Peer-to-Peer Lending, China's $200 Billion Ponzi Scheme

[@rebeltheharem7028]

P2P lending sounds like a genius idea. But then you remember why we have credit scores for a reason.

[@edznyc]

the only reason we have credit scores in the west is for the banking industry to keep you borrowing and paying fees and interests. your score is actually crap if you don't use their services, even if you've never defaulted on or paid a bill late, and actually only spend what you make.

[@91chaves]

@@edznyc the "west" does not have credit scores. Just 2 or 3 countries in them have them. The majority (90%) does not have them

[@edznyc]

@@91chaves i wouldn't count LATAM as the west, as many if not all of those countries are considered the global south. with that said certainly all the larger western powers use credit scores, including the US, UK, spain, france, germany, australia, canada, and the netherlands. many european countries that make up the rest of the west, who don't are smaller and/or former eastern block countries. so absolutely more than 10% use credit scores, and not 2 or 3... that's just totally wrong.

[@91chaves]

I live in the Netherlands and I dont have a credit score... I am actually searching to see if I missed something. I already applied for loans and no one ever mentioned that. There is some sort of credit score when it comes to know your payment history, but that is about it and it is information centralised in the central bank. They do not work like in the USA where they try to push you for more and more credit. I am in a hurry now, but I suggest you taking a look, American credit score is not the same as the one in most European countries. I could be wrong, but I would be very very surprised if I was tbh

[@jonsnow7844]

"No loans were ever made." For a peer to peer lending platform? Did nobody notice?

[@bobchipman4473]

GM never misses out on a good opportunity to lose money.

[@TrueGrantsta]

GM essentially cancelled the deal waaaay back in 2021. It never contributed any money to lose. No idea why this video is talking about GM & Nikola as it has nothing to do with chinese ponzi schemes.

[@789know]

Tho in that case GM pretty much lost nothing

[@wlee9888]

They didn't lose money in the deal...it was as good for GM as it could get. WSM did a whole video on it back then, I'm pretty certain.

[@Fishstycz]

@@789know Except for a bit more of their reputation

[@rebeltheharem7028]

@@Fishstycz Their reputation couldn't get any lower anyways.

[@louisnemzer6801]

You can't lose money on risky loans if you never make any actual loans😎

[@briandbeaudin9166]

Yes, you can! If the loan administrator spends your money on fast cars, fast women and mansions!

[@Leosarebetter]

I worked for a boiler room "organization" the company started out with the boss, me and one other in a back room. Just 24 months later we had close to 50 staff and 3 whole floors. I was a team manger with 7 people under me. Me and my team were consistently at the top of monthly sales. I could see things were getting out of hand and even more outlandish so I pulled the plug and resigned. About 3 months after I quit the company was raided by around 20 Fed Police and Financial Investigators and shut down. Greed works both ways, from the sales team to the customer/victim and changes people. Just watch out for the signs of a scam people and stay safe.

[@pegcity4eva]

I worked at one also. For one afternoon. Made it one day then i noped out. Owner ended up thrown out of a 30 story balcony and the managers both went to jail.

[@tomlxyz]

What changed it from legit to scam?

[@pixelgamer2579]

@@pegcity4evaI had a similar experience with timeshares. Shadowed a single tour with a top rep and said no way.

[@bw1247]

whole bunch of us got ripped off in UK with Saving Stream aka Lendy. 7 years on and we are still clawing back pennies.

[@MakerInMotion]

I just can't grasp how people running a ponzi scheme can enjoy spending the money knowing the whole thing will collapse and they'll be arrested. How satisfying can buying luxury cars be if you know they will be seized and auctioned off later?

[@alabastertheunicorn3204]

I guess they think they'll enjoy a few years of glamorous lifestyle and then jail

[@TheWarmDown_MMA]

@@BracaPhotocan I ask what the grift was? And how it all turned out for you after it crashed

[@xiaoka]

Madoff got away with it for decades….

[@D_Winds]

They can't catch you if you drive really fast!

[@letsgobrandon416]

They think they will be able to get away with it forever because spending money you didn't earn makes you do stupid things, it's a slippery slope. You took a few tens of thousands of $$ from the til to buy a luxury car and nothing bad happened. Then you take a few hundred thousand to buy a better home, and nothing bad happened. Before you know it, you are taking millions from the til to buy luxury homes, cars, boats, etc because you've falsely believed that nothing bad will happen because nothing had happened yet - until it does. It's the exact same way people get in over their head with debt, especially credit cards. You spend, nothing bad happens, your monthly payment goes up, you spend some more, and the payment goes up slightly, but that change is a month away. You don't see it immediately. That delayed penalty is what gets people in trouble. Where they started spending a few hundred extra here or there, in a short order they are spending thousands extra they don't have and then the bill comes do, and their monthly minimum payment is more than they have left over to pay and now they realize they screwed themselves over.

[@yogodagorah5928]

I don’t know how you consistently produce videos of such high quality at such a fast rate, but please keep up the great work. Your work is fantastic, informative, accurate, and comprehensive. I’d never even heard of P2P lending in China prior to this, so thank you for educating me on the subject.

[@abbaday1200]

cause most of the videos are copypasta with his voiceover

[@HarishBabuM]

@@abbaday1200 yes, but where & how is he get to know about such case studies, frauds, scams etc,.

[@uvwxyzero]

@@abbaday1200And yet here you are watching and hating at the same time 😂😂😂😂😂😂. Hating ass

[@looptimelapse]

it's called planning - you could try it

[@abbaday1200]

@@looptimelapse it's just theft

[@ducknorris233]

A bit humorous that actual giving peer to peer loans would have been even more reckless than a Ponzi scheme.

[@george6977]

Globally P2P lending is to sub prime borrowers to whom banks are not prepared to lend. What could possibly go wrong? In a deep recession when defaults rise we will see.

[@abhinav5847]

not really every risk comes with a price, if you can price interest with risk theoratically it can work.

[@amyx231]

P2P is a thing here in the US too. Very favorable rates for borrowers. Risky for lenders - the platform takes a fee but only 1 iirc actually guarantees anything back if the borrower runs. That one, you basically bought insurance - which makes sense.

[@Visiontech]

Your videos have a professional but sped up pace! This is quick but sooo much more information and that's great!!!

[@Chubbylito11]

if family and friends can run away from their borrowed money from you, how much more a stranger?

[@qwaszxerdfcvtyghvb]

very useful and informative as usual, great piece of documentary that gave us a glance of a completely unknown business.

[@chapagawa]

The P2P industry in China sounds like a copy of LendingClub which worked okay in the US without the fraudulent part.

[@bacool]

Lots of parallels with the cesspool that is the crypto industry today. Except crypto is worse as most people get hacked with zero recourse

[@bacool]

This will be the eventual fate of crypto industry

[@vanesslifeygo]

It has been the future of every shitcoin before the shitcoins currently out on the market. This is unacceptable but people are stupid so it continues.

[@looppp]

It already is

[@rebeltheharem7028]

Biggest ponzi scheme yet. Keeps crashing, yet people keep buying into the scheme. Crypto is literally the definition of a ponzi scheme - a form of fraud in which belief in the success of a nonexistent enterprise is fostered by the payment of quick returns to the first investors from money invested by later investors. It would be great if the US would ban it, and very hilarious.

[@psychopathgains2510]

Right because it’s widely widely widely adopted now by basically the entire world, and sure it’s going to be like this😂 the crypto market is the only competition to Wall Street.

[@bacool]

@@psychopathgains2510 next time will be far worse than FTX and the 10 others. Watch. 1-2 years.

[@VinegarMoneyGrows]

p2p lending sounds exactly like crypto lending companies

[@brookss2141]

Ding Ning needs his own movie. He's like the Chinese Wolf of Wall st.

[@Strykenine]

These guys are literally all the same. CZ, SBF, Machinsky, this guy. A generation of jackals that knows no bounds of religion, ethnicity or nationality. Really a warm and fuzzy feeling inside.

[@n0madfernan257]

local govt are not regulating these online lending and gambling apps which leads to victims thinking it is just easy money without any worries.

[@Exilis]

"They never made loans to anyone. " "They opened up brick and mortar retail locations all across China." Didn't people go to these brick and mortar locations to apply for loans? And no one's application for a loan was ever approved? And this didn't spread around by word of mouth or any other means?

[@3xHamid]

So basically uber for loan sharking 😅. Investors forgot to hire enforcers to break people's knees.👍

[@samsonsoturian6013]

Also impossible to enforce collection. At least pawn shops will keep personal items as collateral

[@oatmealcookies916]

Did T.Swift accept the FTX deal? I thought her team asked some prodding questions and turned them down?

[@sandworm9528]

Turns out she tried to play it off like that but really she accepted but it fell through for some other reason

[@laylah150]

​@sandworm9528 lucky for her the deal didnt pull through. She would've had egg on her face

[@KiwiCatherineJemma]

It would have been worth T.Swift getting some egg on her face, if she walked away with an extra $100 Million of cash stuffed into the back pocket of her jeans !

[@CatsMeowPaw]

It always puzzles me how someone with this much cash doesn't just flee the country. 1.5 years living in luxury versus a life sentence. Yeah, that totally seems worth it 😂

[@Youtuberkt]

they didn't expect their fate to be sealed so fast?

[@blackpearlbp]

Wolf of wall street, the guy just got too addicted to his own bs

[@anthonyorwa447]

It's extremely difficult to move money out of China

[@amandasmith1920]

It absolutely is not unfeasible to do due diligence for every advertisement you take if you care about your reputation.

[@johnoldfield2390]

The loan application blocks every time from every provider and then doesn’t release and just gets stuck.

[@jackryan9183]

2:23 That's Chinatown in New York City. Not CHINA.

[@Harald111th]

I think the author doesn't care about the facts, it's about making China look bad, it's part of politics and has nothing to do with the truth.

[@williamchamberlain2263]

2:43 by "need to invest" you mean "can be exploited to acquire"

[@frankmuller0.029]

From SMEs and start-ups standpoint, P2P could have been a saviour in a life-and-death situation as traditional banks and institutional funds only look at past operating results (even for a start-up? this bunch of crooks don’t deserve a big fat salary!) before agreeing to lend.

[@santosakowski9846]

@@anon_148 Exactly, 4 out of 5 new businesses fail in the first 5 years, and that rate rises to 9 out of 10 small businesses that fail in 10 years! The odds are stacked against all small businesses. In fact, all business ventures are risky.

[@mimi21746]

@@anon_148 , but still there is a need to invest/lend to SMEs and start-ups, if you need to grow the economy.

[@johnyossarian9059]

This is not entirely true. Venture capital funds regularly back starts up with no past operating results. VCs don't make money on most of their investments, but the one or two investments that make it can more than cover these loses.

[@mimi21746]

@@johnyossarian9059 Hardware and hard tech start-ups don't do VC most of the time. Same as fintech. They also borrow loans.

[@silversurfer8237]

Great documentary on Ponzi Schemes. Maybe you can give up your take on 1MDB in a future video: that was an elaborate scheme too.

[@user-zo6xg8bx4l]

There NEVER is, or has been, an easy way to make money. If a scheme looks easy, IT IS A SCAM.

[@perfectallycromulent]

inheriting money is the easy way to make it. if you check the backgrounds of many rich people in the news, you will find out they started out rich from birth. lots of billionaires like to pretend coming from a family of multimillionaires means they worked for their wealth instead of merely having the money to take advantage of every opportunity that came their way from birth.

[@ericthecyclist]

@@perfectallycromulent I had a classmate in university who came from a wealthier than average family. At a time when the rest of us were renting the cheapest places we could find, he had a modest condo. I think his real advantage was that his father taught him the basics of investing and they invested in stocks together. A big part of the advantage of wealthy parents is being taught how to get richer.

[@rs-dp6pr]

Yeah still remember when that happened.. the rate of expansion was crazy and they ran out of things to buy. The guy barely graduated from elementary school..

[@AnP865]

Hey man could you do a video about SLAPP lawsuits?

[@matuko313]

2:23 Um.. this b-roll is Chinatown in NYC, not China.

[@sawgames8623]

racists can't tell the difference

[@emilyhangxiong2271]

enzo noble gathering circle... sounds like something from a romance novel

[@deepaktora5963]

9:30 Sounds like FTX

[@Snowolf1984]

Swipe right if she's attractive enough to run your company

[@residentdpl1007]

Amazing and informational.

[@johnoldfield2390]

They don’t put in minimums maximums and countering for topups.

[@001sander2]

Peer to peer lending is an interesting concept, I wonder if he realized it could never work and decided to go ponzi 🤔

[@josesamala1801]

Communist China is the WORLD FACTORY for SCAMS, FAKE NEWS.DONOT TRUST ANYTHING MADE IN CHINA.

[@rebeltheharem7028]

It can work, you just need people to be honest. Too bad people aren't honest.

[@kuukeli]

thank you for the video

[@JS-jh4cy]

Billions now we are talking about real amounts of money 💰

[@zuggernautz]

thx!

[@Mauiwowie05]

Wall Street such an honest place to work

[@dianagama3390]

Wait, how come the median saving is 45%?

[@bbwblk]

Different culture. I'm Dutch and people over here are also notorious savers. Not so good for the economy, but at least we're not racked up in household debt.

[@auraguard0212]

China: "How did this happen?" China's DoJ: "You didn't do due diligence." China: "Can you rephrase that in a way that doesn't make me feel dumb?" _pout_

[@robertthompson1254]

When someone is in front of Congress it's usually the person has done something illegal. It's not a validation of them. It's the road to prison for some.

[@Fishstycz]

"Although it never cost GM anything"... Reputation??? I find it bizarre that so many large companies have been hoodwinked by dodgy schemes recently. It makes a mockery of the term "due diligence".

[@christopherd.winnan8701]

This is a fascinating topic, which deserves a more in depth approach. This video portrayed P2P lending in a very poor light, simply because it was not able to work with Chinese characteristics. It would have been better if you had also shown some successful examples of P2P lending schemes.

[@shantoakter3124]

like?

[@letsburn00]

Kiva is a good service for this.

[@christopherd.winnan8701]

@@shantoakter3124 I am only familiar with successful schemes that are in Africa, such as Zidisha, for example. Of all the P2P schemes in China, was everyone shit down as a ponzi scheme? What are all those that are still operating?

[@christopherd.winnan8701]

@@letsburn00 Another excellent example.

[@Pacific222]

It's a great audio, talking is very informative. But the pictures keep repeating.

[@lastempire7302]

What is not a "scam" in China? The entire Chinese government body is the largest MLM scheme in the world.

[@michaewelina7983]

2nd actually... straight after USA

[@oldleatherhandsfriends4053]

the problem s companies arent started to be profitable anymore but to get investors.

[@MasayaShida]

didnt expect to see my PM's face in a video about chinese p2p lending lol

[@artfulandtricky]

In prison, ding ding will get his ding ding violated

[@johnoldfield2390]

That’s so bad to have so much money and not use any for inputs.

[@WillT25]

Old news. Whether peer to peer or shadow banking a lot of debt is unreported. And this prior to China deciding they no longer needed to report economic numbers. Not that the numbers previously made public bore any resemblance to face.

[@abuferasabdullah]

Amazing episode, Chinese convey a bad image in money lending

[@greylatern]

Liberalize the financial market....you must mean libertarian. Because there was no regulations...or over sight.

[@picanha694]

no wonder the mainland Chinese come to Indonesia to open up peer to peer lending here.

[@masterliu1892]

If I don’t take out a loan, the capitalists won’t be able to cut me leeks

[@theminer49erz]

Not feasible to perform Due diligence on each advertiser or not AS profitable? There are many hurdles to jump to run a business that makes even a fair amount of money in order to operate a sound ethical business. Us small business/independent operation owners always have to adhere to all of them and one slip up is the end. However, all too often not only do the large businesses, banks, etc get away with actting w/o decent ethics, the are often revered for obscene practices. Usually resulting in many less fortunate people suffering even more. At the very least they should be looked down upon for their heartless behaviors, but some prosecutions, regulations, and general denouncement would be ideal. Its disgusting to contemplate what "we" have normalized.

[@protasiocanalita6436]

Imagine this news the shorts target or the cross hairs are truly very rivh snd it is s plethora of targets now, getting playing field even is vrry intersting huh???;

[@screenwriterjohn]

It's not a pyramid scheme. It's an inverse funnel!

[@johnyossarian9059]

In any developing economy, especially one like China that has been experiencing very high growth percentage for years, there are many scammers because the regulating/monitoring institutions are not yet mature enough and investors are not yet educated or experienced enough. Even in the most advanced economy like the US with many highly sophisticated investors we still see so many scams. A country like China that used to practice command economy (aka communism) is like a paradise for these scammers because there are so many legal loopholes they can exploit as a result of the ongoing transition from command to market economy. I have also noticed the same thing happening in other developing countries. As their economies grow, the regulations and laws are playing catch up with economic development and criminals often take advantage of this fact. That is one of the big reasons for the so-called "social credit score". Contrary to what many believe, it doesn't seek to regulate every single person's behavior. It is more about regulating a person or a company's economic behavior. People or companies that have behaved badly in economic terms (not paying loans/debt, breaking business contracts, etc) get punished and put in a black list.

[@SuperPlayz]

You should do a video on Spongetech

[@tonysu8860]

I assume what this video calls "P-P lending" is what more broadly was called the "micro loans" part of China's fintech industry. Of course Ponzi schemes are illegal, but I wonder if at least some of the businesses that were shut don tried to operate legitimately? Although it's impossible to believe any of the financial data published in China about anything Chinese, it should probably have been possible to do a superficial analysis of any company's business model. Although non-analytical folk have no clue how to analyze a business, there should be a cottage industry of analysts in China able to do proper analysis like there is practically everywhere else in the world who understand the circumstances and environment operating in the Chinese economy. Regardless how things turned out in China, there's probably a place and means to operate an online micro-loan business anywhere in the world subject to applicable regulations.

[@arniyo3903]

This is not Ponzi scheme..this is how bank works, they have to maintain 20% reserve ratio only..which means on every 100$ they loan , they keep only 20$ and the is mutliplies as the no of transactions increases

[@jimihendrix991]

...actually it is only 10%...

[@michaewelina7983]

@@jimihendrix991 0%

[@lv7603]

I too am guilty of placing too much faith on the Cambodian prime minister.

[@shazbots]

Man, this stuff kinda reminds me of the FTX scandal.

[@studyou1016]

lol bro used video stock footage of HK and Chinatown NYC when talking about China

[@loupasternak]

Im as greedy as he next guy, but never put 1 cent into any ptp

[@SolidSonicTH]

I'd totally do P2P lending if I could also insure the money I lend out somehow. Let someone else take the crash when the dingus doesn't pay up...

[@samsonsoturian6013]

The excess savings is suspect. Even at the height of the bubble in China people were spending as much as 3/4 wages on mortgages. I don't know how or why that data would be manipulated though

[@luting3]

I am Chinese. I think those number are correct from people I am familiar with

[@samsonsoturian6013]

​@luting3 Come on. We all know you'd say that regardless if it were true. And we know for a fact the majority of Chinese people do not have bank accounts at the moment due to the bank crisis last year. But on second thought, that may explain the skew, as it may be the few people who still use banks have lots of money. For instance, the savings rate of a criminal racketeer may exceed 100% since he must launder ill gotten gains.

[@ThePeterDislikeShow]

Probably skewed to the top. The wealthy save 99% while the poor live paycheck to paycheck.

[@luting3]

@@samsonsoturian6013 If you are willing to believe those false information from Western Media, I could not stop you. Everyone, I am telling you every single adults, I know have bank accounts. You could not survive in China without one since all payments include your payment going through banking system. Chinese government often gives propaganda information but most of Chinese people I know could tell the liars. Unfortunately, lots of people here still blindly believe media and willing to listen they would like to hear. Sorry for that.

[@luting3]

That is completely false. Most of Chinese already fully paid off their houses. Only small amount of recent buyers in big city are going through mortgages. For some of those people, they could May up to 3/4 of their incoming. But that is extremely small portion of people.

[@greylatern]

It's a good idea with regulation.

[@АгронДепартье]

Life in prison (Chinese prison and not US/European resort) - right solution.

[@armchairwomanmao2922]

LOL 😂

[@FellTheSky]

Similar scams? Yeah. It's called bitcoin (and similar)

[@jamesecarson5631]

cannot stop laughing; this was a "bank" not peer to peer lending. what a joke

[@stormryder4305]

See? $250 millions dollars of investors money went into his mistress' pocket. They always have to fund their concubines luxury lifestyle, with their investors money.

[@nomanejane5766]

🎉🎉🎉

[@gera.w]

yep totally sounds like sam bankman fraud copied this p2p lending like a textbook 😂

[@shuxiongbao2698]

$ has become the One world religion

[@jamesroop2233]

AND FRAUD.

[@TiberianFiend]

WSM had to open this video with apologies for his people.

[@ArtyomGalstyan]

Why making a ponzi scheme out of this if he could just make a real business? what a stupid scammer.

[@davidallen8611]

Yessssssss

[@IkeSpeaksUp]

My man really needed a woman that badly he risked it all.

[@gexpe2003]

❤

[@MrScientifictutor]

Its all about that face, bout that face, no checking.

[@LongLivesteph]

I thought Taylor swift pulled out the deal

[@TaoDeChing-ls5gz]

LOL

[@sherkhead9638]

He spent 150 million on women!?? Damn they came up lol

[@tigbuh1283]

China, china, china, china....

[@kenscott9656]

good jail is the least

[@TungTran-pp3tx]

Sounds like crypto playbook.

[@genocidegrand2057]

saw this way back then. looks good to be true and im right

[@passenger175]

-75% payback. Haha. Poor investors

[@laylah150]

They should also ban crypto in the west.

[@babelfishdude]

Pssh, not even close to NASA, who somehow seems to regress in space exploration technology every year for the last 50 years even given a straight off the top percentage of overall USA tax collection.

[@duncanthaw6858]

This it just FTX innit