Paper Marbling 101 - Methocel vs Carrageenan

[@adambarker3130]

Lambda carrageenan forms a gel with alum, which I believe is a key part of sticking the paint to the paper. I'm not sure that methocel does that, in which case you are just relying on its intrinsic stickiness.

[@pretty7545]

Pigments stick to alum. Acrylic sticks to paper anyway. You can literally marble over water on to untreated computer paper using acrylics.

[@hvitis]

@@pretty7545 do you know what is the difference between Carboxymethylocelulose and Methylocelulose?

[@pretty7545]

@@hvitis I may be wrong on this but to my knowledge there is a technical meaning of these terms by which they are synonymous, or one is short for the other. However various related products are sold under these names somewhat arbitrarily, which differ in their chemical composition, purity, refinement, etc, so that if you are looking for the stuff that is ideal as acrylic marbling size, in my experience your options are either to trust a reputable supplier (eg Talas or an ebru artist) or experiment. Btw guar gum makes a fine size for acrylic marbling, although it is slightly colored and spoils faster than mc, and it's available in most grocery stores if that's a convenience. Xanthan gum can also be used but its tendency to stretch and rebound means you have to thin it out considerably, possibly beyond what's practical, or otherwise simply accept that influence on your designs. Btw anyone trying these out this time of year should bear in mind none of them work well when cold.

[@ArrowlessU]

I’ve tried guar gum and it works well, it takes practice though to get the right consistency.

[@cynthiaschleusner6680]

Hey could you tell me what ratio you used to mix guar gum? In my country I don’t find carrageenan or methocel😣

[@shrutiagarwal9667]

Thank you sir for such a valuable information but would also love to know which colour is best for marbelling on fabric

[@Hendeesh]

Have just tried marbling for the first time EVER with natrosol (was too impatient to wait for the lambda to arrive) it worked surprisingly well!! Worth a look at messysupplies for lots of different grades of MC and HEC. Thanks for your videos mate they've been a great help!! X

[@ThisDesignedThat]

Great tip!

[@leonisasuareza.2571]

What ratio you used of natrosol? Thanks

[@Hendeesh]

@@leonisasuareza.2571 can't remember exactly but i know I used de-ionised to make it and probably used around 10-15g of powder per litre. Different grades of natrosol will be thicker than others. The stuff i used i think was the 250 "standard" grade. It wants to be thicker than water (obvs!) but not a full gel. Experiment! Good luck! Have fun!

[@susanmessenger9052]

Temperature affects the methocel as well. Please weigh your materials and water using scales. If you work more exactly then solving problems could be easier. Marbling is complex set of factors. Results are brilliant 4 years on. Do give it a try. People have run with the methocel and are getting the results with exact measuring and leaving it for a day to fully hydrate and testing their paints and inks. Good luck.

[@Merlin_Price]

Hi there, I am looking to do large form backgrounds using some of the suggestions i've found in yr videos(thank you btw they are very informative) Would you be able to tell me whether the dried product is still workable in terms of layering more images over the top?.. or does it need to be fixed in order not to blur or smudge?

[@Marbled-Arts]

The CMC is toooo solid! Add more water!

[@joeymaloey9915]

Where do I find lambda carrageenan? Only supplier I found was someone in USA from Etsy, otherwise I couldnt find any other suppliers. Any tips?

[@ThisDesignedThat]

Yep i was looking on etsy too. Probably the same supplier we come across. Its not a widely sold product so just get from wherever you can

[@joeymaloey9915]

@@ThisDesignedThat Thank you for your answer!

[@pamgrangergale3046]

Prochemical and Dye is my supplier for methyl cellulose

[@gdb1944]

Hi! have you ever tried wallpaper paste powder (e.g. Solvite / Polycel)?

[@ThisDesignedThat]

Not yet! But thats a good idea

[@gdb1944]

@@ThisDesignedThat Looking forward to the answer! I have a lot of left over Solvite packets. Solvite and Polycel are types of modified starch, while others e.g. Auro are methyl cellulose.

[@bambangpeaxie2302]

Hi, how long will the Methocel liquid last?

[@ThisDesignedThat]

Not sure

[@stampenrangers]

Did you treat the paper surface with alum before marbling?

[@ThisDesignedThat]

No as I wanted to do a straight comparison with the carrageenan which didn't use any alum. In a future test I will see if it makes a difference

[@lisajarvis3820]

It didn’t work right ~ cause you didn’t mix it right

[@ThisDesignedThat]

care to share how it should be done then?

[@DASBookbinding]

@@ThisDesignedThat Because of the strange solubility properties of MC I mix it in hot water and let it cool while stirring. I'm sure this is published in the conservation literature somewhere but I can't find it right now.

[@missggdotcom]

I also read that ammonia needs to be added to the MC solution.