Nintendo Has Issued a DMCA Against Dolphin Emulator...

[@SomeOrdinaryGamers]

Check out the newest podcast episode: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qpiamJ1-f9urqqs

[@simeonehdhdyxhxy]

yesir

[@isaackingvideos]

Second. Wow it took 10 years for Nintendo to DMCA Dolphin emulator.

[@raisschultz420]

ok virtual machine daddy

[@fivecentnickel4363]

Man I really hate Nintendo will never buy a new console ever again only buying pre own consoles from them

[@sweetie9271]

@@simeonehdhdyxhxy been hun hub insubmersible béate s

[@Haarschmuckfachgeschafttadpole]

Nintendo: This is ILLEGAL! PAY FOR OUR GAMES Gamers: Sell them then Nintendo: NOPE

[@demomash7549]

It's like they just want the old games dead smh

[@Martan404]

The problem is that Dolphin emulator hard coded the Wii public keys in to the emulator. Nintendo owns those keys hence the DMCA. The fault here is with the Dolphin developers. Once they remove the keys and let users supply their own then Nintendo has nothing on them

[@Hotwopper]

Yeah Nintendo is stupid, they think they are a toy company

[@smoothcream7097]

Nintendo: Best I can do is a bad port 5 to 10 years from now at full price.

[@googleisevil8958]

@Majora the problem is, people would use Dolphin if Nintendo would just sell us Gamecube and Wii games. People are willing to buy them but for whatever reason, Nintendo just lets these games disappear. Or they tie them to the worst online service in the industry...

[@lusamine.5554]

Nintendo and Activision fighting to see who's the biggest anti-consumer company.

[@josueveguilla9069]

Don't forget Microsoft, Sony, Sega, etc.

[@newp0rt]

@@josueveguilla9069 those companies dont even come close to blizzard and nintendo. sony isnt coming after rpcs3 and makes good games and good consoles. microsoft has gamepass. sega? sega is barely alive dude. i get it corpo bad but its not even close. nintendo sues everyone, destroys lives, sells ancient games for full price etc. blizzard is on the news weekly.

[@nyxranobody3690]

@@josueveguilla9069 nah they’re okay plus SEGA is shit now unless is Sonic and Yakuza

[@HydraSpectre1138]

@@nyxranobody3690What about Persona and Total War?

[@josueveguilla9069]

@@nyxranobody3690 Too true.

[@captainspaceboy]

Me and my brother were talking about emulators while having dinner and i said "Its funny how Nintendo hasn't striked dolphin yet". Boy did that age well.

[@burnttoast26]

It should be law that if you're not actively selling games, that you cannot legally go after its emulation.

[@flameshana9]

If Nintendo actually went to court they'd pull a Disney and make it so nobody could use their stuff even if it was centuries old.

[@isaiahdaniels5643]

In a perfect world, maybe. It would certainly get rid of lazy re-releases as everyone already has that version distributed. One of my favorite games of all time is SSX 3. I have no way to play that game anymore outside of Emulation or spending a lot of money in a secondhand market. I don't have 200 dollars to drop on an Xbox, the controllers, and the game just for a thing I already had bought for me as a child. I even still have the game itself... Just no Xbox.

[@Deadsea_1993]

Nintendo is Japan's Disney and they, like Disney, seek to expand on these types of laws to control them forever. Disney is the reason why copyright laws are how they are. It is why Mickey Mouse isn't public domain. They also have tried to claim freeware folk tale characters as their own due to their "spin" on it

[@ejraday]

yeah but thats not how intellectual property works? have you literally ever heard of copyright, trademarks, or IPs?

[@toondude78]

@@ejraday You can add laws to things y'know. We can add a statement like this to copyright laws and so on. It doesn't HAVE to stay like this.

[@zeltech-alpha]

Nintendo smoking the greenest zaza

[@WorstDBDPlayer]

@LCM2 what is Blud waffling about

[@cursorguy]

@@lou06757 the termites in your skin keep trying to censor you

[@travisturner9118]

They're smoking pink za

[@ztykowork]

Smoking they money

[@rios5944]

Nintendo smokes anything but the normal

[@Torchim49]

Most people in the comments don't understand. Emulators are completely Legal. Dolphin had the official Nintendo bios built in when all other emulators had you source it for yourself.

[@ZeanZaffre]

Is there a possibility to re-upload Dolphin to Steam without the BIOS?

[@breadtube_king5744]

​​​@@ZeanZaffreyeah you just have to find the bios yourself before setting it up

[@ZeanZaffre]

@@breadtube_king5744 Thanks! I hope that's what we see in the future for this case. I'd rather sacrifice less than 5 minutes downloading the BIOS over a whole piece of software.

[@GTAbestplayer123]

​@@breadtube_king5744 or if already have the nand.bin file and key.bin file extracted from your Wii.

[@rickydo6572]

They did that? That's so god damn stupid...I mean, I'm not on Nintendo's side, but c'mon man, that's exactly the type of shit these companies want the Emulator's devs to do, they gotta be smarter than that.

[@Anarchnid]

When I heard that Dolphin was coming to Steam, I immediately knew that Nintendo was gonna get involved.

[@AJ-po6up]

Yeah I'm a huge fan of Dolphin but coming to Steam was a stupid choice, attracting such heat is not a good move at all imo.

[@thechugg4372]

@@AJ-po6up And yet retro arch is still on there with 20 times more emulators lmao

[@Ballchugger]

​@@AJ-po6up retroarch is on steam, honestly if Dolphin didn't have the decryption keys hard-coded in, they would've been fine

[@AJ-po6up]

@@MixedVictor Yeah but like Muta said Nintendo hates the Steam Deck, this release was to make it easier for people on Decks to install Dolphin, again attracting this heat from bloodthirsty Nintendo is not a good idea imo.

[@Borti_Ovi]

May I ask why emulators in general have to be on Steam to begin with? That’s just asking for trouble if I have to be honest here.

[@HiTechLoLife]

Emulation represents a great prospect for video game preservation. Especially given moving a video game collection forward is nowhere near as easy as say, movie preservation. I'm worried that this may be a precursor to something worse. An attack on emulation not seen since Sony v Bleem potentially.

[@lordevyl8317]

I love emulation, but I generally prefer hardware based emulation to software based emulation, which is why I bought a MiSTer FPGA. Only software based emulator I still use is MAME.

[@jaykelley103]

@@lordevyl8317 both ways are extremely based. I just beat castlevania 1 on retroarch while running it with 1 single frame of input lag. The og console with the real cartridge on a CRT television has 2 frames of lag, so software emu solutions are starting to become capable of truly performing better than the real hardware. And fpga mister is holding it down on the real hardware accuracy front ofc. Truly a glorious time for retro gaming.

[@BluescreenOS]

It's already been happening, for a while. Another recent one is Internet Archive being sued because they opened up their whole book library scans that they didn't have rights to yet. While, yes, IA took a risk because of COVID. That risk didn't pay off and now IA might have to shut down as a whole. Depending on how the lawsuit goes.

[@kaden-sd6vb]

Man, remember when legality and morality went together, and weren't MUTUALLY GOD DAMN EXCLUSIVE

[@goonerOZZ]

@@BluescreenOS that's not what happens to IA, their whole book library have always been open even before COVID. What happens is, before COVID IA can let people borrow only 2 digital copies per book, making them essentially a digital library. And like brick and mortar libraries they can only let limited numbers of books to be lent. Because of COVID, they let people lent an unlimited number of books, so now one title of book can be lent by unlimited number of people. Now that COVID have no longer limit people travelling capabilities IA has not yet return their 2 digital copies per title limit. Hence the lawsuit.

[@c0ntrolledchaos]

It’s amazing how Nintendo went from the happy father figure of gaming, to an iconoclast set against preserving their own history

[@Revolution5268]

Bro they always been like this since the 80s. How in the world did you just figure it out?

[@mrserious42]

Nintendo has been scummy for like 30+ years at this point

[@c0ntrolledchaos]

I think what you’re missing is that I’m not defending any scummy actions they may have done in the past, I’m highlighting the public perception of the company. Maybe due to the internet, people have become more aware of selfish/pretentious decisions made by corporations like Nintendo.

[@ElliotKeaton]

@D Dd "Grrr. Nintendo bad. Bad Nintendo man is bad!!1!"

[@ElliotKeaton]

@@c0ntrolledchaos People have been hating on Nintendo since they got into the video game industry.

[@lonelyteapot858]

One thing i love about this channel is how passionate you are about the topics you discuss.

[@thecalham]

You know it's something important to him when he opens the first few seconds with hindi

[@Ligmaballin]

Yeah especially established titles

[@user-kd1ho9bu6g]

He was shaking at one Pont and I was like omg he's so passionate about this I love it😂

[@agreedboarart3188]

​@@thecalham Huh? What did he say in Hindi?

[@shoes4clues955]

@@agreedboarart3188 nothing this video, but he does often when he's excited about covering stuff

[@evillecaston]

I had a feeling this would happen once the Steam page appeared, but it's a shame Dolphin made such a mistake. Let's hope emulation as a whole doesn't suffer the same fate.

[@joshuajefferson3504]

It depends how all this ends.

[@angel_of_rust]

why did they need to be on Steam tho? isn't the direct installation just easier?

[@clocked0]

Almost all emulators that I know of require you to dump your own keys/bios from your console. So most likely won't fall under the same fate.

[@clocked0]

@@TheSearchForTruth88 Good meme

[@we4803]

@@TheSearchForTruth88 source?

[@ZeroNeedsCoffee]

If we can't emulate them then how tf are we supposed to play them? They aren't selling those games anymore. Am I missing something? Edit: okay just heard Muta talk about it

[@johnjone965]

You're not supposed to play them. Nintendo's mind set is that you should buy their new games or wait until the new version they may or may not decide to make comes out

[@Jokoko2828]

They don't want you to play their old stuff, they want you to only buy their new shit like a good consumer drone.

[@ShockInazuma]

@@haroldbalczac6431 Even the 3D All-Stars collection didn’t have Galaxy 2 not to mention it was a limited release so you can’t even play it today unless you already have it.

[@tevinmoss12]

​@@ShockInazuma damn bro are you serious. That's foul af on NIntendon't

[@Ad3ptwastaken]

Actually it's just dolphin on steam normal dolphin still works fine

[@vintageshed965]

Copyright laws should be based on "You ain't sellin? You ain't suin!" type of logic.

[@coryyoung7544]

It is, it's called public domain. Just no gamecube game is even 25 years old.

[@Sputterbug]

nah bc then if someone stole your entire comic and released it for free and you took a massive hit to your income, that should be illegal. but for Nintendo, these games are ancient and Nintendo isn't letting us play them

[@carlthejexican7551]

Most companies actually don't pursue legal action for unsupported software or hardware. Abandoned ware is essentially that, still copyrighted just something nobody bothers to sue over because there's no reason to they're not making money for it. Nintendo is just unreasonable.

[@Woogoo336]

Exactly that. It should be written into law. You can't prove damages for something you don't make money from. At that point the only thing copyright should protect is the intellectual property itself from use in other projects.

[@SoukaDeezNutz]

I don't see gamers taking the initiative, and running for government positions to fix this. "Evil triumphs when good men do nothing" -Thomas Jefferson

[@JeyVGaming]

The second thing I hate about most Japanese companies is that they strictly protect their IPs as much as they can. Meaning, they will sue or give DMCA notice to anyone who intrudes or uses one of their property without official authorization, even if that said property is a literal decade old. They just love to stay in the past.

[@MarcosRobertoDosSantosJF]

@Leo Lux Well, the third one was not used...

[@spence6195]

Japanese people are archaic

[@GrandMasterNutBusterYoda]

can't imagine how fan creations are treated there.

[@joeblack7262]

@@GrandMasterNutBusterYoda they’re like Disney remember the Minecraft fiasco

[@GeraltofRivia22]

Not true, some like Sega are more lenient. Nintendo is the worst of the worst.

[@rgmoses2189]

Since emulation is so prevalent when it comes to Nintendo I wonder why they don't just take the Sony approach to this and release their old games on PC. How much effort does it truly take for them to port old nes, snes, and wii games to the switch as we've seen with many Mario games? And if the job isn't that hard they could be making more money just selling it on steam as I know plenty of people myself included who would gladly purchase it knowing I'm financially supporting them for their work

[@MLWJ1993]

The hardware difference between a PC & GameCube/Wii is huge though. It'd be quite the undertaking to port those games with full functionality. There's a reason Dolphin took years to get to the level of compatibility it's at now (and it's still not always perfect).

[@Mae4Ever]

Actually Steam asked Nintendo if they can have Dolphin Emulator and Nintendo just said “no”. There was no DMCA. Steam just accidentally snitched on them.

[@sorbetkidyoutube]

Common Steam L

[@goldswaggamer4007]

Common Steam L

[@ztykowork]

Common Steam and Nintendo L

[@The_Raptor]

Common Steam L

[@harryshuman9637]

Honestly, this is probably for the best. Better this than Dolphin releasing on Steam and Nintendo ordering cease and desist to the entire project.

[@laslocurasdejpelmejorblogd7519]

Nintendo suing someone for emulating? What a surprise!

[@agentmith]

No, watch the video, they distributed decryption keys which is illegal. They fucked up, basically. Nintendo is retarded when it comes to emulation and the internet but they’re in the right here.

[@bigbangrafa8435]

"Big Gaming" made serious progress agains their customers this week. First Activision basically killed 90% of the custom Call of Duty launchers that kept their games alive and safe from hackers for these past years, and now Nintendo is going after Dolphin. Their profit margins keep going up, yet It never seems enough to them, they will keep going after their communities in full force. Hollywood took a decade of bad behaviour and management to start colapsing, I'm asking myself how far we are for gaming to face something similar. These corporations must understand that there's a limit of how much you can bully your target audience before they simply move on.

[@lordevyl8317]

Technically it's not for the emulator itself, it's the fact that the emulator includes proprietary Nintendo copyrighted code I'm not defending Nintendo, I still think they are a shit company, but the emulator's devs fucked up

[@jesusbarrera6916]

They don't sue people for emulating, DOLPHIN did a big oopsie and used Nintendo property in the emulatorn

[@zac-1]

@@jesusbarrera6916 that doesnt fit the narrative

[@OffTheRailGaming]

Someone once said it's possible that Nintendo does these things purely as a way to control the market, so they can create content withdrawals and keep people hungry for every new release. It's starting to make more and more sense actually.

[@m.devellis]

It's not just possible this is literally why they do it and it's so disgusting.

[@flameshana9]

I heard from a Best Buy employee that Nintendo limits their supply on holidays to keep the demand high.

[@lostsauce0]

I'm gonna pirate even their new games because of this. Fuck em. If they go out of business, sucks to suck. Fuck around and find out. If they stop being cunts I'll buy their games.

[@ToadyEN]

Imo no mention of piracy should be mentioned. There is nothing illegal about creating a tool that emulates a gaming system. It's legal to play backups of the games that you own. The self own is the included wii common keys in the source code for dophin afaik.

[@thecreature456]

And also it's perfectly fine to pirate especially if it's a shitty company like nintendo

[@NotThatJonesShow]

Nintendo knows that this DMCA isn't gonna stop Dolphins existence or other emulators from popping up this is just another power trip from their legal team

[@knightofblackfyre7950]

Dolphin has code they legally cannot use and was told to remove cause any one with a brain knew theyd get hit for it and didn't remove it, for once I'm on nintendo's side.

[@sur_shrimpster]

@@knightofblackfyre7950 exactly

[@metal6948]

@@knightofblackfyre7950🤓🤓🤓

[@NotThatJonesShow]

@@knightofblackfyre7950 except so does every other emulator Duckstation PCSX2 YUZU CEMU Xenia Xemu how come Nintendo didn't go after YUZU again considering it's a Switch emulator that requires you to dump a clean OS rip from your switch to use it it's bullshit and a power trip period

[@xBlacklove]

​@@knightofblackfyre7950hey clown, just an FYI that code that they are using is easy to go without, all that code is doing is providing you with the idea of GameCube bios. Guess what? You can easily access one anyway if you don't own a GameCube. Shutting down a project because it made the project just a tiny bit easier for the consumer, why a travesty!!

[@Smiles-Youtube]

I say that we should have a law where if a copyrighted service isn’t currently being sold by official means it goes into public domain so that companies will always have to have some form of a version of software up to keep that copyright protection, and I would want this rule to extend to OS’s as well so that there is always the option to downgrade your version of a software.

[@alias2159]

this is just gonna encourage shitty re-releases and $60 remakes

[@Smiles-Youtube]

@@alias2159 I said the code ITSELF not the IP so remakes wouldn't be possible, re-releases would still exist but it would atleast be better then what we have rn (also it makes running emulators ultra easy)

[@Wiseman108]

This is the way.

[@evilken00]

For those don't know why Nintendo can issue a claim: Dolphin had a hard-coded encryption key which counts as using "copyrighted coded". This is an illegal way of developing an emulator. RetroArch does not have anything like this in their code which is why they can be on Steam. This has been in the Dolphin code for a couple of years and people have warned them about this, but the Dolphin team did not do anything about it. But all they have to do is remove the key and find a workaround this like RetroArch did.

[@helloguy8934]

For reverse engineering purposes it might not be illegal. I'm no lawyer, but a lot of emulators use this stuff and they haven't been taken down.

[@debug9424]

Numbers and cryptographic keys are not copyrightable (they're both also not code). The only potential claim from Nintendo is that distributing the keys constitutes a DRM circumvention method. This is not an issue of general "copyright", and would only violate the DMCA, assuming Nintendo's claims are accepted by a court, but there's precedent suggesting they might not be. As to the decryption code, algorithms can only be patented and only their implementations can be copyrighted. So unless Nintendo has a patent on the decryption algorithm (they don't), or the dolphin devs copied the decryption code instead of reimplementing the algorithm (doubtful they'd copy instead of reimplementing), there's no risk on that front.

[@JustSomeDinosaurPerson]

@@debug9424 They actually are copyrightable (under DMCA) and considered an Illegal Number, unlawful to distribute in any form, just as Muta brought up. This IS enforceable and this whole topic was covered much better by MVG.

[@JustSomeDinosaurPerson]

@@helloguy8934 No other emulator hard codes the common keys... Almost every other emulator forces you to provide one yourself. Think ePSXe and PCSX2 Bios selection. There is a reason people share this stuff on forums completely separate from the emulators and their respective repos.

[@mercury5003]

@@JustSomeDinosaurPerson I do hope its removed in a future update of dolphin. I know its inconvenient and honestly I could give less of a shit about legally aquiring it but I would prefer the dolphin dev team stay on the safe side when it comes to this sort of thing. Dolphin is probably one of if not THE best emulators out there and it would be a massive travesty if the entire emulator got a DMCA

[@skullohm5582]

Nintendo is in full savage mode this year, especially when they handed down a financial life sentence to that hacker....overkill much.

[@SERMareep2007]

​@@Mae4Ever yep and people defend him because they hop on thw hatendo train

[@luckydueces5873]

Thank you Muta, your frustration is extremely justified. This whole copyright issue around preservation (such as the way back machine) really irritates me as well

[@lordmew5]

You do not have a right to preserve other people's work by copying that art then giving it to a bunch of other people

[@lalas3590]

@@lordmew5 As long as your not profiteering from it, I see no harm resulting from sharing a 30+ year old ROM. The sole people being offended by this is corporate shills. Would you say the same thing about a novel published 200 years ago?

[@lordmew5]

@@lalas3590 yes

[@ArkumaPSO]

Everytime I look at Mario I see lawsuits and DMCA takedowns

[@flameshana9]

And yet the movie got endless praise.

[@jellymatsuryuka6853]

@@flameshana9 I mean it was good so I can see why

[@megamix5403]

Since this is Steam we're talking about, I saw this coming from a mile away the moment Dolphin was announced for it. Still sucks that this happened though.

[@klokateer4372]

Everyone probably had that thought in their head lol

[@DFX4509B]

@@klokateer4372 What if the Github repo is next and Dolphin as a whole is a target now?

[@CassiusStelar]

​@@DFX4509B then people rerelease their own downloads of Dolphin elsewhere on places like Myabandonware, Internet Archive, and other places

[@klokateer4372]

@@DFX4509B the thing is this isn't a niche emulator they're trying to crack down on everyone still going to have a copy of it in some form or another

[@DFX4509B]

@@CassiusStelar Or even clone the repo and keep it on their own local storage like I just did including two external copies, one of them being read-only - copied to an external SSD and burned to a blank CD-R because even a CD-R is better than no read-only copy at all in a home setting for anything 700MB and under (Dolphin repo is 530MB), and I don't have a BD burner currently - I have a BD reader/DVD burner combo drive, and plenty of blank CD-Rs still, so that if the worst-case scenario happens and the whole Dolphin project is taken down, I still have my own copy of the repo, plus a read-only copy, that I can build a local binary from, unless Nintendo can DMCA everyone's local storage and start kicking people's doors in en masse, which I'm pretty they legally can't do, let alone logistically.

[@BorganBorgan]

If these companies aren't stopped, I would bet money that selling used games will be in their crosshairs one day.

[@ElliotKeaton]

That's what "games as a service" is.

[@BorganBorgan]

@@ElliotKeaton This is so true

[@Wiseman108]

Many older games had "not for resell" messages on them so it's been in their crosshairs for a long time. Digital only games and limited physical releases are just ways that gaming companies try to prevent this.

[@ElliotKeaton]

@@Wiseman108 Not For Resale was put on games that came bundled with a console/handheld or some kind of collector set. It was so that customers couldn't buy a console/handheld bundle, then turn around and "return" the unopened game for a full refund, and so that retailers couldn't just remove the games from bundles and sell them as new games for full price. Look at games that come bundled with a console or collector set these days. There's no bar code on them for the exact same reason.

[@Wiseman108]

@@ElliotKeaton I remember seeing "not for resell" on way more games than that. Keep in mind I've been playing games since the early 90s.

[@jackdren9974]

I literally wouldn't be at all sad if nintendo collapses overnight and goes bankrupt. Such anti-consumer companies should not exist.

[@PendulumCancel]

I remember being super excited about going to the neighbor's place because they had a NES or a SNES in the early Nineties. Finally getting my first console (N64) and loading up games like Super Mario 64 and Smash Bros 64 was one of the highlights of my childhood. Seeing the beautiful intro sequence for Smash Bros Melee when I got the Gamecube made my jaw hit the ground and I legit couldn't believe how the little GC could produce visuals rivaling the massive Xbox with games like F-Zero GX, Metroid Prime and RE4. I truly believe some of their games and music will linger on in my memories even if I were to get Alzheimer's or Dementia. That is how strongly woven Nintendo is into my childhood and teenage memories. That said... I absolutely gree with you. Companies like Nintendo and Nvidia do their damndest to make even fanboys miserable. They're incredibly litigious and hard to deal with. I replayed the stupendous Super Mario Galaxy for the first time a couple of months ago on my dusty Wii and completed it, but Nintendo could go out of business tomorrow and I don't think I'd feel much at all. I haven't bought one of their games since the Wii U days. I would have gotten a Switch, but the hardware felt dated even at release and they charge way too much money for it even now. I've been waiting for a Switch 2 with actual decent specs and while I didn't get the hype about it I sorta do now that I own an excellent steam deck.

[@ShadowFox10587O]

I like how companies are always fighting with each other to be the most hated Activision: does something shitty EA: hold my beer Nintendo: hold my sake

[@JM-dq7xn]

I don't think they can top out nintendo, they've been shitty for over a decade

[@omegacxv8344]

Nah, Nintendo is ALWAYS on top. Fan Projects, Emulation, e-Sports, their consoles etc etc, they're just an absolute horrible company, treating their fans and customers as mere things. No other company comes close.

[@ShadowFox10587O]

@@omegacxv8344 yeah I'm still pissed at them for killing pokemon uranium

[@kingkoi4241]

Rockstar: hold this sharkcard and give us your wallet

[@ssm85ytp]

Volition: Hold my mimosa

[@DPlayer234]

I took a quick look to see how the keys in the Dolphin code were used. Firstly, they were named as public keys. Those usually aren't used to decrypt, but to encrypt or verify signatures. And it does seem like these keys are exactly used for only that: Verifying signatures. That said, I don't have a good overview of how this emulator works, so I may not have the full picture here, and I certainly have no idea how this would affect the legality.

[@TerraWare]

I love the jab at the fanboys who quickly equate emulation to piracy in every video.

[@Gatorade69]

I have an external DVD drive and use it to play my PS2 games on my PC upscaled. They look much nicer and I don't need to buy expensive upscalers as the cheap HDMI conversion thing I originally got for my PS2 has really bad video quality.

[@ErgoDreams]

Most if not all Japanese companies are known to fiercely defend copyright because of their laws. They've tried it with Saga and Monster, but if you know then you know this is nothing new. If you don't then that is a rabbit hole for another day. Everyone who is in the emulation scene should know that one day if anyone is gonna get you for emulating their stuff... it's Nintendo.

[@stevenxw]

Muta, as a staunch preservationist as well, I always greatly appreciate your fervency on the topic of emulation. Never change

[@MatteoVitello216]

Nintendo never ceases to amaze me

[@bluespinner]

Ohhhh I get it because Nintendo just issued a cease and desist and this is very common

[@MatteoVitello216]

@@bluespinner 😉

[@sorbetkidyoutube]

AYYYYYYYYYYY!

[@jytvreal]

Nintendo never ceases to desist me

[@joed5150]

Little crybaby bitch emulation fanboys never cease to amaze me either

[@KitGanji]

You’ve easily convinced me to get back into learning all I can about emulating so I can just keep a collection of my fav games/systems over the years

[@harryhack91]

This is clearly a targeted attack to Steam Deck users. Otherwise they would have sent the DMCA straight to the emulator's developer team.

[@jesuscornstorm737]

... initiated by steam tho...?

[@umbrellacorpsecurity6511]

They never figured out doing stuff like this just pisses people off to the point of making new Pirates and encouraging people to pirate by doing this

[@flameshana9]

They don't care. Bullies don't stop people from going behind their back. All they want is a show of strength to the masses. It's a pride thing.

[@shreebington]

I wonder if Nintendo is on a war path against emulators right now, as technically Tears of the Kingdom released on PC (and Steam Deck) before it even officially released on Switch. No way they're just gonna let that slide.

[@C4DeadCharge]

You don’t need to put “(and Steam Deck)” lol, the Steam Deck is a PC by definition

[@lesslighter]

@@C4DeadCharge I'm pretty sure someone with a PCMR hardon will argue that the deck is a console

[@JM-dq7xn]

N is on war with everyone today, but especially Deck

[@zelda4ever72]

Yo. How goes the presidential zomboys series? Also yeah Nintendo and Activision seriously going on war paths right now.

[@C4DeadCharge]

@@lesslighter PC means personal computer. The Steam Deck is a computer and if you own it, it is classified as your personal computer. It’s a PC

[@ninjafrog6966]

Nintendo: stop pirating and buy our games! Fans: then sell your games! Nintendo: No!

[@friendofp.24]

If Dolphin ceases development it would be an absolute tragedy for millions. Gamecube and the Wii had so many genre defining classics, and Dolphin is one of the most optimized, easy to use, and feature-full emulators. Absolutely TRAGIC if Dolphin dies.

[@heyjeySigma]

Bro. its been around FOREVER. there is nothing left to """develop"" for Dolphin.. what are u smoking. Even Cemu has finished its development and even Yuzu and ryujinx can run almost anything.

[@kekkodance]

@@heyjeySigma ...you can't finish development for an emulator. there's always room for improvement, optimization, compatibility with new OSes, new instruction sets on CPUs, GPU runtimes. you can't finish development for an emulator of a currently on the shelves console either.

[@toaster_rtx1829]

@@Hallo_215 bro i want what you’re smoking. you’re delusional if you think nintendo, or anyone for that matter can scrub anything from the internet

[@goonerOZZ]

@@toaster_rtx1829 the goal is not to scrub everything from the internet... the goal is to scrub it enough the normies cannot find them.

[@leonidas14775]

​@@heyjeySigma Its about freedom, and not letting big corporations financially destroy the little guy helping the community. Whether you think dolphin needs to be developed more is irrelevant.

[@Matiasfv]

Quick reminder that is morally ok to pirate even the newest Nintendo games out there.

[@mane0808]

Absolutely

[@jamestomlin5525]

I am lol

[@Moonking7]

@@RedCLR they probably pirate the games themselves lmao

[@nono-yw3tv]

Absolutely...... Not true. But ok....

[@TailsGuy72]

Nintendo's devs gotta eat bro... They're always making art, translating the games from Japanese to all sorts of languages, and so on. It's the bigwigs hurting us rn. Buy TOTK bruh they deserve the pay

[@Harrisonidk]

This is literally the most insane time to be a Nintendo fan

[@shadow_realm47]

Some Nintendo Exec: Okay guys let's parlay the goodwill generated by the latest Zelda game, LFG I can't wait to see what crazy thing you come up with next :)

[@jesuscornstorm737]

​@@shadow_realm47 also the populous: **pokes the fkn bear by releasing totk 2 weeks before release**

[@lazy_figetspinner_from2228]

It's crazy people would defend nintendo despite right now their movie is going to be the best selling animated one soon and sadly nintendo can take down every emulator easily no one will fight back because they don't want to deal with the financial bull crap that comes with it

[@RichardPicture]

Do YOU have the money to fight Nintendo?

[@RichardPicture]

@@drayz9655 "dO YoU"

[@AnnieRegret]

​@@drayz9655 isn't that their whole point tho?

[@RichardPicture]

@@AnnieRegret he's an idiot dont acknowledge his ignorance.

[@RichardPicture]

He's probably 30 and pissed off he still lives with his parents.

[@tarikbleak]

After this I will never feel bad about pirating Nintendo games again (for legal reasons this is a joke).

[@leonidas14775]

Don't advocate for other people to buy/play them either. Don't buy their merch

[@koinpusher]

... In Minecraft

[@Smiletofen]

Pirating Nintendo games is morally correct

[@MetalGearEnthusiast]

@@Smiletofen no its just an asshole move no matter if Nintendo or not and openly bragging about it doesnt make yourself or anyone look better.

[@doctahjonez]

Fr gotta hit em in their wallets

[@lightninggear0131]

This is going to backfire on them so hard and i am here for it.

[@tATuCentral]

My guess would be that Nintendo is attacking now is because if Dolphin comes to Steam, and makes it easier to install on the SteamDeck, they see that as “competition” to the Switch.

[@megaman37456]

The Switch isn't competition to Steam deck, even without dolphin Steam Deck would STILL steamroll the Switch.

[@joed5150]

​@@megaman37456 Lay off the drugs. Switch is almost 130 million sold to the SD's barely 3 million.

[@Diogo85]

​@@joed5150 Sales doesn't equal quality.

[@megaman37456]

@@joed5150 I'm not talking in terms of sales, I'm talking in terms of playable games and overall quality.

[@knightofblackfyre7950]

​​@@joed5150 the steamdeck costs more then the switch for one, second if you can play nintendo games on the deck then that completely negates the switch for besides maybe multiple player games. The deck also has access to pc games granted its limited but you cant say the same with the switch.

[@paultidwell8799]

Emudevs should just move their code to a country that isn't patron to the DMCA and upload with VPNs that don't log IP address, torrentfreak has a list but for the record nordvpn, ovpn, privateinternetaccess and ExpressVPN and mullvad are all good choices.

[@sorbetkidyoutube]

I mean you're not wrong...

[@AJ-po6up]

C'mon do you even watch Muta's videos? those are all in the 5 eyes, Mullvad VPN is the only real choice.

[@paultidwell8799]

@@AJ-po6up Not quite that paranoid AJ, the intelligence agencies reallyyyy don't give aa shit about Piracy. Forgot about mullvad,edited my comments.

[@Doomweapon66]

@@AJ-po6up I’ll get a little bit “meta” or whatever the f you want to call it: I would say the 3 letter agencies probably have better things to do than go after pirating but, to be fair, I could see their priorities being backwards enough to go after piracy first, everything else later.

[@Ligmaballin]

@@AJ-po6up But it's so cheap... what's the catch?

[@loomman5296]

Nintendo is the game company equivalent of the kid who reminds the teacher there was homework.

[@swinibald]

yeah but they didnt even do the homework

[@r1l3yian61]

I am not surprised that Nintendo did this.

[@pensoul5362]

All developers should love emulators cause they art lives on and no one or company doesn't have to make money off them anymore

[@lordmew5]

What if you don't want your art to live on forever and that's part of the reason you made ut?

[@Niknokinater]

Not a lawyer & obviously I don't advise anything- this is just a breakdown of my understanding at this point in time. It's been super interesting going through previous cases in similar veins to this. Right now, considering the inclusion of AES key was claimed to violate the DMCA's Anti-Circumvention & Anti-Trafficking, I've only found one successful precedent so far in relation to a decryption key- Universal City Inc. v. Corley from 2001 (the DeCSS case you mentioned). To my understanding, it was deemed that the key violated the DMCA's Anti-Circumvention & Anti-Trafficking on the grounds that it could irreparably harm Universal City's interests, as it was employed with current DVD encryption even if interoperability could not be achieved without it on custom software (playing them for example)(e.g. DMCA Section 1201F). The defendants didn't even get it working on Linux as they claimed the sole intention was due to additional limitations, afaik, instead releasing it right on Windows. The key was able to provide the ability to copy the DVDs as files. In Sega v. Accolade, on the subject of actual copyrighted code & not sharing a number (to support DMCA Section 1201F1), it was deemed that, even though Accolade included code made by Sega to make their unlicensed games work on the Genesis, Accolade was in the right, presumably due the necessity of this code for interoperability, to the best of my understanding. This same defense failed in Atari v. Nintendo that same year because Atari both lied to the patent office by saying they required it for an ongoing legal battle to get a copy of the NES lockchip source code & used non-essential parts of it not necessary for function. The noteworthy differences here in my imagination are that the Wii Common Key is both unrelated to copying copyrighted material (the games, unlike the DVD scenario), as far as I know, only decrypting / encrypting / verifying, etc. it for function on custom software & it's for an end-of-life system, revoked from sale (unlike the DeCSS case where the DVD key enabled copying & could significantly harm an active market built on that key). The integrity of Wii & its sales cannot be undermined because there's no longer a mine above. An event that did not set precedent because it never went to court was Texas Instruments backing down after being countered by the Electronic Frontier Foundation for DMCAs surrounding the sharing of the encryption / verification key that helped in the process of flashing custom operating systems onto the TI-83+ graphing calculator. It could be interpreted that the key was not a vector for copyright infringement. As for the 'Illegal Number' concept, I actually think that it's out of scope here as an AES key may not be able to be interpreted into copyrightable material (e.g. a program, an image, etc.), as it's effectively just a number that goes into an equation to serve a function, and again, in this case, a function unrelated to the act of copying actual copyrighted material & one necessary to achieve interoperability with custom software. The Wii Common Key's purpose, to my understanding, is not a vector for copying copyrighted material. This angle hinges on Dolphin not actually having the Wii BIOS, which is what I've been hearing from some users (Pierre Bourdon said it was just the key). I don't have the resources to verify between Dolphin and the Wii. Please correct me if I'm wrong anywhere, and please add additional insight ! That being said, this could become very interesting if it went to court.

[@MLWJ1993]

They indeed don't ship a Wii or GCN BIOS. They engineered their own with a separate option to load a dump of the original BIOS if the user wants to. Something most Emulators do.

[@NOCKtxt]

Nintendo has failed once at suing emulators, surely it can happen again

[@flameshana9]

And playing Russian roulette is a great way to make money. Surely you will get the empty chamber the second time too. Maybe even a third!

[@evdestroy5304]

They didn't fail though

[@thomasward6022]

⁠@@evdestroy5304 they may have hurt emulation but they didn’t kill it. All they really achieved was showing consumers how much we a hated by the company. And that is gonna lead to more emulator use.

[@evdestroy5304]

@@thomasward6022 no one said they killed emulation.

[@Dinker27]

Didn't they get Emu Paradise or something like that?

[@ztykowork]

"Play our way or get sued." -Nintendo, probably

[@megaman37456]

Me - Fucking bet.

[@NetBattler]

Sheesh Nintendo executives full of boomers...

[@spence6195]

Pay us $50 a year to play a few classic games or get sued

[@TheCheeseMovesSideways]

@@NetBattler stubborn boomers who doesn't understand what the word "preservation is"

[@flameshana9]

Or give us 30% of your wages for life--even better.

[@Chesterchili]

As someone who has been waiting to get Twilight princess Crime is starting to feel more and more welcoming each day

[@thatsruffdog]

I just got Dolphin yesterday. I felt like preserving my favorite Wii games.

[@0potion]

The thing about it is if they did direct parts of pretty much all of their old games I would buy of my old favorites again willingly. But since the vast majority of my favorites aren't available. I'll just keep emulating. Plus it's just easier in my opinion to run randomizers and such on emulation rather than on actual hardware.

[@ashenhare4567]

It's possible that dolphin could win. There was a lawsuit with Oracle and Google where google copied 11,600 lines of code from Oracle, out of 2.9 Million lines. The Court found that Google's repurposing of Oracle's interface "adds something new and important," and "further[s] the development of computer programs." This approach could work because the keys don't make up the majority of the creation, it could be considered trans-formative.

[@bobocop69420]

I'm a casual Mutahar viewer but this is the most worked up I've seen him. I FELT that hair swipe at 1:09

[@juza64]

I hope they take it to a U.S. court and get one of the many judges that hate Nintendo with a passion. Nintendo wishes they had as much pull on the U.S. government like they do on their own.

[@goonerOZZ]

just a reminder Gary Bowser's case is done in the US and the US is trying to extradite 2 more people from France for the same case. US is the one making these copyright laws and Nintendo use them

[@juza64]

@@goonerOZZ A win for Nintendo in court but ultimately a L for their market equity in the long run.

[@goonerOZZ]

@@juza64 yeah looking at the numbers.... Noone cared about that court except for you guys. And my ultimate point is, that Gary Bowser case is not just about Nintendo setting an example, it's actually more of US copyright law setting an example. Because the US government really does work hard to extradite the other 2 people from France

[@kaden-sd6vb]

​@@goonerOZZ yeah, the US government/judicial system is ENTIRELY a puppet for megacorporations. You cannot have a chance to win, unless you wield billions of dollars yourself, and of course, anyone who has that sort of money is either unrelated or is part of the problem group.

[@elit3darkness]

...Not to mention buying third party usually comes with an outrageous mark-up, or over-inflated prices

[@kev2034]

Actually how I got into emulation. Didn't want to pay £300 for an obscure PS1 game that only got released in Japan so thought screw it. Ended up being my introduction into a lot of old consoles that came before my time.

[@Teddyrific]

What pirates do, Nintendont.

[@sorbetkidyoutube]

BA DUM TSS!

[@brentsheltz6473]

What these companies should do once they are done supporting a game or hardware, make it public domain. They aren’t making any money from it and protecting copyright for stuff they don’t make money from costs more and doesn’t provide any benefit for them. Just move it to public domain and wipe their hands of it.

[@Levi-gh1sq]

That or port it to pc

[@forrandomsites3336]

Not happening, ESPECIALLY if a game has officially licensed music and cars, unless they remove all the copyrighted files.

[@xx_isabel_the_wolf_xx3869]

Here from your convo with vaush

[@Ness_and_Sonic]

The thing is because the hardware is so old, one could claim the circumvention is legal because the hardware is likely to fail. In fact, I can speak with some first experience in the sense that I've had both a Gamecube and a Wii fail on me. We've also seen Wii Us fail, too. However, if Retroarch doesn't need it, I've to wonder if it can be removed safely.

[@Ninja0Pain]

I do think there is enough precedent for Dolphin to win a legal case assuming they had the funds to do so. I don't think Nintendo wants this to go to court either. They're definitely using this as a scare tactic and expecting arbitration if it escalates further. This going to the courts has the potential to do more harm than good on both sides. It's honestly so bizarre that they don't just let sleeping dogs lie at this point with Dolphin.

[@rahulpanuganti4623]

But the dolphin emulator has copyrighted keys in it, meaning if it does go to court Nintendo will likely win. On the other hand, RetroArch doesn't have these, which is why they can be on steam with no issues.

[@Ninja0Pain]

@@rahulpanuganti4623 Universal would love to talk to you about King Kong.

[@rahulpanuganti4623]

@@Ninja0Pain Yeah and if Nintendo had made a game with king Kong they probably would have lost the lawsuit. I highly doubt dolphin would come out on top if this goes to court. But I doubt it will. Most likely dolphin and valve will back down.

[@MooseCastle]

@Rute Fernandes Tendie spotted.

[@sonicjoplus]

@@rahulpanuganti4623 But that isn't relevant without something to use, say maybe the copyrighted game in particular.

[@zalzalahbuttsaab]

*Summary* - The video discusses Nintendo's DMCA claim against the Dolphin Emulator on Steam due to its use of cryptographic keys, while also exploring the ethics of game emulation and preservation, particularly for systems no longer supported by their original companies.

[@randehmarshgames4608]

I dont support piracy Unless it’s pirating Nintendo

[@MixedVictor]

Adobe exists bro

[@theblackgamer8103]

So you support piracy

[@Panklne]

morally correct

[@jer1776]

Or EA

[@markm0000]

@@MixedVictorwell in the case of Adobe they actually improve their products and add more features over time, albeit, at a horrendously slow rate. They deserve to get paid.

[@jer1776]

Nintendo has basically become the Japanese EA

[@FlamespeedyAMV]

They always have been, Nintendo has always been a horrible company, plus they have links to the Yakuza

[@LoganWard4621]

@@FlamespeedyAMV what the heck is yakuza?

[@CallMeHunt04]

​@@LoganWard4621 "Japanese mafia"

[@sophieedel6324]

Nintendo never issued a single DCMA. Steam contacted Nintendo and asked if they should take it down.

[@johndor7793]

Why post this as its own thread instead of the popular ones. No one will see it.

[@danielcoffman1022]

Once you (the company) decide not to sell a product anymore, you shouldn’t be allowed to own it or say what happens to existing IPs.

[@FlamespeedyAMV]

Especially if they don't keep updating it or take action in order to properly port it. For example, 40 winks got released on the n64 recently and has a steam port, so they should have way more rights over their IP because of this.

[@lordevyl8317]

I agree, but there should be a timeline. Like for example, if a game has been made from a franchise in like 5 years or so.

[@benjirodaboi8063]

Honestly I’ve expected a video like this, but I honestly am glad. That someone gets it. I was having another conversation with someone earlier who liked the fact that the emulator was being sued, but you made some good points overall

[@ArtemisKitty]

That's actually a very good point regarding the SteamDeck et al. This removes the separation barrier between PC gaming and console gaming that they have built their entire business on. If that gets eroded... they really are in a difficult situation right now due to their ongoing policy to "make fun games, not worrying about who has the strongest hardware." There's a reason some games are said to have "a Nintendo look" - for several generations of hardware, programmers have had to deal with making current games on several systems, only one of them (Nintendo) is 2-3 generations behind the others you're coding for. This is also why they often don't port well. Emulators take care of all of the issues that arise from this, such as dropping framerates and lag on some games due to the inability of the GameCube or whatever to keep up with the demands of the game. This means we can play the games BETTER by not using their machines, therefore NOT being tied to their financial ecosystem. It's a tough time for them. Edit: fixed a couple of typos. Sorry, typing on my mobile.

[@rambutan_lychee9255]

I would not be surprised if one day Nintendo would try to sue the entire Italian government because Mario & Luigi are Italian themselves.

[@Getcrustified]

And somehow, they’d fucking win

[@MDGOLD]

Me who Part italian: Nintendo my freaking God you want Stop at anything to get You want....

[@Dr.UldenWascht]

Nintendo's legal team know exactly what they are doing. First they take down Dolphin (on the basis of cyrptographic keys) on Steam whom they know aren't looking for a legal battle. And once they've succeeded on that front, they've already primed the legal system to allow takedown of Dolphin everywhere else.

[@lordevyl8317]

@A man who enjoyes adventure. Not really, as long as sycophantic fanboys still exist... boycotts very seldom work. For every Boycott that has actually worked "New Coke" for example there were about 50 that didn't. Boycotts with any political motivation, especially

[@sertiana2512]

I mean Tears of The Kingdoms sold really well in a matter of days. Nintento is not going to lose their dedicated fanboys as long as they keep feeding these braindeads with games.

[@level1skeleton317]

​@A man who enjoyes adventure. Dude their reputation is dead, fanboys will fanboy forever. Until they stop shilling nothing changes

[@NatetheNintendofan]

​@@lordevyl8317 part of me evidence and open and wants to boycott them just cuz they make all these terrible decisions they go after pointcrow they update the 3DS to destroy CFW now they tried to take down Dolphin Emulator

[@yarc9]

@@NatetheNintendofan boycott’s are stupid

[@Austanos]

i’m a strong believer in the only time you shouldn’t pirate a game is when it’s going to struggle from it, like pikmin 4 coming in july if it doesn’t sell well we’re probably going to have to wait another 10 years

[@curbthepain]

Good thing archiving is a thing and dolphin is pretty much fleshed out at this point. Means even if they as a site/developer go away you'll always be able to use it. Provided you can still find an archived copy of the software.

[@lightninggear0131]

Way back machine is definitely going to be the way if this gets taken down

[@lightninggear0131]

@Nunya Beezwax ..they need to touch grass

[@NotBasedEnough]

This is why I actually started to hold onto installers for fan made programs and tools

[@standard5131]

Love you muta, this is very important topic and I am appreciative that you voice your frustration as a consumer. Many feel the same

[@ExG131]

I'm glad my love for Nintendo died when I was younger during the Gameboy Advance SP Era. NOW they have become the villain of the industry.

[@nerdporkspass1m1st78]

The way he talks about video games to the point of shouting is absolutely hilarious. Love your videos, you explain yourself well.

[@defeatSpace]

If Nintendo weren't the worst at security, they'd set up their own Emulation platform.

[@OldTimeyDragon]

I think the reason Nintendo's so slow to tackle emulation is because it's been tried before, and it doesn't always go in the plaintiff's favor. In the same way that a case going in favor of the big N would set a precedent against emulation, a case going against them would set a precedent _FOR_ emulation, and Nintendo is afraid of that. I think this was a straw that broke the camel's back so to speak because this isn't just some Joe Schmo team working from a basement, but has involvement from a direct competitor (Valve). I think Nintendo might be testing the water with this one, and will further litigate if it goes in their favor; or they're hoping that Steam will work with them, but I'm not so sure they will.

[@robbegeusens1302]

Instead of hireing these incredible talents that have made one of the best emulators in existence to help create and improve their own emulators, they sue them. Honestly considering their track history I'm surprised this hasn't happened earlier.

[@mayravixx25]

Good thing I still have Dolphin Emulator installed on my end without Steam. If they're targeting the steam version it's only a matter of time before they go after the actual emulator itself

[@megaman37456]

They have no legal ground to target the actual emulator, if they did, they'd have done it years ago.

[@hoss70711]

Thank you for making eye contact at 3:39

[@LoveHandle4890]

Mutahar wearing red, the color of danger ain’t no coincidence now.

[@TiL_Deimos]

watching this guy high is so enjoyable, so much i could be learning and im here just chilling, love muta. ❤😂

[@NubreedFighter]

Mutahar is as pissed off as I am when I wake up to find out I have work

[@Mizikame]

If anything Legally follows through in Nintendo’s Favor.. Be prepared for any of the potential following aftershocks: -You may not be able to download the Dolphin Emulator anymore -So make sure you have the latest version installed on your computer -As once it’s locally saved to a drive Nintendo can’t remove it -Anything Online-Related through Netplay Compatible Games running through Dolphin Emulator may halt one by one or halt all together if Nintendo has its way -Get your ROMs/ISOs dumped and installed ahead of time to avoid any possible issues of Dolphin not allowing new games to be added that haven’t been linked and opened at least once before a possible true cease & desist is applied from Nintendo -Open Dolphin every few days to make sure any new updates are downloaded/installed before a possible Update Server Farm takedown

[@wriathwar285]

I remember using dolphin in my freshman year we played mario kart double dash. Back in 2013 i even remeber a tech teacher installed dolphin emulator to the class room computers and we had different tournament for games. Good times

[@train_go_boom2065]

Wish they released double dash on switch

[@juniorm8857]

This is my first time seeing this channel and after that 3 minute rant I'm subbing just because it was pure entertainment 😂

[@NostalgiaNet8]

I'm concerned this could go beyond just Valve.

[@Neolith_]

Always admired how you manage to deliver serious news with the best humor. Don't change, Muta.

[@wii43j2]

Wow, take legal action against the emulator and not the sites providing the illegal games ☠️

[@Yoshiinite]

Nintendo literally sued Emuparadise's site and won lol

[@daniel5620]

Muta is honestly a boss, I love that he has standards with his game play and won't settle for any less xD DUMP THAT CART AND PLAY IN 4K!!!!!!

[@AppLHD]

I would get the “just buy them legally” argument if they didn’t just shut down the Wii U eshop, which was the ONLY MARKET that still sold Wii games that Nintendo directly profited from. Even then it did not have many options.

[@TheAbsol7448]

Even then, that's not a good solution because it's the fucking Wii U. All of these old games should be on PC, and maybe mobile. You know, the places where people actually pirate these games, and the places where backwards compatibility isn't an issue? _Right,_ Nintendo?

[@AppLHD]

@@TheAbsol7448 what system companies decide to sell their games on is another thing entirely. They have the freedom to do that. So no the problem isn't that it isn't on systems x, y, and z, instead the problem is they don't put it on any system where you can legally buy it without getting fucked by 2nd hand stores.

[@TheAbsol7448]

@@AppLHD All of these old games should be on one accessible platform. Eventually, the Wii U eShop would almost be as bad as old cartridge prices because the demand for the Wii U would only go up in time for those legal purchases. That isn't by any means acceptable. Who wants to own a Wii U, a Wii, a DSi, a N3DS, a PSP, a PS3, a PS4/PS5, a 360, and an Xbox One/Series S|X to have access to every generation older than current? That's why I keep saying these games should all be on PC.

[@macksnotcool]

1:08 ****EXCEPT FOR Just Dance 2020 for Nintendo Wii which is still available officially.

[@noahthespike]

This whole situation reminds me of the time Nintendo sued the Game Genie for providing cheat codes in their NES games, altering copyrighted code. But Nintendo lost the lawsuit because you would need to purchase a copy of the game to even use the codes. It's like a book that you purchased and you replaced all of the periods with commas. Yeah you'll look like an idiot, but once you've bought it, you can do what you fucking want with it.

[@noahthespike]

@@09f9 y'know that is true. And my reasoning to think that is probably different from yours, but Nintendo really just ports all of their old games or games that don't demand a lot out of the hardware (NES, SNES, Game Boy, Game Boy Advance). So therefore they can make 100% a case there. For Wii and GameCube, they're just embarrassing themselves

[@coryyoung7544]

​@@09f9 action replay still exists so they probably wouldnt.(I think there was also something for the switch but blanking on the name) Those actually fall under something like cronus which is in a super gray area.

[@Vessick]

That analogy sounds suspiciously like the one made by Scott the Woz in his video about cheat devices

[@noahthespike]

@@Vessick because it is. He made a great analogy, and it deserves to be repeated. Though not a 100% quote (all from memory)

[@coryyoung7544]

@@09f9 Gary bowser was selling jail broken consoles and games, these fall under accessories that affect the game you legally bought totally different. If nintendo won that case cheats would become illegal something they currently aren't. (There's no law but it breaks tos so there can be fines and jail time if you can't pay those fines)

[@PSOpwnage]

Imagine what kind of games we got if we spent the past decade improving things instead of focusing on money

[@flameshana9]

Games that are higher res than 720p? Nonsense, 20 fps is all you deserve!

[@raspiankiado]

Imagine someone, "pirated" the Dolphin Emulator. Put it to Steam's chopping block, under a different name, and Nintendo ignored it. Then, Dolphin is given the differently named Dolphin.