Model Railway Prices Sparking Further Debate (No, It's NOT A "Rip Off") | Iron Horse Weekly ep90

The sound of stormy teacups rises again....
Seems you're really not allowed to have an opinion before the guard dogs set about you - even if you're polite and articulate - you'll be met with aggression, Sarcasm and other forms of Belittlement - Human nature it seems...
Rapido recently announced the pending arrival of their private owner wagons and of course, someone's opinion sparks a 40 off page argument 🤣
now since it was deleted, but there're plenty of other examples like this about ...

[@Lamp_2155]

In my opinion, price complaints is a consequence of one main thing, People wanting a £300 loco in terms of features but some of them ( and people who don’t crave detail) aren’t willing to pay £300. Once we come to expect , sprung buffers,firebox flickers,sliding doors,etc, we fuel the fire It feels like an upwards spiral.

[@IronHorseRailways]

That's right mate, you cannot expect mountains and want to pay for pebbles! It's not like there's no options out there for everyone, they're all valid and suitable too!

[@neilharbott8394]

And yet Hornby have, what I consider to be, an under-served range of products. They can offer a high detail, high spec model in their standard range, and something less detailed in their Railroad Range. The general problem I have with them is that they're offering 20 year old tooling products at the current high detail prices, and I'm sorry but if I'm paying over £200 then I expect over £200 quality item! By all means blow the dust off that 20 year old mold and offer it as part of the Railroad Range for an appropriate price - in fact I'd be happier if you maybe added a DCC socket, and just sold it as DCC ready (again to keep the cost down).

[@JagoHazzard]

I think honestly, the problem is not that model railways have become too expensive, but that for a long time they were too cheap. By which I mean, manufacturing conditions in China meant that we could get incredibly high quality models for a frankly ridiculously low price. That drove higher levels of detail - I see models that were incredible when they came out in the 2000s decried as dated. But then economic conditions changed, and we started having to pay prices more in line with the quality we were demanding.

[@IronHorseRailways]

That's a fair point of view, Mr Hazard! I have / had plenty of post 2000 models, Bachmann in particular, and they're now a very affordable option if you can find them! Giving scope for some actual modelling! Oh and, thanks for commenting - I do enjoy your videos 🙂👍

[@modelrailfan37]

I personally wish there were more budget options available. I like highly detailed locos/wagons, but I struggle to afford them and justify the cost. The only reason I sometimes buy expensive models is if it’s something I really want, and there is not a cheaper option available, which in Rapido’s case works well since they make some really unusual stuff (I have three Caledonian Vans and two LNWR vans on order from Rapido). The thing that I wish though, is that more rolling stock was built to the same price point as Oxford’s rolling stock, as there stuff is reasonably detailed, works nearly perfect, and is very affordable! I don’t dislike Rapido at all (I have a lot of pre orders in for their stuff right now), but I defenitly think their prices are a little steep. If other people don’t mind the price though, then that’s okay, and as I’ve said, I’ve made exceptions myself for some of their unusual stuff!!

[@ModelRailwaysUnlimited]

A very interesting view point and balanced position. As the person involved and with the thread being removed a bit of context is warranted. Rapido ads have been blitzing my feed for a while, normally ignored but seeing these wagons and having an interest in wagon history and development i looked deeper. Without doubt Rapido have done an excellent well researched job. However i was amazed at the rrp given we are still talking about a few ounces of plastic and two wheel sets. Not because i could not afford it but because i honestly felt it was steep, after complimenting 🎉 them on the models and research i expressed surprise at the cost. It was then that the accusations flew being told that if i didn't buy these i was not a modeller 😮 how arrogant and stupid is that. Rapido did reply fair enough. But in my opinion the whole business model just leads to higher and higher prices relying as you said on retailers taking a hit to find the right price, already in this case £5 less. At the end of the day these wagons are not made of painted wood so can't be 100% accurate as claimed by some. Short pre sold runs are good for manufacturers but not us. Makes everything a collectible. I now realise that the rapido offerings are exclusive and fine scale but i still think it should be possible to have an opinion without attracting aggressive snobbery. Cheers for the vid Craig

[@IronHorseRailways]

It's a shame Mike, but try not to let it get too under your skin

[@JohnDavies-cn3ro]

Part of the 'problem' is that if you produce 'specialist' prototypes, such as SECR or other pre-grouping stock it is likely to have a limited sales appeal anyway , resulting in higher unit costs and prices. GWR, LMS or LNER waggons turned up more or less anywhere, in large numbers - I think the LMS had more than anybody - and can thus be sold 'as cheap as chips'. Everything is going up in price though - and not everybody can support it. My own interests are now sufficiently specialised I can't expect a rtr maker to cover them - and certainly think very, very seriously about anything that does interest me, cost wise!

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Good points Mike, especially regarding the trend for short pre-ordered runs. I would love to have purchased Rapido's new banana vans, but would need to spend over £500 for a rake of 20, as it is (with other pre-orders already in the pipe-line) I can't justify that cost at the moment, so I will be sticking to the Dapol ones (even though they are not prototypical) but which I was able to collect at a fraction of the cost over a longer period of time.

[@ModelRailwaysUnlimited]

@@melchestermodelrailway cheers Chris, that Dapol ones are fine for 1959 onwards

[@lukejackson8741]

I agree with this, and had a similar response to them, I’m about 50/50 to rapido, some of the models are lovely and I’ll happily pay, but some I look at and as you say, few grams of plastic and a few quid metal wheels seems a little mad to then charge that much, I’ll stick with my oxfords and detail them up myself

[@VictoryWorks]

I think this price "debate" does bring up a legitimate secondary issue about limited runs. There is NOTHING more off-putting to someone coming to the hobby (new or after a long break) to find out that something they "need" to model their chosen time period has been out of production for years or was done in such limited runs that wrecked second hand models on eBay are selling for more than they did when brand new. On saying that in the past 3 months with careful research (I am SO happy that the Hattons directory is still available, without that I swear I would have given up the idea of coming back altogether!) and some patience I have bought 4 great condition, decent detail (post 2010) DCC fitted locos (one with sound!) and a van in my chosen era for less than £200 and a very nice DCC controller for £35. Just don't talk to me about 48xx or 64xx's 🤣

[@IronHorseRailways]

Different era?.....😁

[@ModelRailwaysUnlimited]

💯*%

[@chriswotton745]

You may want to have a word with Double O Dave over at Liberty Junction, Ladder man has a mate at the post office who may know where your parcel is...😂😂

[@user-fn1bh3qr6m]

Proper Yorkshireman 😂 he got Craig’s parcel last week right?

[@IronHorseRailways]

Yeah I know he's had it away 🤣

[@mikesmith2905]

The Rolls Royce is by far the best family car, why anyone would build a mini is a mystery. In model railways we don't need any new people entering the hobby, especially poor people and children, they just don't appreciate quality. Any MBA will tell you about Pareto's law, that 80% of the profit comes from 20% of your product range, so why not just produce that 20%. Limited edition collectables (to put up in the loft with your limited edition pet rock) can carry a premium price, so obviously that is the way to go, especially if you can harness the advertising for a big film or TV shows (Star Wars made a lot more from 'merchandising' than it did at the box office). The Peco wonderful wagons were really handy, pre-printed embossed lacquered card bodies on a simple chassis at pocket money prices were the mainstay of many people's early layouts, but that's a 'toy', so no. Peco N wagon kits have doubled in price in the last decade, and that is rather more than inflation (the kits haven't changed). Hornby 'does not make toys' (or so they say), so it's brick-a-brack then? (toys, particularly good toys, are a lot more difficult to make, that's why there are so few on the market). In the 1950s this was not just a luxury hobby, kids like me could build a simple layout and get a great deal of pleasure from it just with pocket money savings You are correct in saying the prices for modern locomotives and stock are not a rip off, for the premium market they are fine. The same can be said for Lamborghini cars or Britains limited edition collectable toy soldiers, you wouldn't (officially) admit to 'playing' with either but there are (or were) plenty of people with social insecurity issues (who want the car) or with fond memories and deep pockets to support the 'collectable' industry. However not generating those fond memories is a questionable strategy in the longer term. I have no objection to the likes of Ferrari and Rolls Royce but personally I would rather pay less for something that is 'good enough'. I remember gazing at those Basset Lowke Gauge 1 locomotives in awe (they still use them at Beconscot) but I was unlikely ever to own one. My mate had a clockwork O(ish) Gauge tinplate setup,but his dad was an enthusiast so it was run 'properly' and the overall effect was a lot more railway-like than my own small layout (very busy). The problem with model railways is that only Kato seem to be catering to the 'good enough' range, if you can interest the child in Japanese outline. The same applies to toy soldiers, a bag of cheap knights these days will inevitably be somewhat Asiatic in appearance and weaponry (you can pay a lot and buy a single European outline model but those are too expensive for a child to play with). It's a couple of decades now since I built someone a model railway to play with (we know the importance of play for child development and adult mental health, we just have no real idea why it is so important), and that was all second hand stuff (google Great Grand Fenwick and Sons for the back-story). It cost me over £300 for the track, stock and electrics (the rest I can make). For toy soldier sets I can rely on cheap Chinese knock-offs but they do not (yet) cater to the toy train market, one can only hope that they take the plunge, the kids seem to enjoy the toy soldier sets and they might enjoy having a train set.

[@russellbenton2987]

Must admit I don’t even look at Rapido wagons as I just think £33 or £27.50 discounted is just too much for a 5 plank wagon . I choose not to pay . Same applies to Bachmann wagons which are just priced too high . The research into pricing things properly is how much can I get away with charging for this . But then my expectations are lower . I run old Mainline Wrenn , quite happy with that

[@IronHorseRailways]

Nothing wrong with that at all mate, a lot to be said for older wagons, not affordable and can be upgraded as you want :)

[@davidwatts1871]

Or I have lots of old Lima wagons which you can usually get for less than a fiver, put some new couplings on along with new Dapol metal wheels and you have a nice running wagon especially if you give it a load and weathering.

[@expatliferealspain1175]

This is why I have to pick up S/H bits and bobs nonrunners ect , I am a carer for my other half and have very little spare cash so do not even look at these type of rolling stock

[@IronHorseRailways]

Sensible option, a great way to do things!

[@Jaherick]

I think the hobby is turning into more of a collectors hobby than modelling. How many people in this hobby build locos or rolling stock from scratch or kits? I would say the majority ( me included ) build the track and scenery then run the models as is from the box. Is it worth buying an expensive piece of rolling stock and weathering it? Some will and I have no problem with that, but a lot may not want to ruin an expensive model. It also goes back to a something I said in the past that all the new stuff manufacturers put out now is limited edition, where’s the long running stock you can save up for and buy in 6 months time? The items produced now will be just as expensive on the second hand market due to rarity. Have fun with the layout changes, I’m on my 16th rebuild since 2020 and still haven’t completed it. The board has more holes than wood now.

[@IronHorseRailways]

Ah yes the infamous "swiss cheese" baseboard method 😁

[@ModelRailwaysUnlimited]

Absolutely 💯 agree

[@gregmacdonald927]

Love the shelf storage for your flat caps! Looking good. Splash out on an office style chair for your weathering station. Your back will thank you😊

[@IronHorseRailways]

I had one - the Mrs stole it 🤣🤣

[@WISDOMDUCK69]

I would have to highly recommend oxford raills 5 and 7 plank trucks for £10

[@IronHorseRailways]

Great price point if you're on a budget!❤️

[@WISDOMDUCK69]

In fact I am on a budget I still haven't build my model railway

[@macnavi]

Weirdly enough, I enjoy this channel. 😎

[@IronHorseRailways]

Cheers Mac

[@sophiaevans9908]

Don't like the price of an item? Don't pay it! Most retailers put a bit of a discount on new stock anyway, so it's usually not too bad. Plus a lot of the Rapido wagons fit in with the location and era of my layout and look very good

[@lifestyleunleashed8046]

I agree with you. At the end of the day if you want the detail (and I do) buy Rapido. If you don't, buy a cheaper model. I don't see the point in turning it into a point of principle. It's ridiculous. The expensive models of the today are the bargains of tomorrow. There are lots of cheap things around. Just don't buy the expensive ones if it bothers you. What's the problem?

[@davidwynne3170]

Hi Craig, l enjoy your channel and discussion. Great stuff! I think that there are options and discounts available. For example, some of Hornby’s recent hopper wagons have been discounted to as little as £45 for a pack of 3 wagons by some retailers. I decided to get 2 packs in loadhaul livery to match a loadhaul loco and I’m happy with result. But somebody else may prefer to use the same money towards just 2 or 3 wagons from Rapido or Accurascale because their wagons are finer models. In the end, it’s personal preference. I appreciate both approaches, either having a few excellent models, or a big box of discounted models. It’s personal choice in the end.

[@Michaelgoestofrance]

As a predominantly Continental modeller, I can only look on with jealousy at the prices charged for UK outline. Fair enough, a lot of Continental stuff is made in Europe, not China (for the most part, anyway) but some of the prices would make UK modellers cry!

[@IronHorseRailways]

I've seen the roco stuff 😁

[@Michaelgoestofrance]

@@IronHorseRailways And Roco's now the cheaper end of the market! Try looking at Ree Modèles or LS Models and you'll fall out of your chair lol!

[@petercole2092]

You can charge much as you want but if people don't have the money it really doesn't matter how good or bad a product is. Rapidio items might be good but it was very telling when they started to do ' Mystery Boxes' of items that clearly were not selling as desired. Retailers are having huge sales to shift stock that is collecting dust it's down to price. We are living though unstable economic times money for hobbies is very limited people are getting run rid of their collections the retailers who buy them are getting overwhelmed it's not looking good.

[@DJ_K666]

While I think there's a world of difference between 'A Bit On The High Side' and 'An Absolute Rip Off' if you look at the difference on the detail which tbf uis on all Rapido models then it's no more expensive than their others. Thd coarse scale models are brilliant as 'trial' wagons for things. I've got a few hanging around with various paint schemes applied. At least one awaiting transfers and a couple with experimentally fitted finer wheels so yeah. They do a good job. Remember those Hachette mk1s that got sold for £5each with that partwork a while back? Got 3 of them and they're my 'experimental' rake, ie if anything detail wise I'm not sure about doing needs doing, it's done on them first. Got them nicely close coupled too. So yes if you want close up detailed wagons then Rapido are great, they've just added what a modeller might add anyway. If you're looking to have a 'scenic' train whizzing round in the background where you won't see the detail, then those cheaper 'coarse' wagons work very well. Mind you Oxford have done some good ones for not too bad a price so maybe they're setting a new standard for mid price range wagons there. Let's getvthings in perspective. Look at prices of things across Europe or in the USA. We're not really being ripped off. I'll keep doing my kits too.

[@danielholden-storey5107]

At the end of the day it's your money and you do what you want with it. Personally I don't have that kind of cash for high-spec models so my choice is for a reasonably priced loco/wagon/coach either new or second-hand. That's the way it is so let people do what they want and while people like Sam's Trains do point our where models are re-issued at a higher price and no real improvement in quality well we've been told and it's up to us what we do. Fed up with all this - it's a hobby, something for us to enjoy and help us relax. Let people be!

[@michaelpiggott7840]

To me it comes back to gatekeeping. I have always been coarse scale but the mouthpieces always sung the praises of the more expensive models and the manufacturers listened. As a n gauge modeller this leaves me either no models or paying more, and the quality isn't there. I still have lima models that run where as Graham farish models purchased later failed with the dread split gears. The problem is if you don't buy the models or partake in the groups controlled by the mouthpieces you have no voice manufacturers talk to those who buy the models not those who don't. How many more modellers would we have if there where cheap models out there to buy?

[@IronHorseRailways]

I'm not entirely sure to be fair, but I know for a fact, I'm not one's mout piece! Apart from my own 🤣

[@robelvery]

Totally agree. Yes it can be an expensive hobby but there are some good deals out there too. Yes we'd all like cheaper models but the more we demand all singing all dancing highly detailed models it ain't gonna happen. Manufacturers don't set out to 'rip people off'. They are businesses not charities and they are out to make a profit. There's a certain popular KZbinr who's constantly banging on about prices of models and frequently uses the term 'rip off'. At the end of the day no one is forcing anyone to buy models. If you don't like the model or don't want to pay the price then don't buy them. As you say if the models don't sell then prices will drop. There are plenty of second hand wagons out there which you can pick up for just a few quid. If they are weathered they can look great.

[@Tigercatflyboy]

I totally agree with you, if you want the latest highly detailed model then its gonna cost you, manufacturers have to make a profit, if they don't then we will eventually lose our supply of these beautiful creations when they decide there is no point in carrying on. Thank god for Hornby for their Railroad Range at least they are trying to address this price problem, it helps My 8 year old grandson who loves his football, video games and his model railway buy his locos etc, he does not care if it has not got sprung buffers, firebox glow, screw link couplings, a crawl slower than a snails pace, all he wants is a nice looking loco to run on his track. I know what you mean about the reviewer who is constantly banging on about "ITS A RIPOFF" you cannot compare prices to 5, 10 or 15 years ago, things have changed, when doing a review keep it real and not always keep complaining about the price, get up off the carpet! Keep expanding your Railroad range Hornby, at least you are doing something to help.

[@robelvery]

@Tigercatflyboy Can't see the point of sprung buffers at all. Unless you have a layout with prototypically gentle curves, and you can run close coupled trains.

[@Tigercatflyboy]

@@robelvery Sprung buffers don't come very high on my list of must have's on any new loco I buy either, but from what some reviewers say it seems in this day and age they are to be expected on every loco, if not the price will be a "Rip Off".

[@nigelcole1936]

I completely agree with your opinion, well said. Ultimately even if I didn't agree I respect your right to express your views. Keep putting it out there... as the actress said to the Bishop.

[@IronHorseRailways]

That's the thing isn't it? The basics right to respect just isn't adhered to a lot of the time :(

[@neilharbott8394]

I believe it was one of the other commentators who gave us an insight on how Rapido does business - that preorder window is important to them, and to anybody who wants to buy one of their products. They use that preorder to determine how many of a model to make, it's one way they keep their costs down - those preorders are either going to a customer or to a retail outlet who thinks they can sell that quantity, but there's almost nothing left over for anyone who wants to make a spur of the moment purchase. I think Accurascale works by similar process too. This is also a reason why a retailer is likely to only offer a small discount on these products, with maybe a deeper discount to clear the shelves of anything left over - but if us hobbyists wait too long we may miss out. The likes of Hornby and Bachmann don't do this, and thus the discounts offered may be deeper, because everything is bought on spec with no guarantee of a sale. This all said, I appreciate the price of Rapido and Accurascale locomotives, they're well placed against the more established manufacturers, but they put the effort in to make their models with some superb detail. The also cascade that detail down to their passenger and freight rolling stock, the additional features of their coaches just blows away the detail of my most recent Hornby purchase and for a similar price. When it comes to freight, I do recall my youth, when going out and buying a wagon for a fiver was in pocket money range, and we still have that from the likes of Dapol and Peco, and if you want something more detailed Rapido and Accura will fill that niche. But it really all boils down to what you want, detail or basic, and how much you're willing to spend, it's all personal choice - as you say, it's a luxury that at the end of the day we don't need to survive.

[@IronHorseRailways]

There's room for both but sadly a lot of folks don't seem to get that and get quite angry and defensive when the opposite is suggested :(

[@rogerevans425]

I think you're correct. Also happened with Sonic. I have long wanted a GCR 9N and was pleased when Sonic announced it, but was not in a position to order one until now - when they are no longer available, and Sonic have no plans for a re-run. Tough, but that's life.. I also agree about the cost of re-issues of old tooling locos. We need to atract young blood into the hobby, and re-issues at lower prices would be the way to do it. I have a lot of experience with children's sport and it is amazing how little a parent is prepared to spend on a child's sport compared to their own activities (e.g. Adult prepared to spend several hundred pounds per year on a golf membership, plus green fees, but complains when childs sport rises by 50pr. If that's the case with sport I should imagine it is the same with hobbies like model raIways.

[@martinshipman3260]

If something doesn’t seem worth the money, don’t buy it. There are plenty of new and used cheaper items out there.

[@malcolmmoore5260]

It's like complaining that a Ferrari is expensive. If you can afford one and it's what you want, fine. Most of us go for the best we can afford, the same should be true for our hobby.

[@IronHorseRailways]

Yup, said it before!

[@chrisvaughan159]

Yes, the market has undergone a reset in pricing, but I don't understand how you can say we are not being ripped off when Bachmann present for sale their old unaltered B1 for an RRP c. £200.00. Clearly if a collector or modeller wants to pay for a Rapido superfine model, that's their business the value for money is relative to personal POV. I love the detail, but can't afford to pursue it, and anyway, how much of it can I see when it's running. But the established large manufacturers offering previously released or old stock models at premium prices just takes my breath away. Accurascale has rightly been highlighted as a manufacturer of quality locomotives at reasonable prices. Dapol too are up there in the value for money stakes. But when it comes to rolling stock, I think the levels of detail average modellers are being asked to pay premium prices for are questionable, for me at least. I'm afraid all the while these practices are adopted the discussion will return to haunt you. We used to "Superdetail" models ourselves, now there's a choice as to, whether we continue to do so; accept that if you can't see the detail it's not worth having; pay for the privilege of having it applied for us. But all the while established manufacturers attempt to maximise profits in order to head-off the effects on them of the current economic storm I think we will be "ripped off", and they risk losing their customer base.🙂🙂🙂🙂🙂 5 for you.

[@IronHorseRailways]

I do enjoy a detailing session when the mood strikes 😁😁

[@ModelRailwaysUnlimited]

💯%

[@clivengauge]

Great video if anyone what's to buy a top model good luck to them if i want a wagon like that i save up for it no worries

[@jongmans38]

Do not see the point of cutting up a layout because someone else says it would be better, please yourself and make it how you want it

[@IronHorseRailways]

If you re watch the last video mate, you'll see I asked if I should do it because I was already half way considering it - I like to know what you guys think :) as it happens, much happier with the cut down version!😁😁

[@jongmans38]

What if they said, don't cut it up?

[@IronHorseRailways]

@@jongmans38 a few did, a few had other suggestions, I considered all of them and went with the option I felt was best 😀

[@jongmans38]

You are your own man!@@IronHorseRailways

[@IronHorseRailways]

@@jongmans38 yes I am

[@jimkemp3142]

Rule No 1 Applies ! It's my layout and I'll run what I want... etc. There are so many items out there on the second-hand market at prices from £1, that you can find everything you need. That is different from what you might WANT, but if there is someting that you REALLY WANT then simply save up for it... There is too much expectation for instant gratification. Support your local model railway club and their second-hand stalls - that supports the hobby. There are so many options that you don't need to pay for the most detailed items - Second-hand, kits, etc. pick up the cheap stuff and detail/repaint etc. it yourself - that is what the 'modelling' part of railway modelling is all about.☺

[@IronHorseRailways]

Did that recently with an old class 20 - brilliant model and perfectly acceptable!❤️

[@johnspencer2914]

There is a saying "Better is the enemy of the good enough" but when it comes to model railways it seems that "better is best for me". Rapido made it pretty clear that they are filling in the "High" end of the model railway mix with only Hornby and Dapol offering the "Low" end. I call it Hi-Lo Some valid points in the comments below whereby if you miss it then it will become hard and expensive to find the items. Rapido have 70 RCH wagons in the first run, I am aware of 60 of them and cannot find the last 10. I always go for South East, so there are 10 wagons there from this run (6 are SECR, 2 are from other regions that I know appeared there and 2 POs). There might be others..... Yes they are pricy, but I've about 150 Pre-grouping pieces of rolling stock, 90% from the south east. A proportion of these are Dapol Bachmann wagons, and I recently converted about 20 older wagons to smaller couplings (they already had metal wheels) as this is a lot cheaper than replacing with Rapido ones (they don't do the exact same liveries anyway). You get about 2 Dapol wagons for 1 Rapido one and my old late 1990s Bachmann Coal trader sets were 3 wagons for about the same as 1 Rapido one.... This allows a decent sized mineral train where detail does not matter. So you can do a Hi-Lo mix giving a balance between detailed items that are more expensive and cheaper items lacking details. If I run the plank layout, the Hi end are the choice. If the big layout, both appear.

[@IronHorseRailways]

Well put Mr S. - Its a practice I myself follow - a good healthy mix of reasonable wagons and a few "specials" to bulk out and add variety for the shunting 😁 Cheers!👍

[@briancooper562]

Just for reference. Early Hornby ex-Triang purchased 1970, pre 1973.prices converted from shillings and pence. R11 £0.47 van, Sliding doors R112 £0.50 open truck, opening centre doors R113 £0.39 open truck low sides, drop sides R114 £0.47 van, sliding doors R676 £0.33 Bolster flat These are the prices attached to the red boxes. Not the highest quality but with the feature great play value.

[@ausfoodgarden]

Yes, but 47p in 1970 is equal to around 10quid today. So similar to the oxford rail wagons cost. If the Rapido wagons are anywhere near the detail level of their dyno car, they'd be well worth it for folks who can afford it. I'm more of a budget buyer and am happy to go with something a bit cheaper and less detailed. The thing that irks me is manufacturers rereleasing old tat models as "NEW" with a high price to go with it.

[@damianinCanadaTT-OO]

All good points but I hope you think it’s fair for reviewers to compare value for money across manufacturers and say company x’s model is better than company y. The reality is some are doing high quality at a better price point than others

[@IronHorseRailways]

To a point yes, I would agree, as far as the extent that value is often a personal perception - it's all very complex - now in terms of features and details on a model for a price point then, yes - but one must factor reliability into this too!

[@damianinCanadaTT-OO]

@@IronHorseRailways so to be more specific I’ve seen Accurascale held up as high quality at a lower price point compared to Hornby and Bachmann. Disagree?

[@stephendavies6949]

Mike, like yourself, is a reasonble and sensible commentator. I applaud your support of others to voice opinions contrary to your own, provided it is done with respect and consideration. AND your condemnation of those who do not. Nuff respect, sir. We must remember that critical thinking is a key element to human development. As you say, the Rapido wagons are expensive, and my view is, "They're a little steep for me, so I'll give them a miss & buy some cheaper Dapol items." No need to be rude or abusive. Having said that, I was very happy to pay £110 for a Rapido 16" Hunslet. As you say, it's an individual choice we have to make. However, I also appreciate people such as Sam (Sam's Trains) who provides forensic model reveiws, which help me decide on where to spend my hard-earned cash. His last one on the "new" Bachmann B1 is a case in point.

[@IronHorseRailways]

Cheers Stephen 🤠🤠

[@mccarronfamily]

You talk a lot of sense Sir!

[@IronHorseRailways]

Wouldn't go that far Steve, but thanks anyway 🤣❤️

[@platformten5958]

Hi Craig. Watched. Paul. ❤️👍

[@IronHorseRailways]

Hope youre well mate ❤️

[@platformten5958]

@@IronHorseRailways So do I mate! 😂👍

[@simontrainsmodelrailway]

I hate it when people use the 😂 emoji for something completely stupid on social media, it one of those that the book of face invented and people abuse it! Great video

[@IronHorseRailways]

It grips my shaft mate 🤣

[@l1a146]

Oh geeze. Are we back here again. Theres a range in the hobby that will suit all budgets. That goes for every hobby/ interest. Theres budget versions, second hand or the top tier stuff. For those who can afford it. People who like cars for instance ... Yes we would all like an Aston Martin or similiar, but maybe we just buy the Fiesta and put our own spin on it. Model Railways arent any different. No good whinging you cant afford a top tier model, buy what you can afford and enjoy it. When you can no longer afford power, food and accomodation thats an issue. Sick of hearing about it tbh.

[@IronHorseRailways]

I know how you feel, it gets grating after a while hearing about it constantly!

[@user-zu5vi6xs4t]

Still running good old fall off the rails Tri ang £3 for a wagon still 😂 don't worry about a few scratches as that's real life and the paint jobs are crap on purpose 😌 and who will miss a buffer here and there real life wagons for 3 quid 😮

[@thomascampbell7648]

Its human nature so you won't change that as regards price the person who goes on about price is Sams trains there is not one product he will not go on about it.

[@IronHorseRailways]

Human nature is the core reason isn't it? Cheers!

[@bentullett6068]

Agreed. I actually stopped watching his channel due to the pattern of complaining over the cost of locomotives and miniscule glue marks or missing paint. Obviously, he hasn't been up close to a real preserved train, as the paint jobs aren't aways 100% neat and tidy.

[@wolvertoncentresidings5676]

Some of the keyboard rants are obviously by people who really really want a model because it's the perfect fit for their railway but they really can't afford it, so, they get upset and go online to vent. It's human nature. Doesn't make it right though!!!

[@IronHorseRailways]

I enjoy a good vent and rant, but in my own little corner 🤣

[@mikeray3993]

late sixties to mid 70s. Then you can get some Hymeks, I like Hymeks

[@IronHorseRailways]

Westies 😎😎👍😁

[@hamshackleton]

"We tried to deliver - - " I often get that, but as I'm retired, I'm ALWAYS at home, except Sundays, and as nobody except Amazon deliver on Sundays - - - ! I saw that the GPO are considering 'every second day' delivery for 2nd class. I wish! I might get ONE a WEEK! and it's never the same time or day, nor the same postie! - - - -Now, I've been billed for it, so when will the latest Jenny (Billy's) wagon turn up? - - - - Totally different and irrelevent subject - that black teeshirt you were wearing for most of the vid did you no favours, it showed up all the sawdust and stray hairs! 🙂

[@IronHorseRailways]

I am a hairy sawdust encrusted yob, mate - I do not pretend otherwise 🤣🤣🤣

[@hamshackleton]

@@IronHorseRailways Be thankful you've not seen ME in my scruffs! 🤑

[@ModelRailwaysUnlimited]

@@IronHorseRailways 😂

[@ianstransporthistorystuff8175]

Looking good and like the idea of having a few different layouts that you can store and then use when i want.

[@IronHorseRailways]

Yeah it's the only option I have really, I like to make different scenes for different reasons so, this way my ever changing mind is happy 😁

[@HighFell]

Some great points as always. We absolutely are not being ripped off over prices in the hobby. None of these manufacturers are making obscene profits; they put the work in and workers deserve to be paid for the work they do, like all of us. It really is that simple. We also have a choice how we spend our money, not how others spend theirs. Perhaps those that think they can do better should show us how it’s done or pipe down 😁

[@IronHorseRailways]

Oh no you any expect people to put their money where their mouth is can you?🤣

[@came-fv8zw]

cool dbz poster

[@IronHorseRailways]

Damn right 😎

[@Steve_RobbieRaygun]

Sorry I completely disagree, not regarding the wagon, but other things, how can the average working family man, who would really like the latest engine, but just can't afford it due to his family commitments (obviously family comes first, every time) This type of person is completely out-priced of the market. Again, someone on a basic wage would love to have a model railway, but the prices like Hornby for example are just ridiculous for the average man in the street. Yes, Hornby can price it any way they want, but as I have already said, it's just out-pricing someone who would love to get into the hobby, without it being classed as a luxury hobby.

[@IronHorseRailways]

What makes you automatically entitled to be able to afford anything from any manufacturer? It's the same with anything else in life, your car, where you shop for food, the clothes you wear etc - there's options out there for every price bracket mate, same for model railways!

[@l1a146]

You can still Buy older models and enjoy those. You dont have to be priced out of the hobby. You may be just priced out of particular items.

[@LiveSteamNick]

I suggest waiting till you nab some cheap bargains from various vendors. There’s pricing to suit everyone!

[@IronHorseRailways]

@@LiveSteamNick says "Moneybags" Nick 😂😂

[@lukejackson8741]

Was it yourself that did a video on ‘gimmicks’ in the hobby? I sort of think some of the rapido models hit this, it’s an open wagon, it looks great but does it need all the little bits of extra detail for a wagon that’s going to be part of a 10/20 model train? I’ll happily pay ‘silly’ money for a super detailed model (dynamometer coach for example) but do I/the industry need a £32 wagon? Probably not, while it may be worth every penny, some others, the usual suspects, will look at this and oh £32 is now the standard price for a wagon, we should make ours £32… and they know people will buy them because they are the name they know,.. it’s never as bad as the internet makes it, but the eyebrows did raise when I saw £32 for an open wagon,.. I just scrolled past it, if it sells out then fair enough, if not I’ll pick it up when/if it drops to a more ‘reasonable’ price

[@IronHorseRailways]

One of them already has sold out mate 😁 They're a lovely wagon, they don't have the pointless sprung buffers either! No gimmicks on this wagon, just a good quality bit of kit 😁 I would suggest that this sort of wagon would do well on smaller layouts like mine where they can Be appreciated more!

[@lukejackson8741]

⁠yeah, I imagine I’m not the target audience tbh, they do look great, if some do pop up, in a future run one day, with more of a connection to my local area I may be persuaded… it doesn’t often take much after all

[@anthonyallen1847]

if a model is deemed too expensive then dont buy it vote with your wallet its simples no need to comment on manufactures websites etc

[@davidmathie9512]

If you can't afford it either save up or stop complaining . Bet they sell thousands . Really tired of the constant negativity and people putting down the hobby .If you have a problem take up another past time . Its really not that important .

[@IronHorseRailways]

Well said David

[@davidcook380]

Iron Horse , Sorry but for detail Bachmann are one of the best but as far their mechanisms in steam locos they are so poor , And they re-release old locos with the same crap running gear as the old ones but at a hugely over inflictive price and they still run poor , however their diesels are the best , so ABSOLUTELY yes Bachmann steam locos are a ripoff.

[@jameshardy4354]

I've had quite a few bachmann motors go I mean both hornby and bachmann make garbage cheap garbage motors

[@bentullett6068]

What these people seem to always forget are the facts that wages in China have increased, material cost has increased and shipping costs have increased. These clever people who think everything should be made cheap should research these things prior to complaining. Also watching a certain channel which has a model railway on a carpet doesn't always help as there is that pricing complaining in some of his video's.

[@lukejackson8741]

I sort of agree, though there’s so much detail on these wagons that’s just not necessary, China is getting expensive maybe time to have a look at making stuff back here, Oxford and dapol have started doing just that,

[@LocomotionMotion]

Ooooooh, you used the words "Model Railways Unlimited" - that's a copyrighted name and the owner will slap you with a copyright take down - trust me, he don't let you get away with nuffink 😜

[@IronHorseRailways]

He's alright is Mike 😎

[@davidwatts1871]

Great video as usual, just looking at your shelving storage. be very mindful of the weight bearing capacity of the fixings (screws/bolts/rawlplugs etc). I used the same type of shelving for ages and then one day the addition of one book caused everything to collapse, not just one shelf since they are all connected by the uprights. You need to jump fast when gravity says 'that is too much'. I much prefer free standing stuff now, metal or plastic, it depends on what they are holding, and they are easier to move around when you have the inclination.

[@IronHorseRailways]

Tbh these really aren't that heavy mate but I see your reasoning for concern!😀

[@PeachyTT120]

I think kudos to you for engaging with your audience. Space for actual modelmaking is an excellent idea. As for people making less than positive comments, I do wonder if sometimes it’s more a case of it being less easy to communicate their thoughts via a few words than actual hate/anger. I’ve met a couple of keyboard warriors at shows now and of course face to face they’re perfectly capable of a reasonable conversation. But then it might be just as simple as a lack of education showing up in their sentence construction 🫣

[@IronHorseRailways]

Sentence structure shouldn't get in the way of making a total arse of oneself 🤣

[@bentullett6068]

There are, however, some I have spoken to at shows that will complain about everything including down to the scale you run. We even have it with preserved railways as some gatekeepers always boast that their railway is better than everyone else's, which then can turn people away from volunteering at the railway they want to volunteer at.