Pathfinder: Kingmaker - Review after 100%

[@phammond2392]

Just popping on here quickly to give a shout out to my daughter. She did some voice acting in this game. :) That is all. Carry on you gamers.

[@aloofguy184]

Who is her character? if you dont mind us asking?

[@trueduke2515]

linzi?

[@Nineteenfivepointfive]

Nice. Now get me a sandwich. At least then you do something.

[@rosalind1635]

@@Nineteenfivepointfive Thanks for your worthless contribution.

[@chiefinasmith]

@@Nineteenfivepointfiveincel

[@JohnnyTightIips]

Good news everyone, 2 years after Mortym brought out this review, the completion rate of this game is now 9.1%!

[@captainlcm]

I admire your effort in reviewing after 100%. Such dedication! Thank you!

[@nwahally]

I loved the Kindom building. I hated the timers. There has not been a single time when I did not hate timers. They add nothing and often ruin everything.

[@baronsengir187]

Loved the timers. Made the world feel real.

[@F0r3v3rT0m0rr0w]

i Agree with you, i LOVED the Turn based mode ... i know it slowed down combat but i rather enjoy tactics games so it felt like tactics RPG with an incredibly deep (and abuse able which in a single player game is fun!) character creator. but oh man ... those timelimits .................................................. fuck those time limits. i tried to mod the time limits for the kingdom management off but they dont seem to work for me *sad face* i guess i had to many mods ? idk ... but man fuuuuck those timers ruined the entire game for me. i hope Wrath of the righteous doesn't have time limits. cause i think ill like that game a heck of a lot more.

[@flynnegankim9428]

Well, Timers, in my opinion, it’s good it makes world real and demanding to manage even rest/camping. And, it gives plenty of times for adventures, but, not enough to waste time.

[@Fallenangel_85]

The timers are part of the stakes, you can fail. Your decisions matter and have consequences. You can't just long rest spam like in BG3 totally making the game super easy.

[@F0r3v3rT0m0rr0w]

@@Fallenangel_85 Save states destroy that discussion entirely.

[@Peter-kh8go]

I have never played a game that was so determined to get in the way of you 'playing the game'.

[@windblownleaf6450]

I've only played for a bit (haven't gotten to kingdom management yet), so far the most annoying thing has been a lack of healing. Don't want to waste my potions and resting only restores a fraction of HP.

[@fcold9402]

@@windblownleaf6450 You can "rest until healed" (there is an option in the rest screen) but it eats up a lot of in game time if you don't have a cleric or someone with healing to heal before resting. The game will give you two clerics if you continue playing, but the start can be really rough if you didn't make the selections to get the first cleric at the mansion.

[@Peter-kh8go]

@@tAiLspo0n not sure what that has to do with my comment. Did you reply to the wrong person?

[@XBullitt16X]

Right ? I understand timers on the main quest, but having them on literally everything, while juggling kingdom management, companion quests and exploring the stolen lands is way too much micromanagement and time minmaxing. Its near impossible to explore, play and enjoy the game to its fullest, you need to go through multiple playthrough before, you can play the game to its fullest, its ridiculous. I guarantee you there is no way to play through the game properly, without spoiling yourself with guides, walkthroughs and a very minimaxed build on the first run. I'm on my second playthrough and I still had to to give up completing a few quests and exploring the rest of the stolen lands, in order to complete the main story quest in time.

[@Lorddacenshadowind]

@@XBullitt16X I both agree and disagree lol, it gives more a sense of time urgency, you can't do everything and things can just fail. However I can also see that some people can get annoyed when they are playing a game and want to do the stuff in the game

[@ThiLI0n]

I actually liked the kingdom management ... there are problems, but urgency gives the quests a more 'real' feeling

[@eroero830]

I lost half of my hair worrying about time management.

[@Harrison11106]

Another thing about alignments: it also affects your kingdom. A Lawful Good Kingdom will have a different set of buildings (& bonuses) then say a Chaotic Neutral one will. As an example, in one playthrough, where I'm a Paladin (LG kingdom) I can have a bulletin board which gives bonuses to kingdom related quests. Playing as a CN kingdom you don't have that Bulletin Board, but instead can have a (barony/state-run) Whorehouse, which gives different bonuses. In an LE kingdom, you have a Gallows in the court square, as opposed to the statue dedicated to my god in my LG kingdom. Those are small things, but added to the flavor & replay-ability on the barony/kingdom side. EDIT: As for the low completion rate, I MIGHT have something of an answer there. When the game originally came out, it was a buggy mess once you hit the 2nd chapter & tried going forward. It was borderline unplayable if not completely unplayable in some places. Hence people dropping it without finishing it & never going back to it for whatever reason. The game got a really LOW overall rating at the time due to the bugs (What CDPR is going through with Cyberpunk 2077, is what Owlcat went through). That the game got a "2nd chance" with the definitive edition is a miracle. Owlcat games so far seems to have learned their lesson, I'm on the BETA of Wrath of the Righteous, & so far no major bugs; that written, I'm only levels 4 & going on 5 in said BETA.

[@gvs2228]

Love this game, amazing world, lore and characters. I didn't mind the Kingdom management stuff, I actually found it fun. The amount of detail and variety of choice and consequence in this game is amazing!

[@Parkbankroman]

You are one of the most underrating youtuber I know. Thanks for your great work. I really enjoyed this review :D

[@sudstahgaming]

I saw this comment and just believed it so subbed

[@Jach93]

I love you took the time to review this, as I really enjoy this game. For me personally I liked the kingdom management and the timers, it really immersed me in the difficult decisions of running a kingdom but also helped me prioritize and categorize problems, which for me is cathartic. I’m really bad when it normally comes to choosing what quests to do in RPGs and tend to get frozen by what to start with, and something saying “the deadline for this quest is one week” and another saying “the deadline for this one is 3 months” really helped me make quicker decisions and made me feel more like a king juggling a lot of problems as best I can. I can see this being extremely frustrating when you are trying to 100% a game though.

[@Ryan_Winter]

The problem isn't the existence of "a timer", it's the convoluted stacking of world ending threats. You have to stop fey from the "first world" (all the blossoming stuff) and then an undead overlord, thereafter you have to prevent a barbarian invasion, only to go back to dealing with fey and undead. And all of this happens in the foreground of the actual problem, the curse you have to undo. It's ceaseless. You don't feel like a newly established ruler of a small territory in a far corner of Golarion's world map, you feel like Lucius Domitius Aurelianus, the man who restored the Roman Empire and provided it with another two centuries of dominance, by quenching a rebellion, stopping several invasions on differing fronts and recapturing thousands of square kilometers of territory for the Roman Empire. That's how this feels to me, like saving a three continents spanning empire and NOT like being a baron of largely unimportant place somewhere in the wilderness.

[@azarisLP]

​@@Ryan_Winter It does get hectic at times, but that's kind of the point of the plot. A malevolent force is specifically targeting you, so there's not always time to go off on endless side quests. Even then, there are gaps of hundreds of days in between to do nothing but kingdom upgrades. If you turn kingdom management on auto, the game has vast stretches of boredom.

[@doctorlolchicken7478]

I’ve been wanting to play this game for a while. The whole timer part you mentioned really put me off. I am a player who likes exploring. I hate timers.

[@slipknotpurity00]

@@Crazmuss Then what is the point of having a timer at all that just adds stress to the player

[@slipknotpurity00]

@@Crazmuss I get enough stress

[@christophermzdenek]

Kingdom Management was the whole reason I grabbed a cheat mod. Nothing big just set the resolution of events to 1 day. Instantly made the game 100% more enjoyable.

[@ecgrey]

What mod did you use?

[@chillax319]

Yeah. What mod did you use? I'm thinking about buying the game.

[@christophermzdenek]

@@chillax319 on nexus, it's the giant cheat menu one, most likely first or second on the list under the game title. I just use it's one function. I can't recall the name.

[@chillax319]

@@christophermzdenek Sounds like "The Bag of Tricks" one I'm checking out right now ^^

[@christophermzdenek]

@@chillax319 that sounds exactly like it. Nearly 100% positive that the one. It has a lot of other things it can do. I mean A LOT of things, but the kingdom function was the important one for me.

[@MrRecoilius]

This was an extremely useful review! I hope that the developers see this and can take your critical points and use them for the new sequel.

[@crow__bar]

Really good review. I'm happy that someone went through the effort of reviewing this game so long after it's been released because most of the ones that do exist focus a lot on the bugs and the features that they think are missing (both valid points, but very much less so with the current state of the game) As for your issues with the game, I think I have to disagree slightly. Kingdom management can be boring to a lot of people, but I personally loved it. It actually made me feel like I am a ruler of the region and that I need to do ruler shit. It also served the story thanks to the time progression. Seeing the seasons change when adventuring, characters talking about other characters from 2 years ago, etc. It really makes you believe that the time shift is real, and not just a date in your journal changing with nothing else to show it. Also have to disagree on the timers. I 100% understand why they are frustrating to you and other players, but to me it was the only time in a game where I actually felt the urgency of the main quest. Just think about all the times in Skyrim, or the Witcher where you got told that "we need to deal with this fast or the world is going to end" only for you to then spend 20 hours doing fetch quests or playing cards. In Kingmaker, there's none of that. You need to learn to budget not only your money and other resources but your time as well. "Do I have time to do this side quest? Is the risk of failing a different quest high enough for this gamble?" It just really nicely loops back around to the story and making you feel like your character. Don't really know what you're doing, everyone needs your help and you're just hoping to get through this without everyone dying.

[@Deviljho5]

You reviewed this two years ago and I am just now getting it! 😊 Your review is spot on!

[@AJTupman]

Loved your dedication in doing a 100% run before giving your review, it’s something I wish more reviewers would do but I suppose for those with deadlines playing over 100 hrs before writing a word isn’t really practical. However, you’ve definitely earned my like and subscription. I’ve got over 1000 hrs in Pathfinder: Kingmaker mainly due to team building in the Tenebrous Depths DLC and it’s probably my favourite CRPG. I also did a 100% run on my first blind playthrough but unlike you I loved the kingdom management and I can’t imagine playing with it turned off, or auto as they put it. I found a real sense of achievement in managing to get every artisan special piece on my first go and also really enjoyed building up my villages and towns. As for the combat, I completed my run when the only option was RTwP and it’s all I’ve done in subsequent runs although I’ve promised myself I’ll give turn based a go in my next attempt, although it will probably feel totally alien to me. Anyway, thanks again for the review even if it is 2 years late ;)

[@williamnoble1537]

It's a shame you didn't enjoy the Kingdom Management. I wouldn't say it's my favorite part of the game, but I certainly enjoyed it across multiple playthroughs. It really gave me the chance to feel like there were goings-on in the kingdom beyond what I was directly seeing at the end of my character's sword. It is frustrating when your 90% success chance advisors get a few critical failures on their Problem cards in a row though... In regards to timers, I never felt they were punishing, even on my first blind playthrough when the game first came out. As long as someone pays attention and doesn't elect to ignore things that are advertised as important, I think it's unlikely that they'll run in to many walls. The main story quests are at least given the countdown in the quest log as to how many days are left before they fail. A great review though overall, and certainly to each's own. Liked and subscribed :) Hope you're looking forward to Wrath of the Righteous!

[@MortismalGaming]

It's more the kingdom management combined with the timers specifically rather than each system individually, but glad you enjoyed it! Edit: I backed WotR on Kickstarter and plan on putting beta info out there which is why I'm knocking this out now

[@XBullitt16X]

@@MortismalGaming Exactly that's the main issue, all this micromanagement on top of timegating, its a lot to take in, especially on the first playthrough which most will inevitably fuck up. On its own, the timer is fine, but not with everything else layered on top of it, its the only downside of the game, not actually letting you play it in its fullest. In the end it makes you have to minmax and manage your time perfectly, in order to get the most out of the game, it won't just let you take your time and enjoy the game's atmosphere, characters lore and storytelling. I think only the main quests should have timers and not nearly every other sidequest too, that's what pushes it over the edge for most people.

[@Raziel078]

I know I'm months late but the two things that drove me crazy about Kingdom management were 1. The amount of money it took and 2. Why did I need to be there to receive a gift from my artisans? For money I felt like I was always slightly behind where I needed to be to find the kingdoms projects and sidequests. I was selling everything that wasn't being actively used and still felt stretched to the limit on money. For the artisans. Just drop off your gift, tell me when you'll be back, and I'll try to be there for the next one. Also the randomness on their masterwork. The guy who is supposed to give you the amazing armor? One of my first artisans, got him working on his masterwork project early in the game and he never completed it. Did everything the guides said to do to speed up his delivering it but it just never happened. I think all told even though I got every artisan and did all quests associated with them, only two of them gave me their masterwork items over the years they were in the kingdom. Which was BS.

[@JohnDoe-dh6zy]

Can you double the time you get or disable the timers but still do kingdom management?

[@shigerufan1]

@@XBullitt16X Found out on the last chapter that Arcane is the stat that reduces the time spent in the kingdom, as it reduces the rank up duration and unlocks the fast-travel building for villages. But you need to get divine up to a certain level just to make arcane rankable in the first place, and nowhere in the game is it suggested that fast travel is possible until you unlock it.

[@thadrine]

I loved the kingdom management once I got several bags of holding, could loot everything, then just dump tons of money into my kingdom.

[@Blasted2Oblivion]

I loved their solution to the bag of holding. In BG1 and 2 you had to put items in the bag but here it just boosts your carry weight.

[@GoldenDaemonas]

Just putting this here for the yt algorithm

[@spartnmarcen5110]

Was thinking about picking this up but after hearing about the timers and the pain that the Kingdom management system (my main draw) is I'll wait. Love your review style.

[@raduscarlat535]

you can bypass the entire kingdom management with a setting if you don't like it

[@Mirekluk]

There are a lot of people that do like it. I personally am in chapter 3 and I do enjoy it. I can't make more money, but I do enjoy the storylines it gives you as well as making the Stolen Lands living region. As D&D player, I really appreciated this, as this is something I would love to do even in tabletop RPG

[@jamesclawk852]

I just finished my first playthrough a couple days ago, after starting with WotR, and I appear to be in the minority with regards to both the kingdom management and the timers. The timers in particular I really appreciated since, in many games, I'll be informed of some urgent threat but instead of addressing it, I'll go around doing as much side content as I can find because I know that some of it will go away once I progress the main story. Here, because everything's on a timer, I can focus on the main story first and then I have a ton of time leftover to do side content. Narratively, I liked that a lot, and I was never really worried about running out of time, since the timers are so generous. As for the kingdom management, it's harder to explain. I think that maybe in a game where I'm constantly unsure of how anything works (I've never played the ttrpg) it's nice to be able to take a breather with something that is simple and easy to understand. In fact, many of the parts that I found the most irritating were the longer dungeon sections, where I'm locked in to doing combat after combat with no relief. I would actually say I liked this game better overall than WotR, though that may change, since WotR has a lot more replay value as far as I can tell.

[@MaxiCidron]

I am now playing Pillars of Eternity:Deadfire, almost buy this game blindly because it's on offert on steam and has some similiraties with PoE2, but thanks to your video im gonna get some extra information before buying it, thanks a lot. We all hate timers.

[@baronsengir187]

You are missing out

[@TralimHobni]

savescuming simulator the game is both incredibly fun and incredibly frustrating, i hope wrath of the righteous actually lets you play it without constantly worrying about some background goings-on it needs: -better class identity -crafting -unlimited preception checks for hidden objects also, tabletop rules dont transition well in to the video games because it is impossible to balance, making things either too easy (neverwinter nights 2) or forcing you in to metagaming (kingmaker)

[@diepappnase111]

I my opinion (Though I didn't play the game and can't tell for sure) it might be a problem with Pathfinder itself, since their modules tend to be extremely unbalenced and hard. In top of that the hole System is extremely unbalanced.

[@TralimHobni]

true, in pathfinder things are measured in absolutes, everything is either too overtuned or compleatly worthless, there is never something in-between its just that a video game lacks flexibility compared to playing tabletop with a dm, kingmaker in particilaur obviously if you are just playing a tabletop, your barbarian with low strenght and high intelligence will be put in the situations that are solved by his intelligence, meanwhile, in a game, you just know that every class has primary and secondary stats, making the whole idea of your characters stats pointless, so if it isnt a barbarian with 20 STR and 18 CON, 13 AGI, its not a barbarian, it is trash kingmaker commits a lot of sins of shitty design, Morti barely scratched the top of it

[@vitaminc2161]

100% agree with the perception checks.... At least a toogle for search mode (with reduced speed), where unlimited preception checks is possible

[@TralimHobni]

@@vitaminc2161 round = 6 seconds 1 check every 6 seconds, improves roleplay and gameplay expirience by making your character actievly search than having 1 quick glance

[@thanhdohuu9473]

I started playing the game after seeing your review. Right at the beginning of the game, when I got framed by Tartucio, with his ring, and tricks and my decision to loot the gold in Aldori's vault was reported and immediately led to consequences, when all characters meet back in the main hall, I was immediately impressed. . I felt that all the choices I made was impactful , meaningful and the characters are quite interesting. it's not every day that you got outsmarted by the villain. Moreover, most of the questions I naturally had was also adequately answered, like why didn't the Aldori simply go there and take the land by themselves, right then, I felt that the writing was very smart and thorough. Furthermore, I quickly realize that the journal was written by Linzi, a companion, and the story is being written as it happens, that way of story telling felt novel and innovative. However, the initial positive impressions went away quite fast. After the prologue, my actions don't seem to matter very much. Looting peasants'/ traders' houses, raiding tombs don't seem to have any consequences. Those actions aren't even counted towards alignment, and are seemingly ignored. Tartucio also appears a lot less cunning and doesn't seem like he has a plan for everything, like in the beginning, his story arc also ended rather abruptly. I also remember another area that was quite disappointing. Leading to Vordakai's tomb, there was a raven that keep asking for names, a behavior that puzzles me. Asking questions like who do you afraid to disappoint the most, which I answered Linzi. Right after answering that, I immediately remember a tooltip I read earlier, that soul eater do more dmg do whoever they know the name of, and I was shocked and thought, oh sh*et, I got tricked and now Linzi may die because of my mistake, that the boss was going to be a soul eater who will instantly one shot whoever he knows the name of. Welp, turned out, there was just a brief encounter with soul eaters right before the entrance to Vordakai, who were more of an annoyance than actual challenges, and there are simply soul eaters that attack the people whose name are given, and no one else can touch those, not much else. Another aspect that didn't get done well is the lack of changes in quest giver and merchant's responses to whatever title I have at the time. For example, an artesian quests, I was already a king at the time, accompanied by my general, grand diplomat, etc., asked to go to get a flower for this one dude from one of my village. I did the task course, but, I feel like I should have been doing much more important tasks. The game likely would have been better if there are quests that only available when you unlock a certain title, and NPC's response in lower tier quests also adjusted slightly, like they fear they're wasting your time, but have no one else to turn to, or something similar, so that you can feel the improvement that you made, as you're on your journey to become king. I also feel that the game missed out a lot by not having the option to chat with companion on trips. For example, when visited the academy in Pitax, I really wanted to talk to Linzi to ask her how she feel coming back to the academy. The responses and dialogue of companions during and after quests are also quite limited and lack luster. I loved the way that each of the NPC have a new, unique response to the current situation in other games, like after Vesemir's death in Witcher 3, each of the NPC attending the funeral have their own new, unique responses that make you want to check, it makes the events feel more real and immersive. Had Owlcat diverted some of their budget , make fewer chapters, but each of them with more details, the game probably would have been better. When Linzi was killed by Nyrissa, I didn't really feel much when that happen. It didn't quite have the emotional impact like when you punch the corpse collector in Witcher 3, during Priscilla's quest, or the romance scene near the end of Divinity Original Sin 2. Another aspect that I felt disappointing was probably the lack of political drama and conquests. When first started, I thought become kings, waging wars, invading, making alliances, betrayal etc. were going to be a large part of the game, and there were going to be huge playable battles. Welp, the game, however, had very little of that, to expand your kingdom, you only need to claim, a simple click and wait, not much else. The political plot point that started the game, has very little mentioned and development over the course of the game. It's like the opposite of GOT, the focus is on the wild walker while the political drama is briefly mentioned then completely ignored. The war of river kings have a bit of political drama, but its plots were rather stupid. Basically, you got invited to Pitax to hand over your crowd and region, or otherwise, get ambushed and killed. Such trap would never work in real life, considering no sane person would willingly walk into an obvious trap like that. Which was exactly what my main character did, willingly walking into an obvious trap, and I have no other options to do anything else, like launching a total war or something. What make that chapter even more moronic was that I was allowed to freely go around to convince everyone to turn against Iroveti, some of them are right in front of him in the main yard as well, while my access to Pitax was blocked, previously, during the Rushlight tournament. One would have thought that a group of individuals as important as my party would have been put on tight leash the moment I set foot on Pitax's soil. But no, I was allowed to go anywhere, for as long as I like, while Iroveti patiently waiting for his demise in the front gate. Iroveti went from a cunning king with silver tongue during the Rushlight tournament to a complete moron , within a span of a few quests. In all fairness, it's possible that Iroveti went insane during that time, but the insanity or changed behavior wasn't elaborated in details, which make this villain's story arc not particularly good. The turn based combat is quite fun, however it doesn't seem balanced, which is understandable, considering the game wasn't built with turn-based in mind. Specifically, effect that used to last 1 minute now last practically entire fight. Your buffs seems like they last forever, but so are enemy's debuffs. If you got hit by a negative status effect and just happen to lack/ run of out charges of the counter spells, you practically lose that members until the end of the fight. This made save scumming a must at later areas, and the monsters that causes tons of status effects while being immune to practically everything very annoying. Also, not sure if I build my casters wrong, but at later stages, casters seem quite useless, compared to physical attack dmg dealers. Each of my physical attack dealers was hitting 6-8 hits per turn, dealing 40-60 dmg a hit, crits/ sneak attacks for over 100 dmg fairly often, while my casters can only do a spell, aoe, dmg once of around 60-100, then run out of charges. I eventually shifted my team from a mixture of physical and caster to 4 physical dmg dealers and 2 mobile buffing/ crowd control bots. Another issue is the potential to miss out on contents, due to the game designs, I missed out on several quests due to failed perception checks and the game's timers. I didn't even know that the DLC, beneath the stolen lands is supposed to be done during the main campaign, rather than something that you can play after finishing the main story, like in other games. Being able to continue playing after the main quest, finish upgrading the kingdom, side quests and endless dungeon beneath the stolen lands with my fully geared and leveled party would have been so great. This is something I perhaps can do on my second playthrough, but I'm currently not that sure if the game deserve more time, considering that it's unlikely I'll make different choices , or using different companions in the second playthrough. That said, I actually have an enjoyable experience. The games certainly have its pros along all those cons. The overall story is interesting enough, the companions, despite lacking details, are likeable. The alignment system having noticeable impacts on the game is quite interesting.

[@Bluq16]

"which is understandable, considering the game wasn't built with turn-based in mind" There is such a big irony with this considering that they mostly just copy-pasted the Pathfinder rules to the game, if anything the game is designed to work turn-based, there was minimal adaptation from the rulebook to work realtime. Minute/level buffs in the normal tabletop RPG are meant to last the whole combat and possibly even more combats, normally there is a balance between buffs duration and effects, where you can have small buffs that lost a whole day to really strong ones that only last for one encounter(that balance being the hours/minutes/rounds per level duration). Regarding debuffs being crippling to characters, sadly that is also imported from the tabletop and normally that works both ways, enemys are equally as vulnerable to them, but it seems that a lot of encounters and bosses were tailored to have a ton of unreasonable immunitys. Regarding your issue with casters doing less damage, as you may guess that also comes from the tabletop, casters are OP as hell, but not at dealing damage, they normally can end encounters with one spell, the famous Save-or-lose or Save-or-die, it just seems some of those OP spells where not implemented into the game.

[@mitjakocjancic2205]

Great review, but I actially loved the kingdom management. I didn't expect to, but it was the part I ended up looking forward to the most. I found it to be near perfect, because every choice it gives you is so flavorful, a huge opportunity to express your character's personality, worldview, political standing.. But I agree that the fact everything is timed is super annoying. I never liked time limits, I prefer to relax and move at my own pace. Still, I used the RestLess mod which saves a lot of time by removong the annoying fatigue mechanic, so the timers aren't super strict and it's not hard to do all the quests if you do that. 100% recommend the game and highly recommend RestLess, as well as the turn-based mod. 10/10 game imo ❤

[@BronnBlackwater]

The kingdom management was my favorite part of the game! I put it on Easy and scum saved a bit to avoid disasters. It's much better at allowing you to feel like a badass lord than say, dragon age: inquisition.

[@MortismalGaming]

😂 to each their own I guess!

[@gotoucanario8341]

@@jeremyalexander135 To me both suffer the same issue to some degree, why is the head of this organization/country doing silly errands for everyone, many of which would logically be assigned to your troops. Kingmaker does a pretty good job at giving you a kingdom to manage and not THAT many trivial tasks but there's still enough to break immersion if you are really looking into it. I'd say they do a comparable job all things considered, Pathfinder's is much more in depth and engaging, DAI feels a bit better, smoother around the edges but perhaps less engaging.

[@supernova9930]

To be fair, the inquisitor was a nobody and not meant to be a badass, really.

[@Aedrion-]

This exactly. In Kingmaker, you have to rule and you earn that chair. You have to manage the projects, juggle responsibilities, choose where to go, who to help or who not to help. You really feel like the ruler of a barony and later a kingdom. In Inquisition, you don't earn that chair. You don't earn jack shit.

[@Dr.UldenWascht]

Thank you for a fantastic and informative review. I'm very glad to have found your channel through this review. Subbed. I've been waiting for some time to get into Pathfinder since I liked the premise of the story. The one thing however that repels me strongly, is the unnecessary time-limits. I may come around to enjoying the kingdom management part; and I may put in the time and do some extra-curricular reading and researching if need be, but the timers ... they just seem to contrived. I did a bit of reading on the PK discussion forums and the responses were mostly addressing the nonissues; like, "there is more than enough time to defeat the final boss!" or "you should rush immediately toward any quest that comes up." They seemed to have completely missed the point, unfortunately. So, as an old-timer, I did what any self-respecting casual would do and looked to the "modding scene". And as it turns out, there is a mod named "Kingdom Resolution" which among other things (basically) removes the timer from the game. But unfortunately the mod has been abandoned for more than year or so and no longer functions. So as far as I could find, there is no easy way to deal with this issue, for now at least. I guess I have to wait or look a bit more for a viable solution. Anyway, once again, great video.

[@usedtobias]

useful review, but I'm gonna argue that calling something a 'review' and then going into what seem to be detailed plot spoilers for the early game is maybe not the best idea. I think I could've gotten a sense of the nature and quality of the narrative without knowing who betrays me, when, and why. mechanic review was strong, tho.

[@ed-te1fp]

This was a brilliant game and enjoyed it a lot. But I agree, it does require a bit of planning and is very unforgiving on people who just want to jump into the game.

[@lmadar3]

I wanted to try out all companions, so my first playthrough I clicked the "distribute XP across party members" or something like that. I started on normal, got to easy and the last fight was on story. Don't do this :) Also, because of the timer, you are better to have less spellcasters, because resting or adventuring is a mistake in this game. you need to plan ahead, find optimal routes in your existing kingdom, even let loot to rot where it is, since money is the only issue you don't have to care about - only time. God I hated this game when I first played.

[@sd5919]

If you put kingdom management at effortless the timers aren't too bad. The trick is to build teleportation circles in each settlement. Adventuring is such a small timesink you'll end up with plenty of extra time.

[@chrisb1531]

Yeah, I was struggling on my first attempted playthrough. The timers are definitely the worst aspect for me, but I was able to deal with those by just making every main quest my first priority for each chapter of the story. Once you finish that then you have a few months till you feel the pressure again. Once you adjust your playstyle this way it becomes more bearable, but it can still be a royal pain in the ass. I enjoyed *some* aspect of kingdom management, primarily conquering new territories, and the construction of towns and cities. Delegating tasks to your advisors was a drag though, especially when you don't have anyone to fill a specific role. I had to turn kingdom management down to effortless after I had spent probably 20 hours in a playthrough because my game was doomed due to the kingdom management, which I was loathe to do since I typically hate playing on "Easy" modes in games. But it's incredibly frustrating to lose all of that progress and have to start over due to some decision you made earlier that ends up screwing you over in the end. Overall, kingdom management needed a lot of revisions, as it is for the most part pure frustration. I am glad I finished it though, and got the good ending. The story and characters are quite strong, and the world is deep and immersive. Never thought I'd dread an invasion of the "Fae", but the game makes them a daunting foe with some interesting lore behind them. Oh, and you're a total madman for 100%ing this game. Props to you for doing that. I finished the main campaign and the Varnhold's Lot DLC and called it there. Might return to it again some day but I think 230 hours is quite enough for at least another year or two...

[@Tyraeleon]

Awesome review. I agree with everything you said. I think the Kingdom Management was a little underwhelming, but really innovative and I would love to see something more in depth like that in the future.

[@luisb9862]

I stopped playing when I got to the kingdom building part. It cannot please everyone I guess

[@zennim125]

i don't really trust myself to find the fun in a game, i have the annoying habit of getting everything right on my first try, so i absolutely loved that the game hide checks that you fail and that some choices can screw your entire save out of some outcomes it forced me to deal with situations that were not ideal, put me in some tough spots where i had to shuffle all my advisors into different slots and just accept some bad outcomes for a change i actually loved that, the first time i also didn't knew there was a timer, so what i thought was a minor side event instead of a main story quest was ruining my kingdom i had to scramble up a solution asap because it was going to cause a fail state, and that desperation to do it was a memorable moment i wish we had more time before the last chapter and between the varnhold storyline and the next one, just so i actually could upgrade all my advisors, but that is it can't wait for the next one to come out

[@TKGames54]

So glad I've found your channel I love CRPGs and I've just binge watched at least 5 of your videos. Great job.

[@brianjohnson4730]

I loved this game and even enjoyed the kingdom management but unfortunately I'm not one of the 7% that completed it. I did all the side content and went into the endgame both good at the game as a player and with a very powerful party. Unfortunately there is a glitch with the dungeon that separates you from your party where all of your inventory stays with your main character and you walk at an absolute crawl. As you get your characters back, it becomes less of an issue but as I got Tristan back the game glitched and I lost the healer I'd used for the entire game, forever. After the annoying inventory glitch, that was kind of the last straw. I loved this game to death but it abused me lol, great review tho!

[@marcelokurashima]

if you like to read, like i do, the kingdom manager can be fun. (not the timers though). but the deal breaker for me is the combat A.I. it feels like the original bg1 had better scripted encounters. i loved the pathfinder characters progressions

[@travisdavidson2415]

I really enjoyed the kingdom management. What I didn't enjoy was the half-ass implemented kingdom building. It could have been so much better. Imagining walking through your capitol as the ruler who built it. I was pretty disappointed that I couldn't go check out the new buildings or work sites in progress. Nope. That giant castle that just completed, still the same throne room with an attached bedroom.

[@JohnnyTightIips]

I loved everything in PF Kingmaker *except* the timers. I don't like being punished when playing a game I paid for lesiurely.

[@ninjakali5137]

You hit the nail on the head sir! I enjoyed the game and I wanted to keep playing. I thought the idea of managing your kingdom was so awesome and that alone sold me to the game. But I hate timed quests. It takes away the fun out of it and the constant back and forth I had to keep doing just so I don't fail a kingdom quest just took the fun out. Also on a much lighter note, I'm a 5e player, I'm familiar with it and I enjoy it, but it was hard to wrap my head around all the classes and insane amount of things in there. Character creation was still overwhelming to me because it felt like I had to study everything about pathfinder to figure things out. So many times I have to keep restarting a new game because a character I made didn't feel fun to play as I originally thought. I put it down and haven't touched it in a long time. Still, I support the developers as they made a fantastic game and they deserve the support to keep innovating, improving, and creating great games, unlike the AAA gaming industry.

[@callmedavid9696]

About halfway through this. Expected to hate the kingdom management but i am actually enjoying it. Really hooked.

[@redfoxx0930]

1st off I enjoyed the review thank you for taking the time but I will admit I have different views on most of your conclusions. I disagree with your assessment that every player needs to turn the kingdom management off at game start, as you said it is an integral part of the “kingmaker” role playing theme to manage the issues in your country, doing it really adds to immersion in some respects if you take the time to learn how to manage it right, but yes the developers could have done a better job instructing people on the optimal way to tackle it so I agree if someone finds that it is to frustrating as they progress then yes at that point I would lower the difficulty/turn it off. As for the time limits while I do agree they can be stressful, they are 1. Usually generous enough 2. Add a sense of urgency that most games like this are lacking...” Oh there’s a troll uprising in your kingdom you should probably handle that, nah no Im gonna just explore around the world and rank up my advisors for months = negative effects. This is logical from a role play perspective, forcing you to balance what you want to do as an rpg character and what you need to do while role playing a King, i.e. part of the. Challenge. And to your last point about this game having a HUGE knowledge gap in terms of learning it’s systems & best way to fight enemies etc. on this one we are in total agreement! This game even more so than DoS2 or POE2 because it is built on that deep expansive tabletop system. I like you had to excessively research the Internet to learn it’s in’s and out’s but funny enough I became engrossed in that very system in my quest to master it. Because of this I wonder if it is not this knowledge hurdle itself that is part of the core crpg experience setting them apart from normal or action rpgs feeding that community/fan base’s desire for more challenging complex role playing experiences? Overall after having played all the latest big 3 new gen crpg’s (DoS2 POE2 @ Pathfinder) I believe Pathfinder to be the best of the bunch for companion characters , story progression fun combat/gameplay and deep core system. Caveat to DoS2 which I think is the more polished product in that gameplay category. Looking forward to more of your reviews in the future 💪🏾

[@AJTupman]

I agree with everything you’ve said, this is probably my favourite CRPG overall. I think the reviewer got too bogged down in his hatred for the kingdom management and let it colour his judgement a little too much.

[@bakuiel1901]

I liked your video though I do disagree with some of your opinions, I loved the Kingdom Building, took some getting used to but I did love it in the end. The game is a bit stressful but I managed to do all the companion quests and only failed one and due to choice not due to time. Mind you I am a Pathfinder player and knew a bit about the adventure path. Still you had valid points, I just love this game its my favorite crpg now. Also one thing they added a while back now is that while you can end up without a adviser for certain positions now you can hire a mercenary and they can fill any of those positions, I thought this a nice touch. Either way though while I may not agree, its just my opinion, you do great videos, I enjoy them. Keep it up and thanks.

[@adammusia9527]

As many other commenters, I love the timers, it's realistic, but still it gives you lots of time, it's normal that someone missing in the mountains will die if you don't go for him in a year or so xd or if you ignore your companion's quest, it's normal that he/she'll be pissed. Possibility to screw yourself is a good thing, consequences are a good thing. Oh, and I actually liked kingdom management, it wasn't great, but it was nice to do between quests + and all the audiences and rank up decisions make you feel more like a baron, it adds to immersion AND it has an effect on the end game. Also if you put it on auto, you actually miss out on some quest and story stuff, you'll also miss some additional gear that you can get via kingdom management, and I don't mean artisan stuff, if you don't like it - just put it on efortless + invincible kingdom, it won't cause you any problems, you'll just have to skip time in the throne room, take some options from time to time and still attend audiences and make rank up decisions that have actual consequences, which for me is the best part of kingdom management.

[@marlonbrando1631]

While I understand and support many of your criticisms I think the time limits are overestimated. The game gives plenty of time for main and companions quests and leaves a lot of time to just travel around the Stolen Lands. I think the simple existence of a timer, no matter how generous, just stressed people out.

[@carl7018]

He also mentions that quests have to be completed in a certian order for you to have a good time. The hidden timers coupled with the fact that quests have an optimal order lol is what kills the game for me i lost my only councilor because I didn't do his quests in order and found out that you can save him if you do it a certian way. Its really not fun.

[@carl7018]

@@robertnomok9750 what if you don't want to be kind to tristian? The game gives you the option to not be kind, but you'll potentially never have a councilor and screw yourself literally out of the game since not having a councelor could end the barony if your other advisor can't keep up. Would've been good to know that it was a non option. The councelor position is really messed up. And also I'm not even talking about the choices on what to do with tristian. I'm taking about shit like what happnes after varnhold, everything went downhill from there. The barbarian mission interlocking with tristian was really not well done from a gameplay perspective, its unbelievably time sensitive and again could potentially screw you over for the rest of the game depending on what order you play the missions. I could write and essay about why its so bad. There is a reason why this game has an extremely low completion rate, relatively speaking.

[@carl7018]

@@robertnomok9750 eh you do two kingdom events and one month already passed lol And also just FYI, you're two alternative councilors are very easy to miss. How do you not acknowledge that? First one is missed at the beginning of the game if you didn't want to pick her, and not to mention she leaves later in the game. Second one belong in a cult and you could've easily killed her not knowing she can become a councilor. Only sensible character left is tristian and even HIS position is not grantees. Since he leave at one point as well, and guess you have no choice but to try and get him back. No other position in the kingdom has this much of an issue. Most of the time you are stuck with tristian and that is bad design. Not to mention Tristian is also a bad councilor lmao. I'm pretty sure those quests are time sensitive, considering that I've messed up the order and still kept both tristian and amiri on my second playthrough. And on my third I was finicky again where I had to really metagame everything to keep amiri and tristian.

[@carl7018]

@@robertnomok9750 I mean you know the events I was talking about. It was kind of implied that I was talking about events that require your own time. And how does it take 7 days? The events that require your own time always takes 14 days for me? Unless another bug or something or something I missed? I don't think you understood my original argument. The game has an optimal order to do things. It is optimal because you get to keep characters alive, resolve issues and not miss content if you wanted it, and not screw yourself out of enjoying the game. Not to mention even this is a lie since quests have hidden timers, so you don't even know what the optimal order is unless you look up what happnes. I've still never figured out which companion question takes precedent and when in that section of the game cause the whole thing is clunky. Again this game requires heavy metagaming. The biggest scam in the whole kingdom management is buildings. The buildings give static increases to stats that are like +2 or something ridiculously small, why build them when you can do a few problem/opportunity events and ypu probably now have +10 to you stats assuming you passed. Buildings are actually useless, other than the ones that help you resolve kingdom events.

[@carl7018]

@@robertnomok9750yeah if you don't build anything else you should at least build teportafion circles lmao. But unfortunately I didn't know how to get them untill my second playthrough of which i didn't actually finish. Cause amiri refuses join my party and I lost interest. I don't mind if characters die at the end of the game thats fine. If a character dies he should be easily replaceable with a meaningful replacement. You can spoil if you want cause I beat the game, and also I'm thinking you're talking about Jaethal? She killed triatian in my first game at the end lol I was playing lawful evil in that game. My friend told me if you make her good she dies later. I just don't like it when you build a team around a character and he/she dies in the middle of the game and now I have to rebuild another character with a class I'm not familiar with. Mercenaries are nice but expensive and not enough stat point buy to match regular characters. I don't think its a bad game I just also don't think its one of the best RPGs lol in my opinion its overhyped. WOTR seems to have improved alot of things but I'm just worried about combat since kingmaker combat was really lackluster which is a shame because you have so many cool classes and your fighting so often against the same shitty horde of enemies it get boring after awhile.

[@pqfire0950]

This game surprised the hell out of me, and I'll be grabbing wrath of the righteous when it comes out. I will say I had kingdom management on easy so it was enjoyable for me.

[@aaronreynolds1504]

I hated the kingdom management only because of the timers. Its a freaking RPG, I want to explore things, not be roped into doing tedious and boring management all the time.

[@aaronreynolds1504]

I'm one of those who hasn't finished the game. The Kingdom management just made it not fun.

[@viniciusqueiroz180]

God damn, this game was a challenge to finish. On one hand, you can see the love they put making it, which got me through it, but it required me to be stubborn. I get how bad the mechanics you pointed are very bad, but for me, the level design of some dungeons and the fact that some hidden dialogue interaction can forever lock you out of your desired path almost made me quit. I actually put the game aside for 6 months before i decided to finish it. I loved it, but can not picture myself ever recommending it to anyone or ever picking it up again.

[@JohnDoe-dh6zy]

This is one of the best video game reviews I've read- very well done indeed. I'm super glad I watched this because I can start over and incorporate your feedback. I'll start it over and load on perception bonuses. I chose straight neutral but I may have to rethink that based on what I'm hearing. I'm thinking chaotic neutral. I'm so glad you spent a good amount if time talking about kingdom management because I'll do everything to disable it completely. Unlocking achievements is a nothing burger. The only real value it might add is giving you an idea of how much of the game you've seen and how much you might have missed missed. But you could look that up online, and I looked at them maybe 1x in POE1/POE2. One place I disagree slightly is having to assign your attribute points up front. If you have experience with other RPG's, you can kind of maneuver your way through that somewhat versus having no idea. That said, I never would have guessed the perception part so I think you proved your own point. Cheers!

[@flamebrindger3984]

I think the best thing PFK has, for me at least, is its artstyle. Combat is fun too, although you're right about how it doesn't require much skill. I also like the dialogue and the lore is interesting to me. I don't play these types of games often, ttrpgs and crpgs, but this game pulls me in with its asethic. I think if someone new who wants to play this game should play it on an easier difficulty so some of the less savory mechanics won't be super immersion breaking. If they ever make a sequel and refined a couple mechanics this series would be on more people's radar.

[@sergeydubovyk9268]

Great review! But I actually enjoyed the "timed mode" because it leads you to prioritize: quests, companions, items, etc. Basically, it throws in that table top feeling of "no, your lvl 9 char can't be everywhere! hell, even you archmage can't solve all the problems". As for the required knowledge -- yes, that's true, you need quite a bit. For me it ended up with me trying out Pathfinder 2 bc I loved the game and was quite bored with D&D :)

[@vladimirtchuiev2218]

What I didn't like about kingdom management is that it seems rather detached from your party's power, I know that there are artisans and kingdom bonuses but they seem somewhat inconsequential, but maybe I'm wrong because I'm in chapter 4 right now. Kingdom management is an exercise in putting out fires and save scumming, and it's rather annoying that its more like an additional ball to juggle rather than providing any actual power boost to your character.

[@forger42]

I did actually like the kingdom management, but I'm not a fan of the timers. But without the timers, you would probably need some other kind of pressure to replace it (no idea what that would be though). In fact, I would have loved the kingdom building to be an even bigger part of the game. I am usually enjoying that, and then I get annoyed that some stuff happens that I need to handle personally. I mean, don't I have a kingdom full of guards and wizards and adventurers? Can't they handle it? :P But that's the timers that get in the way again I suppose. I do get why some people won't like this game, but I ran this Adventure Path as a DM for my group, so I absolutely loved it :)

[@Blasted2Oblivion]

I think I found a solid middle ground for timers. Have a timer for the important stuff and once you finished the important thing, the timer stops until you choose to advance. That way you can clean up the side stuff and allow your kingdom to recover but you still have the pressure from chapter to chapter.

[@Tyreonn]

Regarding the looking up stuff. You do roll for knowledge checks when dealing with mobs, which can reveal stats including weaknesses. The game does provide the meta information when you earn it through knowledge skills. For anyone who does not know. That is what the eye icon in the menu is for. It also shows this information in turn based mode when you mouse over a creature portrait in the turn order.

[@UToobUsername01]

Thank you. Where does a noob go to read up on the correct way to play this game properly?

[@nacivelaz]

I just beat the game last week and the kingdom management is literally a nightmare. Save scumming is the only way to get through it and I toggled the kingdom difficulty between effortless and easy. A very very fun game but yeah also spent like 10+ just reading how to beat fights

[@hugo3627]

I restarted a couple times because of the magic noob trap. I dont understand how cantrips and damage spells are so terrible up to the mid game. Also half of the CC magic does not work on the enemies you need it for, it only works on enemies that Amiri can 1 shot.

[@KaleidoscopeofBrilliance]

I admire your patience and willpower.

[@grantwallace1882]

I am now approaching 150 hours in this game. I would say it is now the best crpg that I have ever played.

[@fiftydabs5114]

I guess you haven’t played baldurs gate 3 lol

[@grantwallace1882]

@@fiftydabs5114 You are correct. Many years ago, I bought a new PC and then played Baldur's Gate. I think it was on 5 disks at the time, plus the expansion. I am now looking for a new PC again to play Baldur's Gate 3. Perhaps I should have posted, "Kingmaker is the best crpg for my Lenovo Legion laptop with its GEFORCE 1050 GTX." Happy Gaming! 😊😬

[@BewareOfTom]

As someone who has played the adventure path, the kingdom building rules in it were much worse than the PC game's.

[@finix7419]

I just enjoy watching these games from time to time but then hate how much they don't care about your time and just don't want to start playing them because they just end up waste up a ton of time like POE1&2 .I wish more of these games do what DA:origins did,brought back crpg and polished it in a playable for most people game in a really cool way

[@paulpantorilla6121]

Timer system broke my game. Can't even beat it now unless I restart 20 hours back or more.

[@MortismalGaming]

Oof

[@CalebRogers808]

I haven't beaten this game yet, mostly due to the fact that I keep restarting it. I'm on chapter 5 rn

[@AlexBabz_]

Same! 😭

[@shawngillogly6873]

Chronic restart syndrome is still a thing for me with this game. 1700 hrs into it. I have finished it, more than once. But there's more to see. And I consider that a good thing.

[@nokronis]

I found that Real Time was great for most of the game, but for big boss fights I would use Turn Based.

[@AeonQuasar]

I agree with this review 100%. I wanted to enjoy the game and I usually love kingdom managment in games like this. (I loved the Neverwinter Nights 2 OC only because of that.) But there was so much I did not know or how to deal with. So many objectives, so little time, so much hidden information. I was determind to just finish the game and not worry too much about whats good or bad ending, but I finally gave up and uninstalled the game when I was trying to do the main quest and was far far into a different region, when some quest I forgot came up. A plague bird nest or something similar had spawned and made a havoc on my empire. I found out it was right above my city. So I had to walk all the way back to deal with a minor inconveniance that could have been just delt by other people. Serious, I can't be everywhere. And the walking back takes forever, as you have to rest so many times on your way. Every day I got a minus 1- for loyalty (unrest) just to walk the entire map back to deal with some stupid birds. Not to say that other quest that I had was in the area I already were in. So the timer from them would also run out if I did go back. I wanted so much to like this game, but the timer, the walking and the empire chaos was just too much for me to handle. I'm still willing to give Pathfinder 2 a new chance. But they got to get this right this time.

[@BorgWolf359]

This was me! I love everything else about Pathfinder: Kingmaker! I love the character creation, the main story, the side quests, all of it! I stopped playing because no matter what I did the Kingdom would start to fail & it seemed to me the game was punishing me for going out to do other quests! I would actually stress out to make it back to the Kingdom to take care of something the dang guards could handle! I will be getting Pathfinder:WotR & I really hope they fix the Crusade system to NOT be stressful like the Kingdom Management System was in this game! I like Morten might pick up Kingmaker again & just put it on effortless or whatever setting it is so I can actually complete the main story line!

[@diegofernandez8981]

I got the game in the recent summer sale and managed just over 100hours and something athat helped the kingdom management side significantly is an option hidden in the menus that says your kingdom will not fail because of a problem. But ive realized it doesn't include other issues to decrease stability such as low BP. Also, i found the game because i was doing research to try to run the actual AP for friends and i found it to be insanely true to life with how the general main story goes, but not necessarily the characters of course.

[@SinSorrowEU]

Nice review. =) As you are going 100% I totally understand the frustration on achis/trophyes or what ever they are called. Imo I want an option to newer see any achies/trophyes in any game. As sell/use/do anything with them only break immersion when they pop in-screen. (Playstation is horrid with this)

[@Alfrebaut]

I actually really like this game. I'm also more of a DnD person than a Pathfinder one, but the knowledge I had from 3.5 somewhat carried over, so while I wasn't familiar with some of the things going on in this game or the lore, the mechanics of the leveling system were at least pretty familiar. I did have huge problems with the kingdom builder, though. I think the idea was decent, but I think too many of the quests were locked behind specific roles and timings, so if you didn't know a certain important problem needing a specific person was coming up, you might lose weeks of progress on a long assignment to deal with an urgent problem. Also, on my first playthrough, I was having trouble with the Stag Lord, so I ended up exploring the southern explorable areas to try to hunt for items or find things to kill for more levels, and ended up saving too far away with only a few days left on the main quest(which I hadn't realized was timed), which caused me to lose a TON of time I had spent exploring because I had saved somewhere without enough time to get back to where I needed to finish the main quest. It absolutely sucked. However, while I haven't played a ton of CRPGs, especially the older ones like BG, and Planescape, I definitely like Pathfinder than most of the other ones I've played. I like how much skills matter, and choices, and while I didn't like getting locked out of options from alignments mattering, I do like that alignments mattered.

[@Sporemaniac777]

I'm glad they learned from this game and didn't make the same mistake with timers in WOTR.

[@azsolus7845]

Will you do a optimal playthrough guide ? Just started this game and it’s overwhelming

[@MortismalGaming]

I'd consider it, though I know a few written guides on it exist already. Optimal means different things to different people, especially depending on what you're trying to achieve, that's my only hang up on it

[@ArutaretiI]

I've beaten this twice. The first time I failed half of the quests because of the timers, and I got my kingdom destroyed, so I had to turn that part of the game off. Second time, once I actually started to pay attention to the kingdom and prioritized finishing quests before exploring everything, I found out that there is plenty of time to explore before the main quest progresses in each chapter and it was much less painful.

[@RyuDouro]

I love the kingdom management and Kingdom management games.

[@theunhappygamer1744]

I enjoyed the Kingdom Management. It was simple. I noticed a lot of players felt they had to do absolutely every single timed card that came up and if they missed even one they would get frustrated. But the truth is for most of those event cards you aren't going to get much out of them even if you complete them, nor will you lose much if you fail them .To fail the entire game you would have to lose a massive amount of those event cards, its balanced so that you aren't really supposed to complete every one with success. .

[@strangeattractor4940]

Really enjoyed the game itself. But on PS4 it crashed every 20 minutes, it got to frustrating to finish.

[@leroyp2212]

I'm having the same problem on xbox. Love the game but gets annoying having to replay the same part 3 times in row

[@MrEtheric]

Played the game at its buggy best at release, and coming back now after wrath. Interested to your opinion on the game. Interesting you hated the kingdom management so much. It was one of my favorite things. I played the game when it first came out, and had to quite restart a few times to get it right, taking the river freedoms at economy rank 6 makes it so much easier. The timers I also did not find that punitive. You have to go solve the problems straight away when they come up, so you get periods of semi calm, a crisis where you have to adventure then calm again. The hilltop timer is pretty clear in terms of letting you know how long you have once you solve the current chapter before the next one comes out. The key part really is having camping supplies so you rest for 9 hours not for days each time. I would have fairly easily got all kingdom stats to 10 at the end of the game, except bugs (the levelup quest/event can go wrong sometimes) The lack of advisors is a problem, particularly if people leave due to story events is definitely a problem. Mercenaries can be used for the positions, but get a -4 penalty. Not sure when that was added, it was not an option at release. One of the reasons the game has such a low completion % I think is the fact that the game was not actually possible to complete at release. The last chapter was a horrible buggy mess for months after the game came out, and quite hard as I understand it. I have 200 hours in the game, but have never finished the last chapter, partially as there would be a mandatory change to my part composition due to story events that I did not feel like dealing with at the time.

[@Flizbap]

I actually like MOST of the kingdom management stuff. My only issue with the timers is that some aren't shown; just bloody show me which quests are timed and which are not.

[@Blasted2Oblivion]

Got this one on xbone when it came out. A buggier mess I have never played. Played another game. After a couple months I tried again and with the really bad bugs fixed, I had fun. My only gripe is that there is never a point where the timer isn't ticking.

[@stoogemcduck8594]

I've been watching your WotR videos and they are great. I've actually been wanting to do an unfair run for the sake of doing one and because I enjoyed the game even though I haven't finished it before. I'm on a run atm in normal to prep for my unfair run and it's the 3rd full restart for me, not including all the chapter start reloads i did in my first playthrough. Personally, the kingdom management was enjoyable while tedious if that makes any sense. I liked the concept and it addressed one of my major gripes with old crpgs (and newer ones too i guess), like BG2, where you get a quest about a necromancer destroying a town, a dragon doing shenanigans, trolls overrunning a fort and animals running wild due to evil druids but no timings even though they all require urgent attention. I do understand people being annoyed at the kingdom management because of the tedium, the brutal combo of no information on management or progression coupled with timed events and then if you delay main quests to advance/expand your kingdom, kingdom management starts giving you events that destroy your kingdom and end your run. For me, the thing I enjoyed most about the kingdom management was that they managed to tie the story of the rpg game into the kingdom development game in a way that made sense, forced the player to make hard decisions and even if you scraped through by the skin of your teeth, you were rewarded well enough to my satisfaction. Once I realised what they did with the story and kingdom management, the tedium wore off a bit and that made me enjoy it a lot more. Admittedly, my gripes with old crpgs were probably a technological limitation with game engines back in the day so I'm not too harsh. Nowadays, I don't know how the timed events thing would go down since it was a massive issue with a lot of ppl playing Kingmaker. Other than that, I 100% agree with you. Crpgs are brutal with the lack of information and without having played so much BG2 and NWN2 when I was younger, I would have struggled mightily when playing Kingmaker. For me Kingmaker is the closest game that we've gotten to Baldur's Gate 2 and the best interpretation of the "strongholds' concept from BG2 even though kingdom management has a ton of issues. Always love finding great ppl doing videos on my favourite genres of games and your content is pretty damn good. I haven't finished Pillars 2 (though I am close), Kingmaker (which I plan to) and DoS2 (not sure I will be going back to it as yet) but you've inspired me to go back and finish other games and achievement hunt. Looking forward to your future videos!

[@Tasarran]

I just got it recently, and I love the open-world aspects of it, but I also hate the open-world aspects of it... I was moving my level 3 party around, and got into a random combat. It was revealed to be a Fire Elemental... A very hard fight at this level, but I sighed and resolved to keep a stiff upper lip. Moved to fight, and what was revealed by my first move? A BULETTE. Third level party vs a Fire Elemental and a Bulette = load saved game

[@STCSk8ers]

I think if youre not going for a 100% the kingdom mgmt is pretty fun gave me a reason to go home without wandering aimlessly. Idk it immersed me

[@harktischris]

I didn't end up liking Pathfinder, but what I will give it credit to (as a former D&D guy) is that in the process of trying to decipher character creation (which is an absolute nightmare for a Pathfinder noob *especially* if like me you wrongly assumed it's just nothing more than re-branded 3.5e D&D when in fact that are some fairly major differences), I really got into Pathfinder the TTRPG system and now I'm really into Pathfinder 2e. So there's that.

[@billyscenic5610]

Great review. I think 100% reviews should be a thing. Initial review from places like IGN are fine, but games change so much now. It's hard to judge a game cus a critical bug may have been fixed OR introduced into the game, month or years later.

[@redelephantsdotnl]

That 7% also has to do with the state of the game when it first came out. It was riddled with bugs, and there was something in the final act that would break the game, don't remember quite what it was. Probably because I am not *in* that 7%, I never beat the game either. Still, I actually *do* enjoy the Kingdom Management of it all, even though I too have had to restart entirely a handful of times due to some unseen timer somewhere. Not that that timer wasn't there, because I failed to see it. Still. Managing time, resources, planning routes and so on was this games' selling point for me. A major gripe I have with this game is the loading screens that become longer and longer the more you play. The game remembers loot on every map, and as such the save state becomes increasingly large, unstable and the load times become longer and longer. Wouldn't be much trouble on newer hardware, perhaps.

[@NurkePL]

Glad you mentioned how horrible Kingdom Management is, I always felt somewhat of a failure when I switched it to 'auto'

[@richardjecooke8036]

Thanks for this. Got it for free on Epic but if quests have timers I'll skip it. Good to know.

[@terand42]

If I dropped this game due to the Kingdom Management and hidden quest objectives should I give Wrath of the Righteous a chance or nah?

[@MortismalGaming]

So far it seems to be addressing those issues

[@exiledcowboy298]

I am playing this game in 2024 and having a lot of fun

[@mbentley6]

I like the art style of Kingmaker slightly more than I do Wrath of the Righteous. Might have to replay the game soon.

[@sergiomessias3691]

I was planning on playing this one after the wrath of the righteous, but changed my mind. I will watch your story video instead and play something else 🎉 thanks

[@gabrielhalisky3334]

I also 100% completed kingmaker with DLC’s. I feel your pain.

[@NotaVampyre111]

I loved the first half of the game. Once I got to the actual kingdom building segment I lost interest. No matter what I did, it didn't click for me.

[@kriskeen6739]

I have to admit, that being a Pathfinder player for some years before this game came out, put me at a huge advantage over any new players. A few things changed in transition to the game, but I pretty much knew the score with character creation. As for kingdom management ... *cough* ... Bag of Tricks. *cough*

[@AstarionWifey]

All I care about is how to romance the Orc lol other than that, I agree with you on the kingdom management (I'm one person and a baroness at that) so I wish they didn't load so much at me so quickly.

[@tanthonymoore]

Kingdom Management was my favorite part of this game! For context, I did one play through, finished the story and got 45% of the achievements. To be fair the Kingdom Management and quest timers might have made 100%'ing the game much more difficult and time consuming. However, I think for us normies just playing the game for fun the Kingdom Management (especially given the time crunch) provided a fun power fantasy that I'd never experienced in a CRPG before. In fact. As soon as I finished Kingmaker I looked for a sequel and discovered WOTR was running a kickstarter but when I found out WOTR wasn't going to continue with the Kingdom Management I lost interest. The rest of the game -- the party scale adventuring -- felt kind of bloated to me. I would love to see another CRPG take the Kingdom Management route.

[@DouglasBurton]

I didn't mind the timers I barely noticed most of them since time only moves when you're wandering the world map. As long as you are wandering towards the current goals felt like I had plenty of time for everything. What I did hate though was when some missions had hidden timers. Like a character asks for help and to meet them immediately. Apparently sometimes that really means immediately and if you wait a few days or weeks you fail. I also like the Kingdom management, it's typically only a handful of tasks you can do at a time, and with the amount of time those tasks take to complete you could complete a bunch of missions before needing to come back to the Kingdom management so it felt pretty secondary most of the time. It was mostly great for building new towns to rest at which saves you a lot of time when having to rest from all the adventuring. My biggest gripe was the encumbrance mechanic, that drove me up the wall the first couple of hours of playing. My characters were getting slowed down, my party was constantly getting tired and needing to rest all because I didn't realize how bad it was to even be slightly encumbered. So managing that was its own little game.

[@favillionbellarion9655]

Heres hopeing after wotr success they may remake this to have proper kingdom mechanics, less timers and same style battles, that be amazing.

[@plainluke722]

I agree with your opinion on kingdom management. Its like i really enjoy the gameplay and really just want to get stuck in, but the damn Kingdom Management is at war with my enjoyment lol

[@yan-amar]

Enjoyed the review. I have this game buried somewhere in my backlog, I'm one of the seven percent. I wonder how are the timers after all this time. Have they been made optional by a patch, or a mod maybe? Are they tied to the difficulty? I guess I'll do some research, if I ever finish the other crpgs that are on my list ^^

[@estebagustin14]

It would have been GREAT (Yeah, caps on) to make a review of the actual game and not about the story, so that you wouldn't have spoiled part of the story. ty

[@vladimirakimov4919]

Love-hate, yes, that's it. The kingdom management can be frustrating but you lose a great part of fun if avoid it. The idea of gameplay is to mix the adventuring and management in a specific pace and it worked for me. Though it indeed have heavy faults. The mechanism of unrest is not transparent and in my first run I stopped playing just because of it and returned only in 2020. I'd recommend to a new player to read some hints before starting. And if you are not familiar with DnD I recommend for the first run to find in internet some builds for you and companions and follow them. BTW turn-based fight mode is great even if time-consuming. For the difficult battles it is definitely preferable.

[@-Plot-]

Kingdom management wasn’t that bad. Would have been easier if they actually implemented the calendar since knowing the months is really important to the timer aspect. There is literally a hotkey for it that the devs just didn’t implement. Now I have played pathfinder 1st edition for around two years and therefore it was easier to get into the gam. I thought combat was very fun but pretty easy even on harder difficulties. Like crowd control spells were too op because enemy AI can’t avoid them. Character creation was my favorite part and gives you a ton of options but the optimal choices are pretty clear to veterans of the pathfinder system. Some of the dungeons were really well done, like some of the best I’ve played in games. One major problem I had was the ending, specifically the debuff that makes you roll 1s (basically % chance to roll 1 increased). I found that to be an extremely unfun and lazy mechanic to make the ending more “difficult”. It does not make the combat harder, it makes it much more grindy. I also thought that enemy selection was limited, basically reskins over and over. Considering this is pathfinder and the tabletop rpg has probably 1000 monsters in it, kingmaker was underwhelming in this aspect. And that folds into the grindy spect of the game, which it becomes once you fight the same monsters for the 20th time.

[@Mirekluk]

Sometimes I wonder how many people who come to play CRPGs are TTRPG nerds just looking to kill time between sessions. As I do really think that there are two vastly different experiences between those that play both and CRPG only. I personally think that this game tries to make love to both, and I as D&D player do find lot's of things I see people complain about (Timers for example) as something I take from granted, as in tradition of TTRPGs, making a choice and live with it, even when it's choice not to do something right now, is exactly the thing I do expect from TTRPG experience, and want in CRPG as a result. I didn't save the wizard in the lonely hut, I missed the gnome alchemist (big problem as both are treasury advisors) but I went "Well, fuck! I failed them". What I am trying to say, is that I feel most modern game struggle with meaningful choices and consequences. Even some DM's do. But this game delivers exactly that.