Why do I hate Sonic Heroes so much...?

[@akiraeatsguitarpicks491]

I want to beat sonic with a hammer.

[@officialpoppyperson]

me too

[@yeoldeseawitch]

preferably amy's hammer

[@Verminangel]

Hammer is not enough I need to put him in a hydraulic press

[@akiraeatsguitarpicks491]

@@KKHell I only want to beat sonic. And the bat, I don’t like the bat

[@cringlord1920]

​@@akiraeatsguitarpicks491Isn't that... Animal cruelty?

[@BlakeAtStake]

ACTUALLY you don't need the chaos emeralds for each team. just collect them all with team rose and it still counts 👍👍👍

[@DataDrain02]

It's true. However... doesn't change the fact the emerald stages are awful. You don't have to do all 7 4 times each. But, playing them once is bad enough alone. ...At least Metal Madness and Metal Overlord WERE kinda cool, though....

[@Nierez]

@@DataDrain02 The trick is letting the boost button pressed. Instead of mashing it like the UI leads you to believe. Also, use Big because the spread of power formation makes it easier to pick the balloons.

[@amazingboi9388]

@@DataDrain02 man the special stages are just fine

[@mrmelonman2893]

​@DataDrain02 The special stages are easy asf just get good

[@Flare8295]

Or Team Sonic because they're the fastest team in the game

[@saturnmunchies]

I grew up despising Sonic Heroes, always saying I felt it was worse than '06. The slippery controls and janky level design always made it a chore to play. But recently I tried the PC port of it and installed some mods and honestly??? I kinda fell in love. There's one in particular called the "Complete Physics Preset & Stage Fix Combo-Patch" that adjusts the physics and fixes the stages and it is GAME CHANGING. Of course, I don't think it's fair to say it's a good game if you need to install mods to fix it, but I've been able to appreciate it for once and it's been nice! Sadly getting the PC port running and installing mods is a huge chore, so hopefully we get a Steam release sometime.

[@jazzminrice]

I feel your critiques of the game are so valid even as someone who loved almost everything Sonic growing up I knew most of the games were janky and unpolished especially Heroes but smooth child brain me was just so happy to play with all these new characters and the worlds and music that it made me look past every flaw

[@charlesmichael190]

I like hearing your perspective about this game, especially from the point of view in which this is the first game you were able to think critically about. I agree.

[@thepuzzlemaster64]

To me Sonic Heroes is one of those games I really want to love since I actually dig the mechanics. There's a lot of little sections in these levels that have hidden little shortcuts if you know where to look for them; especially in team Dark's levels. Though, there's a few that I wish were shortcuts like in the second zone there's a few robots neatly stacked in a staircase fashion, and no matter how many times I try I still cannot reach the top and skip hitting the switch. It's just unfortunate under that treasure is a shit ton of jank that you need to get used to. The rail switching randomly not working, jumps spitting you out both with too much speed and not enough speed, Sonic slipping off edges, some of the bigger enemies having a crappy hitbox, the pinball physics, most of the bosses not really having a better strategy apart from "mash A with Sonic" (legit tried so hard not to use that move to find better ways to hurt the bosses, but none of the other characters can reach the bloody thing), and so many other little problems. Adventure 1 & 2 have a similar situation, but where as those games have a pile of jank that almost anyone can get used to, Heroes is buried under a mountain of jank, and it really gets hard to try and like this game because it almost never works properly. And this is coming from someone who has no nostalgia for these games, I played all of these 3D Sonic games in my late teens and 20s, so this is some fresh unbiased opinions.

[@Liboo52]

I remember around the time it came out I read in one of those Guinness World Records Video Game Editions that Sonic Heroes had the most playable characters in a platformer, and I felt proud that Sonic, my favorite game series at the time, held that distinction

[@TJHelm]

Everyone knows There's one thing unapologetically banger about this game... What goes up must come down Yet my feet don't touch the ground See the world spinning upside down A mighty crash without a sound I can feel your every rage Step aside, I'll turn the page Breaking through your crazy maze Like a laser beam, my eyes on you Watch me rule the night away Watch me save the day Feel my storm is getting close Headed your way Sonic heroes, Sonic heroes Bind you, confine you Defying your reign Sonic heroes, Sonic heroes Setting the stage For a heroes parade I won't even hesitate A second left to alter fate And you try to strike but a bit too late I got you hooked by my own bait Watch me rule the night away Watch me save the day Feel my storm is getting close Headed your way Sonic heroes, Sonic heroes Bind you, confine you Defying your reign Sonic heroes, Sonic heroes Setting the stage For a heroes parade You can bet there ain't no doubt As the words spill from the mouth Of a hero I can chase another day Fight you all the way Like a hero And together we stand tall No matter how No one can bring us down Sonic heroes, Sonic heroes Bind you, confine you Defying your reign Sonic heroes, Sonic heroes Setting the stage For a heroes parade Sonic heroes Sonic heroes Give us a reason And we're on our way

[@robertlupa8273]

Correction: there's two. LET ME SHOOOW YOOUU JUST WHAT! I'M! MAAADE OOOF!

[@paperdawn]

ya know I was gonna make a point in my video that my hatred is so firey for this game that even the crush 40 theme song misses for me. But upon relistening to it... it's pretty good. yeah.

[@orangeslash1667]

@@paperdawn Taksahi Iizuka did not want to make a sequel to Sonic Adventure 2 (2001), as he worried it would only appeal to Sonic fans. Interested in returning to gameplay similar to the Genesis games, Sonic Team decided to design Sonic Heroes so casual players not familiar with Sonic could adapt. Sonic Team had to use the Renderware engine to port Heros to multiple consoles, but it's not as powerful as the Adventure engine.

[@Skoufidios]

I WANT to try and like this game but man is it a hell of a hard task to do when you're presented with the game itself: Is it unplayable? No. But man is it a chore sometimes. - You slip and slide all over the goddamn place due to jacked momentum physics that get delayed by input lag - Team Dark's levels are absurdly long and feel like enemy spammers most of the time - Team Chaotix's missions are all equally as uninteresting and forced. - And the special stages can outright kiss my ass sometimes. Not to sound pessimistic, but did anyone else notice that the story barely makes any sense at all? For Team Sonic is fine, just your typical "Go stop Eggman" plot. But the other teams...? Team Dark's motive is... Treasure? Finding out about Shadow's past? Rouge just kinda forces it all together! All Team Rose wants are their pets back, with Amy simping over Sonic as usual, when it comes to the early 2000's era of Sonic games, and Team Chaotix... Is just shoved in... To pay the rent. Ugh. If I had the chance to fix some of this game's problems, it would be: - Keep the physics exactly the same as the ones from SA2 - Make the levels shorter, at LEAST 5 to 6 minutes MAX - And make the special stages not a janky eye sore. Genuinely shocked at how Generations 3DS managed to fix and imorove upon them. Overall, yeah. I don't like this game, but it's definitely not the worst Sonic game out there. It's CERTAINLY NOT the best, or the "GOAT", if you will...

[@ayrtonjoga]

Team Dark's motivation is simple, Shadow is trying to discover his past, Rouge wants to find Eggman's treasure, and Omega wants a revenge of Eggman for locking him up They all want something from Eggman, so why don't they just team together against the odds, right?

[@ledkicker2392]

14:05 annoying, but did anyone already mention you can charge team blast by punching the air, and using it brings all the team back?

[@VanoverWomack]

When Sonic Heroes first released when I was a kid I hated it. Controls were messy, it felt so draining to go through it four times with each team (especially Team Chaotix), levels starting drag on late game, getting chaos emeralds felt impossible with awful controls in special stages, multiplayer wasn't as fun as adventure 2, and was a pain to even unlock more of it. Like I FEEL like I can appreciate it more nowadays, some level designs in the main game, the extra play styles, it's implementing elements from classic Sonic things like Acts and Zone progression at the core of it's presentation. But with how sloppy a lot of it feels in execution, even I know how to muscle memory around the games issues, it feels weird that I have to play around the janky stuff in the first place and that still sours it.

[@MilesReset]

This is actually one of my favorite 3D Sonic games, but I know it has its problems and all that janky

[@calzonecave]

as someone unblinded by nostalgia who went and played 06, Shadow and Heroes back to back this year I legitimately believe Heroes is the worst game of the three. The gunplay and managing the chaos meters in Shadow is a ton of fun and while 06 is definitely as bad as people say I still had more fun with it than Heroes (and suffered less unfair deaths as a result of jank)

[@Hewasnumber1]

I didn’t think ‘06 was as bad as people say, and Shadow is my favorite Sonic game of all time. ‘06 had really great level design, music and story (Silver became my second favorite Sonic character so fast it’s unreal), and the bugs weren’t that bad to me. The game definitely felt unfinished, but unplayable? Nah, most of the bugs require you to actively poke and prod at the unfinished corners of the game when there’s no real reason to do so. The loading screens, too, weren’t unbearable-though I installed the game on my Xbox 360, which is apparently the best possible setup for shortening load times without emulation. I don’t know, maybe it’s just the fact that I’m coming at it from a modern perspective, and modern video game releases are even more buggy, unfinished messes, and even the fantastic and well made games have unbearable load times. So maybe I’m just more accustomed to jank like it than people were back in ‘06. And as for Shadow, it’s a legitimately fantastic game. I’ve scarcely seen a genuine complaint of the game that wasn’t either an obvious skill issue or a bad-faith argument that’s made with very little knowledge of the actual game-usually being a parroting of other’s opinions with no experience playing the game themselves. Outside of the PS2 port, the game has ONE consistent bug that ceases to be an issue once you know it’s there. Everything else about the game is a complete package of near endless replay-ability. The story is frequently misunderstood, and people love to take scenes out of context to paint it in as bad a light as possible, and fail to understand the surprising nuance in the game’s storytelling-especially considering how it’s formatted; the gameplay is fantastic, and people are quick to shun the game when they don’t immediately adjust to the different gameplay priorities the game set; the soundtrack is written off as edgy and forgettable even though each level has banger after banger; the mission system is unfairly hated despite it being the perfection with the missions structure they’ve been dabbling with since all the way back in Adventure 1. People run around like headless chickens, ignore tutorials that speed up the process of completing the levels and fail to understand that the game prioritizes memorizing the levels and getting better at navigating them on repeat attempts. I don’t get the hate for Shadow, and as you can probably tell, I take to defending the game at the drop of a hat. Genuinely fantastic game that is more than due for a resurgence in popularity within the community.

[@ellagage1256]

Honestly I probably would have been in the same boat as you if I didn't grow up with a PS2 and played the Adventure games. Sonic Heroes was my introduction to the 3D games and that along with Shadow, Riders and Unleashed really set in the stone the idea that modern Sonic games were just very experimental.

[@Maniac4Bricks]

3:29 no lie, I think this is the Demo I've played at my local Kmart as a kid. I've been trying to research it for the past year, and I knew it had Paper Mario on it. Thank-you!

[@Safer_02]

I first played Sonic Generation and I wanted to play all of the Sonic stage from their original games. Yes I even wanted to play Sonic 06. This year I finally played Sonic Heroes and I was disappointed of how the game feels. Sonic 06 feels more satisfying to play than Sonic heroes and idk why. Lmao

[@jayzz.x]

Sonic Heroes was my FIRST ever sonic game. Little me loved it so much, though now I notice the flaws. I mean A LOT of flaws. Even so, I enjoy the game so much due to nostalgic, and I have a good time. Nobody asked but yeah.

[@Diwasho]

If you hated the GameCube version consider yourself lucky you didn't have to suffer through the PS2 port with all the same issues exacerbated even more. This game was Sonic 06 before Sonic 06, I've seen so many people defend it and ignore my criticisms of it just because I played the inferior PS2 version instead of the substantially better GC or Xbox ones, but not even those were good evidently. Also yeah, the first zone has been historically the best zone in ANY Sonic game. This is Sonic Team's approach to game design even in non-Sonic games where they invest a lot of resources and polish into the first level to leave the best first impressions on the player but then it's a downhill from there. Whenever I play PSO I always spend most of my time grinding in the first forest area, that place was a visual marvel for its time, not unlike City Escape.

[@asciiangel7583]

i can definitely understand the frustration. i luv heroes probably bc of nostalgia, but it’s like a more upbeat and surreal sonic adventure. the huge stages and multiple characters rly make it feel like you’re going on a grand adventure, more so that the SA games imo. i get frustrated and die too but it’s still like my cozy junk food game. i also like that it’s not so try hard like SA, i don’t feel as much pressure to perfectly execute tricks or have a perfect time, im just trying to beat this giant level and not die lol, i don’t feel bad for not doing it in a cool way and get skill points or whatever lol

[@Marphic_]

Had this game on PS2 when it first came out, and I shared many certified Sonic Heroes moments as a kid that involved unfair deaths/hits from enemies plus a horrible camera bug that put me in first person view when I would stop moving my character. From a retrospective I admire the core design of the game for its take on the team-based gameplay, but general game physics and level design held it back from being as enjoyable as it could be. Also as a kid before learning how to use the internet I had no idea how to play the secondary missions for each level until months later. This game had lots of potential, if only it had more time for development :(

[@Namingway248]

cons: the game pros: "Look at all those eggman's robots!"

[@Nyaalexi]

I personally enjoyed the game, but I will agree it has a lot of jank.

[@robdoggy]

I still have the (extremely faded and hard to read) eb games receipt of my copy of sonic heroes left in the case from 09/09/2005. I played it a lot with my older siblings and had a lotta good memories but it’s definitely got some outright broken levels and control that make it hard to go back to nowadays haha

[@Ocsttiac]

14:07 lol yeah, I remember watching that happen in call Sonic Heroes is more of a nostalgia game for me. It's not a huge part of my childhood, but not an insignificant amount either. My bias is also probably enforced by the fact it's the only 3D Sonic game I've played.

[@MysticClaws100]

14:07 isn't necessarily a mistake. It's always possible to proceed without a member by spamming attacks to build up the Team Blast gauge to bring your member back if you need them. Of course even if it isn't technically a mistake, it is going to stump people who don't realize that 1) using Team Blast gives you access to all 3 characters again or 2) you can build up your Team Blast meter even if there aren't enemies or objects around to kill/break and 3) your team blast meter is so low that it will take ages to build up, it's just such a huge pace breaker While I originally didn't think that much of the game when I first played it, especially compared to the Adventure games, after getting to know how it works, I really appreciate the freedom you have to use each character, even to do things that you wouldn't expect them to be able to do. Like, using a speed character to do platforming intended for Tails. Skipping fans using Tail's flight. Crossing large distances just by jumping as Tails from a high point to a low point. Skipping combat sections that are normally required by using Tails. Using Knuckles triangle glide to go a far distance by double tapping the A button after getting a lot of speed from rail grinding. In terms of alternate pathways and shortcuts, Heroes is one of the most open 3D Sonic's, only really comparable to SA1 and 06 in this regard (of course 06 is shit in pretty much every other gameplay department). The combat system is really fleshed out and while there is arguably too much combat required for a Sonic game, at least it has a functional combat system with 3 different characters who have their own strengths and weaknesses. In 06, they just throw wave after wave of enemies at you but there's not really many choices for combat. You just spam the homing attack button with Sonic/Shadow. None of the other attacks that Sonic has are all that useful, apart from the bounce attack which speeds things up against characters with multiple hits required. Silver's combat sucks too. The leveling up system in Heroes also really improves the experience in both combat sections and non-combat sections, increasing your strength, speed and platforming abilities Heroes is far from a perfect game. It's way too buggy, sliippery and reliant on certain level design like linear on-rail sections i.e. rail grinding, bobsleds, pinball sections, those flowers/hovercraft things, for me to consider it an absolute favourite of mine but there is so much enjoyment I get out of it, just like the Adventure games

[@kooljokez]

The rails part is the part I quit as a kid. I've seen let's plays recently and yes those parts are off.

[@Altefkatr]

I remember watching Sonic X and playing the hell out of the Sonic Heroes PC demo as a kid around 2004. It was pretty much my first experience with Sonic games and I absolutely loved it. About 9 years later in 2013, and a few games under my belt like Sonic World Adventure and Colors for the Wii, Secret Rings, Adventure, Riders, and some flash games, I had the occasion to finally play the full version of Sonic Heroes for the GameCube. And boy I hated it. The levels were too long, the game was tedious, having to play it four times AND collect all seven chaos emeralds to get the true ending was not something I looked forward to, the controls were way too slippery and the bosses I fought were... something. At least that's how I was feeling at the time and I just couldn't bring myself to finish it. I hated Sonic Heroes but it didn't make me hate the franchise or anything. I moved on and played other games. Oddly enough, I never put Sonic and Mario games in opposition in my mind. Maybe because I was too young, too much into J-RPGs or not American enough to care about the Mega Drive VS SNES "console war" thing (God I hate this term)? I see both series like I see, let's say Psychonauts and A Hat in Time I guess? Plus, the only mainline Mario games I played by 2013 were new Super Bros. Wii, SM64 DS and a bit of Super Mario Sunshine. Fast forward to 2022 and I decided to play all 15 3D Sonic games, from Adventure all the way to Forces, counting Shadow the Hedgehog, both 3D versions of World Adventure and both versions of Lost World before I bought Frontiers. Not necessarily in order since I started with Sonic Forces, beat Sonic Adventure next, Sonic Generations right after, and then I played Sonic Heroes, on PC with mods. The amount of nostalgia the intro made me feel was unreal! The soundtrack, without being one of my favorites is really cool (What I'm made of is an absolute banger). I even was able to replace the ugly shiny 3D models with better ones. Good stuff right there! I think the level design can be quite good and efficient. Knowing when to switch characters and who to switch to is satisfying while blasting through some levels. Seeside Hill and Ocean Palace are classics, I really enjoy Grand Metropolis and Power Plant, and Egg Fleet is by far my favorite level in the game. Unfortunalely I'm not huge on the other levels. Levels can be really long and tedious. To a point where Team Rose was my favorite team to play as. The level up mechanic was a thing I didn't care about that much. If I recall correctly, you get a level up orb for every fifth enemy, or every big enemy you destroy, but you won't get the orb for the character you killed said robot with. For instance, if you destroy a giant robot as Knuckles you'll either get a blue or yellow orb. That said, the negative points clearly outweigh the positives for me. I absolutely hate playing as Team Chaotix, some of the levels truly I don't like, none of the bosses are good, the physics are wonky and the level designs between each team as well as the game structure are way too similar for me not to get bored out of my mind sometimes. It got to a point where some switch flipped in my brain, unlocking the patience I didn't know I had, and now I don't care about long levels in Sonic games anymore, so that's my silver lining I suppose. I did collect every chaos emerald this time, and a perk of playing on PC is that the special stages control so much better than their console counterparts it's not even funny. Got most of them on my first attempt and so many lives I never got a Game Over once. And last point, I won't complain that much about the voice acting. To be honest I always played Sonic games with Japanese voices or in Japanese since I was a kid and I'm way to used to these voices. The Japanese voice acting in Heroes is good, first time Ryo Hirohashi voicing Tails in a Sonic game. I didn't like Cream's voice but it's more a issue I had with her voice per se rather than her voice acting. Overall, I don't hate Sonic Heroes like I used to and I'm glad I gave it a second chance, but no, I don't like this game.

[@Maniac4Bricks]

On my second watch, all I can say for now is, I get how it's frustrating and doesn't age well, even upon release it was buggy depending on the console (glad I grew up on Gamecube)

[@bloodybeesting775]

I feel that way about SA2.

[@cooljrgaming9729]

Same, SA2 simply disappointed me in every regard except plot and playable eggman

[@juarezamorim]

This was my first Sonic and I absolutely despised it. I did 100% since I had no other new game to play for a while, which made me dislike it even more.

[@freddy3715]

When playing through all of the sonic games I distinctly remember being insanely tired playing through heroes. I definitely feel like there’s way more I dislike about this one than say adventure 1 & 2, the controls and overall stability of the game really sour the whole thing which really sucks cause I love the music and how the levels look and everything. It was worth beating 100% once but I don’t think I could stomach doing it again.

[@Sweet_Clod]

Played it when i was like 5, didnt finish it, only remember dying on the canyon level and the casino level being funky and cool looking

[@AdventureAndySnM]

No one else online has been so close to my opinions on this game. When you're a kid and you get one game every 4 months (or longer for a lot of people I imagine) ending up with this game was devastating. Trying to get all "A" rank magnified all these issues enormously. Anyway, become a sonictuber!!

[@darkninjafirefox]

I got sonic heroes cause I thought it was sonic adventure 2 battle. Needless to say, I was disappointed and never got far

[@MrMisterMisterMr]

I think in my playthroughs I've only ever gotten through Team Sonic and Team Rose. Team Dark's stages are way too long and frustrating, and Team Chaotix is just a mess with its mission structure. In fact, Chaotix just sorta feels like a prototype of Shadow the Hedgehog's gameplay without the branching paths: "Find X items," "defeat X enemies," "Reach the end of the level sometimes". The game, I feel, is respectable for what it tries to do, but it fumbles almost every catch. Some zones like Seaside Hill, Hang Castle, and Final Fortress are awesome, but then, like, everything else is bad. Music is 100% bangers tho, no complaints on that front. Team Rose is the way to go, though. I feel the game is a really nice and fun length with them. They also serve as a great way to grind the Chaos Emeralds for the final story, not that I've ever actually reached it. Also, side note, SA2B is to this day my favorite completionist experience of any game. It's constantly rewarding, the mission structure adds a surprising amount of variety to the stages, and seeing those A ranks fill out on the map screen feels so good.

[@KBomi]

i have an weird attachment to this game, i always remember playing it with my friend as a child but at the same time i was scared of some levels skdks

[@Enthusiasm441]

God, our childhoods are so eerily similar. It's nice to watch someone who had all the same games I did at probably the same time. Anyway, this game pisses me off somethin fierce. I think i loved it as a kid, I remember never getting past Bullet Station. These days, the game makes me so mad; the controls, the levels, the special stage, the structure. I do not get why people love it at all. But I'm probably in the minority, i know a lot of people love this game, even if it's one of my least favorite games from my favorite game series. I will beat it one day! Fun fact: my parents once got me Heroes at a KMart or something and it was just another copy of Adventure 2: Battle. Still curious if it was an accident or it if was the first time I got trolled.

[@reddemon6668]

Personally love heroes because the mechanics are fun, most levels were a blast (with exception to pinball), and the jank at some point works for you if you give it time. For example: The bosses? Easily beat by flying type lvl 3 attacks in matters of seconds. (Flying types are OP at lvl 3 and people miss out on this). Focus on upgrading your. Flying type and let loose. Rail canyon? Don’t mash, hold down the rail grind button, you’ll go insanely fast, how fast? So fast you’ll skip scripted scenes and end up ahead of enemies meant to be faster than you. You can also use physics to launch you at high speeds or trust the fall, and skip whole chunks of this map. Forgot which act but on 1 of them you can skip a bunch of swirls and loops on the grind rail, end up on top of a train station roof, and run across it to the finish line . Special stages? Same, hold down the button don’t mash. Also team Amy for them because it’s easy. The stages are absolutely wild and feel like the old Sonic games. Characters level up based on the character type you use to cross a checkpoint. If you loose one character you can activate team blast to regain them all again.

[@biggarffan37]

As someone who recently started playing this game, I pretty much completely agree with everything you said in this video. At points (especially Rail Canyon) the game feels designed like a Mario Maker Troll Level

[@Flare8295]

Just FYI you can get the Chaos Emeralds with any time you want

[@djschannelyep3283]

Question to everyone whats your favorite team in sonic heroes? Mine is team rose there just so cute and wholesome and i think they worked very well together have like a sibling bond the way that amy encourages cream and big is so cute and big saying that he needs to be strong to protect them is so wholesome ans cream just being happy that there together is just so cute

[@Hewasnumber1]

I played exclusively Team Dark as a kid. Shadow will always be cooler than Sonic to me, and my sister claimed Team Rose on that save file anyways. Though as a side note, I think it’s kind of weird how Amy is the speed character for Team Rose. I mean, none of them are very fast, but Amy in all other playable appearances I’ve seen her in has been slow as molasses. Yet Sonic Heroes is the sole reason that the idea that she was fast was instilled in my child mind.

[@GamecubeGeek]

my story was a little different but ultimately the same: I saw sa2b as a kid and got very very interested in the chao garden so the next time I was allowed to pick a game to get I wanted sa2b but didn't know which game it was, so I accidentally picked sonic heroes instead. as a kid I was really disappointed at the lack of chao garden but now that I'm older I think it was a perfectly good introduction to all the characters in sonic at the time and it has a cheesy-charming quality that I just find endearing nowdays. A ranks and special stages are still kinda hard for me to swallow, though

[@raymilbelmont2521]

To say Sonic Heroes is rough around the edges is an understatement, I used to love this game to the point I 100% it, I did recently visit it, the game sucks, I’d can bring myself to play beyond Ocean Palace, and your criticism is totally valid, you were way ahead of the curve.

[@RaphaelDrewBoltman]

"a modding team making a Sonic Heroes fixed version" ...hi.

[@zaneb1319]

also your avatar is suuuuper cute and your crt setup makes me jealous. lol i feel like i need to mention that

[@reddemon6668]

If you actually take the time to learn how to use the jank you realize just how easily the game allows you to break it. The opening song at some point says “… my feet Don’t touch the ground” I took that as a motto when I was kid. I learned to trust the physics and the mechanics, I would deliberately jump off of platforms and end up in a whole different section of the game skipping battles or entire sections all together. Rail canyon, egg fleet, frog forest, and seaside hills were my favorite because of this, I would spend most of the time being launched into the air than actually running, chaining movements with the homing attack, light speed dash, or simply setting myself up for another jump. Egg fleet is the best of them all, starting in the sky, free falling down, I’d trust the game and dive whenever I’d see lower platforms, which was frequent, keeping the momentum and speed going. Slippery movement? lol who cares, so many people are scared of it, instead I give into it, know when to switch to whom for better stability or speed, depending on the situation that calls for it.

[@thesmstudios3223]

The part where you mentioned about the rebellious phases of just hating Sonic and Mario's better was one of those times where I never understood why people compared them. One's slow and the other is fast, heck I was one of the rare one's who said Mario Galaxy 1 & 2 were mid compared to previous games. It's kinda cool and interesting to hear that perspective of yours

[@AizakkuAnalysis]

I always felt good that I never owned heroes as a kid. All my friends had it but I was lucky enough to have Adventure 2 instead. Safe to say I got the much better game.

[@supermariof0521]

Those GameDude clips have REALLY not aged well.

[@enistoja]

the secret to the chaos emeralds was to run on the ceiling and ignore the pickups. which is ridiculous. The game is janky as all getout but gosh darn the soundtrack is aces

[@danyo5786]

Sonic Heroes is one of those games where I jut stop playing after awhile and it's hard to pick up. I beat Sonic Adventure in 2 days and pick up and put down the game multiple times in those two days and still come back regularly, while heroes first level took me like 8 minutes and I was worn out by the end the zone. Like the cutscenes though

[@hgarr]

Sonic Heroes... I've always hade a very Love/Hate relationship with this game. The music and visuals are some of the best in the series, It has the best voice performances from the Ryan Drummond era (except Tails), The levels take place in some absolutely stunning & unique locations, and the gameplay is really thrilling too. When it wants to work properly, that is. And not be a frustrating, janky, tedious mess of wonky collision & control, Russian Roulette rail switching, and tedious, mindless "puzzles" to open a door. I grew up with the PC port from Sonic PC collection, and I have no idea how I managed to beat the entire story mode (including Special Stages and Last Story) using only the Keyboard, but I did it somehow! If Sonic Heroes had more time in the oven to iron out bugs, and better level design, it would easily be one of my favourite Sonic games. I still love it, and find it very nostalgic, but unfortunately, as it is, I wouldn't recommend it to anybody who didn't grow up with it.

[@dummyringbomb]

yay vindication for also not liking this game! i had a lot of the same problems with it. though i do like the voice acting but i also just like annoying weird voice acting in games in general

[@SuperMetalyrics]

Almost Halfway through this: and I agree completely. Have no idea why this game was made at all in the first place

[@GoombaTroopa]

Sonic heroes is the best sonic game in my opinion

[@TheSuperthunderblade]

It took me a long time to collect the chaos emeralds, but boy was it satisfying to see the final story unravel as a kid. Metal Madness is one of my favorite end bosses from Sonic and What I'm Made of is peak Crush 40. I still love Sonic Heroes to this day even though it's very janky and it's very easy to see that it was rushed since development was really rough. I just got used to the controls and game feel over a long time of playing it (I got it for the PS2 which is also the worst version :D). Sonic Heroes really made me a fan of Sonic back in the day as it was my first 3D Sonic game and I'll always have a soft spot for it.

[@yomang6614]

I wish Sonic Heroes was my first Sonic game, then I wouldn't have become a fan in the first place and that would have saved me a lot of time and money, but unfortunately, as a GameCube kid, my first games just had to be Mega Collection and the Adventure games.

[@Millennialplayer97]

Geeze I just beat this game but over a week and a half because Sonic heroes almost made me go mentally insane!

[@GregCubed]

I agree with pretty much everything you said, even though I still like the game. For me the music and aesthetics are enough to make it a worthwhile experience to play, especially since (imo) the game isn't really bad, just kind of jank and mid. I don't return to it super often, but there's so much worse in the Sonic franchise than heroes and I think it's a fun filler game. The biggest issue to me is just how much of a downgrade it is from the Adventure games though. The story is basically non-existent for most of the game, there's no chao garden, the multiplayer is mid, controls are worse, the levels are too long, and it overall just feels like it was made to draw in new fans instead of catering to existing fans... which, well, is actually what the goal was since Sega went 3rd party. Heroes to me represents the last gasping breath of the franchise's golden age, the last game that really tapped into a lot of the things I liked about Sonic growing up before everything collapsed in on itself. There's been glimmers of promise since, sometimes with full games, sometimes nuggets within bad games, but it's never really been the same to me since Heroes.

[@ItsDanielPika]

Heroes is one of my least favorites. Sa2 is my favorite game so Heroes is already a massive drop. But I feel the quality is just such a downgrade. Not as bad as the drop from Unleashed to Colors, but this is very spot on to how I feel

[@UwURainUwU]

Honestly I went into this video really on the defensive, but like, if I paid $50 for Hero's I'd probably not remember it so fondly. 😂

[@Antonio-is2cn]

Has anyone noticed that the majority of people who hate Sonic Heroes only hate it because they try to play the game like Sonic Adventure 1+2?

[@charlottesweb5964]

To be honest, as a little sibling with ADHD, I borrowed my brother's games, played them for a while, and never finished any of them. I probably never even got to the stages you complained about. I was just enjoying the game for a while and forgetting they existed a week after. I might've finished the game with Amy in Babymode, other than that I got nothing. I think the first game I ever finished was a dog game where you fought a wolf with a hat and it had the simplest mechanics possible. I liked you're review though, I like watching people rage, even on the things I like.

[@charlottesweb5964]

It was called Dogz for the PS2. There was also a cat equivalent.

[@AwakeEthelwulf]

I played it all the way through with my dad just to know if I truly hated this game. I do. I get so much shit for hating this game, but it's true. Everything you said.

[@jamilzayas5808]

I've had that game since i was 8 and could _never_ get BINGO Highway's emerald. Somehow i had the patience to play all 4 campaigns (yes, even Team Chaotix) but the Special Stages were awful.

[@kylegetz4917]

I really want to like sonic heroes, but it’s just not very fun to play.

[@kylegetz4917]

I’ve since completed the whole game and now I think it can be pretty fun at times. I still replay some stages but I never want to do the whole thing again. Way too frustrating to get through the special stages, team chaotix as a whole, or some of the later team dark stages. Not to mention the awful metal sonic fights.

[@DataDrain02]

So... I kinda hate Sonic Heroes for a different reason. I liked the gameplay, stages, and music. (Also, Metal Sonic being the big bad.) But, the story is the WORST thing about it.... Like, it is such a huge step down from the Adventure games. Like, Sonic sees Shadow alive and well. After SA2, You'd think he'd have a bit more of a reaction, considering how distraught he was in SA2's ending. But nope, he's just like "wahey, you're full of surprises.... Now let's randomly fight!" Oh, and this was the WORST Amy has ever been in the series. "Marry me or I'll beat you senseless with my hammer!" I just... hate it for that reason. The plot hurt the series in the longrun. And started the flanderization of characters in the series. At the very least we eventually got Frontiers. The plot in that game is actually good. (I love the characterization especially.)

[@TheoNickz]

I agreed with practically everything you said I feel seen

[@Sage_the_Turt]

heroes is one of the most frustrating games I've ever tried to play. i had to force myself just to beat team sonic's story. i'd honestly rather play 06 cause at least that game is funny.

[@zaneb1319]

damn i love the ova watched it on acid, was a good time for all. my friend was weirdly into eggman

[@HyperSonic1999orJTH]

I definitely recall those BS moments as a kid on my PS2. I never despised the game, just found it really hard and frustrating at times when you keep dying in the middle or at the end of act 2 stages and then getting a game over. I only despise Team Dark's Robot Storm, fuck that energy draining slog of a boss. I did however get it bashed into me to always use the flight character in the janky segments of the game especially in rail cayon/bullet station for a safety net, exclusively hold up/down in automated sections don't keep the stick in neutral or move it around unless you want to die (this applies in every 3d sonic game to some extent), when falling, you hold or try to move your character away from the edge's direction to avoid dashing to your death and try to level up your characters equally at every chance to keep the pace of the game up, don't waste a free checkpoint level up on a character that's already level 2 or 3 when your other characters are stuck at level 0 or 1.

[@WanderingChord]

I think this game is such an interesting case. Compared to the immediately preceding games it's a catastrophic crash in quality. However compared to the games that would come after? It's like, fine. Inoffensive. The next SEVERAL games are such unconscionable disasters that Heroes ends up looking like "The Last Decent Sonic game for about a decade." (Altho, frankly, Shadow the Hedgehog is better) So, like, those of us who crash landed at Heroes AFTER the fantastic GCN Adventure remakes find this game to be disappointing trash. But for those that came into the franchise WITH Heroes and then had to suffer through the Sonic Dark Age after that? It's pretty easy to see how this game feels like a pinnacle point for those folks.

[@revilo1st]

Ive always felt the levels are just empty?

[@ClydeJHatbird]

Of all the issues, the special stages were the breaking point for me. The jank was too unforgivable. Second to that would be Tails' voice. Just his specifically. And I actually liked his SA1, "I wOnDeR wUt HaPpUn 2 SoNik" voice, deliveries and all. Finally, there's the baby story mode for babies. I don't mind a more light hearted story, especially after SA2, but yikes this was a downgrade. Like, this felt as if it was targeted at an even younger audience than the original genesis game. The story was so non existent, and when it did show up, the tone was so cringy and lame that I couldn't get invested...and then they had the gall to bring Shadow back and not give a proper dive into why or how. The game's only positive for me, after all these years, was introducing Seaside Hill. A glorious new aesthetic to fit in alongside Green Hill, without just, y'know, being Green Hill. It's a shame though that every time I see it, I'm immediately reminded of everything I hate about Heroes.

[@Blonder_Studio]

oh man im feel so bad for you after i heard your backstory with this game in this vid, geez talk about regrets yeah im on the same boat, i got into the Sonic franchise at 12 years old when a YTuber from my country made a review of the classic sonic games, but i never up until this day even bothered to finish Heroes, and i did play it on emulator but it is just so bad that its rage inducing, heck i emulated 06 and even played that shit on a real xbox 360 and i loved that shit more than heroes (same with shadow, like at least that and 06 i completed but heroes i never did because i just cant keep on with that game its just so much rage inducing) where does the love for that garbage game come from is one heck of a question?

[@SoLemerald]

I can tell who your favorite character is

[@InconspicuousBosch]

Sonic was my idol when I was a kid, I grew up with his Genesis games and graduated straight from the Genesis to the Gamecube. I'd spend hours playing the Sonic Adventure DX demo that came with the bundled disk. At my Mom's house my brother had a ps2 and we rented Sonic Heroes, and I remember being so disappointed by it. I thought there was something wrong with me; I was supposed to like Sonic, but the game was slow and messy and just not fun. I've never liked the game, glad I'm not the only one 😆

[@Celeste-ty5pb]

i do think a bad but interesting game is so much better than a milktoast game. the game that gave me your sonic heroes moment was new super mario bros 2 on the 3ds. was so excited for it, loved mario galaxy as a kid, enjoyed 3d land enough that i wanted new soup 2, then i. beat it in a day. aaaand i hated it. lol same song and dance as you with sonic heroes too, i was doing chores to make money to buy games and felt like i wasted it. turned that feeling around when, a few years later, i gave the game to a kid my sister was babysitting and he LOVED it. even uf new soup 2 is a bad game imo its for sure more polished than sonic heroes, so i didnt feel like i was giving the kid a bad time

[@davion4777]

Sonic Heroes is a game I really want to like, but the game itself does everything to be hated. I genuinely like the level design a lot in many cases, but the game is just filled with jank. Janky controls and janky camera are basically a given in most 3D Sonic games. I think Sonic Team was just not good enough. Many on rail sections were fundamentally broken, with your character just automatically falling to death because the automatic sequence didn’t properly happen if your character was like 1 inch away from the designated position. Game is absolutely full of jank like that. Or the atrocious “mine cart” sections that gave you a millisecond of time to make jumps that if missed would result in a loss of character or a death. Also Invincibility frames were so few you could almost be stunlocked by enemies. Good luck trying to retrieve your rings after a hit, you will be most likely be hit again in the process. Most of the game’s jank can be found all together in the boss Egg Emperor. He can even hit you while you’re stuck in “automatic” sections like springs, thus you can’t defend yourself and you’ll most likely fall in a bottomless pit and die. Game design is also flawed because the various team are absolutely not differentiated enough to justify 4 full playthroughs to unlock the last story. All characters play the same as Sonic, Tails and Knuckles, thus they are basically reskins. It’s shame because as I said, I really like the level design in many stages, the soundtrack is as great as always and I really like the colorful graphics. I think the game would benefit a lot from a full fledged (good) remake.

[@Jiggleslinky]

My only experience with Sonic games was playing the ever loving sh*t out of Adventure 2 as a kid but never really trying the other games. I think I played Shadow the Hedgehog once at a friend's house and hated it. I will say though that I never get tired of watching KZbinrs talk about Sonic.

[@yomang6614]

Early 2000s kids that say Sonic Heroes is the best clearly didn't have a GameCube at the time.

[@userfridaywiggly18943]

Opinions are opinions I love sonic heroes 😉

[@kirbyjinet302]

part of what i liked so much about sonic games was the completionist aspect. The horribly jank physics / colission made A ranks an absolute nightmare and thats not even mentioning the extra missions all being a drag and uninspired (seriously they were really REALLY tedious). What you learn early on in this game is to not fight the jank but just live with it so switching to flight near edges or basically anywhere which to me ruined the fun factor of the game. Maybe its beacuse i played sa2 way too much as a kid but the multiplayer aspect was terrible and a lack of any other content other than the main game really soured my perspective on it as a kid. looking at it as an adult its just okay it can get downright awful at times but its slightly made up for with the music and earlier stages not being complete shit shows.

[@Hey.This.Is.Stuart]

What’s funny is you play the PS2 version of this game, it can be co wondered different since it wasn’t planned. Xbox and gamecube are 60 fps while ps2 is 30 fps

[@stilllogan]

I never played much of Heroes past the first sonic stage myself but watching it played on oneyplays, seemed quite miserable lmao

[@bobjeezorham7658]

I always thought people hated this game, to the point where I was utterly shocked to see it has so many avid defenders. I remember this was also one of the few games as a kid that I really disliked after loving Sonic Adventure 2. I think its a shame since Sonic has such a fun extended cast of characters and the idea of having a game with a bunch of different characters to play, all in their own teams, is really cool. Admittedly I still need to revisit it to form an adult opinion on it, but man I remember being disappointed with how this game fumbled. I had the PS2 version, though, which I hear is worse and more buggy...which might explain why my memories have this game as a glitchy mess lmao This doesn't have to anything to do with Heroes but I've always thought Sonic should do more spin-off type games starring other characters, like how Shadow got his own game (regardless of quality lol) and Tails got a few of his own games. It could explore different genres, like imagine a Knuckles Chaotix beat-em-up game or a Rouge stealth game like Metal Gear.

[@Hewasnumber1]

Don’t diss Shadow’s game! That was just Sonic Heroes if it was good. Significantly less tedious (pumping out ten playthroughs in Shadow is both quicker and offers more level variety than Heroes’ four campaigns of near identical gameplay), much more fun combat with the addition of guns and a falling hitbox on Shadow, a significantly improved Team Chaotix mission structure, a more focused and enjoyable story, and a debatably superior soundtrack (I like rock, metal and industrial music, so Shadow’s soundtrack is right up my alley. Heck, I even listen to Julien-K’s music outside of This Machine and Waking Up).

[@Cyberthewolf]

Well I like Sonic Heroes ... and your opinion is valid, no but this game is indeed janky but it was a fun game to play

[@grimace9670]

Team sonic was fine enough, team rose was kinda boring, but the last levels of team dark and all of team chaotix was absolute hell to me like genuinely some of the worst gaming experiences I had

[@NeonStudios763]

i love this one thats it

[@mackovoir7546]

14:59 You uhhh... actually don't. You collect them once with any team, as it would work in previous games with special stages.

[@paperdawn]

ah that's probably more manageable then. I still don't think i'd want to spend more than 20 seconds in those special stages sadly.

[@otaking3582]

*HOW COULD ANYONE HATE THIS GAME?!?!*

[@risingrevolt]

I think the intro and the history with the blue could of just been shorten or cut, especially for the history part. I felt like that went on way too long. I don't think they add anything of substance to video. I skipped right to actual review to find a pretty clear reason to why you didn't like Sonic Heroes

[@supernew10doh64]

Most of your critiques of Sonic Heroes come off like someone who has no idea how to play through the game. Going through the checkpoints will give Your Leader character whoever it is a level up there's LevelUp capsules scatter throughout the different levels solo leveling up is never that big of a deal. You don't need to collect all the chaos emeralds with every team you just need to collect them in general. It doesn't matter what team you do it with or if you collect some Chaos Emeralds with one team and others with another team. Some of the critiques are valid like the rail switching mechanic being very janky but for the most part most of your critiques are kind of just wrong

[@paperdawn]

The levels still dont encourage a reason to level up, I think it says something about the mechanic that I was able to play the game multiple times throughout the years and never noticed things about it. It doesn't expect you to engage with it. Which was my main point. It feels like a waste of a mechanic. The choas emeralds are not fun to collect. That was my main point. Whether I do it once, twice, or not a single time. The point is it's there, and it's unfinished. I appreciate you pointing out how the game functions, but I don't think it takes away from my points.

[@supernew10doh64]

@paperdawn there is a reason to level up it means that you are able to do more damage and allows for the combat sequences that you and a lot of other people complain about to go by faster. If you want to go through those sections faster than level up your characters it's that simple. I don't know what version of Sonic Heroes you're playing by the way but if the special stages really are as janky as you're making them out to be your likely not playing the GameCube version. The PS2 version and I think it also came out on the Xbox 360 or maybe it was the original Xbox I don't remember I don't own any Xboxes but the GameCube version was what it was originally designed for and Sega had a hard time porting the game to other versions this is why a lot of people myself included so you're going to play this game to play the GameCube version. They are much more manageable in the GameCube version compared to other versions. Not the best still kind of janky but they're at least better. Even if that was your main point though you still did spread some misinformation in your video by implying that you needed to collect the chaos emeralds with every team in order to unlock the final story as well as some of your other issues with the game just factually being wrong. You cannot like the game for whatever reason and that's fine I just think spreading Miss information about mechanics that you yourself clearly just don't understand is not exactly a great move.

[@ellagage1256]

​@@paperdawn It doesn't expect you to in order to beat the game, but it still rewards players for doing so with the ranking system and that seems like a decent choice for an all ages game. I definitely agree with a lot of the criticism of this game but man do I feel like the level up system gets a bad rep. They're what make the difference between finding the flow of the game frustrating or fun. Each Speed level makes you go faster, strengthens your Homing Attacks and at max level you can skip using tornado moves on poles or enemies but even those can still be used to perform double jumps. How fast you can run changes how far Rocket Accel and ramps can fling you and your team which makes skipping through levels easier Each Fly level increases your max flight time and strengthens the Thunder Shoot. The amount of freedom these characters give you in tandem with a speed boost from Rocket Accel can let you break the levels like SA and having extended flight does actually make the difference between being able to take a faster path or not. Also they're great for not falling to your death at the more janky sections like rail switching or small walkways Each Power level gives you access to a much stronger 3-hit combo that at higher levels can reach about the same strength as a Team Blast from a single activation. Their combat movement is really weird but if you ever want to not slip off the stage as them, letting go of the movement stick before attacking will let you stand still and can let you spam your 2-hit punches even when leveled up. Also you inherit the momentum from Speed characters while gliding which can also let you skip parts of the level though how far you go is more based off of the Speed type's level You can get a free level up depending on what character touches a checkpoint, and the power cores that are dropped from enemies are mostly random but they'll never drop a core for the character you're playing as when destroyed, that way you can get the team max level while still focusing on a specific character yourself. Picking up extra cores after level 3 will give you a decent boost to your final score which on top of chaining enemy kills makes the scoring system in this game more satisfying to me than SA2 personally, and I really like SA2 overall Sorry for the long rant, I hope if you ever play the game again in the future the level up stuff clicks with you more because I think it's a ton of fun to master. Also I love your avatar :3

[@spimbles]

@@ellagage1256other dude is completely right. You’re in the minority and most people would say you’re blatantly incorrect

[@ellagage1256]

@@spimbles Yeah and most people can barely back up their claims of this being a bad game besides lack of polish, most of which was PS2 exclusive. Just because the game's system aren't interesting for you to engage in doesn't make them bad or "blatantly wrong"

[@Flare8295]

It's not fun to dislike this game and it shouldn't be

[@paperdawn]

Incorrect, this video was a blast to make! Wouldn't have been possible without my disgust for the game! :)

[@Lemuel928]

I dunno,they’re really bunking cool Sonic Speed on Nintendo GameCube?

[@shahgyy]

0:16 wtf i have the same sonic doll

[@Sonic171K]

The truth hurts. This is how I felt.

[@AverageMD-Fan21]

The GameCube version is actually the best version, I have the worst one, which is the version for the PlayStation 2.

[@2oodoo747]

me sonic me like speed

[@BIG_MUNKY]

I loved this video!!! That said though… I think you don’t like this game because… you’re not good at it 😅 Just watching your gameplay is so painful to me… I do agree with a lot of your points, the boss fights suck ass and it’s junky as fuck, that’s undeniable. I thought you had more subs tho! The quality of this video is great!!!

[@RouxTheKitsune]

Man this is like screaming slurs in public