Trinity Debate: Does the OT Teach that the Angel of the Lord is Yahweh? (Rogers vs Thriepland)

[@valentintomberg4276]

Anthony Rogers ist a real blessing to Christian apologetics, just amazing!

[@birhanukiflu2765]

How can i contact him so that he may teach me to be an apologetic like him. Bk from sudan. My heart burn when i hear his debate.

[@kilemyers784]

@@birhanukiflu2765 Watch his videos, read his articles on answering Islam, also look up both Sam Shamoun and Christian Prince. Both brothers are incredible appologist for the triune God. Christian Prince is an appologist against Islam, Sam Shamoun is like a walking talking bible. God bless

[@vivekp5196]

@@birhanukiflu2765 yes go through all his lectures and material. Takes time to understand the arguments. Anthony also went to seminary so he taken formal courses. Finally Anthony is blessed (same with Sam) with excellent memory. He can recall whatever he reads very very easily.

[@aznation4592]

I Love ❤️ how Anthony preaches / teaches very clearly and understanding

[@courag1]

I am so glad that David encouraged Anthony, he is in his own element now, and see him soar with eagles. Whoever can lay an argument against Anthony has a mind which is willfully blind and whose God is the one they see in the mirror.

[@chelynirico]

When I first read through the OT and encountered "the angel of the Lord", I made notes on the margin of those passages to this effect: "Who is this "angel" and why is he being addressed and treated as God"? This was before I had any instruction or read any resource on the topic.

[@mwitten314]

I had the same questions when reading the Bible for the first time, without any kind of previous instructions.

[@coryc1904]

I love you guys. Have a fun day!

[@bridgetazaz]

Wow thats cool!

[@andriod090]

My favorite question to ask is why do OT figures attest to have seen the face of Yahweh, yet Yahweh himself says no one has seen his face?

[@armaanisaac8252]

Anthony Rogers is a natural treasure, must be protected at all cost

[@pwx13]

any day that Anthony Rogers debates its a good day. Trees hate him because he takes up a ton of notebook paper

[@Pyroverbs205]

Check Google first before clicking and registering on some random unknown site.

[@pwx13]

@@Pyroverbs205 what is the point of these comments, the conversation was about Anthony Rogers

[@Pyroverbs205]

@@pwx13 Are you talking about my comment or their comments? If you're talking about theirs, I think they're bots or something. Just warning people to be cautious. Also, in light of your comment, yea, I also like to watch Anthony's debates. So much to learn.

[@pwx13]

@@Pyroverbs205 I was talking about theirs, they sounded like robots

[@Pyroverbs205]

@@pwx13 I think they are. I've heard they're commenting pretty much the same comments (although maybe different accounts) on different videos apparently. Also, been seeing a bunch of scam comments lately of different variety too. Some about donating to a charity, some about hacking services, and some about bitcoins, now maybe this. Have to be careful.

[@stargategoku]

Nice, I watched this from acts17apologetics before but I don't get bored watching Anthony's debate with unitarian or shabir ally or ijaz.. it's always good to hear from Anthony Rogers when it comes to debate or exegesis OF TRINITY or DEITY OF CHRIST I hope and pray that Anthony Rogers will have million subscribers and thousands of patreon support.

[@manne8575]

Amen, he really is a huge blessing!

[@manne8575]

@@farhanf3732 OK, explain then... I'm sure you would win a debate against him

[@tippiebear1069]

The angel of the Lord is also known as the Memra (logos in Greek and The Word in English) according to the Jewish encyclopedia, the Memra is a manifestation of God.

[@TheLiving_Cross]

Amen.

[@kiranthomas5944]

I really like that Logos could also mean ground ,reason that it would have been better translated as the living word

[@MarinS1319]

@integrity faithEology wtf?

[@Caleb_287]

@@kiranthomas5944 no

[@darkwingduck569]

Where, cant find it.

[@brandonj3606]

I think instead of he trying to debate Anthony Rogers he should've ask Anthony to teach him!

[@sleepwalker7755]

Incredible. The evidence Anthony has put forward, (so eloquently), must have his opponent in the corner, on the ropes. There is no way out, as Anthony has proven the pattern. The pattern of Christ is supreme in scripture. The pattern is key as there’s not a one off scripture but insurmountable evidence that Anthony is right. Thank you both gentlemen for such a cordial debate. The glory goes to Christ.

[@scruiz1226]

I wish I had the opportunity to ask LJ a live question... I truly wonder if LJ, has ever read the Bible cover to cover, from beginning to end. It’s so easy to get lost in a doctrine when we pick and choose how we read the Bible but it’s amazingly clear when you read it from beginning to end. In fact it’s the most beautiful love story of all time ... it’s Gods love and sacrifice that blows our pride and brokenness away.

[@michellejohnsen912]

Yes, so important to read the Bible for ourselves. The Holy Spirit guides us and gives understanding. The entire Bible must be read to have any understanding. There's so much deception in this time period! FATHER, SON AND HOLY SPIRIT, the GODHEAD is truth from the Bible, beginning to end. May God give us all eyes to see and ears to hear! In Jesus name amen 🕊

[@dennismaher9533]

AMEN

[@tippiebear1069]

Fun fact: the letters YHWH in paleo Hebrew means behold the hand, behold the nail. Thomas after seeing Jesus’ hands said “My Lord, and my God”

[@tariqskanaal8187]

@tim joe Eli, eli, lama sabachtani

[@tippiebear1069]

@tim joe Read Psalm 22, Jesus was fulfilling prophecy, and unfortunately for you I used my Taqiyya repellent when I got up this morning.

[@tippiebear1069]

@@elijah_godslayer9904 He was never a Christian. Look how white he made his name 😂 “Tim Joe”

[@tippiebear1069]

@upholding the bible It’s yud hey waw hey or the waw could be pronounced as a vav

[@rayrose6499]

It means YAHWEH IN Paleo and modern Hebrew!

[@bermudagamer-2455]

“The Great Angel Israel’s second God” is a good book on the topic. Author: Margaret Barker. The evidence is clear the Angel of the Lord was identified as Yahweh.

[@bermudagamer-2455]

@Thoska Brah anytime👍 I am going to have a read of your book

[@LivingWateraide]

Yes! I always look forward to Anthony Rodgers debates! Did this guy really just compare Anthony's in-depth agrument to that of a BHI argument???

[@allenarett]

Mr Rogers neighborhood! I can't see how anyone challenges him. He is a theological beast!

[@netballa]

It's only because they are blind.

[@ChiSoter_2024]

One of the best christian apologists

[@TheBeginningOfWisdom]

This was a great debate. I need to listen again. LJ didn’t sound too confident in his performance afterward, but I felt this was the best performance by a unitarian against you out of all of them, including Dale Tuggy. LJ tried to stick to the text and wasn’t ruffled as much as others. Still wrong, but held his own better than the others in my opinion.

[@followintruthlj2865]

Thank you :).....Yes I wasnt too confident..it was literally my second live debate against a very skilled debater....I am not confident in the live arena and I realise my limitations. I did not represent myself or my belief well. Live debate is not my forte :).

[@albusai]

@@followintruthlj2865 what are your thoughts on some Jewish beliefs in the metraton? Have you read two powers in heaven by Alan segal??

[@followintruthlj2865]

@@albusai Yes I have read the two powers and unsean realm by Michael heiser. It wont be a surprise that I disagree with a lot of the claims made :) Metatron Is not biblical.

[@jj691]

@@followintruthlj2865 what is your education related to scripture? If you don’t mind me asking?

[@followintruthlj2865]

@@jj691 Do you mean have a been to "bible school"? No, but I have studied far beyond what I could receive in any school.

[@sketchbook1]

Unitarianism spends so much energy and time, trying hard to prove that Jesus is merely human, and not the pre-existent Word. BUT THIS MEANS ACCORDING TO JESUS that they do not believe that Jesus is the “I Am”- thus they will die in their sins. They fail to find the Son, and thus also do not find the Father.

[@michellejohnsen912]

Amen

[@chuksrichard3598]

If he would read proverbs ch 30:2-4

[@capc2761]

Anthony God bless you for your work. I just want to say that you remind me a lot of my dad even though his Ethiopian, you guys have the same face and are both cool through this type of situation. He is a deacon and could’ve been a priest but had some issued so he chose to stay deacon. Every time I see you, I’m reminded of him, especially when you smile or have a smug.

[@Cavirex]

Tehawedo Church?

[@jbjoeychic]

True Christians everywhere need to be inspired to learn the truth of the Holy Trinity as Orthodox Christianity has taught it. As Anthony Rodgers dispenses with this truth. Oneness Pentecosts, Unitarians, Other deniers of the Triune Godhead need to repent and come aboard the truth. Gid Bless Anthony !

[@trumenfreight6055]

You have many members of the godhead as you worship and pray to idols. In other words you dont believe in the trinity.

[@jcisinvictus6364]

Hiya Anthony, nothing to do with this video, just wanted to send a MASSIVE thank you about the book recommendation. Mathew Henry commentary. I wanted to point out the Lord at work to be honest. I'm pretty new to the study of the Word, but have had my interest sparked by a few things. I'm very VERY selective of who and what I listen to.....there's a compliment in there somewhere mate..😉. So after I've done a few laps of the Bible I've decided I want to venture into a commentary, hence my request for some advice. Also, along the way I've had huge interest in the 'puritans' I've heard about, purely because if the name but didn't know where to start. Then you, from America, have directed me to a puritan without me even mentioning it....and to top it off, this gentleman is only a fellow Welshman...🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿...what's the odds!! I'm over the moon, love you, love God, love everything today....God bless you and yours.....thank you so much...🙏😁

[@stuartofblyth]

"Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one (echad)". "Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one (echad) flesh".

[@sandrajohnson9090]

Yes, it was this example and Genesis 1:26 that sealed the deal for me. Also, the new testament example from Galatians 3, referring to all the believers being one in Christ. Thank you for the reminder.

[@Jason-qv4ib]

What are you saying? Are you saying that God is one in the same way a man and woman are one flesh? I hope not. That would be a blasphemous idea. You do know what it means to be one flesh right? This is probably the dumbest trinitarian example to use in defense of three being one. This the worst example to use and I'd challenge any trinitarian that uses the example to explain to us all how you all are comparing God as being three in one to how a man and woman are made one flesh through the act of sexual intercourse. 🤦🏽‍♂️

[@stuartofblyth]

@@Jason-qv4ib The point is the use of the word "echad" - "one" - in both instances. The MANNER of being echad is neither here nor there.

[@chuksrichard3598]

Now, the Bible being the perfect Word of God stands true. Yachid- oneness that does not tolerate plurality (singleness alone) Echad- oneness that allows plurality and the Bible used echad for a reason. As we see in Genesis 1:26 and 3:22. The Jacob prayer asking the Angel that delivered him from all evil bless the lads after mentioning the God of Abraham and Isaac and that word bless is singular meaning the Angeles is also the God of Abraham and Isaac. Genesis 31:11-13 Angel of the Lord said He’s the God of bethel and Genesis ch 35:1-7, verse 7 God was revealed to Jacob and the word revealed in Hebrew is plural. Just like in the creation, the book of Job ch 33 vs 4: The spirit of God hath made me, and the breath of the Almighty hath given me life. More than one again. Isaiah 63:8-14, God became Israel savior but the Angel of His presence(Face) saved Israel but they grieved His Holy Spirit. Three again saved Israel. Hence, that word echad was used intentionally.

[@chuksrichard3598]

@@Jason-qv4ibyou sure didn’t understand the context of the original comment

[@lampkin9287]

It amazes me how the plain and simple texts hides from a person’s eyes even when you point it out!

[@Mellownius]

Seems like LJ quoted the Targums whereas Rogers referred to them while quoting the scripture ... hopefuly this fellow will see that

[@firstnamelastname2552]

Not the most thrilling debate but definitely another win for Anthony. LJ seems like a really nice guy but he was not ready for this.

[@followintruthlj2865]

Nope I wasnt...and I doubt I ever will be. Live debating is not my forte and I realise my limitations. I am not confident enough to do these types of debates...I shall stick to being a keyboard warrior.

[@kilemyers784]

@@followintruthlj2865 Lord willing you become a keyboard warrior for the truth of the triune God of the bible.!

[@MrChemenger]

@@followintruthlj2865 my brother you are confused and fail to articulate your position clearly. you do not deal with all the evidence Anthony presented. You failed to convince me that the messenger of God is not YHW. my advice to you is go through scripture and let it interpret. You are are wrong on this one. the evidence is just overwhelming as presented by Anthony

[@jj691]

@@MrChemenger yes, it usually boils down to bad exegesis. I always find most unitarians single out certain verses to interpret the entirety of the bible.

[@jamesb6818]

It was so hard following LJ when he was speaking. I just wanted to fast forward. Great job Anthony..

[@followintruthlj2865]

Yep.....Im just not a live debater.....just have to realise my limitations...this was literally my second live debate.....

[@kilemyers784]

@@followintruthlj2865 Even though you are 100% incorrect in your theology I respect you for debating Anthony none the less. May the triune God, Father Son and Holy Spirit bring you into the truth of who He is in Jesus mighty name.

[@followintruthlj2865]

@@kilemyers784 :) thank you for the comment...I just wish I had done a better job in representing what I believe...maybe I will do it again one day :)

[@kilemyers784]

@@followintruthlj2865 Just a question what evidence would convince you that the trinity is biblical?

[@jamesb6818]

@@followintruthlj2865 Thanks for the comment and your humility. Respect for standing in there.

[@AR15andGOD]

1:31:25 Sometimes your guests ask certain questions and I'm just sitting here like yes, that's exactly the point. We differentiate because they are different persons. That's the point. You're so close to getting it LJ

[@brandonj3606]

Anthony Rogers is a boss!

[@brothabrian6004]

This is good debate ,I may be bias but it seemed one side with Anthony rogers running away with it

[@alessandrostabile6701]

ANTHONY KEEP GOING!!!! YOUR VIDEOS AREEEEE SOOOOOOOOOOOOO HELPFUL! YOU DONT BELIEVE IT!

[@darthmullet6138]

The entire debate ended when Anthony said "he can give no evidence that the Father isn't some other representative of God"

[@StateofMind75]

As John Lennox said, " If I see 2 + 2 = 4 over and over again, I start to believe 2 + 2 = 4 " Let's keep learning brothers and sisters for God deserves all our attention.

[@albusai]

Anthony Rogers schooling again

[@floridaballerboy]

I don’t see how any oneness believer would want to debate Brother Rogers. I’ll be running from him. Glory to God for using Anthony.

[@MichaelJahckson]

AR Wins again Blessed

[@ramezaziz2336]

Better ten months late than never!!

[@mannytorrez2138]

The cross examination is the best why can't it be more longer why just 10 min :)

[@PopoolaTemidayo]

I doubt that the guy was the one that did the debate. Someone behind the scene is writing a response as Anthony was speaking and when it is his turn, he reads yet make mistakes and has to back in lines to read over. If he's the one who wrote those responses, it should be highlighted points which he can explain as he picks them each. He is busy reading lecture notes as debate .

[@henrythecat3094]

How unitarians believe Jesus is the messiah but he's not God? I don't get it 😕

[@followintruthlj2865]

Simple, there is no biblical reason to believe that :)

[@Bowen12676]

Because "the messiah" just means the one anointed by God. Not God.

[@chuksrichard3598]

@@followintruthlj2865read Micah 5:2 - the ruler of Israel will be from Bethlehem and this ruler have been existing from the beginning. Tell me it’s not Jesus

[@rdavenport8420]

Pastor Rogers is one of the greatest

[@christismylordandgod]

He lost the moment he said Jesus wasn't God, may christ make him repent from such heresy

[@dennismaher9533]

L.J. is in a tough spot because he is trying to defend a ludicrous NON-BIBLICAL position ...........

[@AR15andGOD]

I'd feel so wrong worshipping Jesus as I worship the Father if I were a unitarian, I don't know how to square that. Unless you don't worship Jesus, in which case He would be just as worthless and no-good as I am so why should I give Him any praise. Unless He was specifically created and empowered to be sinless, but that still wouldn't work because He'd be a finite sacrifice for our infinite transgressions and we'd go to hell anyway. I'm so glad I learned a lot about philosophy and science before I got saved otherwise I'd probably fall for some of this stuff too

[@DaddyBooneDon]

The part where LJ is asked what would Jesus say or do if he was the 2nd person in the Godhead, and LJ says that he wouldn't come as God's messenger... I still think that's what he would do, because the scriptures speak of Jesus as the eternal Son, so why wouldn't he subject himself to be a meesenger, a servant, just as in other places, Phil 2 etc. I think this speaks to the eternal love that is in the community of the Trinity. It's a love that serves one another, and we are commanded to be like him by doing the same.

JESUS IS THE Mighty GOD: Isa 9:6 For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government shall be upon his shoulder, and his name shall be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty GOD, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. GOD IS THE ONLY SAVIOR: Isa 43:11 I, I am the LORD, and besides me there is no savior. 1Ti 2:3 This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior GOD IS THE FIRST AND THE LAST: Isa 44:6 Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: “I am the first and I am the last; besides me there is no god. Rev 1:17-18 Rev When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. But he laid his right hand on me, saying, “Fear not, I am the first and the last, Rev 1:18 and the living one. I died, and behold I am alive forevermore TO GOD EVERY KNEE SHALL BOW: Isa 45:23 By myself I have sworn; from my mouth has gone out in righteousness a word that shall not return: ‘To me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear allegiance.’Php 2:10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth Php 2:11 and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord JESUS IS GOD WITH US: Mat 1:23 “Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a son, and they shall call his name Immanuel” (which means, God with us). Isa 7:14 AND ALL THESE VERSES PROVE JESUS IS GOD: Mat 9:6 But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins” Mat 28:18 And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Luk 3:22 and the Holy Spirit descended on him in bodily form, like a dove; and a voice came from heaven, “You are my beloved Son; with you I am well pleased.” Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. Joh 5:22 For the Father judges no one, but has given all judgment to the Son, Joh 5:23 that all may honor the Son, just as they honor the Father. Whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent him. Joh 5:27 And he has given him authority to execute judgment, because he is the Son of Man Joh 8:58 Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am.” Joh 10:33 The Jews answered him, “It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you but for blasphemy, because you, being a man, make yourself God.” Joh 12:45 And whoever sees me sees him who sent me. Joh 14:9 Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long, and you still do not know me, Philip? Whoever has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? Joh 14:10 Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? Joh 14:11 Believe me that I am in the Father and the Father is in me Joh 14:14 If you ask me anything in my name, I will do it. Joh 14:26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you. Joh 20:28 Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!” Rom 9:5 To them belong the patriarchs, and from their race, according to the flesh, is the Christ, who is God over all, blessed forever. Amen. Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. Col 2:9 For in him the whole fullness of deity dwells bodily, 1Co 15:24 Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom to God the Father after destroying every rule and every authority and power. Php 2:6 Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage Php 2:6 who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, Tit 2:13 while we wait for the blessed hope-the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ Heb 1:6 And again, when he brings the firstborn into the world, he says, “Let all God's angels worship him.” Heb 1:8 But of the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever, the scepter of uprightness is the scepter of your kingdom. 2Pe 1:1 Simeon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who have obtained a faith of equal standing with ours by the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ: 1Jn 5:20 And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true; and we are in him who is true, in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life. Jud 1:25 to the only God, our Savior, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion, and authority, before all time and now and forever. Amen.

The Trinity is Biblical ❤️

[@followintruthlj2865]

I hope you dont use Isaiah 9:6 inconsistently....if you want to use this verse to prove Jesus is Mighty God....I hope you also use it to prove he is the Father not the son.

@@followintruthlj2865 In Isaiah 9:6 "his name" IT'S ALL ONE NAME / TITLE! "His name shall be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace." Just like when Jesus said to Mat 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the NAME of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. IN the Trinity that one name applies to The Father The Son and the Holy Spirit. DID YOU NOTICE THAT IT DIDN'T SAY NAMES??

[@followintruthlj2865]

@ If its all one title then using this to prove he is mighty God you must also remain consistent and say this proves he is the father.

@@followintruthlj2865 if you were consistent and If we were just talking about Mt 28:19 you would claim that Jesus is The Father based on that name right ? Yes or no? But I haven't heard a oneness use Mt 28:19 to claim that Jesus is the Father.

[@aquavitae3824]

Echad = COMPOUND singular

[@eliyahuisnotme7717]

The arm of Yahuah is the Malach of Yahuah. WHO has believed our report? and to whom is the arm of Yahuah revealed? YESHA'YAHU (ISAIAH) 53:1 את CEPHER

[@anaarkadievna]

2:20 "I just want people to know that this is a highly contentious verse" OK! Let's deny what the Bible says.... That's the way to go, right?

[@WolfBenjamite]

Ps is the term Elohym in Hebrew a "Generic" title used for Men or rulers of Israel and Heavenly beins etc?

[@susiervo1]

Unitarian = JW reasoning🧐

[@susiervo1]

Triepland did not point to any occasion in which moses was seen by someone who then said i saw GoD. On the contrary, when the Angel of the Lord was seen, the person seeing the Angel said I saw GoD.

[@prayingpatriot8018]

Like Carlos before him, I hope LJ retires from debating Trinitarian hard-hitters like Anthony Rogers. And maybe be convicted of the truth that God is indeed Triune.

[@followintruthlj2865]

I will never retire from debating, just probably wont be engaging in live ones anymore :) Not my forte. Likewise, I will never be convinced of a triune god. :)

[@prayingpatriot8018]

@@followintruthlj2865So be it. Are you beginning to realize that Unitarians still use the same old arguments against the Triune God? It takes two key points to destroy Unitarianism: Knowing church history and understanding of the Greek/Hebrew. We see this in debates with: Anthony Rogers vs. Dale Tuggy Anthony Rogers vs. Carlos Xavier Trinitarians vs. Uniterians (White/Brown vs. two Unitarian strongholds) As a former Mormon, these debates along with reading the Bible for myself, helped me knowing that the God of Abraham, Isaac & Jacob is Triune.

[@followintruthlj2865]

@@prayingpatriot8018 Actually church "history" has very little to do with the argument. Otherwise you would be a catholic (maybe you are) If you are then you would certainly disagree with Anthony on MANY other "church history" taught doctrines where Anthony would then argue against what church history teaches ..if you are not a Catholic then YOU would do this as well, so those appealing to church history normally are not very consistent with this line of argumentation. Understanding the Greek and Hebrew, however, I would agree is an important part of the argument. While Anthony buzzard is seen by some (certainly not all unitarians) as being a "leader" of unitarianism or at least a foremost speaker of it, Joseph Good, the other debater in the debate you mention with White and Brown, most definitely is not. He certainly isnt considered a Unitarian stronghold. While I agree with much of Buzzards argumentation, I would not in any way put him on such a pedestal. Personally I think the key point on what is and isnt biblical ultimately comes down o what the Bible itself says. It wont be a surprise to you that I do not think the Bible proclaims a triune God. :)

[@prayingpatriot8018]

@@followintruthlj2865The church has been professing the Triunity of God for 20 centuries now. Long before any "creed" was ever proclaimed or the weak naive "Catholic" argument Unitarians like to conjure up. So yes, church history is very much a part of our Trinitarian background relative to scripture. The lack thereof, only proves Unitarian deniability. Would you call John a "Catholic" when he quotes in John 1:18 that Jesus has eternally existed with the Father; who Himself was also God? To deny the eternal Sonship of Christ is to deny the Father also (1 John 2:23). As you stated; yes we do can turn to what the Bible says about the Ontological makeup of the Biblical Godhead. Which is why we don't need the "Creeds" nor the word "Trinity" to demonstrate this. Just like the passages I referenced in this comment. And there's a whole lot more. Unitarians must stick to their trite passages and arguments as seen in many debates. Mormons make the exact same case against the Triune God. As with any other cult group.

[@followintruthlj2865]

@@prayingpatriot8018 :) yes thats the claim that the church as been professing it for 20 centuries....the reality however, is far from this. Im sure you know that "the trinity" was first proclaimed by Theophilus, although his "trinity " was not the same as what you would profess as the trinity. The trinity of today has not in any way shape or form been proclaimed for 20 centuries. While I make no assertion that Jesus being "God" is not an early belief, it is not what the apostles taught nor is it part of the Apostles Creed and certainly there is no trinity there. The trinity as you understand it, has been formulated by the Church through the authority of the church.

[@JohnSmith-wz7tq]

You should refute Blogging Theology on "Jesus said 'Allah', not Deus' 300k views many Christians falling for it.

[@Mellownius]

Word of the Lord is the figure who wrote most of the Bible or at least kept it alive until it could be transcribed 🤦‍♂️He def walked the sands of time 🤩🤩

[@chuksrichard3598]

For the Unitarian when he spoke of God sending the Angel before the children of Israel and saying the Angel isn’t forgiving sin and is speaking as an agent of God, then i’ll tell him that the Angel of the he Lord said He’s the God of bethel in Genesis 31:11-13 and in Genesis 31:1-7 God said to Jacob to build an altar unto God that appeared unto him. Now this is showing two persons called God (one essence) and literally in verse 7, God was revealed unto Jacob and that word revealed in Hebrew language is plural. Then if you read Zachariah ch 3:1-4 Joshua was standing before the Angel of the Lord and satan came to accuse him. Reading further, the Angel of the Lord commanded other angels around Joshua to remove the filthy garment and He said I remove your iniquities. Now that’s the Angel of the Lord forgiving sins. We all know that if you see God, you die right but reading Judges ch 13, the Angel of the Lord appeared to Manoah and his wife and when they made offerings to God, the Angel of the Lord went up with the flames and Manoah said to his wife that they’d die because they’ve seen God. The Moses encounter with the burning flames (Exodus 3) where the Angel of the Lord appeared to him later God said to remove his shoes for he’s standing on a holy ground same thing happened in Joshua 5:14-15 the Man that appeared to Joshua as the captain of God’s Army told Joshua to remove his shoes for he’s standing on a holy ground. Just as the Angel of the Lord in Zachariah 3:4 commanding other angels to take away Joshua’s filthy garments same happened in Daniel ch 8:15-16- And it came to pass, when I, even I Daniel, had seen the vision, and sought for the meaning, then, behold, there stood before me as the appearance of a man. 16 And I heard a man's voice between the banks of Ulai, which called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision. So who’s that Man that called Gabriel? Daniel ch 7:13-14 Ezekiel ch 1:26-28 Isaiah ch 63:8-14, we see God being Israel’s savior, verse 9, the Angel of His presence(Face) saved Israel then verse 10, they grieved His Holy Spirit. Isn’t that the Trinity?

[@rajuhop]

This was wondering learning and wish there is nother debate with LJ and brother sam Shamounian.

[@chuksrichard3598]

In the question and answer section, the Unitarian claim about the angels being the ones that destroyed sodom and Gomorrah is absolutely false. As we see in Genesis ch 18: God appeared to Abraham and he saw 3 Men and he bowed down. Verse 13 and 14 made it clear that the Lord God among those 3 Men was speaking. Verse 21- then said that God will go down to sodom and gomorrah but verse 22- said They Men went to sodom but Abraham still stood before the Lord. Meaning it must be 2 out of the 3 men that went to Sodom which Genesis ch 19 vs 1- showing two angels arrived at sodom. So the 3rd Man is the Lord God. It’s clear that Abraham was talking to someone he was seeing which was the 3rd Man. Verse 25- after Abraham was negotiating with God, he said shall not the Judge of all the earth do right? We all know that God is the only Judge of all the earth. Verse 26 said and the Lord said, if I find… meaning God Himself will go to sodom and if He (God) find fifty righteous in sodom then I (God) will forgive. Only God can forgive sins right? Verse 33: God went away after communing with Abraham. Now let’s see Genesis ch 19 vs 24: Then the LORD rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven. So here we see that 3rd Man(the Lord) on earth which Abraham saw and spoke to raining down fire and brimstone from the Lord out of heaven. If you read down to verse 27, Abraham went to the location where he stood before the Lord.

[@michaelcarlson7954]

That wasn't even fair Anthony.

[@DennisMaher-v4i]

.MR ROGERS DESTROYED HIM

[@TheAngryAmericanRenegade1776]

Good morning, Anthony, I'm stumped on one sentence in Revelation 2:16. I know that we have difference Manuscripts of The Bible to lead us to what the Holy Spirit said to the Apostles, most variants being spellings - from what I've learned from "Discover The Book Ministries" (DTMB). The reason why I'm asking is because I'm doing a Bible Study for myself and my blog in the New Testament from Revelation to Matthew, and I don't want to distort the Word of God - my love for Christ being extreme. I'm using Logos 9 Basic to help me learn the Scriptures because that's what it was created for, and I'm using The New King James Version as The Main Text, being a Word for Word Translation that uses Dynamic Equivalence. I will have the part of Revelation 2:16 below; the Translations spaced out and distinguished: Old Translation First and New Last: The 1599 Geneva Bible: "or else I will come unto thee shortly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth." The New King James Version: "else I will come to you quickly and will fight against them with the sword of My mouth." I'm stumped on the comma used in the older translation. Is that due to the Manuscripts they were using at the time or was it to help the reader distinguish one part of the sentence from the other?

[@TheAngryAmericanRenegade1776]

@@toomanymarys7355 Okay, thank you!

[@followintruthlj2865]

As Too Many Marys stated, there were no commas in the biblical manuscripts. This is a translator inclusion. There are times when punctuation CAN make a difference in the meaning of a text such as Luke 23:43 Luke 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise. KJV Luke 23:43 And he said to him: “Truly I tell you today, you will be with me in Paradise NWT BIG difference here. I would be more concerned about the word shortly/Quickly while they have similar meanings and can at times be interchangeable they can also give different meanings and the correct meaning may not be understandable by using the incorrect word. Shortly is incorrect here and doesnt give the correct meaning of the verse it should be quickly.

[@TheAngryAmericanRenegade1776]

@@followintruthlj2865 Could eminently be a better word to render the greek? It seems that "Tachys" would be better understood if rendered eminently because Christ wants us to be ready for Him.

[@followintruthlj2865]

mmmm I wouldnt personally go with that. The meaning of the verse is to convey the speed of the return not the length of time between when he ascended and when he will return. Shortly would seem to point to a quick return in time (2000+ years certainly isnt a short period of time. I dont think eminently would suit here. Quickly indicates more the speed with which he would return so I would say you could also render this with speed or haste. It could Therefore be rendered (if you wish to paraphrase the meaning rather than go for a more word for word (which the word quickly would suffice) Repent; or else I will come unto thee with speed (at my return) , and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth.

[@song4night]

DJ was all over the place.

[@eliyahuisnotme7717]

When you see Yerushalayim with invader's gather against Her and invading. Than Yahusha will return. But He will have the Name of Yahuah. He was the Malach of Yahuah. Before He came down as Yahusha. But now there will be echad Yahuah. And Yahuah shall be King over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Yahuah, and his name echad. ZAKARYAHU (ZECHARIAH) 14:9 את CEPHER Blessed be he that comes in the name of Yahuah: we have blessed you out of the house of Yahuah. TEHILLIYM (PSALMS) 118:26 את CEPHER Behold, your house is left unto you desolate: and Amein I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say, Blessed is he that comes in the name of Yahuah. LUQAS (LUKE) 13:35 את CEPHER BEHOLD, the day of Yahuah comes, and your spoil shall be divided in the midst of you. For I will gather all nations against Yerushalayim to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the remnant of the people shall not be cut off from the city. Then shall Yahuah go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. ZAKARYAHU (ZECHARIAH) 14:1-3 את CEPHER Then shall Yahuah go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. And his feet shall stand in that day upon the Mount of Olives, which is before Yerushalayim on the east, and the Mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the Negev. ZAKARYAHU (ZECHARIAH) 14:3-4 את CEPHER Which also said, Ye men of Galiyl, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Yahusha, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. Then returned they unto Yerushalayim from the Mount called Olivet, which is from Yerushalayim a Shabbath day's journey. MA'ASIYM (ACTS) 1:11-12 את CEPHER In that day shall Yahuah defend the inhabitants of Yerushalayim; and he that is feeble among them at that day shall be as Daviyd; and the house of Daviyd shall be as Elohiym, as the angel of Yahuah before them. And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Yerushalayim. And I will pour upon the house of Daviyd, and upon the inhabitants of Yerushalayim, the Ruach Chen V’TACHANUNIYM: and they shall look upon me את whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourns for his yachiyd, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn. In that day shall there be a great mourning in Yerushalayim, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddo. ZAKARYAHU (ZECHARIAH) 12:8-11 את CEPHER

[@brandonj3606]

Why is he reading from a phone? man like you say you're still struggling/ studying go study again!

[@-Pierre]

*Here are bible verses showing that the Father and the Holy Spirit are united with Jesus Christ, which means that there is a Biblical Trinity: The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit united 3 as 1.* *John 14:9-11* *9* Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? *He who has seen Me has seen the Father;* so how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? *10* Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? The words that I speak to you I do not speak on My own authority; but *the Father who dwells in Me does the works. 11 Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father in Me,* or else believe Me for the sake of the works themselves. *John 10:30* *30 I* and *my Father* are *one.* *2 Corinthians 5:19* *19 namely, that God was in Christ* reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their transgressions against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation. *Matthew 3:16* *16* When *He* had been baptized, *Jesus* came up immediately from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened to Him, and He saw *the Spirit of God* descending like a dove and alighting *upon Him.* *Colossians 2:9* *9* For *in Him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.* *Colossians 1:19* *19* For *it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;* *1 John 5:7-8* *7* For there are *three* that bear record in heaven, *the Father, the Word,* and *the Holy Ghost:* and *these three are one.* *8* And there are *three* that bear witness in earth, *the Spirit,* and *the water,* and *the blood:* and *these three agree in one.* *Matthew 28:19* *19* Go ye *therefore,* and teach all nations, baptizing them *in the name of the Father,* and of *the Son,* and of *the Holy Ghost:"* *1 Peter 1:2* *2* elect *according to* the foreknowledge of *God the Father,* through sanctification of *the Spirit,* unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of *Jesus Christ:* Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied. *2 Corinthians 13:14* *14* The grace of *the Lord Jesus Christ,* and the love of *God,* and the communion of *the Holy Ghost,* be with you all. Amen. There are also other examples in Genesis where God describes Himself in *the plural:* *Genesis 1:26* *26* And *God* said, *let us* make man in *our image,* after *our likeness* *Genesis 3:22* *22* And *the Lord God said,* Behold, the man is become as *one of us* *Genesis 18:1-3* *Yahweh Appears to Abraham* *18* Then *Yahweh appeared to him* by the oaks of Mamre, while he was sitting at the tent door in the heat of the day. *2* And he lifted up his eyes and looked, and behold, *three men* were standing nearby; he saw, and he ran from the tent door to meet them, and he bowed himself to the earth, *3* and he said, “ *My Lord,* if now I have found favor in Your sight, please do not pass Your servant by.

[@WolfBenjamite]

Matthew 1:20 But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Ghost. So were saying Jesus in Spirit form appeared to his earthly father in a dream? While he was concieved in Marys womb? 🤔

[@greatworld8230]

It was an angel of the Lord that appeared to Joseph not the Angel of the Lord. There is a huge difference between the two.

[@Jason-qv4ib]

You people in the comments need to be ashamed of yourselves. Here is a warning don't let a man like Anthony Rogers lead you into destruction. He does this every debate I watch with him in it. He says a whole lot of nothing and waste a whole lot of time getting to no points whatsoever. Hosea 12:4-5 (KJV), it says:"Yea, he had power over the angel, and prevailed: he wept, and made supplication unto him: he found him in Bethel, and there he spake with us; Even the Lord God of hosts; the Lord is his memorial." It was an angel that Jacob wrestled with...it has to be according to God's word... no one has ever seen God, they can not see God and live, they haven't even heard the voice of God. That's what the bible says, you can not over look this one enormous fact that has everything to do with this discussion and act as though it isn't written. On top of that the bible it self tells us it was an angel. Now whatever word game Anthony wants to play God has never been called an angel. He is not the messenger he is the one who sends messengers. That would include Jesus. Repent!

[@kardiognostesministries8150]

Why is the Messenger prayed to in Genesis 48:16?

[@ingodwetrustgachatuber2747]

@1:24:00 to 1:24:30, the Unitarian perfectly describes what it means to say the angel of The LORD; it is an angel coming in God's representation and not of himself which is why the angel opf the Lord speaks as God and never says it's own name

[@fifacrazy4418]

Show where a messenger of God asks for another prophet to take off their sandles

[@sandrajohnson9090]

@@fifacrazy4418 I really wish you'd expound on this question so I could understand where you're coming from. I genuinely want to know. Not being snarky, lol.

[@Kostaspapas90]

Nonsense

[@Kostaspapas90]

Many times in the Bible angels come on behalf of God YHWH and they are not called the angel of the lord. The Angel of YHWH is the unique name for God limiting himself and entering his creation. If anybody denies this, you are willingly blinding yourself

[@lampkin9287]

I can’t believe that he claimed to be a type of David! Wow!! David who of more than likely killed him for his heresy !!!

[@dennismaher9533]

AMEN

[@ShepherdsHook]

#RatingDebates #GradingDebates In an apologetic training group I admin we are working on a set of criteria to "Grade Debates" on utube to achieve better quality and outcomes. Rough draft. Critique please. Grading of debates. A, B, C, F On the following. "A" , being highest honor, to "F" for lowest dishonor in the area being judged. . 1. Ability to answer questions 2. Staying on topic 3. How well participants avoided logical fallacies. 4. Who spoke as they knew exactly what they were talking about. 5. How well they interact with on topic arguments. 6.Quotes followed by references or citations of a scholarly field. 7. Originality, anyone can read from a website but is there something original in what your saying. 8. Allows facts to lead to conclusions and not feelings, or relativistic personal opinion.

[@tyowongndeso]

44:50 God is invisible, dont you think He is also invisible to angels?

[@ingodwetrustgachatuber2747]

1:39:00 when Anthony asked why people worshipped, bowed, set up monuments where the angel of God appeared, he should have asked why the ark of the covenant was bowed before, why Nehushtan was looked upon for healing (but was later destroyed when people thought it was Nehushtan that really was the object of worship) and so on. When the presence (Name of The LORD) is in anything or any being in His fullness, that thing or person changes and all who goes before it must bow because of The LORD that indwells it and not because of the thing or being. That was why Moses bowed before the burning bush, Hebrews saw the pillar of cloud and of fire as God, Moses and the elders sat before His presence and so on. In this case, the unitarian clearly understood what Trinitarians do not.

[@fikazon6938]

You cant argue with the truth that has serious evidence. Not that LJ wasn't good enough but no way he was going to win the truth. He knows he cant deep down.

[@capstore393]

I was wondering where act1 went

[@AR15andGOD]

1:35:50 Beautiful

[@Tony_4_Chiliasm]

If you are a "Christian" scholar and you quote Tovia Singer as an authoritative source you have already lost all credibility and, therefore, any argument you are attempting to make. This LJ guy refuted his own argument throughout the entire debate. Anthony didn't even need to say anything, he could have just kicked back and watched this guy dig his own grave. Unitarianism is taught nowhere in Scripture. All throughout the Bible the plurality of God's character is taught, from the first verses to the last. Let US create man in OUR image, the Spirit hovered over the waters, the Lord said to my Lord sit at my right hand until I make your enemies your footstool, Yahweh rained down fire from Yahweh in heaven, Jesus saying I AM the First and the Last, the Aleph and the Tav, Moses, Joshua, Gideon, etc. worshipping the Angel of the Lord, Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever. Trinity, all throughout the Bible. Anyone who says any different lacks basic reading comprehension skills.

[@he9515]

Angel or Messenger מלאך = ך + מלא = Filling + Your (God's) The same word מלא male or mala: to be full, to fill is used in describing the glory of God filling the tabernacle and the temple of Solomon on the day of the dedication of the temple [Ex 40:35,2Ch 7:2] Angel of His presence מלאך פניו [Isa 63:9] (Absolute = 237 ; Ordinal = 84 ; Reduced= 30; Milui Full = 584) I am that I am אֶהְיֶה אֲשֶׁר אֶהְיֶה (O=84) [Ex 3:14] YHVH He is God יְהוָה֙ ה֣וּא הָאֱלֹהִ֔ים (O=84,R=48) [1King 18:39] The glory of YHVH כְּבֹ֣וד יְהוָ֑ה (58) [Isa 40:5] In the Temple of YHVH בְּהֵיכַ֣ל יְהוָ֔ה (O=30) [1Sam 3:3] And it is wonderful (the name of the Angel) וְהוּא פֶֽלִא (O=30) [Jdg 13:18] Stone that was not (made) by hands אבן די לא בידין (O=30) [Dan 2:34,2:45] Eternal Life חַיֵּי עוֹלָם (O=30) [Jn 6:40]

[@anaarkadievna]

2:33 "I AM is not the name of God... YAHWEH this is my name" I never saw anyone contradicting himself so fast. What does Yahweh mean, dude? This is ridiculous!

[@followintruthlj2865]

YHWH doesnt mean I AM :)

[@anaarkadievna]

@@followintruthlj2865 Then what does it mean? You are so dishonest!

[@ֆքǟռ-m5g]

🌎 What if there is a God, and he has made his will known to his creation through his word? What if in his word you find the complete opposite is true to your current ideology? What if because you rejected his word by your own free will to rebel, are judged according to the words of God that you rejected.🤔 Does this make God that evil or unjust God you speak of because of your own decision to reject him🤔 If you are here and are not a believer in Christ Jesus, your only concern should be your reconciliation with God,, as you (and all of humanity) have been separated from Him because of sin and are awaiting His righteous judgment.. As a perfectly just and Holy God,, he cannot arbitrarily pardon your sin, anymore than a good judge would allow a convicted child molester to walk out of the courtroom without punishment. ANY offense toward God, however, is of an infinite nature. Being an infinite God, and of infinite worth and power, our rebellion (lack of keeping His commands PERFECTLY) necessitates an infinite punishment i.e. hell. God’s loving nature engenders the absolute hatred of evil which would include you and I. Our case is a hopeless one, indeed…. BUT.. Jesus Christ came in the flesh to atone for the sin of humanity (John 1:14), offering Himself as the spotless sacrifice pleasing to The Father (Hebrews 9:22/1 Peter 1:19), as men are utterly hopeless to save themselves (Ephesians 2:1 & 8). He bore the sin of the world and the very wrath of God (1 John 2:2/ Matthew 27:46), that whosoever would come to Him (John 3:16), forsaking their sin, could do so through His shed blood. He was crucified unto death. He rose again from the dead on the third day (1 Corinthians 15:3-4). Those who believe in their heart and confess with their tongue that Jesus is Lord and that God raised Him from the dead shall be saved; to the glory of God the Father (Romans 10:9). Christ is seated at the right hand of God having been given all power and dominion (Romans 8:34/Ephesians 1:20-23). He will return for His bride (the church) and establish His kingdom (John 14:3). He will judge the world in righteous judgment (Revelation 20:11-15) The Holy Spirit, being God, has been sent as earnest for true believers until Christ returns (2 Corinthians 1:22). He dwells in true believers and guides them into all truth (John 14:16-17, 26/John 16:13). REPENT! For the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand (Matthew 4:17).🌸

[@anaarkadievna]

1:01 "I don't like to go outside the Bible"... says the guy that invoked Tovia Singer as an authority...

[@followintruthlj2865]

NO I did not invoke Tovia as an authority......

[@anaarkadievna]

@@followintruthlj2865 Then don;t bring that guy up next time... He also said that he thinks christian churches near him should be demolished! Why would you even appeal to that guy ? He is a horrible human being...

[@followintruthlj2865]

@@anaarkadievna Im allowed to bring up whoever I want to....I didnt appeal to him, I was using him to demonstrate a point. Maybe take the time to actually understand what I said next time.

[@anaarkadievna]

@@followintruthlj2865 "Maybe take the time to actually understand what I said next time." Well... your dishonesty was seen all over this debate! I just hope other debates like this come along! This is how we see the mental gymnastic in Unitarianism.

[@anaarkadievna]

@Ecclesia Bro "he didn't bring up Tovia." 31:58 actually he did say he agrees to Tovia, as if this even matters... "William Lane Craig ... Apollonarian heretic" ... yes I agree Apollinarism to be a heresy!

[@keysofthekingdomholybible]

I agree with what LJ Thriepland says. Isaiah 63/9-11 calls "the Angel of His Presence" by the title "Holy Spirit".

[@MrCharlesMartel]

No it doesn’t. LJ is wrong.

[@keysofthekingdomholybible]

@@MrCharlesMartel no. Isaiah 63/9-11 says it plainly. Have a look.

[@MrCharlesMartel]

@@keysofthekingdomholybible I looked. It doesn't say the Spirit is the Angel of the Lord/Presence. You need to do more than assert your view. LJ lost this debate while trying to argue his points and you would have done even worse since you would have merely made assertions without argument or exegesis.

[@keysofthekingdomholybible]

@@MrCharlesMartel Have another look at Isaiah 63. LJ’s opening points were perfect. He was right.

[@MrCharlesMartel]

@@keysofthekingdomholybible I looked at it again. It still says the same thing, which isn't what you are saying. LJ failed but at least attempted to argue his points. You should try to catch up with LJ.

[@brandonj3606]

But Anyway LJ did had some good points!

[@followintruthlj2865]

Well thats a bonus :)

[@OneWayApologetics]

I was first

[@christianrefutations5194]

😔

[@LivingWateraide]

@@christianrefutations5194 lol

[@petemiller9865]

👊✌

[@coryc1904]

👌🏿🌚🤙🏿

[@sammyson3492]

According to uniterians, even if the Angel of Jehovah says that "I am the Lord of Israel the only one God", it should mean that the angel is uttering behalf of Jehovah so the angel is therefore not Jehovah. At this point, nothing can be proven..

[@davidbrachetto1420]

Obviously, if a messenger of Yahweh appears and speaks and says “I am Yahweh…” etc then it is Yahweh speaking through the messenger. Messengers bring messages.

[@nocontent4908]

This was tough to watch.

[@tichintors8908]

Why

[@nocontent4908]

@@tichintors8908 major leagues vs pee wee.

[@Ousias1]

In other words, “Unitarians keep losing so Anthony must be cheating.” Lol

[@MrCharlesMartel]

@@joshuasmith4230 Let's pretend Anthony hasn't seen right through you and called a spade a spade: Why should anyone care about misinterpreting your words when unitarians don't care about misinterpreting the Bible and pretending they have come up with a secret meaning that has been missed by the church for 2,000 years?

[@nocontent4908]

@@Ousias1 not in the least. I’m 100% in your camp for AOTL, Anthony. You are providing amazing arguments every time you open your mouth. The Unitarian position is not logical at all. It falls back on a representative for every appearance. The comment I made is a comparison in substance. Your debate opponent came poorly prepared to support a losing position. And it was a complete smack down. I just kept skipping through his arguments near the end because it was like a broken record. Looking forward to your next performance in defense of the correct view of scripture and the role of the pre-incarnate Son of Man.

[@ingodwetrustgachatuber2747]

I am trinitarian by definition but the unitarian is 100% correct. The Jewish teaching should be the reference. For example, when God says let's make man in our image, it does NOT make any sense that He was speaking to the trinity. He was speaking to those spiritual beings with Him at the time which could have been the angels, cherubims etc but not Himself.

[@jesussaves8022]

So are we made in the image of God and angels? Did the angels also created us? Pls give biblical answer for your blasphemy!

[@Caleb_287]

@@jesussaves8022 amen

[@williemaysfan1731]

LJ talked about Anthony being Goliath and LJ being David. Well, Goliath beat down David. All praise to the Triune God!

[@danglingondivineladders3994]

330th comment as well as 404th like. good ratio

[@jesuschristiskingofkingslo2023]

I can't stand this static

[@Mellownius]

NIV 🤦‍♂️🙄

[@sking7003]

🙂

[@brandonj3606]

L J you lost the debate!

[@Oscar-wu1cc]

Munlin man

[@Nbovfm22]

6:55 “the angel of the Lord is jhwh” Let’s repeat this: “the messenger of jhwh is jhwh” Does this make sense?

[@MrCharlesMartel]

It makes perfect sense given the truth of the Trinity. But it is inexplicable if one assumes that God is only one person. The proper response of people to the revelation of God is to look at what God said and believe and submit to it. It is not the place of creatures to subject God’s word to what we arbitrarily set up as a criteria of what makes sense. God tells us who he is and he is not measured by the yardstick of finite and fallen minds.

[@Nbovfm22]

@@MrCharlesMartel I’m not assuming that God is one person, I’ve read it in the Bible. “Jhwh your god is one Jhwh” But if “messenger of jhwh” doesn’t mean messenger of jhwh anymore, then I assume “one” doesn’t mean “one” anymore, too.

[@MrCharlesMartel]

@@Nbovfm22 it doesn’t say “one Yahweh” but “Yahweh is one”. This is also how Jesus quoted it in Mark 12. And the Shema does not say Yahweh is one *person*, for then it would contradict itself since it repeatedly identifies the Angel of the Lord as Yahweh. God is not uni-personal as you do in fact assume. Once you stop begging the question you might begin to see what the Bible is telling you.

[@joeydelrio]

if the Hebrew bible teaches the trinity then one also has to conclude that great men like Moses, Elijah, Isaiah, just didnt get it. which is a bit foolish.

[@MrCharlesMartel]

Dumb. If the Hebrew Bible teaches the Trinity, then it is precisely because the men who wrote it, men like Moses, Isaiah, and others, DID get it! Oy vey! Your comment isn't even intelligible. It's like you got to the point of concluding your thought and had forgotten what you were saying at the beginning of it.

[@joeydelrio]

@@MrCharlesMartel Jews dont teach the trinity, they never have. its kinda hard to make sense of what your talking about being as you dont explain what your talking about, i am wrong because you say i am wrong, typical trin logic. .

[@MrCharlesMartel]

@@joeydelrio Normally I tell cultists who reject orthodox Christian doctrine not to trust their leaders and to think for themselves. While I do think you should stop listening to whoever it is that is teaching you, I am not as confident in your case that you should be told to think for yourself. That looks like it could be dangerous and might be at the root of the problem. Leaving that aside, let me help walk you through this. First, there is nothing in my previous comment that entails that you are wrong because I said you are wrong. I can't even tell what you could have mistakenly taken that way. Second, what I said is self-contained and didn't require any long explanation: you said something at the beginning of your comment that you seem to have forgotten by the end of your comment. In the first part of your statement you said, "If the Hebrew Bible teaches the Trinity," which, if we analyze this part of your statement, would mean that the authors of the Hebrew Bible like Moses and Isaiah did get the Trinity, but then you went on to say: "then one also has to conclude that great men like Moses, Elijah, Isaiah, just didnt get it." Your statement is literally self-contradictory. You didn't even take two statements to contradict yourself when trying to refute Christianity. Third, ancient Jews were certainly not unitarians or polytheists and did teach things that are consistent with Trinitarianism.

[@eddiemonesti5671]

It's time to listen what the Rabbis have to say about the Messiah. Based in the OT jesus clearly is not the Messiah.

[@MrCharlesMartel]

It is well known that Talmudic Judaism is a post-Christian creation. It is out of step not only with Christianity but second temple Judaism.

[@eddiemonesti5671]

@@MrCharlesMartel Who cares about Talmudic?

[@MrCharlesMartel]

@@eddiemonesti5671 Exactly my point. Thanks for refuting yourself.

[@eddiemonesti5671]

@@MrCharlesMartelMan I don't know what are you talking about.

[@MrCharlesMartel]

@@eddiemonesti5671 If you can’t keep up, then you should probably should keep silent.