Pam Should Be In JAIL - Minor 1.5 Spoilers

[@elizabethb4168]

I've seen the theory that the bus is out of commission because Pam crashed it while drunk driving, evidence being the skid marks on the road leading straight into a broken fence I don't think that Pam killed anyone, but I do think the bus is broken at the start of the game because of her drunk driving Also! I think that the bus that drops us off at the start it's a completely different boss that only takes trips to Stardew Valley once or twice a year, or only stops by special request enroute to somewhere else. It would explain how everybody shows up for the Stardew Valley fair, and why the bus at the bus stop only seems to go to the desert, and I don't think Pam's driving the bus for Sam's heart scene.

[@Korilian13]

I think we arrive with the bus from Zozo city, which seems to run more regulalry (as its a more viable line). I think its the bus that brings us and the tourists and the one we take for Sam's concert.

[@Leapalot]

For sure! I don't think they were the same bus. I just realized it was silly that you get off a bus, when there's a broken bus sitting right there like five minutes later. I wonder if Pam's only allowed to go to the desert as part of her approved travel areas lol.

[@miss-laea]

Yeah I agree. And the bus is legit called « the bus to calico desert » so it only goes there and probably doesn’t get frequent enough use to be profitable to anyone, which is why it has to be founded by either Pelican town, or in that case, by you, the player

[@battlesheep2552]

I like the idea that the bus is fine, but Pam had her license suspended because of a DUI, and the juminos have to grease a few palms to get it back

[@isaacjohnson437]

@@battlesheep2552 I personally think the junimos use their magic to remove the breathalyzer lock on the bus so Pam can drive it.

[@rainfyre2694]

It killed me when I got a quest to make “potato juice” for Pam. I didn’t want to become a vodka dealer…

[@kailomonkey]

At least she didn't like it.

[@barboraklepalova3886]

Don't worry, potato juice is not alcoholic in this game

[@wronggeometry]

You dont have to do it

[@kymo6343]

@@barboraklepalova3886 To be fair I think she WANTED you to make vodka but the player misunderstands and makes her potato juice instead, which is why she hates it. XD

[@quietmaiden]

It seems every character has a hard story that keeps the community feel like it's remote town from the rest of state. Maybe the broken down community center reflects on the towns people can't move on, cause they are holding on to their past and haven't gotten a resolution. The farm can go into each character and by making right choices help each person. With Leah you can give her Sculpture show, Alex music concert, and you can help them pursue their dreams.

[@Leapalot]

Everyone is very static when you get there. It makes sense that the game wants you to drive the story, but it's sad that everyone is just kind of existing.

[@silbers456]

One thing that i noticed is that Leah doesn't actually want a relationship and to settle down, since that's the main reason she left the city.

[@noahkirschtein8169]

i think you mixed sam and alex here lolol but yes.

[@miceltusav88]

@@silbers456 really? I thought she left because her ex didn't support her chosen path in life. Since the farmer does, she is far more willing to settle down with them because the farmer had shown that they support her and have her back when it comes to pursuing her dream.

[@charliewright2667]

@@silbers456 bruh what she didn't leave the city because she didn't like being in a relationship, she was literally being abused by her partner. Closer to being in a relationship where you get beat the fuck out of and finally gather the courage to run tf away. Why do you think her house is always locked?

[@polaris_503]

As someone who deals with having a "high functioning" alcoholic as my parent, I can understand the things that penny goes through, in my headcanon penny teaches the kids of the valley because she wants things to be better for them than they're for her, she wants them to have a good education, so they'll grow up knowing what's good and what's not. I think Pam definitely struggles, and I feel deeply that she's not fleshed out enough, it may look like she wants things to change, be because of "the road block" of her actual game development she's unable to actually change, she's been through a lot, put Penny through a lot also, she wants to be a better mother for her daughter. I can only hope that concerned ape adds a recovery arc for her, that would be awesome.

[@Leapalot]

I think it would be nice to have a recovery arc. I don't know if we'll see one, but it would give people some hope for change in their own lives.

[@alannacussons9680]

I grew up with a single mother who was a high functioning alcoholic who ended up getting a DUI. Penny is my absolute favourite romance candidate in stardew valley. I'm also in university right now studying to become a primary school teacher. Huh. Well I'll add it to the notes of things to talk to my therapist about ahahaha

[@khoibut6206]

I love Penny till death

[@survivordave]

Pam actually was a truck driver before she becomes the Calico Desert bus driver. I got this quote on a recent playthrough: "I miss my old truck driving job. I used to go all around the valley, meetin' people, listenin' to the radio. Times sure do change.” Perhaps she was laid off of the truck driving job and couldn't get any other employment, so she took to drinking to drown away her loss of a job she loved. Then when the bus becomes available, she's the only one in town with a commercial driver's license and can take the job.

[@pamelahoney874]

leapalot: *discussing serious topics like alcoholism and providing resources like hotlines* the music in the background: ✨💕💐😃😌☺️

[@kitkatty52211]

I heard a theory that the cost for the bus is actually paying off the debt from a trial from Pam's drunk driving. I think that makes a lot of sense too

[@Leapalot]

Yes! That one definitely makes sense to me!

[@J-Johna-Jameson]

@@Leapalot but then how would the junimos fix it. Go to court?

[@TwelveRats]

​@@J-Johna-Jameson Yes, exactly

[@discodog4582]

Man my dad’s an alcoholic, and he’s invited me to check out his AA meetings a few times. And hearing about these people’s stories, you really start learning that addiction and alcoholism prey on those who are alone and vulnerable, like some sort of cult or scammer. Maybe they started because their parents abused them, or because they didn’t have any friends, or the friends they did have pressured them into it. It doesn’t matter; once they begin to rely on it more and more, the more others stay away from them, and the more they in turn become alone and vulnerable, repeating the cycle. If they get in trouble with law enforcement, that just makes those sentiments even worse. This is why a support system is so important for the recovering alcoholic. This is why sponsor programs, groups like AA, and religion are such common options to turn to, because they provide someone to be there with you. So yeah, I think that’s why Pam turns to religion, why she got worse after losing her job and husband, and didn’t get better just because she became better off financially.

[@Leapalot]

Humans are social creatures. Isolate them and some nasty stuff can happen. Thanks for sharing. Hope you, your father, and your family are doing as well as possible.

[@froggijo]

I think you handled all the sensitive info and ideas respectfully. I don't think she killed anyone, but the bus accident and breathalyzer are solid. The text on the screen can be really hard to read sometimes, especially when it is scrolling up the screen while you are speaking, and the two have little to do with each other. I think you could slow down a bit, maybe read the quotes out loud as well as put them on screen. Just a suggestion! I appreciate all the research and information you are providing with these videos, keep it up!

[@Leapalot]

Thanks for the feedback! I heard that from another commenter too. It's easy for me to read and listen because I know what's coming, but yeah. Makes sense!

[@WillyLee23]

The farmer is a worse person. Shane and Pam confide in me their substance abuse problems, yet here I am… gifting them beer twice a week when I see them.

[@Leapalot]

Yeah... Big enabler vibes...

[@nicolaim4275]

Shane should be given pizza and peppers.

[@Cawffee7]

@@nicolaim4275 thats what i do!

[@charcoaleater343]

Now i feel bad, the first time i met Pam on day 1 i got her a beer, didn't know she was alcoholic

[@jepleure]

@@nicolaim4275 Yeah once I figured out that Shane was an alcoholic, I stopped gifting him beer--just pizza and pepper poppers

[@annesophie4037]

It always rubbed me the wrong way that her quest are about giving her more alcohol. (i'm pretty sure potato "Juice" is just whiskey). It's weird how Pam, the known towndrunk, never gets cut off by anyone ever, even the player gives her more

[@Leapalot]

Gotta keep her sated so she doesn't go berserk?

[@gelu_4499]

Concernedape realised Pam is too powerful so he nerved her. The only thing keeping the Beast at bay is Alcohol!

[@annesophie4037]

@@LucifersLittleDemon666 lol i guess you're right xD

[@Leapalot]

@@LucifersLittleDemon666 Definitely Vodka.

[@aprilhelm518]

This bothered me too. Maybe an option to decline could have been nice so it wouldn't go into the quest log. Mayor's quests also bugged me, personally. Penny doesn't give Pam alcohol, and other than Gus kind of enabling her, I guess(?)(...although she might've just drank her own beers at home instead), I don't know of anyone else who does.

[@oxybrightdark8765]

Your trigger warnings- I don’t need them, but I really appreciate them

[@Leapalot]

That's great! Thanks for the affirmation. I think they're a good use of time, even if they hopefully won't affect anyone's experience.

[@migitri]

Same here. I appreciate the trigger warnings.

[@stormie175]

Yes! 💕

[@charliewright2667]

That's because trigger warnings are proven not to work and you don't have ptsd so obviously it's a non-issue for you but you like to feel better about how you speak so it doesn't 'hurt' anyone. Here's an article summary from the association for the association of psychological science on such: Summary: New research suggests that trigger warnings have little or no benefit in cushioning the blow of potentially disturbing content and, in some cases, may make things worse. See the make things worse bit? Stop using trigger warnings. They're stupid bullshit made by people without psych degrees and without trauma that don't even help and have the capacity to make it worse. If you want another reliable source that says the same exact thing, the New Yorker magazine also has an article about this issue. Please educate, educate, educate on this issue, as this whole trigger warning bs is getting out of hand.

[@charliewright2667]

@@Leapalot please see my comment and reconsider your use of trigger warnings.

[@Ed.Underscore.Underscore]

I think it’s a missed opportunity but on CA’s behalf to not have the farmer arrive on the train. At least the train passes through once in awhile the bus that brought you never shows again.

[@Leapalot]

That's fair! We would have to have a landslide like that same day though, since the bathhouse map is initially off limits.

[@kiroonsmoon]

Oh I just recently learned about ignition locks in my drivers Ed class and honestly I’m so confused about why not every single car/vehicle has one. Yes, it’ll cost more money to make the car and it won’t be a catch all to completely get rid of drunk driving (as someone could just drink WHILE driving or the lock could malfunction/be broken). But you can’t deny it’ll significantly reduce the number of drunk driving incidents, crashes, injuries and deaths. I’ll gladly pay more money if I know I wouldn’t be able to drive drunk or have a drunk driver. Anyways actually on to Pam lol. I personally don’t think Pam killed someone while drunk driving. Cuz if Pam did kill or injure someone while driving drunk that would probably make the news and I highly doubt the WHOLE town would be quiet about it. I can see Pam getting caught drunk driving tho & having to pay a fine (and maybe a little jail time.) which could lead to her living in a trailer. My question tho is who decided to give the alcoholic a job as a bus driver. Even if she wasn’t an alcoholic when she started who would allow her to go back to the job???

[@Leapalot]

Hi there! I think they're interesting little machines. They're completely unobtrusive unless you're having issues, but I don't think they'll ever be widespread other than as a deterrent. People just won't accept that restriction if they don't have to. By the way! If you think people can't get away with killing someone without losing their job/jail time, look up South Dakota Attorney General Jason Ravnsborn. Short version is... He killed a man while driving (almost certainly) drunk and using his phone, he called the police and told them he hit a deer. Later he returned and found the body. When tested, many hours after the collision, his BAC was of course not illegal. He then settled out of court with the man's widow. Obviously Pam is not as well connected, but dang.

[@coolcatalesha]

breathalyzers are very temperamental. im close w someone who has one and so many things can make them go off. yogurt, mouth wash, cologne, hand sanitizer, and so many more food items that do not have alcohol in them. cant be a designated driver because if someone in your car has been drinking, it’ll go off sometimes. its incredibly sensitive. i think its absolutely necessary for people who drink & drive & dont seem to wanna stop doing that, but for everyone else who doesn’t like you or i, they are annoying ass machines that would make us to have to think through everything we do before we start driving. also, luckily, they go off while the person is driving. so they can’t start drinking once they’ve started their car, it goes off pretty frequently.

[@designerwookiee]

We could go a step further and eliminate the risks of all forms of driving under the influence and distracted driving entirely by making the switch to self-diving vehicles. It'll cost more money to make the self-driving cars and won't solve all vehicle safety issues, but it would significantly reduce the number of DUI and distracted driving incidents, crashes, injuries and deaths. I think that we should embrace our inevitable AI overlords. Plus, think of the other conveniences and quality of life. Consider individuals who can't drive themselves around due to a disability; if the vehicle drives itself, problem solved! Neil Degras Tyson brought up an interesting counter-argument though... If every self-driving vehicle always gives way to pedestrians, what would stop pedestrians from just constantly crossing the streets whenever they feel like it once everyone is in a self-driving vehicle?

[@coolcatalesha]

@@designerwookiee i completely agree that self driving cars will solve so many issues, including traffic issues in some cases as well. im not sure pedestrians crossing the street whenever would really be that big of an issue. but who knows!

[@miceltusav88]

The same person who makes a gold statue of themselves

[@cofeejoe2882]

For Pam's credit, she does go directly to work and just after she is done she goes to the salon after the bus is fixed. Tho her dependency might be an explanation to why she leaves her post arguably early. All in all you were very tactful on this topic, (I also have family who struggle with substance abuse). I appreciate your perspective.

[@Leapalot]

Thank you! I did my best to give some insight and be kind of out there, but keep it respectful. Glad that came through because it's a tough balancing act! I hope you and yours are as well as can be.

[@aulliray]

I have very mixed feelings on Pam. Similar to George, I love how flawed she is, and the near horrifying realism, but I just can’t make peace with her lack of an “ending”. We get to see her start on a path to recovery, but we never see it go anywhere. On one hand, that’s how it goes sometimes, it’s not uncommon to find an addict who says they’re trying (and perhaps they really are), who makes no progress for one reason or another. Addiction is debilitating and exhausting and sometimes when you’re alone in your recovery, as it seems Pam is, it can feel like climbing a mountain without any gear. On the other hand, she is alone in her recovery, or attempt at it anyways. The town is small, the people around her MUST know she’s trying if she’s putting any effort in, so why is no one offering support? Why don’t we see Gus try to reduce Pam’s drinking with mixed drinks and alternatives? See him cutting her off early for the night? Why don’t we see Penny talk about Pam’s relapses or mood swings from the reduction of Alcohol? Little things like this ruined the immersion of Stardew valley in my opinion. Maybe even an optional event, a secret event that’s unlocked through a high heart event with Gus AND Pam where we see her talk about how she spends nights at the Saloon now more out of habit than to drink, or Gus talking to you about helping out Pam (since it feels like he does care about her, after watching her train wreck alcoholism for so long)… Okay that turned into more of a rant but I just wish we got more out of Pam, even just. A LITTLE more visible change. She has so much potential, or maybe I’m just seeing that as someone with a functioning alcoholic as a parent myself-

[@nuggyy]

I think there is one event either with Gus or Pam that talks about how Gus kinda struggles with money at the saloon and Pam doesn’t pay her tab or something like that but he doesn’t want to refuse her cause they’re friends. I guess Gus is kind of in a weird position where he wants to make money from his business and he doesn’t really feel comfortable or know how to approach her with her issues. Or maybe he just doesn’t care enough, who knows

[@prepster8886]

The disclaimers are the beginning of the video didn't go unappreciated :] I feel like alcoholism and substance abuse are so normalised nowadays that people don't realise its upsetting for some people to listen to Great video dude!! You're one of my favourite stardew valley KZbinrs atm haha

[@Leapalot]

Most people won't need the disclaimers and that's a good thing! But I'd rather have them and not need them than not have them and need them. Glad to hear you're having fun! 😁

[@disc0-zi337]

This! My dad was an alcoholic when I was 9 or 10. He stopped drinking but it somewhat getting back into it. I love that he put a disclaimer for this :)

[@prepster8886]

@@disc0-zi337 I'm sorry to hear that :( I've been exposed to alcoholism my whole life so it can make me uncomfortable in the wrong contexts yk? I'm glad someone appreciates the disclaimers just as much me me :D

[@-chippedstars-2889]

I've always felt terrible for Pam, and Penny (My other favorite bachelorette after Leah). They're stuck in this shitty situation and both want out but only Penny seems to be doing anything to try and fix it

[@Leapalot]

It can be really challenging to even know what your next step should be in those situations. A lot of times it's just about making through each day. Survival mode.

[@-chippedstars-2889]

@@Leapalot That is true. Depression + substance abuse are crippling, I should know

[@spencerallison3196]

My head canon is that Lewis was the one who broke the bus by neglecting repairs because when it's the start of the game or Shane's or Sam's events it's the fat guy with the green shirt driving.

[@qrapefru1t150]

I would just like to say I hope you and your family/friends are doing ok (this is directed towards the segment at the start of the video) I’m lucky enough to have not had any experiences with this kind of thing but I do know how damaging it can be for a family especially. (from what I observed from a close friend) My heart goes out to anyone who is/knows someone struggling with alcohol. Stay strong :)

[@AgentSteffi]

So the whole "she killed Mona and Lewis is hiding her" thing is definitely waaay to overboard imo.

[@Leapalot]

Almost definitely not true. Unless... But yeah. I think she probably she hit a fence or went in the ditch. The rest I hold to though!

[@kailomonkey]

@@Leapalot I don't think any of the DUI stuff is for sure. Instead those skid marks were made by Harry Mason trying to avoid hitting a young girl in the fog.

[@VGInterviews]

I don't think that if all that happened, including Lewis protecting Pam from further repercussion he would allow Gus to keep serving her alcohol, even Gus would feel guilty to keep enabling her in case she really was the reason another member of the community was killed, for the same reason I don't think Lewis would allow her to return to her post if she had done 0 progress on improving herself, if not for her, for his own position as Mayor, to avoid any further scandals, he would likely look for another alternative among the citizens

[@Leapalot]

Definitely! Lewis always looks out for himself first. 👀

[@cryptid6279]

i grew up with drug addicts as my guardians and i super empathize with penny. my mother was just like pam in a lot of ways, just way worse. you *want* to love them. you really do. because they're your parents. but the way they continually screw themselves over is incredibly painful. it makes you feel inadequate. like you're not good enough of a reason for them to get better. obviously this isnt true, the addict is in their own world, theyre not in the right state of mind. when you're an addict, most of the time all you can focus on is your next fix. it's a horrifying disease that i wouldnt wish on anyone. in a situation like pam and penny's, i can say from experience that pam, at this current moment, isnt capable of getting better on her own. she isnt capable of implementing that change that she wants in her life, she's in too deep right now, and it's gonna take the help of a professional to get her out of that. that is, if she's willing to accept that help. as someone who's been in penny's situation, the best thing she can do for herself is to sadly cut pam off. the relationship is incredibly toxic, and its hurting her mental health to stay in it. maybe if pam sobers up and addresses the pain she's trying to address with alcohol, they can start to mend that relationship. but it seems like thats gonna be a while.

[@j.m.3537]

Pam is the reason why I always marry Penny in all of my Savefiles. She has some good sites, but the negative ones outweigh them by far. Especially when you never who whether she is sober or not when she drives the bus. And she gets mad at Penny for trying to have a better life, even if she acknowledges that Penny is way smarter than her, she doesn't seem to see a reason to change. I really like how the developers portrayed the bad sites of alcohol. You have some funny scenes, but you also see how disfunctional the Charakters are, when they drink to much. Sadly, you can't change them. Even if the characters learn, that they should not drink that much, they always take Beer as a gift and love it.

[@OllieV__nl]

That was the reason I picked Penny for my first playthrough. She's just so sweet and caring and deserves better. Or if that's not available, me. I've since gone through all the bachelors (except Shane. Screw Shane) but I really do need to make a new one for Penny because I last married her on 1.0, I need to see the expanded events.

[@Leapalot]

I think this is why a lot of people marry Penny. To try to like rescue her. I've said it before, but many players want to fix or save people. Penny is like a prime subject for that. Thanks for the insight. :)

[@mochimochi4179]

Oof yea that do be me, savior complex over here. It also hurts that you can't properly "save" Shane without marrying him, while at least you can buy pam/penny a whole ass house.

[@rvbkid]

Its always nice seeing people talk about Shane and Pam with the understanding of what a heavy disorder like addiction can do to people.

[@funkytime69]

I'm sorry but talking about addiction with Pierre sending Morris to Brazil in the background is kind of hilarious

[@cosmicfails2053]

I wouldn't take Lewis' opinion on most if not all matters at all that reliable given his... reputation as someone who lies and covers up a lot of things. *Looks at the Solid Gold Lewis that is made with enough money to repair most of the town.*

[@Leapalot]

If only we could afford to pay for a new bridge to the quarry! Or fix the beach crossing! Or the one that leads to the flower dance! Or.. Fix the bus? Thanks Lewis...

[@verdatum]

Damn. If only Alcohol Abuse Disorder had an easy solution. Then, it wouldn't be such a massive and complicated problem. Someone, please get on top of that. I like how you treated this topic with sincerity. The days of Otis the loveable alcoholic from The Andy Griffith Show needs to stop. It's a death sentence. Even trying to quit can kill you.

[@Olivia-W]

How alcohol is a legal drug and psilocybin and LSD are banned is a perfect example of how laws make no damn sense sometimes.

[@Sam-lr9oi]

Just wanted to say as someone nearly 7 months off alcohol and who lost my brother to addiction: I did not expect such a fantastic and affecting video when I started putting these on during my breaks at work. Really well done, man.

[@Leapalot]

Congrats on 7 months! Keep up the great work!

[@cherryleafy101]

I did find it weird at first that the bus had been broken down for such a long time. But, after thinking about it, I think it was actually broken. It could have been for two reasons. The first is it naturally breaking down. It seems old, since Lewis said it broke down a really long time ago. So it could have naturally broken down, and then the town couldn't afford to fix it or get the parts. Lewis seems to siphon a lot of money off the town coffers, the tax system barely functions, etc., so I think that's fairly likely. Also, since it's probably old maybe parts weren't even available anymore. The second is that maybe Pam crashed it. Either due to drunk driving or something like poor weather/road conditions/avoiding an animal that jumped out into the road/etc. If you look around the backwoods (to the left of the bus stop), you can find some tire tracks that looks like the bus swerved/skidded. So perhaps the bus broke down because of an accident. Maybe it's both reasons combined. Regardless of how the bus broke down, I think that might have been the catalyst for Pam's severe drinking problem. I think she was probably an alcoholic before, and maybe drove drunk, but I think the bus breaking down would have made it much worse. It also raises another question for me. Where is Pam's old house? I doubt she and Penny live in that trailer by choice. Especially since Pam is glad when you get her a new house. I think it's likely that she lost the house she used to live in once she got laid off due to the bus breaking down; she couldn't pay the rent/mortgage, bills, etc. anymore so it got repossessed and they had to move into the trailer. But then, assuming that Pam lived in the valley, what house did they live in before? What happened to it? And why did nobody there help her when she lost everything and clearly had a problem?

[@Leapalot]

Hat mouse's house?

[@cherryleafy101]

@@Leapalot Maybe. That would make sense. I wondered who lived there before and why it got so run down.

[@irene7clover419]

I always thought of it as 1.) Pam had Penny with Penny's dad 2.) At some point, the bus just broke down and the town didn't have money to fix it (which wouldn't be unreasonable, the infrastructure of the town is questionable at best), but that's okay, Penny's dad probably works so they still have money coming in, Pam wasn't an alcoholic at this point. Then 3.) One day, when Penny was old enough to remember details (so not a baby/toddler) her dad gets fed up with living in such a small community, and it's not like they can save up to move because all the money is going to necessities, and there's no job good opportunities in the town (Gus could reasonably run the saloon by himself at that point, Pierre is Pierre, learning to be a black smith takes time/money, It's dummy hard to get a job at a library, and Willy, while he would in a heartbeat, probably couldn't afford to hire another person to work with him), so he decides to just leave Pam and Penny behind. This is when Pam starts drinking. It got a bit better after time had passed, but at that point Pam's body had become addicted to alcohol, so she just...continues. This could explain why no one brings up Pam's ex/Penny's dad, out of fear of making Pam go back to her previous state.

[@Leapalot]

I think these are all good points except that Sam slides into working at the museum pretty easily after Joja closes!

[@irene7clover419]

@@Leapalot Wait he works there?

[@Leapalot]

Yup! Monday and Wednesday afternoons if I remember right.

[@VaqueroGamerSonGoku]

Again, congratulations for your job! And every day closer to Penny's video :))

[@Leapalot]

Inching ever closer!

[@ladyalesiel4209]

I literally feel so bad for Pam. She reminds me a lot of a family member of mine, who still struggles to this day.

[@idris-lemmings3277]

I like how Leapalot takes this stuff seriously. Also I think asking Yoba for help might work because the Yoba ring works, and that might be proof of Yoba existing. 🤔

[@Leapalot]

Hard to argue with a deity exisitng when their blessing exists in a measurable way lol.

[@leannr563]

Functioning alcoholics are just not fun. My mother in law is like this and it’s just sad to watch someone do this to themselves and to justify it by using what they are able to do (though they’re still not doing as well as they think they are).

[@disc0-zi337]

I feel bad for Pam and Penny. I can't imagine how Penny feels watching her only parent figure in her life drink constantly. I honestly understand how she feels, I still have my mother and father but, my father used to drink constantly when I was younger and was verbally abusive towards my mother. She'd constantly worry about my safety. I wish she actually got help, not by praying but by going to therapy and trying to better herself for her daughter too.

[@CamCat13]

Go to the bus, walk on the street westward, same place you find Linus' Blackberry basket. If u look at the road, there are 2 tire brake marks and a wrecked fence line. It couldve been anything- but what if that was the car crash that resulted in the bus issue?

[@scrapsarcher1444]

This makes so much sense! I still don’t want to believe this tho. Also it doesn’t seem like the kimonos to remove something like that. I’m assuming they didn’t know what they were doing when they removed it-you wouldn’t get busses in forest magic land!

[@Leapalot]

Are we sure the junimos are the good guys? 🤔

[@scrapsarcher1444]

@@Leapalot please no! They’re too cute to be bad guys! Though I wonder what they’re going to do with all the money from the vault bundle…

[@TheGrinningViking]

Actually functional alcoholics don't get spotted. Don't pry if people have it together enough that you never would have known before, and if you have to poke your nose in to see it after. I have fibromyalgia and I live in America. I stopped carrying a hip flask and I rely on a cane and foot braces most of the time now. It's either be visibly disabled or have a drink, and the drink cost more. Either way I can't drive, vision gets blurry and my reflexes aren't great, and that's when I'm sober.

[@TheWretchedOwl]

I always sort of thought that CA intended for the player to arrive by train, but then had to change that after locking the train station behind a timed event, and that arriving on the bus sort of just got swept up in things. Though, correct me if I’m wrong, when everyone goes to Zuzu city for the music concert thing, doesn’t everyone leave by bus? Maybe a different bus drops off the player at the start of the game, at the all purpose bus stop, and drives off before the camera fades in, and it only looks like you get off the broken bus for some reason… 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@Leapalot]

They do go by bus! Presumably you go to Zuzu with Shane by bus as well. 🤔

[@cridow]

i think that killing someone is a wee bit too far, but like the other comment said, the skid marks on the road and all else considered, do make me believe pam possibly crashed the bus and thats why it broke.

[@Leapalot]

Probably! Seems more likely that it was that. Maybe a second offense or something.

[@SlyPearTree]

The repair might be to make the bus self driving with Pam only having to turn it on and make sure no ones rides it for free.

[@kailomonkey]

I actually thought the same about the bus. I guess the first playthrough I got the impression losing her job influenced the alcoholism and assumed the bus really was broken. But coming back to the game and forgetting all that I assumed alcoholism was the reason the bus wasn't running, and we're paying to get a drunk driver back in the driver's seat... The breathalyzer is an extension I hadn't thought of but works! Regarding the resort she shows up pretty often for me. Not the best eye candy I have to say.

[@bat8046]

I honestly really like Pam. I think she was the first npc I befriended. I really felt for her after I bought her the house. She wanted to change but she couldn’t. And she felt like she’d failed her ‘anonymous donor.’ And I just wanted to tell her that it wasn’t why I bought the house for her. She didn’t have to earn it. I know most people bought the house for Penny. But I absolutely bought it for Pam. I wanted her to have something nice. I don’t have addiction issues but I’ve felt the same way about my own severe mental health issues. Like I should be able to fix things if something material changes. That theoretically a nice house would solve everything. I really felt for her realizing that there was no easy solution. I honestly don’t think she’ll ever be able to stop drinking. But I still like her a lot. I can’t bring myself to judge her. I want her to be as happy as she can be.

[@Occhii_Docchii]

Pam is the reason for the don’t drink and drive law

[@Leapalot]

The OG DUI.

[@sammig.8286]

I actually didn't realize that Pam was Penny's mother. For all I knew she was Gus' wife. I never really got far in relationship with Penny either. I just knew Pam as easy to please, because all you have to do is buy a beer at the bar and walk right over and give it to Pam. Same with Shane. That said, I'm usually out mining in the evenings until I collapse or barely make it to bed.

[@Leapalot]

It does make it super easy to befriend her. But then I feel guilty!

[@MC-from-Hell]

At some point at the ten heart event with Pam, the player will have, in her words "caught [her] praying" which according to some family members that I have that also went to alcohol anonymous, a prayer or even a placebo prayer can have an effect on your drinking as a coping mechanism. Sometimes what also helps is replacing alcohol with sparkling water, which is something that Shane does at a certain heart event.

[@imvegan2836]

A video with: 1.scenes from the game 2. your scrolling captions 3. you talking all at the same time. I didn't know where to look, what to read and simply couldn't listen. This has to be one of my most favorite games, and Penny is one of my fave stardew characters, yet I couldn't catch a single thing from this vid. I clearly love your content, that's why I'm a subscriber but - I got nothing from this video. Not because the topic was bad, it was just a bit much.

[@Leapalot]

That's fair! Sometimes I worry about being overly busy, and apparently that was the case here! Thanks for the feedback!

[@Hellscap3]

Pams bus is just between pelican town and calico desert. Other buses exist for the rest of places. Like all buses it just has its own route but if no one really needs it lewis can avoid repairing it forever. Another gold lewis lets goo

[@RedRaiderFilmsLLC]

Wonderful video and a great theory! I’ve also seen quite a few people turn to alcohol more after a DUI, and I wouldn’t be surprised if thats Pams story as well. It’s a tough hole to dig yourself out of, perhaps in the future Concerned Ape will add more to her storyline, probably not but might as well wish for it.

[@Leapalot]

I would be surprised at this point. Pleasantly surprised though!

[@katiealleena2049]

I just recently found your channel. Was I wrong or was that a Kingkiller reference re: Gus? Genius. Also Pam is a very sad character ): I only saw the house/yoba scene for the first time a day or so ago.

[@Growmetheus]

The best way to learn about addiction is to attend addiction meetings. Don’t read about anybody else’s opinion from any angle until you see it for yourself. When you hear someone else’s life story….. or even hear 10 stories- 50 stories- 100 stories, it changes your perception of the world entirely. Even beyond addiction, the place is full of wisdom.

[@ThresherSharkz]

It does seem quite possible that Pam killed Mona when drunk driving, but Pelican Town is a very remote town. The only law maker wing the governor who had Lewis enforce them. However in Penny’s 6 heart dialogue, when she said her father left because he felt trapped, the way I interpreted it is that Pam’s husband killed Mona in a drunk driving accident. Then Pam got on him about his drinking after that. Pam could possibly have formed an alcoholic addiction as a way to remember him before the accident with Mona.

[@Leapalot]

Yikes!

[@tiffanykeefe2368]

Kind of always thought Mona was Abigail's pet. like David's (?) friend which is why she only has 1 guinea pig.

[@Mathlink2695]

As a teacher with an alcoholic parent, I related so hard to Penny it was never even a question who I'd end up marrying in the end. It's so tough growing up in an environment like that because even though you love them for sure, you also can't deny the hurt they do to you and feelings of being abandoned in favor of God knows how many drinks every day, so instead of growing up like them you try to become an example for the next generation to be better. And the worst part is that, the way addictions work you can't really escape by yourself, you're gonna need help and support and you have to want that help and support, for the sake of those who love you most.

[@oxybrightdark8765]

I don’t think there’s any evidence for Pam killing anyone. I always thought that the character didn’t actually get that bus to the town, anyways, they were just by the broken bus because that’s where the bus stop is. I think they were just waiting there for a while, until robin showed up.

[@Leapalot]

I don't think there's any evidence for a lot of the stuff I say, so you're definitely right about that!

[@deltius]

strange that we didn't have to finish another bundle to fix the hole Pierre made in the roof

[@reinafox7639]

I can see how this could be true as on the road that you can see when you take the north exit of your farm are tire tracks going into the fence, and a bit of the fence is broken. This could be where the accident was that took Mona’s life.

[@skarlettsapphire4065]

this series is real entertaining. thanks for showing us more about the trash gremlin no one's pushed into the river yet :)

[@Leapalot]

Key word being yet!

[@CuppoJoe_]

Funny thing is, the bus might not even be broken. If you use a desert totem and then use the bus to get back home, you will drive the bus yourself.

[@aliencreative9360]

your content is wildly chaotic i love

[@jaketheconfusedlad6845]

just wanna say you did a great job on the video :D!!

[@Leapalot]

Hey thank you!

[@Doodbabs]

I super appreciate your intro for being so thorough about trigger warnings not a lot of channels even bother to place a warning so thank you for going beyond the expectation 😊

[@Leapalot]

You bet! This one was kind of nasty for some people, so I wanted to be sure people knew what was up. :)

[@aheadsounds2522]

The bus theory is probably not true because Pam works at the bus then goes to the saloon

[@matthewtalbot-paine7977]

A heart event could be taken 2 ways although I believe doctors would call that a cardiac event.

[@neiltheblaze]

One of my favorite things to do is give Pam a pale ale as she stands waiting at the bus stop in the morning. "Top of the morning Pam!"

[@mal3068]

i think that pam's struggles are why i'm so attached to her. she's not a great mother, nor a great friend. she regrets a lot about her past. she struggles with alcohol- i do too. even though she's not a terribly good person, i still care about her more than most of the marriage candidates. i just wish that she could get the recovery and healing she deserves, and that she and penny could actually talk through and acknowledge the trauma pam has no doubt caused penny.

[@alexartemisia]

On that zoom in of Gus, I just noticed that his overshirt has eggplants all over it xD

[@candelaportalea5377]

I'm watching this kinda in tears, I almost became a drug addict because I wanted to be more happy with my friends and boyfriend, I don't know if I was smart or lucky but didn't pursue that life, but my friends and now ex did. I'm still recovering from the problems that life gave me, it hurted more loosing the people that the substance abuse. I know I'm better off without them, but I remember when there where no drugs in anyone's life, and now the last I heard is that they keep doing drugs and even one of them dreams to become the next Pablo Escobar. I used this space to vent more than anything, but if somone sees it, there is a better life ahead, and if you need to do drugs to be fun and likeable you are with the wring people, no matter if they didn't do drugs before. Thanks for the video, it made me think a lot

[@anne5182]

Shane literally never changes he’s my husband and he still drinks so ???? I don’t understand his arc

[@ThePrimeMinisterOfTheBlock]

Marriage won't fix alcoholism, maybe

[@pinkiichi]

Marriage does a hard reset on a lot of the characters arcs. I don't know why they did it but it's not just a Shane issue

[@Leapalot]

His arc is better if you don't marry I think. I feel like marriage makes a lot of the NPCs lose/change their personality.

[@marykateharmon]

I could agree to that with Shane. With Sebastian and Penny though, I think it works since they're getting out of an environment they feel trapped in and finally getting a situation they're happy in, so they start warming in ways they couldn't before. I've only really experienced this with Sebastian, but I imagine it wouldn't be that different with Penny (save that with Sebastian, you always get the bonus of having a spouse that is more often than not always home with his work and so is able to watch the kids while you're out galivanting around). I think in general though, it would help the game if there was more things that could be done with your chosen spouse that would help differentiate the experience of marrying them from the others. For instance, Sebastian is among the spouses that suggests the slime hatch. I got it for him, but then he never helps with it. If he would while other spouses helped on other projects on the farm that they suggested to the farmer, then it would give some variety and fleshing out to the spouses post marriage. Also would be good if there were scenes and more interactions between the spouses and the children. And that the farmer could choose to do stuff with their spouse sometimes like play pool with Sam, Abigail, or Sebastian or do more band things with Sam or help Penny with more field trips for the kids or Exercise with Alex or take Abigail or Sebastian with you while mining or directly spar with Abigail or Sebastian or have more sessions of the in world's D&D with Sebastian or take a motorcycle drive with Sebastian sometime while having a friend watch the kids. (Look, I really like Sebastian, okay.) Just, more stuff to do with the spouse post marriage that makes it actually seem like they're still who you married while taking advantage of the fact that you're married.

[@ZatannaZataraGrayson]

He changes on his own before marriage but then starts drinking again after you marry him, it's so weird. He always has a beer before bed and I'm just ??? I thought you were hitting Joja Cola instead. Granted, an alcoholic in recovery can still have a drink every now and then without relapsing, but a hard drink every night before bed is counterintuitive. It's just terrible writing honestly.

[@dragonalpaca3530]

Stardew valley doesnt need a farmer, it needs a therapist /hj /lh

[@hawkticus_history_corner]

I know it's a common theory that Pam was drinking when she crashed the bus, but I would like to propose another idea: Pam didn't start drinking until after she lost her job. So her husband left her and her daughter, saying he was 'trapped' here. We don't know what that means, we don't have any other context, we just know he left. So Pam is still in town with Penny and her job, a job she seems to like, or at least likes having. Then the bus breaks. No idea what it is, let's say the transmission gives out. It breaks and busts something else when it does. No one's fault, it just happens. Problem, it's the town's bus, as it just goes to the desert, so it's the town's problem. Except the town can't afford to basically put in a new engine. So Pam is now out of a job. Pam, no husband and jobless, can't take it anymore and starts to drink. She probably drank a bit before this, I doubt she was a lightweight, but she was probably a more social drinker. Go to the bar, have a beer or two after work kind of thing. Except now she's drinking a lot. And it just keeps getting worse. This goes on for years (or however long the bus has been broken) until we show up and start to get things fixed.

[@cobaltprime9467]

So I marry Penny, Pam is my mother-in-law and I built her a house. I told her she was my “mom.” I do like Pam, I always buy her a beer, even if Penny would be mad if she knew lol.

[@viyudobra9628]

Pam having an accident actually make sense if u think about the wheels marks at the west were the bus is

[@Leapalot]

Probably just hit a fence or something though...right?

[@Saphira1198]

I got a geart event with Gus today, that involves Pam. It only triggers, if you have at least four hearts with Pam also. The scene: You come in the bar and find Gus distraught. The costs are to high and the income to low. Pam especially is a problem, since she drinks and never pays. Gus doesn't want to pressure her because he sees her as a friend. Pam comes in. Gus seems a bit afraid (?) and doesn't mention the topic. You tell her about the situation. She feels guilty but also angry. She pays her debt immediately. That means, that she had the necessary money all along and just exploited Gus' good will.

[@em6644]

I just assumed that she had the money set aside for something like a drs appointment or bills, but then payed Gus with it and had to make the money for the other thing by selling something. Idk though!

[@ace_trainerriley8713]

I recall hearing somewhere that Pam was one of the options on who the sixth female marriage candidate would be in a Twitter poll CA posted back in 2016. I can’t help but wonder how different Pam’s development would be if she won that poll! Regardless, like most of the comments I don’t believe Pam ended up killing someone, however the rest of the theory sounds good to me! Great video as usual

[@Leapalot]

I think that would have made a huge difference in her story! Could have been really neat.

[@catdust]

team Abigale member here, i always felt bad for penny, not too the point of romancing her but maybe i'm just shallow for wanting a goth wife. i like that the devs included the option of just building pam/penny a new house, pam sucks no way around it, but nobody should live like that

[@Meltorizor]

Although many good points are made in this and other videos about the different character's... well, character, their behaviour , flaws and "missing" story arcs, we should not forget that this whole game, including the story writing and character development, is done by a single guy. There are many comments going like: "Why don't we have that? Why isn't there this? Why does XYZ not exist?" etc. There is just so much you can do. I'm pretty sure ConcernedApe is well aware of these issues (and maybe even having anxiety about it not having the perfect, complete game 😔). And still, you can only do so much.

[@xenxander]

I'm an alcoholic but even I don't' stoop to Pam's level...

[@Rabbitzan]

Both of my parents were alcoholics but at least one good thing came out of their messed up relationship, me. I do my best to avoid things they obviously couldn't, because I didn't like how they acted or treated me so I don't make the same mistakes. I also want to up my mother especially as I was the reason she "had" to quit school. I personally don't think she had to do that but rather used me as an excuse to get out of finishing high school but whet do I know..

[@Leapalot]

Hey there! Hope you can break the cycle if you choose to have a family! Or, if not, I hope you can do your best for your own wellbeing and prove that you're more than the sume of their struggles!

[@Rabbitzan]

@@Leapalot I am giving my all to break the cycle for sure. Love your videos by the way am currently binge watching the series you did on every villager. xD

[@CathyDotUK]

I watch stardew videos to have a chill walk home and now I have this to watch instead

[@aetherius6221]

Vehicular Pamslaughter

[@L44tsmasher735]

Pam already feels guilty about how she treats penny, I doubt she would've killed anyone and let herself walk. Besides, it's CLEARLY a different bus in the beginning, I mean the door in on the opposite side! ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) In all reality about the bus though, there's more than 1 person on, and the driver is someone who doesn't live in the valley. So I don't believe it's the same bus that's at the bus stop.

[@Leapalot]

You got me on that door. Absolutely bamboozled. Dang it!

[@victoriawhitcomb6475]

Yeah, my family has it's own drunkard but the most terrifying part is that he drives better drunk. If he drives sober then you would swear on your life he was sh*tfaced but when he's drunk you would think he's driving sober. It's honestly pretty scary.

[@FernandoRafaelNogueiraReis]

I respectfully disagree with the theory this time (while your Wizard theory was also bonkers, I find that one fun) but still enjoy the time you spent to give such lovely content. Kudos.

[@Leapalot]

Hey that's fair! Thanks for taking the time to check it out and drop a comment anyway!

[@CarnivorousConnor]

I also suffer from addiction. Those things are: Sprite Zero Gaming Sleeping And being an endless buffet to mosquitoes I really don’t see it ever affecting my life in a negative way.

[@Leapalot]

Can I introduce you to West Nile?

[@CarnivorousConnor]

@@Leapalot The virus?

[@Leapalot]

@@CarnivorousConnor Yeah! I mean. You said you were an endless buffet for mosquitoes!

[@CarnivorousConnor]

@@Leapalot Nah fam I’m good. And what I meant by “endless buffet to mosquitoes” is that I get bit a lot, often during summer. If I ever go to Florida during summer, don’t expect me To make it out alive.

[@aprilhelm518]

Well, A) I don't really have good experience with alcoholism, and I don't drink myself, but B) I like to think that just because Pam is at the Saloon until midnight doesn't mean that she's still intoxicated by the time she arrives at work the next day, which is all the way at 10 AM, 10 hours (almost half a day) later. I think she has anger management issues, and part of why she probably drinks as much as she does is depression. Although I don't assume that people have to be at Shane level of suicidal to be depressed to the point that it's causing issues, like aggravated substance abuse and emotional issues.

[@Leapalot]

Fun fact! Depending on the quantity consumed and the capability of one's body to process alcohol, they might actually still be legally drunk as late as the next evening. The longer you drink heavily and damage your liver, the longer it takes to process the alcohol. Lots of other factors too though. Hard agree though that the drinking might be a symptom of other issues too.

[@aprilhelm518]

@@Leapalot That's good to know. Personally, I just think Pam is okay, and I don't get why so many fans have such an averse reaction to her (and also Clint -- I don't get anyone who is anti-Clint) and yet characters like Shane are fan favorites.

[@jasondphoenix]

"Minor 1.5 spoilers" Me :"it's fine...as a mobile player, this is the only way I can experience 1.5..."

[@Leapalot]

😭

[@yomandinga]

I just always assumed it was a different bus you arrive on. :-D

[@Leapalot]

It almost certainly is tbh.

[@Rose_Haw]

The most biggest problem I could find in this was that the bus is broken. But idk about the second bus..

[@lesewing]

Pam probably escaped out of one of those strange capsules when the players grandfather ran the farm.

[@Leapalot]

🤣

[@TheRealHedgehogSonic]

I would've guessed that in your hot take, Lewis would've just refused to "repair" the bus, since he must know Pam is drunk most of the time.

[@MelaKenzu]

Honestly, Pam reminds me so much of the mother I cut off, I almost always marry Penny to get her away from that environment.

[@Leapalot]

Yeah I think this one might hit some people a little too close to home..

[@syd6800]

i like ur videos bc u and me have the same reading speed it’s painful when i finish reading and it doesn’t move on for like 3 seconds Every Time

[@syd6800]

also cuz ur videos are great lol!!! just an added bonus

[@l.z.6553]

excellent video as always :)

[@Leapalot]

Thank you! 😁

[@UshioKiss]

I doubt the bus has an ignition interlock. why would they do that when they could just get a new driver. its not like she owns the bus.

[@Leapalot]

Like who? Maybe Kent in year 2+? 🤔

[@vanessawalker6666]

This is my 2nd time playing through Stardew and I just can't help but befriend Pam. Idk if I feel bad for her but she's always cheery despite her situation and isn't too hard to please gift wise. I get beer and give it to her before going to the desert lol

[@Alex_Barbosa]

Alcohol is just bad in general and needs to be regulated like the hard drug it is.

[@Avarstia_Owain]

Honestly of the original marrige candidates, I will always think we got some of the poorer choices. Emily vs Pam, Marnie, and Sandy, and don't get me started on the male candidates. Personally Pam and Sandy are the two I think would work best, but I lean more toward Sandy due to the Pam idea of trying to improve via Yoba, because she acknowledges the issue and attempting to fix it, if she was marrigable, I think there would have been an alternate story but one that would have been as lackluster as the Emily scenes or the Shane scenes at events 10 and 14. Ngl I would love a heart scene/general scene expansion for a lot of the NPCs to learn more about them or give them more dives into who they are.

[@JoshuaRWorkman]

Assuming this was all true, I don't see why Mona couldn't have been an adventurer who died in a drunk driving accident. We see evidence of one, skid marks on the road pointing towards the fence, doesn't take much to imagine what happened there or who was behind the wheel, but was it bad enough to have killed somebody? If so, what might have been a mostly routine trip to the desert took a tragic turn, and if at least one person did die in that accident, then there's no saying the bus wasn't damaged so badly it wouldn't run until either the junimos or Joja fixed it. But this is all speculation, isn't it? Yes, there is evidence of a vehicle accident of some sort, Pam is an alcoholic, a woman named Mona is no longer alive who knows how long before our farmers arrived in the valley, but does it really all point to a drunk driver accidentally killing someone while on the job? We know winter comes in full force to the valley and taking into consideration real life road conditions in cold, snowy winters, it's not much of a stretch of the imagination to assume there might have been black ice which caused an accident there. Now granted, a drunk driver on icy roads is a tragedy waiting to happen, but even if Pam was sober at the time or is a high functioning alcoholic, can we really blame her for Mona's death when anybody driving a car or bus could have slid out of control on possible black ice in the winter, took out the fence, and collided with a tree or the elevation behind the fence? We can't even say definitively if Mona was on the bus or in a car that crashed into at minimum that particular section of fence, or when the accident happened in the first place.