Oddity Archive: Episode 244.5 - Sony Videocorders Update (CV-2100 & AV-3600) (8/2022)

[@OddityArchive]

UPDATE: I was right. The breaker box was made improperly. As of the release date of this video, the box is out for repair. EDIT: Got the box back. Check it out here and lemme (attempt to) address a good point brought up in the comments. kzbin.info/www/bejne/r5Szm4uebrR6hpI

[@ntsecrets]

Yeah looked like he had the signal and grounds reversed. It was inverted video.

[@seanmckinnon4612]

Break OUT box (not to be that guy) as in you are taking the combined cable and breaking it out to separate I/o

[@OddityArchive]

That's what Rick likes to call them. I don't entirely get it either.

[@tomcarlson3913]

VTR EIAJ 8 pin connectors carry 4 coaxes Video IN, Audio IN, Video OUT, Audio OUT. That box should really have 4 RCA jacks on it to break out everything. The idea of the EIAJ connector was 2 fold: one to have a nice single connector hook up (the way HDMI is today) and to cheapen the VTR by omitting an internal TV tuner in the VTR, and instead allowing the VTR to record audio and video from the tuner in the TV set you used with the VTR for playback.

[@mikefellhauer3350]

@@OddityArchive Well, then he is also naming it wrong! From Wiki, "The term breakout box is derived from the mechanical enclosure in which a connector's aggregate connections are separated (i.e., broken out) into the individual signal or current-carrying wires or cables." en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakout_box "Breakers" are devices that cut off electric flow if the current is too high.

[@vwestlife]

I have the portable version of one of these, but it's non-working. It still has the original, long-dead NiCad battery pack.

[@kokovin93]

34:05 Definetely low drum speed. Probably old belt became loose after few test-runs and now slippering. If capstan speed is low too, it would be a good idea to check phase shift capacitors in series with one of motor windings. I had low motor speed on my 2100ACE when one of capacitors was shorted. Seen the same problem in one of videolabguy's video.

[@OddityArchive]

It needs at least 3 out of the 4 belts replaced, but I didn’t want to through any more money at it before making sure it was salvageable. I’m 99.9999999% sure at least one capacitor is bad as well.

[@andershammer9307]

@@OddityArchive I have a GE version of one of these and the motor cap was bad but I had to use one bigger than the original to get it up to speed but I think I'm just getting trash video out of it now. It's been awhile since I played with it. I'd like to get a Sony that I could repair because when I was a kid in grade school I operated one of these.

[@MaxW-er1hm]

I couldn't find this one earlier, I'm glad you covered CV

[@OddityArchive]

i hope to give the CV stuff a proper episode someday--the repairs on one of those machines is well beyond my skillset (and pricey to boot).

[@GabrielleCenter2000]

Happy Oddity Thursday morning. A way to start my favorite day of the week.

[@WSNO]

Gathering all the info i can find on these for restoring and art use...so glad to see you release some info and restoration documentation along with Spats Bear and Cathode Ray Dude, Ben!

[@WSNO]

Oh hey ben what the heck is that thing at the end of the video, i think you called it a "calibar" like a calibration bar, that you plugged into the PVM to make the test pattern show up????? I gotta get my paws on one

[@OddityArchive]

The Newtek Calibar. I did a Ben’s Junk on it not too long ago. kzbin.info/www/bejne/qZqcdYqqfNOUg5o

[@SnepStuff]

@@OddityArchive hey this is also me, this channel being for the stuff & repairs and that kind of thing. Thanks for the info!

[@mxbunnycatter]

interesting sidenote, maybe; those 2 prong sockets are an ancient IEC standard, and they sell figute 8 lead to 2 prong plugs on aliexpress (i happen to know this because i bought one of those for an equally ancient sewing machine a little while ago (E D i T : its an IEC 320 C9 connector)

[@noneofyourbusiness4616]

You should probably release a "Militant About Lubing" t-shirt.

[@Mattfromthepast]

Good night! I was just watching an old episode of Hawaii Five-0 and they used this exactly machine to look at video footage of a suspect. Small world.

[@dglcomputers1498]

The mains plug looks suspiciously like the ones a lot of Japanese audio equipment used, including a few Keyboards from Roland, Korg and Yamaha. Thomann sell them as the NRK2.

[@OddityArchive]

Same country of origin.

[@kanalnamn]

Yep, my Revox A77 uses that kind of connector. I bought new ones from Thomann.

[@KITR-UK]

I've got CV-2100 as well, I've got no tape though, so I can't properly test the bloody thing.

[@russellhltn1396]

About the VU meter - make sure you don't have anything connected to the device that might be back feeding a signal. I've been reviving a Sony T-530 audio reel-to-reel from 1965 and initially had the same problem. Most likely a parasitic oscillation due to dried up filter caps on the voltage rail for the preamp. (Not the power supply.) I left it on for hours to reform the caps and it settled down. I also found a separate problem of a lifted ground trace.

[@ScottGrammer]

Old, heavy Sony units like this (VTR's and audio rtr's like the TC-500-a) tended to get dropped a lot. They were very dense (small but heavy) and people would either misjudge the weight when first picking it up, or get tired of carrying it and just drop it to the ground out of frustration. I have an AV-3650, looking hard for a skip-field machine. I just had to turn down a transfer job because I can't find a skip-field machine in as good a shape as yours. I did have to replace a motor-run cap in the 3650. Oh, and by the way, 40+ years ago when I started repairing electronics, I learned what techs often call "E-clips." They call them "Jesus clips," because of what you might automatically say when one leaves your pliers at 500 miles an hour.

[@dazzfromaus4797]

Glad to see that you're keeping the good old E I A J machines alive and running well.

[@XaneMyers]

28:52, 32:19 - Why is this so funny-sounding to me? It's almost like corrupted video game music.

[@wdavem]

As for that connection problem, you'll get it. Something's just backwards connected wrong or shorted... most likely anyway. When i got my first one of those 1/2" in the mid 90s as a kid I was hoping way too much that it was really a color machine and it had s-video ready chroma output somewhere in that dreaded 'tv out' connector. It didn't. Then I realized that model had no where near enough electronics to do color... but I thought I saw a flash of color on the monitor and I didn't give up for WAYY too long. The only reason I didn't absolutely love the thing anyway was the mono sound. In those days I was hell bent on getting something better then VHS but it had to be stereo so I went with UMATIC.... a 2610 pretty much just like the one you have - it it was good!

[@flemishdog]

It's always fun to point out that those medical PVMs probably showed a lot of colons during their life.

[@jamesburke2759]

I had similar problems with a unit i have, i ran dry head cleaner through it (and held a q tip) on the moving head and it cleared the picture right up, because they have a fixed drum with moving heads they get dirty easily.

[@holderbee7811]

You said militant about lubing

[@OddityArchive]

(insert Beavis & Butthead impression here)

[@That_AMC_Guy]

There should be a way to adjust pinch roller tension on that older Sony machine.

[@RobbieStrike]

They were getting close but glad VHS and Bata worked better

[@veb92168]

I thought you were gonna say "in the words of Henry Rollins ,I can fly and kill! Lol! "

[@rayceeya8659]

Two pronged non polarized? That's a zappy accident waiting to happen. I lived in a place where the landlord did some of their own wiring and as a result, when we got cable installed there was about 50V on the ground of the coaxile cable.

[@russellhltn1396]

Only if the thing is wired in a way that connects the neutral to the case.

[@rayceeya8659]

@@russellhltn1396 Yeah that whole house was two wire. No grounded outlets, but the cable coax was grounded. Do you see the problem?

[@russellhltn1396]

@@rayceeya8659 Coax is supposed to be grounded. Old houses only had two wire. As long as they didn't install non-GFI three wire outlets, that's not an issue. However, the fact the cable and neutral aren't grounded to the same ground where they enter the building is a problem. That's where you're 50V is coming from.

[@rayceeya8659]

@@russellhltn1396 I know. Trust me I know. I tried explaining the difference between ground and neutral to a friend and he didn't believe me.

[@mikefellhauer3350]

"Breakout" box..."breaker" box is your home's AC electrical panel!

[@OddityArchive]

Please see the pinned comment.

[@BB..........]

I have a question that nobody has ever answered: Why are the reel heights staggered on these early machines? Why not have the reels level and tilt the head more?

[@OddityArchive]

The tape proper is recorded and read at a slight angle, so I'd imagine it was easier for Sony to just have the two reels at an angle than trying to put the head at an angle (though they started doing just that with VCR's--out of necessity).

[@BB..........]

@@OddityArchive It just seems really odd to have the two reels at different heights and force the tape to bend through guides to force it from the higher left reel to the lower right reel. That can't be great for the tape to force it to 'turn' through the guides.

[@OddityArchive]

It’s surprisingly natural.

[@CaseyRevoir]

The unobtainable plug is similar to the end of a Christmas light set, which are non polarized. You may need to trim the "wings". (you would need to use the male end of the light set with the female to protect the conductor during a short or load over 3 amp.) This fan cord looks right, "Cleveland WR50159". A polarized plug end should work fine. With a maybe wing trim, the "Legrand-Pass & Seymour SA155CC10" (available in white or brown) or the "Leviton 102-EP" would work.

[@lensmann4002]

If video recorders had not improved over the decades, the home video market would have ceased to exist. What a troublesome piece of- tech. You are a better man than me. Ben, I would have used a sledgehammer on this thing if I had it and it gave me this much trouble.

[@tomcarlson3913]

It seems like your friend miss-wired that breakout box. From what I see it looks like he mixed up the outer grounded shield and inner signal hot lead on one of the RCA jacks... Also those jacks carry audio and video out and IN. Had I made that box I would have included 4 RCA jacks and labeled them. Being able to record is sometimes a useful diagnostic feature. Hopefully that Sony monitor used the EIAJ-8 connector as EIAJ-VTR audio/composite-video and NOT as TTL RGB-component Video only...Basically in the 80's after VTRs stopped using the connector it briefly came back by supporting an incompatible signal format used by early computer graphics systems. PL-259 to RCA adapters do exist, and even if you can't find them its not that hard to solder a PL-259 end onto an RCA cable...Teenage me grabbed a couple of PL-259 ends from Radio Shack and did that when I got my first EIAJ decks about 15 years ago and was able to make them work like that. The issue at the end looks like the video head drum speed is wrong.

[@OddityArchive]

If I'm not mistaken, the pins are kept together and should still allow output or input. EDIT: You got me curious, so I went back and checked my manuals-it varies by machine. On a U-Matic deck, it’s output only. On a CV or AV-series machine, it should be two-way.

[@bakonfreek]

"Jesus!" clips XD

[@wdavem]

EIAJ format excels in two things: B&W detail/contrast and nice FAT sound. Occasionally I see a good high band color tape but for B&W these are excellent performers. I really like the sound actually, just remember it's always MONO as far as I know, (I've repaired dozens of those things for a local transfer house). Some call those clips names that offend religious people. Vanishing Deity Short-out clips. I'll admit I havent played around with skip field yet, it runs @ 7.5 ips like EIAJ, Skip field has more width room for it's video tracks so maybe it likes the newer tape!

[@jamesslick4790]

The '90s are not "vintage" enough for me yet, (Unless its MiniDisc, but that IS a "killer" little pro monitor. I'd love one in black!

[@OddityArchive]

My whole thing was I wanted something with EIAJ-8, some kind of standard composite and S-Video jacks on it, so it put me right at the early 90’s. I wasn’t thinking of aesthetics at all.

[@jamesslick4790]

@@OddityArchive I can dig ( and who knew that any thing that "new" would have EIAJ-8)

[@OddityArchive]

Right at the end of its run as a "legacy" thing.

[@outletvideo2015]

Hi. I need help. I have the same. What type of reel must get? or please send me some links from ebay. Thank you

[@OddityArchive]

Empty take-up reels? Sony RH-5 (5-inch) and RH-7 (7-inch). Or, just find a known junk reel of half-inch tape and dump the tape.

[@bobsbits5357]

hi you need to use new stock video tape like 1/2 inch may be betacam sp to test the tape is running over the tape place's in the deck i use betacam sp to test betacam sp decks as lot of reel to reel video tapes get the tape ill and jam up the decks

[@robertheckman9813]

What type of tape do these units take? What is the width of the tape? Does it use regular VHS or Beta tape or a wider width?

[@OddityArchive]

Half-inch.

[@marcse7en]

I've successfully used VHS tape on an EIAJ VTR. Recordable playback was perfect. Spooling the tape was tricky!

[@TheGrandJury]

Just discovered this channel, totally hooked, totally binging and loving it. What I'm sure is a well-answered question: the intro montage in most vids, perfect mix of creepy and late night uhf scanning. The bits, specifically the castle dance at the end, what is that from? Thx

[@OddityArchive]

It's called "A Touch of Magic". It first appeared on the "Industrial Musicals" episode.

[@TheGrandJury]

@@OddityArchive Thx!

[@rayceeya8659]

LOL "E-clip". Some of us call those "Jesus Clips" because that's the first words out of your mouth after it goes flying across the room.

[@OddityArchive]

Mine isn't so FCC-friendly.

[@bradmad8346]

Don't beat your self up too bad, it is 50 years old, I think these were problematic at best, so good luck going forward.

[@jamesslick4790]

Early VTRs could get flaky when NEW. It amazing ANY of them still can be made functional now.

[@jonathaneastwood2927]

Its a shame something as nice as this has fallen into the hands of somebody that has no idea.

[@OddityArchive]

Thanks for the vote of confidence.