No Scrubs VS No Pigeons: Music Gender Wars (TLC vs Sporty Thievz)

A documentary detailing the infamous No Scrubs VS No Pigeons musical battle of 1999! RIP Left Eye and Marlon Brando. Features T-Boz, Chilli, King Kirk, Big Dubez, Kandi Burrus, Mr Wood$, DJ Rude.
Sources: www.theringer....
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[@MissAlmostFine]

This deep dive into the "No Scrubs" vs "No Pigeons" 'gender war' just shows there's nothing new under the sun. Only this time instead of fun songs we all can sing along and dance to like back then, we have grifters radicalizing young ppl in the worst ways imaginable😒 Rest In Peace to Left Eye and Marlon. They both had so much to offer and their deaths were a loss to us all.

[@romello4913]

💯💯💯🎯🎯🎯🎯

[@jeremybrown9611]

It was crazy being called a Scrub at 8 years old😂😂😂😂

[@AlexJonesFool]

😂

[@maliksmith9003]

Ok but can we like talk about how we were being stacked up against that grown man game before we had ball hair?

[@Maryland-Man-Son]

@maliksmith9003 wanting to go pay $1200 rent to not live at home anymore

[@turtleclub840]

Factory

[@meechmitchell2384]

Bro I was in 4th grade or 3 and was called that by on the swings 😂

[@tanjigandy]

You are a LEGEND for creating these visual essays of how crucial TLC’s impact was on the zeitgeist of the 90’s, 2000’s, and beyond. So well researched, so thoroughly executed. Your videos are like time capsules from my childhood through the lens of someone who clearly knows and understands the culture. Thank you.

[@isaidwhatIsaid86]

No Scrubs WITH the rap is the only version I acknowledge.

[@kingdivostrut]

@@isaidwhatIsaid86 THIS!!!!!!

[@daniel_vaughannn]

RIP to Marlon Brando of Sporty Thievz and Left Eye

[@Forteoverload]

Moral of the story: Scrubs and pigeons exist, ya'll can get out ya feelings now. If it don't apply to you, let it fly.

[@jeremybrown9611]

It's crazy how folks even in this comment sections are battliñg over those 2 songs. I was what round 8 yrs old when those songs dropped and I'm 34 now, those songs still got folks in their feelings😂. I agree tho if the hat fits then wear it and if it don't then it's just music to Bop too😂

[@StreetsofATL_19]

@@jeremybrown9611😂🤣😂🤣I get where you are coming from but you aren’t familiar with the zeitgeist. Women in general abused the word and verbally attacked men with no reason or justification thus there was a direct response to the disrespect with disrespect.

[@Translationsthruspeakers]

It’s literally that simple🎯 if you’re a guy upset about “No Scrubs” after all these years, something struck a nerve. If you’re a woman upset about “No Pigeons”, something struck a nerve. Let it go.

[@Jaleel_HS]

I work a good job, pay all my bills alone, put myself through school and because i dont drive right now i was called a scrub. yall gotta just learn to laugh and move on. some stuff isnt worth your time

[@danavixen6274]

Ahh! The late 90s Musical Gender Wars. No Scrubs vs. No Pigeons was DEFINITELY a thing. 1999 was a good time to be a HS senior. 😂

[@92alpha13]

Looking back on being called a scrub because I didn’t have a car and lived with my mom while in high school made sense. Because the majority of the girls in my high school was dating mid 20s d boys who drove Chevy Cavaliers on 15s with 12 6x9s blasting Slob on my Knob while picking them up from school. Not mad, just grateful.

[@ngelwings]

yeah i never got mad from the song

[@xxXlaytSss]

Gah Damn sporty thieves was always ready to respond LMFAOO

[@kiwthebeauty]

Listen to me! I was there in 1999 and when this video dropped we felt like we hit the future. We were sure Y2K was gonna look like this…we were wrong! But it doesn’t change the fact that this song just went crazy! I had no idea this song was made for Xscape I thought Kandi purposely wrote it for TLC. That was her best business decision I know she eats very well off that song!!

[@hazelmonroe7725]

Kandi be eating alone off her pen game . She's been writing and giving songs away since the 90s

[@danavixen6274]

Kandi's pen 🖊️ game is just as UNDENIABLE as her PERFECT smile. 😁

[@phillinsogood]

“Beyoncé & Friends” my type of petty hand me your phone 😂

[@jamesbishop2000]

No pigeons song sounds a mess 😂. No Scrubs is iconic and still a hit 20 plus years later. Chilli ate with her response

[@newelldavis1858]

Boy u wack ..No Pigeoms is still an anthem..the group just didn’t last ..u used to eat lunch at the girls table 😂

[@JaiOdom-d1d]

Glaze

[@MEBOLOR]

@@newelldavis1858 not even bro they got no scrubs in fortnite i don't see pigeons in fortnite

[@Oozeyjew8604]

Never thought I’d see a video about these 2 songs ever

[@TheoriginalPR1]

I was shocked when I looked up No Pigeonz on KZbin and saw men and WOMEN praising and defending the song in the comments lol.

[@hazelmonroe7725]

Cuz some of these females are pigeons duh 😂😂😂😂

[@romello4913]

It was a harmless response. Nothing was wrong with it.

[@Captain-America4992]

Women don't really do all that sisterhood stuff, most women side with their men. The only women deep into that sisterhood, feminist, misandrist stuff are lesbians.

[@lolabunny1157]

@@Captain-America4992that’s a ridiculous statement.

[@raregrimebeats1352]

The song was not a diss song to TLC. More akin to a remix/redux if anything.

[@host2498]

Never was offended by TLC's version but I loved the response track too. Everybody thinking they the prize

[@byronrush9802]

I just assumed some girls who called me a scrub wasn't worth my time, so I just kept walking and started talking to someone else

[@NDGOCHYLD]

How in TF did I miss the whole TLC series? I am subscribed and my bell is on. KZbin your days is numbered.

[@joehewlett897]

Craziest thing that I often hear and see discussed is the fact that mainly my generation mostly 38 year olds now where the guys point out that a lot of women who sung this so aggressively growing up still grew up to choose and lay with the scrubs they sung along so passionately about 😂😂😂😂😂

[@TheoriginalPR1]

Not gonna lie tho, I can see how TLC could be a bit hypocritical sometimes and not just with No Scrubs, Chilli for example wants a man who will accept her small breasts (see Unpretty) but she'll be the first to shame and ridicule men with small penises. Sidenote: I always kinda got the vibe that Left Eye never fully agreed with the message of the song, which wouldn't have been the first time. BUT at the same time it's not like TLC never held women accountable for their poor behaviors too. They had a whole song called Silly Ho, I think T-Boz even called it a "female scrub" in an interview and of course the "Ho remover" interlude. So meh.

[@surfacesweller751]

@@TheoriginalPR1 Do you remember when Chilli wanted to chase after Floyd Mayweather so bad and rejected every man that her the dating specialist brought to her? I heard Mack10 used to be at TBoz. These are the women who millennial women were taking dating advice from.

[@Enigmajestic1]

"like this aint my car, like that aint yo hair UH OH"😂😂😂

[@familybizness9398]

What an awesome job on this. Exceptional commentary. Well-articulated breakdown. Keep up the good work.

[@KammyG]

This was recommended to me and i watched the whole thing! Your voice is soothing and you kept the information entertaining and engaging.

[@happycampersincorporated]

I feel like no scrubs vs no pigeons, they are both talking about the bad parts of the opposite gender. So I feel like they would agree more than fight

[@surfacesweller751]

@@happycampersincorporated Chilli and t box seemed less agreeable

[@jayburnell128]

RIP Marlon Brando and Left Eye

[@marceejohnson4113]

No Pigeons is LIT AF!! My pick between the two songs. Still gets in the current rotation.

[@D00M3R-SK8]

"Your flat a$$, gets enough laughs, take it to the salon and wax your mustache" :'D

[@malaysiabarrmb]

Jeury, you never miss! This gave me a good laugh and made me think about a few things.

[@freestyleskyline]

Im a dude. I love both songs. Lisa Left eyez verse was my favorite. And no pigeons was hilarious parody to me

[@scorpio1647]

Outstanding documentary! I always wanted to know the backstory of no scrubs! Great details and editing.

[@eazycustomsbyeric5403]

That scrub song never bothered me it was actually pretty good

[@tash8492]

No pigeons always took me out 😂😂😂😂. I use to recite both songs back in high school with no care in the world 🤦🏾‍♀️

[@freezhollywood]

This is why music just hit diff back then. Relatable to everybody! It spoke to the everyday ppl. Music now is just look how rich I am.

[@Uta_Chandra.H]

I miss the times when people can settle their differences through talent or compassion. Alot more productive energy than bickering through tweets or Crying at the court house😂

[@danderson8431]

I appreciate your TLC deep dives. You’re sharing information that I didn’t know despite loving them for their entire career. I was 9 when “Ohhhhh… On The TLC Tip” came out.

[@blackcoffy83]

Great video! It brought back memories of the late 90s and early 2000s. Very detailed, and I learned some facts that I didn't know before.

[@toniamcclelland-sample7278]

Kandy and Tiny made the best decision!!

[@LBgodchild]

TI wasn't having it! Plus what's considered an unattractive girl group bashing men?!

[@gavinmccleskey3363]

RIP Marlon & Lisa it still hurts me deep down.

[@bfnfamily]

You can just be minding your business and your life ends because of an idiot is out in the world.

[@darrindrones5304]

At the end of the day, both songs are about calling out the wannabes.

[@jimmckinney1935]

No scrubs created this bizarro world we live in now.

[@MegaPsycho84]

True dat

[@surfacesweller751]

Thank you

[@gregorygriffin6341]

To anyone who would be interested in the deeper context of the term "scrub", it is actually a sports term. A scrub would be someone who claims they can play, but is truly horrible at the sport. For further proof, check out the clip in "THE GOLDEN CHILD" where Eddie Murphy is playing basketball with children. He was the first to use it!

[@justifiedbyjeury]

“Scrub” may have been used in sports too, but the term actually goes back even further than that. Chilli said in an interview with Rosie O’Donnell that she was called Scrub repeatedly in the 9th grade because she was the new kid. Chilli would’ve entered the 9th grade in 1985. THE GOLDEN CHILD was released the following year. But T-boz told TMF that people in her mother’s generation used the term as far back as the 1940s.

[@katlehokomeke]

When I was in University, this song motivated me to get my money up. Sometimes shaming men works.

[@LIFEWITHTHEJONESES1]

Had to subscribe as soon as i saw the title. I remember when sporty thievz came out with their response track. They had a few more songs, but no pigeons is still a classic to this day, in my opinion.

[@Rieky22]

It’s really eerie how one of each member died from vehicle related deaths like seriously woah 😳

[@kingraisin]

Your delivery of the lyrics at 4:15 is pure gold, and when you hit the words "no scrub" I literally LOL'ed 👏

[@phillinsogood]

Love your videos!! Nothing will ever top pop culture from the 90’s. Can’t wait to see what other nostalgia artist you will talk about

[@melanino]

I mean no pigeons is funny, but I remember TLC, I dont even know who sings no pigeons

[@XJag9684]

If you had a Britney Spears or Spice Girls CD and not one Jay or Cash Money Cd, then you most def won't remember any part of that spring of '99 rap history. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that at all!

[@marvinhurley2752]

​@XJag9684 men and women was singing no pigeons

[@kimoramicheal8353]

I just had a feeling u would have mentioned the tragic car accidents from both groups. Somehow I thought you would have added the member from Blaque Natina Reed since they were signed under Left Eye. I always found all three incidents so freaking eerie! Once again another great video from you!

[@TheLoveBellows]

He already mention Natina death in other videos. This video had nothin to do with Blaque

[@potatochip4202]

Either way, Kandi Buruss got paid 💅🏽

[@jaysonderrickson9540]

Folks made way too much of these songs for real and the reactions to it then (and especially now just looking thru the comments) showed the huge distance between black men and women. Both sides have deep rooted issues and problems that need to get fixed and the finger pointing and blame game isn't helping. It honestly is pathetic how folks act and can't seem to function in relationships today.

[@nunyabizz3518]

All this time I thought "Chickenhead" was the response to "No scrubs". After all these years I finally know the truth🤣

[@DLCOrganization]

Well, who did the song "Chickenhead"?

[@czotheghostgmail]

@@DLCOrganizationproject pat

[@nunyabizz3518]

@@DLCOrganization Pat project

[@maverickhunter24]

I remember chicken head tho not no pigeons.

[@LTKK]

I love music history. I never knew about these response records. Thanks so much for this. salute! 17:43 COME THROUGH WITH THE VOCALS BRUH! I HEAR YOU lol

[@kingdivostrut]

I love TLC so much. Their FANMAIL era set a precedent for female groups. No Scrubs will forever stand the test of time. From T-BOZ’s iconic dance sequence in the video, to LEFTEYE’s iconic rap verse, and CHILLI’s vocals.. man this song is just phenomenal

[@shamoney9385]

This was a classic, I remember being in elementary recess and the girls and boys having a scrub vs pigeons war 😂. Learned a lot from this video.

[@McHotti]

This was a great video you kept me up during my teams meeting lol but you’re definitely have a new subscriber

[@AntDevon]

One of your best videos yet. Great work.

[@LeroyFurious]

You earned a subscriber, this was perfect.

[@kayyjayy32]

It’s crazy how both of these are are still fitting 🙊😂

[@HelzHeli313]

Man girls was calling us SCRUBS in elementary school.. When PIGEONS came out it was like God calling around that era

[@misfittv313]

What about women being called b*tches and 304s in songs? Boys were singing along. So if anything no scrubs was God calling

[@MrKingkz]

So true i find it all funny now but getting called a scrub at like the age of 10 wasnt very nice so it was really nice to have are own to sing back lol

[@russelladams7134]

King Kirk is a talented dude. Great video. Rest in peace to Marlon Brando and Left Eye.

[@lindozik2063]

Amazing breakdown 👌 And so crazy how a member from each group passed away on the same year😮

[@notdorawinifred1127]

This is so funny that dudes took No Scrubs so seriously 😂

[@Trestl0]

Only the guys who it applied to😂

[@matthewlee4697]

It wasn't seriously....it was more like a parody though

[@ramoduff9399]

RIP TO MARLON BRANDO OF SPORTY THEIVZ. RIP TO LEFT EYE OF TLC.

[@jbk19xx57]

What a time to be alive.

[@nicolemoore04]

I feel like you can only be offended by what applies to you, if it don't then it really shouldn't bother you especially bcuz someone's perspective or experience is just that , it's nothing to take personal. I feel only scrubs were offended by no scrubs & only pigeons were offended by pigeons. 💯

[@DLCOrganization]

Only one problem with that theory -- If you were watching and listening carefully, you will have noticed that while "No Scrubs" was a one-off (at least with the kind of impact it had) for TLC, the THEME was directly connected to similar songs by Destiny's Child -- all of which were penned by Kandi Burruss. The ultimate purpose of these songs was to stigmatize and demonize ALL men and was NOT AT ALL a coincidence. So it was important that these harmful anti-male message were checked well in advance as they were.

[@DialloMoore503]

No, that’s not how it works. It someone insults homeless people, I’m going to take offense. I’m not homeless. It’s called using your voice to stand up for what you believe.

[@autumnasters]

Watching this on the 25th anniversary of No Scrubs release date 😊

[@2ruthl355]

@29:00 i finally found this version 😂 since my early teens. It’s like nobody around me I knew what I was talking about. I clearly remembered “I-can’t-trick-my-cash so pigeons-do-not-ask”

[@RemyLeBeaü-b7l]

So the sporty thieves were basically just responding 2 every popular male bashing track they could 🤔 GOT IT 👍💯

[@marky3609]

Man I loved this song when I was a kid growing up I didn't care TLC was favorite group

[@pureromanceable]

This song was everyone favourite song of 1999 by TLC. There was hip-hop version "No pigeon" by Sporty thievz.There had been heated bickering between female and male views between the two songs .Even though it made history in the music billboard chart there won't be another song to replace "No scrubs" vs "No pigeon".Much respect to Kandi and Tiny (Escape).R.i.p Lisa"left eye"Lopes and Marlon Brando they both would be missed their legacies continues.

[@cropp]

I created my email based off of no pigeons back then. Til this day nobody knows what i be talking about when they ask what my email means. Glad to see someone remembers!

[@surfacesweller751]

No pigeons was only known in the Tri-state

[@faeriegraver]

I'm English and I remember it ​@@surfacesweller751

[@jaklumen]

​@@surfacesweller751I'm in a remote, rural area of Eastern Washington state and I caught No Pigeons. But I'm also old enough to remember Grandmaster Flash and The Message as well as Houdini's The Freaks Come Out, so I dunno what to tell you

[@tty23]

​@@surfacesweller751I don't even think y'all in the East Coast know that trie state refers to any 3 states, but that said...I didn't remember the song until they showed the Ricki late segment..it was definitely around the country but scrubs was a bigger track

[@D00M3R-SK8]

Ha ha, my friend had "No Pigeons" on tape (remember singles on tape? hahaha, wow) we used to blast it all the time in our makeshift music-machine. We had a shopping trolley, with some music playing device (likely a boomboox, but I don't fully remember) hooked up to a car battery, and we'd go around challenging random people to dance battles. Our favourites to play were the new "at the time" Dre album (chronic 2000) and I had an old Electro tape, with stuff like Electric Kingdom by Egyptian Lover, on it, too. Whenever we ran into Drunken Girls singing "No Scrubs" we'd switch the tape out for "No Pigeons" though. Was hilarious.

[@anthonyjames9745]

I remember hearing no pigeons growing up but it popped into my memory last year and i still play it from time to time.

[@surfacesweller751]

I did not realize the effect that this song would have on women until i became dating age so i think i liked this song when it came out. I used to jam to this song as a kid not knowing any better.

[@TranceCore3]

I love how the term "scrub" became standard FGC lingo Also you went crazy with the editing lmao

[@natv55]

What's FGC?

[@ptrco5]

I really enjoyed the era of the response to song as well as the collaborations. Continuous peace To Marlon and Left eye 🕊️❤️🕊️

[@theatlantaspectator]

Left Eye rapped like 2Pac on No Scrubs

[@HildaSerrano16]

Lisa and Marlon both had cute slanted eyes 🥺 Rest In Peace

[@gsignaturemessage]

No Scrubs was a massive hit. I was in sixth grade I think. But when No Pigeons dropped, we were relieved to have a comeback.

[@ahmad.tillery.1987]

RIP Marlon Bryant March 19, 1979 - May 11, 2001. 🙏🌹

[@Jetanium]

This must be where the term "bird brain" comes from 😂😂

[@dj2prince]

Marlon from that group was a hero. He saved that child from the van.

[@jeremyhall2727]

I never even heard of the guy's group 😅

[@vincentwelch8577]

Its so funny i was 14 in 99 when No Scrubs came out i was in the 8th Grade and i remember in school girls calling me and my friends Scrubs and we like huh we in Middle school of course we cant drive and have no money we live with our parents it was all in good fun and the No Pigeons joint had us rolling back then. Again all in good fun

[@surfacesweller751]

@@vincentwelch8577 it might have seemed harmless back then but it was definitely training young women to look at you and other men a certain way when you got older. I thought it was funny back then too until I became dating age.

[@vincentwelch8577]

@@surfacesweller751 good one fam I didn't even think of it that way especially back then that was training girls to think a certain way. Cuz it used to trip us out then them same girls got to Highschool and only dated older guys and it's funny nobody had a problem then with that now everyone is up in arms about it but hey that's another conversation.

[@413westernmassbornjp6]

Late 90s early 2000s were a time miss those days

[@TL-kt2ye]

Classiccccccc. The lyrics to my 20s, phat!😂😂😂😂

[@juliuschatman5119]

To me both songs had some truth to it! I remember when both songs were out and I was a fan of TLC and Sporty thievz they both had a point with these songs🤷🏿‍♂️

[@TheGoldenUno]

😂 pigeon 🐦, boy what a time to be alive 😂😂

[@ghostlover951]

I was in h/s when this scrub and pigeon war started back in 99.... i remember the TLC scrubs song came out first... the girls had a feild week calling guys scrubs... but when bet the bastment first played no pigeon, we couldn't wait to go to school the next day to call every girl a pigeon....good times.... DAMN I MISS THE 90S

[@beemocha]

I love your videos! 🙌🏽🙌🏽 You have the perfect voice for narrating❤ Your videos are so entertaining: I feel like I’m watching an episode of Behind The Music or E! True Hollywood stories,& those were 2 of my absolute favorite entertainment/music documentary shows growing up. I get so excited when you upload anything.😂🫶🏽 I love the way you sang lol

[@DLCOrganization]

FINALLY! -- Someone is covering this issue!

[@smonelh]

This is a very educational video lol thank you for this!

[@JamesShow]

When you brought in Destiny's Child I had expected to see "Bugaboo" which was essentially the same song as "No Scrubs"

[@resetthegame839]

Keep the TLC documtries coming ❤❤❤❤

[@shaylalauren]

Caught this on my learning break. Im ready for the content you about to drop in 2025🎉🎉🎉

[@GRTVO]

Who remembers No Pidgeons??? Exactly.

[@86twin]

I do

[@matthewlee4697]

​@@86twinme too lol 😂

[@sugarzblossom8168]

I don't but that's because I don't think I have even heard of that song before this video

[@notyours143forlife2]

Crazy I was listening to no pigeons a couple of weeks ago😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@jerseykillabee]

New sub here yo I really liked the video like Really liked it. I'm from up top and I haven't heard anyone talk about Sporty Thieves in forever.

[@Marc-King777]

Thanx for featuring Sporty Thievz in this video. They deserve some love.

[@plairway]

Anti Simp pioneers!!!

[@holdthetruthhostage]

Word

[@MistyBlue1189]

No scrubs and bills bills bills had the boyzzzz upset. Shout out to Kandi and Tiny for holding down the 99 and 00s. 😂

[@jovanreid6782]

Or, it just had the boys who hate gold-diggers upset.

[@Omar-ff6fo]

The songs that birthed gold-digging thot culture. It’s cool though, just have the bread to attract. But don’t feed these pigeons 😁

[@MistyBlue1189]

@@jovanreid6782 idk my step dad hated hearing both songs because of the message. No matter what the reason was it still had them feeling away

[@StormKoriHQ]

Reliving my childhood through this video!!!!