Is Genghis Khan Harder Than Jocko Willink? - Dan Jones | Modern Wisdom Podcast 380

[@ChrisWillx]

Yes team. Here’s the timestamps: 00:00 Intro 04:38 Dan’s Powers & Thrones Book 11:25 Why Rome Was Destroyed 19:26 Hard People Throughout Time 32:57 Medieval Archetypes 40:15 Pandemics in the Middle-Ages 47:45 Innovation in Medieval Times 1:04:25 Making History More Accessible

[@sliceyy]

Cheers ears!

[@chumpyland]

"Why did Genghis Khan put together the greatest land empire in the middle ages, because he was hard..." worth a listen just for that moment! Actually had fun listing to this!

[@ChrisWillx]

10/10 history banter.

[@phillipward937]

@@ChrisWillx The Great Wall of China wasn't built to stop a major invasion. It was to deal with roving bands of marauders so people would settle in the northern frontier. The Chinese Signal Corps could send a signal with flags from one end of the Great Wall to the other in 20 minutes, a distance it would take a month to travel. The Signal Corps alerted the Chinese high command as soon as the Mongol army was spotted, they knew the troop count within 50 men, they knew their supplies and the weapons they carried. The Chinese Generals had devolved from warriors into politicians and couldn't see spending the money to overwhelm the Mongols, so they sent the smallest force they thought they could get away with. The Mongol horse archers routed the Chinese defenders, when word got back to the Imperial Command they rallied the rest of the army, however the tales of Mongol savagery had totally destroyed Chinese morale and before the Mongols got to the battlefield over half of the remaining Chinese army had deserted. The moral of the story is, keep a close watch on experts, most of them are liars who are promoted up the ladder because they pose no threat to their superiors. Naturally they are handy after wars to backstab the heros in order to return the glory to the Emperor and his Imperial Command.

[@Mark27472]

@@ChrisWillx Awesome history banner!

[@nashvegasmgt]

Dan is my favorite historian. Love how he educates with wit, sarcasm, always keeps it interesting, and he dgaf about anything, lol. Great episode 👍

[@Dimera09]

David Starkey certainly fits that description too 😂

[@aydanjesson9748]

I recently watched Britain's Bloodiest Dynasty and Britain's Bloody Crown with Dan Jones and immensely enjoyed them! The middle ages were all I could think about!!

[@MeanBeanComedy]

It was so much fun. 😁👍🏻

[@orenalbertmeisel3127]

Lessons from the Middle Ages? This is going to be a legendary episode

[@ChrisWillx]

Enjoy 🤌

[@juliecollins4855]

Brilliant! I thoroughly enjoyed this interview and laughed out loud a couple of times. Bringing history alive Dan 🤩

[@Furniture121]

I this was one of the most entertaining podcasts I've heard in quite a while!

[@MrRileysc11]

Love Dan Jones. Excellent historian IMO. Great interview Chris! Appreciate your content.

[@ChrisWillx]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@edwardtomkinson3418]

You’re the history teacher we never got at school!

[@lassyduckie8830]

This is my second time listening to this podcast. Really great!

[@Baboonfromdatoon]

The 'wizard' archetype is derived from that of the druid; a religious leader of Celtic society, and other figures whom were analogous in practicing other forms of Indo-European paganism (i.e Norse, Slavic, Baltic etc). The Anglo-Saxons had a knowledge and understanding of what we know as 'magic', so yes, a wizard/magician would have existed in pre-Christian Dark Age (early Medieval) society. Merlin, a Celtic wizard who features in the European literary tradition (Arthurian legend) was inspired by the 6th century Myrddin Wyllt. Bear in mind that Tolkein was a professor of Anglo-Saxon and his understanding of their religion informed his development of characters such as the wizards Gandalf and Saruman. But hey, I'm not a published historian so I could be completely wrong...

[@ChrisWillx]

Great insight Benjamin. Can you now fix Dan's fancy dress bigotry so I can go as my preferred character to his party please.

[@phillipward937]

The Celts came after the Druids. They arrived in the British Isles around 560 BCE, the Druids supposedly built Stonehenge around 2500 BCE. There were probably Druids scattered around the area when the Celts came across from Brittany and Spain. When the Romans left Britannica the Scoti hadn't crossed over from Northern Ireland. My mother is in the McLarty book traced all the way back to Larty one of the first clan chieftains to settle the Inner Hebrides. When my second grade teacher told me that the Scotts weren't actually from Scotland, I asked, "how does that work". I must have fallen asleep while she told the class the history of the Keltic migration. I woke up just in time to hear that the Tartan jacket and Beret passed down from my grandfather was the one Charles Edward Stuart wrapped his son in when he sent him to live with James Francis Stuart in Italy. My mother gave my family artifacts to two men who said they were collecting rags. No big deal, they were only priceless.

[@Baboonfromdatoon]

@@phillipward937 True. Nobody knows who they were...or what they doing. But their legacy remains ...hewn into the living rock...of Stonehenge

[@lmop3663]

28:25 Gotta love that pause for thought.

[@brianbarrett6316]

Stoner in the US here. Love Dan Jones 😂

[@colleenfox]

Love the variety of your channel Chris. Your humor and humility make the listener comfortable and your insights and guests are all so engaging. Keep it up!

[@louimcquire2393]

You look so young. I have just discovered Dan Jones. What a find.

[@Mark27472]

Just discovered this episode. Love Dan's books. This is so enjoyable. My nomination for "hardest man of the Middle ages": Henry V. Just ask about the arrow wound when he was 16.

[@DavidSmith-qc9hm]

Brilliant interview. Factual, interesting and very funny.

[@ChrisWillx]

Gracias David

[@leebrown1049]

I think you so interview Mary Beard, I really love her historic programmes, she is such a character

[@melissacoulter708]

It takes a genius to come up with the Stirrup comment. That was amazing. I’d never think of that.

[@RMFilmStudios]

Great to see some history on the channel bro! 👊🏼

[@squoblat]

I've visited a lot of castles in the UK thanks to Dan, between him and Kevin Kevin McCloud, my ability to be satisfied living in a regular semi detached with a small garden is pretty much annihilated. If he runs out of show ideas, I'd pay a lot of money to see him fight Tony Robinson.

[@5dollarshake263]

This was a fun chit chat. I like how it was chill.

[@OkTxSheepLady]

I would love to hear Dan Jones discus the spread of the spinning wheel and the influence of cloth on civilization.

[@NathanCline12-21]

As a stoned watcher of Dan's and many others podcasts

[@mayliam5049]

So because they're having fun and being witty while educating us for free people are mad in the comment... 🤨

[@jabbrewoki]

@9:45 Very 'Blackadder' moment. You brits and your cheeky humor.

[@ChrisWillx]

Getting real Blackadder vibes from this one. Agreed.

[@PerennialDew]

Literally watched great British castles while dying of a hangover last month 😂😂

[@ChrisWillx]

Legit show. I’m tellin u. Season 6 needs to happen.

[@PerennialDew]

@@ChrisWillx totally agree. Went to visit a castle based on the show recently. He’s great. Not a fan of the heckler from his recent British Library appearance, imagine being such a dick that you shout at someone who talks about castles. Like the desperation to politicise everyone and everything is exhausting

[@iraplikeyoubreathe]

This was great, thanks! #Hard

[@charlieweaver6322]

6:00 The Mary Renault book Dan mentions is called 'The King Must Die', not 'The King is Dead' as Dan said. Not that I've read it, but I did waste time searching for the wrong title.

[@Dimera09]

Great chat, destructive banter

[@joedavis4150]

... one of the best channels on KZbin is the ditchwalker arrowhead hunting videos.... It goes back nine thousand years.

[@ChrisWillx]

Dan would still probably ban arrowhead hunters from attending his fancy dress party.

[@joedavis4150]

@@ChrisWillx ...... but the ditchwalker is in northern Mississippi. Would that make a difference?

[@nicholaschristodoulou3821]

@@ChrisWillx 😂😂👌🏻

[@charlieweaver6322]

Chris, any chance of covering the recent Newcastle United FC takeover by the Saudis? Would be an interesting episode?

[@journeyhero8870]

I really enjoyed this podcast @Chris Williamson. What I learned, that I didn't know, is that a Peleton Treadmill is probably, in fact, harder than Attila the Hun, Genghis Khan, Joko Willink and maybe even Danny Trejo (although the jury is still out on Danny). I also learned very practical skills like: watching "Great British Castles" is better when your f'ed-up on your favourite dope, @Dan Jones' "Power and Thrones" is book-ended (no pun intended, I guess) by Rome getting f'ed twice and you would attend Dan's fictional costume party dress as a wench! Nice going! Well worth 1:11:38 of my valuable time -- which so happens to equate to exactly three vodka martinis! I've now subscribed to your podcast because of my admiration for @Dan Jones. I hope that is what you both intended.

[@ChrisWillx]

Welcome to the team, fellow wizard.

[@phillipward937]

Great British Castles ain't got shit on Bob Ross when it comes to Stoner Viewing. Bob Ross was the bee's knees

[@ritaadams9240]

I love watching all his shows stoned & not

[@Loscrik]

Middle age chroniclers and modern day "journalists" are synonymous. The art has not changed lol.

[@jamieelkes5210]

im stoned...also I love castles

[@jusjord2414]

Who would win in a fight between Ghengis Khan and William Marshall?

[@tnekkc]

What we have in common with homo sapiens, is our metabolism is built for a meat diet. OR eat carbs and get every chronic disease.

[@ObelixCMM]

Goggins was a Navy SEAL not Marine, starting running Chris 😁😁

[@ChrisWillx]

STAY HARD.

[@noGPSdata]

This one has a strange energy lol

[@ChrisWillx]

I loved it. One of my favourites this year 🤌

[@noGPSdata]

@@ChrisWillx yes, it was a great interview but being from the U.S. I felt blunted by the back and forth, like two brothers ribbing one another.

[@ritaadams9240]

40 really❤

[@h____hchump8941]

The Welsh will be happy to learn the tallest building in the UK is now the restaurant on top of Mount Snowdon

[@ChrisWillx]

MANSCAPING.

[@theideallinewithsahan]

And so was JS Bach

[@joedavis4150]

... Who cares about the Middle Ages? I want to hear about the Hipster Revival!

[@ChrisWillx]

Give the stoners what they want Dan!

[@joedavis4150]

@@ChrisWillx ...... that would be Stellar reefer, right?

[@jesperburns]

Btw, I feel that your current title isn't a really great one. I didn't recognise Dan (or his name - though I should've) and I thought this was just some banter with one of your mates, instead of with an actual historian. Incidentally, this has always been my gripe with Joe Rogan; you can't tell from his titles what his guests are about.

[@munkiking4511]

I like the title and knew who everyone mentioned was on first reading!

[@THINKincessantly]

🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿Dam Jones is the producer that turned QUEEN ANNE BOLEYN into an african...Great Englishman ay❓❓

[@robertmacdonaldch5105]

He really didnt address why Rome beyond a generic Rome was an empire, all empires fall. The 2 factors he cites come post peak Rome. 2 factors really did Rome in, they forgot what got then there, so the core of the Empire was decadent, lazy and dependent on outer provinces. And Rome became ever less Roman, particularly the army. So it became unreliable, allowing for the Goths to start piling up victories

[@phillipward937]

When the empire split the eastern empire pretty much cut off the commerce to the Western Empire. Rome had to buy everything that came from the east through Byzantium. Rome went into decline while Byzantium thrived (until corruption eventually led to its fall at the hands of the Ottomans.

[@robertmacdonaldch5105]

@@phillipward937 sounds familiar doesn't it

[@phillipward937]

@@robertmacdonaldch5105 Borrowing a quote from Yogi Barra, it's like deja vu all over again.

[@mmf356]

What about the Spanish Empire? Russia?

[@phillipward937]

Apparently they've never heard of the Barbary Pirates. Thomas Jefferson sent Commodore Sinclair to the Mediterranean to deal with them. Commodore Sinclair would allow a few pirates to escape, then he would follow them home, and destroy their village. That's where the Shores of Tripoli part of the United States Marine Corps Hymn, and the term "Devil Dogs" come from.

[@genghiskhan5020]

I hope the title of this video is a joke!

[@ChrisWillx]

😂😂😂

[@Fohrenbach]

Got me to click so it was a success on that front

[@munkiking4511]

Cant fault you there Genghis! You da man!

[@kjmsification]

Well, well, well Dan, what do we have here.... Do you have a ghost that you let just run loose doing whatever the Fu*k it feels like? 🤭

[@The_Original_Default_Username]

Is a meritocratic, world-dominating warrior-king harder than a Navy motard? That's not really an apples-to-apples comparison.

[@AutoSanchezMusic]

I'm pretty sure Jocko is meritocratic.

[@The_Original_Default_Username]

Jocko succeeded in a structure that already existed. Genghis Khan built the system that he succeeded in. If Jocko constructed the US Navy from scratch, then it might be a fair comparison.

[@AutoSanchezMusic]

@@The_Original_Default_Username I think you just don't like him for some reason.

[@The_Original_Default_Username]

@@AutoSanchezMusic I don't care for him because he's a follower's leader. Some of his lifestyle advice is absurd, and his contribution to discourse is about living in and obsessing over his own past.

[@AutoSanchezMusic]

@@The_Original_Default_Username You need to properly follow in order to properly lead. I also don't see how encouraging discipline is absurd, it leads to a better life on all accounts. I'm sure you know what your talking about though, you seem really intelligent.

[@robertmacdonaldch5105]

How did Rome do it and why not Greece? The Greeks I think were superior in nearly everything over the Roman's, but were never a solid nation state, they were united for barely 2 generations on their own for their whole history. Rome was the Borg of their day, unlike the Greeks who wanted to everything to be Greek or Greek influenced, Rome just wanted whatever worked best Another big factor is once they had Italy united and began to expand, their backside, didnt hold any true competitors, sure the Guals/ Celts would raid, but not as a united nation or empire so initially Rome could focus on the more wealthy Mediterranean countries. Although they paid for it when the Gauls did sack Rome, yet by then they could take the blow and eventually conquered Gaul.

[@StephensCrazyHour]

Well they kind of did. The longest lasting empire in history, even at the shortest way of accounting for it, was the Byzantine empire and they were the Romans, centred in Greece.

[@robertmacdonaldch5105]

@@StephensCrazyHour kinda did what?

[@StephensCrazyHour]

@@robertmacdonaldch5105 the Greeks ended up winning. The Roman empire became the Greek empire and it lasted for 800+ years. And they would have probably been just as wide reaching and powerful as the classical Roman empire if it wasn't for the plague of Justinian and the endless wars with the Persian empires. The Byzantines were so successful that they survived the Huns, Avars, Abassids, Sassanids, Umayyads, Khazars, Bulgars, Pechenegs, Ostrogoths, Visigoths and half a dozen other empires I'm forgetting. If we treat them as a separate entity from the classical Roman empire, they lasted twice as long as their Roman ancestors. If we treat them as a continuation of the Roman empire then they take up 2/3 of Roman history. The Greek-Roman Byzantine empire was the longest lasting continuous empire this side of the bronze age collapse and it took the combined might of the Latin crusaders and hundreds of years of Turkic invaders to finally destroy them. Were it not for the battle of Manzikurt they still might be a force today.

[@Khalikhalzit]

Two seconds in and he's already mispronouncing "Genghis." It's a soft G, as in "Jenghiz." Opinion discarded. _Everyone_ uses the hard G, but that's incorrect.

[@eaf888]

🙌🙌😎😎

[@stevepickford3004]

This was hilarious. Watching the guys desperate attempts to explain the fall of Rome without upsetting modern sensibilities by using culture and immigration as a negative.

[@grazzitdvram]

why on earth didn't this guy mention the barbery pirates and maybe point out that the northern coast of the med was basically depopulated by the muslim slave trade. You're going to let chris make a joke about Mediterranean pirates and pasta and not come back with anything? Maybe the piracy that occurred all along the spice routes? Hell captain kid was famous for being a pirate but he wasn't convicted of piracy for what he did in the Caribbean, he was convicted for what he did in the indian ocean.... frustrating

[@ChrisWillx]

I agree. These are the real issues I want addressed.

[@grazzitdvram]

@@ChrisWillx He's a historian, I get you're being playful with the interview but its frustrating, maybe you know the real history and are just having a bit of playful banter but how many people don't know and now walk away with it as a bit of a joke.

[@jesperburns]

Bloody hell, just looked it up, Charles Manson was 157cm, Danny Trejo is 167cm. Both these lads are tiny.

[@davelewis9795]

The great Khan would make Jocko look like a little girl but if JOcko was born at the time of Genghis Khan he would be hard as nails also...

[@genghiskhan5020]

Thank you.

[@landsknecht8654]

Meh...the Mongolians were overrated.

[@owenhunt]

@@landsknecht8654 Tell your Lemon Chicken chef them knowledge nuggets..

[@MichailHordens]

The true appearance of Chinghiz Khan, the real History of Tatars, many of Turkic peoples and Russians: Perhaps you know that recently were published books about the unwritten (hidden) real history of the Tatars by independent Tatar historian Gali Yenikey. His books present a new, or rather ‘well-forgotted old’ information about the real history of the Tatars and other Turkic peoples. It must be said, that in official history there are many falsifications and slanders about the ‘Tatars - wild nomads’ etc., which were written by pro-Chinese, Persian, also both Romanovs tsars and Bolshevik ideologists. However primarily we should know the truth about the meaning of the names ‘Mongol’ and ‘Tatar’ (‘Tartar’) in the medieval Eurasia: According to many medieval sources, the name ‘Mongol’ until the 17th-18th centuries meant belonging to a political community, and was not the ethnic name. While ‘‘the name ‘Tatar’ was ‘the name of the own ethnos (nation) of Chinghiz Khan'. Also ‘…Chinghiz Khan and his people did not speak the language, which we now call the ‘Mongolian’…’’ (an academician-orientalist V.P.Vasiliev, 19th century). This confirmed by many little known data. So in fact Chinghiz Khan was from among the medieval Tatars and the outstanding and progressive leader of the Turkic peoples. It is worth saying that according to many little-known data, the ancient and medieval Tatars were a very developed people both in spiritual and material aspects. It was the medieval Tatars who created the first Constitution of Eurasia, which was called in Tatar ‘Great Yasu’ (‘Yasu’ in Tatar means 'Scripture'). But with time many of their descendants became spiritually disabled and forgot invaluable doctrine and covenants of the creators of Great Yasu... So that the Tatars of Chinghiz Khan - medieval Tatars - were one of the Turkic nations, whose descendants now live in many of the fraternal Turkic peoples of Eurasia - among the Tatars, Kazakhs, Bashkirs, Uighurs, and many others. And few people know that the ethnos of medieval Tatars, which stopped the expansion of the Persians and the Chinese to the West of the World in Medieval centuries, is still alive. Despite to the politicians of the tsars Romanovs tsars and Bolsheviks dictators, which had divided and scattered this ethnos to different nations... About everything above mentioned and a lot of the true history of the Tatars and other fraternal Turkic peoples, which was hidden from us, had been written, in detail and proved, in the book ‘Forgotten Heritage of Tatars’ - it is one of the dooks by Gali Yenikey, translated in Engilsh. There are a lot of previously little-known historical facts, as well as 16 maps and illustrations in this book. This e-book (in English language) you can easily find in the Internet: www.kobo.com/ebook/forgotten-heritage-of-tatars-1 On the cover of this book you can see the true appearance of Chinghiz Khan. It is his lifetime portrait. In the ancient Tatar historical source ‘About the clan of Chinghiz Khan’ its author gave the words of the mother of Chinghiz Khan: ‘My son Chinghiz looks like this: he has a golden bushy beard, he wears a white fur coat and rides on a white horse’. As we can see, the portrait of an unknown medieval artist in many ways corresponds to the words of the mother of the Hero, which have come down to us in this ancient Tatar epic. Therefore, this portrait, which corresponds to the information of the Tatar source and to data from other sources, we believe, the most reliably transmits the appearance of Chinghiz Khan...’. And here's another interesting thing: We can't keep silent that some 'very important' official historians try to retell the content (or rather, the concept) of the works of the independent historian Gali Yenikey (Yenikeiev). But they conceal where the information was by them taken from. However it turned out they were unsuccessful and confused - this official historians, apparently, do not dare to show the real history of the Tatars, being afraid of their ‘scientific chiefs’. But not only this - see the portrait of Chingiz Khan - see on the 7th minute of the video of the Institute of history of the Academy of Sciences of Tatarstan (Russia): kzbin.info/www/bejne/aYjUc2pnnNhomMU - also this portrait is shown there both before and after. This portrait is reconstruction, which made by Yenikeiev on the basis of a lifetime portrait of Chingiz Khan and of information from the medieval Tatar Dastan (epic) 'About the Origin of Ciingiz Khan', as well as from other historical sources. This portrait was used by authors of the video without Yenikeiev's permission and without telling where the portrait came from. This portrait is published on the cover of G. R. Yenikeiev's book ‘Forgotten heritage of the Tatars’: see: payhip.com/b/Xujb For the first time this portrait was published on the cover of the third book by G. R. Yenikeiev ‘In the footsteps of the black legend’ (published in 2009), see its electronic version: payhip.com/b/DNdC This ‘creativity’ of the official historians is called among the decent people as plagiarism - that is, as theft.