MY BEST SPORTS CARD PURCHASES EVER! 📈

[@PackmanCards]

WHAT ARE SOME OF YOUR BEST SPORTS CARD PURCHASES EVER? My worst sports card purchases: kzbin.info/www/bejne/sHTMnH9mgpugr7M ▶️THE GIANNIS ROOKIE CHASE GIVEAWAY WINNER IS POSTED ON MY IGTV AND THE KZbin COMMUNITY TAB 🚨Follow me on Instagram for exclusive info & early news: instagram.com/packmancards instagram.com/packmanbreaks instagram.com/packmeetsworld 🚨Join our community of collectors on Discord: discord.gg/XzwBYMD2fY 🚨Check out my new Twitch/gaming channels: www.twitch.tv/packmanbutgaming kzbin.info/door/5C2LmagAfjGY6drzeSBrmg Link to my site for group breaks: packmansportscards.com/collections/all Check out my second channel for group breaks: KZbin.com/c/packmanbreaks

[@Italiag1]

Can’t find who won Giannis

[@alejandrowright3887]

Also my lcs gifted me a free kobe rookie PSA 9.5 from upper deck

[@dollarbindan2291]

Awesome cards. I also found a Kawhi 2012 Prizm in a dollar box back in like 2014. Going through my boxes last summer I realized how much it was worth and sold mine raw for $1200 alongside a 2012 Prizm Lebron and Kobe which came from the same dollar box.

[@michaelmanyak8778]

Do a worst buys video please itd be cool to see the contrast, big fan also!

[@colescardsandcollectibles8796]

I found a Tom Brady card in a box for $2 and sold it back to the same guy for $100

[@matthewboyle9571]

Ik this would take a long time but u could break it up into multiple episodes, it would be really cool to see a full collection video

[@Playlistofshi]

I got the same Luka for $25 at my LCS. While I was buying the card, he laughed at me and said this man is just on a hot streak and will cool off soon. He was very wrong

[@philhalbig6148]

Always nice when the shop owner laughs at you for supporting their business 🙄

[@Rgnotown]

Wow a luka rc refractor for 25. I got a base luka for 9 bucks. Times have def changed lol

[@noahthompson8908]

LOL now YOU GET THE LAST LAUGH

[@sphon5905]

@@Rgnotown fax in the vid he was saying blaster box for 13 dollars

[@Doseggies]

Your point on why you prefer BGS vs PSA is exactly why i prefer BGS. Subgrades really make a difference to me and give you(the consumer) a little more of an idea of why the grade is what it is.

[@richiehinojosa3318]

Best card I’ve purchased recently was a numbered Brady Optic contenders for $40 that’s now selling for about $150-$200 raw. Also bought a Topps soccer blaster pulled a CR7 /299 which was pretty cool

[@RickM23]

My Best Buy: Kobe, Lebron, KD rookie cards back in 2010-11. Bought 100s of their rookie cards. We’re selling $1-2@ for Topps, Fleer. The higher end cards during the time were Topps Chrome and Topps Finest were selling at $20. I kept the cards and quit the hobby for almost a decade then came back 2019 (Luka year).

[@thedrawinggoat3366]

That kawhi is nice, my best purchase was a giannis prestige rookie I found at a thrift store for $1.50, the condition isn’t the best but definitely my best purchase

[@frozenllama7830]

That’s insane lol

[@bear570]

Wow congrats

[@HWproductions]

That is pretty cool, recently I bought a Warren Sapp rookie and a chad Johnson rookie at at thrift store as well

[@wedo9932]

That's amazing

[@cmorrow0231]

I recently bought an 84 Star MJ at a local show - BGS 6.5 with solid subs - paid $650 for it - flipped on ebay for $3700 less than 2 weeks later - easily my best pickup. Also have a Jokic Prizm silver RC at PSA currently - thinking it will be a 10 - I paid $100 for it a little over a year ago - easily a 3k card now...BANGERS! Also - that Mahomes bronze star auto just went for 21k in a BGS 9.5 - That is an INCREDIBLE card man

[@PackmanCards]

Awesome congrats! Saw the mahomes sale recently. Love to see it!

[@JEWebb-hp6eb]

By far the best card buy was an $8 Mahomes Prizm. Graded and PSA 9. To say the least getting $1,900 for it was a good deal. Oh and still have one I got for $20. The best wax, still have in closet, 2019-20 Prizm Gravity Feed Box. Paid $105 for it.

[@3BrothersCards]

My best purchase was actually at The National this year! Stumbled onto a guy selling a Tua Origins #1/5 (Jersey Match) Green Ink Auto PSA 10! The guy had a sticker on it for $900, which I thought was low, and I offered $750. He immediately accepted. It's a Pop 1, but the /25 Auto PSA 10(non jersey match) brought $2500! Probably a $3000-$4000 card! Tua is my PC though, so it's staying in my hands!

[@PackmanCards]

Congrats on the pickup!! 🔥

[@robivaartnou1647]

I bought Lebron Bazooka RC for 15$ in 2018 and graded it for 25$(Got PSA 10). Sold it in April this year for little over 10k, my biggest ROI in this game.

[@PackmanCards]

That’s awesome congrats!!

[@stephendecoste7615]

Buying Shohei RC for 2-3 bucks in February.. one of my first big investments in the hobby and it paid off well

[@andrew-y1k8g]

My best purchase was two topps chrome Bundesliga hobby packs for $30 and I pulled a purple Bellingham /299 worth $300+

[@APMUMBP]

Kid is going to be a stud. All the big clubs in England want him. Plus at 17 he already played at the euros.

[@andrewthemastercards9402]

Best buys for me were 4 18-19 status blasters at retail for $20 a piece, plus a 17-18 optic basketball Target mega box with the whole shock set. Also have gotten a lot of sweet steals while buying PC Cards. Missed on a luka optic auto for $175 around his rookie season, I was really considering it and just passed on it 😭

[@nicoheenan6586]

i also bought the shock set for retail!

[@andrewthemastercards9402]

@@nicoheenan6586 yeah, still so happy I got that, pretty sure I still have all of the good ones except the Collins (traded away)

[@alexspyropoulos3152]

Josh Allen 2018 select rookie die-cut /49 for 22 bucks on ebay

[@Djonit408]

Awesome cards! And I sure do miss the ol days when you can buy a hobby for less than 200. My best purchase was a Luka rc auto Jersey /99 crown royale for 400 but my best pull was a 18 Kobe auto mosaic

[@joeydicar740]

I keep saying it man but your content is always 🔥🔥🔥and you always do your own thing. Too many people doing the same types of videos. Kudos my man! Keep that heat coming! My best purchase ever was somewhat of an accident. I went to an estate auction because it said in the newspaper that they had sports collectibles. Turned out to just be a ton of mid 70s to early 90s baseball cards all in binders. The auctioneer didn't allow anyone to go thru the binders which kind of raised some red flags. All together I believe there were 4 or 5 binders 500-600 per binder. They started the bidding out at $100 on the first binder. I waited to see what interest there was and looking around I had a feeling nobody was there for the cards and I was right. I ended up getting the first binder for $25. When they brought the second binder up I simply asked if they would do the entire lot for $100 and they took it. Once I got them home and began looking through them it looked like I was going to be selling .25 -$1 cards for the next year to make a $75-$100 lol but in the middle of all this trash I found 6 1987 O-Pee Chee Barry Bonds rookie cards and 1 Topps #320 Double Misprint Barry Bonds rookie. The O-Pee Chee cards were not in the best of shape but ended up selling them for $200-$300 per card at one show. Havent looked in a while at their value but years later I found out I probably got robbed because i believe most of these cards still would have graded at about an 8. The double misprint I still have and it graded at a 9. The value continues to go up but ill still never sell because its my most favorite card I've ever had. Pirates are my squad he's my favorite baseball player of all time even with all the asterisks lol.

[@foodmooddude4605]

Beckett 9 2003 UD top prospects rookie LeBron promo card. I bought it from an old man for 75 bucks.

[@DaBlueprint80]

This was a creative and interesting video approach. It was fun to watch and wonder what card could be next and what the story and value was. You mentioned needing to move on from cards....that's why I always tell you to open a card shop so I can manage it for you...lol....but I had another thought, maybe more in line with the times ...at least for now. I'm gonna send you the idea and see what you think.

[@zhichen2799]

Mahomes rc prizm patch auto bgs 9.5 for 500. Ohtani blowman chrome blue /150 for 700. Mike trout rc bowman chrome ref /499 auto for 1800. Luka contender blue auto /99 for 750. Mcdavis exquisite rc /97 for 1800. lebron kicks auto /10 for 750. most of card I bought is in 1 year time fame.

[@PackmanCards]

Awesome pickups!

[@michaelkennedy1537]

Some of my best are Tatum Gold rpa for 150. Donovan cracked ice bought for 300 sold for 3k. Donovan gold spectra rc patch w Jazz note for 40 bucks. My fav is bought a collection for 2300 sold off most for 2700 and got a Jordan Rc sticker high grade and several star Jordans for free. Thanks for the video. Clear that you love cards and dont just do this for money. Cheers

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks! Congrats on those awesome buys!

[@corners3755]

Most of them don't do subs because then they would need more professional graders . I personally think sub grades should be part of the grading cost already. They need to check all categories the subgrades cover anyways . I think subgrades keep graders more honest , like you said you cant tell why it got a grade without them.

[@smey02]

My best buy was actually a Luka Doncic Silver rookie that I got for base price 😅 even for base the price wouldve been cheap. Guess the guy who sold it just had no idea about cards. Got it for 130$ btw

[@dominicvasquez4111]

My best purchase isn't crazy but it has potential it was recent actually, I got a 2020 select field level silver tua tagovailoa for $12

[@727kardz4]

Got a $40 box of select and it’s a $200 box now also pulled a 5/5 Ceedee Lamb auto of a $20 blaster of select

[@Rgnotown]

I agree back in the days everyone was after Watson kind of hard to think that you would get the Watson for 15 because all his cards were way higher than mahomes. Oh well great video. I also pulled a optic pink mahomes out of a blaster but I was looking for a Watson. Those optic blaster would keep going on clearance for 15 bucks at Walmart and every time I would see them I would scoop them all up. I have a lot 2018-19 basketball product like Prizm mega boxes, They would be on the shelf all day and nobody would buy them. I would buy 1 here and there. Now they are going for at least 800. Crazy days

[@petereagle877]

I grew up in Clemson and went to school there and would really love to own that Watson if you ever want to sell it I'm your guy I collect anyone from Clemson! Just an amazing place to grow up! Thanks for sharing everything is insane would like to see the card room mines nuts stacks everywhere lol

[@okihaveaname]

Bought my Lebron Topps Chrome 111 rc around 2005 for $35. Just sold it over 2k.

[@PackmanCards]

Congrats!!

[@SpursCards21]

Best cards are the ones you pull! Awesome that you pulled that JJJ! I use to have a nice JJJ 😉😀 Sweet collection! Thanks for sharing Ryan! Take care Buddy! 🤙🏽🤙🏽

[@PackmanCards]

True that! Thanks to you, I have another sweet Jaren for the collection!

[@cubbiepulls]

my best purchase was auston matthews young guns psa 10 for $200 Easter day 2020. It was selling for $2,000 this past season down a bit now but should go back up in season. Great video!

[@paullmight42]

i was collecting eason all year...had less than 100 invested/traded for 70ish cards and sold it all for 630 last week(to 3 different people)...small potatoes but still in line with the concept...

[@BigfootBreaks]

What size one touch do you use for normal non-patch cards?

[@PackmanCards]

Regular 35pt

[@BillDotree]

I bought about 30 Jokic Prizm RC for $8-15 back in 2019

[@chrispuente4917]

Because of the boom too many to list..unfortunately i sold some i bought low too soon too (giannis psa 10 prizm bought for $50 sold for 2.1 k) but notable cards i still have Luka Optic Contenders Preview BGS 9.5-$550 Jayson Tatum Raw Blue Ice RC-$450 Tatum Optic Purple Auto RC-$200 Mahomes Purple Crystals Prizm Auto RC-$425 1996-97 Kobe Bryant Topps Finest Gold Refractor RC PSA 9-$500 Got a lot more but most notable

[@brooklopez8034]

Man crazy thing is I remember you getting most of these early on in ur channel specifically the Mahomes and the Faulk I wonder if u remember good ol brook in the comments back in the day

[@brooklopez8034]

Are the Jaren through those 6 box series rips

[@PackmanCards]

How could I forget one of the OGs??

[@xkingkittyx]

My best cards sale was a keldon /49 psa 19 for 200 and sold for 4k

[@alwayzchillin0714]

Bought a stained glass Lamar Jackson & Baker Mayfield their rookie year for $20 each. They have aged nicely, wish I would have bought the Josh Allen too. 🤦‍♂️

[@RyeJG]

My Best Buy was a klay Thompson prizm RC for $5!!!

[@rclvideos3758]

I picked up 4 or 5 totally certified 2013-2014 boxes and pulled 2 Giannis rookie autos that used to go for $100. I bought the boxes for $40 and now they have skyrocketed

[@PackmanCards]

That’s awesome congrats!!

[@sawyermc642]

I bought a SGA silver prizm auto rc for $20 on OfferUp earlier this year and sold it for $600 a couple months later... then I put it into crypto and it exploded into a little over 3k

[@darrensanta1892]

That card is only going up 📈📈

[@ajcrew2]

I don’t have much money to spend on the hobby so it’s really cool to me seeing purchases you made around my price range back in the day!! Awesome collection

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks! It’s crazy to see how much things have gone up over the last few years!

[@Jo.3yy]

I bought a binder of cards that I thought was all James Harden vet cards and in the back came fresh in sleeve Luka Doncic Donruss Rc, Luka Doncic Hoops Rc, Trae Young Donruss Rc. There was like 50!cards and it cost 40$

[@PackmanCards]

Awesome congrats!!

[@BOT_Riley]

My best purchases ever were a Ohtani Heritage Rookie Refractor /569 from a cello pack from Target and a BI Contenders Draft Picks rookie auto /99 from one of those weird Target third-party repacks.

[@nigelnuj]

When my grand pa passed away, with inheritance I bought Jordan rc and sticker rc psa 9. Was like 15 years ago.

[@connoradams8637]

my best purchase is a 2017-18 national treasures kobe bryant colossal game used jumbo jersey on card auto /49 for $120 and I still have it too

[@aaronhess]

My best purchase was buying a rookie Giannis nba hoops card for 2 dollars in 2015

[@premmemez2902]

my best buy is a lebron 06 exquisite patch auto bought it for 3k ungraded then graded it a BGS 9.5/10 and sold it for 55k

[@XxBLKMAMBAxX]

I think First year of prizm had like 2 rookie classes together so the 2nd year dudes were considered rookies in that set (regarding the kawhi)

[@tantk6187]

My best purchase is probably a 06-07 MJ exquisite patch auto. Traded another mj auto plus about $350 for it. Also got a LeBron 06-07 trilogy patch auto #/10 for less than $300 more than 10 years ago

[@chadtaylor1196]

My best card is a Ja Morant prizm rc auto I pulled.

[@eliastobias1687]

My Best Buy’s back in the December high was I bought like 40 Ja mosaic bases for $10 each and sold them for $40 each

[@stevebob2363]

Best Buys picked up CMC purple crystal prizm rookie back in 2017 for 36$ now there 400-500$+ scored a pink rated rookie Patty back in 2017 in a blaster and got a Brady Upperdeck Star rookie from upper deck back in 2018 for 100$ now there doing 500-1000$

[@frmacst108]

That national treasures box definitely has the 1/1 Zion logo man auto in it

[@investinthebest7696]

Zion will never win a ring lol why do people want new guys?

[@frmacst108]

@@investinthebest7696 there’s a bounty on the card. It’s the most sought after card in that particular set. That’s why

[@investinthebest7696]

@@frmacst108 you don’t think new guys are a mistake? What do you think the value will be worth in 15 years? Compared to someone with a lot of rings

[@patriotsholobreakers6308]

@@investinthebest7696 he is saying there is a bounty so someone will pay you on the spot if you pull it

[@nizzle428]

@@investinthebest7696 how can you confidently say that zion will never win a title. he’s only played a season and a half so far and he’s been incredible thus far, even exceeding the expectations set for him. i think you’re just being a hater

[@jordanmichael9073]

I’m a bgs guy as well. Many psa 10 could be a 9 and vice versa based on their own criteria that’s on website.

[@samhiniang8590]

Thank you for your service to the hobby.

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks for your support!

[@livinwithlt]

My best sports card was not a purchase. More like a gift where the person who gave it to me was cleaning out his garage and making way for a new baby. So I was very grateful and took the collectibles. Guess what was in there? 1996 Kobe Bryant Topps RC 😎🤙🏽

[@PackmanCards]

Amazing find!

[@bluntedout247]

My best sports card purchases was last year the sports card store one and 1/4 block away from World Trade Center in NYC (Chameleon Cards and Comics, 3 Maiden Lane) was going out of business (after 30+ years in business) and I copped 2 2008-09 Topps Chrome Russell Westbrook's raw and a PSA 9 1980 Topps Nolan Ryan Base for $130. Value now $1200+ for the 3. And a NYC $1 table grab raw (43rd st and 5th ave) which is a 1997 Best Premium Previews David Ortiz Hand #'d/200. My best ebay are $30-$40 for (each when cold 🥶) 1996 E-X2000 Kobe PSA 8, 2002 Finest (Redemption) Dwayne Wade XRC BGS 9.5, a 2007 Bowman Chrome Calvin Johnson BGS 9.5 (true) and a 1985 Topps Mark McGwire BCCG 10. Just brought yesterday (stopping for now) a 1993 Stadium Club Michael Strahan (No Draft Logo ERR) PSA 9 for

[@bluntedout247]

Just got card. I like BGS better because they secure the card. This one has no plastic to keep the card from moving around. Also note it's an old psa case with no holo. Card still looks mint. 2 minor corner microscopic dings. But after seeing this, I would not buy PSA again because their cards needs to be more secure and stabilized in holder. I think they only do that for Gems and vintage.

[@aggiecards6725]

My best is definitely an Allen and Ginter fat pack for only $5.99 or $4.99 @Target, but only because I pulled an Alex Morgan blue auto in that pack. I’m sending it off to be graded and hoping it comes back a 10

[@andrewlane2674]

I remember the video when u pulled the 1/1 Faulk. U have grown so much since then. Congrats on all of your success

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks!!

[@packersfan1267]

Great video as always, my best purchase was a Patrick Mahomes rpa out of Origins back in 2018 for $150. Still have it!

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks! Congrats on the A+ buy!

[@ericeckstein2706]

2014 Topps Allen and Ginter Dave Portnoy auto. Bought for 20 bucks in 2015, sold it in February for 1200

[@user-dy2xu3uv8k]

Non-Autographed / Non-Numbered Cards will tank in price sooner than everyone thinks....Mark My Words. Sealed Product, Autographs, and LOW Numbered Cards hold the greatest store of value.

[@willholmes3980]

Back when it was fun to go to your local Target and buy cheap cards I would occasionally go and buy baseball and football cards. No lie I wasn't even there to buy basketball cards but when I got there there were a bunch of 2 dollar packs of Donruss 2019 NBA basketball. I said what the heck I'll just get one for fun. So I got to my car ripped the pack open and there on top was a Zion Williamson. My first pack ever of Donruss basketball. I don't think I will ever get that good of luck again.

[@PackmanCards]

Congrats on the pull!

[@andr3w132]

Have you ever considered grading the prizm mahomes auto? would look awesome in bgs slab!

[@braindethinc.7229]

You should use team bags for your toploaders. Looks way cleaner then tape lol.

[@braindethinc.7229]

NM looks like you got tape and a bag on that luka lol

[@natecleverley6817]

Bought a $20 select nfl blaster at target, pulled a field level zebra die cut of jalen hurts…. Sold it for $850

[@acceptings7508]

A cool video would be like open a pack of every panini product and ranking them by how the community see them for new coming people to the hobby! Took me some time to know that prizm was the one hoops lower tier etc etc

[@cardsandchemistry9923]

Awesome video idea. My favorite card is a Kobe Auto from gold standard my wife bought it for me ten years ago for $150. I would guess it’s worth about $2,000 now.

[@minnesotacards8980]

2019 prizm definitely didn’t sit on shelves but it was definitely findable if you tried. Me and my dad probably ripped 8 of our 10 full trays of retail and we sold the last two for about the price that we had into everything. Those were the good ol days

[@Knicks176]

BGS slabs look so much better + the subs. PSA slabs look cheap tbh

[@XxBLKMAMBAxX]

Back in like 2006 I asked my grandma for a an 04-05 Kobe exquisite enshrinements auto to 25 for like $500 for my birthday. I haven’t been able to find a comp on eBay but I’m pretty sure it def made its value back

[@PattersonPacks]

Insane collection man! All amazing purchases! Crazy to think you picked up 2019 Prizm boxes for $20 LOL

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks! I miss the days when you could find retail!

[@cardhubph]

Awesome purchase Packman. Thank you for sharing. 😇 #GetHyped💥

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks for watching!!

[@spdog3344]

The real question is what does packman do for a living!?

[@DubsSports]

great video man! you should do a video showing your sealed wax collection!

[@copioushighlights]

I hope they start to mass produce retail so I can find some in the next couple of years.

[@camlutkins4292]

my best purchase is a juan soto bowman chrome printing plate 1/1. it is sought after by countless collectors. it’s not in the best condition but regardless i bought it for 150 bucks it’s prob over 5 grand now

[@camlutkins4292]

rookie autograph*

[@joshelwood8369]

Maybe my fav video of yours ever. Nice job!

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks a lot!

[@gregdiamond2018]

@packman do you have an eBay store or website that you sell cards from?

[@drxppy7983]

My best was a 2011 topps update trout rookie for 60 bucks

[@juanantoniocarcel9274]

was waiting for u to open the boxes hahaha

[@GriFteR_Gamer]

Enjoyed you taking us down memory lane

[@theburrisbunch6649]

I sold a rwb prizm luka and base in a package deal for 45 dollars but back them I used that money to buy more packs because prizm sat at walmart back then

[@jeremyrobert2052]

Awesome cards! Thanks for sharing Packman.

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks for watching!

[@TomCardHits]

Love the Luka cards you have! As always great content 🔥

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks!!

[@toddrichardson8595]

Packman, that Ohtani card is worth a lot more than $74 currently.... He's the hottest player in the game along with Vladimir Guerrero Jr. Great Video...

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks! Really happy I bought that one!

[@davidfalzarano1925]

Packman is so phenomenal that he has ZERO dislikes on this video. That is unheard of.

[@Playlistofshi]

You Jinxed it

[@davidfalzarano1925]

@@Playlistofshi Don’t tell me you disliked it bro? Jj

[@patriotsholobreakers6308]

I remember when you pulled that Mahomes auto so sick

[@smey02]

You should get some perfect fit sleeves for the psa cards dude...would look so much better

[@PackmanCards]

I actually have some but haven’t switched them all over yet

[@fultoncrabtree4184]

My man you’re going make a killing on that sho time!!!! Nice to see your solid buys!

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks! It’s crazy how things have changed. That one probably would’ve made the bad buys vid a little over a year ago

[@wiplash25]

My best purchases are a mahomes 2017 origins rpa 2 color that I bought for 35 dollars before he ever played in the nfl 😂, also got a josh Allen Phoenix rpa /50 4 color for 30 bucks

[@PackmanCards]

I remember josh Allen was super cheap. Wish I bought some more of his cards (mahomes too of course)

[@deanli6721]

Great video on some of your cards and sharing the stories behind it...

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks for watching!

[@JC-hs5ng]

Awesome Packman. GOAT of cards on KZbin

[@PackmanCards]

Thanks!

[@Samstoller6123]

Another banger from Packman 🔥🔥

[@rodtwichi1290]

My best pull is a card I had from I was little and didn’t even know. I just recently went through my cards and found a tom Brady rookie and stars 86 jordon both in amazing condition. As far as boxes I’ve got I pulled an a Ion book on card contenders auto. Nothing fancy but my first on card and first auto.

[@bobbyboy3557]

Love this content please keep doing stuff like this

[@seannewcomb3751]

Can someone help me out, I need a sleeve for my one touches. What do you guys think I should get or what do you use

[@xkingkittyx]

Luka pulsar had a print line across under the RC logo

[@lugahh100]

Can you do a vid on how you started? and the ups n down in the Sports cards World?..

[@shaqr0541]

I ended up buying a mahomes 1/1 for $400 raw, got it graded & came back a psa 10 🔥🔥🔥

[@PackmanCards]

Congrats!!