PAX DEI- Is It Too Expensive or Worth the Future Cost?

[@vex2788]

also you can purchase the base game then purchase the upgrade to master pack and you save 30 dollars at least in canada anyways. prices will differ per country i know.

[@francoispiche5225]

The devs could also end up saying the monthly fee is: Common fee (IE: 7.99$/month) + plot fee (IE: 2.99$/plot/month) but WE don't know.... These are assumptions.. Anyways, here's why I'm not ready to bite the hook: First HUGE red flag is showing the purchasing page without mention of the monthly fee unless you start reading the fine prints (And even then, you don't even know what your getting into!). Second HUGE red flag is the pressure they put on us to purchase the game while they have not clarified their subscription model. To be honest I was ready to part with the 99$ but there's no way that I am getting into a subscription. Having played the game for a few hours, I can say that it ain't the Ferrari of MMO RPG's so for these reasons, I'm out.

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

Pressure? The devs literally say if you're not sure about Pax then wait and see how the game develops. And if people want to get EA, get the 40 dollar one and if you like it you can always upgrade later and you just pay the difference. They are very active in discord and have been very transparent.

[@francoispiche5225]

@@northernfabricationllc2281 If you don't pay now, you'll miss out. That's my definition of pressure. In this case, mainly you get early access for longer but also that negligible founder outfits (Some peeps are into that). Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against early access if they show upfront what the monthly fees will be after EA is over or if there's no monthly fee at all. The pressure I hate is the dev puts me in a position where if I paid for early access, and like the game just enough to play it casually, I could be kicked out if I don't think the monthly fee is worth paying.

[@venusyo]

This is one of the biggest scam i've ever seen in a fucking videogame. It's absolutely atrocious to think that they could charge you money for your plot when u buy the full FUCKING GAME.

[@stivenandre7924]

The game will have a sub post release, they just told you about it in advance. During EA you don't need to pay for sub. Whats the problem with it ? Should they not reveal it now and later add "battlepass" or "season belt" or some crap like that ? Like cmon.

[@vex2788]

@@stivenandre7924 they shouldnt be gate keeping character or land slots for one thing behind a paywall.

[@DjangoLowe]

Considering they're going to wipe after early access you can decide on how many plots its worth it for you to have. it's not like your going to loose anything by going with less plots that you weren't going to loose in the wipe already. The prices you're paying is for the entire EA and you get to play the game and have unique-ish recipes. It doesn't seem to make sense that you have to buy a 4 plot sub after it releases. It doesn't make sense for them to just let you have additional space for a one time fee.

[@MyUsualMe]

Value is in the eye of the beholder for sure. It's exactly why I asked the question if you thought it is worth it.

[@hechla]

I see about $5 dollars per xtra plot $30 or $40 max

[@eggzacklee]

The subscription scaling for active plots is insane. Even Activision isn't that greedy with blackcell battlepass bundles for Call of Duty which are 30$ but they are every 2-3 months because one season is roughly 2-3 months and you get bunch of added stuff plus additional cod points to buy whatever you wish from the store on top of everything. Yes all those extra skins are just variants of the ones you can already get from basic battle pass but its still something, plus you can do all battlepasses for 10$ total because you will always earn enough plus some bit extra to renew the next season

[@Macphotographs]

A game where square footage allows for more, faster crafting and refinement, garden space, storage space and limited resources, selling extra plots is pay to win. No matter how you slice it, it's pay to win. You can get ahead, and get there faster by paying more money. That's the definition of p2w

[@MyUsualMe]

Thanks for your thoughts!

[@lilililil8201]

I agree on the fact that is expensive however i think your assumption are a bit too hight : 99.99 is for a year at minimum of EA so it is 99.99/12=8.33 This is not taking into account that it is also paying for the base game. So let's say the base game is 20.99 : 99.99 - 19.99 = 80 80 / 12 = 6.66 6.66 dollar maximum a month for 4 plot in EA with the 39.99 pack we have 39.99/12=3.33 Or with a base game of 19.99 : 20 / 12 = 1.66 1.66 for one plot now i don't know how price will be and i don't really believe either a 1.66 /month sub price but just to say, the 20/plot/month seemed to be a too high assumption Also, solo 1 plot is difficult yes (for mid game cause early is managable) but if you make a clan of 2-3 player it get reasonnable. In the end i still don't know if i want to pay 39.99 for min 1 year EA with wipes.

[@MyUsualMe]

All the hypothetical plot prices I mentioned were for full release not EA.

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

Wipes do come with testing though. Its unfortunate but it is part of the process sadly. ut being there at the ground level and being able to play the game as it grows, to me is well worth it. And with everything they plan on adding, I can definitely see EA lasting at least 2 or 3. So even at 40 its honestly a good deal I think, but that's just me.

[@TB2K08]

absolutely no reason to change characters for skills you can level all skills on your character and a single plot is enough for all crafting stations with a 3 story house and a master founder wouldn't have to maintain all 4 plots, and there will be a full wipe before going live you are also assuming the monthly fee will be $x/plot. A group of 5 friends with 1 plot a piece will have a TON of room

[@MyUsualMe]

Phew! You must be a master organizer! It can be done, I did it. The place was pretty packed by the time I was finished with the week though.

[@stivenandre7924]

I put everything on the ground without even putting foundations and had enough place for everything on 1 plot.

[@Zalem22]

Very insightful points here! You changed my mind about this with the point about clans having to constantly update their villages and castles every time they lose a member. That's an issue if plots cost any money at all. Who's gonna be the person that has to fork over $5 more per month per plot owned by a member leaving a clan? This is a major problem for large and small clans alike. This isn't gonna work.

[@MyUsualMe]

I actually hadn't considered that empty plot purchasing might even be a thing they would introduce. Now I have this vision of one lonely guild leader paying out of pocket for placeholder plots hoping that people will come play with them. lol That would be super sad.

[@slashrocks19801]

As much as I like building and survival games the game trailer was selling dangerous outskirts where it would look to be an amazing RPG journey. The reality is you build stuff and the combat is hideous nor does it even seem to be focused around combat. I was already at major pass then I heard the prices with subscription I'm rolling my eyes they don't even have a complete game lol.

[@MyUsualMe]

Fair enough. Time will tell, right?

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

Subs come after EA. Which will last a minimum of one year, which I'm figuring at least 2 or 3 with all the features they want to add. Of course everything isnt complete, it's still in development, things will be fleshed out through the EA. The devs are sharp and know what their doing. I have a lot of faith in their team based off how well the crafting and building systems are already and those are totally finished yet either. The dungeons are bad ass if you like going after named mobs and magic gear and such.

[@slashrocks19801]

​@@MyUsualMeLot of game companies have done some shady advertising practices I definitely expect it with Bethesda lol. I'll still keep an eye out on this game.

[@ZiadZiyed]

كيف نطور المظلة في لعبة dying Lingh 2

[@leebob4965]

I went to there discord faq on there founders package announcements. They are saying you are not locked into paying for the extra 2 or 4 plots, once the game goes live. Game will go live close to june or july 2025 they claim. I played the second alpha when it came out. I found two plots could house every crafting station they had. I do not lnow about future releases though.

[@MyUsualMe]

Right, as I said, you will only be charged by the plots you want to maintain. But as you said, you really need two plots to realistically house all the crafting stations comfortably. So the question still stands, how much are people willing to pay?

[@SoggyTreks]

I doubt they will double or quadruple the monthly fee.

[@MyUsualMe]

I never said you are locked into paying for plots. I specifically read what was on the page which says you will be charged per month per plot that you choose to maintain. You misheard. Go back and watch it again.

[@MyUsualMe]

@@SoggyTreks If you want to maintain two plots, you will pay for two plots. If you want to maintain one, you'll pay for one. It would be nice to see a discount per month for four plots though.

[@leebob4965]

$5 USD MAX per plot, should be $3 though if i have to maintain decay states. As far as the sub fee i am assuming they will go with the traditional price of 14.99 a month. When i played 2nd alpha i was able to build 10 walls high with supports in place. i was quite comfortable with the space of two months.

[@LordAikido]

This would suggest they will be selling 'plots' in the future.... which, if they are to keep the founders happy would need to be priced at more that $25 per plot; just to purchase... then priced per month to maintain.

[@MyUsualMe]

Yeah, they state that the price structure will be based on the players feedback which is why I made this video. If you don't know to say something how can you affect the change, right?

[@WmJFaust]

Wow! I had no idea. I purchased a Master and was going to get a second one for guild development in the future. Now I'm seriously worried. 😢

[@MyUsualMe]

Nah, It'll be fine. Besides, it's a year away. That was just a public service announcement.

[@TomsyOfficial]

Totally agree. The prices are crazy. I was excited about this game, but with these packs and prices I have completely lost interest in it. The height cap on buildings forcing us to get a larger pack for even more money is just.. Honestly 40$ for an early access game is expensive to begin with.

[@CanisoGaming]

This priced plot thing is such bullshit i honestly wasnt expecting plots to be locked behind oaywall, i thought it was gonna be plots being bought at first & then players can trade them with each other creating a sort of real estate market, i mean look at how Mortal Online 2 approached it, they are totally in the right with that formula, the online market is literally full of people buying & selling properties and plots all the time, this approach will totally kill pax dei at some point..

[@MyUsualMe]

I wasn't aware of M.O. 2's pricing structure, that's interesting. Thanks!

[@CanisoGaming]

@@MyUsualMe looking at both it's so much better tbh, I hope pax dei devs will take a few things from mo2 because they definitely did things right, & if I remember correctly I think the subscription now for MO2 is literally just 15$, hope pax won't be much higher than that considering the plots are paid 😂. Tho pax dei crafting is still easier than mo2 😂

[@MyUsualMe]

@@CanisoGaming Yeah, I'll probably play the game through EA and hope the devs do the right thing. It's good to keep an eye on these things.

[@CanisoGaming]

@@MyUsualMe yea it's definitely a game with great potential, but thing with this kind of games is that they are pretty much HEAVILY reliant on the quality of the community, if the community (or even a fairly small part of it) is toxic they will drive players away. Same goes with "solo players" extreme mentality, if there's too many of those they will just make the "social" in this game's genre title irrelevant 😂, I hope the community will really be high quality because this game & the devs totally deserve a cooperating playerbase

[@scuro691]

to be fair capping the height is also necessary due to coding/hardware limitations, ex. you can have 400 structures 40 ft tall, 200 structures at 80 ft tall, im fine with no sky scrapers, did not know they plan to charge for plots like that though. changes what im choosing for sure!

[@23paingel]

They advertise tall structures on the website right as you buy it. Look at the master package, that's at least 6 stories high. If it's really capped at 3 high, then that's deceptive af.

[@rjwaller1973]

Or buy the basic $ buy char slots ?

[@MyUsualMe]

You know, I don't think they've mentioned buying character slots as a standalone option. That would be cool as a onetime thing. I used to have 6 characters on Life is Feudal.

[@nickjoy8868]

My immediate response is to only buy the Journeyman pack with no sub until I've played 29 days of bought time before deciding whether it's worth any kind of monthly sub; but at $40 that's still a very expensive month of gaming. So all things being taken into account I may well stick this on the back burner for 6 months and see whether it's going to sink or swim. Thanks Usual, very informative video which has given me pause for thought rather than charging in regardless.

[@MyUsualMe]

Yeah this was just a buyer beware video. This wasn't a hit piece.

[@stivenandre7924]

Where does the 40$/month price came up from ? Thats bizzare price for a sub and PxD in no way mentioned having it that high anywhere. Make the math, current plots given EA duration and pack prices is like 3-4$/month.

[@SomeGuyFromUtah]

I think plots are ok if the price is reasonable, this video at the end seems to have a good grasp of what is a reasonable pricing structure. Although this comment was going to look very different if I would have posted it before getting to that point (when it said 10-20 bucks per plot, which I don't think the devs would be dumb enough to charge) FFXIV has retainers, 2 are free and then they are 2 bucks a month, and I think that's reasonable... I pay for like 5 extra I think for a total of 7 (2 miner, 2 botanist 1 fisher 2 adventurers) plus lots more listings for the marketplace (20 per retainer). (10 is max) I have played one other sandbox MMO with plots of land... it's voxel based like a minecraft , Boundless. It's pretty dead now, but I think a lot of the problems with that game relate to how challenging it is to maintain performance and add features and just keep a game like that running where you can maintain plots of land. I'm not a programmer, but I think it's significantly harder to maintain a server with hundreds of players where they can all own land and actually edit the game world. It doesn't surprise me at all that they would need to charge for this functionality. I haven't even looked much into Pax Dei... it kinda came out of nowhere for me, but this is exactly the type of game that appeals to me, so I'll be looking close at this and maybe grabbin that 100 dollar founders pack if it looks promising.

[@dannytak3584]

Thks for the info man .take care

[@MyUsualMe]

No problem 👍

[@mylara7779]

Do we know what the initial buy-in price is going to be for EA and what that is going to give us??

[@MyUsualMe]

What I saw on their Discord is that the pricing levels will be the same with the same perks. So I guess the founder packs are going to be available during early access? It isn't clear and there was only one answer to the question.

[@CanisoGaming]

1 year early access (potentially longer), once it releases the early access is over & will most probably be at a subscription price, pretty much the same kind of monetization another sandbox mmo went with (Mortal online 2), tho mortal online 2 is way more advanced in everything other than the building (the building in MO2 is basically presets that you just input materials into & it builds itself on the plot you are on

[@Kuja_H]

They only way that I can see this making sense for EA buy ins, would to incorporate a discount structure for those of whom, who bought in. For example; If you opt for Master Founder's pack, you get 75% off sub fees. 50% off sub fees for Journeyman, etc... Although, you referenced land plots for the sliding scale in sub fees, it's most likely character slots that's going to determine the slide job there, being a MMO. Great video, thank you for taking the time to help us Usuals out.

[@MyUsualMe]

Glad to be of help! I doubt we will be seeing any type of discount though.

[@XelaML]

Makes it seem like plots may be unlimited. and if some whale has 50 plots that's a lot of storage of all the details, requiring more storage for the game itself somewhere, and scale that on a worldwide scale, yeah pay per plot so people don't go too crazy with it. Coming from the age of DAOC, WOW, Everquest, Warhammer etc, all MMOs had a monthly fee. And I felt those MMOs provided better service and content than most of the ones today that rely on an item shop. Ive only seen the item shop done right in one game (PoE) and that isn't "really" a MMO, but ARPG. Look at Ultima Online, one of the first games to give you "housing", people could have 1 home per account (after they limited it) and people just bought more accounts to hold more houses, which is same here, except you can just pay for them all on one account instead of having to go around the limit by buying multiple accounts, which WOULD happen if they limited the plots to 1-2 plots per account.

[@Boonedale]

The issue is that the monthly subscription scales with the number of plots of land you have. Thats some what new in the MMO industry. The only other MMO I know of that has a system like this is Second Life. I would rather have an ingame "rent" system then a real world cash transaction based on how much digital land I have.

[@XelaML]

@@Boonedale it scaled in Ultima Online too, one house per account meant you were paying the subs to multiple accounts (ie higher "rent") just to hold those houses. If Pax Dei limited it to one plot per account, people would just buy multiple accounts to get more plots and pay more that way instead of just through one account. Makes it more conveinant

[@Boonedale]

@@XelaML Actully, for UO you had one house plot per shard per account. In PD you can have up to 4 on one account and thay are scaling the monthly sub based on that metric. UO never did that. Your example of buying more accounts for more land in UO is correct, people did that in UO back in the day (and still do).

[@RRtechsolutions]

My thoughts is it's pretty normal to have a sub fee. Although based on plots is BS. That said I made my purchase already, I figured this is a problem that's at least a year down the road. We have a year to convince the devs that this is not the plan they want to go forward with. If they do charge by plot, we need to see what the pricing is going to be. it's likely to be a couple bucks extra per plot, which wouldn't be horrible but if they choose to charge more they will lose some of their best spenders right at launch.

[@MyUsualMe]

This is exactly why I made this video. I want the devs to do the right thing after release and if people don't know about their plans, then there will be no voices to be heard until it's too late.

[@whalley8835]

Thats crazy money 😬

[@MyUsualMe]

It'll depend on their price point for sure.

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

It really isn't

[@whalley8835]

If you're paying more than 200 all in for a game you're paying to win and that's just sad.

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

Who is playing more than 200? You can buy a 40, 60 and 100 dollar founder pack. That in which gives you access throughout all of EA. If someone wants to spend more for plots to build on, how exactly is that pay to win? Me personally, I loved what I saw in Alpha 2 and I love to build. Having extra plots to have a nice home with acreage and a farm isn't pay to win, there's nothing someone would be winning with it other than having the room to do what they want if they wanted the extra space. It also supports a the development of the game which in my mind is a good thing.

[@betterthantelevision]

Saw these pricing tiers yesterday and immediately clicked 'ignore'.

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

Games are supposed to free then I take it?

[@vex2788]

@@northernfabricationllc2281 there's a middle ground between greedy and scam, and free. its called a reasonable price point, and not scaling depending on how much you want to play a game. If that were the case no lifers WoW players would be playing thousands a year just to play, with how many hours they can put in. we arent dealing in absolutes, there is a middle ground. But this developer just seems to want more money, more money, more money.

[@Zirichel_]

I hate the idea of a subscription. But if it was only like a dollar a month then who cares. That wouldn't be bad. I just like to buy my video games once. Let me just purchase access. I literally would rather them create some simple monetized in game purchases. Like cosmetics. Obviously I know people don't love those, and I ironically don't either. But I'd prefer that they build a base game, that works and is fun, and then add cosmetics. I hate the idea of a subscription. I don't think I've ever paid for a subscription in game. Hell I'd rather they create a battlepass or anything else to fund their game on top of base purchases. Or they could make a subscription option for a certain area, or type of progress, or do like Runescape and create "Members Only" content. That way you can play the base game and even do most everything, but maybe the paying members have an advantage. I'm sure people don't love that either, but I'd prefer that to a required subscription. I want to play this game, but I won't if I have to have a subscription in order to play it. I would literally grind my way to the top than pay to play the damn game that I purchased access to. To me that feels like paying to get into a theme park only to have to pay for every single ride once you paid to get inside. You're still going to have to wait in a line. Why pay to wait in a line, when I already paid to enter the damn park in the first place. I don't care if they charged $50-60 for the game instead of using a subscription. But I know that they'll love to have their subscription. Because you'll pay for the game, there's $40 or more if you get a founders pack. And then if you actually have to pay a scaled price for plots, come on, that's bullshit, and extra bullshitty having to pay an upkeep. That's literally taxes in a video game, that's not fun or cool, or even ethical. That's like saying welcome to the fucking Matrix. You thought being a battery was bad? Try having to pay for it on top of the slavery. I get I've gone a little over the top with my comment, I just am disgusted at the concept. I will re-iterate however, I do agree that a dollar or so isn't bad. I just think it's awful for a company to make me pay over and over to retain access to a game a pay for a copy of to play in the first place. If it's $14+ a month, and they have a million players, that's $14+ million dollars a month. Yes it's smart and great for them and you'd hope it would mean that their game would only improve in detail and quality, QOL, content, performance, their dev team, etc. But I guess we will just have to wait and see. I can't say I blame them, because I would love to be able to make that much money just from some gamers forking over their cash for access to a game, but I hate that model, and I hate that people are okay with it.

[@MyUsualMe]

Great points! I'm always of the opinion you hope for the best but should prepare for the worst. They said the price would depend on the community feedback which is why I made this video.

[@Zirichel_]

@@MyUsualMe thanks for the reply! And thanks for making this video. Hopefully people will speak up and a consensus can be determined. I really wanna buy the game and after thinking about it, I might buy the game and play during EA. I’ll likely stop playing if they choose to go down the subscription route. But I think it would be cool if they did what RuneScape does (or very similar) so I can keep playing without the sub. Thanks again and best wishes for the channel!

[@MyUsualMe]

@@Zirichel_ Thanks man! Yeah, I think I will probably play the game at the lowest level for EA and then evaluate after full release as well. We will see what they do.

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

Any good MMO has a sub. It covers maintenance cost for the servers and allows for continuous new content. It literally costs around. 50 cents a day for a months worth of fun. Majority of people waste a lot more than that a day on frivolous garbage lol.

[@sween1432]

My issue is that there are 8 wtf decisions stacked up on top of one another I am the target demo for this game. I won't respect myself if I pay 100 dollars for korean minecraft... in Early Access...that's gonna be wiped multiple times...that's gonna have a subscription fee...a fee that scales based on your interest in the game....

[@sasdasu00dfsdfardo]

is better the devs making money than making a cool game that needs to be closed in a year and stops receiving updates in 6 months.

[@lio1234234]

They said they're doing subscriptions purely so that when players stop playing or caring about the game their plots deteriorate for ones that actually want to play. Just saying that I have no idea whether or not they are telling the truth or not, this is just what they've stated

[@MyUsualMe]

Right, that's exactly what is said, you pay for the plots you wish to maintain. You want 1 plot, you pay for one plot, you want 4 plots, you pay for four plots. I believe them.

[@jimrizzy]

I mean we have games like ark survival and connen exiles when players stop playing their stuff auto decay after a week of no activity and it's all free.... just seems they just trying to grab money tbh...

[@stivenandre7924]

Even if we go for highest price which is 100$: Game itself is buy2play so like 30$? That leaves us with 70$ left. Now, early access will be at least a year and more likely 2 years so lets go with 1.5years thats 70$/18 ~= 3.9$/plot/month 4$/plot/month is what you are currently paying to have your plots even if you buy the priciest edition. Whats the problem here ? Why do you assume that founders have to use all plots on release ? This 1/2/4 plot thingy is for the duration of early access ONLY. The max price it will be reasonable on release is like 30$-50$(which you don't need to pay if you buy one of the packs now) for the game and 4$/plot/month. There is no issue with "pay2win" with having more plots, like cmon, even if you would be locked to 1 plot per character people who want more will just create alts and do it that way. During A2 I used about 70% of my single plot and built almost everything(crafting station + storage wise), I didn't "go up" I put everything on the ground.... Playing with 1 plot is perfectly reasonable. Having more makes you be able to have more bases but its not pay2win or anything.

[@MyUsualMe]

Why do I assume that founders have to use all plots on release ? I don't. I simply quoted the devs that we will be charged for each plot used/ month. I'm super stoked that so many people are responding. Thanks for your comment! The engagement on this video is outstanding!

[@imperialorc1]

I agree 💯 man well said

[@MyUsualMe]

Thanks! I didn't want to bash the devs too hard but it does seem a little sus to not say it a little louder to the people.

[@chadsmith66]

Them trying to add a sub i think is gonna kill it imo

[@atoy2489]

Just play until it last and enjoy the game while you can. Don’t invest too much. That’s it

[@Sevrmark]

"Much more than any of us expected?" Nonsense. It's exactly what many of us expected.

[@MyUsualMe]

Glad you expect it.

[@ripple911]

I came here because I generally like your content, and could understand your point of view right until you said they placed a building height restriction of 3 for building. This is certainly not the case, and anyone who looks can very easily find many examples. One would hope that anyone who purchases a product does their own research as to what they are buying, but even more so, those who made content should also do some research to ensure they are presenting facts. Anyone who tries even a little can very easily fit all they need on one plot, the rest is for vanity.

[@MyUsualMe]

There is a building height limit. That's a fact unless they have changed it. Asmongold himself and his people had to build up a mountain with their plots to get around that issue. But hey, if they have changed it since the last playtest, then that's great.

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

There is. In flat land its 8 stories high. Using cliff sides or mountain sides when placing your plot up against it will shoot the boundary up the cliff face allowing for greater height in your build.

[@theGermanPrintingNerd]

one time That price now listed OK and if demanded only 10 per month NOT MORE after the 1 Year !!!!

[@MyUsualMe]

Can you make this statement clearer please?

[@theGermanPrintingNerd]

I mean what the 3 starters each cost is okay but after the 1 year trial if they demand a Monthly it should be like ArcheAge or Final Fantasy 14 , 10 USD each Month so even poorer people can play

[@MyUsualMe]

@@theGermanPrintingNerd Gotcha! Thanks for that clarification!

[@B1ackReign]

I get the hypothetical, but no sub is $20 a month. The average or even popular MMO is $15 a month. If they raise it more I won’t support that.

[@vicjar]

one of the best game ive ever played!!! for me worht it 100%

[@MyUsualMe]

I'll reserve my final thoughts after they update it a few more times. They really should fix their combat.

[@TakenCypress369]

Will not be buying or playing this because of the mystery price subscription later not even gonna bother trying it out no way to know what costs your getting into there for easy pass on pax dei

[@jayschmidt2196]

One off purchase OR subscription. No successful game has ever done both

[@ulgrim93]

I planned on buying the game, but I didn't know I would have to pay a monthly fee. Your video helped me to make sure to kick the game off my wishlist on Steam. Thank you. 😅

[@MyUsualMe]

If that's A dealbreaker for you, I'm glad you now know.

[@ulgrim93]

I rather pay once for a game and own it, being able to play whenever I want without extra cost.

[@phxbadash]

@@ulgrim93 that's all well and good for a single player game but MMO's have ongoing server costs as well as regular content updates. Do you think that all happens for free?

[@ulgrim93]

Nothing is free, but that won't change the fact that I don't like to be forced to subscribe to a game I already paid for, just so I can play. I played a bunch of MMO's that did well enough with no subscription system or an optional subscription system.

[@humblegiant4362]

Where did they say the price was gonna scale at a 1:1 ratio dude??? FF14 scales their sub for the retainers and its not 25 dollars per. Are you just making this up in your head? You think they gonna charge someone 80 dollars a month?

[@MyUsualMe]

That's the beauty of them not giving us a ratio. They can charge whatever they want. The only thing they said for sure is that they were going to charge us per plot. Per plot. I really hope I'm wrong. These comments will be interesting after EA is over.

[@humblegiant4362]

@@MyUsualMe right.. and for example ff14 is a 20 dollar sub lets say.. it scales by extra retainers.. which only raise the price by a couple of dollars per retainer. In the video it's not mentioned that we "think" it might scale thiis way. It's pretty much stated as a fact that its gonna be 20 dollars per plot.. that's just spreading lies and fear. Will the game be good? It could be absolute garbage... I was just calling out how bad the info was in the video that's all. I have no wish for pax dei to succeed or fail.. im indifferent at this time.

[@OlavSchneider]

It's safe to say, I'm never going to pay 20 bucks a Month to play a game.

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

Nobody knows what their pricing will be yet for the sub after EA.

[@tubbs819]

You dont know the pricing, youre panicking for what you think might happen. could be 3$ per plot, 4$ i mean why would you assume 10+? this is clickbait !!! you said "I had to get you this information" you didnt give information, you gave your opinion lol holy fuck im so bugged that i watched this video LMFAO grats bro you got me..

[@MyUsualMe]

Not clickbait at all. The information given is that they are going to charge players per month per plot. The only reason we have to speculate is they are keeping the cost vague so they can accordion the price up or down depending on how much pushback they get. So no, I'm not panicking, I'm informing. It's more than they have done. They should have an asterisk next to their plot amount on the sales page with a disclaimer. If that had happened, this video would never have been made.

[@tubbs819]

@@MyUsualMe Again... you didnt give any "Information" other than your opinion on what they might do. You made a video to make a video lol, i mean cool you got me.

[@Boonedale]

@@tubbs819 "Speculation" is still "Information" because it is "informative" of what someone may not notice. All your doing is nitpicking.

[@tubbs819]

@Boonedale how is it "informative" when NOTHING you claimed is factual? Lol it's simply for views.

[@twooldguyz]

Your making a LOT of assumptions concerning what MAY happen as if you have a crystal ball to see into the future. There are many reasons other than making money for setting up this Early Access pricing, and simply coming up with what you suspect MIGHT be their final subscription pricing based on this, expressing it as excessive, is short-sighted and alarmist. Let's let things play out. If they do price things as you say without providing true value, I'll respond by leaving. If not, i have saved myself from having to admit I was wrong, and possibly apologizing, and can show myself as someone willing to work through this growth with them as long as it takes.

[@MyUsualMe]

If you are suggesting that I may ever feel the need to apologize for pointing out a pricing structure that should be on the purchase page instead of being buried in a half sentence where few would see it, that won't happen. Should my three different possible pricing examples give others pause and reflection, so be it. If there is any pushback to make the devs temper their final price, so much the better. As you say, if they over price, the game is dead on arrival of full release. I hope I'm wrong. But I'll stand by my warning.

[@twooldguyz]

@@MyUsualMe Oh, I'm not talking about you apologizing for their pricing structure OR for pointing out that clause MAY be something to watch for. In fact, I'm not talking about you apologizing at all. I was speaking for myself: I would feel I had spoken negatively about someone or their plans without any direct communication with them on the matter, possibly causing someone else to be suspicious of them before their is a confirmed reason -- that's just me. You make a fair point about the message far down the page, but ONLY if they intend for plot maintenance to be a high expense. At this point, it would be an assumption to corelate the Early Access pricing with a future "maintenance fee" for plots. We have NO idea (and they may not either) what they will require for maintaining plots. For myself, I'm going to wait and see, confirming what I suspect before questioning...but again, that's just me.

[@Cody-jm9vq]

80$ a month to maintain your plots is a stretch bro

[@MyUsualMe]

Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. I'd like to believe the developers won't charge more but time will tell.

[@Picklelil]

Sadly its going to be a no from me. The sub thing will kill the game IMO, I think this was a poor choice.

[@MyUsualMe]

I get it. It'll be interesting to see what others think as well.

[@Isamma848]

EA will last at least 1 year, most likely more. There are no subs during the EA. Who cares after that. Most people who start the EA will leave the game anyway before the launch. That's such the way it is. It takes a few months at most for most people to get bored with any game.

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

The most successful MMO's out there are all sub based... If you can't save between .30 and .67 cents a day to go towards a months worth of fun. You honestly shouldn't be gaming at all and should be using that time to get a skilled trade or a degree or anything for that matter to help advance yourself financially.

[@Picklelil]

Well, that's a very narrow world view. I shouldn't be gaming at all?! People from all walks of life game. I have a highly skilled trade and degree which actually means I sometimes don't have very much time to dedicate to a game. I therefore prefer to be able to access any games I have without paying a monthly subscription.

[@Picklelil]

But the reason I think it will kill the game is that people will get bored of it and not sub so they won't have any players. But we'll see!

[@BlackWinds]

Nah, I'm out. Wanted to try this game, but if they are going to a subscription model after early access, I'm not interested. That's the main reason why I don't play FF14. I'm not paying $180 a year to play a game AND have to buy the expansions on top of it. ESO does it pretty well imo. Subscribe and get all the main expansions or you can play without a monthly subscription and pay a 1 time fee for each expansion that you want.

[@MyUsualMe]

ESO giving options is smart. More options is always preferable.

[@uberrod]

Why would you assume having two plots would mean a subscription doubled that of 1 plot and 4 plots would be a subscription doubled that of 2 plots? They only said scaling depending on number of plots. Could be $15, $18, and $20. Could be what you said, Could be anything in between. Could be $1, $5, $10. Could be anything. Yet you sound 100% convinced that it will be $20, $40, $80 per month. Now I'm not saying you have to be wrong, just that there's no justification or evidence for your claims at this point. And seriously you only need one character. Why waste time having a character who only does blacksmithing when the recipes tie in other crafts like woodworking and leatherworking? You would spend more time switching between characters than actually playing.

[@MyUsualMe]

Granted, I'm giving worst case scenarios here, I'll give you that however, I play enough games to see the shady, greedy things some devs get up to. This is simply a buyer beware video. And you're right, you don't need more than one character. Most people that want multiples switch so the appropriate gear is on the alt at all times. It's a convenience thing.

[@uberrod]

@@MyUsualMe Ok, I can see your point about subsriptions. But multiple characters I still don't get. What appropriate gear do you need for crafting other than the construction hammer and access to the appropriate workbench? None. Since there are no classes, it's not like you have a paladin character in plate armor, paladin exclusive abilities, and paladin weapons and an alt mage in cloth armor, mage exclusive abilities, and mage weapons. You can do everything on one character. Since magic is tied to items I can run around in plate armor and great sword, but since I added a gem to my chest armor I can now cast fireballs too. I see alts as ways of exploring other maps, or having an alt be a member of a clan while your main is solo, but not much point other than that.

[@GarryArthur-et8dg]

You are fake news they already stated you won’t be locked into the 4 plots of lane but it won’t be 80 dollars

[@MyUsualMe]

I never said either of those things were a thing. I warned people that IF they wanted to keep their plots they would have to pay a monthly fee for them upon full release. Don't put words into my mouth.

[@SwapwareGames]

its just an sandbox MMO NOT an MMO RPG. And you are WRONG you buy the game now and thats it ! - the future monthly fee only covers buying additional plots over and above the original product .. If you want to not upgrade you will not pay anything more for the game - thats the rules for early access !

[@MyUsualMe]

I wasn't talking about early access, I specifically quoted them on the full release monthly price.

[@SwapwareGames]

@@MyUsualMe yes but under the rules of early access even in full release they cannot charge a monthly fee if you have already purchased the game, they can however charge you a monthly fee on anything additional you purchase in the future being DLCs or additional plots of land - but you cannot be blocked from playing an early access game even in full release if you purchased the game in early access but they decide to add a monthly service fee model on full release, that will not apply to anyone thats already purchased the game - you cannot charge for early access then charge again at full release - thats against steams terms of service. However what they do for the non-steam version - thats there choice whether to scam loyal early access players for more money.

[@MyUsualMe]

@@SwapwareGames I think you'll find that you are mistaken once full release happens. Keep in mind they aren't double charging for the game. They are charging a subscription fee for each plot you use per month.

[@SwapwareGames]

@@MyUsualMe as i was saying the first plot doesnt count in the monthly fee as its covered by the initial purchase, so if you want to play with the original founders pack in full release you will not be subject to future monthly fees, only additional purchases thereafter..

[@MyUsualMe]

@@SwapwareGames Cite your sources for this please.

[@StreeterPerw]

I was waiting for this game just because of the building. Now seeing that, I'm out.

[@MyUsualMe]

Well, I would still wait until we get confirmation on the price point. It might be reasonable.

[@SlyRioga]

Just throwing out numbers

[@MyUsualMe]

I did! This way people can be aware of the incoming monthly land tax after full release.

[@SlyRioga]

@@MyUsualMe Yes they will have a sub upon full release, but you are just throwing out made up prices with no backing of how the monetization will actually work.

[@MyUsualMe]

@@SlyRioga They literally tell us how the pricing will work. QUOTE_ "This will be followed by a recurring fee for ongoing game access, which will vary based on the number of plots a player wishes to maintain."

[@SlyRioga]

@@MyUsualMe Yes, but you don't know if its doubled or quadrupled, you're just making assumptions on the prices of the sub in 1+ year(s), you don't actually know. it could be $10 a month and $5 per extra plot, WE don't know. They could discount on plot packs. WE don't know. I personally don't think they are going to charge $80 a month for 4 plots, but who knows, WE don't.

[@garydezern5212]

Hmm they're going that archage route with land plots.....that's a real shame as that's the very reason archage fumbled and lost the game.

[@MyUsualMe]

Archage did it this way? Interesting. See, this is why the discussion on the structure is important. I couldn't have asked for a better response from the community. Thanks!

[@garydezern5212]

@@MyUsualMe if a clan/guild is large enough, they could merge plots. I'm sure, eventually whole zones and hunting ground will be blotted out by mega structures. As for the plot space, people who had the gold(in-game currency) bout out 2-4 farming lots, mostly that was huge guilds or people who bought gold from outside. More over, the plots were limited, those plots you had to pay for I think within 3 days? Anyways, this will turn out the same, no matter how you look at it, space is limited, and only the massive guilds/clans or the whales will be able to afford it. Archage pretty much lost about 60% of it player base, not everyone could afford it, not everyone had a right to the lands, it's wasn't a fair distribution, and it was needed for quests.

[@Stevekpb]

Sorry, this is just hysterics considering information provided so far by the devs. There really isn't anything to back the pricing mentioned in this video, its doesn't make sense either. You could easily say the base sub is $20 like mentioned, and then you pay a set price for each additional piece of land you own. Which could be a fraction of the based sub cost. They would literally have to be brain dead to think someone would pay $80 a MONTH for 4 plots of land in a sub. Especially considering there size. 🤣 If they play it smart it would be more like FFXIV, and banking space (hopefully cheaper). Kinda cheap on their own, but quickly add up if you want the max. There is nothing to say plots of land can't be additional fees added to your monthly standard sub. I doubt buying the master pack would force people to pay for 4 plots in a sub no matter what on release either. It just doesn't make sense, sounds like a good way to scare of your entire customer base off. For all we know they could end up offering even more single plots of land outside these numbers down the track. There is no information to come up with a conclusion on this. This is all just speculation, I think people need to calm down till we actually have the information. 😆 In the end as long as you get the value/hours out of the pack you choose prior to full release, there really is no issue here. Just move onto something else if the sub is unreasonable.

[@MyUsualMe]

I love how some of these comments focus solely on the $80/ month price point I used and completely ignore the other two price points I mentioned. They were examples. And no, we don't know. And every comment that rebuts my "speculation" is also speculating. But this video has generated enough interest that I am 100% sure the developers are catching and will continue to catch feedback. Like you said, they would be out of their minds to overcharge but I've seen studio after studio do exactly that in recent years. Time will tell.

[@Stevekpb]

​@@MyUsualMe That's fair, and I did also listen to your other points, and I agree. They need to be watched carefully, and its good you gave a warning shot through your channel. I just think it would be better to keep away from mentioning any figures/dread scenarios with out any info released yet, and mentioning a $80 month sub has to be up there on the extremes for MMO subs. 😆 Especially when the devs haven't even picked their poison yet. But I understand with the way devs/publishers act these days it can be pretty hard to trust them. It would just be a shame if they actually planned to be reasonable for sub, only to have the game killed by the community before it even hit the ground properly. There seems to be a lot of outrage based around the fact they even mentioned something as basic as a sub for MMO which is pretty crazy. Let alone the other things they mentioned.

[@MyUsualMe]

@@Stevekpb Yeah, I look at it this way. Better to have a few people mad and not purchase now than have people not read the fine print and revolt En masse later and kill their game entirely.

[@Stevekpb]

@@MyUsualMe Yeah that's fair enough. Hopefully they don't kill this game with greed when they finally present us with their business model they have been hiding. 😆

[@MyUsualMe]

@@Stevekpb Let's hope haha.

[@fatjay9402]

Also .. i would not pay 20 Dollars for a MMO... unless is the best game ever...

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

It's a cheap price for a month's worth of fun. Literally you would need to save .67 cents a day, which most people spend way more than that on frivolous garbage. It really isn't expensive at all.

[@woundedsqrl]

20 a month is not cheap considering the price of everything these days. It will absolutely cut the amount of people playing in half right at the start, maybe even more.

[@fatjay9402]

@@woundedsqrl yes ... if thats the price .. but also ... the fact that this game gonna be pretty limited ... big groups can controll everything.

[@rickskynight98]

Who the fuck cares if it's $1,000 a year to play the game with 4 plots of land.. Are you enjoying the game? Yes/No?? If no then don't do it.. Plenty of crappier games you can play that are free but you won't enjoy as much. What's more important to you?

[@MyUsualMe]

That's really what it boils down to. If people see value, they will pay what they think it's worth.

[@willyboy809]

No game is worth that money

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

There are plenty of games that are worth the money to play.

[@willyboy809]

​@northernfabricationllc2281 name, what game is worth 80$ a month???

[@willyboy809]

@@northernfabricationllc2281 can you name 1 game that's worth 80$ a month?

[@rambaral340]

Starting to sound like some nft land plot Bullshit kinda "game"

[@MyUsualMe]

No, they just need to be transparent with their pricing. It's their system, they know how much they will need to keep it up and running per plot. My concern is why they chose to not disclose that number to the players now? It smelled off so I said something. It will be interesting to see in a year or two if my instincts were right.

[@Machiavelli959]

The price is insanely high

[@MyUsualMe]

Thanks for commenting!

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

Insanely high? How do you figure?

[@bobbythorton7693]

40$ for 1 year of gameplay and some extra stuff and to get started no on the 1000$ a year for 4 plots or paying monthly per plot at that cost is dumb. So many castles will fall apart from failed payment. I see them raising the price on plots. But plots in a big guild you really only need 1. So people who pay for that are just getting extra that won't really benefit that much.

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

It isn't going to be anywhere near that. Mr. Usual is spreading some really bad misinformation in this video I don't think it was intentional but he is way off In left field. He needs to research games better before he starts telling lies that arent true that turn people away from a game. The game itself will have a sub of around 10 dollars a month, maybe 15. And the sub price will be based possibly off the number of plots you want. They have also hinted at have a no sub option for people, you just would have to join up with a clan and utilize their plots. The EA price is a one time thing. Once release hits you wont have to repurchase the game and the plots you have with yoir founder pack will not be tied to your account on release so you're forced to pay for those plots that came with your package. You'll have the choice to choose how many you want or possibly none at all if you wanted to go the free route. I tried to explain to Mr. Usual about the bad misinformation in his video but he either does t care or refuses to respond. He by all rights should delete this video and make a new one containing actual factual information.

[@bobbythorton7693]

@@northernfabricationllc2281 are you a dev? Just curious on the info. Don't want to pay monthly for extra plots

[@norbertnagy8767]

this game die 2-3 Months

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

You fail to understand the amount of people that will be playing a game like this. Especially once they start working through EA and adding all the other features.

[@norbertnagy8767]

@@northernfabricationllc2281 this game only building and farming, buged not balanced empty word

[@nohandlenotme]

Usual i think you aren making it happen😊!

[@MyUsualMe]

What do you mean? Making what happen?

[@nohandlenotme]

@@MyUsualMe I meant are making more videos that are a little different from what you have done in the past!

[@MyUsualMe]

@@nohandlenotme Ah, ok.

[@nohandlenotme]

@@MyUsualMe Remember I had to change my name from oldschool, dang it.

[@WayneStapleton]

Your making a HUGE assumption here.

[@MyUsualMe]

Check out the comments to see my responses on this.

[@Kesen2003]

🙃

[@fatjay9402]

but WOW has 1000000000000000000000 times more content :)... this game doesnt have a combat system or NPCs.. etc

[@TB2K08]

WoW had the sub at launch when there was way less content. PD has dungeons etc already and alot more will be fleshed out be launch

[@fatjay9402]

@@TB2K08 Way less content that PAX DEI ? how ? they had NPC, storys ,, etc... are you coping ?

[@TB2K08]

Way less content then they do now not than PD. While there will not be NPCs there will be a form of quests with items hinting at you to go places and there is definitely a story of which they have released some and the dungeons have paintings in them depicting parts of it. PD will also have player driven religions and knights that other players and swear fealty to and they can join forces to create baronies and they can join into kingdoms and declare war. You can't compare wow to a game 2 short alpha tests in. For the EA the packs end up ranging from $3.33 to $8.33 a month or less which is not a lot.

[@Lotus_Lenex]

Subscription is the model. It's a live service game. Don't make them add a cash shop, plz. Just pay for the content you are getting!

[@Lotus_Lenex]

It's a base level subscription, not a a separate fee for each plot. It means a sliding scale for # of plots. That's not the same thing as a flat fee for plots. If that was the case they would say so. Don't be absurd... You have a responsibility with your platform to not speculate so dangerously. It's fair to assume the sub will be btwen $10-50. Life is feudal failed because it didn't have viable server space, not bcuz no one played it. This is not a developer with many projects, so they don't have incentive to scam ppl with a crappy project. Shame on you! You are extremely excessive in your terminology. Up takes as much space as out. When you buy 1 plot to get 4 plots vertical > that is exploitative. Not capping the vertical You are speaking out of every side of your mouth right now seemingly demanding that people get more product for the same as those who get less. That's not how consumption works. Lastly, your constant straw mans of retorts are beyond facile

[@MyUsualMe]

I love how much you've commented on this! I can't tell if you are a developer or a massive fan. Either way, the discussion on this is exactly what I wanted. Thanks for the engagement!

[@pvprangergod4024]

for the low low price of 100 euros, you too can build a house. (which will be deleted in 1 year)

[@MyUsualMe]

Well it's 100 USD so that might be more in Euros, right? To be fair, you are buying the land plots so you can still have your house if you want to pay the tax man every month per plot.

[@OlavSchneider]

It's less in Euro but I think in the Euro zone you have to add VAT to the asking price.

[@northernfabricationllc2281]

Someone apparently doesn't understand EA.

[@johnski4709]

I bought the Master Pack. I have the money and do not mind supporting the developers. So later on I have to pay a little more for my four plots. Okay. I am good with it. Why does it bother you?

[@MyUsualMe]

It doesn't bother me. I simply want people to be aware of the possibility of the coming costs.

[@bobbythorton7693]

it should not be 1000$ a year for 4 plots my guy but i don't think it will be

[@lurknlurch]

I agree

[@Tigs2]

John your comment is arrogant and crap. So what if it doesn’t bother you. The vid was not made as a 1-2-1 for YOU. It is made to give facts to members of a gaming community so that EVERYONE can make an informed decision. Let me know what guilds and alliances you start so i can avoid them.

[@johnski4709]

@@Tigs2No one need your 'help'. People can make up their own minds. Everything spouted on this info-video was scare-mongering opinion. If you don't like the pricing, don't buy it. Stop trying to cancel culture the rest of us.

[@grumpy_goat]

i am with you on this bicas i dont have a lot of money i whas look for this game so long but this pay every month thing put this game of the rails bicas i cant pay that and keep my son feed at the same time why do the always try to rip ppl of why not make it like you say 1 or 2 doller a month

[@MyUsualMe]

Well, we don't know how much per month it will be so we can hope for the best but this is a company so who knows.

[@Kesen2003]

🫠

[@Lotus_Lenex]

What pricing structure would you do? Mmos fail because they try to give too much away for free. You are part of the problem with this content. $20/month is not predatory. Go play AAA live service.

[@Zirichel_]

He's referring to paying for the plots on top of the monthly subscription. Obviously monthly money coming in would be great. Nobody can disagree with that. Especially if there are millions of players monthly paying the subscription, that's millions of dollars a month, but how much money do they really need? I for one don't want to pay monthly to play a video game. I prefer the one time purchase, but I can see both sides of the argument. On one hand it is fairly predatory. Again, how much money do they really need. I'd personally prefer that they create cosmetics and a shop and in game currency. I'll grind harder if it means I can play for free. The people who will pay to play and get ahead will do that and I'm sure they'll make money enough to play and pay to win. It happens in plenty of games. Or they could make a model similar to Runescape where there's member's only content. I would appreciate that. I might even pay for a subscription if I like the game enough, but not if I don't have to. And if I have to pay for a subscription then I won't play this game, and that's just my personal take. I'm sure there are plenty of people who are okay with making a monthly purchase and view it as supporting the devs. On the other hand there are people who view it as predatory because they paid to gain access to the game, why should they have to keep paying to maintain their access? If that's the case, just do a subscription and once you've signed up for the subscription then play the game based off the subscription. Again, I can see both sides here, but this is just a little nudge to realize that your opinion is not the only opinion and it's not the only way.