One Accident that CAUSED Another! United Airlines 608 & 624

[@alzo7891]

“Do not share with CAA.” That Douglas culture that now runs Boeing has roots.

[@MentourPilot]

That’s what I thought.. when it first read it

[@Isnt_that_Aaronic]

The defence knew this was an admission so tried to hide it. I hope they got disbarred

[@vidura]

You also have to be quite psychopatic to do what they did with the warning.

[@khosrowzare8301]

The fact that the chief pilot wrote it is even worse. If it were a random suit, it would be less disturbing. Everyone knows they are part lizard anyway, but the chief pilot should really know better.

[@gr8xr7]

This is corporate mentallity, everywhere

[@khosrowzare8301]

Good to know the Douglas safety culture managed to survive all the way to 737Max.

[@redwaller1]

This is exactly what I was thinking about.

[@pjohan74]

That was exactly what we all were thinking about.

[@321ssteeeeeve]

Or the C17

[@fareedmasood]

Agreed 100% ❤👍

[@tourmaline07]

I was thinking that Douglas not documenting crucial design changes to their pilots and trying to hide things from the regulators seemed all too familiar - even in a company they ended up buying half a decade later ;) Also to a group of concerned pilots "everything's entirely satisfactory - us shoving as much CO2 at aircraft fires as we can manage , but there's a few little vent holes which you need to open first against your intuition before you know you're on fire so you don't get incapacitated.... ['putting in a system which could trim the aircraft nose down very quickly without indication , and which would keep doing so every five seconds even if you tried to counteract those trims unless you did something counter-intuitive to turn the autotrim off] is all good and dandy , now shut up [stop telling us we need to specify simulator training for this magical new system and killing our potential sales and $$$] ....

[@checkyourself164]

As a long time fan/watcher of this channel. These ''window into the past'' episodes would be an unreal series to watch. Please make it happen! They're really refreshing.

[@garenwillow]

MentourAviationHistory? POG

[@mileslagomarsino8852]

I agree something like a blast from the past in this case quite literally

[@volvo09]

I agree, lots of aviation lessons were learned from the past.

[@billboyd03]

I definitely do enjoy this.

[@ascii115]

That would be a great series!

[@ThatWouldBeCareless]

I'm so used to aviation as you describe it today, with layers of safety nets. It's so weird to hear something so safety critical relying on unpublished procedures done from memory. It's amazing how far the industry has come in a relatively short time.

[@aaaaaaaard9586]

I see that everyday on the road, granted not the same industry

[@jursamaj]

Well, it was "unpublished" because it was never meant to **be** a procedure. Douglas never intended pilots to cross-fill the tanks.

[@MeppyMan]

I was flying in GA in the 80s and 90s and saw plenty of that sort of thing going on. Attitudes have come a long way since then thankfully.

[@MGower4465]

​@@MeppyManTell me about it. I took *a* flying lesson in the late 80s, my parents bought a block of time as a graduation present. Mind, I had lived airplanes firever, studied the physics. Instructor decided it was a great idea to wrap up the first lesson by flying along the river *very* low, not quite dipping the tires. This in a Cessna 152, not an aeribatics aircraft. I got home, told my oarents ti get their money back - I refused to fly with that instructor again. I didn't know how to fly, but I did know that was not safe. A year or so later I heard he lawn-darted and crashed, possibly as a result of trying an inside loop too low. Again, in a utility/trainer plane. He d8d3n't take anybody with him.

[@UnknownUser-j3n]

You can add safety nets to the planes, not to human greed and corruption. I am sure they are as much in force today as they were back in the 1940s.

[@philippal8666]

I have deep respect for those who trained problems directly on the plane, with no simulators.

[@RoyalFusilier]

You've got a point. "Hey, we think this aircraft has a potentially fatal design flaw, you down for a quick jaunt?"

[@ibrahimkayikci2146]

​@@RoyalFusilier test piloting and test driving are not the safest occupations, similar to stunt piloting. There are things hard to test with simulators. Asphyxiation risk is one of them.

[@essiebessie661]

The old timer pilots (like Dad) often said the simulators didn’t train pilots to handle emergencies realistically. You just can’t react the same as when you think a mistake will kill you.

[@mangos2888]

I suppose they also think no practice is better than simulated practice, too. ​@@essiebessie661

[@MandoMonge]

That explains why grand dad was able to have 17 children with 3 different wives by the time he was 45 xD

[@fridgeffs5662]

I'm an engineer. At 14:00 as soon as I saw the air inlet I was like dont tell me they're unintentionally pissing fuel out of the plane. Oh my god. Who made that system and didn't put a valve in?

[@CalcG]

yeah this whole airplane is so asinine to me. but i guess it was the 1940s and we didnt have the experience to make fixes like that and take safety as seriously as we do now.

[@Juan-qv5nc]

I'm a regular person and thought the same until just before "Oh my god". Instead I cursed.

[@giftofthewild6665]

Not only are they unintentionally pissing fuel, but its going right next to the engine and the intake for the heater inside... 🤦‍♀️ there's much better places for a vent surely

[@daviddavis4885]

McDonnell-Douglas/Boeing safety culture is a truly incredible thing… as in it’s hard to believe that it’s real…

[@fkcoolers2669]

*Me nodding as if I understand this*: Seriously, who made that system?

[@SlightlyLucyy]

It was great to see the credits of the crew at the start! Love to see them getting love! And it looks very professional!

[@bitman_agent67]

I was looking for this comment so that I would not have to make it. Credits for documentary style content is a boss move. Meets the expectations for TV productions. Way to go Petter.

[@zamirathezenathazami5200]

Agreed! Was about to say this myself.

[@VegaTheLyra]

15:59 Petter's sceptical face made me cackle lol

[@aircraftadventures-vids]

😔🤨🤔

[@Martuhhhh]

It’s nice to see you cover an older accident!

[@bennewman566]

15:30 It's the Civil Aeronautics Administration in the 40s, not the Civil Aviation Authority (which is the UK's aviation regulator). To be fair, there have been a lot of names for it, so it's easy to get muddled. I've listed them below for anyone interested: 1926 - Aviation Branch (of the Dept. of Commerce) 1934 - Bureau of Air Commerce 1938 - Civil Aeronautics Authority 1940 - Civil Aeronautics Administration & Civil Aeronautics Board 1958 - Federal Aviation Agency 1967 - Federal Aviation Administration edit: sorry for being a bit nit-picky, but the history of aviation regulators is a topic I am very interested in so I couldn't help it.

[@lilaichimaru]

Thank you, this was very interesting 😊

[@MrNicoJac]

This is not nitpicky, this is precise. And being diligent/detail oriented saves lives, especially in aviation. Thanks!

[@XpOzgamingx]

The Douglas company becomes McDonnell Douglas, which becomes part of the modern Boeing company. A history of covering up design flaws that has been written in blood.

[@rauljosechaves3291]

I thought the same thing. I'm curious, but I don't remember reading about old Boeing or Airbus trying to cover and deceive regulators like Boeing did after DC merge and DC did in the past

[@Isnt_that_Aaronic]

Now. You have to think about Douglass greatest casualty. Lower than expected returns on shares. The humanity/s

[@NathanSimonGottemer]

@@Isnt_that_AaronicTHY981 did cost the company a lot of money. Sadly those that suffered those consequences were the employees and not the execs that made the choices that got 400 people killed

[@caroleminke6116]

This is why I own stock in Lockheed Martin

[@giftofthewild6665]

​@@rauljosechaves3291 Airbus hasn't been caught deceiving regulators AFAIK, I trust airbus planes more due to this.

[@MichaelScanlan-n1y]

My father was a CAA employee stationed at the Bryce Canyon airport at the time of the United crash. He was one of the first responders to the crash site. My mother, who was pregnant with me(I was born that December) was not permitted to visit the crash site. It was horrific. Great video as always.

[@jedisith25]

Being a lifelong enthusiast of planes and the history of aviation, I find these "window into the past" episodes utterly captivating and believe they would make a fantastic series. While I’m not a professional in the field and lack formal qualifications or commercial experience, I hold a profound admiration for the pilots, crew, and all those who contribute to aviation. It's remarkable how these episodes thoughtfully address past accidents, highlighting the progress and advancements in the industry over the years. They provide a refreshing and distinct viewpoint. Please continue producing them-I’m eager to see more!

[@jamesengland7461]

THIS!

[@ChaJ67]

I was once a passenger on one of the last DC-6's flying people inside of the continental United States. Way back I was in the Boy Scouts and we took off from the Coronado naval base in a DC-6 to fly out to San Clemente Island, a military controlled island. I remember very well the four piston engines thrumming away and flying a lot lower than a jet airliner, bouncing up and down in the more turbulent air at that lower altitude while over the Pacific Ocean. It wasn't a long flight from Coronado to San Clemente Island, but of course it did take a lot longer in a DC-6 than a modern jet airliner. I heard they finally decommissioned that DC-6 some time after I went to the island with the scouts. But this was in the early 1990's when I flew on that DC-6.

[@BlueRaven7]

Petter, as someone who has been here for a few years now and consider you one of the most talented and professional creators on the entire platform - seeing what your videos have become, with fully professional editing, professional credits to the team you've been able to put together in your intro, thorough background research and relevant graphics and video you've added... Your videos sitting on a couch with your dog are still wonderful, but I just want to say I'm proud of what this has turned into, you truly earned what you've got, and you've done a wonderful job and put together a really amazing thing here. Cheers, keep up the awesome work man! Just wanted to say thanks for what you do, it just really struck me today watching your intro how far things have come!

[@mbur1gess]

I completely agree, and it's great to see you're adding credits at the start of the video to recognize the work your crew do along with you!

[@Feenix102]

So. Fixing the problem of an exploding aircraft by, essentially, turning it into a flying gas chamber/CO2 dispenser? Interesting technique...

[@wilfreddv]

To be fair it causes way less panic that way, I guess...

[@vasilivh]

@@wilfreddv carbon dioxide causes severe agitation and hyperactivity before unconsciousness and death, so a cabin (and cockpit) filled with CO2 is paradoxically way more panicked

[@Feenix102]

@ Oof - wouldn't fancy that then. Its remarkable how much power these massive companies have, that they can bypass all sorts of safety regulations to maximise profit. Still, par for the course I guess its just...a worry.

[@NicolaW72]

Yes.

[@CarlosOrtiz-g8d]

Might not be right to laugh, but ; your conclusion is hilarious!!! (Spot on)😅

[@MariaMagdalena-z3s]

I started watching your videos because I really has a severe case of aviophobia. I still has the phobia but I gained something different from your videos: my English is getting better! I'm learning English as 3rd language and my listening isn't very good yet especially with heavily accented British English. But whenever I watch your video I can understand every words you said without turning on the subtitles. Your pronunciation is just so clear that I can understand everything even when the explanation becomes too technical. Thank you for helping me learn English and I hope I can overcome my aviophobia too. Thank you for your good work!

[@PetraKann]

A very good way to learn another language and practice 😊

[@mississippichris]

You'll trade the aviophobia for aviophilia in no time.

[@thetweer]

Your english sounds good! For non-native speakers it's easier to understand other non-native speakers. This channel is perfect in that regard as Petter speaks in a structured and clear manner. Moreover, in contrast to e.g. TV series, Petter speaks at the same volume. In TV shows, the loudness may vary making it even harder to understand. It may happen though, that you get a quite "technical" vocabulary. I was often told that I don't speak like a native as I use academic vocabulary for every day stuff (I just don't know better).

[@y_fam_goeglyd]

​@@thetweer Always aim high regardless of the subject. It's easier to pick up on the "shortcuts" (in linguistics that would be slang and typical informal speech) than it is to work your way back up the ladder! Your comment was a joy to read compared to so many lazy native-English speakers. (I have done a lot of proofreading and have become very didactic as a result! 😅)

[@y_fam_goeglyd]

Your English is a lot better than many a native speaker. Keep up your good work!

[@MikeWMiller]

Definitely appreciate the opening credits. It's nice to see all the people behind the scenes helping create your amazing videos, and it's great that they can get a little more public credit for the awesome work!

[@aimeedean1]

I really wish you'd find it in your schedule to do a video on the Comet and how the crash investigators gave the first real roadmap for how they solved these accidents. I think it's interesting to find out just how they went about investigating and what practices and lessons learnt way back in the 1950s are still used today with investigating air accidents. Pretty Please Petter!

[@MentourPilot]

I’ll see what I can do

[@NicolaW72]

Indeed.

[@trinity72gp]

The evolution of Air crash investigation 👌🏾

[@Blur4strike-2]

@@MentourPilot Take your time in doing so.

[@johnvender]

Brings back memories of the DC10 back door.

[@NicolaW72]

Indeed. And of the 737MAX-Story.

[@SpectrumMom]

Already waiting for your video on the helicopter airplane crash in DC tonight. Even a general discussion of your knowledge of that airport and how planes and military helicopters communicate.

[@alyessamaddox7022]

It's going to be a while. He doesn't post stuff until he's got hard evidence to go off, and there isn't much of that.

[@augustingarnier4625]

A lawyer tampering with evidence linked to a crash is grounds for disbarment.

[@jessstone7486]

Yes, it would be, if there was *actual* justice in today's courts.

[@hollandsemum1]

It is now, but that was pre NTSB, in the old CAB days, and 9 years before the crash over the Grand Canyon with the (first?) very meticulous investigator, and the realization that air traffic could no longer be a freewheeling, cowboy style, adventure, leading to changing the general aviation paradigm completely.

[@Blur4strike-2]

@@jessstone7486 Sadly, the courts are two-tiered these days (especially in the US.).

[@danidulfu]

Is it me, or is this the first time the video starts with credits for the production? This is so cool! I find it unbelievable how many people are involved. Thank you all for your hard work and dedication!

[@anna_in_aotearoa3166]

Have seen it on a few of the previous vids, but yeah, really appreciate the formal shoutouts to the very talented team making this educational safety-focused channel possible! There was actually also a vid introducing some of the BTS team too, very international bunch, but I can't remember sorry if it was on Mentour Now or the main channel?

Those old Piston Bangers like the Lockheed Constellation are so majestic!

[@creeper6530]

They gave the plane a nickname of "the best three engined plane in the world"😅

[@aarondavis8943]

When Bugs Bunny flies, it's usually on something looking much like the Connie😁. It was contemporary to those cartoons but it also has a real Warner Bros "past-future" design aesthetic.

[@joefin5900]

My first cross country flight was in March of 1958 on a United DC-6 from Stapleton to Idlewild. Great flight, great food and, great when the plane ascended and descended due to the atmosphere at the cruising altitude. On landing, great blue flames issued from the exhaust port just outside the window! Thrilling for a kid.

[@alanmiller9681]

Fire was normal out of the exhaust of Lockheed Constellation aircraft. It surprised many passengers.

[@Simple_But_Expensive]

So McD was covering up design flaws for profit. Years later Boeng buys them out, but keeps the management team. Suddenly, Boeng starts having accidents caused by design flaws attributed to things like quality control inspections being cut to save money and design flaws not being communicated to pilots or the FAA. Correlation? I get the feeling Starliner and 737 max are the tip of the iceberg.

[@Juanguar]

Do keep in mind that this is before Douglas merged with mcdonall So you could say that culture is embedded in Douglas

[@mz00956]

well let's be honest. McD bought Boeing and got Boeing to pay for it

[@aaaaaaaard9586]

What do you expect, companies to prioritize safety over profit? The aviation industry became safe thanks to external audit and political pressure not the high moral standard of manufacturers. This is sadly not the case in the automobile industry where everyone blames the victims and drivers, not the oversize 3 ton death machines designed to maximize profit.

[@Simple_But_Expensive]

@@Juanguar Fair enough. It seems to be a strange form of genetic contamination.

[@uzlonewolf]

@@aaaaaaaard9586 While profit is one of the reasons, the biggest reason the road is filled with 3-ton death machines is emissions regulations. Those huge machines are classified as trucks which allows them much more emissions, whereas something smaller like a station wagon is classified as a car and basically cannot meet those emissions requirements.

[@Ladybird-s5j]

Your graphics crew is amazing!

[@hcy0]

Only the fashion of the passengers was not really 1940s style ;-)

[@daviddavis4885]

The I learn more about McDonnell-Douglas’s design choices, the more I wonder how they managed to last so long 😅

[@tlum4081]

Douglas ==> McDonnell ===> Boeing is the the road to hell. I haven't flown since 2001 and if I fly again, it's not on a Boeing aircraft.

[@katrineroberts4084]

The 747/400 series was an excellent plane.

[@katrineroberts4084]

The DC3 was an iconic plane.

[@michaelg4931]

Simple, deemed 'Too important to the MIC to fail.'

[@princessroyal80]

Military contracts. MD was shit at making passenger planes but they had a lot of solid military assets. They only really started faltering in the 90’s because the Cold War ended and the contracts dried up.

[@cinemapigeon4898]

These past few months have given you tons of work. Azerbaijan crash, South Korean crash, Washington DC crash, Philly crash, etc...

[@BladePHF]

Adding my comment to the choir asking for more ''window into the past'' episodes - historical accidents inform a lot of the current baseline, and it's very interesting to see them developed in videos like yours!

[@YoskiRS]

Definitely gonna need a video about the incident in Washington DC today

[@MrHav1k]

I find these older accident breakdowns fascinating. Keep them coming Petter!

[@SwapBlogRU]

Hm, interesting, this has to be the first time I'm seeing a vintage story on this channel. Feels a bit weird even, with how different a time it was compared to the modern day and how much more different aviation was back then (with none of the lessons learned during the jet age having been integrated into flying, protocols, procedures etc.).

[@RegalCobra097]

Nice to see you, BMIRussian.

[@SwapBlogRU]

@@RegalCobra097 what's up! Yeah, I'm a bit of an av-geek)

[@EricRush]

My father avoided flying in new models of aircraft. He wanted to give them a couple of years to get the bugs worked out. He cited the DC6 fires as examples.

[@_Dimon_]

Not a bad idea. There's also a 737 max as a more recent example.

[@eddiebruv]

Don’t buy a car in its first year of production either. 😂

[@Blur4strike-2]

Similar applies to computer hardware (hello Intel 13th and 14th gen processors.)

[@polarberri]

Fascinating breakdown. I really appreciate how much the industry has changed - the usual parts I look for like the cockpit voice recorder and the final report aren't there! Thank you for your quality documentaries that always make us feel safer in the skies.

[@alexandriaaaable]

One more thing... I wish to compliment you on covering flight incidents that do not necessarily result in deaths. I think that is important, and makes your channel stand out from other series that focus strictly on disasters.

[@calebcarlin6784]

It's astonishing to think that the same "wee don't need to test that, it'll work fine" mindset still exists, even after all these years. The Lockheed Electra had problems with propeller separation that were shrugged off as an "inconvenience". The flight that changed that oversight was Reeve Aleutian Airways flight 8. That flight and the improvements made in it's wake would be another great one to cover in the future!

[@hughallen6621]

Did you ever try Windows 95? Total junk rushed to market and drove users up the wall. But it made MS no. 1

[@goodyhi6989]

​@@hughallen6621Compared to Windows 3.11, Win 95 was a big improvement.

[@juk-hw5lv]

Admiral Cloudberg is writing for you! Gosh, that's wonderful! Great to see the masters of the trade cooperating together

[@johnle6982]

This situation boiled down to adapting a military plane with complicated cross feed fuel system to cope with battle damages but with a flight engineer to handle high the work load to 2 man cockpit. Greed reigned supreme forever I guess.

[@michaellandry2227]

I was surprised there was no flight engineer.

[@die_moehre5658]

Oh, now this fuel system makes sense.

[@LMDProductionsOfficial]

@die_moehre5658 yeah that detail suddenly explains a lot

[@kevinbarry71]

I am not a pilot although I am an enthusiast. I am, however, an attorney. Any attorney who would erase evidence like that should be disbarred immediately. It is equivalent to suborning perjury.

[@marybarry2230]

As very sad that these accidents were, you did a beautiful job depicting them! Your videos are getting better and better!

[@wardsdotnet]

My parents met on board a United DC-6 when she brought coffee to the cockpit (she was a stewardess and he was captain) in the 1960s. Glad the safety issues in the video were corrected before that!!

[@christopherg2347]

25:12 "99 little bugs in my code. 99 little bugs. Take one out. Patch it around. 129 little bugs in my code. 129 little bugs."

[@farkhodbekmamadjanov8719]

It would be great to have such "window into the past" episodes going forward as well. They provide a great background story for the safety procedures and technological solutions that we consider as vital nowadays. Super interesting!

[@NicolaW72]

Indeed, exactly.

[@ketchup901]

It's an interesting story for sure but I think the core strength of their documentaries is the in-depth technical analysis. This episode had a lot of guesswork, maybe better suited for his other channel.

[@SuperdadChris1]

Tack så mycket för ditt engagemang och kunskap om dessa videor! det är min dröm att flyga en dag. hoppas nästa gång jag flyger kan jag ha förmånen att du är kapten 🙏

[@dipling.pitzler7650]

Very appropriate follow up to Egyptair 804! Beautiful CGI of the DC and SC, with a small gangway glitch at 0:20! A bit amusing and could be left as is as not only the "fuel management" research, I assume, caused a lot of in depth detailed work!

[@deanworsley5208]

As an ex RAAF aircraft maintenance man, engines and airframes, these technical based videos just have me totally captivated. My service included time on De Havilland Canada, Caribou aircraft, powered by P&W R2000 engines so even more fascinating for me. Thanks so much for these Petter 👌🏼👌🏼

[@anna_in_aotearoa3166]

Agreed! I find them really interesting too, & think they're super-valuable as learning tools across any industry? A lot to learn and remind ourselves re. how technical matters are not academic/humdrum but can have vital personal consequences! Also how important good UI design is to safety; how key it is to properly test new designs before they go live; that good user manuals are essential; and how corners cut don't just save money short-term but can lose it (& potentially even lives) long-term... Although in this vid, some added unexpected reminders about the vital role of accurate fault reporting, the dangers of regulatory capture, and (yikes) not suborning your clients to commit perjury?? 🫣

[@aszteroidt]

I'm from the area of Pennsylvania where 624 went down...as a kid I remember hearing some of the "old-timers" talking about the accident...another incredible video...great content as always...

[@chadim33]

Sunday on the couch and mentor uploads, amazing!

[@Deagon-p6b]

I have a suggestion for another vintage air accident with quite an interesting story if you'll entertain me. The crash Gene Roddenberry (former pilot and creator of star trek) was involved in. The Civil Aeronautics Board report (1-0053) is a fascinating read, not just of the horrific fire aboard Pan Am Flight 121 where some of the engines melted off the aircraft but also what the survivors went through after they crashed. There's a short clip of this crash/wreckage on KZbin from pathe news too. The video title is "usa: American civilian plane crashed in desert (1947)"

[@deleted_redacted]

The new opening staff/crew credits look very professional. Well done, and good to see. Nice!

[@MentourPilot]

Thanks for noticing!

[@richardstaples8621]

My first flight as an 11yo boy was on a TAA DC6 flying from Sydney to Canberra on a school excursion in 1963. Great excitement. No fires.

[@fareedmasood]

Dear Mentourpilot team, what an incredible job done from animation, research, script writing to editing with Mr. Petter's high storytelling skills adding icing to the cake. Pardon me for detrackiing if I have, as I'm incapacitated by the high CO2 levels 😮 but reliving an 80yrs old story in such an immaculate manner is truly laudable. Hats off to the whole team once again with condolences for the flight 608 passengers and crew 😢😢😢

[@JavierCR25]

I love this format. You are so right, we are blessed by over a century of accumulated knowledge, all thanks to so many lives that have been lost but not forgotten and contributed to aviation safety.

[@anna_in_aotearoa3166]

Agreed! I really hope the way these tragedies do help save future lives provides some comfort at least to those who lose loved ones in such terrible accidents...? (Not to mention the survivors, in cases where there are any). The thing I do find truly gut-wrenching is when lessons FAIL to be learned from prior awful events? In this particular case, a lot of people in the comments have been drawing truly disturbing parallels between M-D's historical rushed & flawed money-focused design process and 'nah leave it out of the manual' approach here, and what happened later at Boeing once the two firms merged... 😬 Chilling, makes one wonder just how much the firm's ethos really changed??

[@maty1229]

Wonderful to see you covering older accidents. As a fan of piston-liners, I was surprised I hadn't heard bout these!

[@tomriley5790]

I had no idea that Douglas history of shady practices and evasion went back so far, I'd often looked at the DC10 accidents and wondered what was going on with the culture there and then obviously later post merger with Boeing and everything leading up to MCAS but this is crazy, just shows how entrenched company culture can become.... Good to know the story about why pilots have full face oxygen masks too. Also can't help wondering why didn't the pilots land in a field in the first fire? Yes it would have been a belly land/crash but... Love this series thank you mentour!

[@volvo09]

We will never know... Maybe they didn't know the extent of it? Now that I think of it, did they have cockpit doors in these early planes? If so then they could have been shielded from the extent of it...

[@NicolaW72]

Indeed. It was shocking for me to discover the similarities to the DC-10-Story in the 1970ies and to the recent 737MAX-Story.

[@domkelly1972]

Whats amazing about the first story is that the pilott at 42 was born in a world that basically no passenger airplanes existed. Can you imagine him explaining his job to his parents or grandparents?.

[@timothystamm3200]

They probably thought of him as similar to the conductor or engineer of the equivalent of an airborne train or a driver of the equivalent of an airborne bus.

[@satwiksil6192]

Come on people ... Your favourite aviation youtuber uploaded a video

[@AristoCat221]

We are here :))

[@senaspirant574]

Ok

[@goldfishi5776]

If im gonna take a dopamine hit from the youtube pipe it may as well have some positive development characteristics. 👍

[@abwnizami]

Present sir

[@PortoNova]

Where do I present my boarding pass?

[@JoramNyambu]

The best content available. Detailed and factual not forgetting educational. Can't wait to follow every detail of this story as well

[@WillLentry]

I Love Mentour Pilot. I know you are not flying for now, but as an 'afraid of flying' USAF Veteran...I would feel safe and even sleep on an international over the water flight with YOU as Captain. Salute!

[@mitchyk]

Good to know things haven't changed with companies trying to avoid responsibility. Hence me never taking any company at it's word! I love these looking back videos. To see how far we've progressed.

[@Gr8fulbluz]

Great to see you covering this. My dad flew the DC4 and 6. Love love radial engines. The thought of traveling from LA to Chicago in uncontrolled airspace is interesting and shows how far we have come with CPDL and such. Cheers

[@fahdsk]

I just completed the last episode which was uploaded 8days ago due to my busy schedule, and suddenly I saw this new one uploaded so quickly. Your videos are very informative and technical details are well explained. Thanks for your efforts.

[@OwlRTA]

I remember reading about these accidents in Paul Eddy's "Destination Disaster", a 1970s book about the DC-10's cargo door. It seemed like Douglas had a history of having design flaws that they tried to cover up, which was fascinating to discover.

[@NicolaW72]

Indeed.

[@cr10001]

I read that book too. Fascinating. The DC10 saga was marked by inadequate 'fixes' even after the fault was known and a 'gentleman's agreement' with the FAA to minimise costs and risks - to McDonnell Douglas. Standard McDonnell Douglas response to any incident: "There's nothing wrong with our planes!" In those days, Boeing (and Lockheed) were a far more trustworthy and reliable manufacturer.

[@alexturnbackthearmy1907]

@@cr10001 Not without flaws either. It was a different time after all...

[@23gatesy]

The transition from the background of the DC6 into the day of the accident flight was a masterclass in storytelling. Brilliant as always from this channel.

[@supernoodles91]

Just got in out of the wind and rain, warming up and I find a new Mentour Pilot video......excellent!!

[@casparcoaster1936]

Love the rendering of that Doughlas!!!

[@pass-the-juice]

graphics rivalling hollywood now

[@volvo09]

@@pass-the-juice and drama free delivery you'd never get from them... No unnecessary clips of screaming passengers and pilots arguing over who is right...

[@timoooo7320]

17:00 this is all just ridiculous, from an engineering perspective. I'm sometimes amazed at how elaborate these systems can be made, yet end up with such a simple and ridiculous issue like not having a valve, which is very easy to fix!!

[@WorldTravelerCooking]

5% CO2 is crazy. I have witnessed partial incapacitation at levels or 2% in indoor conditions in IT environmments.

[@Bloodwhiner]

Really happy that you are going back to examine these early accidents. So much of what is relied upon today came about because of those mishaps. I would also suggest looking at Flying Tiger Flight 923

[@philiphumphrey1548]

It's one of the classic problems in Health and Safety, by trying to control or eliminate one hazard you can inadvertently introduce another. That's why you need to do a thorough second risk assessment/analysis starting from scratch after you've completed the first and done whatever changes have been recommended.

[@NicolaW72]

Indeed.

[@anna_in_aotearoa3166]

Absolutely, well put! And that's also why NOT sharing full details of past failures is so destructive to quality assurance... That lawyer's illegal advisories had me seething!

[@ronjones1077]

Excellent production and research! In my 75 years I’ve flown on the Connie, Dc’s 3, 4, 8 and 9 plus many others (I’m in Alaska). So learning or being reminded of these events is of great interest. Thank you and your crew !

[@ronjones1077]

I left off the DC10!

[@koini11]

Enjoyed this one. An interesting tale from the past. I appreciate the work since the details must have been harder to bring together

[@GiR1854]

Loved this video of old aircraft accidents which had tremendous influence on Modern Aviation safety. Please do more such old accidents. I recommend:- Manchester United Munich Air disaster which taught us a great deal about Icing on wings

[@killerdublin]

I loved this. If we forget lessons learned in the passed we are destined to relive them. Your coverage of historic safety incidents reminds us of this.

[@NicolaW72]

Indeed. This story remembered me strongly to George Santayana´s famous sentence, too.

[@paulkile9998]

Kudos, Mentour!! Those are the best computer renditions of a United DC-6 I have ever seen...I can picture my Dad in that cockpit! The only minor issue is United never used the streamlined propeller spinners on any of its DC-6s.

[@kruksog]

Love what you (and your team) do Petter. Thanks for making quality stuff.

[@LaczPro]

I don't really want to talk about Boeing and get mad as usual, but is it a coincidence there's a 737 Max in the background at 32:07 when showing the DC-6? That was a big "I see what you did there" moment.

[@muenstercheese]

oh that's beautiful

[@LMDProductionsOfficial]

I think it was just the AI traffic in flight sim but it would be kind of funny if it actually was intentional

[@cbspock1701]

Really interesting look back into the beginning of passenger aviation.

[@jbrynolfsson]

Please don’t stop making these videos. I just love watching them

[@andreypetrov4868]

Pilots have so many other things to worry about during the flight and that fuel system looks overcomplicated. It calls for a flight engineer.

[@reaperseeker]

0:56 Glad to see my hunch about Kyra "Admiral Cloudberg" Dempsey, being involved in some way with this channel was correct. A few videos really felt like it was her articles being used, and now I see exactly why I thought that.

[@amandaseneviratne3605]

Yay! Another video from Mentour Pilot!

[@jonaskuula5218]

its wonderfull to see into the early roots of civil aviation, really gives a morbid reminder, why modern procedure and rules are so thorugh.

[@VegaTheLyra]

25:11 You really had me here, I thought you were going into the final thoughts and then you just pulled a "wait, we're not done yet" on me. Well played, Petter, well played

[@FifinatorKlon]

16:00 next time I fail an exam I tell the prof that a failure was not what I envisioned. Didn't know it was that easy.

[@aerofoca]

I love the retro content Petter! Theres something so graceful about these old props. My best memories of flying as a child are "puddle jumping" in Puerto Rico not on the ATRs or even shorts 360s but the twin otters and casa 212s which arent even that old Plus i love the smell of jet A in morning 😆 and ground boarding which is getting rarer and rarer!

[@BlackCrag]

Easily the greatest channel on KZbin! I absolutely devour these videos! Thank you so much for all the effort you and your team put into them 🙏

[@bobbydigital_BobbyinLA]

Beautiful video Petter and Team!! Your videos are pure class!

[@MentourPilot]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@MarinCipollina]

Thanks for this one, Peter !.. I think there's a wealth of history you could explore involving older incidents. I hope such stories aren't being bypassed on the basis of being too remote.

[@anna_in_aotearoa3166]

Really good point! As far as I can tell with a brief check, even the excellent creators over at Green Dot Aviation and Disaster Breakdown mostly only seem to look back as far as ~1980 at the earliest....? But I concur that there's valuable learnings possible even from the very early days of aviation. And it honestly feels like some of the holdovers from that period (eg Mc-D's corporate culture later apparently imported into Boeing post-merger) are still having very long and problematic tails today, despite everything that has changed otherwise...?

[@madvova118]

Mentour Pilot! Thank you for the video. Can you please do a detailed review of how new planes are tested before they are released for commercial use? For example, when they built a new plane, who does the first flight? How do they know it will work? How about the systems that they put in place, and new bank angle limits etc., it would be interesting to know.

[@Dovietail]

My biggest fear. Thank you for your kind and straightforward approach to a virtually unspeakable end for those poor people.

[@dantreadwell7421]

That crossfeed system was probably carryover from being originally designed as a military aircraft. Crossfeeds were needed in case of fuel loss from damage.

[@hollandsemum1]

Good point. The concept of serious, detailed research into cause and effect wasn't anywhere near what it is today, so probably little forethought as to how a fuel system designed for shrapnel wouldn't necessarily transfer to a different use context.

[@larrydugan1441]

Terrific video. Great historical review of the hard learned lessons of early aviation.

[@fraginz]

Douglas / McDonnell Douglas: bringing you hidden flawed aircrafts since 1940s 😬

[@gzk6nk]

That wasn't the end of fatal accidents caused by the DC4 / 6 fuel system. In 1967 a Canadair Argonaut (basically a DC4 with RR Merlin engines) of British Midland Airways crashed in Stockport on the approach to Manchester Airport with much loss of life. It had lost power in engines 3 & 4 through fuel starvation caused by inadvertent cross-feeding of fuel which could happen if certain fuel control levers were not FULLY pushed into position. There had been earlier non-fatal accidents and incidents to DC4s through this cause and it was thought the danger was well known among DC4 crews who would ensure the fuel levers were fully pushed home. However, that knowledge seems to have evaded the crew of this Argonaut. The crash of the aircraft, Hotel Golf, would make an excellent Mentour video! There have been suggestions that the wrong engine was shut down (one of them was never feathered), and of very poor CRM (it was a long time ago!) and also possible crew fatigue leading to poor decision making (the first engine failure happened on short final to Manchester, but instead of simply landing on the runway just a couple of miles in front of him, the captain decided to go around to try to trouble-shoot the problem). Vince C

[@Tolpuddle581]

I remember that event I was a teenager in Derby back then.

[@anna_in_aotearoa3166]

Oof, that final issue with potentially choosing go-around instead of 'just land right now' had an uncomfortable resonance with some of the potential-contributing-factor discussion Juan Browne was contributing re the recent Jeju Air crash..? 😬 One always hopes that the industry learns & grows from past tragedies, but sometimes these echoes do seem to recur... (As many in the comments have been remarking, the McDonnell-Douglas flaws around design, fault-reporting & regulatory capture also have some nasty resonances with the course of events at Boeing following their merger, ouch!! 😵‍💫)

[@gzk6nk]

@@anna_in_aotearoa3166 Indeed, but in fairness to Jeju it now seems they went around to avoid a dense flock of teal on final approach rather than fly through them, but hit birds in the go-around, taking out both engines.

[@kenblankley3017]

I too was a youngster in Stockport at the time of the crash and have recently given talks about the incident so was shocked to watch Petters account of the DC-6 incidents and feel a case of history repeating itself. Twenty years after the DC-6 event Stockport should not have happened. What was more uncomfortable was that this accident happened on 4 June 1967 and the day before a DC-4 Air Ferry's aircraft taking holiday makers from Kent UK to Palma Majorca had crashed In near Perpignan France where the accident board blamed carbon monoxide poisoning of the crew caused by a faulty cabin heater. Or was it CO2?

[@DrangeDragRacingTeam1967]

Nothing like a Mentour Pilot video on a Sunday afternoon! Greetings from Norway 🇳🇴

[@matthewwilliams9200]

It's amazing how history repeats itself

[@memes4themasses365]

Back to back weekend uploads! , how lucky we are