New Study on Vegan Diets for Cats and Dogs

[@MictheVegan]

Many of you have mentioned the concern for urinary tract issues in cats fed plants. I wouldn't loved to see the study cover this but sadly it didn't. I should've mentioned it anyway since it is a valid concern and can be the result of a more alkaline diet. However, I was surprised to see that a 2021 study on cats found: "Of interest, the reported prevalence of disorders expected to be higher in cats fed plant-based diets, such as urinary tract disease [22], did not differ between diet groups in this study." Owner reported though so subject to bias. bmcvetres.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12917-021-02754-8 Making sure formulations aren't too alkaline seems to be the key. Going further, since the issue is the formation of struvite crystals (phosphate mineral) you can actually lower the amount of struvite precursors in the diet and/or attempt to increase water intake to dilute urine. Here is a case study on this issue where they planned a lower struvite precursor vegan diet: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8062804/ It seems like tracking cat pee pH at first and periodically would be diligent as well.

[@teagoldleaf4137]

Thanks Mike 👍 😊

[@jordancommander4194]

Mic is correct about this as well. Urinary crystals are formed due to the pH of the urine being unbalanced (too acidic or too alkaline). These crystals then "clump" together to form urinary stones similar to how people can get kidney stones. The most common crystal is struvite like Mic mentioned, which are formed in urine that is too alkaline, but crystals can also form in urine that is too acidic. The goal to avoid this problem is to feed a diet that will keep the urine pH appropriately balanced. Thank you for all you do Mic. Dr. Commander

[@jinsakai7008]

All that useless studies, just give each species what it needs, just give your cat MEAT and ORGANS like they are supposed to Veganism is a mental illness, the loss of common sense

[@eileencahill8541]

Thanks for the information. I’m honestly afraid to try again after a scare that required multiple hospital visits and caused my cat a lot of pain and stress. She’s doing better on prescription food, and if the company reformulated it using vegan ingredients I’d be thrilled. One thing that might have helped, possibly, is if she’d been willing to eat enough canned food to make a meal of it. Instead the canned vegan food went to waste, and I worried that she wasn’t getting enough to eat. When I reintroduced dry vegan food, out of desperation to get her to eat enough, the symptoms came right back. Again, I fully support vegan feeding for cats who do well on it, but Jellybean is the second cat in my family to develop urinary tract issues on vegan food. Her sister Phoenix’s problems took longer to become apparent. Phoenix actually required surgery, but recovered on prescription food and only showed signs of relapsing when I briefly reintroduced vegan kibble. Once she switched back to prescription food, the crystals dissolved and she lived to be 20 with no recurrence. I feel like there’s a need for new products on the market and for the big-name brands to cooperate, unfortunately. Anecdotal evidence, I know, but still.

[@marilynsummit1764]

Cats are true carnivores. Dogs are omnivores.

[@autumnalfoliage]

3 years ago, I adopted a 12 yr old Dachshund who was 16.5 lbs and on arthritis and liver medications. I started giving him v-dog and a vegan supplement. He's now 15 yrs old this month, 10 lbs, and no longer on any medications. He's also joins on hikes averaging 7 miles, the longest being 10 miles. He's done so well, and I'm proud of my bouncy boy. I've got to go watch him flop his ears, brb.

[@redj936]

What is the vegan supplement you give your baby?

[@autumnalfoliage]

@redj936 Mokai 10 in 1 Daily Multifunction / Multivitamin (soft chew), and Milk Thistle drops to put on his food once a day. (for his liver)

[@GregariousAntithesis]

Because a vegan diet is a starvation diet, exactly what an over weight unhealthy dog needs as do obese humans. The problem is once a person or pet is at a healthy weight plants alone are not optimal for long term health.

[@autumnalfoliage]

@GregariousAntithesis 😂😂😂 okay, whatever you say, buddy.

[@GregariousAntithesis]

@@autumnalfoliage my dog i presently have is 3.25 years old fed raw meat and meaty bones daily his whole life. Zero plaque. Go look at my short video showing his teeth. Commercial pet food is pet fast food comprised of 70% grain and its cooked down into highly caloric, high glycemic poison. Hence why vets make a lot of money cleaning dogs teeth.

[@vderak1]

Professor Andrew knight has been doing research on plant based dogs and cats and the findings are positive.

[@sonnetdarkly2456]

I adopted my dog from a shelter and he had terrible allergies, hair loss and was obese. Now he eats Halo Garden of Vegan canned food and vdog kibble and he loves both. His allergies are much improved, his fur has grown back and he's at a healthy weight now.

[@BM1982.V2]

Both our dogs were rescues and looked pretty rough when we got them. They also eat Halo Garden of Vegan and we noticed a huge change when switched. We get people complimenting their soft fur all the time, they have so much energy, their poops are so much better and don't smell bad and they used to strain a lot when eating meat and the smell was horrible where you could smell it from a few meters away. Now you barely smell it even when up close to pick it up.

[@jeffk464]

I'm sure a lot of the "meat" in most kibble is some really low quality stuff. Dogs have allergies from bad breeding, but what you have to do is get limited ingredient food and keep trying until you find one that doesn't cause an allergic reaction. It could be your dog was allergic to chicken so switching to a vegan diet solved the problem. I had an allergic dog that did pretty well with a salmon and sweet potato based kibble, couldn't handle anything else. Again it's a genetic problem caused by unethical breeders. Even if you adopt a mutt those genes started somewhere, your mutt will trace its lineage back to a mix of pure breeds.

[@sonnetdarkly2456]

@@jeffk464 Unethical breeders steal health and joy and from animals and their guardians' money too

[@ksitigarbha9787]

@@BM1982.V2 I stepped in some dog poo once. The smell couldn't be washed off after many attempts. That's great it smells better now

[@sonnetdarkly2456]

At the shelter he ate prescription canned food for allergies made from kangaroo

[@LuisSanchez-pw9uv]

As a vet student, I find this video really interesting, I can never fully trust my teachers when it comes to these topics since many of them aren't as aware of new studies as I'd like, even more considering that here in Mexico there's still a lot of prejudice about a vegan diet's impact even in human's health and the veterinary career is kinda hostile to people who don't eat meat. I personally still a little skeptical when it comes to cats, but things are looking really good, if more evidence comes out I'd be glad to change my mind. Anyway, nice video and keep up the good work!

[@MictheVegan]

Yes things are certainly changing. The study partly came from veterinary scientists in Mexico!!

[@DoubleDelishdotcom]

Amen! Considering how pet friendly AND vegan friendly Mexico City is, I was shocked to be unable to find veggie dog food when I moved here. I have a vet in the city who is fully supportive, but I have to pay outrageous import fees for the food and I just buy the vitamins when I make a trip home. I have tried to get some boutique shops in the area to carry some without success, but I will keep trying!

[@barbaraibiel]

"...I can never fully trust my teachers". And what do they say about castration? If they are teaching you that depriving cats and dogs of vital hormones, then you surely have a right to be skeptical. Do some research on this topic. You might be shocked.

[@_Tao__]

El whitexican mas inteligente:

[@jamilifunk6199]

​@fishfeelpain7764 A progressive vegan pet movement. Look, I fully support veganism in humans, and I can see how it could benefit a sick animal. However, dogs and cats are not humans and they are not herbivores, especially cats. They are predators. Nature is not non violent. That is a human emotional traits passed for onto animals, trying to instill human emotions and ethical behavior. It goes against the biological and instinctual nature of animals. It's the future for our furry friends going to be lab grown meat like 'Beyond Meat'? I knew vegans in Portland Oregon who tried to make their pets vegan and some of these animals died. Instead of feeding them what they needed to survive, they, too cited special studies and gave them meat alternatives and eggs. What I'm really curious about is if any vegans are deciding to make their snakes vegan? I would love to see that. Frozen tofu or beyond meat mice, maybe? Vegan wolves? Vegan mountain lions? I'm wondering how far it can go?

[@Britbec]

My large breed dog came to us at 18 months and was fed Vdog kibble and Natural Balance wet food with a plethora of other suitable veggies and fruits and passed last year at 14. She had really great blood work every year, even right at the end of her life. Now our new little rescue is eating the same diet and thriving, after a really rough start to her life. Thanks for this video Mic!

[@korstiaanakse1]

So you actualy abused your dog and you are proud of it. Dogs are carnivores get a rabit if you want to give your pet veganfood.

[@oscarcat1231]

What was their breed? X

[@rebelScience]

We feed our 5 y.o Vegan cat food - Benevo, for 4 years now. She is insanely energetic and healthy. We travel EU, UK and USA with her, so she constantly has health checkups, as it is a requirement for travel. She is in perfect health. Her blood test shows perfect healthy levels of everything. Her long fur is perfect, and she does not shed her hair at all. I had 6 cats in my lifetime. Our current one is the healthiest cat I have seen. Other cats were on a commercial pet food, and all died the same way - extra weight, bone issues, diabetes.

[@Febreezy]

I've had three cats throughout my life. First one, conventional pet food. She had constant vomiting problems. She switched to "healthier" pet food without meat by products. Her vomiting was greatly reduced. Being a long haired mane coon may have been a factor on vomiting. Second cat, organic animal based feed. Hardly had gastro issues. Third cat I adopted as a stray, after I went vegan. She eats plant based 90% of the time and we've tried an array of different brands from Wysong (very brief amount of time), to Ami, to now Benevo. She's always had great blood results at the vet even when she had not consumed animal products for months from the cat sitter. Never had vomiting issues despite being long haired... Benevo is the only brand she seems to really enjoy. Ami cat she ate unenthusiasticly.

[@Janet_Price]

I've been feeding my cat Evolution cat food for nearly five years and Maggie is so healthy. Right now, Evolution is not available and she's eating Benevo dry and Evolution wet. I've only given her filtered water. Cats can be vegan and healthy!

[@rebelScience]

@VoteGreen we also used Evolution when we were in the US. Both are good brands that have a full set of nutrients. Say hi to Maggie from our Dasha.

[@GG-vq6ro]

This is called an anecdote. Not exactly evidence. I heard the opposite from people feeding cats vegan food. My girlfriend and I are vegan but will never deprive our beloved cats the meat they crave and need. Only high quality cat food not ones with byproducts.

[@Janet_Price]

@@rebelScience - Thanks so much! We love our cats immensely and we don't take what we feed them lightly. I researched for months before I chose a brand of vegan cat food. Here's to great health for our "loved ones."

[@kat4animals004]

No kibble for cats. Way too drying. Not good for dogs either but cats for sure because they don't typically drink a lot of water. They get their water source from food, from the water content and food and there's not much in dry food.

[@kat4animals004]

@Homie they don't adapt well to that. Cats become dehydrated easily. And over time eating low water content foods is harmful to cats. They are not fully domesticated, they can and will be able to survive without humans.... Eating Mice etc.

[@kat4animals004]

@Homie they will drink.... But not enough from the drying effects of dry kibble food. Humans being vegan or not makes no difference does not change the facts of what cats need in their body to thrive.

[@jimmckinley8110]

Our 8 year old , vegan, Chocolate Lab just had a check up at the vet. The vet was amazed at how healthy our city dog is.

[@flyingpuma9729]

This is cringe. Dogs are carnivores. Really no need to push your ideology onto the dog.

[@ryanbarry4916]

​@@flyingpuma9729 Thats exactly why people are doing research on this.

[@marius0448]

​@@flyingpuma9729Obligate carnivores because they need vitamins and other stuff from meat, so you can supplement that.

[@ObsessiveGod]

@@flyingpuma9729no need to push your ideology onto dogs

[@VIProach]

​@@flyingpuma9729How about not pushing Your ideology on the other animals that are being killed for your pet food?

[@eileencahill8541]

I wish you had addressed urinary tract health in cats, because that’s the major concern for most of us. Urinary problems were the only reason my cats had to go back to nonvegan food; all their other test results were good.

[@PACKTdotSPACE]

What brand(s) were you using

[@kat4animals004]

Dry food, low water content foods can and do create many problems. Along with corn and wheat gluten and grain meals just to name a few.

[@weevil8025]

My male cat developed urinary tract issues on Benevo cat food... He had never developed them in the 4 years of his life until I switched him to that brand. Thankfully, the surgery didn't kill him and he's alright now.

[@weevil8025]

The wet Benevo food is also disgusting. Neither of my cats would go anywhere near it. My female cat tried to bury it the moment she saw it.

[@FactsBeFacts]

​@@weevil8025 The most common organism to cause UTIs in cats is Escherichia coli (the bacteria found in feces). Maybe change your cats litter daily in future.

[@amandagloverart]

Our dogs get homemade food. I add taurine/B12. I've been making our own for over a year now. Our ten year old dog has the same alertness and energy level as our hyper two year old. But the kitties get non vegan cat food - because they are carnivores and giving them a vegan diet appears to be far more complicated/easier to mess up.

[@yourlocallesbian6448]

Can you give the recipe?

[@leahspilchen590]

Yes, please share doggo food recipe. Thank you.

[@DM-ql6ps]

I kinda wish you would have touched on the rising issue of dogs getting diet related dilated cardiomyopathy (dcm). This seems to be mostly associated with boutique, often expensive, grain free foods. There are a number of hypothesises going around, the most prominent are: low taurine levels (despite many dcm dogs having normal taurine), the use of peas or potatoes in grain free food, poor quality control w/ small manufacturers, something in grain/starchy foods that helps dogs, issue with too much animal protein (dogs with dcm often eat more meat than most). I haven't heard any reports of dcm in vegan dogs, but I was wondering if you stumbled across it in researching this video. In any case diet related dcm typically improves when dogs are switch to a grain inclusive/higher starch/carb diet.

[@trish5111]

Actually Mic. It seems that VDog somehow forgot to put b12 in their original dogfood.. It wasn't even on the ingredients list and I have kept the bag for proof of this. I became aware of the problem when one of my dogs dog became b12 deficient, with no gut issue to cause it. Only one of my dogs was on Vdog (due to soy intolerance). My other dog was fed Veganpet, an Australian brand, and her levels remained normal. Vdog never replied to any of my emails but they rebranded in Australia as Vplanet I think and now have added b12 in the ingredient list and presumably in the food.

[@DoubleDelishdotcom]

I've used the Vegedog supplements for years and love them. When you purchase the vitamins, they give you a bunch of recipes you can use them with that result in a fully balanced meal. I also use Natural Balance brand kibble and canned food. I will usually mix the kibble with steamed sweet potatoes that I mash or canned pumpkin. I alternate the main meals so she has variety. Snacks are vegan treats I find at stores or just stuff I'm eating that I give her bites of. Her faves are edamame, green peas, steamed sweet potatoes, steamed carrots, peanut butter on pretty much anything, fruit (faves include apples and pitted cherries). She's a 5 yr old chihuahua mix who loves running and couldn't be healthier! Good luck to everyone, I was nervous when we started but I'm confident now that it's the right choice for us.

[@hablarcomohispanoparlante836]

Thank you for this information. It was very helpful.

[@boogiekang619]

Delusional

[@Incredible43]

My Dog Rocko eats plant based food plus veggies, beans, some fruit in moderation, he's doing great his yearly check up are great, he's 10 now and full of energy, no health issues. So happy for this guy 💚

[@malenejensen2995]

We have fed our labrador retriever an almost vegan diet since 2017. He i now 9 1/2 years old, is playful, has a normal weight (around 32 kg), and a beautiful coat. But he does shed a lot and has got something looking like tumors groving under his skin. The vet took a tissue sample, which only showed fat cells, no cancer. But it has worsened since. I am happy for Mic to do this video, and I have already seen comments with ideas to change his diet up to see if it could help. If anybody has any ideas or experience to share, I would be grateful. By the way, when we shifted him to the "vegan" diet (contains vitamin D3) he became calmer and his coat improved a lot.

[@karin64]

I've heard that Labrador Retrievers are prone to developing these fatty tumors. My brothers old LR has many of them which will hopefully remain benign.

[@JasonNoto]

When possible, it could be good to provide scenarios for your dog to play around or walk on grass or a beach potentially more often (in addition to walking on sidewalks etc.) for earthing/grounding benefits outdoors with fresh air and natural light

[@Ane127]

Get a homeopath.

[@chadwaters5894]

Over however many 1000s of years with domesticated pets, we've only had this industry dog food for 100? People didn't eat tons of meat in the past (it was expensive), my assumption is people fed their dogs whatever their table scraps were. Potatoes, rice, beans, meat, etc. Dogs surely evolved to be more able to digest plants over the years. Seems reasonable.

[@lauratanln]

People are being brainwashed that they need to buy dog food for their nutritional needs and even have to buy supplements like humans "need" .

[@alohafueled]

After becoming so frustrated trying to help my pooch with bad allergies and health issues she had, I tried a 100% Veg diet, starting at age 2. She became the healthiest of 7 dogs I had on non-veg diets and lived into her teens. She passed peacefully of old age. I was concerned at first, but because of my journey with her, came to learn dogs can be well nourished and very healthy w/out meat/organs/fish oils/etc. She is the one that got our fam veg leaning :)

[@oscarcat1231]

That’s great. How old was she and what breed? X

[@rachelgoodkind6545]

Thanks for sharing. There was a front page major scare about 20 years ago when it was shown that major known brands of dog food used some rendered dogs and cats in their dog food. It was and is legal to do this, but the brands got away with it until many dogs died from eating the food and the news got out. Now most dog and cat food use recycled rendered animal offal remains, including macerated male chicks, animal hair, diseased/downer animals, dead baby farm animals, and similar yuck. The natural diet for an omnivore dog is not dry dog food, and even the wet foods smell awful. I think a good deal of raw plant food mixed in is best--carrots, broccoli, lettuce, sweet potatoes, apples, beets, peas, etcetera. I would not trust the quality of any animal protein-based foods. I am vegan and would rather make my own.

[@Jaeflame94]

It’s ashamed that this doesn’t have more views & with all the misinformation going around nowadays. Thanks for this Mic!

[@Ane127]

I think his channel is being suppressed. He should have millions of followers by now.

[@The40yearoldVegan]

I wonder if Folate vs Folic Acid (which has been used interchangeably, which it shouldn’t) has any bearing on cat health. I read something about some humans have absorption issues with either folate or folic acid and should switch to one or the other if thats an issue.

[@botzer8817]

Folate is the most natural form and, in humans, is not linked to cancers like folic acid.

[@NLR759]

I feed my one year-old border-heeler Natural Balance vegan kibble, along with daily toppers of other fresh veggies and fruit. He loves fresh broccoli, cauliflower, carrots, bananas, frozen blueberries, apples, etc. So far he is doing very well on his diet. He has tonnes of energy and no bad effects. I would be interested to know if cancer rates are lower among vegan dogs, and whether life span is longer.

[@user-lu6cy7hm2t]

ive fed my dog a good 10 years vegan...self cooked and various brands like v dog...he didnt have any big issues and died of old age at some point. Exceeding his average life expectancy by 2-3 years...ive seen other dogs getting fed average dog foods and they were mostly miserable..Including cancer and other big issues. While my statement doesnt prove anything at least it shows all the other dogs had cancer and crazy sicknesses and so it can be any worse feeding it vegan.

[@bw1955]

Mic, I have a question about this that nobody ever answers regarding feeding cats a plant based diet. It never seems to be addressed in these studies either. Correct me if I’m wrong but cats are obligate carnivores. So they are unable to convert beta carotene into retinol. As far as I know, there are no vegan retinol supplements, as vitamin A on vegan ingredient lists is usually used interchangeably with beta carotene. So how can a cat get vitamin A from a plant based diet?

[@bw1955]

@animals are here with us, not for us oh thanks for clearing that up. I always read that vitamin A palmitate was sourced from animals, but it can be synthetic also.

[@bw1955]

@Homie your comment is coming off as patronizing. Did you see the part about not being able to synthesize vitamin A, a characteristic of a carnivore? They are most definitely carnivores by nature. Just because you may be able to feed them a plant based diet with carnivore-specific nutrients doesn’t change their biology.

[@bw1955]

@Homie and another psychotic cat-hating vegan who can’t even have a rational conversation. Block.

[@bw1955]

@Homie when you start by saying that carnivores aren’t carnivores and their nutrition doesn’t matter, it isn’t rational. What you speak of is also a man-made problem, just as factory farming is. The cat population does need to be controlled, just as the dog population does. In the meantime, they are still animals who need care and rescued. Companies are working to make lab cultured cat food to address this problem. I originally asked a question and received a logical answer. Then you came in here guns blazing saying how cats don’t even deserve to live, which is weirdly something some anti-carnivore vegans push all too often. I guess only the seed and grass munching animals are important. Have you ever rescued or adopted an animal in need of a home or just tell others on the internet how ethically pure you are?

[@bw1955]

@Homie lol no, you called them something like “taurine-vores.” Again, it seems you don’t understand biology and what the differences are between carnivores and herbivores, which is why I originally asked about vitamin A. You obviously are speciesist towards cats as you also can’t grasp the concept of rescuing animals and instead say they need to be wiped out. The populations of wild cats need to be brought down. There are spay and neuter groups actually working on this, what are you doing about it? There are also organizations and people volunteering to get laws passed to make it illegal to sell commercially bred cats and dogs in “pet stores.” Are you working on this as well? Just trying to see how ethically pure you really are. Also, as Mic pointed out in the video, most cat food contains meat that are factory farmed scraps. If you (actually) rescue a cat off the street instead of wishing it dead and feed it commercial pet food while keeping it inside, you aren’t really contributing to more animal suffering.

[@buffshepherd1540]

I'm worried that if I got my black lab vegan kibble, I might end up eating it too. Then I'd be way too embarrassed to tell anyone I've eaten dog food, which I'd no doubtably do, so I'd best just avoid getting it.

[@oscarcat1231]

Ha ha.

[@sschreck08]

Sometimes I watch my son's dogs, one happens to be my dogs' mom and the other is their sister from a second litter. My son feeds them some Holistic high-end kibble. When they're with me, I put about 1/4 cup of V-dog in their bowl along with their own food, and I kid you not, they go for the V-dog first. I usually cook a mix of fresh veggies to top off my dogs' food and my son's dogs come running down the hallway to get some of that too. Unfortunately, my son's dog has bladder/uterine cancer and it's not operable 💔😢. I keep wondering if he switched them to vegan food, if that would help at all.

[@ASMRyouVEGANyet]

Does your son know you're doing this? It's really not good to be adjusting their diets to your perceived idea of what it should be. It can cause gastrointestinal problems. I'd be absolutely pissed if someone did this to my dog. You never know if the dog has allergies or just flat out doesnt get table food.

[@sschreck08]

@@ASMRyouVEGANyet Yes, he knows! So you can be as pissed off as you want! I wouldn’t do anything without telling him about it. He actually switched them to vegan food, after consulting with his vet. Vets are learning more about vegan food. Mine is not opposed to it at all. Also, there are dogs out there that are allergic to meat as well, so it goes both ways.

[@jedikfc]

The UK has widely commercial vegan pet foods. In the US you usually have to have it shipped and it’s expensive.

[@jannacoyote4246]

Is there a Petco store, or a PetSmart store, in your town? Those stores carry some vegan pet foods here in Oregon. If you have those pet supply stores, in your town, you might try calling them & asking them if they carry some & if they have it in stock. By the way, the vegan pet foods they carry are still a bit more spendy than some of the others.

[@jbarber1016]

Pet supermarket has natural balance vegan dog food

[@flyingpuma9729]

Cats and Dogs are carnivores get over it.

[@vendetta.02]

​@sleepydevilzNot true, vegan is healthy for cats. Look at the science.

[@demoskunk]

@@vendetta.02 What science? You're delusional.

[@KYLE-zo4bm]

the standard dog food diet sounds as bad as the standard american diet

[@juliav.mcclelland2415]

The cheap commercial pet food you can find on store shelf is basically like feeding your pet Oreos. No cat should be fed dry food, and no dog should be fed kibble full of meat meal, natural flavors, corn, and all the nasty ingredients they don't mention like euthanized pets and styrofoam (that's not a myth, it's true). There are plenty of non-vegan, meal free, high quality pet foods to choose from, but dogs (unlike carnivores) can thrive on a vegan diet.

[@kat4animals004]

@@juliav.mcclelland2415 yes, I agree, this is the truth!

[@user-lu6cy7hm2t]

@@juliav.mcclelland2415 yes they can thrive on a vegan diet..and the best part is other animals will thrive too and not get ground up into pet food..much less bacteria,germs and other infections which are found in meat. Plants are much more hygenic in the first place and therefore cause much less trouble to the body

[@lauratanln]

Very true.

[@sophieh.2986]

the data on health parameters regarding cats eating a vegan diet is not sufficient to switch to it at the moment. That is why my cats will stay on a meat diet until there are better studies.

[@straberryshinigami15g97]

I'm looking into feeding my cat vegan. What do I need to prepare? What sort of bloodwork should I do? Should I tell my vet? I'm worried they will advise against it. How often should I do the tests, and how much do they cost?

[@shawng1590]

Definitely consult your vet. Doing this to your cat is very risky and can lead to a pretty crappy life and early death.

[@stephss]

Love this! Great breakdown and explanation. I'm up for more of these kinds of videos if you're into it. Ty mike🤘

[@commonberus1]

Do these studies allow for hunting, of small animals, by dogs or cats?

[@nuclearwaste2062]

In one study the owners did indeed let their pets outside. So its safe to assume no carnivorous animal chooses a vegan diet,😂. An average cat let outside will kill like 187 animals a year. No such thing as a vegan carnivore. A meat eater will eat meat, whether or not you provide it or nature does.

[@annarichter484]

Kitten Lady who is (to my knowledge) vegan herself, has just released a really good video regarding can cat's be vegan. The short answer is No. Cats are obligate carnivores and who cannot tolerate having a pet that eats meat should not have a cat. If you like animals and want to protect them please cater to their needs. Thank you

[@boogiekang619]

You vegans have no knowledge on animals 😂

[@boogiekang619]

BTW forcing a cat to be vegan is actual animal abuse you obviously know extremely nothing about cats 😂

[@boogiekang619]

@sleepydevilz I agree

[@svedrics]

Aha so what is worse starving your pets or feeding them the dead corpses of thousands of tortured and murdered animals throughout the pets life

[@boogiekang619]

@@svedrics you know what a pig will eat anything they're not herbivores 😂

[@non-applicable.]

Definitely would like to see more cat studies. Mainly because of urinary health. That's my main concern.

[@gracepettit7566]

If you have a cat with a urinary problem the vet will give you food that has high sodium that breaks down the crystals so the magic ingredient as far as I can see are the salts not the animal protein.However certain fillers can cause problems and my suspicion is that its grains and animal protein combined that's why my vegan cat food is pea and veg based now and I have not had an issue but you have to watch out for male cats who are the most vulnerable and there behaviour around a litter box will tell you so take them to the vet no matter what you feed them.I nearly lost a cat once but he was not on a vegan diet.

[@MictheVegan]

I wouldn't loved to see the study cover this but sadly it didn't. I should've mentioned it anyway since it is a concern but one study on cats found, "Of interest, the reported prevalence of disorders expected to be higher in cats fed plant-based diets, such as urinary tract disease [22], did not differ between diet groups in this study." Owener reported though. bmcvetres.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12917-021-02754-8

[@wildernessisland2573]

@@gracepettit7566 what brand vegan cat food do you use?

[@gracepettit7566]

@@wildernessisland2573 Hello ,I get vecado gourment evolution which is grain free unfortunately vecado is having supply chain issues due to drought and there is a pea shortage in Canada which is were they make the food so I switched to ami brand instead also from vecado .I think they are the only company who makes vegan cat food .Ami has grain but my cats seem ok and they like it. I have also started getting the tins which has more moisture and adding some cranberry powder in case of urinary problems.Vegan Dog food is good too from vecado but there are more companys making it and its easy to find in the pet food stores which is impressive because for years there was only one brand sold so even in rural B.C there is a growing interest in vegan dog food which means things are changing.

[@smilingismyfavorit]

Hi Mic. Unrelated to this video but can you please do a video on collagen supplementation (I didn't see that you had one?) I'm a skincare enthusiast and collagen supplementation is getting highly popular in that community for it's potential skin benefits. Yesterday a popular aesthetic specialist Dr Rajani released a yt video reviewing a recent study on collagen supplementation improving skin appearance, and of course recommended his own line of collagen supplement at the end of the video. The comment section has all these vegans discussing whether they should start a collagen supplement and start eating animal products. I know most studies on collagen supplementation have been industry funded. Would love to see a video on collagen, but if you have one already please let me know, thanks.

[@barbaraibiel]

Is there vegan collagen?

[@smilingismyfavorit]

@@barbaraibiel vegan collagen supplements are usually called collagen builders. Instead of providing actual collagen (which is animal derived), vegan collagen builders contain nutrients/vitamins that are building blocks or precursors that support the body’s natural production of human collagen.

[@barbaraibiel]

@@smilingismyfavorit Thanks for the info!

[@marilynsummit1764]

I have two Maltipoo dogs. One had to be put down a couple of months ago. All three of them were always sick. Throwing up, ear infections, diarrhea every time I give them meat. I would give them pieces of real meat. Can you imagine three dogs with diarrhea in your house? I tried raw. They liked it for a while but they wouldn't eat it after awhile. I tried making it and used ground meat but only half cooked. Still the same thing, so I made it with just eggs instead of meat. It worked great for a while but they were vomiting again. The vet didn't know what to do after that. I made food with no meat or egg. Brown rice, vegetables, sweet potatoes, blueberries, sea moss which has 92 minerals, olive oil. I would feed them pumpkin, cranberries, apples. They loved it and the problems stopped. I also bought halo vegan food and everything is back to normal. They also don't keep getting ear infections. I looked it up and the oldest dog in the Guinness book was 23 years old and vegan from a puppy.

[@frizzelfrazzel99]

we need more videos for plant based cats. we need more talk about it.

[@frizzelfrazzel99]

@sleepydevilz WE ALL FORCE DIETARY DIETS ON CHILDREN AND ANIMALS! YOUR COMMENT IS A CONTRADICTION!!! IF IT IS A WELL BALANCED PLANT BASED DIET WHY DO YOU NEED TO SPREAD YOUR CONTRADICTIONS AROUND!

[@jordancommander4194]

As a veterinarian I can back pretty much everything Mic is saying. Making sure that taurine is in the diet is probably the most important thing

[@MictheVegan]

I will happily take that endorsement! Best of luck treating all those animals!

[@WildWildWomen]

Hi, are there specific brands of vegan cat foods and dog foods that you'd recommend? Also, have you been the vet for any vegan cats specifically? There isn't enough information out there especially about if any vegan cat foods are safe and healthy and we'd love a veterinarian's opinion. Thank you!

[@lauratanln]

@@WildWildWomen I would just try out any vegan cat food available because these tend to be limited anyway. And see which your cat enjoys and if you want, check her blood works after a few months.

[@GG-vq6ro]

I'm vegan and so is my girlfriend but we have cats and feed strays and feral cats but we would never take meat away from our feline friends. Humans can be herbivores but cats are carnivores and our goal is to keep our little friends as happy and healthy as possible. I don't see it as ethically wrong to feed carnivores meat.

[@GG-vq6ro]

@jonahwhale9047 Cats aren't obligate carnivores? Sorry mate but you are dead wrong on that one. It is crazy to me that some vegans don't think it's enough that I personally don't consume animal products but feel like I should force my beliefs onto my cats. I love all animals but cats for me are my spirit animals and I couldn't imagine a life without them. Also the meat in cat food is a byproduct of human meat consumption so as long as most humans consume meat I'm not actually contributing to more animals being killed. They don't actually slaughter cows or chickens to make cat food. I think Rabbits and birds are great but I'm a crazy cat man who will continue being vegan but also feeding my cats the food they need.

[@GG-vq6ro]

@jonahwhale9047 I really hope you never have cats. Like I said I'm a human who doesn't need to eat meat. My cats are not and they do need meat. You can't push a herbivore diet on a carnivore and expect them to be healthy. Whatever dude ima keep taking care of cats while also not eating animal products. I really don't care what anyone thinks.

[@GG-vq6ro]

@jonahwhale9047 what part of I don't care what anyone thinks do you not comprehend? I'm not willing to sacrifice my cats or their health. Period. End of story. Think of me what you want that's fine but if you think you'll convince me to give up my cats your wasting your time.

[@GG-vq6ro]

@jonahwhale9047 look at you, supposed animal lover calling cats an invasive species. You're the kind of vegan that turns most people off from ever even considering going vegan.

[@muhammadmadyun3790]

The study you're referencing: "cats fed vegetarian diets that were supplemented with potassium, a myopathy was seen within 2 weeks of the dietary change" "The cats also showed lateral head resting, a stiff gait, muscular weakness, unsteadiness, and the occasional tremor of the head and pinnae. Erythrocyte transketolase activity was assessed to determine whether thiamine deficiency was con- tributing to the clinical myopathy, independent of potassium status." "Weight loss and poor coat condition have also been observed in cats fed vegetarian diets [29,30]. However, most cats in another study had a normal coat condition and no obviously diet-related clinical abnormalities picked up by clinical examination [27]. Clinical signs of lethargy with altered mentation, dysorexia, and muscle wasting, along with gut signs of bloating and increased borborygmi have also been observed [30]."

[@muhammadmadyun3790]

@@loumona76 skipped right over the part that says a vegan diet will have an affect on your cats neurological and cardiac health. Denial is dangerous, save the animals, torture your cat.

[@Emp158]

Damn wtf

[@dannyboi472]

Mic has pretty much replied to every comment apart from this one… wonder why 🤔

[@andrewbiondi1081]

Which study was this one specifically? I’d like to read it

[@muhammadmadyun3790]

@@andrewbiondi1081 The study discussed in the video.

[@leonardoterzani9639]

Thank you Mic, very appreciated

[@rel6889]

Thanks Mic, been waiting for this one for a while. Really want that big kitty study soon though.

[@emily042794]

Thanks for doing a video covering this

[@starcatcher3691]

Because they were soliciting money to study this. I remember I donated

[@Spyrit2011]

So feed carnivore animals a plant based diet boosted with meat based amino acids, how is that any different than a commercial diet?

[@remylebeau_]

The problem with this study is they haven’t identified what consists of the meat diet. There is a huge difference in macro micro nutirents in a raw, organ heavy, land and sea animal diet compared to canned or loaf food. Also what were the results of combined vegetable and meat diets which pretty much every research concludes is optimal for canines

[@miss1of2]

It's a meta-analysis, so they looked at the results of 16 studies. Only 6 were about cats, not all of those gathered clinical data to determine the health outcomes. The rest were only guardians surveys.... So I don't think we can conclude much from that....

[@rebelScience]

Mike, please try emailing Dr. Andrew Knight, and ask him to get on your show. That would be a big deal.

[@spacewanderern]

Bottom line is, a dog's (or especially cat's) choice would never be to eat exclusively vegan, so in a way it is abuse to feed them vegan diet, no matter how much we make it sustainable for them. It's like a government imposing on people what we can eat based on their ideology and values we don't share. If it's such a moral issue for vegans, maybe don't have a cat or dog in the first place? P. S. Personally I eat vegan diet and am really thankful for Mike's content.

[@spacewanderern]

​@jonahwhale9047 Child would eventually grow up and find out about the ice cream and other junk foods. You can't really compare an animal to a human child. Life eats life. We can't ignore how nature works. We can strive to minimize the suffering, and to that point I hope that lab meat comes soon, but until then and sufficient data I'm not feeding my dogs or cats exclusively vegan diet. Based on all the data and research and individual circumstances, we should strive to not eat animals and minimize the suffering, do what we can, but not go crazy over it. The "not go crazy over it" part is very individual.

[@spacewanderern]

@jonahwhale9047 We've not evolved beyond nature, everything is nature. Even our heightened sense of selves. With all due respect, this is the exact sort of "crazy" that repulses many people from looking into following a vegan diet. If you want to stop animal suffering learn how not to project and impose onto others your views and feelings. I think this is the major issue of veganism that I don't see anyone talking about. That's why I don't say: "I am a vegan", but rather: I'm on a vegan diet. We need more open-minded discussion and education, not emotional manipulation.

[@spacewanderern]

@jonahwhale9047I think you're failing to see things outside of a self-centric worldview. It's about agreeing on the fundamental human values and principles, like minimazation of suffering, and building from there and helping as many living things, including people, as possible. Veganism is just a term. Ethical approach to life is many things. But really it's just some of the stories that the masses believe in, and it evolves with us as part of our consciousness. Slavery didn't seem wrong to many back then. Today it is. Killing animals for eating if we don't have to doesn't seem wrong to many today, but hopefully it will be one day if we do things right. These two examples are not really comparable, but as the latter is a much more complex issue. Forcing people to live in certain way is never the way for a lasting change.

[@veracity5412]

​@Jonah Whale okay so if your cats were strays or go out and kill those birds or rats then it will be okay for you since they are surviving? How does it make a difference between when they are fed meat by their owners and when your cats hunt so many small animals to kill and eat them? It's the same thing. Right? And the supplements you get are from animals. Just getting the nutritional supplements aren't enough. The source of the supplements are also important.

[@ladyriethegoldendelmo5441]

@Jonah Whale if we were to go for this logic? why on earth would japan feed tuna many many sardines or any small fish just to keep one tuna alive? it sames goes for all beings including us.

[@AtypicalPaul]

V dog is a great company and seem to really care

[@trish5111]

Actually, that wasn't my experience. It seems that VDog somehow forgot to put b12 in their original dogfood, or at least the Vdog we received in Australia. B12 wasn't even on the ingredients list and I have kept the bag for proof of this. I became aware of the problem when one of my dogs became b12 deficient, with no gut issue to cause it. Only one of my dogs was on Vdog (due to soy intolerance). My other dog was fed Veganpet, an Australian brand, and her levels remained normal. Vdog never replied to any of my emails but they rebranded in Australia as Vplanet I think and now have added b12 in the ingredient list and presumably in the food.

[@nitsan]

Could be asking a local butcher for leftovers might work. Though I read that alone could lead to deficiencies too because it's missing organs and bones that carnivores would eat in nature.

[@noticeddamian]

Would be interesting to find out who funded these studies .

[@Shad0wBl0wer]

They are required to include this information in the study. There are links in the description :)

[@MictheVegan]

Great question. I quickly flashed the funding when talking about the authors. I wish I mentioned that verbally is was just a part of a larger university fund and wasn't from industry. A deep dive to check author biases would be interesting but so far signs point to it being done out of academic curiosity. As for some of the studies in there, I just did a deeper look and at least one of the studies that is self reported by owners was funded by ProVeg which is obviously a "pro veg" organization lol. They do claim, "However, this funder played no role in study conceptualisation, design, data collection and analysis, preparation of the resultant manuscript nor decisions relating to publication." There is always a pressure to come out with positive results though. It's probably not the only one so that is worth taking into consideration.

[@LeanOnPlants]

Big Broccoli, I bet 😮

[@lauratanln]

I hope you ask the same question for "studies" claiming the need for animal flesh, products and supplements

[@melanieselin4187]

My dog developed a lot of allergies when he got older, he had blisters on his skin, scratched them up and they got infected. I tried to reason with vets but they only wanted to put him on the type of food that were sponsoring them. So I did my own research and talked to a bunch of people who gave their dogs vegan food, i order it and after 3-4 weeks his allergies were almost gone. The biggest thing was that he didn't itch. Eventually he got epilepsy and the vet I met then was really understanding. We sadly had to euthanasia him because he got a liver failure because of the medications he was on for the epilepsy. But it had nothing to do with his diet. I now have adopted a cat and he eats meat. I try to pick the best options. I am sceptical to giving him vegetarian or vegan food, I am scared he will get sick. (I've already lost so many animals..). I honestly don't know what to do, I just want him healthy. I didn't buy him, and I know what I need to contribute to letting him eat. But it's not his fault he was brought onto this world to be abandoned. He needed a home. Maybe I'll do some research and I can give him 50/50

[@pupolozano]

Most of vegans say how unhealthy meat is with the antibiotics cholesterol and stuff but when some of us say that cant be good for animals too some of they jump and get angry... and then we surprised about how many dogs and cats die from CANCER outhere.. we givin animals literally EVERY DAY those substances with ultra procesed foods :(

[@vlkodrak1987]

Holy shit, I actually thought that it's just case of some odd cases here and there that cat owners feed their cats vegan food. I hate hearing about this from meat eaters trying to discredit veganism on something I thought to be virtually non-existent. I had no idea that actual studies were made about this. I don't know about dogs, they are omnivores so whatever, but cats are obligatory meat-eaters, so even as a vegan, having cats, I hate this so much...

[@sr-kt9ml]

It would be interesting to compare different dog breed for ability to synthesize taurine. I would hypothesize that dogs who came from agricultural societies are better at taurine synthesis than dogs that came from hunter/gatherer societies, especially Arctic dogs

[@bellabelle8490]

Vet here! I'd say the studies are pointing towards dogs being able to do well on a vegan diet but cats are obligate carnivores so unless they have different health issues (e.g. CKD), they should be fed meat, as we simply don't know enough about feline nutrition in terms of vegan food to recommend it currently. I'd suggest getting a herbivore pet if you have issues with that, cats are supposed to eat meat. Now, the overall quality of kibble out there is a topic on its own.

[@yourlocallesbian6448]

💚 any vegan dog food to recommend?

[@PepperTheHamster488]

@@yourlocallesbian6448none

[@PepperTheHamster488]

@@homie3461cats ARE obligate carnavores. If your not feeding them a meat diet your abusing your cat

[@johnfurey3593]

​@@homie3461🙈🙈🙉🙉🙊🙊

[@user-TooManyFandoms]

@@homie3461that is misinformation, all feline types, weather big cats or small cats are obligate carnivores, defined as having the inability to process plant matter because of a short digestive tract

[@PawshGardener]

I have raised a total of 4 Dobermans, 1 Hound/Dobie mix, 1 Min Pin, and a Great Dane on a full vegan diet and all have turned heads with their "holographic-like" coats, high energy levels, and lean and healthy bodies well into their senior years (14+). 3 of these pups were rescues and came to us underweight, malnourished, knuckling, and with scratchy/splotchy coats. We use a combination of Wild Earth and V-Dog as the base of their diet; we supplement with fresh food as well - they love garden-fresh fruit/veggie smoothies, oatmeal, sweet taters, herbs/spices...really anything to include kale and broccoli! Lol For all during puppyhood, I very lightly supplemented with a vegan 3-6-9 (including DHA); they use the same one my hubby and I use! 😊🌿🐾

[@oscarcat1231]

That’s great. I feed/fed on Benevo wet and dry with added veg, added flaxseed and nutritional yeast, sometimes fish and occasionally homemade meals. I just lost my beloved dog aged about 12 to a heart tumour. Her lungs were filling up and only option was expensive chest drain fitted to drain at home. They didn’t give her long but I know there’s naturopathic remedies to treat tumours etc but because she was so ill she was put to sleep but I feel tormented that I could have saved her. How much omega do you give to your dogs - is it oil form or tablet?

[@PawshGardener]

@@oscarcat1231 I'm so sorry to hear about the loss of your baby; life takes them from us too quickly. 😞 I use Live Wise Naturals Omega Complex with Ahi Flower Oil and Astaxanthin. It's a liquid (with a dropper)

[@flyingpuma9729]

Feeding Dogs vegan is imoral. They are carnivores. You push your ideology on other species. You couldnt even know the dog will stay healthy. Its 50/50 if Dogs will stay healthy with a vegan diet. Why risking it? To satisfy your ego?

[@HummusPizza]

i have a shih tzu who's eaten mostly v-dog and other vegan dog kibbles his entire life, he's 5 years old and surprisingly large for his breed

[@Alysuis]

I have been cooking vegan food for my dog since my 14 yr old basset passed away. He had congestive heart faillure, IBD, poor eye sight and was def. Some of these diseases, I suspect, could have been from his off the shelf kibble diet. Either way, he wouldn't eat his food for the last couple weeks of his life, so I started making them beans and rice and and both dogs loved it so we have just kept doing it. We are currently feeding half home cooked food using the Vegedog supplements and half vegan kibble. We might switch to a 100% home cooked vegan diet at some point but we are being cautious. Obviously, this is all done with regular vet visits and consultation.

[@oscarcat1231]

Very good. I lost my beloved dog who was fed Benevo wet and dry mostly with added flax/nutritional yeast, veggies, some fish etc. I am bereft as I wish I could have saved her but only option was expensive chest drain fitted to drain fluid due to heart tumour. If I’d have spent those thousands and she’d died or what if I could have saved her giving her naturopathic treatments? She was very poorly but I still think what if.

[@theresnoi9792]

I think lab grown meat will make vegan cat food a no brainer

[@n2003cc]

If a person doesn't agree with eating meat and extends that to their pet, then they probably shouldn't keep a carnivore pet.

[@VIProach]

Well vegans adopt, don't ship, first of all. So basically they give the cat in need food l, cover and care. The other choice it to let the cat suffer from hunger and/or cold, mistrestment, accidents. I think you find it a better choice to let the cat go around, vet hit by a car, then being fed some food some person can give them

[@annaal7480]

Hi Mic, please address this issue for people like me. Vegan doctors don’t talk about it. I am vegan from 2012, before that vegetarian for 30 years. Started to follow religiously whpb diet in August. Felt strange . Before that was partially junk food vegan but mostly ate good food. In September went for a month to visit my family in California. Ate vegan food on planes, at airports, drunk wine, coffee again, ate vegan tacos at Taco Bell and felt great. Came back home to my perfect diet and my health went nose dive again. I started auto immune diseases I never had before! I don’t want to stop my new way of eating but would appreciate some reassurance that I am not acquiring some horrible disease from my new diet and why do I feel so bad??????

[@McCaffreyPickleball]

Blood work + check for nutrient deficiencies, figure out what to add to your diet to up those areas and try again in 4-6 months

[@McCaffreyPickleball]

@@homie3461 I guess... Or rather than throwing your arms up and saying "it's impossible", you could give a few suggestions that might help them diagnose rectify some possible problems

[@annaal7480]

@Jonah Whale wholefood plant based darling, I am on this site so assumed we all follow it. Why wouldn’t we.

[@annaal7480]

@@McCaffreyPickleball had it, blood perfect.

[@annaal7480]

@Homie wholefood plant based diet is not fruitarian or anything weird. It is the diet vegan doctors recommend as per my comment. I eat what Physicians Committee, Dr Greger, Dr Bulsiewicz etc recommend. So don’t assume I am not educated in this regard. I want to know if it is possible to be detoxing months after starting the diet. Everyone claims to be better on it after 3-4 weeks. I want to know if there are people like me around.

[@ceeemm1901]

Synthetic taurine is also added to standard meat cat food anyway because it's all cooked and the cooking destroys or denatures all proteins. Adding taurine to a vegan cats diet is no different than standard.

[@melissawhite9301]

Our dog is thriving on a vegan diet. I appreciate the study review but it looks like the study lengths are rather short. Looking forward to seeing some more long term studies in the future. Thanks Mic!

[@greendreem9684]

I’m reporting you to the ASPCA you’re an animal abuser and should be ashamed.

[@DoubleDelishdotcom]

Wish I could get MY "Melissa White" on board with veganism! It's my sister. I'll show her this comment to prove to her that she should join her people and get with the program 😁

[@teagoldleaf4137]

Thanks for the information Mike, it seems like a reasonable option for dogs but it's not enough to convince me to put my sweet kitties on a vegan diet,.as much as I want to. If there was enough long-term research with positive results, maybe but atm I'm not going to risk their health.

[@danielm6871]

Agree, 100%.

[@danielm6871]

@@vrrrrrr6872 wonder what the pet would pick? There is that famous clip of a woman showing how vegan her dog is, before she can finish the intro the dog takes the meat of the plate quicker than you can blink.

[@kat4animals004]

Agreed!!!!

[@meismeems1]

Yeah my kitties tend to live long healthy lives, not changing their diet because I changed mine

[@davidformosa3114]

@@meismeems1 - you wouldn't be changing their diet because you changed yours - you would be changing their diet for the same reason you changed yours.

[@kat4animals004]

Thank you for over this study in a calm and well thought out approach

[@ElsjeMassyn]

Benevo seems to work for cats. We cant find Vegan dog and cat food in South Africa. Also extremely to import. At the moment its survival on whats available.

[@Atheria444]

With my 2 prior cats (both have passed away) I tried an Evolution brand vegan kibble for them and it was a massive failure. It was FULL of soy and caused them so much digestive hell, I moved them back to regular quality cat food with meat. I would love for my cats to be vegan, but, it's not natural for obligate carnivores.

[@jeffk464]

Get a dog

[@frankchen4229]

Feed bivalves.

[@pri.sci.lla.]

I am so sorry your cats passed away 💔

[@nancyneyedly4587]

@@jeffk464 So your advice is to do away with cats as pets? Just feed the cats what they need and get on with life.

[@jeffk464]

@@nancyneyedly4587 Ok I was a cat person growing up I had a Siamese cat which you know is much cooler than your normal cat. Then as an adult I got into aussie shepherds and they are just 10 times the interaction and companionship than a cat is. I had a cockatiel and even birds, of the parrot family, are more social than cats.

[@sudd3660]

the odd position we put ourselves in, owning another sentient being of another race. it sure is messed up. that is way to much control of another.

[@jomaby3693]

This is what this video should be on: people not owning any pets. But Mic is a dog owner so justifying his own choice I guess.

[@sudd3660]

@@jomaby3693 there is a lot of good justifications, but at some point we have to create a world that do not necessitate those.

[@theironfox2756]

Vegan cat and dog food is super science and it comes out in the price tag.

[@Brians_World81]

I fed my old cat vegan diet and he developed crystal on his bladder. Apparently, its quite common.

[@kat4animals004]

Does V-Dog make a wet food anyways? If somebody really wants to feed vegan to their dog I would highly suggest doing research and making it yourself and not a kibble

[@Britbec]

V dog doesn’t, Natural Balance do.

[@kat4animals004]

@@Britbec for cats? There is a vegan wet food by natural balance?

[@chrisbusby4395]

I had an elderly neighbour who had 3 cats all lived over 20 years, she fed them raw mince only and not tinned rubbish that Mars and Co spew out, they lived happy healthy lives and it wasn’t until the last year they started to deteriorate.

[@ZsS911]

Since 1 month ago i don't see your videos recommended. I felt i miss something and needed to find you. Look into what needs to be adjusted, since you are a gem...

[@xCooler88]

Good format helps us to learn how to process and display the study to others.

[@languagelynnie]

It was very illuminating to have you analyse this study in real time! Thanks!

[@blub3260]

I recently adopted a 17yo cat. I ordered vegan cat food and will be changing his food when it arrives. Very excited for it!

[@carinaekstrom1]

I think one reason that some diseases were "unheard of" before kibble became common is that dogs were not taken care of as well in the past, so it was more common to kill a sick dog than to take it to a vet. And who knows what the average life expectancy of a dog was in the past?

[@VeganWellnessTribe]

Thank you sm for the video Mic!

[@veganvet2383]

Well done Mic - brilliant resume of the studies 👋

[@NicholeLynne28]

Man, I would love to see a study comparing homemade vegan food, homemade non vegan food, and a raw meat diet in dogs and cats. I feel like the results of these studies are slightly skewed as they doubtless include people feeding their pet cheapo Walmart pet food. Anything is better than that. Thanks for the info!!

[@andrewdl6824]

I always heard people saying that synthetic taurin can't be digested by cats. This research suggests that isn't true.

[@BM1982.V2]

Even commercial meat based foods add taurine so even if that's true they add it in anyway because they are so over processed that they have to add a lot of things back in just to make up for what's lost during processing. Just look at the synthetic supplements added to most meat food and you'll see it's almost just as long as the vegan ones.

[@paifu.]

9:05 Cats Urinary tract problems (Urine PH too high or too low can create kidney stones) Diet too high in magnesium Plants are more alkaline than meat. "When the urine pH becomes too alkaline, there is an increased risk of formation of struvite (also known as magnesium ammonium phosphate) bladder crystals and/or stones. Calcium oxalate stones can also occur, but these do not occur if the urine is too alkaline, but rather if it is too acidic. Such stones can create irritation and infection of the urinary tract and require veterinary treatment." "It is important to not supplement the cat’s diet with urinary acidifiers unless it is actually needed because a too acidic pH can cause a different kind of stone to form (calcium oxalate stones). While many cats appear to thrive on a vegan diet, there are also anecdotal reports of cats with recurring urinary tract problems, including infections associated with previous urethral obstructions caused by urinary crystals." And kidney issues: "the differences between the two diet groups were not statistically significant. There was only one disease for which a significant statistical difference was observed: cats fed a vegan diet were slightly more likely to have kidney disease."

[@nancyneyedly4587]

I am vegan, but I would not expect my cat, an obligate carnivore to be "vegan". This is where the younger youtube/online raised vegans don't understand veganism and think that it pertains to their animals. How could you be vegan and work as an animal rescuer, rescuing injured seals for rehab? You would have to catch fish for them to feed them while they rehab, you could not give them chickpeas. Or work at a big cat rescue, rescuing tigers, (which shouldn't even be in N.America)? Would you not rescue these animals at all because you couldn't feed them according to veganism? Please understand that you can definitely raise your whole family vegan, but it cannot apply in every instance in life and that's okay. (I put this in a reply to a comment below as well)

[@davidsan9583]

good point from you. in my words, "want be vegan and help animals, but not give these animals, the food, they need". :D

[@TheInnerCosmos]

Don't be so logical. These whacko vegans here have no ability to reason and are selfishly forcing their vegan diet onto carnivorous animals. I say this as a 6 year vegan

[@TheInnerCosmos]

@Homie There is no such thing as degrees of veganism. Veganism is someone who doesn't eat any food derived from animal products. Nothing more, nothing less, that's it. What you describe is more akin to some extreme activist movement or cult. Vegans like to keep moving the goal posts on what defines a vegan, but it seems it's more of a contest on who can outdo each other on who/what is the most ethical and who can do the most fake virtue signaling. It's pretty whacko to say someone isn't vegan because they refuse to convert carnivorous animals to a plant based diet. Pure insanity

[@TheInnerCosmos]

@Homie Wrong, that's just you and the entire movement moving the goal posts to fit your own selfish narratives "veg·an /ˈvēɡən/ Learn to pronounce noun a person who does not eat any food derived from animals and who typically does not use other animal products. "I'm a strict vegan" adjective eating, using, or containing no food or other products derived from animals. "a vegan diet"

[@TheInnerCosmos]

@Homie Did they really start the movement or is that self proclaimed? Sounds like they are blowing their own horn. I would say it is quite exploitative, cruel and not practicable to force or try to convert carnivorous animals to a vegan diet, or "plant based", as you would say😂 Sounds like the opposite of your own definition, making YOU the non vegan😂😂🤪

[@kuraarachan]

I definitely think further research is needed before we conclude whether vegan diets are actually healthy. A lot of the studies reviewed were owner surveys instead of veterinary data on each cats health over time. There will be an inherent bias in that any owner feeding their cat vegan food will automatically assume it will be healthy and have positive effects. In addition owners who put their pets on vegan diets will likely be vegans themselves, and it is not uncommon for similar opinions on the benefits of vegan food to be spread far through the community. If people are researching and getting advice about vegan pet diets from other vegan owners they are likely to be biased to see similar positive effects as the person they obtained the information from. Overall I think it is still way to early to make a definitive conclusion on how healthy a vegan diet is for cats. In addition, I think it is important for a study to research the different vegan cat food products, their composition including the presence of additional synthetic compounds like taurine, and look to see if there is any effect on health. Perhaps the term vegan cat food is a misnomer since you aren’t actually feeding the animals straight vegetables, but a highly processed, heavily supplemented food. So people are correct when they say a cat cannot be vegan in the sense that without intentional human supplementation a cat could not survive on only plants. I think there is also room for discussion for the ethics of vegan pet food vs meat pet food, including where the plants for the food are sourced vs where the meat is sourced. I fear the plant matter may come from very exploitative sources due to its cheap price. While this is often the same for meat too, the price is often lower due to the less desirable meat that could not be sold to humans, being used for pet food instead.

[@asloan193]

Hmmmm I may have to look into this again. I had decided to switch my cats over to a cultured meat diet as soon as it was feasible, but I may have to look at what is out there. Thanks for the video.

[@Phainou7]

Thank you for sharing! Nice job

[@tamcon72]

This was very interesting to me, as someone who no longer has an animal companion due to my living situation, but who is thinking about it for the future. Also, Mikhaila Peterson apparently DOES think she's a lion. You won't be able to metabolize folate from spleen, sweetie, because you're not a cat. [eye roll] Thanks for posting : )

[@miss1of2]

Please don't get a cat if you plan on feeding vegan! Get a bunny, they are made to be vegan! A cat digestive track is built to process meat. As complete as a vegan cat food is, it's useless if the cat doesn't extract all the nutrients from it. Also, most of the "studies" are actually surveys of owners. So they are not reliable!

[@nonononononono000]

That extra methionine is bad for mtor. The daily carnitine is bad for TMOA. I can’t find a single nutrient mix or food for dogs that doesn’t have choline chloride, an ingredient so bad for TMOA that I consider it poison. Wish I didn’t feel compelled to have a crazy spreadsheet with all my dogs nutritional requirements for the sake of making his food from scratch, but here we are

[@matwinner9708]

According to my cat, mice taste is vastly improved by a torture session beforehand.

[@LAJAP]

I witness the same meat tendering here. Lili even calls me to open the door and bring it to the kitchen, where she "cooks" too. I think I know exactly what she thinks of this vegan agenda.

[@dracdraconeia8150]

The major brands that pour most the research into cat nutrition have products that tend to be upward of 99% plant based ingredients by weight. Look at a bag of Royal canin, Purina, hills science diet kibble. The animal ingredients are either hydrated ingredients in contrast to dry ingredients for the plants. So you see them higher up on the list and think, oh this contains mostly 'chicken breast'. Chicken breast or ' animal meal' and are about 80% or more water though. Another common annimal ingredient in pet food is 'animal fat' which doesnt provide anything essential to cats, as their wild ancestors were mostly consuming lean game. An obligate carnivore (or a hypercarnivore) are often defined as a carnivore who depends solely on animal flesh for their nutrient requirements. However, the scientific definition of hypercarnivores is organisms that depend on animals for at least 70% of their diet. This is simply not true anymore for domesticated cats and dogs, and has not been true for a while. Most people, shelters, rescues feed their cats kibble, which IS mostly plant based. You can actually tell which cat foods have the least animal products in them. They are ususaly the cheapest, but not always, and contain words like 'flavour' in the title of the food. Legallly these labelling laws mean 3% or less animal products in the kibble. There is also no legal obligation for the manufacturer to add animal ingredients to meet tha standards set out by AAFCO.

[@Emile-philia]

The dietary aspect of pet animals has been one of the main reasons I chose not to keep a pet at my house. If they do well on vegan feed I would consider getting one!

[@MictheVegan]

Rabbits?

[@jordanbrackin9633]

Sounds like you need a bunny :)

[@stevelandstra4052]

Beware of small dogs. They can be very picky eaters. Larger dogs are easier. A dab of peanut butter on chopped apples and carrots and they'll scarf it all down.

[@Eggcornbean]

Idc what anyone says DO NOT get a PREDATOR pet and feed him a VEGAN DIET. These animals have evolved for MILLIONS of years to primarily eat animals. You will make your animal suffer if you decide to impose your moral decision on that suffering animal. It is far more morally wrong to not give a predator meat. Predators eat prey it’s how the world works. Can’t get around it

[@boogiekang619]

@@MictheVegan bro quit telling false information

[@thechannelofrandomness6814]

Why force animals to eat the way we choose to eat? Dogs and cats are made to eat meat.

[@user-TooManyFandoms]

Dogs are actually omnivores and can thrive in a vegan diet, but u would still recommend staying as close to their natural diet as possible

[@PHOENIXAHELO]

I thought cats were obligate carnivores ?

[@AK-np4rp]

Cats need the nutrients that are normally obtained from animal bodies. They don't need to eat animal bodies.

[@frankchen4229]

Vegan cat food is specifically formulated and fortified to meet the nutrient needs of the cat. A vegan cat isn't eating plain lettuce salad.

[@PHOENIXAHELO]

@AK good to know, thanks!

[@user-me1mv4vy9q]

Yes they are, some people don't understand dat just cuz they can eat greens, doesn't mean they should Like teeth, not all digestive systems are designed for vegetation Not to mention, some herbivores like a horse would willingly eat smaller animals if they necessary, which would be safe for them in small quantities. There was dat vid dat went viral of the horse eating a chick Ig for now, we wait until lab grown meat becomes widespread

[@pri.sci.lla.]

They are. I am a vegan animal scientist and cats should not be vegan.

[@thexentrader897]

my male Norwegian cat developed crystal in the urine because of vegan pet after 10 months ....stopping me from getting a maine coon

[@Janet_Price]

My cat will be 5 years old in May, 2023. Maggie has been eating wet & dry Evolution Cat Food for all but one month of her life. Maggie is happy and healthy.

[@CharGC123]

If you can't see past your ethical CHOICE to be vegan and feel obligated to foist your beliefs on your OBLIGATE CARNIVORE cat, PLEASE get a bunny, or even a dog!

[@Janet_Price]

@@CharGC123 - Grow up!

[@nancyneyedly4587]

@@CharGC123 I agree. I am vegan, but I would not expect my cat, an obligate carnivore to be "vegan". This is where the younger youtube/online raised vegans don't understand veganism and think that it pertains to their animals. How could you be vegan and work as an animal rescuer, rescuing injured seals for rehab? You would have to catch fish for them to feed them while they rehab, you could not give them chickpeas. Or work at a big cat rescue, rescuing tigers, (which shouldn't even be in N.America)? Would you not rescue these animals at all because you couldn't feed them according to veganism? Please understand that you can definitely raise your whole family vegan, but it cannot apply in every instance in life and that's okay.

[@victorgloom]

@@Janet_Price Vegan here. Have you looked into the long-term effects of high amount of plant fibers/starches for carnivorous animals? This has been flagged as a health concern for cats, so while they may survive, it's not what's best for them, as their natural fiber intake is less than 1%. Is it ethical to take health/life away from a carnivore in the long-term because you are over-valuing prey animals?

[@CharGC123]

@@Janet_Price I'm 70... grow up? LOL

[@skpjoecoursegold366]

how does one collect cat pee?

[@teresabarreiros5830]

My cats hunts, they control the mice population in my neighborhood

[@davidformosa3114]

do they also control the lizard population?

[@ladyriethegoldendelmo5441]

yea but most pet cats dont eat mice since people just give them pet food or raw meat

[@ladyriethegoldendelmo5441]

@Animals are here with us, not for us well I should say a bit too much... theres a reason why all cats and yes even the regular ones get hunted down by humans. cause they death many bird populations. but mainly they are for mice. but right now cats just for pet really

[@user-TooManyFandoms]

We have some large fields and farm land around our house so it’s pretty nice, they only ever kill maybe two birds a year per our six cats, and are super fit and healthy

[@insu_na]

I'm not feeding my cats a vegan diet, actually they're getting a 99% meat diet which includes supplements to ensure their health, but I really wish I could feed them in a vegetarian way at least. I won't do that however until there have been extensive studies to show which ingredients are necessary to keep health markers in a good direction, and I won't just experiment on my own cats, because I do not have the means to constantly monitor their health with blood tests, ultra-sounds, etc, which a large scale study would be able to do. So I hope there will be ethical studies conducted to establish this information

[@Annaandlight]

I’m supper happy that people start to talk about it ! My cats are vegans from birth They are healthy and happy 🤩🤍

[@lisagallo1745]

What do you feed them? Have a cat who looks like his collar has been taken off and he's been abandoned. Not sure if he's wild enough to catch most of his own food on the property.

[@LFR0705]

I feel sorry for your cat, you are sick in your mind

[@kanashihito1214]

I'm sure they're not happy and you're crazy. Get a rabbit instead if you can't respect cats

[@geovanamendes2677]

The cat is naturally a strict carnivore, and you are not being vegan by neglecting your pets.

[@madzo0omadz]

Imagine you are a pet, and you are being fed meat and only meat by a cat that thinks it’s giving you what it understands as -the best life-. I mean, even if in five years enough studies prove definitely that vegan diet is healthy for a feline, until then, you really should put more contemplation and weight to just deciding such fate to your pet. It’s a responsibility. It’s a soul. A soul that relies on you every single day. Have you watched the video till the end by the way? Even Mic himself at the end of the video clearly explained that there needs to be much more research done for cats and that had he had a cat he would be so paranoid, as a vegan, to have a cat fully vegan and would feed it meat.

[@jordanpryor2981]

@MictheVegan hi mic. i was wondering if great white sharks can be vegan. many thanks, stay safe ❤️