Phoenix Inverter Installation On Narrowboat

[@markmangan845]

Nice vid martyn 😊😎👍

[@narrowboatelectrician]

Cheers Mark

[@billabongoneill]

Wouldn’t a fuse blowing in a battery box be a source of ignition if hydrogen gas is present? And would it therefore be safer further away from the battery box as you had it initially?

[@narrowboatelectrician]

Battery boxes need to be vented at high level for BSS, so no accumulation of hydrogen.

[@vickylediard9]

I've enjoyed the content of this (single) vlog on Rob's lovely boat compared to was it at least 3 on nb Perfik? And happy that I got a few mentions to keep my vlogger stalking status right up there! (Rob makes me filter coffee every Sunday afternoon by the way 😂)

[@narrowboatelectrician]

Hi Vicky, yes, you are beating Rob 3-1 in terms of videos. And even though I got coffee and biscuits, you have bought us a few coffees too. A valued subscriber no doubt.

[@robtheplod]

Nice one Martin!

[@narrowboatelectrician]

Many thanks!

[@optimist3580]

Martin, why only use “Arctic ” cable for 230v fixed installation? There are countless other flex’s that are suitable for marine use ie. low smoke, fire rating, vibration tolerance and temp range. Is there some other regulation that requires that blue arctic cable to be only used

[@narrowboatelectrician]

There is no colour regulation, only that the cable be stranded and rated to lower temperatures. So there may well be others but arctic is generally used. But Ive seen twin and earth and bell wire lol.

[@jeffr8670]

Hi. Anychance you would come to look over my webasto and heating system on my boat?

[@narrowboatelectrician]

Where are you Jeff?

[@jeffr8670]

@@narrowboatelectrician Penkridge area bud

[@shnboardman1]

Would you recommend Lithium batteries for a narrowboat?

[@narrowboatelectrician]

I have installed lithium to narrowboats and widebeams. It’s down to needs and lifestyle really. I talk most out of them as that level of investment isn’t required for what they need.

[@michaelmurphy2259]

Hi I'm looking to install a similar 2k inverter. I have 70mm cable but what would be correct size fuse and isolator? Thanks.

[@robtheplod]

Victron are really good with their documentation - if you go on their site you can download the manual which will tell you these bits....

[@narrowboatelectrician]

Victron state 70mm up to 6m. that cable ( depending on manufacturer) is rated at 435A. Full load The inverter will draw 173A, but peak power is 3500w taking 304A. Considering this a 350A fuse and a 600A isolator is my choice. But really if you are installing things like this you should be able to calculate that so you understand the logic.

[@michaelmurphy2259]

​​@@narrowboatelectrician Hi Martin, i had given to me a 350A isolator ( Blue Sea) rated at 600A for 5min and a Mega Fuse carrier, I'll get a 350A fuse to put in it. Many thanks Michael

[@narrowboatelectrician]

I just go up to be sure.

[@reinhardfredebold9169]

Hello from Germany, I do not understand, why you diskuss about more than one grounding on board. You get the earth from the shoreline only to the galvanic isolator and on the other side of the galvanic isolator it goes to the ground of the boat. Every 230V-equippment on the boat can be groundet even the inverter. The engine is groundet and normaly the 12V Minus is groundet. You never should ground both sides of the galvanic isolator. In the case of an electric fault, the current goes from the 230V-live to the fault, from there to the Ground on the Boat and from there to the galvanic isolator, from there to the earth of the shoreline, from there to the neutral. That is the circuit to trip the fuse or the RCD. For the savety of the persons it does not matter, if you have one or more grounding-points. It only matters for the corrosion of your boat. If there is some current through the hull of your boat, you have corrosion. That is the reason for having only one connection from the minus of the starterbattery to the hull. This point is normally the connection of the minus of the Starterbattery to the engine. That is the reason, why you should have a dedicatet connection from the galvanic isolator to the minus of the starterbattery at the engine-connection-point. If you have build this connection, you need to ground the case of the inverter. But now you have to think about a possible fault inside the inverter from the 12V+ to the case of the inverter. If your Grounding-cable is not thick enough for the used Fuse of the 12V (more than 100A), the cable would melt and a fire could arise. That is the reason why the Cable for the cas-grounding of the inverter needs to be minimum one size smaller than the used cable-size for the 12V for the inverter. If you use the 70mm²-cable for the 12V, you should use a 50mm² for the case-grounding of the inverter. If you think that I am wrong, I would be happy for your explanation. Best wishes Reinhard from Germany

[@narrowboatelectrician]

A long message, thank you 1) I don't ground both sides, thats lost in translation somewhere. This boat had an odd changeover from shore to inverter, and I was checking that no matter which power source was connected, the hull was grounded

[@narrowboatelectrician]

I am also aware multiple grounding points are no issue. The case of the inverter is also connected to earth. The grounding of the chassis is for 230v RCD operation not for faults in the 12v DC side.

[@reinhardfredebold9169]

@@narrowboatelectrician Hello from Germany again. Ok, I think I understand. Please think, what will happen whenever a faulty connection between the 12V+ to the inverter-case will arise: The cable for the grounding of the case has to take the current until the fuse trips. It does not matter, that the cable is only build for the earth of the 230V. It is the connection wich will take the current and it is not able for that. I know that in many narrowboats this connection is maximum 2,5mm² but this is much too small. I do not know if there is a rule in england for that but does it matter? We are talking about the possibility of a fire on board. I do not see a risk of elektric shock but fire. Do I see a risk where is none? Best wishes Reinhard from Germany

[@narrowboatelectrician]

Hi Reinhard. I see your point completely. Should that happen that small earth cable with fry pretty quickly. (With a 350 A fuse we both know what that would blow at) I have never seen your solution on any boat I have ever worked on and the risk is very small, but you are correct it is there. You have got me thinking, why not just hop from the negative supply to the case and use that, after all that is ground and shouldn't matter where you take it from. I am not sure there is enough room, or even if that small earth stud could handle that cable or fault current. I will dig some more but this is very interesting.

[@reinhardfredebold9169]

@@narrowboatelectrician Hello from Germany again, I think you're right: We can use the direct connection from the case to the 12V Minus. Only when the mounting of the inverter has a low resistance to ground (the hull) and is able to draw the needed current, then we can forget about. We need to look for the grounding of the Battery-minus too. I mean the electric way between the battery-minus and the inner port of the galvanic isolator. There may be no situation in the future that the connection will be cut while the 230V is active because of a possible electric shock if a fault will occur in this moment. Then we have the problem to fix the thick cable to the case of the inverter. Normaly there is only a thin bolt to mount and it can break if you try to mount a 50mm² cable. Is it possible to drill a hole in the case and grind the area to bare metal to get the contact? Maybe you could weld a 8 mm bolt for a good contact. I think this is the problem whenever the user does not want to become problems with the guarantee. I am happy that you are thinking about. Best wishes from Germany Reinhard