PFL & Bellator NOW in BIG TROUBLE... TRUTH REVEALED!

Josh Thomson and John McCarthy breakdown the potential for ufc to gain plenty of new fighters from the PFL and Bellator after concerning news has come out, regarding fighters struggling to get fights booked along with being kept in the dark, while they waste their fight careers away. Dana White predicted the downfall of the mma promotions and now Josh and John give their honest reaction.
Full Podcast: • UFC Macau and BIG FIGH...

[@Trevlee74]

Well we know PFL not paying these two anymore.

[@JusticeDem87]

I was thinking the same. Their contracts expired

[@rockybalboa3150]

Thinking same , they are being truthful on this but they bit their tongue before when still on the payroll

[@ggeeoofff]

so they know more info since theyve been there and dont have to hold back

[@davidsmith2132]

Lmao. So true.

[@art_of_comedy3241]

Its ironic that francis said he wants to help fighters and thats one of the main reasons he signed to pfl but his contract put a lot of fighters out of business because they don't have anymore money to pay the others

[@mr.brenman2132]

He's also completely unqualified to have any executive position. Don't forget about Jake Paul's contract either.

[@chicoperico]

you really think these fighters care about other fighters? they care about their themselves only.they pretend to care about others by acting like they are on high horse crap. say what you say about UFC, without UFC, theres no MMA and no money for any fighters. i recall these fighters how much they praised PFL but look whats happening now. Its very simple,if you dont like UFC,sign with other MMA organization.its a free country.

[@Kancerru]

Turns out Dana was actually being honest for once when he said Ngannou's demands were unreasonable and insane.

[@KrikZ32]

That's on the company though, they have the numbers to know whether a deal is doable or not, not Francis.

[@Kcutthth]

Francis puts on an act. Many people have said he’s two faced. Teddy Atlas has a story about him, Dana does but I question much of what he says

[@__M738]

Bellator pfl ect will not ever compete with the UFC.

[@misterclownface]

Thanks captain obvious.

[@Matthew-vu9qi]

Well no 💩

[@thepipsterdufus]

I think he means, 'Bellator, PFL, etc., will never be as good as the UFC.' Lofty. Haha.

[@tommygunnggg1127]

It's a monopoly no one will be able to compete, but they blew the chance to try to be a distant 2

[@wooltank6877]

No but they could've gone head to head with some of these dogshit unranked Apex main events but PFL is run by guys who don't wtf they're doing

[@jayp1013]

Pfl should have immediately shut down Bellator and absorbed the fighters. You have to put on a consistent product, running a show once a month isn’t going to work..

[@mr.brenman2132]

The PFL season formal is ridiculous. The Bellator purchase was ridiculous. Bellator was worth nothing.

[@aslanlovett4059]

​@@mr.brenman2132 but bellator fighters were on average better then pfl ones, it was proven. But they need to merge the two not leave them in this dumb limbo

[@KrikZ32]

@@mr.brenman2132 Bellator was at their all time peak, they actually had several interesting high level fighters. They were doing way better than PFL and that shows with how PFL has run them into the ground.

[@mr.brenman2132]

@@KrikZ32 Not financially they weren't. They were going out of business.

[@mr.brenman2132]

@@aslanlovett4059 Bellator was going out of business. They could have gotten the fighters they wanted. Now they can't pay half of them.

[@Jjweeks01]

Big surprise 😂 when they signed Francis it was over. They had no plans for him and still don’t. There’s nobody for him to fight

[@MMA_Jackal]

They need to cut the bullshit with the goofy ass PFL season bullshit. Put all the fighters under one banner and start holding events CONSISTENTLY and on Friday nights!!! Don’t try and go head to head with them ufc, give mma fans some content when the ufc ISN’T have a show

[@_cohen]

Trying to hard to put on these big fights they don’t even have a stable promotion. No one actually watches that shit. If anyone is watching mma outside of ufc it’s gonna be ONE. All the great fighters in/from Bellator need a miracle for their careers

[@rparas34]

Dana White is always RIGHT about PFL & Bellator. Hilarious

[@milesdvd]

Number 1 complaint in ufc is fighter pay.. let’s not act like dana isn’t a cheap mf as well.. pfl not the only ones even the big company holding their fighters.

[@rparas34]

@milesdvd The fighters truly can't complain. They and their management team signed the contracts. It is what it is.

[@milesdvd]

@@rparas34 agreed

[@buckbreaker5185]

​@@milesdvd yes, soyboys complain about athlete pay. Your point?

[@marshawnfleming2873]

​@@rparas34they want money here's another idea either stop buying such expensive gifts or compete in jiu jitsu competitions contract says they can't fight in other promotions it never said they can't compete in jiu jitsu competitions

[@drunkenboxing781]

Bone headed offering Francis that sized deal... thinking he's going to save the day.

[@peterbug1977]

What do you think? Does he go to One, or try to make amends with Dana?

[@Kancerru]

@@peterbug1977 He's made his money now. Doesn't really need to go anywhere after PFL sinks.

[@Matt-jc2ml]

​@@Kancerruhe didn't even need that money though lol. Fury 10 mil, Joshua 20 mil, pfl 9+ mil 😂.

[@devinhanna53]

@@Kancerru the real Nigerian scammer

[@charleswebsterjr.6350]

​@peterbug1977 he already won the UFC and PFL title, why not go after the ONE FC title and maybe even Rizin title.

[@mig14ced]

I knew pfl was garbage when they hired jake paul 😂

[@thepipsterdufus]

He's part owner. :p

[@milesdvd]

Number 1 complaint in ufc is fighter pay.. let’s not act like dana isn’t a cheap mf as well.. pfl not the only ones even the big company holding their fighters.

[@buckbreaker5185]

​@@milesdvdyou keep repasting this. No one outside soys care about athlete pay 😂😂😂😂 get a life dude

[@Gratefulfellow]

Oh Dana White isn't a cheap MF! PFL are the Santa Claus how is that going for them. Dana White is the best for a reason.

[@Newbtuber]

@@milesdvd ufc pays extremely well for their mid to low fighters. The problem always stem from them not paying their top fighter what they are capable of. You look at boxing and boxing pays their prelims 2k to 3k. Then you look at someone like Wonderboy who has never been champion and still making 300k which is about the same or more than the average boxing champions.

[@Jg_nation]

They’re not even getting Aaron pico a fight. Dudes been sitting since February

[@JusticeDem87]

Good thing no one cares about pico lol jk

[@LucaLampini]

Frustrating, great prospect

[@JohnAdams-bb3qz]

​@@JusticeDem87speak for urself

[@russianbot2630]

It’s funny how proponents of the UFC lawsuit and increased fighter pay pointed at organizations like PFL. Now these organizations are going under. The UFC is the only MMA organization that is profitable at the moment and that’s for a reason.

[@davidsmith2132]

For not paying fighters yes

[@AnyDayOnTheWater]

Josh fumbled “encouraging” these guys to sign to Bellator/PFL! It pisses me off soooo much! I am in Canada and can’t even watch PFL this week without DAZN - help make this make sense to me? There is no UFC this weekend and PFL us on Thursday night and unavailable in one of the largest mma markets?!? FFS

[@LordHolley]

This is a bummer. I remember when Bellitor announced that they bought PFL, Dana was asked about it and said, "Why would you buy a company that nobody watches? Real genius move." Looks like he was right, unfortunately. We need more organizations with owners who can actually run it!

[@RoBear-xo6zw]

PFL bought Bellitor🎉

[@theviolentone]

rip bellator...pfl is dying

[@tomjones1424]

Mousasi was saying this a few months back. He's never contacted, therefore never fights.

[@mikestar7326]

And he's the moron who left the ufc lmao

[@Kancerru]

It's crazy, Mousasi's been waiting for a fight for almost a year and a half now.

[@Ltproductions98]

@@Kancerru they realeased gegard hes in a lawsuit with pfl owners now

[@Kancerru]

@@Ltproductions98 Welp hope he wins

[@livedierepeat420]

sign with someone else - they’ll talk to you. you take it from there.

[@livefree1030]

UFC has the entire ecosystem.

[@glenshort6567]

Because they are the only one that puts on great shows consistently.

[@mr.brenman2132]

One championship still exists so no. The PFL had a chance and they squandered the whole thing.

[@milesdvd]

Number 1 complaint in ufc is fighter pay.. let’s not act like dana isn’t a cheap mf as well.. pfl not the only ones even the big company holding their fighters.

[@mr.brenman2132]

@@milesdvd The UFC pays more then any of these other organizations.

[@buckbreaker5185]

​@@milesdvdthere he is again 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@gabagoolovahere5869]

After the pfl/bellator merged they had enough highly recognized names in the sport to really become an actual competitor but the show runners can't seem to get things right

[@drunkenmmamaster419]

It is criminal that Patchy Mix and Usman nurmagomedov arent in the ufc and wasting their primes away in Bellator

[@drake4642]

Usman doesn’t want to be in the ufc until Islam retires

[@Youafool500]

@@drake4642They are making a mistake with him, he should be in the UFC, he needs to work his way to a title shot, he ain’t coming and getting a shot at the belt straight away

[@Devilm4n-cw8tv]

He might if you consider that the Japanese guy from rizin got an instant title shot​@@Youafool500

[@joehisel5966]

I love big John and Josh with all my heart, but I have been sensing some resentment and saltiness towards pfl for not keeping them in their Bellator positions doing commentary.

[@tannermcguire7713]

Well they both worked for them for 7 years, I'd be pissed too

[@drop3r4]

Davis couldn't say what recent fight or fighter he was excited about. He said "I don't have time to pay attention to the fights." Imagine if Dana ever sat there and couldn't answer! The media would crucify him.

[@tonyclifton2230]

The need to bring back dada 5000.

[@Jai.P91]

😂

[@chatosancarlosligaliga8626]

To be honest i dont think PFL ever really intended to use bellator fighters. I feel like they bought bellator for the flex. Just to keep their name in the news. Its sad but pfl buying bellator is arguably messing up mma.

[@maverickat4544]

Eblen is overated. He wouldn't get past any top10 UFC middleweight

[@bestbyfar1118]

Bkfc is coming to get all those good guys

[@ABOB-v1i]

😂

[@Brian_Jaxon]

Aren’t they a boxing promotion ?

[@richirich999]

@@Brian_Jaxonthey’re a boxing promotion for retired MMA fighters as well as journeyman

[@pjswoman0829]

I knew this would happen.

[@paulc8588]

Everyone with a functioning brain knew this would happen.

[@Mikehawkurmom]

PFL should do an American idol type show invite unknown fighters from different locations. fight to represent the state then fight other states for the championship.

[@art_of_comedy3241]

What's does that solve ? They can't even pay the ones they have

[@Mikehawkurmom]

@ they need to more fans to bring in sponsors

[@robk3848]

Thats kinda what Dana does with his multiple shows bub

[@QPO5555]

Imagine killing two companies at once

[@ToddAtkinsShow]

Bjorn Rebney took a similar approach. He put his talent scouts out there to find talented guys that were not fighting in the UFC and then let the tournament format build the stars. Bellator had a lot of great fighters that came out of that format.

[@tenderlungs2065]

John McCarthy needs to disappear

[@gordonschiff3621]

Come on man. Don’t watch. Don’t post.

[@coleheketoa]

It's a shame that these organisations have bad business models that simply cannot create a pathways to success in the combat market.

[@milesdvd]

Number 1 complaint in ufc is fighter pay.. let’s not act like dana isn’t a cheap mf as well.. pfl not the only ones even the big company holding their fighters.

[@LennyTwo-o7q]

PFL was doomed the moment they rebrranded from WSOF and adopted the season bracket garbage. And Bellator was always just a way for viacom to launder money 😂

[@derekbk9093]

Yea the brackets was a horrible idea

[@charleswebsterjr.6350]

World Series of Fighting was such a better name.

[@adriane7841]

Dana white must love this news

[@HassanMohamoud-lg2xw]

He doesn't care

[@uriel6374]

What love? He already knows when they try to sign Francis. This isn't a surprise

[@John-i1e7p]

Patchy mix is no where near the best bantamweight in the world. Patchy hasn’t done a Damm thing if he’s not in the ufc 135 pound division.

[@CJH94]

Doesn’t beat anyone top 5 in the ufc

[@marshawnfleming2873]

Actually he is, he's trained with multiple people from UFC in 135 including aljo merab and Umar and they all say he's the best in the world at 135 and that the only person that could give him problems are strikers like O'Malley sandhegan and Yan because of the speed and unique moments, just bc he's not in the UFC doesn't mean can't beat the top 5 or be champ he's not in the UFC bc it's by choice not bc his lack of skills and talent

[@marshawnfleming2873]

​@@CJH94actually he can

[@John-i1e7p]

@ training is not fighting, that is such a nonsense argument, if that was the case why isn’t ange loosa top five since he trains with guys like Shavkat and Gilbert burns ? But every time he fights he gets beat up. Training with the best does not in any way mean you are the best. There are so many fighters that train with killers and are still trash

[@John-i1e7p]

@ doesn’t matter he isn’t nobody until he’s in that shark tank of a division.

[@manticomar1146]

Josh is biased against chimaev

[@theojarome6108]

Nobody else has consistent fights in Las Vegas. This is a huge Red Flag! Blaming Francis is boneheaded. I tried, watching, just have zero interest.

[@jasontaylor1820]

Now you have another organisation called Gfl. Retirement village of old fighters. I wish all these companies all the best but wtf uf GFL NEW LEAGUE actually becomes successful i would be extremely surprised

[@ivanc9231]

Dana knew when he gave them.nganu and the amount they offered ,he knew there goes their whole budget

[@franciscoramirez9867]

I thought bellator was gone already lol

[@thepipsterdufus]

Absorbed by PFL. PFL vs Bellator was a cool event that they put off shortly after the deal. Great fighters in that promotion house, now. It'd be sad to see them go; lots more fighters wouldn't be fighting if so!

[@geoff3103]

Bellator is a horrible name for a sports league. PFL isn't much better. Change it to the NFA, IFC, UFA, something like that. Make the league the "Triple-A" league to the UFC's NHL. Only room for one league, so pick a good name and stick with it. And have fights on Friday night or even Sundays after football season is done, or on Saturdays if its before UFC events. But there is PLENTY of business out there for another league. Dana doesn't mind another league if it doesn't step on his toes.

[@livedierepeat420]

this last show was awesome! It was a terrific change to watch. The production was great top to bottom. The talent level is growing and the fights were good! 👍

[@camwatters-iz5bs]

Do these guys not work for pfl/ bellator now?

[@JusticeDem87]

Clearly

[@facts2676]

PFL should absorb Bellator and have a normal competition system, change the 1 million tournament and give it to whoever wins the belt

[@dangmetafunny]

I can’t tell you how many times I used to comment under the PFL’s post pleading them to do weight classes every 10 pounds so that they could be first and set the selves apart hoping they would dare to be different but to no avail

[@nvmm166]

That wouldn’t solve anything lmao

[@nvmm166]

So now they just have more weight classes to not have enough spots for guys to fight

[@sigmauchiba4734]

​@nvmm166 with bellator it's more possible now but they just don't have the funds to pay all these guys

[@flex2timez]

Looks like big John will go back to being a ref and Josh will fade away

[@StonedApe94]

I haven’t seen this podcast in the past couple years. Glad to see they’re looking healthy. MMA Pioneers

[@nourzakor2184]

There is no way Eddi is getting paid 7 figures for fighting

[@AlexCruz-zf1qn]

Idk why they do tournament and nonsense ! Put the fight on Friday nights give us fans a much needed day of sports

[@Mendoza627]

The problem is once they acquired Bellator. You should’ve shut it down and brought all their fighters of PFL and changed the dynamics between the both organizations. There’s some really good fighters out there. There’s no reason why you shouldn’t succeed. Somehow the problem is they’re too scattered. nobody knows when events are hell I look up Bella or just to see when the events are barely any promotion Sergio Perez guys like patchy mix or fantastic fighters. They shouldn’t be out there in the wind either released that let them go somewhere else

[@VCR_Repairman]

I had really bad insomnia, went to the doctor and he prescribed PFL.

[@rustytennakoon8661]

And people continue to doubt Dana. The guy really knows what he is doing

[@emile1612]

They didn’t fumble, they never would compete, let’s be fair. Both never did and they would never when try it together.

[@corbo9838]

In all honesty though, Dana needs to sign some of these fighters to the UFC. Both PFL and Bellator have some incredible fighters that need a chance to fight on the big stage. Lots of guys in the UFC that are past their time and still on contracts, need to be replaced with fighters who are known outside the UFC

[@SquallSf]

"Morab doesnt pose a threat to him at all. Shaun pose more of threat to him". That is funny to say, because Merab literary dominated Sean and finished him (quite easily) .... I'm sure Dana White thought the same before their fight. Now lets be real, Sean O'Malley is one dimensional. That is why, when a real MMA fighter comes in he will mop the floor with him - Merab, Umar, Patchy,.... Pretty much same as OConor, it pains me to see people even today talk for him as good fighter.

[@SecNano]

a...are you dumb? Merab did not finish Sean.... You are right when you say he dominated him, then you just go complete fucking retard by saying something that clearly did not happen when you said Merab finished him.. finishing fighters is something Merab never had or will have the ability to do, he can barely finish a fucking sentence.

[@robk3848]

Gotta like Josh n John collab. Dope. Theyre very knowledgeable, more so than most youtube, mma channels.

[@chaseheath1750]

Big john missing one thing talking about it’s the managers duty to call asking for fights for there fighters??, pfl and bellator don’t have any competion for Johnny umar patchy Cory why do u think umar is facing Hughes in his 2nd fight that the ufc wanted nothing to do with “yet” possibly

[@JusticeDem87]

I think josh thinks patchy is alot better then what he is..we gotta see these dudes jump

[@marshawnfleming2873]

Maybe but patchy is an impressive fighter and I don't see anybody in the division that can compete with him on the ground not even merab

[@TheKro16]

I'm here to bask in the glory of "I told you so," to Josh and John.

[@wadeh8418]

PFL and Bellator always sucked anyways. I think strikeforce was the last great promotion. You can’t be an altruistic fight promotion and expect to remain in business. You have to make money… investors can’t support you forever.

[@Timduo]

Buying bellator and signing Francis back to back definitely was not a good business decision

[@elrifle24]

The UFC is the only MMA promotion that matters since Pride went out of business.

[@tchambers807]

I've got to imagine PFL could have found more useful ways to spend that Francis money. He's never really been must see TV for me. Good for him to get paid. Not quite sure he's going to have made any difference whatsoever in the end for anybody else, and possibly for himself

[@howardroark3670]

1:02 Anyone have a good guess who Josh is talking about?

[@ganjahiwalker2641]

You can’t give Francis all this money when he doesn’t bring any in.

[@penelopealequin8563]

Patchy is not an easy fight for merab as much as u think of it , patchy gas tank still needs to be ufc tested. And patchy striking is horrible for the 135 division

[@westcoast8506]

When you don’t bring in the money you don’t get paid money

[@stricklykickly7968]

No, no, no, you two keep that same energy talking about how the fighters are getting paid from the UFC and how the ufc is so bad and these other companies are so much better.

[@AlexCruz-zf1qn]

Maybe it’s just right to have the UFC be the organization to control the MMA just like NFL control football. Idk how they fumble the bag

[@nvmm166]

Saying Sean O’Malley has more of a chance over patchy mix then Merab is hilarious, patchy would sub Sean and go to decision with Merab

[@earthstrong-43.72]

They never should've signed Ngannou. He isn't worth the money for the return. PFLlator is in terrible shape. Donn Davis is borderline special needs.

[@ganjahiwalker2641]

BUT FrAnCiS dEsErvEs iT

[@earthstrong-43.72]

@ganjahiwalker2641 😂

[@keithkellogg5325]

I just pray for a very rich guy that loves the fight game loves it his heart and soul in it to get Bell and PFL

[@yogi2983]

Big John cuts off Josh a lot. Old habits die hard but sometimes I'd like to hear Josh finish a thought but Big John keeps interrupting. Please someone tell him to stop

[@AnthonyDavidsound]

“ufc may get LUCKY” 😂😂 after all this time and al these failed organizations, they still think it’s “luck”.

[@jacobuzlyan-bc2nc]

Big John who do you work for?

[@simonheit8025]

Patchy was gifted a decision in his last fight, he’s not even close to the best bantamweight in the world lmao

[@nvmm166]

Couldn’t be more happier Josh is out of a job, dude was legit the worst analyst I’ve ever seen, you could have put a golden retriever up there and they would have done a better job

[@FightMoney]

One Championship is the only promotion that has the potential to compete with ufc because they have muay thai. 2nd best promotion imo, unfortunately they're all the way in asia lol

[@charleswebsterjr.6350]

They literally bought Bellator for no reason

[@keithkellogg5325]

I agree 100 % what you guys are saying about PFL because this guy in charge is a total idiot.So UFC could very easily get PFL and Bellator fighters like you say for a song or less 👍

[@dano1307]

Pfl buying bellator was the worst decision

[@HawkYounkins]

Well, technically they "acquired" Bellator. They paid $0 for the promotion & offered Paramount stock ownership in return so it was a great deal that they've royally screwed up.

[@JamieMcilreavy]

PFL / bellator should have known UFC was to big Dana created a machine of a company UFC is the OG

[@Mendoza627]

But also, there’s a reality check with some of these fighters Eddie Alvarez won’t fight for less than seven figures dude you realize your Eddie Alvarez correct I mean nothing against the guy, but the guy is not worth watching. It’s not worth paying seven figures to watch for any organization, he doesn’t bring the eyeballs in but good for him to know what he thinks he’s worth.

[@StrawHatVladEK]

But big John and Josh said they were doing good not even that long ago. Bellator & pfl are garbage Josh Thomson and big John are cancer to my ears

[@Wade-1]

There arent anymoee strikeforce level fighters. PS 155 will always be the best weight class with the most exciting fights

[@jmhollingsworth8396]

They are paying Jake Paul to be a mma fighter he will never ever step foot in a cage 😅

[@kaymill5565]

Big John was great in the octagon--not so much on any mic.

[@TheKasun1991]

Yall thought don as a saviour n dana asa bad man . Now what the devil we know is better 😂😂😂

[@jm7468]

PFL & Bellator have done a shambolic job at promotion, maybe in US its not bad but in EU how do you watch the fights *legally* fire the PR teams, as much as the world wants to clown on Jake Paul give his team the reigns and say gets us views. The production quality sucks and at times looks like they are in a 200 person ball room, ditch the ramp. For christ sake i have seen better production quality on mizkifs MMA events at his iron forge gym.

[@mikestar7326]

Lmao josh is joke saying the best bantam weight is not in the ufc, thats how you lose credibility

[@Sean-p5c4j]

I completely agree! I used to listen to Josh and John but don’t bother anymore. They constantly shit on UFC, and won’t admit that the UFC has created the only Sustainable mma promotion.

[@dariancollins9746]

you stupid shills, Underpaid Fighters Championship isn't the best

[@Drew-pd8nt]

Big John will have to go back to writing folks tickets and violating people's rights.

[@tommygunnggg1127]

Honestly they cant even be a 2 place, one championships mma roster is not good but i really only watch for the kb and Muay Thai, submission grapple is ok the rotolo bros but there going down fast

[@AtPEACE77]

Doesn’t seem like johns taking it well

[@mrvgoat1294]

Give me PFL money I can make them bend the knee and that being the case I am already working on a promotion of my own 3rd show next year :)

[@megamatt53]

Francis is in it for him self. The death of pfl shows that. Don’t blame him. But let’s be honest he looked out for him self.

[@nickbowenfishing2885]

Thought yall worked for them?

[@keithkellogg5325]

Everything you’re saying is right on they can raise money so figure it out.

[@toochangz]

I bet he's talking about AJ McKee

[@johnylalrina1451]

Wait, these two guys are not payed by the Bellator anymore? Big John should have stay with the ufc but he wants to be the Joe Rogan of bellator. Good riddance.

[@FtbMaki]

Francis put them out of business

[@hale1494]

PFL is run worse than elite xc was