The Downfall of Storytelling in Call of Duty Zombies

Modern Warfare 3 Zombies is already dangerously close to breaking a tradition held for 10+ years of past Zombies maps.
Let's talk about how the Zombies story started, and the knife-edge it finds itself on today.
Please leave a like if you enjoyed the video and want more Call of Duty Zombies video essay style thinkpieces from me in future! Maybe even suggest a topic in the comments 👀
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[@jonfero8072]

As a zombies veteran I laughed out loud at how good some of your points were. You should be lead story developer lmao

[@ginger6757]

How do we make this happen ?

[@gansotonto]

I would love what he'd do but having to deal with the requirements of Microsoft/Activision/"modern gaming" would burn him out "Hey Milo this story is great, but we can't have 4 main characters because that limits the amount of skins we can sell" "Hey Milo we need you to make the story 'more accessible' for 'broader audiences'"

[@ginger6757]

@@gansotonto I understand. It wouldn't just be story ideas and world creation. Somewhere in the multiverse, activation is actually cool

[@ponttoonimies]

HIRE THE FANS!!!!!! HIRE THE FUCKING FANS!"""" FIRE THE HANS!!!

[@Nothingforever192]

@@ginger6757In that universe we get Tony Hawk’s Underground remastered sheesh.

[@Alhabeeb43]

Holding a community's hand through a simple 'Good Vs. Evil' story. A community that literally deciphers morse codes from random flashing lights and a hidden piece of paper in less than a day

[@ProdLucio]

We are the good activision is the evil

[@Hollow_AMV]

@@ProdLucio fr tho

[@wahhnopfp]

To be honest though we kinda brought that upon ourselves, though Treyarch certainly didn't help. The hardcore fans absolutely loved the easter eggs, which made them solve the puzzles faster and a sort of frenzy began. Which in turn led to Treyarch making harder ones, and then that cycle kept feeding itself until Treyarch probably saw a decline in people doing the easter eggs (or the game numbers, or zombie numbers), either due to people losing interest or the puzzles getting too hard/tedious/convoluted. So then they do a complete 180 due to losing numbers either in zombies, the game as a whole, or just specifically the easter eggs, which could also be attributed to the later game's qualities in the other areas of the game like single player or multiplayer, to be fair.

[@Giolopy]

@@ProdLuciothen playtesters must be the zombies crew fighting activisions questionable code 💀🧌💀🧌

[@primedasymmium]

I can tell Milo has started leaning more to doing videos he enjoys making rather than just focusing on what he thinks we want to see, which I hope he taps into even more Milo isn't crazy, (probably) just a fellow human being like some of us here

[@I_O246]

Milo has been killing it with his videos lately. He is single-handedly keeping the zombies community alive. This man deserves to be the official zombies community manager.

[@zenh276]

That is facts 🔥🔥

[@jordanholder]

That is facts 🔥🔥

[@Aether_Rxse]

Idk about that statement, I feel like Lex and probably Noah have been consistent with zombies content. I mean Lex basically makes zombie vids almost daily so what you said is a hot take 💀

[@zenh276]

@@Aether_Rxse yeah that’s a fair point that lex and Noah upload daily but they haven’t spoken up for the zombies community like Milo has in my opinion, don’t get me wrong they definitely have too just not to the extent that Milo has (perhaps the reason he wasn’t invited to COD next 👀 controversial opinion) and I’m not throwing shade at either lex or Noah here but they both upload reactions to zombies speed runs which feels like all the time it seems. Noah just does customs which is nice to see him supporting the community map creators don’t get me wrong. Lex’s content has gone a bit stale which is no fault of him more so there’s no new zombies content to cover and has reverted to posting EE tutorials. My point is that Milo seems like the only one calling treyarch out on their bullshit and properly going into detail and making arguments for both sides of the hardcore and casual fans while also pushing forward the fact that this new stuff doesn’t feel like zombies and more so that the hardcore round based fans are being neglected. I feel like Milo is doing the best for the zombies community rn and I think that’s what I_O246 probably means

[@I_O246]

@@Aether_Rxse they can also be community members, but Milo has been showing his honest opinions and he has been trying to hear all sides. Early on when black ops 4 was out, I could see Milo enjoying the franchise less and less but was not really having the discussion about it, he was ranting. Noah can’t really share his true opinions because he doesn’t want to lose his relationship with cod, and activision.

[@st_52erdna26]

I miss the cryptic stuff of the old story. The cyphers, the obscure EEs, the radios scattered around the map that posed new questions, etc. It feels like the new story is just babying us

[@imabipolarbear9324]

It feels so spoon fed dude. The EE is just handed to you now. It can’t even be classified as an EE anymore, there’s literally fucking objective markers!!

[@OwNAvenged]

Bring back Jimmy Zelinksi

[@imabipolarbear9324]

@@OwNAvenged hellll no.

[@OwNAvenged]

@@imabipolarbear9324 I preferred his story-telling waaaay more than anything post BO2.

[@imabipolarbear9324]

@@OwNAvenged lol he literally didn’t even know what to do with the story, said so himself with BO2. And the only two good maps from that game were both of Blundell’s. 🤣

[@alexbasha0508]

Just the downfall in general…

[@MeikaiX]

I miss when zombies was actually filled with funny characters and lots of story. Lots of the old devs left, so everyone who made what we loved is gone.

[@thearmoredman8319]

Sad but true

[@heiwaire5496]

Ain't had a good zombies experience since bo3

[@Schwacked]

Wrong

[@alexbasha0508]

@@SchwackedOk.

[@Milla4life2]

This is so sentimental man. So much time spent watching zombies theories, even tried my hand at some. This is a true walk down memory lane, I feel like I’m at my mommas house again, even though I’m in my apartment and she’s been gone for one year now. Thank you Milo for continuing to do what you do.

[@zenh276]

You put it into the best words possible, the zombies community is so lucky to have big voices like yourself to speak up for it and actually be talking the most sense. Keep up the great uploads Milo 🔥

[@bryzombie]

I would love to see a new zombies storyline in the future but the aether story will always be the best!

[@Lynch2507]

if Treyarch had just given Aether its proper finish by allowing BO4 to be all aether and then brought Chaos in later, we would've been probably approaching the Revelations equivalent of that storyline if not a new one all together

[@letubbzy4103]

I would love the chaos story to continue as originally promised 💀

[@EinsNiemand]

@@letubbzy4103 same but it feels like people who actually want that to happen are in the minority so I think it'll likely never happen

[@badcatgames783]

​@@EinsNiemand"minority" Most of the people don't care about the new storyline or don't care anymore about zombies at all. From what i've seen, at least half of the people who actually love zombies still, wants Chaos back. The actual problem is that the people who originally worked on Chaos doesn't work at Treyarch anymore so that's a bummer.

[@Schwacked]

@@Lynch2507 aether got its proper finish with tag der toten.

[@Disphotic9282]

This might get a bit abstract but bear with me. Essay incoming… Environmental storytelling was utilized a great amount in the earlier zombies. I think it's interesting how a shocking amount of writers or directors think you need to tell people everything. I think personally the reason there's so much telling instead of showing nowadays is linked to propaganda and how these things are made (they are also not viewed as art pieces but products) but also lack of faith in the audiences intelligence or just plain conceitedness in their own intelligence. Part of the fun of being a reader, player, or audience is putting pieces together. Not to mention it feels more organic that way instead of having exposition dumps, even if exposition can be a valid tool if used properly. Zombies alludes to many things and actually rewards exploration and player curiosity. Basically the mode rewards you for using your brain which is an amazing irony in a mode about zombies. The storyline was also great and tackled many heavy themes, and even if it seemed like some schizo stuff, it amazingly had historical backing. I don't know about you, but the stuff I learned about the nazi regime from researching stuff due to zombies was way more interesting then anything I learned back in high school. Like the Vril-ya, Die Glocke, the Black Sun, Argartha, Wonder Weapons, the search for ancient artifacts. It seems like some wacko conspiracy stuff but a lot of it is real. And I believe it ties into what zombies really got right. It married myth and history. It leaned more into myth and fantasy later on, mostly departing from the horror mad scientist vibe, in turn becoming less grounded, which some people didn't like but I'd argue with the help of the occult references it was always there as an undertow. The existential horror was residually still there but instead it tackled existential themes with various references to mythology. I think it also reveals the genius of zombies in a way. Inevitably in its depth and existential stakes you find mythological and religious themes in its narrative. The zombie itself can be seen as a metaphor for a nihilistic person. I think it's why the idea of zombies has made a resurgence in recent years. But the symbolism in zombies inevitably emerges. And I think it may even make the claim that mythology applies to general history. Which is why I think zombies transcends simple militaristic narratives in most Call Of Duty's. But a basic gestalt is there is an underlying hidden order in the chaos… Which I think people loved to explore and is true for many aspects of life. And maybe it even revealed a profound meaning that emerged from the chaos of the narrative. Another problem with modern zombies is a feel like the characters are not memorable. But let's be honest, will the old characters ever be topped? Probably not. But old Treyarch did a fantastic job of making us interested or invested in characters in one off maps. I'd say Mob Of The Dead comes to mind (Victus is a mixed bag). Also an underrated point is difficulty. People weren't great back then since we were all new players, but the round counter was a measurement of skill and the natural inclination of many players to get better was there, whether to get to a higher round for egoic boasting or just the satisfaction of growing in skill. Not to mention, the small RNG aspects of the mode that give it replayability, and the satisfying growth in strength as a player alongside the increasing demand of the strength and ferocity of the zombies. All of it was a recipe for a masterpiece. I feel like with this new mode it doesn't do any of that. If you enjoy it and have fun with it, more power to you. But to me, its just more generic, bland, and boring. Admittedly, I haven't played anything past BO4. But instead of moving on in a different direction they cling to the past to cash in on nostalgia and their old golden egg. Do the mystery box or wall Weapons make sense thematically anymore? Is that really all the veteran players mean to them? They want to catch lightning in a bottle again, and I would honestly go so far as to say without understanding what made zombies so great. They're kicking a soulless dead corpse that won't reanimate… A song comes to mind. You know the line lmfao.

[@BoogerBoy1027]

K.

[@Disphotic9282]

@@BoogerBoy1027 u rite

[@panzershreck8077]

What a great breakdown of the mode mate, I don't think I could've explained to any other person on some forum like the cod zombies reddit where people are defending this modern day slop they call a "video game" lol. The 2 biggest and most simplest things to me that matter in cod zombies was 1. Passion, this is the most important aspect to me, it doesn't have to be the most amazing story line or mythology or historical connections of the mode to real life, but something where it feels like the devs genuinely TRIED to make something new and innovative, for example IW zombies. I know alot of people didn't like it when it released especially during bo3 craze ( me included ). But after deciding to play all the dlc's/ zombie maps for the game I loved it. It didn't have any sort of storyline or deep meaning that the treyarch games had, but uk what it did have? Charm and passion for creativity in their map design and gameplay. I just don't understand how anyone can look at mw3 zombies and can't see that the mode is a glorified XP weapon grinder with the most bare minimum effort put in, THE MAP IS LITERALLY PORTED OVER FROM FUCKIN WARZONE LIKE COME FUCKIN ON. And for the 2nd most important thing in cod zombies? It's what you said near the end a 'challenge'. I absolutely hate everything about cold war zombies and everything onwards it's a complete fuckin joke of a mode that can be played by brain dead toddlers with dyslexia. The lack of any challenge whatsoever is what disappoints me the most, even bo3 makes me pissed off with how easy it is to survive (bo4 included), BUT uk what these 2 games are really good at? Their easter eggs for dedicated players and those always give me a great challenge and tons of replayability. It's the reason why bo1 has out of nowhere become one of my favourite cod games for zombies BECAUSE of it's incredibly hard round difficulty trying to survive despite not having very good easter egg runs. But challenge isn't just dying out in cod it's dying everywhere in the online video game atmosphere. For example one of my most played games of all time Destiny1/ 2. Destiny 1 had been one of my most favorite games of all time despite lacking content on release and it's 'questionable' releases of cut out content in the dlc's because it GAVE ME A CHALLENGE and what did I get for completing the hardest modes in the game? exclusive armour and weapons and all kinds of good loot. Destiny 2 has absolutely killed rewarding good players for doing anything that requires more than a minimum 10 IQ. Master raids? why do that when u can get all the gear from doing the normal version of the raid ur not missing anything from not doing the master version. Master dungeons to get the best min/max armour in the game? No point pay 10 dollars for the season and play most braindead easy activities to instantly get the best armour in the game.

[@SocksFCGameArchives]

Honestly yeah, Cold War Zombies feels like I'm only playing to get camos on one gun at a time, feeling like a chore more than an actual experience in a world of conspiracy and fantasy

[@Disphotic9282]

@socksfc4162 Some people like the grind, which fair enough. But to me, if I'm going to grind, I need to enjoy the game. It has to have a meaning more than just for the sake of the grind. I think BO3 did an okay job on progression. Red Hex was a cool camo. The other camos weren't great, though. Except for the Pack-a-Punch camos which became available later- those were fuckin' awesome. You could do Gobblegum loadouts which fit thematically and were a nice addition if admittedly some were a little broken. But it was fun. And you could earn Liquid Divinium pretty easily to get stuff, and the best part is the Gumballs weren't required to play. Overall it wasn't incredible, but it was something neat. Now it's just a grocery list. Endless tasks. It's just fast food gaming. Rehashed and uninspired and sometimes with the cherry on top being paid progression.

[@HDBeltran92]

for me, it went downhill when the apothicons were brought in. All the conspiracy stuff and real world events like the great leap forward made it juicy. It was a great time :)

[@JustinSimoneau]

So the downfall is bo3?

[@clevername4188]

Would you say that aliens don't fit in zombies?

[@CAMAKA101]

I actually agree a lot with this, I just lost interest when it went from gritty, grungy horror with alien scifi elements to "epic heroic" stuff + dragons

[@HDBeltran92]

​@pet_silencieu115 when it comes to the story yes. The game itself was still fun to play but without a good story it sadly became an arcade game to me

[@starryyynightzzz4691]

same, I feel like the horror creepy aspect was dropped a lot in bo3, which I continue to miss even now. Still love to play zombies just miss that old time scary feel yk

[@temple1997_]

You know, you make an excellent point about the whole "zombies being something completely alien, something completely unexpected" thing. The more I think about it, the more I realize just how DIFFERENT zombies was to the campaigns and multiplayers - and how much we needed that. The campaigns were fantastic and the multiplayer was always a ton of fun too, but there was just something about zombies that was so different and off the rails when compared to the rest of the Call of Duty content that made it so special.

[@iiambasicz8111]

It’s so damn awesome just hearing Milo’s passion for Zombies. Feels like the BO3-4 days

[@MrAjking808]

lol y’all sound like bots

[@iiambasicz8111]

@@MrAjking808 Ya mum

[@saveyourhero3307]

BO3 was peak zombies. I miss those days 2015-2016

[@Shirohige4yonko]

BO3 was the last time I played zombies with passion. Anything after that I didn't feel like investing the time.

[@Boobiebumpp]

@@saveyourhero3307 wasn't a huge fan of the BO3. I liked it but just dealing with all the secret shit was frustrating.

[@BlackxOpsxSoldiers]

The piece at the end about the storytelling went crazy and really is a microcosm of the entire storytelling strategy at large since cold war began.

[@SlickSF]

Very well said! The way that info is given instead of left as a mystery takes away from the player's experience in the end

[@MajorPayne2319]

Milo man, i gotta say how nice it is to see your videos popping up so much recently, I grew up with your channel and i'm really digging your new video style, feels like my own personally tailored podcast.

[@lordofthebuckets2676]

People grew so accustomed to full on opening cutscenes for maps but I do love and miss the days of the comic book style loading screens for maps like Nuketown, Moon, Ascension, even Buried. This left it up to you to try and decipher what you think the meaning of it was. A lot of times you don’t even know in Black Ops 1 why our characters are here on this map.

[@itsyahboy2000]

Milo is speaking on the behalf of a lot of us tbh

[@MrRoflWaffles]

trying to make sure our voices are heard! 🙏

[@tHe_ZoU_cReW]

This is definitely my position

[@gordogonk8068]

just wanna say i love the type of content you have been putting out lately.

[@apologetic2195]

I felt this, homie just brought me back to the good old days when I didn’t know a thing about zombies but still trying to understand the story as to why they exist. It was a fun mystery and experience.

[@troutwithfingers]

a new mrroflwaffles era has begun and im loving it

[@MrLumberjackz]

This is why the best zombies EE came from BLOPS1 and 2, after that they leaned way too hard being vague and cryptic where for me i couldnt figure out most easter eggs ever on my own. A nice mix of fun challenge with rewarding story bits or powerups or changes in the map

[@jakegarbani7777]

Cool to see you play the old zombies maps again, would love to see more!

[@ado3607]

I started playing zombies heavily in BO3, and what kept me in that game was the mystery of the story and the zombies community passion towards finding out what was going on. I wasn't even that deep into the story like Milo was, but it was still interesting to load into a game and do the Easter egg, progressing through the story each map. In Gorod , when Dr. Monty revealed himself, I lost my shit cause I personally didn't see it coming and we only had 1 map left, and so many questions to be answered. These things are what makes the maps so amazing and interesting. If you look at fan favorite maps like Origins, Mob, or Shadows, there all great lore wise. Yeah, they might have the most fun gameplay, but the story aspects are what truly makes those maps amazing. At the end of Origins, where the Samantha and Eddie cutscene happens and you see the characters as dolls, that shit blows your mind and keeps you thinking. Hope we can get something like that again!

[@obi-wanjabronii]

This is the only element of Zombies that made me infatuated. I'm a filmmaker and have seen a lot of stuff, nothing in media has ever resonated or fascinated me like the decade of Zombie story-building. The ever evolving premise, characters and world hasn't been reached by any other format of media imo. This is why one day I believe it has a chance to be one of the most successful TV shows of all time, but even a long running series would comparatively be a movie to the book that Zombies is.

[@amazing_imp1698]

Loved hearing him talk about loving the flame thrower and then immediately cutting to the round end screen 😭

[@HHHbyRRR]

I remember reading Reddit post after Reddit post about the mountains on Shangri la. Those were the days.

[@timtimgregg]

Old zombies maps always felt like there was so much more outside of the map. I loved exploring and imagining what was beyond the barriers

[@PriestlyBlock67]

Storytelling shouldn't have been so obvious and in your face when it comes to zombies, it's what defined the mode

[@looper4340]

Salty

[@Bradley22449]

The great thing about the way the zombies story use to be told is that it scratches the same itch as Analog Horror. Piecing together story and lore based on environmental story telling, puzzles and ciphers was always the most fun way to receive and interact with the story and characters. Basically leaving us to figure it out rather than just giving it to us.

[@murco_]

learned so many tidbits about der riese from this vid like the zombie hazard sign. pls make more like this on other maps

[@mrgadd]

Bruh, HOW MANY VIDEOS. IS THIS EARLY CHRISTMAS!?

[@Cloudiroth462]

Facts! I also want to say that while I hated Ghosts... but the Alien mode really gelt like unique classic zombies.

[@justineverett5273]

I’ve always loved how detailed and well spoken Milo is at explaining the zombies storyline, even way back 10 years ago

[@masterbeta1089]

the bags under milo’s eyes deepen every mw3 video he makes

[@ThatsMySkill]

im the most interested in stories that make me question things. i want the story to give me bits and pieces so that i can put them together myself. thats why i like from software games so much. explaining why when and where like this dude did in that reveal was bad cause it takes away any interest ive had in the mode. the best stories are the ones that create more questions than they answer. its an important thing to make your fanbase actively interact with each other to find a common ground on those things. thats the main reason the zombies community got so passionate in the first place. cause blundell knew what to say and what to keep secret. from software games are so vague in storytelling that all the things you hear around the world surrounding god like beings and higher purposes feel like legends, myths and folktales that could actually be true. it increases the believability by a factor of 100 in comparison to games that just straight up tell you how it is. vagueness is one of the best tools in storytelling but its sadly not used very often.

[@thimbletoe]

I loved the early style of zombies so much, mainly gameplay that anyone can enjoy, with enough actual "easter eggs" and story hints through map design and character dialogue for people who wanted to speculate about what the story could be. I really feel like it lost its way around CotD where the EE turned into the "main quest" and the mystery started to get lost

[@rikkietoffen4216]

man milo really is pumping out these great videos lately

[@n_dinardo01]

I had this video on in the background while doing other things, and all I gotta say is you voiced my thoughts and opinions perfectly. I feel like us og players are no longer the main focus and that is just a bummer

[@cmdxx]

i just love der reise, the atmosphere, lore, pap, its all so good

[@NathanSylbreon]

I love that he now kinda along with with his normal guides just throws shade at modern zombies

[@NoobeyGaming]

I thought the video was going to go in a different direction with talking more about the internal stuff within the game and game world only from the title name compared to the video which included a lot of the external things with Jason Blundell and Cod Next. However I still agree with a majority of what was said. Externally away from the game, I don't feel like there's much mystery going into MWIII as answers were questioned and did feel talked down to a little. I never really thought about how other audiences would see that information and just assumed it benefited them without really thinking about it. Internally in game , I'm not a fan of the "new" direction of learning stuff in lore. Yes I love the Intel/Notes system but man make 4 operators (similar to WWII) have actual Zombies Dialogue that can have interactive conversations and talk to us. I'd love the interactions in Blood of the Dead between Primis about there emotions and thoughts. I'm someone who has a pretty strong imagination and so I love putting myself if possible in the characters shoes in situations because it makes myself feel more emerged into the game world. In Cold War even with the notes, I couldn't get emerged into that game world because the interactions of what was happening were with Weaver, Dr Grey etc. all of which weren't me as the character and all of which aren't physically dealing with the danger of the game world. I love going back to Ancient Evil and putting myself in the shoes of a member of the Chaos Crew and work out what I'd be feeling and doing after the end of the main quest EE. Even still in Ancient Evil, I may learn a little new thing here and there from a conversation between characters. Do I think storytelling is "dead" in zombies. Of course not. I'm just not as emerged into it and therefore my interest isn't there as much. That's why when at CoD Next, when I felt like I had no real story interest besides the Weaver Situation and I only cared for the gameplay aspect. Sorry if this doesn't make sense or waffles too much. It's Midnight when this got released and I'm tired lmao

[@FlareBlitzed]

The genius of the COD Zombies storytelling back in the day of WaW & BO1 (kinda lost going into BO2), was that the story was delivered in breadcrumbs here and there throughout all of the maps that we have played. Being given an objective through a radio rather than just observing the space and putting together an objective through your own observations was part of how the storytelling started the crumble. The breadcrumbs in Verruckt, Shi No Numa, Der Riese, Kino Der Toten, etc was what made the storytelling in COD Zombies so unique and intriguing, it was not handed out to you on a silver platter and many different theories can be made about the story from those breadcrumbs was something back in the day truly special! Modern Zombies just gives the story to you through conversations with minimal environmental cues.

[@aggressivefox454]

Something I loved about the zelinsky maps in bo2 is that they had an amazing story going on in the background with the radios and the flesh and stuhlinger etc. it was so cool and felt like waw again

[@KooFsWing]

you have been on fire with the daily uploads thanks milo

[@SteelKreel]

Everyone praises FromSoft’s storytelling in games like Dark Souls and Elden Ring for being so groundbreaking and different. I personally first experienced that type of storytelling in WaW zombies and it was amazing. It was so mysterious and all the community theory crafting was great to follow. I miss it

[@danny0288]

I remember, looking up story videos for world at war zombies and all the videos were spooky music and images with texts on them. Yet it was one of the more frightening things when growing up. But it was also super fun to learn about the story and that’s partially why we stuck with it for so long in my friend group!

[@justinkyp]

i still remember how insane the reveal for the bo3 campaign story was and how little information we were given. audio clips, pictures, etc, but none of it made sense and we had to piece everything together ourselves sort of like a scavenger hunt of information, and it was probably the last time i was invested in a cod game because of how good the marketing was. cold war was a little bit like it but still didn't really get me as excited. this though, with how complicated the story is and being spoon-fed information, there's no mystery and there's no enticement to actually try to figure things out on your own; and zombies felt like a mode where you were trying to piece bits of information together while simply trying to survive but it hasn't felt like that for so long

[@arcticbreeze7524]

something that i really wish you got into, was Dark Aether Zombies being 100% canon to the events of Modern Warfare and Black Ops Campaigns now. I liked this at first but now that i've thought about it more, Zombies will never have that hard hitting storytelling that affects the world again, something as big as blowing up the Earth in Bo1, or Apothicons invading and destroying worlds in Bo3 can't happen anymore because TF141 need to go on there boring adventures in middle east and they can't do that if the there's a global outbreak of zombies. I fear all zombies will be moving forward will be very small outbreaks like we see in MWIII or Cold War, with the entire outbreak being resolved within that map, and that just sound so boring to me. I know i'm in the minority here but I really am not excited for the future of the mode i grew up loving anymore.

[@AnimeGuy246]

outbreak is our great war story line 😢

[@MayoForBrains]

The BO1 & 2 events were the playground for so much storytelling. You could genuinely take any place on earth and build up a fully original map with unique crews and objectives. Also no interdimensional galactical alien space war.

[@TheLyosacks]

I used to do these CoD Zombies animated videos just out of pure love for the storytelling methods Treyarch followed and how much room they left for our imaginations. The surface level was always the story of soldiers from WWII and, at the bottom of the iceberg, you had all of these occult elements like the Vrill, Illuminati, etc. I genuinely think someone should do a CoD Zombies remake that is a lot more focused and back to basics. I miss the old days when this franchise inspired me like it did.

[@colbyvi]

i love this video so much i was 5 years old when world at war came out, and never have played the og maps directly from that game. i grew up on bo2, bo3, and bo4, getting addicted to each game, and fell in love with EEs, wonder weapon quests, and the complexity of zombies. This has always made me disregard the og maps as just simple stepping stones with little value to me, but this video has made me appreciate the game design and thought of the early maps like der riese. Since cold war, zombies has felt bland, soulless, and uninspired, and it makes me SO sad. Im not sure if we will ever get a zombie experience again that even comes close to the quality of black ops 4. Like you described, zombies provided such a foreign and mystical experience that contrasted against the MP, but now zombies feels just as straightforward and linear as a normal MP experience. Call of duty zombies, (especially black ops 1-4) was such a magical adventure with each new map, and i hope one day treyarch can recapture that magic.

[@BigHomieGayAss1917]

I was alive to play World at War zombies from the start and there was literally no talking or explanation of anything in the maps outside of what you would discover or hear from other players theorizing. Part of the fun of 2009-2010 was that a lot of people agreed on the essential story of WaW zombies, but outside of the few established facts, people’s opinions varied wildly on the ancillary details. There is so much mystery that is now gone nowadays, and part of the fun of WW2 zombies or Cold War was the fact we had little idea of what was going on outside of the broad details. I agree very much with the video, keep it up

[@StevenChet]

This is a really important video, I hope zombies can recover but i'm not so sure anymore. Glad that you still care!

[@dismal-26]

34:40 This is why Cold War succeeded so well. That easter egg build up for the launch was some of, if not the best marketing COD has ever had. It got the attentions of new and old players, getting us curious and intrigued about the story. This is especially true after the Bo4 ending, if they could've done something like this for MW3 it 100% would've made fans more excited (even without round based) because of vanguard.

[@jacobmorgan6660]

As someone who has pretty much stepped away from call of duty and the zombies story for a while, seeing the COD Next event play out and literally watching them break the first rule of narrative storytelling (show don't tell) by just explaining everything away is so jarring and bizarre. Like how on earth is this not talked about as "hey we can probably have some cool easter eggs explaining how he's alive!" but is instead just seen as a way to force feed us story. They really need to remember that the mystery and intrigue is what brought us all here in the first place, and seriously LET US EXPLORE AND FIGURE OUT THE STORY ON OUR OWN!!

[@JoWubbGaming]

Really strong takes on the story and progress of zombies over the years. I always loved zombies far more than multi or campaign. Thanks for being the voice for the community Milo. Please listen to him 3arch. We need a standalone or just overall GOOD zombies to keep us caring in the future.

[@2kdavv]

good vid Milo this is exactly how I feel about zombies, I’ve got ZERO interest in BUYING MW3 but I might see what’s going on every now and then but zombies being boiled down to “I am a disembodied voice, I need your help so I will tell you exactly what to do step by step” process rather than a puzzle to figure out like through riddles and codes and stuff makes me disinterested. It doesn’t really leave room for replay-ability either, which is another thing that makes me stay away from newer zombies modes. Also it’s good not to be the only one who noticed how different the experience between early maps and figuring them out and the most recent maps, so stark the contrast.

[@SoldierX-Gamer]

I never open that door top of stairs in furnace room till rd 30+ as thompson room is a good training area

[@TecraX2]

10:22 - Perfect illustration of a situation that made all but the most dedicated players lose interest in Zombies...

[@bigmanjosh1726]

Fosho, to be honest Milos been doing alot to speak up for the community which I really appreciate

[@mrwizard2137]

I couldn't agree with Milo more. Another point is that with Cold War, waiting for the next map, I wasn't excited because I thought about how the story would unfold, I was excited because I got another map to play. The speculation is fun, watching theory vids and coming up with your own was amazing. In CW, we literally knew what was gonna happen in the next map before it even came out. I like seeing a new map for the first time and exploring it, trying to map it out as I go, and finding map features. I'm really hoping in the 2024 title, we get originality, an old school formula (round based, great atmosphere, mystery, etc.) and no more of the spoon feeding. Also the point of make us ask questions instead of giving us answers, that is what we need. We need a zombies that challenges us, provokes thought, and makes us work for the story telling so we can have more fun and a more pleasurable experience to spark back that love for the game

[@WeekndWarriorrr]

What's crazy is us veterans will literally except almost anything story wise if the mystery is there and the gameplay is good. Proof is in the fact we accepted the multiverse idea and even leaned into it ourselves. It's such a hard thing to mess up and they have done it consistently.

[@xConr.]

I remember Milo replying "you right!" to my tweet about the hardest EE (cos he forgot that moon existed, i would repress any memory of running that map too) and it hit me, finally that, it "sucks" from a nostalgia view what zombies is now but Fucking hell we had some amazing times, Milo doing his degree and also doing EE Guides I wont say the term, but we know exactly how much nonsense was involved His fitness arc, his time away. NoahJ, Lex, all the boys Probably get so many similar comments but, as one person in the massive community that is Zombies Thank you, for everything MrRoflWaffles

[@IWolfless]

Crazy how much this video holds up after that disaterous Liberty Falls reveal

[@demonz4733]

This absolutely covers all my issues with the new story. It feels so hand fed to the point where during cold war a lot of the time when I was thinking of these questions I would have in the back of my mind I would think 'oh the intel probably answers that' and never even both interacting with the theory side of the community. I love watching theory videos myself and when the storyline boils down to read read read read read to get all the answers to all my questions it's not really enjoyable.

[@shikulli]

I would talk about zombies at school all the time. My mom got a call home once that I was talking excitedly about guns at school and I couldn't think of what it would relate to... Until I realized I was talking about upgrading your guns in pack a punch. That didn't help my case and I got it taken away but I would have my friends bring me info about the map so I could draw up a diagram of all of it

[@SunnyDEElight]

Hit the nail, this is why I rank bo1 zombies so highly, it was a great push above WaW, but it still had that ‘mystery’ to it. You had to figure everything out yourself, no buttons, no handouts, no clues. Sadly it’ll never go back to this, they’re so far deep into the lore instead of the story and journey, but I still like it for what it is.

[@Larrysleft4deadagain]

I am currently trying to make my own FPS zombies extraction looter shooter on Unreal Engine and videos like this that explore game design and storytelling is very enlightening.

[@duck7642]

back in the day (bo1s year release) zombies was the perfect fix for 6 y/o me’s fps fix. i couldn’t pub stomp in mp but man as a little kid i carried more than plenty of my weight in zombies it was so fun to just mindlessly play.

[@RyanStandring]

hey milo can we get a current zombies story so we can follow even if we are unsure mw3 zombies is connected but i would love to just see the whole story and cutscenes to show the progression of the current zombies to lead into mw3 please :D

[@GriffBall40]

you summed it up perfectly.. I liked COD, I LOVED Zombies, Topping the leaderboard for highest round amount your friends was all we talked about at school.

[@DogThroat]

This is such a nostalgic video for so many reasons if it was just a voice over commentary I'd be back in 2009

[@riley1082]

questions not answers is the perfect way to put it!

[@walmartman31]

I totally agree what got me playing zombies was my friends in school pulling me into a game and us discovering new questions w/ every detail. I love that speculation and the devs seems to completely ignore that part. Zombies without that speculation and mystery is a single dimension game that only has a few free hours a replay ability.

[@spire259]

I love what you are bringing up! I am a huge zombies fan and still am playing BO3 every chance I can. BO1, 2, 3, and 4 are all super strong zombie games in my opinion. So good to talk about things that have changed which aren't for the better. I miss the cryptic storytelling in the older games.

[@Treyarchblows]

The whole reason zombies was interesting and intriguing was the mystery and ambiguity it came with. The main goal was obviously to kill zombies and survive but the mystery of an easter egg or different story clues around the map is what made it cool. Hopefully Treyarch will listen to the ideas you have and take the zombies community seriously

[@Njea90]

Thank you Milo for speaking out, everything you said was SPOT ON!

[@AllXllA]

Kinda feels like they watched your vid and used some of your pointers for BO6. I mean, apart from some minor details, we don't know shit about BO6 zombies' story, and that's awesome!

[@Wehttam96]

I’ll never understand why a publisher like treyarch wouldn’t get direct ideas and feedback from popular creators like Milo. Milo has such a good grasp of the story and would be great to help bring ideas that they never thought about to light.

[@CritHitChance]

Zombies story went south at origins. As soon as it became multiversal it went from horroresque to sci-fi convoluted retcon world. Then at Cold War when they merged the OG campaign with zombies it was irreversibly ruined. I don’t think anyone was asking for masons timeline to fuse with the zombies timeline. I was here for the over the top characters in a twisted cryptic nazi plot but once it was aliens and dimensions and shit it lost all of its charm. Especially once it was objectives and cut scenes rather than notes and radios. Less is more in this game mode for sure

[@f.prince6642]

31:00 😂 love you my guy. Thanks for always keeping it real. This was obviously the best part gotta watch til the end comment sleuths.

[@Itsumi456]

I feel personally the death of storytelling is like this: BO1-4 EE: The story is intricately tied into and progressed through the Easter Egg in such a fashion that finding more of the story by succeeding in challenging steps is a reward in its own sense as it doesn't baby the player in the slightest and leaves so much to the player without handholding. Vanguard zombies: FIND THE GREEN MACHINE

[@kyledegroot14]

it's the same reason why they show the end of a movie in the first 2 minutes people don't have the patience to let a story develop as the go along

[@TheFoxStalksHisPrey]

Bro's content soothes my childhood soul.

[@Brodman2k]

I never played the older COD zombies because my parents were super strict (a decade ago) about me playing violent video games and how it would "effect" me. However, I did watch you and many others (secretly) play zombies and talk about the theories and mysteries about the story. But having played the more recent zombies games (Cold War mostly. Played VG:Z, but never did the EEs), it does have a hand-holding kind of gameplay loop and I'd prefer to be inquisitive about the zombies, how they came to be, who the enemies (outside of the zombies) are working on, etc. I do hope that this year of zombies has a good gameplay loop and what have you

[@owenking1499]

I'm reminded of the Chaos story: Who is the High Priest of Chaos? What are the sentinel artifactsb& trials? What happened to Alistair? What's the deal with the scepter of ra resurrecting people and placing them under the control of the cult of Chaos? What's the significance of the 4 elements and alchemy?

[@CrNcHyFROG5]

God, I miss how much the maps made you WANT to learn the story. You felt legitimately mystified and curious over what was going on. Cryptic, somewhat grounded and minimalistic while being deep when looked into properly!

[@nathanswitala7208]

what i miss most about zombies we lost over the years is how simple it was, while still being challenging to get to higher rounds.

[@TemariTheKid]

Warzone kinda killed our story telling, that and Jimmy Z and blundell had 2 different approaches

[@dirt481]

I remember getting out of class, going to a friends house and scrolling random theory websites and watching random KZbin videos to figure out the original story. Falling for so many fake Easter egg videos and being so excited when milo or dalek uploaded a new video. I would love to go back to those times but the players base was also so different, maybe one day! (Also shout out to GoldenBoy, dude is awesome)

[@Aigis31]

To be fair, media literacy IS pretty dead recently, especially on social media. There is no room for nuance. No room for interpretation. Only the surface level. It sucks but it's the truth.

[@ItsNifer]

Been absolutely loving these cut-commentary videos of milo just gaming. Keep this up please!

[@weirdpath5481]

This Milo comeback is getting me haaaaarrrdddd

[@grimgrim6490]

"I was just a sucker for the tommy." - Milo 2023😂😂😂😂

[@Funkiotologist]

I was a teenager through the lifecycle of BO3 and recently bought the BO DLC. That game scared me so badly as a kid and was so hard, going back it’s been an absolutely beautiful and phenomenal experience, I’ve always loved how the story has soft hints to the campaign like Nova gas and obviously FIVE. It has the perfect mix of creepy eeriness and environmental storytelling

[@sugarcombfilms3467]

Modern zombies devs feel like they're waiting for you to finish the map so they can ask: "So.... what did you think of the story?" Classic zombies devs felt like they'd go: "Wait, you figured out the story? No way, that's awesome." Somewhere within BO2-BO3, and definitely by the end of BO3, it felt less like we were playing within a world and more like we were playing through a story.

[@Chrisey96.]

When BO4 came out I just imagined the writers who have ended the zombie storyline on three different occasions just going "I don't know...eeerrr... Nikolai? Yeah he'll save the day, he's the chosen one now. Yeah that'll do" that's genuinely what it felt like with how little sense it made at the end.

[@cranep.s.7701]

At this point, I feel like I just started doing a degree in "Storytelling in CoD Zombies". 😆

[@jmoreno6150]

I was 12 when I first played COD Zombies (Five in BO1). I am 24 now, with a degree, a masters, a job, a whole different life. Zombies simply could not keep up with my life, it became outdated.