Otto Hightower Is Everything A Westerosi Man Is Supposed To Be

Otto Hightower is shaping up to be one of the most important characters in House of the Dragon. While, like most of the Hightowers, he is positioned as a villain of the story, his characterization is a bit more complex than that. Ironically, Otto is everything that a Westerosi man is supposed to be, which both translates to villainy and to a massively misunderstood character.
Content of This Video:
00:00 Intro
01:28 Otto & Alicent From A Different Point Of View
03:29 Otto's Handship From A Different Point Of View
08:32 Otto Is A Perfect Representation Of Westeros
11:37 Outro

[@peterhanes7333]

I have always said the difference between Team Black and Team Green is GRRM slapping us in the face with Deliberate Values Dissonance. The facts are that by Westerosi standards, Team Green is right. But their arguments repulse modern Westerners. They are essentially, "Boys come first, and Rhaenyra's children are bastards!" Both are absolutely valid points in Westeros. But modern readers aren't scared of female leaders, and aren't bothered by female promiscuity. So we support Team Black. We perceive them as fighting for "our values". In reality, Daemon and Rhaenyra are just fighting for themselves.

[@amyward8861]

Oh this is a take I like!

[@livl9152]

now this is important

[@victoriaseveroferreira110]

This is one of the best takes on this story so Far!

[@justt1984]

Thank youuuu

[@idawg7332]

Completely agree but it’s not just the gender aspect. The greens specifically Alicent and Otto overall have more traditional stern values while rhaenyra and daemon are more rebellious and try to live free. Obviously in there modern west we would want to have freedom but it doesn’t work in Westeros especially where you have a responsibility as a ruler

[@HolyknightVader999]

The fact that Otto can keep his cool around a guy like Daemon, who pushes his buttons more than once and mocks him over his dead wife, is a testament to his emotional and psychological control of himself. Most men would crack if they had to deal with that so often that the king even says that Daemon makes a sport of it.

[@grimaldus1523]

What could otto even do? doing anything would just get him killed.

[@100EmotionalDamage]

@@grimaldus1523 Otto is one of the most dangerous men in all of Westeros if not the most! Trust me there is a lot he can do about it, but he always chooses the path that serves his family best!

[@elsamariahertervig6171]

Bad people with huge embtions are usually good at keeping their cool, that is why some people go far in politics and some don't.

[@clementtroaming5435]

Otto is good until Lord Tywin Lannister comes into the game. Lord Tywin will probably be the massive middle finger to Daemon as compared to Otto.

[@HolyknightVader999]

@@clementtroaming5435 I don't think so. Tywin would probably relish Daemon's cruelty and efficiency. While Otto condemned Daemon's brutal sense of justice, Tywin would probably applaud it and back Daemon up. He'd probably even support Rhaenyra's claim to the throne and ensure she wins, because the Greens aren't as brutally efficient as Daemon is.

[@magpie_monster]

People hate "team green" so much they purposefully misunderstand whats happening on screen. Great video!

[@agentz4695]

His scene with Alicent when he warns her about the danger Aegon is in is my favourite Otto scene. It was so good. And seeing Otto so emotional was awesome. Like that scene truly showed me that he isn't an evil man, that he truly believes the things he does are for the best. "Either you prepare Aegon or you cleave to Rhynerya and pray for her mercy!" I think he truly believed Rhyneyra would see Alicent's children as a threat.

[@courier420winter]

regardless of rhaenyra daemon deff would have yeet those kids

[@kimiko6732]

She prayed for mercy and all her children death because she made Aegon king

[@ucnguyenanh9414]

People believe in what they believe. A evil person can have belief too. But there's no good and evil in this conflict.

[@khfan4life365]

Even if Rhaenyra didn’t want to, she would have to get rid of those kids and their offspring to secure her place on the throne. Robert Baratheon didn’t want to murder the Targaryen children either but knew he had to to secure his claim, which was why he had Tywin do it.

[@nicholasbarber3644]

otto did all this as a second son he is an example of how a second son can be one of the most powerful people in westeros without usurping his older brother

[@nont18411]

Stannis should take note from him

[@simonorourke4465]

True but I'm pretty sure that everything that Otto did was first vetted and signed off on by his order brother, who wanted to advance the power of Hoyse Hightower at any cost.

[@publiopaolacci495]

@@nont18411 Stannis was loyal to Robert to a fault, he grumbled and complained but always did his duty

[@MomoAfterDark]

@@nont18411 nah Renly should take note he was the dirty usurper

[@commenttuff8891]

Excepts he helps usurps the throne lol

[@hamzaorakzai3490]

Quite evident that GRRM wrote 'The Dance' with a certain bias towards the blacks but often times the criticisms levelled at Alicent and Otto are downright hypocritical in nature, considering that Rhaenyra, Daemon and Corlys can at times demonstrate a greater level of self serving ambition

[@HillsAliveYT]

Yeah, I've always been a bit thrown off by the overwhelming support for the blacks, but I find it more interesting now that we've seen the intro to HotD because it has had GRRM's input and Alicent and Otto are characterized as the exact opposite type of people that they are in F&B. GRRM loves using POV to mess with readers so the inability for many to read through the lines when it comes to this conflict is strange.

[@poppag8281]

@@HillsAliveYT I personaly felt overall that the blacks and the greens weren't both painted as mostly black and white characters in fire and blood, can you elaborate as to why you think otherwise?

[@Argos-xb8ek]

@@HillsAliveYT I mean it's hard to not feel for the blacks.

[@vortex_1336]

Fire and Blood is written as a history book. It's an in universe tome. The characters that are writing the histories have their own biases.

[@mcstotti8691]

I always thought that the point of the dance was that neither the greens nor the blacks where good guys. They fought over who's right it was to sit on the throne instead of governing. They saw the crown not as a burden to be carried but as a price to be won. And in their petty squabling the people they wanted to rule bled even more than the targaryens ever could. The whole discussion about who the show or the book portrays as sympathic kinda misses the mark by a lot.

[@KuningannaSansa]

Some SANITY in this fandom, finally!! A lot of people seem to view this show like some kind of soap opera, leading to comments like "alicent is evil for secretly seducing her bbf's father behind her back" and other nonsense. Otto clearly loves his daughter and his idea for the marriage of rhaenyra and aegon was good. In fact, Viserys later praises rhanyra for offering a marriage aliance between her kid and alicent's daughter except it's clear to the whole realm her kid is illegitimate and alicent's son not daughter has the better claim so.... it's the same but less good.

[@HillsAliveYT]

Yes, I do think that Otto has genuine love for Alicent, and we can recognize that their union is disgusting and dubiously consenting while also recognizing that Otto matching her with someone who isn't evil, who is incredibly powerful, who won't horrifically abuse her, and where Otto can be at her side for years to come (or at least he would have assumed at the time) is actually a HUGE win in a place as messed up and misogynistic as Westeros.

[@AdityaNema]

So true! I deleted twitter because it went there and all I see is "Otto is a pimp", "Alicent is a bitch" and "Criston Cole is an incel" type of shit and endless fangirling over Daemon who I think is the most evil of them all

[@lisahuber9329]

I think a lot of people do recognize that Alicent had no choice in marrying Viserys, but many just don't like the fact that she didn't tell Rhaenyra about it. The "everything is black and white" kind of haters are just as always the loudest. Also Viserys was against Otto's suggestion of marrying Aegon to Rhaenyra because he was just way too young and he needed a husband for Rhaenyra asap.

[@bleedingcrystal4722]

Otto made one critical error. He assumed that Viscerys would follow tradition if a son was born. I agree that even the solution he came up when that corkscrew was thrown his was was sound. Marrying Rhaenyra and Aegon was a sound idea. Tywin wanted to marry Cersei to Rhaegar and he’s widely regarded as being brilliant at playing the game. I don’t like Otto but if not for a corkscrew no one could have seen coming his place in history would look far different.

[@chrisrubin6445]

@@HillsAliveYT I mean I guess what is considered “horrific abuse” might be subjective, but when I saw Viserys raping Alicent on screen as she dissociated and Viserys then turned her head so he could look into her eyes , i as a viewer was pretty horrified, and I imagine Alicent was too, and Otto put her in this position, on purpose, for the power and glory of his house

[@WattalaKnights]

Great take on Otto. It's interesting to note how people seem to hate Otto for putting his daughter in Viserys's line of sight but give Daemon a pass. This man killed his wife and took his niece to a brothel but they look passed it because he's so charismatic. LOL Moving on to Viserys and the succession crisis he created. I was listening to the Fire and Blood audiobook about Jaehaerys reign (didn't get to the Dance yet) and what stood out to me was how he got around the incest issue. According to the book, Westeros was not thrilled with incest. In fact, Jaehaerys older brother and sister were nearly killed by a mob for their marriage and when the young king married his sister, his mother was despondent because she thought he destroyed his claim to the throne. So how did the man get around it? He got the Faith to pass a rule of "exceptionalism" for the Taragaryens where his family got a free pass because their connection to the dragons made it important that they keep their line pure. Of course, it helps that his Hand was a Sept of the Faith that he did that. It blows my mind that Viserys didn't do anything similar. If he wanted Rhaenyra to succeed him without issue, he should have built out that "exceptionalism" law and allowed for equal primogeniture for the Iron Throne. It would have saved his house so many problems and it would have discouraged her detractors.

[@nunyabiznes33]

True. He could have gotten Ottos to use the Hightower's influence to get the Faith on their side.

[@Valentinianist]

Viserys himself benefited of the prohibition of women in the iron throne (aka Rhaenys the queen that never was), so he wanted Rhaenyra and only Rhaenyra to be queen and never passed a law that would undermine his reign. He only wanted to break the rules once for his daughter,

[@ClementWilliamstheoneandonly]

I saw another argument that he should've abdicated while he was alive to ensure that Rhaenyra really did take the throne but I think all of these ideas show that 1. Vizzy was no shrewd machiavelian politician 2. He really did not anticipate the extent to which people he loved would scheme against other people he loved for a throne he never really cared for, beyond his duty.

[@fabioviti7384]

Daemon didn't killed his wife, didn't u see?; he used the force of dragon jedi magic to scare the horse soo much (by making him watch season 8) that he failed his backflip, which he did out of nowhere, so the unlucky woman died :) That scene was so stupid

[@totalwar1793]

I mean, bringing your niece to a brothel, provided she's of age is a meh thing. Now... seducing and grooming your niece to make it so that she becomes your wife when she becomes older is problematic

[@hark1007]

I think part of Otto being hated as much as he is is because Daemon has been a fucking badass in a lot of the episodes we've seen him in making him sympathetic to many even if he doesn't deserve it. So a lot of people reflexivly side with Daemons View on Otto. I agree with your take. He's the ugly reflection of Westerosi Society but arguably one of the most competent administrators and diplomats of the Dance making him a immensly interesting Character including thematically

[@HillsAliveYT]

LOL yes, Otto is not helped by the fact that Daemon seems like the coolest dude ever and Otto gives off the vibe of a shy nerd.

[@hark1007]

@@HillsAliveYT which makes me like him just a little bit more tbh

[@HillsAliveYT]

@@hark1007 LOL yes same, definitely find the corny overly detailed geek far more relatable than the natural-born badass.

[@assortmentofpillsbutneverb3756]

Yep the blacks are the frame team. Badass, scandalous, blood, and even noble for the kids... idk if id call them rightous or smart outside of rule of cool haha

[@zillagrilla315]

@@HillsAliveYT Not only that when we see him we see Tywin/Littlefinger so we automatically assume he's the bad guy. Is Otto an ambitious cunt, yes, but compared to the aforementioned above Otto is a saint.

[@ukotoa1639]

I think Otto at one point thought of Viserys as a close friend since when Viserys suggests he had something to do Baleon’s death he looks actually a bit hurt and you know if my best friend suggested I murdered her father yeah I’d be hurt to

[@MrBroken030]

For a second i was on board with your theory but then i remembered the looks Otto and the maester were exchanging :/ there was some scheming going on there, the maggots and leeches therapy also never worked out for Viserys. Also note how leprosy is something we have never seen on any other character before. Also note how a good friend would not plot behind Viserys back or would epxloit his emotional weakness in the mourning of his dead wife......

[@hez859]

@@MrBroken030 the showrunners came out already and said Otto does indeed love Viserys though. Also, look at his face before he goes to the king's chambers to tell him about His daughter and Daemon. He certainly wasn't looking forward to telling him that news

[@andrewkessler2020]

@@MrBroken030 Yeah, there is even a leprosy analogue (included in HoTD!) in greyscale yet the King doesn't have that, he has something else wrong with him

[@wizardmongol4868]

@@MrBroken030 except he didnt do the seacond regarding the first he actually had to deal with alot of politics its a lose-lose situation in either case

[@trevordavis6830]

@@hez859 I think there's truth to both claims about Otto. I think Otto did really care for Viserys as a friend, but his sense of duty to his house ultimately always pushed him to manipulate and undermine Viserys in any way that would eventually help benefit his house. Its like when he had his daughter marry Viserys or when he brushed aside the fact that Aemond lost his eye. Yes he does care for others and doesn't necessarily want them to be harmed, but their happiness and well-being are secondary to their function to further his house's legacy.

[@juanrubenjuarezmacias1824]

Well, he was trying to keep daemon far from the throne, and then the heir is becoming his fangirl to the point of going to a brothel with him, he knows than now daemon has a certain influence over her, and maybe he dont thinks than rhaenyra will kill his grandsons but he thinks daemon will.

[@vivideblois]

I couldn't understand why people were so furious about him telling on Rhaenyra, was he suppose to keep it secret and let her run wild until it became a public scandal ? Sure there is some self-interest, but I saw him doing it because it was the right thing to do. He hesitated, he went back and forth, he wasn't rubbing his hands in glee. Could you do Criston Cole next ? He's not a good person, but considering that the book had two very different reasons as to why he and Rhaenyra fell out and how uncomfortable that sex scene was to watch, I think it's quite unfair that he's reduced to an incel by the fandom.

[@Leo_ofRedKeep]

Rhaenyra was risking her own reputation and Otto told Viserys so he could stop the damage. There was no self-interest in there, on the contrary.

[@shihoblade]

It was 100% self serving. And he doesnt even try to deny it later when talking with Alicent. He outright tells her thay the war is already on and the time to be fair is over. He directly tells his daughter that his actions were self centered and that dhe needs to get on the same page. And thats the same thought pattern older Alicent is on, she doesnt want fair and balanced, she wants people supporting her side over the "fair" thing. So no, Otto isnt some poor servant falsely accused. He meant to poison the king against Daemon and Rhaenyra, and that wasnt his first move to undermine The potential heirs to the throne.

[@vivideblois]

@@shihoblade That's why I said there was some self-interest. But is it poison when he's right ? Could you imagine the backlash if that had been made public ? If a single one of those people had been a highborn who told others what he saw ?

[@paycunha6092]

@@shihoblade I mean, yeah he’s going to put his house first. That’s exactly what every Targaryen in this show does as well but no one acts like they are the villains. The truth is The king is the reason the dance of dragons happened. He made his daughter heir but then went and married again having true born sons and refused to change the succession. By Westeros tradition both those boys should be ahead of Rhaenyra in succession and because of this when Rhaenyra becomes queen they will always be a threat to her rule, and there would be lords and houses scheming to put them on the throne instead of her and her sons who everyone wildly knows are bastards. She would have to cut down both those boys to keep the throne, and that’s what Otto told Alicent. So really, no one has much of a choice in this war and if the king made different choices all of it could have been avoided.

[@vivideblois]

@@dreamshakejunya They didn't show it but it's book canon that he did and in the show he doesn't dispute it. And they didn't have penetrative sex, they were still engaging in sexually activities in a brothel. That's still just as bad, and considering that the spy was outside the brothel, he's not purposefully lying.

[@MarshallBouchard]

I just realized why I respect Otto so much. In law school, a professor once told me that lawyers don't apply the law, they manipulate it. That characterization has always stuck with me. Otto is excellent at playing this game. He is able to take any situation and present it with a spin that plays to his agenda of advancing the interests of his immediate family, his house, and Westerosi customs, in that order. While not always effective at persuading others, he has a way of presenting his viewpoints as practical, sensible, even moral at times.

[@SightUnseen555]

In the books, Alicent is 17 and Viserys is 28 when Aemma dies. Paddy Considine was cast as a much older actor (49) to really exaggerate that aging process that takes a toll on him through the series, but canonically the age gap isn't THAT wide. It's still 11 years, but it's not really that bad for the time period that this is based on. So to say he's old enough to be her father isn't really true. Also the other leading candidate for marriage was a 12 year old.

[@MomoAfterDark]

11 years wouldn’t even be that crazy in our times depending on when it starts. A 35 year old man with a 24 year old woman wouldn’t even be blinked at.

[@TXbornTNpaid615]

You have NO CLUE how old Alicent is in the show, she could've easily been 20, which still happens, and is NOTHING considering both are adults

[@jamiemohan2049]

Yes. When Alicent reached her twenties he should have only looked a few years older then her.

[@SightUnseen555]

@@TXbornTNpaid615 I'm not sure what argument you're replying to or why you sound so angry.

[@thethessaliah]

@@TXbornTNpaid615 She's supposed to be 14 according to the interviews.

[@pg1448]

The Hightowers being painted as the villains never made sense to me. I mean even if you removed their motivation of being scared of what Rhaenyra in power might do to Alicents children, I could still see where they are coming from because they are all of a sudden denied what according to all the customs and laws of their world should have been theirs to begin with - namely Aegon being heir to the throne. After all literally everyone expected that Aegon would be the heir. Baelon, Aemmas short lived son, would have been the heir. Every Targaryen king before Viserys chose a male heir, usually the oldest son as is tradition. Only Viserys now decides to break the tradition due to his bad conscience and regrets towards the death of his first wife. Keeping Aemmas daughter as heir, since Aemma died from his desire of getting a male heir, is his way of making amends, he eases his bad conscience that way without realizing that by doing that he screws over his second wife Alicent and her children and pretty much everyone else. I don't think Viserys disclosed his intentions regarding succession towards Otto or Corlys when discussing their marriage proposals. The main reason they wanted to marry their daughters to Viserys was obviously the prospect that their grandsons would inherit the throne. I can't imagine them agreeing to the marriage otherwise, because there is zero benefit in that match for Alicent when her children are sidelined and are a potential threat to the kings chose heir. No father, including Otto, would have moved his daughter intentionally into this miserable position where she stands to gain nothing. This to me makes Viserys the villain first and foremost, he must have known why everyone wanted him to marry their daughter and he basically fucked them over by not keeping the implicit promise that came with that offer. The Hightowers are still in the wrong for starting a war, but it is hard not to recognize their reasoning in this. Aegon has a very strong claim as the firstborn son in the eyes of many lords, even more so now that Rhaenyra fucked up again and birthed illegitimate children - two serious violations of tradition, not only a daughter should come before a son but even her bastards instead of trueborn children. Even if Rhaenyra doesn't want to harm Alicents children, there is a good chance that rumours would spread and fierce opposition would grow against her succession. Power tends to corrupt people and make them paranoid of potential challengers, especially Targaryens are known to be prone to this. And if not Rhaenyra, then at least someone like Daemon who hates Otto and the Hightowers would have zero qualms about removing the potential threat. Otto as an experienced politician is probably accurate about his assessment of the situation and genuine in his worry for his daughter and her children. But even if that threat didn't exist, then the point still stands that the Hightowers have simply been cheated and treated unfairly by the king.

[@made-line7627]

Very true. It's a little strange to me that not many people have been discussing Viserys' _radical_ promise to Corlys in the betrothal deal with Laenor, that the first born child - *regardless of their gender* - would inherit the Iron Throne after Rhaenyra's death. That is a _huge_ deal, but I've heard _one_ comment about it on _one_ KZbin video. Weird.

[@HillsAliveYT]

Yes agreed, honestly if Viserys wanted Rhaenyra to maintain her status as heir then that's something that should have been disclosed before he married anyone else. And the Velaryons are the biggest reason why I can't understand the Hightowers being portrayed as villains, because if Viserys had married Laena and she'd had sons and skipped over them in favor of Rhaenyra, then the Dance of the Dragons still would have happened. It's an entirely predictable outcome of the fuckery.

[@Leo_ofRedKeep]

The Hightowers are seen as villains by morons who go into this story unconditionally buying Rhaenyra as the proposed protagonist the same way they stuck to Daenerys long after she went bad.

[@kellharris2491]

I think by the time his sons came into the picture that Rhae had been heir for to long. She would be a threat. He realized that if he switched that she would likely die as would her children. But I think honestly the dance would have happened some other way The Targaryens were too many. The powers that be wanted a war. It was like the start of ww1. So many ready to fight.

[@zillagrilla315]

True but they weren't blindsided that Rhaenyr was the heir. If Viserys named Rhaenyr on his death bed then the Greens had every justification to start the war (in my opinion) but they had years to accept and make peace with Rhaenyr but they didn't.

[@equusquaggaquagga536]

Good news: Otto gets a grandson to become king Bad news: it's Aegon II

[@MrLuchenkov]

Otto gets jealousy more than hate from the other noblemen and quite a bit of resentment as he's a second son of a wealthy house (but by no means an extremely powerful house). However, GRRM pushes Team Black and the show does it to such great extent that people are associating with Team Black due to "you go girl, you fierce" rather than any argument that would be logically sound in their own universe. It's the same reason why few people - outside of some of us, men and women of culture - backed Stannis during the GoT years, despite his claim being the strongest one by far. Otto does (almost) everything right. His marriage proposal would have solved the crisis Viserys was too stubborn to face. It'd have united Team Black and Team Green before there ever was such a thing. He married his daughter to Viserys, which made her queen in her own right (easily the best match the daughter of a second son of Hightower, a landless lord, could have hoped for). Not only that but he also assured her well-being, knowing Viserys was a kind and loving husband. She likely wouldn't know the great passionate love (that's when the show is trying to use modern values to paint him as a villain) but then again, during that time period, who did? Sure, it did also solidify his hold on power but if you do something for others and you also stand to benefit from it, it doesn't negate the fact that what you did also benefited the other parties. It's actually the hallmark of a great move if everybody comes out on top. Outside of that, the realm is at peace and has been for the longest time. Finances are in order. There are no active rebellions. As a Hand, those are major accomplishments. No, seriously, I'm personally Team Otto. Man is shrewd. So what? Shrewdness isn't a necessary evil trait, as so many people seem to think. Shrewdness, for the greater good, is an excellent trait to possess.

[@wserthmar8908]

There can only be two opinions on Otto: yours and the wrong one. Just kidding, but you're right

[@karem3462]

You are right my friend, long live the rightful king stannis the mannis

[@notyetawomen5257]

I’m not team Otto but I do respect shrewdness in a character.

[@thedarkestfateful]

I love your points on Otto Hightower being the quintessential Westerosi nobleman. One of the show’s weaknesses is trying to paint the Greens as villains, even though Otto clearly has good reasonable suggestions such as marrying both Aegon and Rhaenyra together. They’d both get what they want. In fact, the outcome would be better since Aegon would be King Consort while Rhaenyra would do the actual ruling - Aegon didn’t want to rule anyway. Book Alicent makes this suggestion and presses Viserys, which he also ignored TT_TT. Rhaenyra is my fave but she definitely was not prepared to be a Queen. She doesn’t possess the political acumen that she could have easily gained with experience if Viserys had let her participate more in the Small Council. I mean, all this running around with Daemon in a pleasure house of all places and she expects the smallfolk to respect her as Queen. Otto was right to snitch.

[@elisahiichan3147]

@@focusedstudying8993 and this is what the black stans can't get into their head. Aegon would always be a threat to rhaenyra claim because he has a d!ck. Like it or not, rhaenyra has to kill Aegon in order to strengthen her claim

[@kimiko6732]

Greens are the evil ones

[@ttowen]

Yeah, I was surprised when HOTD started with how compelling Otto was. In the first episode he Carrie’s notes of what people insist Tywin was as Hand, but without the brutality and a worldview based on pragmatism- not pragmatic cruelty. I preferred Lyonel, but his problem was a lack of the same ambition Otto has.

[@johansmallberries9874]

I do love how Otto IS the shortlist for hand of the king. He just keeps getting the gig.

[@Bonanzababe]

"Is he a good person? No." No he is not and I absolutely loooove hiiim! I love these morally gray characters who have so much charisma. I'm so glad he's coming back for tomorrow's episode!

[@TheGoodLuc]

Otto and Alicent are right enough to root for them and wrong enough not to. Just like with Rhaenyra.

[@pindanetel]

he is a good person, it just that his doesn't follow the definition of what is good by your post enlightenment modern liberal values

[@Bonanzababe]

@@pindanetel Well he did attempt to order the murder of a woman and her children who he has known their entire lives, so let's call him morally gray then.

[@SoilToSoul]

Another good take! I really appreciate how you remind both yourself and the listener to really put themselves within the context of the society that is shown, and not to only look at it from the stance of how our societies are today. I think many people lose that context, and their takes on things can be lacking because of it.

[@sleejay8910]

My only problem with this take is that societies develop for a reason. We wouldn’t want to live in a sexist society, prejudiced against bastard children, where women like allicent are forced to wed men like viserys. It ultimately means that the group which stands to lead their society towards modernity is the one most in the right. In this case, that is the blacks. Because even if it is normal for their world, the greens’ entire claim is based on one form of prejudice or another.

[@poenpotzu2865]

What like about you said about Otto is that he is noble everyman. What makes Otto a threat is that his privilege and background gives him the most amount of connections to most nobles in the realm. Ps love your videos

[@maggyfrog]

the disdain for daemon is more personal imo. he knows that he (and by extension house hightower) doesn't have a place in court with daemon as king. it's self-interest that drives it. he knows he can't manipulate daemon or even be the bearer of "bad news" to him. there's no way otto could have any kind of rapport with daemon whom he probably correctly surmises as an intelligent reader of people.

[@HillsAliveYT]

I'm sure there is an element of this, because Daemon undoubtedly makes Otto's aims and his job in general much harder, but I also think they just do not vibe whatsoever, Otto seems like a straitlaced stick in the mud and Daemon is bananas so I don't think they would ever not hate each other by nature.

[@MenwithHill]

Daemon would make his life difficult in the same way Maegor probably made a lot of people's lives difficult. He's a loose canon who doesn't respect people's boundaries and doesn't seem interested in good governance. It's not difficult to see he would make a terrible king.

[@maggyfrog]

@@HillsAliveYT yes, that's true. it's also apparent though that no matter how "by-the-rules" otto is, he is still just as ambitious as any other lord in the realm. he just knows how to plant seeds in the right way such that nothing is technically "wrong" with his actions. and daemon correctly reads his ultimate goal through the smokescreen of calculated lawfulness. daemon is chaotic but i don't think he lacked the skills to rule. he just wanted to be all "dragon" about everything, but it means that he wants none of the lickspittles within the bureaucracy chain and replace it all with as much valyrian power as possible.

[@sonnysmith3244]

@@MenwithHill I have the diametrically opposed opinion as you do about Daemon. I think he’d make a good if not great King. Just going by what we’ve seen in the show, he demonstrated a good amount of organizational acumen with his restructuring and refitting of the Gold Cloaks. He has demonstrated that he is both concerned with and interested in what the smallfolk collectively feel about things and has shown some empathy towards them in that he seems to want King’s Landing to be safe for people to live in. He has shown an interest in history and an ability to learn, he isn’t concerned with material possessions, he’s open-handed towards people that he likes and are loyal to either him or his family, he understands the strategic importance of pirates taking over the Stepstones and acts on it. He also isn’t afraid to put himself in harms way, which is important for the common foot soldier and lower nobility to see for morale. He’s not overly magnanimous but he is far from cruel. We’ve been told he would be a bad king, despite in my opinion seeing the opposite.

[@hermithefrog629]

@@sonnysmith3244 in a word, no Gold cloaks - running a military or paramilitary organization is different from nation. And he didn't really restructure them so much as instilled into them a soft hero cult with him as it's head. Sure, many of the people killed were surely criminals, but with how they were going about it all it takes is one accusation to be on the chopping block. Stepstones - he didn't go because he wanted to end the threat they posed to westerosi sailors, that's what Alicent tells Viserys to make him realize it's importance. And while you can argue that Daemon going helped, he and his men were shown to be ineffective in dealing with pirates, in spite of their restructuring and fanaticism towards Daemon. Harm's way - if that was the case he'd have hopped off the dragon after teamkilling his guy, and gone and hunted down the crab feeder there and then. Clearly he's able to cut his way through the caves they were using, and their entire force. He did the suicide run because his brother was about to upstage him. Ask that messenger he beat nearly(?) to death. He'd be like Robert but would not be satisfied with wine and women. He would hate ruling, avoid it at all costs, and prefer to go flying on his dragon or fighting in tourneys. Not so bad as Maegor, or Aerys towards the end

[@ThePatman1980]

I know some are defending HOT D for going too fast because it's not like Laena and Harwin are well-written in the book. Fire & Blood is more of a history book about the Targs. It's not written like a novel. It takes until Chapter 12 in F&B until we get to the part that HOT D covers. But if TV writers can improve Viserys, they could do the same for Laena and Harwin. When Rhea and Joffrey got killed, I didn't care. It was our first time seeing them. But we saw Laena at age 12 in Ep 2. We saw Harwin in Ep 3. I feel we needed one more episode with Laena and Harwin so when they died, it can really hit us harder. Daemon and Rhaenyra had children with these two characters and they got treated like red shirts in Star Trek.

[@made-line7627]

Completely, 100% agree. I'm seeing many book-readers belittle people whom they assume haven't read Fire & Blood when the latter raise issues with the extreme 180 with Alicent, and the lack of feeling those people had with Laena and Harwin's deaths. I *have* read the book (all of the ASOIAF material), and I agree with those sentiments. Just _one_ extra episode would have been beneficial in getting the audience to, 1) Not feel whiplash by Alicent's full-on turn into seemingly unredeemable bitch, and 2) Actually feel strong emotion when Laena and Harwin die. The former people seem to think we all wanted a 12 episode season, or for the younger cast to stay in their roles until the season's end, and while some people may have wanted that, it's not everyone, and it's certainly not just the show-only audience. The defense used against people who think the show is seeming a little rushed _is_ that "F&B doesn't include many lines about Harwin and Laena, so the show is just being true to the book". But as you said, they managed to flesh-out Viserys really well, and Laena and Harwin are integral enough to the story that they should have received the same treatment. Soz for the rant haha.

[@nunyabiznes33]

And worse they just killed Laena for shock value.

[@vini_lla07]

Showing more of Lady Rhea would have not worked in internet Bf Daemon's favour.

[@colmoe]

Your video is extremely underrated. Most asoiaf youtubers are Black fans who are ironclad in their hatred of Otto/the Hightowers (most of the reasons stemming from "Hightowers aren't Valyrians, and therefore bad"). I'm a Green, for many reasons, but this video perfectly summarizes some of those up (e.x. Viserys being a friend to Otto, Otto being a good friend to Viserys, Alicent being in "safe hands"). Yes, Otto is ambitious. Every lord is. How many of those lords were genuinely friends with Viserys? Its the game of thrones. If you think Otto is bad, Daemon, Corlys, and even Rhaenys are also bad. EDIT: I think the King's word is not law. Daemon IS going to be Maegor with Teats. That one night gold cloak raid proves it. However, the fandom loves Targaryens (the "chaotic" ones and the "girlbosses") Kudos to you for this. You've earned a sub.

[@HillsAliveYT]

LOL it is not an easy world out there for the Greens that's for sure! And I will always be more interested in characters like Otto and Alicent simply because they don't have the dragon nuclear option, it's far more interesting to see characters actually work their way out of disadvantaged situations rather than just being able to mass murder their rivals or force them into submission because they're so overpowered.

[@MenwithHill]

I feel like a lot of the Blacks' appeal to the audience is exactly why they struggle through the entire rebellion. They're made up of impulsive rule breakers who don't respect society's norms. I am still baffled at the number of people who don't seem to understand how offensive it is for Rhaenyra to offer **the world's most obvious bastards** to marry Alicent's children. And why not have Aemond marry Seasmoke too ?

[@HillsAliveYT]

@@MenwithHill Okay seriously though, like "put your trueborn daughter's life and future prospects at risk by marrying her to my obvious bastard" is not the gesture of kindness that a lot of people seem to think that it is.

[@theflashgordon193]

@@HillsAliveYT people would have really care if he was a bastard if they married ? I still think it could have fix the problem.

[@MenwithHill]

@@theflashgordon193 They absolutely would. Having bastards in itself isn't a massive deal, but trying to pass them off as truebornes completely undermines the entire basis of feudal inheritance.

[@AHEM1313]

These videos always offer the most interesting commentary and examinations of Westerosi characters, and they blast apart common fan ideas (and misconceptions) so frequently that they could be part of a series called, "Everything you think you know about the characters of Westeros is wrong!" The next one I really want to see: "Jaehaerys the Conciliator Was NOT The Perfect King!"

[@HillsAliveYT]

OMG I definitely do not stan Jaehaerys to say the least, he's wildly overrated!

[@alialmuhanna4938]

@@HillsAliveYT When the maesters praise someone, it’s always a good idea to take the opposite position.

[@poppag8281]

@@HillsAliveYT oh really? I dissagree so I would love to hear your perspective

[@matthewbrady6370]

He wasn't! Absolutely not! Tons of the stuff IN the text suggests he was a deeply flawed and toxic person. He murdered a man in a duel with Blackfyre (consider what happens in that guy strikes the king) and checked to make sure his daughter was watching him do it. The maesters love him first and foremost because his rule wasn't another Maegor, the ruler who strongly eschewed the Faith and the Maesters. Frankly there isn't a perfect king at any point in Westeros, because they're either too soft and concerned with peace (Viserys I, Baelor, Aenys, Daeron II, Aerys I, Jaehaerys II), too brutal and obsessed with legacy (Maegor, Daeron I, Aerys II, Maekar), or simply too riddled with the Kool-aid of how important they are (Aegons I-V, Jaehaerys I). Oh wait, there's Viserys, Second of his Name, Hand to three kings and then King himself, whose only flaw is fathering Aegon IV . . . which is still pretty bad.

[@poppag8281]

@@matthewbrady6370 can you be more percise I remember him killing a few people in trial by combat, also I never said he was a perfect king but I do think despite his faults (which he had plenty of) he still did a really good job

[@Princess_Weekes]

Another great video and I appreciate your way of bringing in an in textual idea. I think that if the Dance had gone differently Otto would be seen as a fantastic hand

[@HillsAliveYT]

Totes, one of the great ironies of the Dance is that in another lifetime Viserys and Otto could have been borderline legendary leaders for all of the right reasons instead of all of the wrong ones.

[@R0NYFL0NY]

Otto Hightower is a bit like little finger, but instead of being driven by personal ambition, he's driven by societal, cultural, and familial expectation.

[@Health-is-Wealth92]

That is a man of surely then? Little finger was evil manipulative for all the wrong reasons

[@Yatagurusu]

So nothing like littlefinger? Because little finger wants to break societal and cultural rules to create chaos and has no real family and IS driven by personal ambition. You cant say hes like littlefinger when he has none of LFs core characteristics

[@Tlevids]

On the moral greyness scale of political schemers in GoT, I'd say he is somewhere between Baelish (very dark grey) and Tywin (pretty dark grey) on the one side and Varys (light grey) on the other. He's self serving (for himself and his house) but also seems to have a sound reputation in administering the realm as Hand prior to the Dance of Dragons.

[@R0NYFL0NY]

@@Tlevids I don't know, to some extent I agree but his fear of Daemon getting on the throne does come off like genuine concern for the realm, and his suggestion of marrying Aegon to Rhaenerya when they were young was also quite pragmatic and good for the realm as well.

[@77chotu77]

In GOT, everyone supported Ned for trying to expose Cersei's secret... And hated Cersei coz. Cersei's children are bastards born out of an illegal relationship and she was going to extreme extent to protect this secret... They also hated Jaime for trying to kill Bran as it would expose his relationship with Cersei... ---- In HOTD, Raeneyra's children are bastrads born out of illegal relationship... But ppl are hating Alicent and others for trying to expose this secret... - Spoiler Warning---> In books, in future, Raeneyra pushes for her younger son Luke as heir to Driftmark... Corlys' brother opposes this as her sons are bastards... He petitions the King Viserys... But the King punishes them instead... If Luke doesn't become heir, Raeneyra's secret will be exposed... So, both King and Raeneyra went to such an extent to kill Corlys's brother and family... (Wonder how Blacks will react to this if it is included in the series...)... ---- Anyways, the difference between audience' responses to similar situations in GOT and HOTD is quite interesting...

[@HillsAliveYT]

LOL yes I'm aware of Rhaenyra's future moves RE Driftmark and one thing she definitely has is the audacity.

[@77chotu77]

@@HillsAliveYT Also, relooking at GOT, Cersei and Raeneyra are actually more similar than Cersei and Alicent... They just wanted a great sexual life instead of a loveless marriage and simply wanted to be left alone... But when their children's secret was being exposed, they went to extreme extents...

[@theflashgordon193]

the fact we start the serie from their perspective help I guess. Also the way cersei is characterized make her antipatic compared to the stark. same for jaime atleast in season 1.

[@Leo_ofRedKeep]

In GoT, idiots hated Cersei for antagonising the despicably dumb and reckless protagonist put in front of their stupid faces. In HotD, they hate the Hightowers for the same reason. Idiots don't get smart.

[@munken7673]

I Think it has more to do with Joffrey being a monster and Rhaenyra’s kids not being nearly as bad as him

[@lilbrit0821]

In the books Dameon never killed his wife. He was nowhere near her when she died. This was supposed to emphasize how much he ignored his rightful lady wife, that he never went to her even as she was dying. The show runners are the one who added the killing scene

[@Bronn92]

Yes and no. The book it's a chronic written several years later, it shows the official version of history (with a lot of bias in some moments by Gyldayn) and some rumours, no the objective history. Daemon killing his wife in HotD doesn't contradict the book, because nobody saw him. So, like in the book, it was officially an accident.

[@Hiro49265]

@@Bronn92 No, his wife didn't die instantly but dragged on for like a week and even felt well enough to walk just before she died. If it were Daemon who killed her she would tell everyone.

[@Zephur0s]

this is contradictory to people who state that the books are a biased account of what happened and that the show is the truth of what actually happened

[@sugarpearl9781]

@@Zephur0sNo, there are things in the show that directly contradict the things we know for a fact happened. Alicent and Rhaenyra weren’t that close and we’re not the same age for example

[@tiberseptim8434]

Even as a black, I can’t argue that Otto would probably be a way better ruler than Rhaenyra.

[@tiberseptim8434]

Oh god, I just re-read the comment and this looks so bad out of context 😭

[@hark1007]

@@tiberseptim8434 I read it in the Trump Voice. It looks bad out of context but with that it was kinda funny

[@-_-5470]

Considering how Rhaenyra's rule turns out it's hard to agree with this ^^

[@InitialPC]

@@-_-5470 you mean disagree? after all she is known is maegor the cruel with teets, the people hated her so much they rebelled against her and killed her dragons, her cruelty led to the extinction of dragons, think about that

[@saudaltwaijri3427]

Were you born Dumb ?

[@stephanieb5120]

I feel like you’re right about Otto, especially when the latest episode links him with Larys so much (since Larys claims he did what he did to bring Otto back for Alicent’s sake.) Thinking about these two at the same time sort of forces you to compare and contrast what they did. Otto’s whole deal so far is taking advantage of situations others have presented up for him almost on a platter… Rhaenyra and Daemon were not subtle at all in Flea Bottom. Honestly in some ways its not that different from Ned running investigations on Cersei. Meanwhile there’s Larys who goes around gathering information only for it to culminate in some very aggressive. And also it’s something that’s incredibly at odds with the realm’s ideology; namely kin slaying. So on one hand you have someone doing some repulsive things because it’s expected of him, and another doing repulsive things that he has a reasonable chance of believing he could get away with it because it’s so repulsive in universe that people wouldn’t immediately suspect him of it. They make for interesting fouls and it’ll be interesting to see if the show keeps using them this way.

[@stephanieb5120]

*foils not fouls Normally I’d change that autocorrect but this one makes me giggle so I’ll keep it

[@made-line7627]

@@stephanieb5120 They're definitely interesting fouls haha

[@bmosig]

Finally some sense in the fandom. He is probably the only sane and competent character in the whole series

[@AmandaabnamA]

Rhaenyra becomes more and more of the villian as the show goes on, but people stick by her bc shes a Targaryen. It's like people don't realize how much of a mirror this is to Dany, but she actually is

[@Health-is-Wealth92]

Dany had honour, this lady can’t be trusted

[@maestromars8487]

what we wished dany to be basically.

[@TheJewishAzovMember]

@@theelectricprince8231 how? Her cities fell apart instantly when she left them.

[@sugarpearl9781]

@@theelectricprince8231…where? She left every kingdom she conquered worse than they were before she took over.

[@sugarpearl9781]

@@TheJewishAzovMemberThank you! Dany was not a competent ruler! She wasn’t horrible but as a traumatized 13 year old girl with no real training or experience she did as well as could be expected

[@soja8044]

THIS. Thank you so much for this, i hate it so much when people judge characters by the standards of our world and not the one they live in (except Daemon apparently because twitter is weird). Obviously so many things Otto or other characters are terribles by our standards and morals ; but the smartest moves he could do in Westeros. I also think the criticism against him are linked to the fact that he is Alicent's father, and people clearly see them as the villains when both them and Rhaenyra's claims are right (Alicent&Aegon even more if we see it by Westerosi's standards and what the serie established which is males heirs on the throne AND the fact that Rhaenyra's heirs are obviously not Targaryens) and the real one responsible for all this mess is Viserys by not setting clear rules regarding his succession. Living two heirs with equal claims to the throne is arguably one of his worst decisions as a king but everybody seem to see only a kind old grandfather in him that's really sad. Thank you for all your videos, you took me back to Westeros and i'm so happy with it.

[@sonnysmith3244]

Rhyneara’a heirs are only obviously not Targaryens to us as the audience. Targaryen’s have married into families before and the offspring looked nothing like a Targaryen, perhaps most famously Jon Snow (if he is the child of who we think he is). Also, Viserys did set clear rules as to who was to inherit, the fact that the third most powerful house in realm (at the time) isn’t accepting of it doesn’t change that Viserys has been crystal clear on who he wants.

[@soja8044]

​@@sonnysmith3244 but the Velaryon are dragon's blood, having the exact same features as the Targaryen, silver/blonde hair and clear eyes which is nothing like Rhaenyra's sons. It is obvious to everybody looking at their children, especially since everybody seem to know/suspect Laenor is gay. I'd add that Rhaenys is a Targaryen, so by the logic of the show, dragon blood + dragon blood = light hair and clear eyes and people in Westeros knows that. The kids have brown hair and brown eyes which makes it obvious they're not Laenor's childs. Jon Snow is the mix of Targaryen and non Targaryen blood, and it's pretty clear the Targaryen genes are recessive, so they have to marry each other to keep their blood "pure" and their particular traits. The audience isn't the only one who sees all of it : it is stated multiple times that the boys are bastards, everybody sees that, even children, except maybe Viserys and Corlys (more like he doesn't exactly care if they're his blood as long as they have the Velaryon name). Even if Viserys set what he wants crystal clear, it doesn't make it right for most lords of Westeros, as this world is sexist and so many would probably prefer betray their rightful heir rather than seeing a woman on the Iron Throne. And, that claim can be fought against even more now that Rhaenyra becoming queen would make Daemon, who is portrayed as a wannabe tyrant, king consort of the kingdoms. Viserys made it clear too : he never wanted Daemon to be king because he is dangerous for the realm. He could've make him heir to the throne and yet preferred his own daughter, breaking all the laws of Westeros. Both claims are right, as they are both Visery's children. One has the advantage of being the first born and first heir (almost as Rhaenys was) and the other the first male in line for succession (as Viserys was). And it was stated in the beginning of the serie that the lords of Westeros prefer to see a man on the throne if claims are equals. This is why the Greens are fighting for and this is what makes their claims right by the standards of Westeros.

[@Mcbignuts]

Rhaenyras so called "claim", is basically an angry rage-fueled declaration made by king viserys as an insult to daemon targaryen, it's the equivalent of a father angrily disowning his son and giving all the family inheritance to the family dog,only to later sire a second son, obv the son get its not the dog!!! It doesn't help that her kids are bastards either

[@stephenjenkins7971]

People are hypocrites. This was the case in GoT too, when people rightfully called out Jaime for his actions like pushing Bran out of a tower -but then suddenly defend it as natural when they start to like Jaime. Modern standards for when they hate the character shift to "do whatever you want boo" standards if they love the character.

[@trevordavis6830]

Except Visersys stated multiple times and made it perfectly clear that Rhaenyra was to be claimed as heir. While he was hesitant on this matter at first during episode 3, every moment the topic had come up since then made it clear that Rhaenyra was to be his heir. Even during the coup, there is no confusion on who Visersys wanted to be heir(well, except for Alicent, but that's because she thought he changed his mind at the last second).

[@matthewhart9610]

Thank you, so many people seem to hate Otto (and Alicent as well) right now. I definitely don't think they're good people, by modern standards at least, but they are absolutely characters that are interesting and within the world, are everything their society would expect of them. I think Otto does care about Alicent and that he's being unfairly villainised for pushing Alicent towards Viserys (even though it is bad) when Corlys Velaryon did almost exactly the same thing, except his daughter was still a child and yet people don't seem to have the same disdain for his actions. Just compare Otto and Tywin; both are essentially the pinnacle of what a Westerosi Noble should be, and Tywin is even downright abusive towards his children, trying to have Tyrion killed and bullying and berating Cersei into marrying Loras Tyrell. it's obvious even Tywin's own children were terrified of him and yet Otto isn't ever like that, he isn't needlessly cruel, yet despite all that people laud Tywin for his genius and political ruthlessness. I think people tend to forget that you have to try and look at these characters within the frame of the world it's all set in, you can't really apply today's expectations on them because if you do, they're pretty much all villains.

[@chrisrubin6445]

The difference is Corlys Velaryons children were Targaryens and rode dragons, they were literally Viserys first cousins just like his first wife, by marrying Laena Velaryon even though it’s disgusting (he doesent have to bed her until she comes of age, there are whores and he is king) he keeps all the dragons in the royal family, by marrying Alicent the royal family gets nothing, and the most powerful enemy house of the Targaryen’s gets multiple dragon riders

[@fabioviti7384]

Mate, comparing basically evil Machiavelli (tywin) with anoyone isn't a good way to put em in a good light

[@noelmakarth156]

@@fabioviti7384 You completely missed his point. He was comparing fan favoritism not the characters themselves

[@samlasalle3853]

Regarding Otto's last conversation with young Alicent, on one hand he is prepping his daughter for a realistic scenario where her family will be in danger. But, he is also starting a new cycle of generational trauma that sets up Alicent to manipulate her own kids too. Just as you said, he is doing the right thing by Westerosi standards of telling Alicent that Rhaenyra will kill her children and start a war, but this also ends up being the cause of Alicent solidifying green power at court and undermining Viserys's wishes.

[@ucnguyenanh9414]

Otto is a more subtle and more low-profile version of Tywin. Which makes sense, when your mornachs' family own giant flying fire-breathing lizards, being subtle and low-profile is without a doubt a good call.

[@jyuts4359]

I never thought of this. I didn't like Otto because I thought he made Alicent's life miserable and seemed to me powerhungry villain. But you opened my eyes on him and I realised how brilliant this character is how he is better than anyone especially Daemon. Indeed, Otto/Alicent and Daemon/Rhaenyra relationships are both sides of the same coin. Daemon is older by one generation than Rhaenyra like Otto to Alicent but he seduces and manipulates his protege to his own adventage though for Rhaenyra having affairs and bastards, marrying her uncle make her claim to the throne quetionable. Not to mention, because of his selfcentered worldview that he fed the niece, she never wants to sacrifice anything to become better ruler. But being a ruler is a great sacrifice of dreams, wishes, personal life for the nation. Viserys knows it. Alicent knows it. Even Aegon knows and tries his attempt to escape. But Rhaenyra has no idea. She seeks power and recognition and nothing more. Otto being second son, no dragon and no real support but himself made Alicent the most powerful woman in Westeross. Daemon, on the other hand, being a fkin dragon prince, having loving forgiving brother-king made Rhaenyra weaker and incompetent with hateful rival-brothers. Great job, uncle Daemi!!! Besides, relationship of Daemon and Rhaenyra is fked up. How is it romantic? He saw her growth from child. He was supposed to be protective, a father-figure. When she was in her teen how he could thought wow, how hot she is becoming , let's go to the brothel i show you somthing interesting don't even think of responsibilities and reputation that lie on you as a crown princess. Lol, dude, you're perverted freak.

[@leadvendor]

Although the narrative has yet to provide us with further insight into Otto, I give full praise to Rhys Ifans being able to translate so much from the vagueness. The aforementioned conversation with Alicent in the courtyard prior to his departure is masterfully performed by Ifans and Carey because for better or worse, he IS speaking the truth to his daughter, not only for the oncoming storm but out of concern and love for her. Despite his anger and frustration at her denial, he still embraces her the way a caring father would. Is it part of his manipulation, for sure, but like all of the finest manipulations, there is equal amount of truth behind it.

[@yhbgj]

I love Otto because he acts exactly like I do in an average Crusader Kings run

[@nachoyoutube2732]

I wish I had known your channel when GoT was airing. Now I'm glad I can watch HotD while having your perspective on it. Great job 😊

[@misterscorpius1446]

This is a good argument The idea that someone can be rightly seen as antagonistic or even evil by our standards just by being exceptionally normal and highly skilled at meeting the expectations of his setting and time is interesting

[@miam2772]

Another banger video! Definitely agree with your analysis and I am VERY excited to see his path during the show.

[@alaa6532]

love your vids and your reasonable takes on unpopular characters like otto. i would love to see your take on stannis baratheon.

[@HillsAliveYT]

Oh yeah I'll do Stannis for sure! And I think a lot of the "bad" characters are interesting, because I can be grossed out by Otto but also recognize that he is doing precisely what is expected of him, and ironically it all goes to shit because everyone around him is acting bananas.

[@thekage100]

@@HillsAliveYT And maybe Criston Cole?? Like damn, i never thought i could understand Otto, but ur video made me! Also the one with Alicent!

[@BillyBasd]

@@thekage100 One thing that many people miss in the characterization of Cristin is that he could not really say no to Rhaenrya and that their relationship puts him in extreme danger. The first point is contentious, so I'll focus only on the second. Cristin is in danger of being tortured to death if they are discovered. Rhaenrya doesn't seem to understand or care that Cristin is very disturbed and worried after they hook up. Cristin doesn't articulate this to her, instead proposes marriage and running away. In her refusal Rhaenrya uses the duty argument, saying that she would do whatever is needed to gain the throne. It's not a big leap for Cristin to believe that this includes tossing him to this torturous fate. He says as much to Alicent when he confesses, asking for the mercy of a quick death. I have not heard many youtubers bring this horrible fate hanging over Cristin up. It's sad to me how Rhaenrya lost him. I feel that she could have kept him by assuring him that she would never allow him to be tortured to death for their relationship.

[@made-line7627]

@@BillyBasd I agree with you wholeheartedly, I just think she may have missed these signs due to being a teenager with little comprehension of consequences and other people's feelings. Rhaenyra has pretty blatantly been ignoring and dismissive of the feelings of those around her/under her.

[@sonnysmith3244]

@@made-line7627 She doesn’t get better with age.

[@ellaphx]

What a great video! I hadn't thought of any of it that way but I find myself completely agreeing with you. Thanks for posting!

[@legendsofthebravebard]

I really enjoy your efforts to present an unbiased presentation. I look forward to more of your thoughts on the show.

[@yensid4294]

The social-political culture of Westeros is an amoral system that promotes self-interest, self preservation, & self promotion. It rewards violence, cunning & agression. And it punishes the weak, the irresponsible, the sentimental & the incompetent. The characters in this story are very much products of their environment as my mother used to say. Any character, especially an antagonist, is much more interesting when they do" bad " things for "good" reasons than when they are mustache twirling evil-doers gleefully reveling in their maliciousness. The only character I would possibly call a villain so far is Larys, but that's mainly because his motivations & goals are somewhat unclear. And I have a strong aversion to torturers & gossips. 😉

[@TopNotch770]

Great work and a great channel! Very glad I found it!

[@Sigurjon96]

Otto is such a great character. He's smarter and wiser than all of them and isn't cunning and cowardly like Littlefinger from GOT. I don't even understand where that comparison came from. He's the definition of good politics and is so clever with way he handles things. I hope he lasts the entire show and if he doesn't that's injustice. Daemon is an ego freak most of the time and deserves karma whether brutal or not. I can see why Otto distrusts and has a low opinion of him even if he is a badass at times. Daemon's done terrible things without remorse or guilt to his conscience. I don't think I've ever seen a more trustworthy and a loyal hand than Otto was to Viserys. He always managed to give good advices and knowledge to the table. I feel like Daemon would have just manipulated him constantly or made him into a worse being if he was his hand and probably started a war or something even if he didn't mean for it to happen. Even characters like Ser Criston Cole and Ser Larys Strong have much more villainous traits to them than Otto ever does.

[@wserthmar8908]

A spoiler below (I don't know how long this line is supposed to be so the text below couldn't be seen): He will be … executed by Rhaenyra on the 3/5 point of the overall series. He'll have his time to shine through his scheming, but Aegon will fire him in favor of Criston Cole. After Rhaenyra's return to King's Landing, he'll be executed. But I hope the showrunners will keep Rhys Ifans for longer, just to use his acting potential.

[@notyetawomen5257]

@@wserthmar8908I’m curious, how come Rhaenrya didn’t spare Otto this time around, does he do something in the war to anger her or is it revenge against Alicent?

[@nicholasricardo8443]

Fortunately for me I've become so immersed in the world of Ice and Fire that I unironically believe in Westerosi Ethics. Hail His Grace Aegon the Second

[@kimiko6732]

Usurper rapist king

[@playoffpaul6938]

this was a fire character analysis. thank u for this

[@dylanhastry]

I’ve only came across your channel today and I just want to say that you’ve gained a subscriber with me! Love your videos! X

[@marcomongke3116]

Always love it when topics make you think again. Instant subs for more.

[@blackbeardtx371]

I think of Otto and everyone in GoT universe as chess players. Everyone has different styles and strategies when they play and I think of Otto as a reactionary player. Making moves when the opportunity presents itself. When he lost his position as Hand he was patient and waited 10 years to get it back, not even knowing IF he even would get it back. Littlefinger was more of an opportunist, sowing chaos and forcing others to make moves in order to act accordingly. Different styles that CAN be effective, Otto's style just requires much more patience.

[@randominternetguyoffical]

This is a fantastic and insightful character analysis! One of the things I love about your videos is the fact that you actually dive deep into the nuances of the world, the politics and the characters themselves. Its so much more rewarding to hear the multilayered commentary you bring than a surface level relisting of who is who in the series and their most base qualities.

[@Potential_Increase]

He's my favorite character (after maybe Rhaenyra), i just hope they don't mess him up like they did littlefinger. Great video, just found a new amazing smart channel :)

[@huntedboy28]

Thank you! A deep and unbiased analysis of a character is a breath of fresh air, Most people just form emotional attachments to characters and defend them to oblivion (or vice versa).

[@davidhowe3257]

I've watched a lot of your videos and I like your nuanced view of things

[@LizbetNene]

Fantastic analysis again!

[@turnip9367]

I'm glad to see Otto being appreciated as a character. Too many people are easily dismissive of him because they view him as deceitful or scheming, but the reality is, in the game of thrones, everyone is motivated by self-interest. Otto saw a chance to install his blood on the throne and took it. Anyone else in his position would have done the exact same thing, the only difference is they may not have been as successful because they lack his level of shrewd diplomacy and political intrigue. After all, he went from being a second son of a medium sized house to Hand of the King for three rulers. Regardless of your allegiances, you have to respect his tenacity and determination. Very few men would come close to even matching half of his achievements, let along all of them.

[@AdityaNema]

Please do livestreams or episode analysis videos because you have a different perspective than anyone I've seen online and I agree with yours the most

[@HillsAliveYT]

I'd actually love to do that in the future! My real life job prevents me from doing much content beyond these little analysis blurbs each week but if I can ever cut down on my full time job to work more on YT I'd actually love to do livestreams and episode analyses and stuff.

[@Christopherjazzcat]

An excellent, nuanced take. Thank you for sharing

[@rattiegirl5]

Otto Hightower reminds me of Richard Neville- a real historical character known as "The Kingmaker." Neville, unlike Hightower, had no sons, so he had to advance his family solely through his access to the throne and peddling his daughters to powerful men. Although both of his daughters tragically died, one was briefly in line to be queen and the other became queen. Richard Neville himself became one of the most powerful men in England in his time. In the end, however, he overplayed his hand.

[@hasna7542]

such an illuminating study of the character! thank you so much

[@HFeyn]

Your videos are awesome! Liked and subscribed.

[@abhinandanbanerjee5471]

I think I agree with Viserys when he said Otto's ambitions were transparent. For me he is a very methodical man when it comes to governance. In politics, he distinctly lacks cunning. Viserys saw through the whole Alicent plan from the beginning. It has only gone so far due to his depression and lethargy. Whilst trying to take the egg from Daemon, Otto proved himself to be as politically inept as Ned Stark. Rhaenyra saved him.

[@HillsAliveYT]

I think Otto is very politically intelligent but he's also the dude who knows how to operate within the system and is really thrown for a loop when someone goes against that system. He is a kind of weird mirror of Ned Stark not in personality type, but in that they're very good at playing by the rules and the minute they encounter people who don't give af about the rules everything blows up in their faces immediately.

[@abhinandanbanerjee5471]

@@HillsAliveYT is he that intelligent? A lot of his moves work out through luck. Viserys could have been disgusted at Otto for trying to manipulate him with his daughter so soon after Aemma's death. That was entirely a mood thing and Otto got lucky. Daemon could have denied the "Prince for a Day" thing. How would Otto have proved it? What would he do if Daemon demanded a trial by arms to defend himself against the slander? No kingsguard would take up arms against the heir. Corlyn and Rhaenys could have had Alicent killed to push a marriage through between Laena and Viserys. Rhaenyra could have fed Otto to Syrax as retaliation for all the slander. Daemon would support her. What would Westeros do then? Absolutely nothing. Otto brought about the Dance of the Dragons. The truth is, it was dumb luck that Laena died and Aemond got Vhagar. Without that one single variable falling the way it did, Alicent's children would have had no chance.

[@sitting_nut]

​@@abhinandanbanerjee5471 your 2nd comment ( when it is not based on absurd speculations like "corlyn and rhaenys" killing bride to be of king and daughter of the hand, or ignoring fact there were many witnesses to "heir for a day", etc ) is based on assumption dragons are all powerful and thus going against them is necessarily politically unintelligent. which is not the case . targaryans, inspite of their dragons, have been already made to compromise in order to rule, before the period of the show. war is the result of their not compromising in this case of radical change. otto "didn't bring about the dance of dragons". if it wasn't alicent some other queen will have male children threatening rhaenyra' position, and if that queen and her supporters act in anyway to ensure their survival, a similar dance of dragon would result . if they don't act like that they will end up like ned stark. outcome of wars depend on many factors, including motivation and inner strength of those involved , and luck (though luck plays less of a part longer the war). very rarely does it depend of firepower . remember usa regime has not won even one real war since ww2 in-spite of its overwhelming firepower. imo personally, while it will be less visually appealing a war between a side that has no dragons and one that has dragon will be more interesting ( and less soap opera like, ie not in modern western audience's taste, since one side will depend on mass of people instead of few dragon riders being dramatic ) . also it would have asked right questions about what is wrong with westrosi political system . in feudal system, kings rule, as the name implies, through implied contracts based on mutual faith and trust. between king and vassals ( lords ) and lords and commoners. king by himself can't change the system and in real medieval world kings didn't have much power. of course in westros , dragonlords imposed themselves on a feudal system with overwhelming fire power. that makes that world, a feudal system with kings ( and members of royal family )who think they can be absolutists, inherently unstable, especially if king/queen asserts his power.

[@DominionSorcerer]

@@abhinandanbanerjee5471 Viserys could have been disgusted at Otto for trying to manipulate him,yeah. What's the worst that could have happened? Fired as Hand and Viserys doesn't marry Alicent: you are also assuming Otto didn't know Viserys well enough to know it would have worked. How could Otto have proved it? He said it in a room full of people, guardsmen, servants and whores. Daemon could have demanded a trial by arms to defend himself against the slander, that's true. A Kingsguard doesn't have to fight for Otto, he could get a household knight to fight for him. Or fight himself. Neither Corlyn or Rhaenys would have killed Alicent, it's not in their nature and that would have utterly ruined relations between the Velaryons and the Hightowers , and Rhaenyra would hate them. House Hightower is one of the most powerful families in the entire realm, feeding Otto to a dragon would have meant drastic consequences for the Targaryens and the stability of the entire realm.

[@nostalgicbliss5547]

@@abhinandanbanerjee5471 You realize the Hightowers are an extremely powerful and connected house? You can't just murder Otto and his daughter and think everything just goes smooth sailing.

[@lebarondeminuit3580]

He's my favorite character, thank you for your video

[@roseofthegarden_]

You said what I'd been thinking and your video is just another reminder that the ASOIAF and its characters are far more complex than many fans give them credit for.

[@PhoenixRiseinFlame]

The Hightowers are my favorite house in HOTD. They’re clever and knowledgeable but also stick to their principles and seek stability for the realm.

[@lmaocetung]

I've always viewed him as a better version of Tywin Lannister. He is doing the best for his house and wants his children to be strong and wise but Tywin wants his children to be strong and wise only because they are the future of his house. Otto wants the best for his children because he loves his children

[@NathanAllebach]

Brilliant commentary!

[@judeannethecandorchannel2153]

Oh My God I LOVE Rhys Ifans. From the Absurdly dysfunctional weirdo in Notting Hill to the "real" Shakespeare. He's rather beautiful actually and clearly "just doesn't care" as an actor. He'll go there. Anywhere. No inhibitions in the work.

[@beatrizjardim8308]

I haven't begin to watch this show yet, but I love your videos.

[@jackbharucha1475]

Twitter fans and misunderstanding an ASOIAF product name a more iconic duo.

[@lauren8135]

This is definitely an interesting perspective. To me it seems like this is one of those cases where two things are true at the same time. I think Otto is definitely mainly interested in power and advancing his house one of the the themes Martin talked about it second sons and how they have to strive and toil for recognition and legacy. Ottos brother rules Oldtown but there is societal pressure on Otto to make a name for himself and prove his worth as a second son with no grand inheritance. I think to a degree there is a commentary here on how the pursuit of legacy for the sake of legacy can be harmful to those who get swept up in it. Him wanting his grandchild to be on throne is very self interested, while it could be he best option for the realm vs Rhaenyra because lords may not take a woman on the throne seriously, I think it’s still pretty self interested to serve up his teen slaughter on a platter. While it will give her station and wealth I dunno watching her bite her nails and look depressed and then having to watch the S£X scene with her and Viserys makes me feel terrible for her. I think that’s also one of the reasons why she grows to hate Rhaenyra so much Rhaenyra is able to break the rules and seemingly avoid consequences while Alicent follows all the rules does her duty and is constrained, lonely, and scared. So while a male heir grandson seems like the best option on paper the fact that it just happens to also be in Otto’s immediate best interests is interesting to be sure.

[@AlbinoMutant]

I have been wondering why so many people are Team Black when I can't stand any of them; neither Rhaenyra, nor Damon, nor Corlys, nor Rhaenys are sympathetic to me at all. I think this video explains it well. I see Team Green as being true to their Westerosi traditions. These traditions aren't always fair or even moral, but the traditions are what maintains civilization, and the unintentional lesson of this show is that repudiating tradition -- even one we see as unfair from our comfy safe spaces -- just might lead to bloody anarchy. Let us reflect on our biases for a moment. The bargain GRRM and the showrunners have offered is this: we get a man as a king, and you have to live with a few grumpy Targaryans, or you get a woman as queen, and we all live with thousands dead in (the Westerosi equivalent of) nuclear war (with dragons). That's really what's going on here. We've become so sensitive to inequality in our world that we can't really think clearly about the fictional world GRRM has created and analyze it on its own terms. To our minds, equality must come at any price. For us, the price is a few grumpy old white men. But for the smallfolk of Westeros, its fire and blood. Their blood.

[@shantanusengupta1749]

This is great content

[@jackbharucha1475]

The one thing Otto does that is weird is put Allicent in a sexy dress and give her a chance to bond with her husband. If he was following the standards of the day he would have gone to play Lego's with Viserys.

[@kaidenmunsey7380]

Great Essay! You are someone willing to dig into the moral complexity of the characters when a lot of people simply jump into the easily dichotomous nature of the conflict. The books have a a narrative bias and television as a medium has a tendency to bias towards certain characters as a simple matter of framing and screen time. I appreciate a take that rationally delves into the actions and motivations of the characters and appreciate the focus on a sociological explanation for characters personal psychological issues!

[@topdeckhelix8450]

Thank you for analyzing this in the lenses of the books he was represented in. I think that’s very important because even though George is writing on the show we know he is keeping his book in mind while writing it as well making all of this speculation very relevant and poignant.

[@SpiffierShindigs]

Alicent: I acted reprehensibly. Otto: no u did gud. i'm finally proud of u. Alicent: - aghast -

[@rezenpm]

"The society that they live in is so unjust that it nurtures them into villainy". Otto's villainy does not derive from his being an 'unadulterated reflection of the world he lives in' as you say, but rather from the fact that he is terminally cynical and utterly devoid of hope and faith in humanity. His conviction that Rhaenyra would undoubtedly have Aegon killed from the moment of his own birth, that Daemon was incapable of honor, that Vicerys was too soft to thrive as king, that cold blooded murder is regretfully the best option when considering the interests of the realm. He never gives anyone a second chance, or the benefit of the doubt, or a chance to prove themselves. He's always betting on the worst case scenario almost to the point of willing it into existence by his own fear and anxiety. He is the most interesting character in the series because even though he honorably does his duty as a father and as Hand without corruption, his utter lack of hope, lack of faith in humanity, and brutally cynical judgement of other people singlehandedly prevent any redemption or reconciliation from happening around him. And that is terrifying.

[@alanpennie8013]

Happy to find a video about a character who tends to be overlooked because the focus is naturally on the three (five) leads and even Aemond and Helaena. I do wish that the show hadn't repeatedly made him look like a fool for the sake of drama.

[@dawn1424]

as lord Tywin Lannister puts it” A good man does everything in his power to better his family’s position”

[@timy.9512]

Whoever wrote the beast epic of Reynard the Fox was clearly thinking of someone like Otto - the quintessential survivor, willing to do anything for his mate & cubs. Viserys reminds me of King Noble the Lion, and Daemon of Isengrim the Wolf.

[@omolisa3783]

As someone who hasn't read F&B and didn't like Otto so far, I really liked hearing your take & thoughts on him! Although I gotta say that I have little empathy regarding his "honest worry" for Alicient, because he is the one that put her in that dangerous position to begin with.

[@lucasistrom]

Otto is one of my favorite characters so far and he was my favorite reading the book.

[@bascal133]

I was really concerned about the video but after watching to the end I appreciate that you explain their actions without excusing them

[@Tormund_Giantsbrain]

Do you like not have BASED takes? Why is all your takes so BASED?! I figured you would say something like this from the "Alicent is the only one worth supporting" video essay (100% agreed)…but it’s great to see. People really blaming Otto for the marriage forgetting that marriage was the most conventional one for the times (stop transplanting 21st century sensibilities on medieval characters!). So you can't marry your daughter to the King because the King's daughter might one day get jealous and kill your grandchildren? Da fuq? How about the King's daughter don't murder any children lol.

[@MomoAfterDark]

Excellent video. Otto reminds me of Tywin Lannister just very efficient politicians and Hands.

[@jonsigwanz7993]

Otto and Daemon are the two villains of the series; they combined with Viserys's inaction start a war. However while Otto is a villain because he is a perfect reflection of his time Daemon is a villain because he is a violent and unpredictable psychopath. In the end since these two men are the respective heads of the two factions I would rather support Otto over Daemon.

[@jomeotrashgod1098]

I definitely agree with what you said he's really just doing what's expected of him but I will also say his talk to ancient after aemond lost his eye made me think he was like "Holy shit we can actually pull this off" and I think he definitely wonders what it would be like to sit on the iron throne

[@daddy_1453]

Having to choose between Black and Green is annoying af because both are my favourite colours. I'm currently only Team Green for 3 reasons: 1) Law of First son being King 2) Rhaeneyra is a shortsighted spoilt brat. Daemon killed his own wife. Both are wacky/ illogical af. 3) That banger Hightower theme.

[@TimeandMonotony]

Finally some justice for my man Otto and the Greens in general! Really like your videos, I've subscribed, thanks for your more nuanced takes on the Dance rather than the "Blacks good, Greens bad" of the general audience/fandom.

[@lonemotheomatshaba9640]

"Whether they're decisions are good or bad the audience can clearly see where they are coming from" Me: why Rhaenyra choosing to have all her children be Harwins Strongs

[@karthiknarayanan3705]

I mean Rhaenyra has been shown as an entitled, arrogant, spoiled, bratty and dumb Princess who thinks she can do whatever the fuck she wasn't and get away with it without any consequence. So her having bastards with Harwin kind of makes sense to her character.

[@LoneWolf-xe6ye]

They literally mention that Rhaenyra could actually have sex with laenor meaning there's no reason why she couldn't have at least one chocolate baby.

[@kauswekazilimani3736]

@@LoneWolf-xe6ye She could have also picked some dude from driftmark to father her kids if Leanor is infertile or that uncomfortable.

[@user-sl1wt1dv4y]

"It is my belief that a moment of chaos affords opportunities lost soon after" "you say that as if you were the first man alive to think it" -Ty "WIN" Lannister

[@hiphopemployeee]

Damm Girl your Videos are fire.

[@jbug1979]

you, milady, have a new subscriber 🤓