps, but I figure it couldn't hurt

[@timheffernan3577]

It hard to say but I use an Oxygen Concentrator and a Venturi Injector to oxygenate the wort on the way to the fermenter and I have had no problems. I also brew almost exlcuively big beers

[@detlefkoertge6988]

Why didn’t you add aquarium pump aeration to the test?

[@Fortymlshot]

No love for Venturi aeration method?

[@xander1052]

I don't do much aeration, just Pouring the hot liquor open into the fermenter and shake it a bunch for the first week lightly, but having tasted many of my beers of recent times which includes an 11.6% Barleywine, no off flavours were detectable.

[@RiggerBrew]

I have noticed a longer LAG time when not aerating.

[@onemileperhour]

Consider introducing counter balancing and randomization into your sensory tests

[@wrayzor97]

One thing I haven’t heard is what yeast are used. Liquid or dry? Dry yeast needs no oxygen.

[@suziederkins3310]

Funny I’ve never once done an aeration and I’ve brewed for over 15 years; never had a brew not ferment.

[@terryj3593]

I suppose if it’s fresh yeast, dry or otherwise, it wouldn’t make much difference. It would be interesting to see after a few generations of use though.

[@Morventhus]

New episode let's go

[@LloydGM]

I use yeast starters and have never seen any difference using oxygen or not, even with the occasional tripel or my frequent wee-heavies.

[@SeanEidge]

Confirmation that my laziness was the insignificantly inferior approach.

[@alexrocks135]

Shoutout the t test chart and also the z test

[@grahamhawes7089]

I never skip oxygenation. I just see inconsistent fermentation performance and timing from batch-to-batch if I don’t oxygenate. I think this is especially important if you re-use or propagate yeast. Every professional brewery oxygenates and every yeast expert recommends it, if it wasn’t necessary, professional brewers would surely eliminate that extra cost and complexity from their operations.

[@fdk7014]

People are often superstitious. If something worked for them once they keep doing that and even recommend that to others even if it doesn't have any measurable effect at all.

[@grahamhawes7089]

@@fdk7014 brewing is an extremely competitive industry with tight margins. Everything that isn’t essential will get cut out to save cost. The ubiquity of oxygenation in commercial brewing suggests that it is probably vital at scale or due to some difference in commercial processes, and the results of these experiments suggest that homebrewers are often able to get by without it for different reasons. One such factor is that commercial breweries typically re-use yeast 5-10 times. It’s incredible hubris to think that an experiment in your garage invalidates the SOP of a multi billion dollar industry.

[@fdk7014]

@@grahamhawes7089 Yes if you do reuse yeast many times you need to resupply the sterol reserves of the yeast. When you buy yeast for your homebrewing it comes fully loaded with sterols already, it doesn't need any more and it will have no use for more. Adding more oxygen does nothing. You can easily repitch that 3-5 times with very little oxygenation.

[@EcoRuno]

i my experience lager yeast need more oxygenation

[@davec4955]

I definitely won't be investing in oxygen anytime soon. 🍻

[@fdk7014]

I never aerate the wort, it's not needed unless you have yeast that has been re-pitched several times. I used to try to aerate as a beginner brewer. I quickly learned that it makes no difference whatsoever.

[@graeme02]

Over pitching healthy yeast beats under pitching EVERY time. Making a starter is great insurance against under pitching IMHO.

[@fdk7014]

Yeast pitch rate is another myth that Brulosophy has effectively dealt with. If you underpitch all that happens is that the yeast will grow for longer, i.e. the fermentation takes a bit longer time. That's not a problem for a home brewer. Pitch rate is important for breweries because they have significant investments in fermenters and they need to turn them over at a good rate to get good value from them. Thus a long fermentation is not desirable so they use a good amount of yeast to speed it up.

[@xdonnix]

If you pitch a large enough healthy population of yeast that has been calculated based on OG, you really shouldn't have to worry about dissolved o2.

[@paskrell]

We need to redo all with nothing to hide beer like helles.

[@ianlaker9161]

Confirmation to me that this is the most overstated area of brewing. My approach is to let the wort drop into the fermentation vessel above the surface of the liquid, thereby creating some bubbles. My beers invariably ferment out completely and in good time and taste great. As for extra virgin olive oil, I'd rather use it in a fine pasta dish than completely waste it. So many people overthink brewing.

[@stoddsify4158]

I do the same. I think the same on the overthinking. I probably otherthink in other areas, just not on aeration.

[@januszkszczotek8587]

Regarding the first experiment: dry yeast does not need aeration. So the result is not unexpected.

[@sirjenkins7442]

I don't aerate. My beer has always turned out really well.

[@TheAlchemistsBrewery]

I have a wort aeration hack. Don't do it at all. Just put in more yeast. Or a big starter.

[@grahamhawes7089]

I never skip oxygenation. I just see inconsistent fermentation performance and timing from batch-to-batch if I don’t oxygenate. I think this is especially important if you re-use or propagate yeast. Every professional brewery oxygenates and every yeast expert recommends it, if it wasn’t necessary, professional brewers would surely eliminate that extra cost and complexity from their operations.