Part 3: Digging a 9 ft Well With a Shovel

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This is the final stage of building the well. It involves pumping the water clear, testing the water, and filing the correct paperwork. There were a lot of things that surprised us with this one. First, it took a long time to pump the water clear, like more than one day. The second surprise was how much the setup slowed the flow of the water. The water was rushing in while we were digging and it slowed down to 3-4 gpm. The last surprise was how easy it was to contaminate the well, luckily it was just as easy to disinfect it. This part of the process took soooo long to finish. I am so glad it is done.
Part 1
• Part 1: Digging a 9ft ...
Part2
• Part 2: Digging a 9ft ...
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[@simonforget280]

Congrats for the 1k subscribers and your well. A few points: 1. Install the biggest water holding tank(s) that you can afford at the highest point possible. A total of 3500 gallons tank is what I consider the minimum. You cannot imagine how much water you'll need when fully established with livestock, crops and so on. Do not forget the forest fire hazards; you will need every drop of water available to protect your house. Water pressure is way easier to obtain and maintain by height difference rather than pump pressure. Even if you have to build separate pump and water houses, you will have a simpler and more reliable water system. It will also allow you to run the water pump straight from solar panels, without batteries. Water can be pumped up during the day, will allow the water to refill your well overnight and the holding tank will be big enough to supply water with enough pressure even if the pump is not running. Lastly, any small and pump well can be compensated by larger holding tank(s). It is cheaper to buy an excellent small flow pump than multiple crappy high flow pumps that might pump more water than your well can provide. 2. Be careful when choosing your electric pump well. Check valves are also a must on the filler pipe. Engineer775 have great videos on that subject too. 3. Nothing prevents you to install your electric and hand pumps on your well simultaneously. A few valves and switches will allow you to control which one you use. Procure an hand pump that can be fitted on a water hose; I found these are better fitted for our modern needs. 4. Have you consider a ram pump for your irrigation water needs? No electricity, a few moving parts and you let the water pump itself where you need it. With smaller holding tank(s) than your potable water to damp the water flow, you would be surprise how much it can achieve for such small investment. 5. Governments can be a pain (well, they are a pain...) but they have not established rules and laws for the sake of it. Other people made bad decisions and/or got in trouble previously so they had to regulate a few things here and there. Let me tell you that you are happy to deal with them; just imagine doing the same in Canada... Keep up your good work.

[@Simplegroundlife]

Hi Simon, Thanks yet again for sharing what you have learned. I have been pondering how to put a water storage tank on the hill near the house. The little pump that you see in my video should pump uphill a ways. (I bought it to run off a solar panel without a battery) I'm trying to figure out the county's regulations for putting a storage tank on a hill, a water house would be an expensive endeavor because it would require an engineering study due to landslide risk. It would be nice to turn on the tap and have water even if my power system is down. I have also been thinking of creating ponds for fire prevention, similar to those of ancient Japan. The natural water features can be used to water animals. Ram pumps are on my radar too. I think they are a great technology and I would love to work with them on my homestead, we will just have to see how I pull it off. I must agree with you on government and their role in maintaining order and protecting everyone's rights. The frustration you hear from me is the fact that they seem to cater to the common way of doing things over the intent of the law. I feel that I am often discouraged by those in charge of issuing permits, only because I am acting for myself instead of hiring someone in the system. It is probably the right thing for them to do, but it sure gets tiring for me. Thanks again for the great comment.

[@simonforget280]

The landslide risk is surely a concern. Putting the water tank on the hill would make things easier but it doesn't have to be this way. How about putting it above your workshop or your barn? It is my understanding it needs to be higher than your house but nothing says it needs to be on the hill behind your house... Your decision about the pump and its power feed is the right one. I'm off today. You can give me a call up to 18:30 EST today or most of the time over the weekend. Keep up your good work.

[@simonforget280]

Simple Ground By the way, anyone that wants to keep its job can make sure to interpret and enforce any rule and laws to its full extend. Give those people three times the amount of work they have to get through and they will ease anything they can to get things done.

[@moseskr6503]

Great job. I felt the well ought to have been a few more feet deeper for a bigger holding capacity in that second video. Also, depending on the kind of soil, you want to widen the base so that it's more like an underground reservoir with water seeping in at it's own rate. I have got 2 and both were done that way by hand with a holding capacity of about 1321 Gallons. This is on the shores of lake Victoria and the Nile in Uganda. Thanks for the videos, i really enjoyed them.

[@BryceThe2011]

Some regulations are ridiculous. I feel for you. Subscribed.

[@thecraftycorner4002]

Most of the times, it seems like they're mad because they didn't get to charge you as much as they could have. Because you didn't need them as much, as the average person.

[@adeyemiadesanya-rg2qc]

You have a good land, good fertile soil to accommodate backyard farming.

[@jackalandia81]

I'm really impressed with the well you did. Very good job.

[@Petrigore]

Anchors aweigh! Congratulations!

[@SkyfansRS]

Great Stuff man I love the content u make honestly u inspired me to make a bunker underground with my friends

[@andylee5863]

Great series. Thanks for sharing. Doing something similar in the spring.

[@subhaspatel4837]

well done man, inspirational to watch, best of luck

[@StanVanGundy1]

At least you can use the water to boil and cook with

[@georgejordan7309]

Thanks for your videos,my own wheel is about to finish now,with the help of my wife,ive got an idea from you,thanks again

[@calmperson101]

Congrats on hitting the 1k follows... thanks for sharing your experiences and journey. I can't wait for the final aspect of the well... Those are some interesting aspects to watch out for when doing a well. Thanks again for the awesome information. Cheers!! :D

[@Simplegroundlife]

Middle Way Thank you so much! We are so excited.

[@ludwingvega2003]

Seen all three of your videos. Great Job Fam.

[@Simplegroundlife]

Thank you!

[@greenspiraldragon]

Good job with the well.

[@beggsnachin]

The lack of water... here in SW WA, we have an existing 6 ft deep hand dug seep well. Similar issues, especially in summer. The water will clear up. In winter when there's massive rain, the water is crystal clear. We have a lot of iron in our water, though. We run the well dry doing a load of laundry with the washer. Or when I fill up the cow water trough. Or when I run the sprinkler on the garden. So overnight it fills up again, but this wreaks havoc in our pump house with the pump losing its prime. We have backup water, but ya. Seep wells are slow as heck. Been following your well thing, obviously you probly already figured things out since this is from 2016. We have been here in 2021 3 years now and the water is the bane of my existence. Clay soil, no rocks, springs and water everywhere and can't get it in large amounts for what I need. Ugh.

[@treeclimbing7798]

Time Switch Arms 💪 woooo ! On the Plus Side-we learn, from your mistakes-that’s valuable! thank you

[@markgray9896]

Thanks for the tips I'm going too start digging my well today

[@Simplegroundlife]

+Mark Gray Best of luck to you! If I could go back I would have rented a pump to pump out the water as I dug the well deeper. Happy digging, I'd like to hear how it goes.

[@timhump63]

It's kind of silly that you had to dig through all of that clay to get to the water table, and then buy different clay to fill the hole back in.

[@markgray9896]

ill keep you informed Sir, Thank you

[@arnoldromppai5395]

this why when I was 18 I wanted country land away from the city in an in-organized township were no permits are needed of any kind except if you are connecting to the grid you need a hydro permit, I can drill my well, build what ever I want do want I want, and back when I was 18 I paid 20,000 for all the land I have and my taxs are under 300.00 a year,, I wanted no control by government bs,,, of any kind

[@ngpillsbury]

never even switched arms! champ.

[@Simplegroundlife]

+ngpillsbury I'm pretty sure I did, I must not have gotten a good shot. Or my memory is bad.

[@doumor99]

practice makes perfect LOL

[@normgraham8630]

There was an existing well, in NJ. One day, after the well was there for 50+ years, the state made us cap it. the metal cap, 1/4 inch of metal, is still there to this day, as far as I know. In summary, you have a water sold by the town, by the gallon. And you use that to flush. They are afraid you'll cheat the system, by using their septic, but drawing cheaper water, from your own well. It's absurd, because it was a hand pump on the well, and not an electric pump.

[@jeffreyculberth4021]

consider a jet pump. also great job I'm very envious of your well. I didn't do my research before buying my land. where I'm from it's all sand people use shallow wells I have a friend with an 18' driven well right near the bay and it's clear freshwater. 20 miles away I purchase land and hand auger a 20 foot well hole through clay and start pumping pure salt water. come to find out I have 400-500 foot of salty clay before I can get to decent water. my closest neighbors well is 620' and the waters still a bit saline. hello $20000 well in the future... for now I'm hauling water ugh... once again great job man am going to continue watching your videos I enjoy watching you work so happily

[@TheUserid82]

How much rain do you get? Could be worth it to setup a rain roof/build a big shop to get water for at a minimum flushing, shower, laundry and garden to reduce the hauled water to just drinking.

[@nhh49]

congrats, awesome

[@arnoldromppai5395]

what I do for an under ground reserve on all dug wells is put 3 concert well tiles 48" aroundd at the bottom after I put 2 feet of cores washed crushed rock/gravel an set each tile around the main tile coming up, and put 3 concert lids on the 3 bottom tiles an Barry them in 4 to 5 feet of the same washed crushed rock, this hols hundreds of gallons of reserve water and bring up the water table as well, we don't have that clay stuff here, we back full the dug well and seal a mound of red clay on the surface so ground water cant get though and runs off

[@moniquedelatour3502]

Awesome. Im off grid in lowcountry sc. Thinking about handdigging a well.

[@Simplegroundlife]

Thanks best of luck!

[@joedegorostiza8305]

Great vid and unfortunate that you have to get permit and go thru the paperwork headache. In Texas, we're lucky enough to skip all asking permission.

[@denverkirk7722]

Congratulations on making all the way to 10k subs (as of this time). Ty for taking us all along the way with you and your well adventure.

[@stephenmellis9423]

Great viceo. I did not know you could dig your own well. I guess it depends on where the water table is.

[@davidgooding2940]

We shouldn't have to go through all these hoops to work on our own property. Crazy

[@williambraun616]

What was your total cost for instillation, construction, and finished product? Any last min finical money traps you had not foreseen?

[@lashawnknowles2491]

Is this video a 1 day vid? How come know one is talking about this man's stamina? Coulda been a boxer

[@ahorseman4ever1]

Awesome, I'm so happy for your well and 1000 subscribers. I just started following your channel today. I'm a little behind you on subscribers, I was just excited to get 50 subscribers the other day. Well you can count me as one more. I also live in Washington state. I'll be checking out your other videos. Take care.

[@leonardobonacci8238]

Good job!! I'm in the southwest part of Washington, in Mason Co. Planning to do the same of you, you really encourage me and I really hope you and your family are doing fine. How was the well during last dry season? Thank you for share yours experiences with us.

[@tectalabyss]

Great job ! New subscriber. Sad how many rules are on the books these days. Not all but some are plain silly. and just another way to get into our business and bank accounts. Thank you for sharing.

[@Simplegroundlife]

Hello and welcome! Thanks for saying hello!

[@Br1cht]

I put pavement stone 6 ft around my well but I guess that is on the list. Best wishes from Sweden. Edit: Be thankful that you don´t live here cause the state makes living here a real test;)

[@annetsoy8082]

felicidades por disfrutar agua limpia t

[@mnshp7548]

i think its that screen that you put on the pipe, its blocked with fine sediment stopping water from coming in quickly, i made my well, its only about a inch wide and a 16lpm pump never runs dry, but i have no cloth around my "sand point" which is just a pipe with angle grinded holes in the sides of it, its only about 5 feet below the water table and was quick to do

[@Mercmad]

Where some of my ancestors lived in Aldgate, London. There was a public well on the corner of the street. A lot of folks swore by the water they drank from it ... unfortunately the Aquifer ran through a few grave yards and the minerals in the water were actually human remains,,,, blechhh!

[@markgray9896]

Already thought of a pump

[@chaosmasker9858]

what did you put down as a barrier between the gravel and the clay? I think your clay sifted through the gravel blocking the flow. this also may be why you didn't have enough clay.

[@tomd5953]

crazy in Australia drill a bore well, pump what ever you want out of it no paper work at all. But our water is at least 15m down

[@markgray9896]

i am using corrugated steel too give the wall more strenght .

[@Simplegroundlife]

Mark Gray Sounds like a plan, stay safe.

[@sarahgracebrooks2629]

I LOVE your Journey!! We have dug a 4' hole near a branch of run off water. Its about 20ft away from the branch and we have struck water after going thru a lot of red Georgia Clay. Should we keep digging deeper?? Thank you for your encouragement !! We want a well sooo, badly. Our sewer bill is twice our water bill, again thanks!!

[@Simplegroundlife]

+Sarah Grace Brooks +Sarah Grace Brooks Thanks for the comment. I have heard of shallow wells that are that shallow, but you are close enough to the surface that I would keep investigating. There is a high chance of contamination in my shallow well. Your clay layer is hopeful though. I would dig down more to see where the next restrictive layer is. (At least to get enough water to draw from) Remember that if you puncture a restrictive layer, you risk contaminating lower water levels or draining the current water table. So be careful and if you punch through and start loosing water use some of the clay to patch it back up. Another thing to keep in mind is that the most telling time to dig a well is at the end of the dry season when the water is the lowest. Whatever you do make sure your water is tested so you know what is in it. I know that my news isn't the most encouraging for someone who needs a well. If you don't have a lot of restrictions, it doesn't hurt to try your well with all of that in mind and have your water tested often. Then, in the dry season, you can try a little deeper. I would also recommend calling a well driller in the area to see what they think. They would know the area and the worries more than I would. Best wishes! It is so exciting to dig a well.

[@sarahgracebrooks2629]

Thanks I will, I have dug 2 more spots 10 or 12 feet apart...same thing, I hit water about 4 feet....who knows? Thanks!

[@sarahgracebrooks2629]

By the way, there are plenty of poplar trees and saplings near where I am digging.

[@markgray9896]

I already thought of the sump pump

[@Simplegroundlife]

+Mark Gray Perfect!

[@gentlelove]

Some bath houses would take the dirty used bath water and boil and filter water to use again and again and again etc. Shalom

[@twb605]

Enjoy your videos. You did a great job, but while watching I was thinking you need to go deeper to reach more water and the deeper that source is the better quality it will be. At 9 feet you are likely collecting surface ground water. I went 21 feet using a 6 inch Seymour post hold auger and still did not reach the water bearing sand layer I was hoping for. Not being critical, just offering a thought. In your soil, you might could drive a sand point. Your 9 feet gives you a head start. If you drove a point to water bearing sand, you are in luck.

[@RandyMcDumpy]

Seems like I am in this general area (In Washington, near Idaho). Would love to know where you got the info on how to do this when you were doing all of your research. I am looking at starting on my own very similar expedition very soon.

[@Simplegroundlife]

I'm actually on the Western side of Washington here, but the state info is still the same. I read through the information on this website. ecology.wa.gov/Water-Shorelines/Water-supply/Wells I also contacted a local well drilling company and had them coach me.

[@throughoureyes5160]

What was the well bleaching process?

[@Simplegroundlife]

+Through Our Eyes There is a ratio of bleach to water for sanitizing a well. I don't have access to it right now but you can find it in a KZbin search. After mixing the bleach with the well water you run the pump long enough to flood the system with the bleach water solution. Then you let it sit for 24-48 hours. After that you run the pump until.you can't smell the bleach anymore and retest.

[@normgraham8630]

ps....cheap cat litter is clay.

[@mahalaleelforever4806]

You should always dig deeper then you did. At least 20 ft down

[@austinnoles8395]

How did you hook the pump up

[@SaintCoemgen]

Two years later..... What is the status of the well? Kind of left the issue hanging. Final followup video on topics like, was water output sufficient, were regulations satisfied, etc, would be great for this "Digging a Well With a Shovel" playlist.

[@Romeguy2]

We have moved to Patagonia. We have successfully used your video to dig a 9 foot well with a shovel, and have now about one to two gallons per minute flow. We have a small 1/2 horsepower jet pump which we can use. We are pumping to an existing 800-gallon storage tank. Our problem: How to we get the pump to shut off before it pumps the well dry and the pump loses sufficinet water to prevent restarting. (due to lack of water in the chamber) It is crazy hard here in Argentina to get advice!!

[@Simplegroundlife]

I lived in Mendoza and San Juan for a couple years. It's exciting to hear from you. I'm not am expert when it comes to plumbing but it seems to me that a half horse jet pump would pump a really high gpm. But of course you have already mentioned that. My first thought is to suggest a valve at the tank that limits your water flow to 1 gpm or so but it will cause your pump to cycle on and off a lot and that could shorten the life of my pump. I am using a little 12v diaphragm pump and it only pums 3 gpm. I'm not sure how hard it is to find something like that down in Patagonia. I hope this helps a little. Enjoy that beautiful landscape down there!

[@Romeguy2]

Wow!! That's crazy!! How many people from America actually wind up spending a couple of years in Argentia!!!....that's so cool that you know where I am; Bariloche. I have not gotten to Mendoza. Really wish we had, but all our time spent fixing up the cabin in the woods. ...next trip down. Thanks so much for your feedback. Oh...our pump is only a centrifugal pump so we won't be using it after all. Your advice is great! Great videos!!

[@Arnd2it]

Buy a mini bilge pump for a boat and drop it down to the bottom of your well. It doesn't need priming and has a float switch that turns itself off when it runs dry. They run on 12 volts and are relatively cheap, starting around $25. Just make sure you get one that puts out at least 10 feet of head pressure.

[@BeKemeFeqadu]

How’s this well holding up ?

[@fahermsen]

He great job making your own well but would it be an idea to atach a rampump to it, free from electricity no need to pump it yourself.

[@skelitalmisfit12]

Why did you choose to play anchors away for your fast forward? Lmao it struck me as odd being a sailor myself. But refreshing to hear it out of the blue none the less

[@Simplegroundlife]

I know it is a little strange. I edit in the moment by the feel of things and it just seemed to fit. Thank you for your service and thanks for your comment.

[@skelitalmisfit12]

Youre very welcome, it was my pleasure and thank you for your videos! I love your channel and I am very glad I stumbled on it. Keep up the great content!

[@timbeetersuethaddeus4682]

What is this black thing? How do i get it?

[@chrismcconnell6163]

maybe getting a holding tank , would help

[@scottcarl3086]

Stevens county?

[@selador11]

Really good job! Good for you! I am assuming that by now, you have a solid cap on that well casing. (This was probably the reason you had ecoli in there.) 7.8k subscribers plus one, now. :)

[@Simplegroundlife]

Thank you. Yes you do have a good solid cap on the well now. Thanks for subscribing, I am amazed that it has come so far.

[@chriszablocki2460]

Bureaucracy. Shocker.

[@NicholasBlazonis]

I have a uv system. With a whole filtration system

[@Simplegroundlife]

That is what we have as well. It has been working great for us so far.

[@NicholasBlazonis]

@@Simplegroundlife awesome, it been working great for me too. Love your videos.

[@doright9845]

I like my system better! I know my wife does because she keeps the water going as long as she's awake!

[@scottsutton7989]

You did not drill enough holes in the casing my friend!!

[@AnonymousYT-oy8fm]

so you did not show how the black pump was installed.

[@BenNewman1776]

How is the well holding up?

[@Simplegroundlife]

+Ben Newman It is doing fine but that doesn't mean much because it really isn't that old and we are still in the wet season. We will see as time goes on.

[@sarahgracebrooks2629]

I hit water at 4ft, is that ok?

[@reneebrown5598]

You have to run your water thru. It will be dirty for a while.

[@kevinfromheaven5324]

Can you tell me why you moved from Idaho to Washington, I am going into the panhandle of Idaho and just was curious why you moved away from a state that is more leaning toward off-grid living.

[@Simplegroundlife]

+Kp Lebeck You are right, Idaho is much more receptive to the lifestyle that I am seeking. Our move to Washington had to do with had to do with feeling lead to be here. Kind of a spiritual thing, though we still are figuring out why.

[@kevinfromheaven5324]

I am trying to gather info on buying raw land in Idaho, can you tell me what counties are the best to move into or any tips or web-sites to seek out, in gathering info in avoiding Government traps and snares.

[@Simplegroundlife]

+Kp Lebeck I'm sorry, I don't know any good resources about that. I do know that most rural counties in Idaho are fairly lenient the further you are from town. I also know that there are some counties that offer a lot of freedom in this regard. But I don't have any specifics.

[@light487]

It's the government's water, they say, they need to tax you for the water through a utilities company, who also wants to make money off you. Hehe.

[@MrCntryjoe]

put some crayfish in the well several dozen

[@Splatzloki]

+Simple Ground E.Coli can be fatal to adults and tends to target the elderly and YOUR KIDS. it's bad in the worst way. 1. How did it get in your water, did you transport it from the surface on your boots, or did it leach in with the rainwater? 2. I saw you pour bleach into the bottom of the well, what about the walls? Was that the problem? 3. Did the state ever approve your well, or did you have to dig another? 4, If your well gets shut down is there any way to dig a parallel hole get to the bottom of your existing well and decontaminate it that way? 5. Did you contaminate the ground water table with your well?

[@Simplegroundlife]

Max Steel Max Steel Thank you for your comment, I can tell by the tone that there was a a lot for concern for our well being. Thank you, and I'll do my best to answer your concerns. Of course it is hard to know for certain where the e.coli came from but I'm pretty sure it was a problem with the hand pump. I would take it out of the well when it wasn't in use and then put it back in when I need it. (A stupid decision in hindsight) After installing the permanent pump lines and foot valve and disinfecting the system, the test came back clean and we haven't had any more trouble. I should also add, because the well is shallow it requires an in line disinfecting unit just in case. And yes, my well has been approved.

[@Splatzloki]

I appreciate you replying, and yes, I was very concerned. In future, and mind you, I put a double heaping of warning and caution when doing this, in all my studies, there is only one thing, that kills bacteria, fungus, germs, down to the microcelular level. IMMOLATION. When sanitizing surfaces I recommend bringing the surface temperature to about 400 degrees. This can be complicated by the surrounding area, in that, if the offending contaminant "replicates" (breeds) (parasites/bacteria/mold) then it can recontaminate what you've sanitized, "but", if you've eliminated the "favorable conditions" for that happening, and you immolate, and isolate/seal afterwards, the odds are very slim of any reoccurance.

[@beggsnachin]

You picked the wrong doggone side of our state to move to, especially coming from Idaho. Dunno why you left that place to come here. We are the tax and rule capital. My Dad left the west side and moved to NE Washington. Bare land. He had to put in his own well and had it done by professional just to get it done. but as far as building permits? He had to get a permit to put the power pole in, and he is building a house from scratch with no fuss and no muss. Seriously, you moved to the wrong part of the state. Ugh. I'm thankful down here in SW WA they don't bother us much (yet...), but in Thurston County? Forgetaboutit... they were taxing Dad for the use of his own septic tank, required it pumped like every year I think whether it needed it or not, and they required those ugly mound systems that are designed to fail- seriously. Oh- and ten acres of unusable "wetland" , but still the excessive taxes. And at the same time a big housing development suddenly can use the "wetland" that the previous land owner couldn't. And don't even get me started about all the squatters all over setting things on fire. Ugh. You moved to the wrong doggone side of the state, and if you are in Grays Harbor, God help you. We moved from there. Hope you are 2A friendly.

[@mccallumcra]

Come on dude. Your pumping the surrounding area into a pressure hole. You need to put the evacuated hole reminisce around the hole to keep the surface Water from contaminating the hole.

[@scioenimveritatem2400]

They lied to you, there was no need to chlorinate it. Man, I was truly hoping you would refrain from that.

[@Simplegroundlife]

+CalledChosen Faithful Well I did drink some of the water before I sanitized it. It was only a swallow or two. And it did give me some significant gastrointestinal distress. I didn't want to mention it in the video because it was a dumb thing for me to do. Water born illness is real and it can be killed with chlorine. I don't want anyone to get the wrong idea.

[@frankbradleyjr]

Any and all new Wells has to be clorinated don't matter were you live. Even well drilling company's do it especially if its for home use.

[@scottsutton7989]

Simple Ground the idiot who said not to chlorinate is ignorant!!! I put in huge waterlines and it’s a requirement! What if some fool pissed on one of those bags of rocks??? So ye you wanna chlorinate fools!!! I’ve seen Home Depot employees pee on the backside of pallets of materials so keep that in mind!!! Not pretty but is reality

[@briangosselin9205]

That is a real pump don't you mean an electric pump

[@danielvogt5067]

You getting eating thy the government

[@jobaron7967]

We enjoyed your video up until the part where you made a crack about "not being attacked by Indians"...we are from Canada & suggest you study Truth, Healing & Reconciliation of Indigenous (Indians) people. As the comment "being attacked by Indians" is insulting, perhaps you watched to many western shows. When Europeans first arrived in Turtle Island, millions of Indians were killed by foreigners. Sad history please take time to check this information out...

[@Simplegroundlife]

I'm sure you can tell that I mean no offense. I did grow up in a culture of cowboys and the wild west so you pegged me there. We all have things to learn in this world and we don't learn it all at once. I promise I mean no disrespect.