NEW!: How to Strengthen a Weak, ACIDIC Starter (A Barnyard Tragedy)

Struggling with a weak sourdough starter? It is usually caused by a buildup of acidity.
In this groundbreaking video you will learn:
- How to identify a weak, acidic starter
- Understand the science behind starter acidity
- How to fix a weak, acidic starter
- How to maintain a healthy starter in the future
Weak, acidic sourdough starters cause all kinds of problems including:
- Slow rising time
- Gummy crumb
- Premature overproofing
- and more...
DOCUMENTS REFERENCED IN THIS VIDEO:
How to Strengthen and Deacidify a Weak Starter
thesourdoughjourney.com/how-t...
My Starter Smells Like Acetone
thesourdoughjourney.com/my-so...
The Science of the Peak-to-Peak Starter Strengthening Method
thesourdoughjourney.com/the-s...
PRODUCTS USED IN THIS VIDEO
thesourdoughjourney.com/products
MORE INFO ON SOURDOUGH STARTERS
thesourdoughjourney.com/encyc...
CHAPTERS IN THIS VIDEO
0:00 Introduction
1:48 How to Identify a Weak Starter
5:40 Background Research
10:47 Disclaimer
12:04 What's Happening in the Jar?
13:45 How to Read Your Sourdough Starter
16:25 My Starter Smells Like Acetone
16:55 The Interplay of Yeast and Lactic Acid Bacteria
20:27 Two Common Misconceptions
22:23 The Barnyard Example
32:21 What Causes and Acidic Starter
34:13 How to Fix a Weak, Acidic Starter
34:51 The High Feeding Ratio Method
42:47 The Peak-to-Peak Method
47:30 The Many Uses of the Peak-to-Peak Method
48:40 The Science Behind the Peak-to-Peak Method
54:21 The Temperature Effect
56:56 Routine Starter Maintenance
59:40 Closing Thoughts

[@chulada03]

Dough acidity is so common that this class should be "a must" for everyone that is a beginner. Thank you so much for this video; you are awesome!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@marybethburns8895]

Tom, you really need to make a sourdough book, it would be a great seller! I learn more from you than any sourdough book I have purchased. Thank you!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. I’m still working on content with these videos and my website.

[@heartoshare]

I have a sluggish homemade starter that seems to very slowly peak, have small bubbles, give off that "vinegar" smell and seems to overferment/overproof my dough into something stickier during shaping than when I finish my stretch and folds. This is EXACTLY the video I needed----had to comment before I even finished the video because the timing was SO APT. Thank you so much for all of your knowledge!!!! You ROCK.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@alfontana6242]

Thanks Tom. You probably saved a lot of people from dumping out their starter and running to the store to buy yeast. Your video displays your knowledge of sourdough, how to fix your starter, and a entertaining delivery which made it easy to understand what an acidic starter is.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. I appreciate the feedback.

[@tuyetngocnguyen1684]

This man deserves a hundred thousand of subscribers

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@dianapagnucco8161]

From all of us visual learners, THANK YOU again for your demos combined with clear descriptions - you stand alone in the field of sourdough teachers! (Like a cow, not a dinosaur)

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@yarnexpress]

Thanks, once again, for the science. I keep my starter refrigerated & TRY to refresh once a week. The day before I want to bake, I do 2 peak to peak feedings, refrigerate overnight, feed again & I'm ready to bake. Now I understand why this works for me. Looking forward to your upcoming refrigerator maintenance.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks! 🙏

[@peterthomas5792]

Brilliant video! By far the best explanation I've seen anywhere. And the cows & acid-spitting velociraptors were a great (not to mention entertaining) analogy.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you so much.

[@user-pp5om8nl9d]

Wow ...wow... wow such a concise and precise explanations with fun demonstrations to the feeding cycle for sourdough baking. The explanations are at its best that even beginners like me can comprehend with better understanding through your generous sharing and commitment to sourdough baking. Thank you for your videos and experiments, commitment and dedication for all sourdough bakers especially those who are intimidated by sourdough bread making. Thank you...! All your videos are so well thought of and presented. Living in a tropical country your insight to double bulk fermentation helped me in baking a beautiful loaf. I couldn't have done it without your great explanation! Looking forward to more videos

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@lindajeanne9962]

This was EXACTLY the information I’ve been looking for. Thank you so much!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Glad it was helpful!

[@lindajeanne9962]

@@thesourdoughjourney There isn’t much information available (and I do quite a bit of research) that clarifies how the variables affect the starter that isn’t used everyday/very regularly. Please continue helping us home bakers!

[@nikosmix]

This must be the most important video for home bakers that came out from the Institute in Cleveland...!!It has put together all the answers that a medium-advanced level home baker like myself wanted to get for a lot of problems and questions about my baking life...!Well done.....!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@gravy229]

I started uh, well, a starter, beginning of this year following an artisan SD book's instruction. After so many days the starter recipe dropped using whole grains. I dumped it and started following another book. That starter also struggled a bit but I think it was due to the whole timing issue of 24 hrs. in a day (starters don't wear watches). I switched to your advice and fed my starter just after peak. I listened/observed my starter for when she said, "Please sir, may I have some more?" This was a month old, weak starter and soon it changed to an overflowing mess on my counter regularly so I had to rethink my starter size vs. container vol. It's nice to not worry about the starter and just focus on the rest of the dough recipe. My loaves look great and I'm getting good compliments after doing the work. Thanks Tom.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks.

[@TheKlashvorn]

I've been using instant yeast for a while, always afraid to try nurturing a sourdough starter and I've finally taken the leap about a week and a half ago. I'm happy to report that I have a healthy starter after 10 days and I was able to catch the peak for my first mini baguette batch. With your example using cows and acid spitting dinosaurs, my mind is reminded to care for the cows. Save the cows everyone! Anyway, thank you for sharing your knowledge, findings and spending time laying things out for anyone interested in the topic 🙏 Happy sourdough baking!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@birdwatcher1015]

Great Video! Watching your videos, I have gone from bricks, to pancakes, to pretty darn good sourdough loaves with 6.5 hours BF. I couldn't have done it without you and your wonderful experiments, all of which I have watched multiple times. Many thanks!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!🙏

[@GamelaPadaria]

I just want to say that this happens in microbakeries too. Yesterday, I had to throw kilos of dough in the compost because by the time the dough had hit the percentage rise I was looking for, it had completely liquified 🥲. I feed my starter two times a day, but I guess I haven’t being paying attention to what it was telling me and I paid the price for it 😄 Thank you so much for your videos! I’ve been baking sourdough since 2016 and I never felt I fully got it in a way that made sense until I found your videos. About 6 months ago, I decided to follow my passion and opened my own sourdough microbakery. Even though your videos are targeted more towards home bakers, I still find the information you share to be extremely valuable.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! I appreciate the feedback.

[@charlenegarcia5144]

What a nice comment 💞

[@DRz754]

This afternoon I took my first ever sourdough loaf out of the oven. whoa - boy did i make SOURdough bread. I've been enjoying your various videos and am SO glad you made this one! I honestly laughed out loud when the cows got some vinegar in their water.(and at your NASA apron confession). Anyway - THANK YOU for making this Journey (or in my case, Adventure) so interesting and entertaining! Peak-to-peak here I go!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. Good luck!

[@SallyChi-gm1jt]

I finally understand what is happening to my starter that always produces a densed and gummy loaf. Living in a tropical country, it is harder to keep the starter at the desired temperatures.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you 🙏

[@BH-gr2ds]

Thank you for taking the time to share your knowledge! I find your videos very helpful. You address and answer questions about so many issues!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

You are so welcome!🙏

[@illuminouz5032]

Thank you! This is the most helpful video I have ever seen for sourdough starters.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. 🙏

[@Maddipham]

you got me at the NASA apron lol, thanks for making the video so informative, despite the length (yeah I'm a lazy student), I did enjoy all of It, especially the cow demo

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. 🙏

[@whimseestitcher4270]

Appreciate the work you put into this and giving us novices valuable info….I know I really needed this as I believe my starters need to be strengthened! Thank You

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks! 🙏

[@markacyr]

I laughed so hard at how you described the velociraptor 😂

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Haha, thanks

[@tiataccia6546]

Needed this video! Thanks Tom!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@bwesterfield9165]

Great video! Thank you so much for the help.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@JLZwissRN1950]

Another well researched video from Tom! Thank you..I even took notes. 😊

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. There is also a link to a companion guide in the description of the video. And here... thesourdoughjourney.com/how-to-strengthen-a-weak-acidic-starter/

[@brentchristian1661]

Thank you!!! This is the video I've been needing for years! So helpful!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. I appreciate the feedback!

[@UitdekeukenvanLevine]

Tom, thank you very much for this video!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

My pleasure!

[@kaltoum01]

Thanks for this video. It's very useful information. Keep up the good work.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@hersheyqueenlisa]

This is an amazing video! Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge. You made it so understandable!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@adeleboulter9376]

Great video learnt alot ! You have wonderful visuals that really explain things so thanks for this ....always excited to watch your videos ! 😊

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!🙏

[@mnchaser]

Like a lot of things, I put fixing the real problem (acidity) off until last. Inconsistent starter rise times, sluggish levain, no strength in shaped dough, and no proof. Every word of this video is gold...it should have been the first thing I watched/learned. Thank you! I had previously been doing 1:1:1 feedings, but basically getting dough that wouldn't rise/proof. Super smooth, but zero strength (puddle). I'm convinced now it's acidity. I'm doing a few peak to peaks to get a feel for shortening times and then will be gradually switching to something like 1:5:5 - which I'm hoping is a great balance of strength ratio and convenience (~12hr peak). If I understand correctly... if I'm good with the time a 1:5:5 takes to peak/cycle, there's no quality difference between that and a 1:1:1 (or a 1: 50:50 for that matter). It's just quantity of starter (and waste) and the cycle duration.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

That is correct.

[@chiangsim]

Thank you!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

👍

[@charlenegarcia5144]

Thank you, you're a Godsend ❤

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you 🙏

[@charlenegarcia5144]

@@thesourdoughjourney I need that Apron too. Happy St. Patrick's Day 🍀

[@janetrosener9867]

Such a helpful video..and love the creativity! So helpful.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. 🙏

[@angiejean66]

This is pure GOLD! I am so glad I found your videos. Thank you!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@sjp8969]

GREAT VIDEO !!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you 🙏

[@stephaniejones5715]

Really fantastic and informative video, thank you so much for the effort and time you put into it. I enjoy learning about the science behind what I'm doing, so I'm so glad I took the time to watch this. I was always confused by people's descriptions of starters being "sleepy" or needing to "wake them up", but I can see now that what it really comes down to is the acidity. I had many lightbulb moments here, including with your explanation of the effect of temperature on the protease. Living in Australia, where my kitchen has been averaging 29C in recent weeks, I have a new appreciation for why my sourdoughs seem to be breaking down so quickly. As a side note, it was interesting hearing you mention that keeping a starter in the fridge can make it hard to see when it has peaked. I keep a 100% hydration rye starter that very visibly doubles, peaks, and falls in the fridge. Perhaps an added advantage of a rye starter over normal bread flour. Thanks once again!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. 🙏 Yes, rye starters behave a little differently.

[@croixmom]

Thank you so much for this awesome video!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks! 🙏

[@carolmelancon]

Thank you so much! This is exactly what I needed. Noticed your spiffy Hedley & Bennett apron instantly.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. It is a lovely apron.

[@violacapecchi3250]

I think I never found a more detailed, and yet fun, esplicative video about sourdough starter 😂😂 Thank you very much! This was very helpful! 🙏🏽

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@sophiekarnak3936]

This is exactly my problem, thank you so much for this video!!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@lindahammond249]

Tom, you are a rock star!!! I finally understand what was happening to my starters (yes, PLURAL)! I couldn't get them to rise consistently, and I tossed them all. Finally bought some starter and after several days it was going the same way as the previously ones. I have now corrected my mistakes and look forward to maintaining a healthy, strong starter. Thank you, thank you, thank you!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@ChrisQunst]

This is is just brilliant! Thank you for explaining everything with just a hint of science and for keeping it down to earth and simple. 🐄🦖🍞

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you.

[@user-vj7hj3ph1j]

Brilliant. One of the best starter videos I’ve seen. And just what I needed - time to reinvigorate “Charlie”. Thank you Tom.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

thank you! 🙏

[@Gregasaurus]

Thank you so much. I've learnt so much. Hopefully better bread to come. Much appreciated.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@galinibekou8227]

Congratulations Tom…this video is one of your best if not the best!!! You put so much work behind and the explanations you give are spot on! I am very much looking forward to a book you will publish hopefully soon. Greetings from Greece.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@EmRsum]

I found out my starter I'd been struggling with for weeks to get going was acidic thanks to your videos...she's finally ALIVE!! lol Thank you for your content!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@dianem.351]

Thank you so much for the wonderfully informative video. I just started following you on IG. I was pleasantly surprised to hear you say you’re in Cleveland cuz we’re in Medina. 😃 This is exactly what’s happening to my starter and now I know how to fix it.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@tianabryce3483]

Thank you for such an informative video!!! It explains perfectly what is going on with my starter at the moment. Loved the acid spitting dinosaur analogy!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@yru435]

This was a Masterpiece. It is also timely as I have been trying to bring my just purchased 'starter' up to active duty.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@juliaw6129]

Your channel is a treasure!❤ I am so new to the sourdough, I would watch your episode a 1000 times to understand every detail in your video! I love there are always science related to the topic! Thank you for doing the hard work! ❤

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you for the feedback!

[@goldlover5915]

Your the best Tom there is and the best that ever will be!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you so much. 😊

[@goldlover5915]

Organic white flour,sprouted wheat,sprouted spell,sprouted millet,sprouted barley,sprouted navy bean,sprouted green lentil,grounded flax seeds,sesame seeds,chia seeds,sun flower seeds,wheat germ,pumpkin seeds,Whole Husk Psyllium. salt whole wheat starter.Filtered water. Seeds are lightly sprinkled in the flour,like psyllium husk,chia@@thesourdoughjourney

[@hhavila]

Best explanation ever of the sourdough starter microbiome! 😊

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@teod.2779]

Thank you so much, Tom! You released another video full of valuable information (and fun!) and easy to understand. I highly appreciate all the work and research that you put behind all your videos. I have currently some problems with my starter and I wanted to send you some photos and ask what could be wrong. But now I think I know what it is wrong! Acidity...

[@thesourdoughjourney]

You can email me at [e-mail]

[@teod.2779]

Thanks a lot, Tom! I will! Now I will give it a few peak-to-peak feeds 1:2:2.

[@margaretgonzales3945]

Such a great topic, no one else talks about. I think that's what has been wrong with my starter. I hope to have a healthy thriving starter soon.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks! Good luck. 👍

[@jeanneknight4791]

Wow! This video was so well prepared and informative! A++++++ Brilliant presentation! I needed to see this a week ago but intution led me to the same conclusions for remedy. Now I understand the cause.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@jillblackie3485]

Holy COW! Pun intended! You are simply the best….funny and complete run down of solutions to many of my issues. Thank you so much! I love the science side of this. You really explained this well. Cheers!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@cindybroadus3277]

Thank you most patiently gracious teacher for this remedial video for those of us who just can’t get a successful starter experience ❤

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. 🙏

[@yairdvora871]

Wow Tom! I loved it! I bake once a week. I feed my starter right after using it in the dough at 20:30:30 and put it in the fridge. The day before making the next dough I take it out in the afternoon, at around 10pm I feed it 20 (or 30):160:160 and in the morning it’s ready to be used in a dough. I never paid attention to the acidity in the starter. I will from now and do maintenance (as much as I can) thank you again for these videos!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. Your method is similar to mine. It is probably working fine; but may benefit from a discard and feeding before making the leaven at night. But if it’s working, don’t change anything!

[@yairdvora871]

@@thesourdoughjourney I’m going to make dough tomorrow. I took my dough out now and will do one peak feeding before the final feeding (at peak) overnight.

[@kathyisern4890]

Tom, you are a gem! Thanks for ALL of the information you have given us - and the sense of humor you impart while doing so! I have a question and I apologize if I should be able to answer it after this video but haven’t connected the dots to do so. So I’ve fixed my starter with one of the two methods you showed here. It is now in the rising stage of the third peak-to-peak feed. However, I will need to put this new and much improved starter in the refrigerator because something has come up and I cannot start making the dough right after it peaks. I can start the dough process the next day, so I want to refrigerate it so it won’t starve in the meantime. When is the best time in the cycle to put it in the refrigerator? Right after peak?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Yes, you can always refrigerate it. Usually before peak is best (after it has begin rising), but you can also refrigerate it at peak and use it directly from the fridge for about 3 days.

[@jmj9063]

Ive been doing small experiments since starting my sourdough journey. Even got my kiddos in on them. Its been fun but sometimes i just want to know why right now. You have just made my day and im loving the videos.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@stansieniawski]

Classic 👌

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you!

[@creativereindeer]

So helpful! I was close to pitching my starter that I got off a friend and left in my fridge for a month. It’s DEFINITELY acidic and I now have a plan to help it get back to full health - thank you so much for helping me understand what’s going on with it, hugely helps. Also enjoyed the visual aid of the cows et al. Thank you so much, already you have given me more confidence!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. Good luck.

[@creativereindeer]

@@thesourdoughjourney it's started to rise!! After a couple of weeks of faffing and getting nowhere I woke up to progress!! All thanks to you!!! STOKED. Thank you for helping me not pitch it!!

[@barrychambers4047]

Great information Tom! Thank you! You Sir, indeed, should have been working at Nasa!😆 Just recently I'd come across the Detmolder two( and three) stage builds. The one on youtube (a professional baker presents it), the first build is with 5% starter and 70% hydration, with rye flour, at 75F for 12 to 16 hrs. The second build goes at 85% carryover starter, with 100% hydration, at 90F for 3-4 hrs. This is obviously too hot from what you've said? Also, Hamelman talks about the 3 phase Detmolder rye method in his excellent book, "Bread." I think, de-acidification, and building natural yeast is the goal of Detmolder methods.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you Barry. I will look into that method.

[@Dr_Bombay]

Whoa -- at 23:00, things take an unexpected, darker turn, lol. Great explainer video, as always!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

You never know what you’re going to learn at The Sourdough Journey.

[@jbirdyhome-4050]

This is sooooo helpful!!! I knew my starter was too acidic and my new 1-5-5- was at peak in 6 hours, but I plan to continue strengthening it and checking the ph until I get it to a reasonable 4ish level. It started at like 3.91 and that was way acidic. Very helpful!!! Thank you I like the explanations, the demonstrations and the long videos. I feel sorry for the cows, though!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. 🙏

[@shaebellow6826]

Great video, Tom! Can you comment on what is happening when people post that they made a gorgeous fluffy high standing loaf of sourdough from starving starter? Like starter that's been in the fridge for 4 weeks without being fed and then they just take it out and use it in their bread recipe without feeding it? Your explanation of what happens at each stage of the starters process is always so logical. The yeast is most active at peak, and it makes sense that this would be the time you would want to use your starter in a recipe. But these people who use starving starter (And I've done it effectively myself when I've been desperate to make a loaf and forgot to create the levain) really blow my mind! I mean, it makes sense because when you mix your dough, you are effectively giving the starter a giant feeding with all the flower you use, right? It does take longer but it's still rises the dough pretty well. Sometimes exactly the same effectiveness as starter that is used when it's at its peak. So I really would love to understand what the argument is to create the levain in the first place. Is the idea that eventually that starter will become too acidic or are there other reasons?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

You can use an unfed starter, but that doesn’t mean you should. The results are very inconsistent depending how long it has been since it was last fed, and some other factors. It’s hard to say without knowing the specifics of each case, but a few things I’ve seen with my tests: You can use a refrigerated starter for about one week after its last feeding, with pretty good results. The results go downhill after that. An unfed starter works best in dough at lower percentages (10% starter versus 20%, for example), and it works best at low dough temps (70F versus 80%)l. Lastly, it works better at lower hydration (70%) versus high (80%). If I used 20%, 2-week unfed starter in 80F dough with 78% hydration it would be a disaster. If I use 10% in 68F dough at 70% hydration, it will make a decent loaf.

[@JasonD0550]

Always love Tom's content. He also looks like Damien Jurado, so I always half-expect him to pull out a guitar and start singing halfway through his videos.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. I was not familiar with Damien but I see a resemblance. I also play guitar. 😀

[@torben2333]

Thanks for the helpful video! You put so much effort in it. Thanks for that! I have two questions, because I find it a bit confusing when I heard it. 1. You talked about the peak-to-peak method and mentioned, that you take out the acidic starter from the fridge and feed it in a 1:2:2 ratio. But in the high feeding ratio section you mentioned that this ratio is not so good for acidic starters, because you take all the acidity with you to the next starter. How does that fit? 2. We talk about peak times of 4 hours, but besides temperature this is highly dependent on the ratio, isn't it? So when you use a 1:2:2 ratio it would develop much faster in comparison to a 1:10:10 ratio, does it?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

I knew that part could be confusing, but I think you have it backwards. High feeding ratios carry over very little existing starter, so they sometimes can knock down the acidity in one or two feedings. That's why I recommend it first. If that doesn't work, then I recommend the peak to peak method, but if you do the peak to peak method with high feeding ratios, it strettch out the time to much and it's difficult to monitor the starter to catch it at peak. So I am recommending a "suboptimal" lower feeding ratio (1:2:2), so you can get more feedings in during the day or in a short period of time. It is purely a scheduling convenience. If you had a lab team monitoring and feeding your starter 24/7 , then you would do peak to peak with 1:5:5. But if you need to work, sleep, etc, you can get more 1:2:2 feedings in and it has the same outcome in the end.

[@antonyia64]

Oh my goodness. Now I know what's been wrong with my effects to make sourdough bread which always ends up in a bread tin as it seems to be going well then the final shaping ends in a frisbee like dough pat! This now makes sense to me what is wrong and what I need to do next time. Thank you so much you sourdough genius 👌🇬🇧

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. 🙏

[@Spinning4Lisa]

Thanks Tom! I needed this so much! Acidity issues are exactly what I thought was sabotaging me, but I wasn't sure how to remedy!! What do you think about letting whats left of my starter after use, dry out in the jar? Then reconstitute it a day or two before I need it again??? Thanks for all your hard work!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Some people do that. Look up the “scrapings method” on Bake with Jack channel on KZbin.

[@crystalsypniewski857]

Great information again. And perfect timing. I will use this information immediately. Do you have any suggestions for accomplishing the same thing but on a 12-hour feeding schedule as opposed to 4? I'm doing a 1:5:5 feeding schedule because it's what I can manage with my work schedule, but will that help reduce the acidity?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks!

[@Febox1]

I'm really enjoying the videos you've made with care. I would also like to see and learn how to make focaccia. Please consider my request.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you. I will add that to my list.

[@kiraamber8767]

Your videos are very informative, thank you! Is there a difference if your starter is new? I started mine from scratch about 8 weeks ago and I never see this type of information differentiated for early stages of starters.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

This issue is more common with mature starters.

[@yairdvora871]

To all viewers… DO NOT MISS THE DEMONSTRATION OF STATER BEHAVIOR! I’ve been baking sourdough bread for about 4 years. After watching this video my knowledge doubled!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you for the feedback.

[@goattactics]

The thing that has helped me control acidity the most is to maintain a stiff starter, i dont know why more people dont do this

[@thesourdoughjourney]

That is also a great method.

[@StagArmslower]

I was an ignorant about the starter and after two screwups I do it methodically and do my bulk fermentation in my proof box. At 10pm I prep the levain 1: 5 :5 so in the morning I can bake. From the levain jar I prep another levain 1:5:5 and when it raises a little bit I put it in the fridge for the next cycle. If I use 1:1: 1 feeding my levain become acidic and flat in few hours. As usual great presentation.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you? 1:5:5 is a good ratio to keep the acidity down all the time.

[@JS-ne5pk]

Excellent vedio, bu I heard that putting starter in the fridge makes it lose many of the good anzyme or bacteria, and there for its better to dry it out. Can you do some research about that and tell us about your findings

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Not true.

[@yousefalabdrabalnabi6356]

Tom, thank you for the invaluable insights you share on sourdough baking. Your videos have been incredibly educational for me. I have a few questions: 1. Regarding sourdough starter, could we increase the percentage of starter in the recipe by using all the water for the feeding (1:1:1), then adding the remaining flour to adjust the final hydration of the dough? Basically using higher sourdough stater, like more than 50%. 2. I've been making Neapolitan-style pizza with sourdough, and achieving a strong gluten network is crucial for stretching the dough without tearing. Considering the acidity of sourdough can weaken gluten, would you suggest adding a small amount of baking powder to counterbalance this effect? Sometimes, during a 48-hour cold fermentation, I encounter issues (thanks to your insights I know why now 😀) with flat, weak, and tearing pizza dough. Would baking powder help in such cases? 3. In your video "The SECRET of Bulk Fermentation: Measuring Dough Temperature and % Rise - The Two-Factor Method," when would you recommend shaping the pizza balls? Should we complete bulk fermentation to 100% and then shape the balls for final proofing? Or is it better to shape them before bulk fermentation and treat each individual ball separately during bulk fermentation?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 1. When you exceed about 35% starter on your dough, the acidity and weak gluten from the fermented starter begins to break down the dough structure too quickly. 2. I’ve not tried adding baking powder to reduce the acidity. I’ve not heard of any sourdough bakers trying it. The science seems to indicate it would help, but I’m skeptical only because I’ve never heard of anyone doing it. 3. I would shape the balls after bulk fermentation.

[@Simple_and_natural]

This video is A M A Z I N G! I understand now why my breads are gummy do not brown do not rise do not keep their shape. I still have a doubt, how to determine the peak point if I do not have a ph reader. You said for instance that your first attempt took 13 hours to peak, that is a long time, i could think that it peak at 11 hours or 14. The volume duplicates? Triplicates?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. My starter usually doubles. Some triple.

[@yiayiavirgeniusfavoriterec6726]

Very helpful and informative, as always! Quick question…do you have a preferred ratio of bread flour to rye or wheat flour in your starter. Should it be 70/30 bread flour/rye or wheat flour?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. I use 50/50 but I think many different ratios work.

[@yiayiavirgeniusfavoriterec6726]

Thanks so much!

[@user-wi5sn6rb8w]

Thank you thank you! I’ve been looking for something like this forever. Would you mind clarifying what peak looks like for an acidic starter? As in, should I prioritise height or bubbles? My starter stalemates at a certain height but the bubbles at the top comes much later.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Usually it will peak at a lower height and will fall quickly after peak. The bubbles are difficult to use as an indicator.

[@user-wi5sn6rb8w]

Thank you!

[@dorcashobbs4668]

Anyway to guestamate how long a starter is at peak? Or is there too many variables? Temperature, flour type, etc. Love your examples! You would have been a very interesting science teacher! Keep the videos coming!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

It’s impossible to know how long it will stay at peak. It depends on the flour, the hydration, the temperature and the acidity. Maybe more.

[@Cindy-ln3do]

Hi Tom!!! My 30 day old starter is still taking 8-9 hours to peak at 75-77 degrees, feeding at 1:2:2 every 24hrs (increased to 1:3:3 yesterday). Smells of vodka/acetone by feeding time with lots of pinpoint bubbles. I planned to stay that course until this video - would you recommend one of these methods for my situation? Or is mine perhaps too young for an intervention? I love love your content - I’ve been “studying” on your channel this last month while waiting for my starter to become bake-worthy and can’t wait to put all of this information into practice!!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Try a few feedings of 1:2:2 at 12 hours (assuming it is clearly past peak in 12 hours).

[@bethmarquez865]

This is exactly the info I needed to understand the whole process and why my bread fails.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thank you! 🙏

[@SandiHooper]

Super thorough. How can there be any questions on this subject left? Well, I have a math question: the reason to use 1:1:1 is to facilitate calculation of hydration levels of your loaf, right? So how does a 1:5:5 ( for example) change the hydration calculation? Thank you so much for the incredible work on this, and all of your videos.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

As long as the last 2 numbers on the ratio are the same, the starter hydration is always 100% (equal parts flour and water). 100g of starter at 1:2:2 and 100g of starter at 1:5:5 have the same hydration % and would impact the dough hydration exactly the same. The dough hydration is only imp@ ted by the starter hydration if you change the totally quantity of starter used in a recipe, such as 200g versus 100g. To calculate the “recipe hydration” you need to add the flour and water components of the starter to the dry flour and water in the recipe.

[@jwtcalif]

Thanks for a very thoughtful and informative presentation Tom. I'm struggling with a sluggish starter and I feel like I understand the process better now. My starter typically is feed with 25% rye flour, and it will grow reasonably well- although it has never been at an optimal level and that's where I believe your information will be key. However, one issue I'm having is with my levain (or any starter) made with only 11.5% white flour. It simply does not grow and expand like a culture/levain containing the rye flour. If I make bread with 25% rye flour, it isn't bad, it just tastes too much like rye. I thought my problem could either be kitchen temperature or water quality, so I kept the culture in the oven with the light on and I used bottled spring water and neither of them made a difference. Any thoughts on my situation would be appreciated. Thanks very much.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

It can be difficult to transition away from a starter that is trained to eat rye flour. So, if you're making your starter with 100% white flour, the starter is looking for something else and will underperform. You can try to gradually wean it off the rye flour over about 2 weeks. Gradually take the percentage of rye down a little bit every few days and see if you can get it off the rye completely (if that's what you prefer). You should also be able to make a leaven (or starter) with a small amount of your starter (10g) and 50g white flour and 50g water. It should not taste at all like rye. Or is that what you are saying is not working?

[@jwtcalif]

Thanks for your reply Tom. Perhaps I have not been patient enough weaning the starter off the rye. But making a levain or starter with 10g of my starter, 50g white flour and 50g water is not working for baking. It takes way too long for the starter to get going. It actually never seems to get to the point where it's active enough to bake with. To me it suggests (as you did) that there are nutrients in the rye that the starter needs to grow.

[@jonathanpoirier2164]

Excellent work as always. I started sourdough baking about 3 months ago. I keep my starter on the countertop and TRY to feed her (she's called Vitalyne) every 24h or more. I noticed a vinegar smell that stays in my starter even right after the feeding. I went to give Vitalyne a 1-5-5 feeding while watching your video and I hope i'll see the difference in my next loaves. Thank you so much for this video and can't wait for the next one on keeping the starter in the fridge. I have a question thought, do you create your levain the night before baking with a 1-5-5 ratio for your starter to reach peak only the next morning and not during the night ?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Thanks. I usually create a leaven at 10pm with a 1:10:10 feeding and it will peak by morning.

[@gingerhns]

Hi Tom! I’ve watched most of your videos over the past month or so and there’s one issue with my bakes that I can’t seem to shake out. I’m having trouble baking out all of the moisture in my loaves. I’m still learning and my starter is still young, just over a month at the time of making this video. It doubles predictably within 6 hours but never 4 at 78°f. I’ve watched your video on bake temps, bulk fermentation, stretch and folds nearly to completion. I’m methodical about ingredients and measurements in grams so all of that is on point. Over time I’ve become more successful however the remaining issue is the oven spring and gummy/moist dough. Is a gummy dough a product of a weak/young starter or baking time and temperature? I’ve tried high and low temps specified in your baking temperature video and my best result was on the lower and longer end. I’ve had varied levels of success (mostly moving in the right direction) of cutting off BF. Any info you could share or link me too would be greatly appreciated.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

"Gummy crumb" is one of the most common problems and the hardest to fix. First, you want to make sure your dough is fully fermented. Really try pushing the dough right to the edge of overproofing. That's when the crumb becomes the most delicate and releases more moisture in baking. Second, try different baking methods. More time and temperature in the oven evaporates more moisture. Some people "cure" their loaves. After the loaf is baked, put it back on the oven on the rack, with the oven off. As the oven cools down, it should not brown the crust anymore, but it will evaporate another 25g of water out of the loaf, typically.

[@gingerhns]

@@thesourdoughjourney thanks for replying, I’ll keep going until I get it right!

[@smartcookie3500]

On topic, I was afraid of leaving my starter in the fridge unattended for an upcoming trip and decided to put it in the fridge as a test run. I put it in right after feeding it. Three days later I took it out and placed it on my counter and it doubled by the morning of the next day. It is more lively than before I put it in. Before, I had to keep it in a yogurt maker to keep it around 75° F. Now it's doubling daily at 65°F-68°F. I believe it has strengthened because of letting it rest in the fridge.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Yes, some starters come out of the fridge very strong.

[@Mr1Spring]

As a backup I air dried (At 30C in a food dehydrator) some freshly bubbly starter and crumbled it in a mixer. Storage in a deepfreezer at -25C. Dp you have experience with this?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Yes, that is a good idea.

[@studio.cosmiccrochetpec]

Great video! My first try at sourdough baking resulted in a heavy, gummy loaf and I now understand what - my starter was weak and acidic! After watching your video, I followed the peak-to-peak method for three days. Time to peak volume reduced after each of the first four feedings - 10 hrs, 8 hrs, 5 1/2 hours, 4 1/2 hours then put it in the fridge overnight. In the morning, I watched it on the counter noting that although volume fell a bit in the fridge, it doubled in volume within 6 hours without feeding. It has lots of bubbles, is quite thick and smells yeasty, but thins out when stirred it down. I refreshed with one more feeding, and it doubled within two hours! I plan to put it back in the fridge because I can't bake for a week. But I expect that it's strong enough to go for it. What do you think? Do I have a strong starter?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Sounds strong. I’d probably feed it once more coming out of the fridge in a week.

[@studio.cosmiccrochetpec]

Thank you! Should I feed at 1:2:2 or higher?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

1:2:2

[@tuyetngocnguyen1684]

This video really answers for what happened to my starter . All the signs in the video happened to my starter, smell like vinegar, make the dough after colf proof like a pancake and BF took me 12 hours with 76 degrees 😢But please help im trying the high feeding ratio 1:5:5 for 4 times already but my starter even tho it rise but the bubbles on the sides of the jar super tiny like y can barely see and take like more than 12 hours to peak what should i do w my starter now 😢maybe i discArd too early? I tried the peak to peak method after i took my starter out of the fridge with 1:2:2 ratio twice a day for 2-3 days before i baked but my starter still seems really acidic

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Try a very high feeding ratio a few times.

[@KogakuKing]

Somewhat related question: Can you typically use Any strong, mature starter that you have in your arsenal in the making of the levain in several different sourdough recipes? For instance, I have a very strong, reliable starter that only requires about 15 grams of carryover each time it is fed. But the recipe I’d like to bake indicates the use of a starter which uses 50 grams of carryover; similar to Chad Robertson’s basic country bread. Many thanks for your dedication!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Yes. You can use any strong starter. It is simply the “yeast delivery vehicle.” It doesn’t matter how it is made.

[@nielsdrost5120]

I must have the most acidic starter on the planet. A book I used describes to keep your starter before using it in a dough on 30 degrees Celsius for a couple of hours to “boost” it. Now that I’ve watched this video I understand how horribly messed up my starter is

[@thesourdoughjourney]

30C is very warm.

[@janetill1158]

Hi Tom, I have been strengthening my starter. I have noticed that my starter will come to a dome and if I tap the jar on the counter it falls, I stir it and it will rise and double and dome again. Was the first time not actual peak? Am I best to use my starter as soon as it doubles or after it has just fallen the first or second time?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Good question. Many starters will rise a second time if you agitate or stir them. I generally assume the first rise to be the “peak.”

[@thepack5018]

I'm on day 24 and I changed the feedings to 1:4:4 because I was planning something. I did that for the past 2 days and both times: It doubled (like 2.2x ) in like 6-7 hours but there was not many surface bubbles. It got flat for a few hours, then I stirred it and waited, and it ended up doubling again but this time there was plenty of bubble activity on top. That's when I feed it at that 2nd peak. Did I do that right?

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Yes. You’re doing the right thing. Sounds strong.

[@khabbaz-99nnn]

Hi how are you 🙏.I Tried some thing I don't know if it's wright.on My acidic starter for once.I instead of water I used yogurt .and amazing how from the first time All acidity just disappear and my starter become stronger than any starter I ever had.I chose its because yogurt almost have the same bacteria or lactic acid.... what you think about it?again excuse My English talk 🙏

[@khabbaz-99nnn]

Is it the lactose sugar in yogurt helped bacteria yeast and adapt the acidity or The kind of lactic acid in yogurt too healthy than my starter because I didn't mention that's a New starter with 15 days Old and it becomes active but with high asidic smell 🙏

[@thesourdoughjourney]

I have not tried that. Thanks for sharing.

[@miriahsawrey5280]

What would you recommend to do when taking the starter out of the fridge for a weekly bake, but don’t have the time to do a peak to peak feed on the Friday before baking? Could I just do one high ratio feed on the Friday, and hope that reduces the acidity in time for baking on the weekend? 😊

[@thesourdoughjourney]

Yes, that would probably work.

[@miriahsawrey5280]

@@thesourdoughjourney great, thank you! And do I discard once out of the fridge, but before I do a high ratio feed? Then after using the starter for baking, do I do another high ratio feed and then put it back in the fridge? 😊

[@thesourdoughjourney]

The timing is a little tricky and may take some trial and error. I would actually do a 1:1:1 feeding and let it begin to rise before putting it back in the fridge. If you just give it a high feeding and out it directly on the fridge, it won’t get through that food in a week on the fridge and will come out weaker. I hope that makes sense. Similarly, when it comes out of the fridge, try a 1:2:2 ratio and see what happens. That may be sufficient. Starters come out of the fridge pretty strong after just 7 days.

[@Boater]

I have a starter that has remained sluggish since i built it several months ago. I tried doing peak-to-peak feedings for a week now, and no improvement after the first couple. It's still taking 7-8 hours before the peak flattens out (and 6 to achieve peak). Dump and start over, change the flour mix and hope it improves (currently on KA AP, began with KA WW & Bobs Red Mill dark rye), or do you have other suggestions? Thanks for the help!

[@thesourdoughjourney]

I’d try changing up the flour and feeding ratios, but if it doesn’t come around, I’d start building a new one on the side. Keep working with the existing one while the new one gets established.

[@thesourdoughjourney]

I’d also consider buying a starter. King Arthur sells a fresh starter.

[@Boater]

@@thesourdoughjourney thanks! I'm going to do a 1:5:5 feeding with 50% fresh-milled WW and some AP and.dark rye, then follow that with a few daily 1:1:1 feedings - essentially trying a jump-start, rather than starting from scratch. If I don't see some response within a couple weeks, I'll probably grab a starter. You ever use the Breadtopia fresh starter? I need a couple things from them and could add that to a cart to limit shipping fees.