Nato pressure ‘unavoidable’ on thin UK defence spending

[@tusken2305]

A simple answer for our conventional defence is to take the Nuclear deterrent costs out of the defence, The Nuclear deterrent was never part of the standard defence costs until the odious Osborne came up with the weeze of folding the Nuclear budget into the conventional budget as a way of paddling the defence budget in the wake of the disastrous 2010 defence review which gutted an already hollowed out armed forces

[@OliC-f9f]

Deterence keeps the peace

[@dub604]

@@OliC-f9f 😂🤣😂

[@RoyLock]

I agree defence should be an high priority

[@williamrusk1675]

England should invest in their military and do it fast.

[@BrianWMay]

But this is the result of the Peace Dividend, politicians and Civil Service looking for savings, so the easy target is the military. Those of us IN the military pointed out once you'd lost the facility, it wasn't a matter of just reinstating it overnight, skills and experience were lost. Who would want to join a military where you're followed by lawyers waiting to pounce so they can prosecute someone for doing the job the politicians sent them there for. Plus Defence contractors are notorious over-spenders, rarely on time and controlled by management steeped in Woke and DEI. No hope.

[@OzzieDeWitt]

@@BrianWMay Agreed in part. One really big thing that's affected Defence as well is successive Governments lowering taxes to win votes and power. Defence then becomes an easy target for cuts ( not enough money to go around). And, of course, people like paying less tax as it increases their standards of living. Unfortunately, making cuts in defence is not a strategically good way to make sure you can " hang on" to your newly found personal wealth especially if the country becomes vulnerable to " bad actors" who see " ripe and easy pickings,". Re: Defence Industries Over Spending. For a number of years I worked in the defence industries on prototype systems. It's a very expensive game saying ahead of the curve and your adversaries. Some things are very successful. Others need lots of ongoing modification and sometimes rethinking completely because your adversary has come up with something " New". In all my years in Defence I never saw or heard of any deliberate wasting of money. Yes, contracts often over-ran and yes, contracts often needed more money than was originally quoted. But, like any research and development programs, you hit obstacles and puzzles along the way that weren't envisaged at the start. No-one is clairvoyant when it comes to designing highly complex bits of kit that have to marry with other bits of kit, existing or projected. It can get very complicated very quickly baffling some of the brightest designers on the planet. They nearly always find solutions eventually but, that takes time, a lot of money, a lot of " trials" time and a lot of burning the midnight oil. It's fascinating and frustrating on many levels but nothing is ever " wasted". Other things that don't help are The MOD moving the goal posts and politicians trying to score points on projects that they know nothing about. Complaining in the house about " overspend" etc. There are ALWAYS good reasons for overspend and one of the best reasons is " being ahead in the game". There's a lot going on with defence projects that people haven't got a clue about. They think you can get this stuff off of a shelf somewhere. Afraid not. Defence is a helluva lot more complicated and nuanced than that.......and, if you want the very best it's going to be expensive. Rolls Royce or a horse and cart ??? The choice is yours.

[@MAA1591]

So what now then? How do those of us in the military persuade the public that we need the money more than, say, schools do?

[@stephendalton1648]

How about the 8 billions spent annually on dinghy migrants

[@hoaxheaven]

I'll take every migrant on the planet over you any day.

[@hoaxheaven]

Racist.

[@hoaxheaven]

And the racist bone heads liking your racist bone head comment.

[@edaleman2758]

Kings just had a £45 million a year pay rise. And on top of that he's raking it in from the NHS. What a great guy, and aren't Britains traditions so wonderful and worth keeping? 🤣💩🇬🇧

[@AaronfromEngland1989]

@@edaleman2758 that's nothing he should be running the country like the good old days anyway he can shut them all down if he wanted he has the power

[@OzzieDeWitt]

The degradation of UK Defence since the Thatcher/ Reagan / Gorbachev era has been deplorable. Successive governments just haven't seen or bothered with defence as an important item. Without a realistic defence budget the UK is vulnerable to all sorts of threats. Something that autocrats like Putin are very well aware of and will take advantage of. UK 'sovereignty and freedoms even the way of life depends on the countries defence capabilities. To think otherwise is short sighted and naive. We should be ramping up to at least 5% of GDP. We should be expanding our armed forces, not depleting them You have to be in a position for a potential enemy to think twice before acting. Putin didn't think twice about Ukraine. He just went straight in. And, do you think he will stop there if he succeeds in Ukraine ?? Of course he won't !! He wants to rebuild The USSR. He wants to dominate wherever he can. We have to be in a position to be able to say to him " Try it". The current raft of politicians think everything, but everything, can be negotiated. People like Putin look at negotiation as a weakness. They don't think like we do as has been proven with Ukraine. The only thing they understand and respect is strength. More defence spending please. Not less.

[@johnathanh2660]

The so-called peace dividend. In the interim housing costs sky-rocketed, and national infrastructure was under-maintained. Our decline has been accelerated by poor political leadership.

[@zubversivezigotto9731]

Back in 2018 they laughed at the Donald for wanting members to stick to the 2% deal. Now they all realise they'll have to spend way more than that.

[@artgreen6915]

I don't know about that. They may have ignored him but did 'they' laugh at him? Of his various utterances, exhorting Europe to get a lot closer to carrying its own weight seemed to me one of the most reasonable. The reason European governments haven't yet is political inertia and financial constraints independent of Trump.

[@lukepowell9939]

Time to tax The Rich 80% would be fair

[@simonm9097]

8 million a day on illegal immigrants... maybe this should be spent on defense ffs

[@AnotherPointOfView944]

small change. small change.

[@delhog6161]

Be careful you might get locked up by Slippery Starmer, the gay prime Minister.

[@adriandeb2710]

They (the government )should stop wasting money trying to keep the migrants happy in 4 star hotels and start getting their heads out of the sand and sort this country out

[@BrianOriet]

Why don’t you guys send some back ? Why would your government take in so much that it would hurt its population?

[@suemowat222]

In many cases that's impossible because they come from countries where their lives are genuinely at risk ​@@BrianOriet

[@robertmeshew1935]

The government does nothing for nobody, they are getting kickbacks somewhere for their personal enrichment! They do not care about their citizens or they WOULD do things for their citizens not bring in cultures that DO NOT respect your laws and blame you for not coddling them! They act like spoiled bratty children with no respect! Get your head out of the sand and protect your people. You think people you had enslaved for centuries will not destroy you the first chance they get! WAKE UP!

[@andyguyuk1]

​@@BrianOrietbecause they have more rights then the British people that live here, loads of homeless with no where to go yet if you come across illegal then you get a lovely warm hotel meals clothes spending money, just so wrong

[@AnnaAnna-uc2ff]

Thanks.

[@alien4422]

Getting rid of the standing charge as well as capping both energy producers and suppliers profiteering will mean more money in peoples pockets. Which will be spent in the economy thereby boosting it.

[@AaronfromEngland1989]

That's the main problem that never gets talked about these greedy slithering little rat's making ten's of Billions profits and still keeps being put up and up and up

[@alpal2002]

If the UK reduced all public servant pay by 2% and all social welfare by 2% they could double their defence expenditure. They won't do it.

[@Bungle-UK]

Current UK government spending has never been higher. They need to spend it well, not take more money for us all!

[@SamWilkinsonn]

Not give it to a country committing mass war crimes (gener side)

[@Bungle-UK]

@ we don’t give money to Hamas 🤷‍♂️

[@SamWilkinsonn]

I know, we give it to the ones I -mentioned- referenced.

[@OzzieDeWitt]

@@Bungle-UK I think you mean that Defence Spending has never been lower. Look at the defence spending as a % of GDP from the 1950's through to the mid 1980's and then note the steady decline since then to now. Defence spending has never been lower than it is now.

[@Bungle-UK]

@ I’m referring to overall spending. If they want the defence budget to rise, there’s no need to raise taxation. Plenty of current government spending can be cut.

[@dwaynejones1555]

Red Box - Similar in appearance to a briefcase, they are primarily used to hold and transport official ministerial papers.

[@johnholkham2420]

Two huge aircraft carriers with no planes and nowhere to go. Many expensive equipment project where joint collaborations with other NATO countries would have been cheaper.

[@widsof7862]

Jsut had the same thought, remembering the sad farce of the launch wirh half the planes and US marines, was embarrassing.

[@emiliojuanmenesesc4903]

Very difficult and parlous situation and the Labour government likely to go into paralysis because the obvious actions that they have to take are not of their liking.

[@jillallan8985]

There really is no point in nuclear weapons.We would be gone in one go. We don't stand a chance now. It's better to defend with sticks.

[@clintcumberland1664]

That’s least of this country’s problems 🙄

[@orlandodessi5460]

I did vote for ningel farage, i think is the only straight man left who is telling the yrue to the british people's. ❤

[@nancyhope2205]

Tax the wealthy. Proper fair taxes.

[@AlasdairMorrison-z8m]

LSE reports that "three in every ten pounds that the government receives in income tax is paid by just over 300,000 individuals." The majority of people take out more than they pay in.

[@nancyhope2205]

@ explain how for the last 55 years productivity has risen and risen yet workers have experienced no commensurate rise in pay. CEOs salaries are many hundreds of times more than workers yet they are not paying equivalent rates in their taxes. Somewhere wealth is siphoned away, away with the fairies, is it?

[@pb100160]

How with such high taxes..money laundering racketeering 101.

[@seanlander9321]

Why is Britain in NATO? Britain is a nuclear power, it can defend itself without incurring the liability of warring Europeans.

[@AlasdairMorrison-z8m]

Do you really fancy trying to fund defence outside NATO?

[@seanlander9321]

@ It’s cheaper than being in NATO.

[@saba1030]

​@@seanlander9321🙄 Didn't learn from Brexit? You should leave the ECHR as well, as it's protecting YOUR human rights 😂 Oh, and the WHO, UN, UEFA, ESC, etc, etc 😂

[@4362mont]

You aways pay a lot for defense, nut much more for NOT paying for defense. Also, having your enemies *know* that you have defenses is a defense in itself.

[@simongardner3766]

Britain needs to invest a lot more money on missile defence. All we have is a few ships off the coast and they are probably in port most of the time being repaired. I know it is difficult but we are virtually defenseless nowadays militarily and focusing more on the country rather than foreign wars would be a better use of our resources.

[@lloydbooth-w1j]

A few weeks ago we only had one ship that could put to sea...!

[@saba1030]

There is the UK-German Trinity House Agreement which got signed recently...a simular one exists with France... Soon the German air forces will operate its P-8 Poseidons from RAF Lossiemouth to protect the North Atlantic 😊 UK is NATO member state, and it goes like that ONLY = all for one, one for all, together we're strong 😊 💪

[@fishingstevie8830]

And we have handed Ukraine all them millions of £s ..Mad .

[@saba1030]

@@fishingstevie8830 So you obviously don't mind the £ billions which were "spent" for the masks, the "Covid app" and those "ferry deals" and the "HS2 project"? 🤔🙄

[@JCT442]

With Trump back, the UK can't rely on the US to protect them... good luck.

[@widsof7862]

The US does have assets here and uses the UK as part of its own logistics chain so there is some benefit, I guess it will come down to if that is seen as needed or not

[@AaronC123-q9t]

He would have to help Britain because of the enormous political pressure he would be under to act . There is no circumstances where a U.S president could get away with doing nothing while one of Americas closest allies is under attack . Also the U.S and U.k defence industries are so intertwined now that an attack on the U.K is not much different to an attack on the U.S.

[@kennychad2821]

The UK should look at Finland and Poland as far as current military "defense." Also, those two new carriers should have been nuclear powered and they should have stuck to their original decision on the F-35B variant. Waste of money waffling back and forth.

[@Oliver-cv6pv]

15 years? Are you that confident that Russia with the state of his economy will still exist?

[@JenniferBartlett-xi3tq]

They should pay soldiers better and give them better houses .or we may not have them when we need them.they need to be properly armed.

[@engchoontan8483]

America failed Madagascar launches Saudi armed al-shuddup before firing and went critical after launch failure on second Israel fired Crippled Weapons systems online due to policy and conditions of sale.? All militaries to verify and negotiate for pre-approved vectors

[@chieftandriver703]

Who is going to want to invest in the r-pe capital of Europe?

[@edaleman2758]

@@chieftandriver703 Gary Glitter? Prince Andrew?

[@dalecrocker3213]

Who are we supposed to be defending ourselves against exactly?

[@Deadbeat-k1l]

Starmer

[@AKCFTW]

I’m not sure if you follow Russian media, but they literally talk about attacking the United Kingdom on a weekly, almost daily basis. Especially Vladimir Solovyov, and Margarita Simonyon. They say nothing on those shows without the approval of Putin. It may be sabre rattling, but they’re still prepping their audience for it “just in case”.

[@RatTerminator]

China,Russia,Islam

[@dalecrocker3213]

@@RatTerminator Make treaties with the first two and outlaw the third.

[@RatTerminator]

@dalecrocker3213 Appeasement Neville Chamberlain

[@desydukuk291]

We're wide open.

[@lindastevens6861]

Our borders 😮😢

[@JustTakeAMoment]

Money isn't your only problem, recruitment is a challenge because ask yourself this question Q. Who would want to defend this country given the level of destruction of British values and culture. A. No one in their right mind.

[@charlesburgoyne-probyn6044]

Just watch a WW2 movie that will reassure one and forget about the present

[@imperatorvespasian3125]

15,000 soldiers quit the army, spend anything you like, bankrupt the country, you still cant fight

[@AlasdairMorrison-z8m]

Soldiers leave the army if morale is poor, accommodation etc is below standard, equipment is inadequate and pay is low. Pay properly for defence and you have adequate provision.

[@Infopirates]

UK and EU need much higher taxes now 😁😁😁😁

[@bakedbean37]

"😁😁😁😁" I suppose Russia is fighting free of then charge is it? Apart from all the piles of scrap metal, destroyed oil infrastructure, corpses and cripples of course.

[@RatTerminator]

Stop ur Woke BS & spend on Defense 🇺🇲😡

[@hoaxheaven]

Hu? What are you saying...

[@hoaxheaven]

Esssplain, Lucy.

[@hoaxheaven]

Do not "wave the flag" unless you are coherent, sober.

[@hoaxheaven]

US government should keep wasting US resources, and keep US troops out of the frigging US, where US troops belong, is that what you are saying...bad "American", how do I know you are American, you seem like a liar.

[@-GeordieDan-]

*Defence - please use real English. None of that yank bastardisation here.

[@margaretkerr3449]

If they taxed all the people on benefits the same as they taxed the ones that work are taxed, It's called INCOME TAX they would get 100's of billions in tax and would have loads of money to spend

[@johnathanh2660]

£23bn of UNCLAIMED benefits. And depending on the nature of the benefit, it is taxed. That is, no one is exempt from income tax/NI.

[@edaleman2758]

@margaretkerr3449 people on benefits do actually pay tax you know

[@jillallan8985]

errrr no.People on benefits are taxed. The greedy rich are to blame. Pick on the king.

[@tomkerr4617]

@@edaleman2758 How much income tax do they pay on 40k and how much rent do they pay?

[@margaretkerr3449]

@@johnathanh2660 Are you on benefits? how much and how much income tax on it,?

[@davidclerihew3539]

Thin? We have the 6th largest defence budget on the planet. It’s incompetent (or corrupt) MP’s & management within the MoD.

[@hoaxheaven]

They want cash for more liquor, confess.

[@hoaxheaven]

Doing the same fear mongering nonsense to Americans "Putin and Xi are under your beds! With nukes!" 🤣🤣🤣😆🫡

[@hoaxheaven]

Now they're even trying to get Americans afraid of Elon... 🤭🫠 Errrkay.😂

[@bryandimery6509]

You ll pay whatever USA tells you to. Vassalage has a price

[@AnotherPointOfView944]

Or what.

[@elbibwen3019]

you should spend 50% and than teach people how to eat the weapons 😁

[@رضوانربيع-خ5ض]

😢

[@stevehorn4680]

Getting behind is a ditch that's been dug. Freedom isn't free and loyalty is key. Don't question Trump, or America. American people are loyal to our friends that respect the simple things. We'll fight with anyone that we trust. Trust isn't simple.

[@hoaxheaven]

Do not speak...for...me...idiot...

[@hoaxheaven]

You losers always try to speak for everyone. I am an anti-war American and your wimpy self is not fighting anyone, give me a break.

[@hoaxheaven]

Lying Maga morons at it...again...cannot stand you "people".

[@hoaxheaven]

Maga is illegitimate so you are irrelevant.

[@mrb.5610]

I'm voting Reform. Nigel is going to increase defence spending, cure the NHS, stop migration and cut taxes.

[@explosive-diarrhea]

Lol

[@telebubba5527]

Great satire! 😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣

[@ianfraser6161]

Are you hard-of-thinking?

[@ArfurFoolkesAche]

And how does he propose to pay for all that?

[@mrb.5610]

@ArfurFoolkesAche Exactly.

[@34xrfad]

Could'nt defend a bubble bath.

[@BrianWillcox-qp2hr]

Stop giving it to Ukraine.

[@saba1030]

Well, as stated by Putler various times since years "he wants to create the Great Russian Empire again within the borders before 1989, Finland included"...So to stop support for Ukraine is a very shortsited view on that issue...or do you think, Putler will be impressed by those 34ish kms extra caused by the channel?

[@RodneyBrown-r1s]

Yall know fell behind so its time to step up sell football team raise tax yall life is on the line time step up .

[@RoyLock]

Starmer couldn't care less got he's warm bunker for friends and family

[@maartenrog]

the British strengthen countries more in the east because you don't conquer an island quickly, ask nato member states for SAMs. Thanks to the British, NATO has become stronger, now the British must be given priority.

[@StPiter111]

I told you many times. UK and EU need much higher taxes now. You have to save Stealensky. Forget about European public education, infrastructure and health care 😁😁😁😁

[@mrb.5610]

EU is in better shape financially then Russia, comrade.

[@StPiter111]

@mrb.5610 Russia's got the fastest growing economy in Europe these days 🙂

[@StPiter111]

@mrb.5610 kzbin.info/www/bejne/h3rbnHt6jdp2aJIsi=Bk5K_0WWo3LMQFpG

[@telebubba5527]

@@StPiter111 Absolute nonsense. Russia doesn't give its real figures, just like in Soviet times. Never trust a Russian!

[@jounik]

@@StPiter111 Only if you measure it in rubles.

[@delhog6161]

Why did you show a video of LEGO HEAD holding the red briefcase? What has that got to do with anything, apart from OAP’s dying of hypothermia.

[@longevity-u1z]

basically, with women now voting, violence is out of the question, no???

[@jakhaughton1800]

I’m wondering what would be the outcome if Belgium invaded the Isle of Wight? It’d be touch and go!

[@BrianOriet]

You should be more worried about Argentina once they get up and running.. in a few years maybe a little more they might start looking back out to sea , you need to be ready for that

[@jakhaughton1800]

@ And Spain/Gibraltar. I don’t want to even think about it.

[@edaleman2758]

@@jakhaughton1800 The Isle of Wight would probably benefit from it's reentry to the EU and have better beer 😎🍻

[@gaijindeviant5385]

Wonder who will pay for all this

[@رضوانربيع-خ5ض]

Civilians

[@gaijindeviant5385]

@@رضوانربيع-خ5ض Yeah, I was being sarcastic

[@E_Rex_Sean]

*We need to secure our Muslim future.*

[@petruflorintofoleanu5865]

COMEBACK TO YOUR COUNTRY BRITAIN IS A CHRISTIAN COUNTRY

[@JenniferBartlett-xi3tq]

You can't give it away and spend on military our government is dumb

[@MichaelPetersFenwicks]

Send the money to Ukraine.......

[@hoaxheaven]

Uh, you, can send, your...paycheck...derp...still want to send money, yea that is what I thought.

[@E_Rex_Sean]

*Personally I’d rather be speaking Russian than Arabic.*

[@telebubba5527]

I'll stick to my own language, if you don't mind. Otherwise it might offend you.

[@Withnail1969]

Just print some more money, what's the problem.

[@tanyak9349]

bring migrants to the army

[@alundavies1016]

We spend plenty on defence, we are not at risk from Russia, they can’t get more than 40 Miles through Ukraine. Can we stop shilling for the defence industry and get on with trying to fix our country’s actual problems, education, hospitals, social care.

[@AlasdairMorrison-z8m]

Defence is a very real problem that should never have been discounted. Spending on these other issues needs to be reduced to return defence spending to its historic percentage of GDP. The increase in spending on these other areas was not based on realities.

[@jillallan8985]

We haven't invested in diplomacy.We must find peace

[@RidleyHolmes-sr2tw]

Next 15 years? You mean the next 15 minutes.

[@AnotherPointOfView944]

Your comment was more than 60 minutes ago. Are you still around?

[@Deadbeat-k1l]

War mongers, should have left Russia alone. OAPs in Russia are not going to die of hypothermia this winter ffs

[@AKCFTW]

How on earth have you left hundreds of comments on this channel in just the three months you’ve had that account? Something seems fishy.

[@Deadbeat-k1l]

@@AKCFTW There has been a lot of rain and I love talking to the far right lol

[@amacke4736]

russia is not leaving us alone - it is attacking us!

[@bakedbean37]

@@AKCFTW You have to pull your finger out when you're only being paid one measly potato per comment. It's a shame really as the quality of the comments suffers horrendously as witnessed here.

[@telebubba5527]

@@bakedbean37 Indeed, he's becoming delusional.

[@mustafajan1292]

Rather then spending on war why not on businesses and live style If ukrain is fighting let them fight keep uk out of war