How to Paper Tune a Bow Without Moving the Arrowrest

[@elliotswan7339]

I've been waiting for someone to make a video explaining paper tuning with cams for a lifetime. Thank you MFJJ.

[@PennNative]

Josh, I know you made a grip video. But you need to do another. Maybe more In depth. Take a guy who has a bad grip. Shooting through paper, work with him on camera and show how much the grip effects tuning. It is so huge and such an underestimated point! It’s the biggest key to all this. The grip needs to be buttoned up even before one tries to tune and shoot through paper. It’s such a key element and it’s not gone over enough.

[@MostlyPeacefulCombatVet]

This is precisely why I’m shooting Bowtech this year. Such an easy bow to tune! Thanks for the Video Josh Jones

[@StephenMeringolo]

I was struggling to get the right tune on my Bowtech SS34 and Rekoning by moving the rest - followed this and in a half turn on each set of cams and now getting a perfect bullet hole. Thank you!!!

[@huntsimple9527]

This is super simple. Does not matter if you are right or left handed. Move the cams the direction of the tail tear. Done.

[@tonysorcinelli]

Do you move both cams the same?

[@huntsimple9527]

@@tonysorcinelli I move the bottom cam first. If that is not enough, then I move the top one to match. If that is not enough then I move the bottom one again, etc. It is not unusual for a tear to go away just by moving one cam, of course pending the severity of the tear.

[@josephfolsom2030]

Working on my new Phase 4 29”. Bought the tophat kit from you. I had a point left tear. Switched the existing tophats, still a 1/4 - 5/16ths tear. Now I’ll go with the next larger set to move that cam more to the right. Appreciate your simple tutorials. Hunting season starts here in Oregon on Sept 2. 🤪. Got a late start with my bow since the bow with all the accessories was a gift from my son who bought the same bow. My kids like me

[@douglasvaughn9530]

Great video and I agree that moving the CAMs is much better than moving the rest. It will make your bow shoot better and be more forgiving. Only move the rest for micro adjustments. Never more than 1/16" out from recommended center shot in either direction. I do wish you would say cam lean instead of wheel lean. Wheel bows are a thing of the past. I guess there are still some single cams with idler wheels but very few. One more suggestion, I think you may confuse people when you say point right or left instead of nock right or left. You are the only person I've ever heard talk about point direction or wheel lean.

[@michaelswenson8399]

Great info as usual. One note, if you have a bow that uses shims/top hats you might find that you are between sizes and have to move the rest ever so slightly to get that bullet hole with a bare shaft. Just a couple clicks on a micro adjustable, I can barely see it move with my naked eye on the Epsilon but it affects flight.

[@CoachGoodwin23]

Josh, thank you --- great vid. I always learn when reviewing your content! I like working on my own stuff and your help is greatly appreciated!

[@Futurase1]

2/3's of everything I have learend is from Josh on bow setup and tuning. Thanks again the information is extremely valuable!!!

[@joeodonnell4188]

Hey Josh. Been a fan for a while now but haven’t gotten to all of your videos. I may have missed it but I think I’m not the only one who would love a video of a start to finish full setup and how to do it all. (Bow selection and build, tuning, arrow selection and build, etc) if u already have one I apologize. Thanks

[@user_unk5]

You're a GENIUS!! This is why I always look forward to watching your videos, you're always so informative!

[@mikemitchell9157]

Whats genius about it. He never came up with this way of tuning. All he is doing is showing how to tune. And this is how you always tuned a bow in a shop. Even before movable cams you would twist the cable yoke to induce cam lean to tune the bow. This is just informative for those new to tuning their own bows

[@adamryerson2974]

Thank you for this and more. I ended up needing to learn this on my own through trial and error.

[@gawgum]

So I have an Elite omnia and had right tears (point left). I had that bow all jacked up. Finally just swallowed my pride and took it to the bow shop. Just to find out I was torquing my bow....yeah that just to find out I need to work more on me than my bow lol. $60/labor lesson learned. But now I'm hitting dimes @ 80yds. Ok maybe not every time but once in a session at least. Thanks for all the helpful videos Josh. They are a real help for me since I just got back into bow hunting last year after almost 30 yrs.

[@SeaPro360]

Stick white golf tees in your target. Cheap and last forever.

[@HeartlandMakesAndOutdoors]

Thanks for sharing and have a blessed season this year sir. Dale

[@davidfargen2167]

Great video you mentioned how tuning elite with the SET system is not as efficient as using its shim system I was wondering if you could do a video on how you would tune a new elite and more in-depth on why the set system is not as good

[@less4734]

Agreed, I would love to see that also. I own 2 Elites with the SET system and would love to know more.

[@KevinVarnum-j9x]

More quality info for the average Joe to learn to work on their own equipment. Much appreciated. Quality shops are few and far between. Learn to work on your own stuff.

[@davidoneill615]

Hi Josh - I enjoy your videos. With the Bowtech Deadlock system you are not inducing CAM lean as you mention in your video. With the old CAM system, with the yolks, you twisted strings to impact CAM lean. With the new Deadlock CAM system you are moving the CAM along the axle to position the energy directly behind the arrow. The system is specifically designed to tune your bow without leaning the CAMs; you just slide the top cam and/or bottom cam over to take out tail left and tail right.

[@the_sharp_carpenter]

It also affects lean, as it shifts the tension of the system lant and right between to load bearing points. You're also pulling the cables more or less relative to the roller guard. The cams will lean more at either end of the travel than they do in the middle. The axel is like a barbell thats loaded evenly, if you grip it in th center it stays level, if you shift left or right the "axel" or barbell will tip off of level, as one side gains more leverage over the other. With yolk tonight you're keeping the cam central and "adding more weight" to either end of the barbell. They both change the plane of the axel. Yes yolk tuning leans it more aggressively but they lean the axel weather or not that's that's the desired intent.

[@royhoglund1322]

Making tuning look easy! Keep the videos coming. You might want to mention that all other things need to be right before this step, like bow specs, timing, and arrow spine.

[@DanielMcleod-z1q]

Sometimes the rest has to be moved. When you work with shims or top hats, you only have widths to work with. If grip and tune fall in between, then a small rest tweak will finish it up.

[@mjc_208]

Keep these awesome short videos coming! Thanks!!!

[@craigg350]

Love the bow. You can't beat a bowtech for tuning!

[@chriswarfield9896]

Keep it up!!! I really enjoy the content you put out. It has been informative and helpful.

[@greywolf1606]

Thanks for sharing Josh. 🏹

[@timsilva6057]

Great video Josh! Much appreciated!!

[@maplehappy]

MFJJ, I love this video, it really shows how adjusting the cams can tune the bow. Here's what I would love to see, a video demonstrating WHY moving the rest out of center is bad or how it affects your impacts or groups or tune or whatever. I've always tuned my bows by bumping the rest, and out to 100 yards i dont have any weird left or right variance or anything. I'm very intermediate though, so im just working off of what has worked the best for me. I've never had to move the rest super far out of center, so maybe only extremes make a big difference? Exactly the kind of answer i'd like to see and MFJJ is the man to do it. Please! and Thanks!

[@jhuntley575]

I can answer that for you if you want.

[@WS_00]

@@jhuntley575 I’d like to hear your answer 👍

[@perryknetter8577]

Thank you for sharing this great information 👍

[@Ohyouknowbro]

I used to pride myself on not being a fanboy about anything but bowtech got me when they invented the deadlock cams. My revolt x is one of my most prized possessions. When/if it dies ill be getting another bowtech.

[@jeffreyenglebert9016]

Please make a detailed video on setting 3rd axis. Black Gold first up please. Which way to turn each adjustment screw.

[@csoultrain80]

Same concept on a hoyt rx3 when yoke tuning? I was looking at my buddies the other day and it was definitely tuned by moving the rest way out!

[@brettwelch8368]

I was suprised at how much smaller the 2nd tear was than the first. I got lucky with my bow and wheel lean was spot on right from the factory.

[@arrowflinginop]

A video on how to do this for a bow with a single yoke like an older Hoyt would be awesome.

[@TheDweebert]

Great video, thanks! New subscriber here who just found you guys a couple of weeks ago...love your channel! Might be a dumb request, but a video about your paper tuning rack would be awesome. I built one out of PVC, and it's not great. Would love to see more detail on your paper tuning rack build.

[@danielely7437]

How have I missed this video?!? Thanks man

[@scottbergan5608]

Josh have a question for you if you get your bow paper tuned properly Will your site pin A directly overtop of your arrow shaft Hopefully I'm asking the question properly I'm assuming string Wheel riser rest site All to be in the same line of sight Keep up with the videos I've been learning a great deal from you

[@dimitriwessendorf2391]

Nice video MFJJ. I liked the way you explained tuning. I’d really like to see how you can do this on a Hoyt bow. I’m always afraid to touch anything on my bow! I’m worried I’m going to screw it up.

[@johnsmith1812]

Why do I see paper tuning all over the internets but as soon as you step in a shop they look at you like you’re wasting everyone’s time.

[@andrewkelly6909]

90% of shops are run by know it alls or d bags that think the consumers aren't supposed to know anything about tuning because they are "supposed " to do all the work.

[@NoMomYoureWrong]

Because a lot of people who walk in don’t have consistent enough form for it to make any difference in a tear. That’s why they set it up off the center-shot and recommend mechanical broadheads.

[@davidfleer5307]

Because a lot of people don’t want to take the time to learn just grad their bow and wound a animal and if it doesn’t die they blame it the bow and go and spend a couple thousand and the bow shops look at us and say I’m too busy you can leave it here and I might have it done in a month, so who needs our money Spokane Archery gosh that’s 20 hours from me 🤷🏼‍♂️

[@newzealandspotlightersasso9181]

Because you can paper tune at home, firstly you get humbled when you try to paper tune as it shows people's inconsistencies in their grips. Better to learn that at home.

[@humanperson4132]

The difference between a bow shop and a pro shop

[@wadefarley1996]

MFJJ, You have done the wheeling videos before using a draw board while having the bow at full draw using the Spot Hogg laser tool. Do both of these processes accomplish the same thing? I know in your bow build videos you do the draw board wheeling method and verify it is correct by shooting through paper. Does this way accomplish the same thing? Is one method more precise and accurate than the other? I feel the draw board method would be more precise but have never had the chance to do it that way and no shop will ever do it that way either. Look forward to your response. Thanks!

[@pfv3462]

hi Josh, great vid. can the adjustment of the arrowrest influence this adjustment of the cam?

[@jordanpowell228]

Tail left, move the cam left Tail right move the cam right Tail left move rest right Tail right move rest left

[@clintonmoore1070]

Would you use the deadlock to broadhead tune or just the rest because the adjustment needed is so minute?

[@MontanaBadass]

MFJJ it would be awesome if you could give us some tuning tips on some old bows. I am running a 2012 Diamond Black Ice which is a single cam solid limb bow. I got the bow from a friend Brand New in the box 3 years ago I have paper tuned it a couple of times now and it seems like after I get a bullet hole and then shoot a couple hundred shots i start to see the tail wag in my arrow flight. I shoot a pretty good group with field points but now with broadheads I'm shooting right. I'd appreciate it a little advice man!

[@michaelburrows7600]

Thank you thank you. Being a KZbin self taught archer I've read so many times about moving the arrow rest that I assumed that to be gospel. I'd end up typically with an arrow pointing left. This just makes so much sense. Set the arrow down the middle and then get the string to align with that and forget the arrow rest/arrow central and boom the arrow flies straight and my sight marks comes down because it's so much more efficient. It is like looking through the other end of a telescope or rather the right end of a telescope having spent years looking through it the wrong way

[@CryptoHuntinDad]

Man the bowtech carbon bows look cool. I really want to buy the new PSE Mach 33 but its hard to pass up the tuning from bowtech and Ive been with bowtech and Mathews for over 20 years.

[@harveyrousejr.2069]

Great, useful video content.

[@HuckFTW]

2:11 “this did have a clean hole, before I just jacked it all up” 😂

[@billhemphill1243]

Really appreciate video! I would like to see with Mathews top hats

[@wademoulton5109]

Great information.

[@eguthrie-k2i]

Hey Josh, can you show how to adjust cam lean on old bow, I like how you tune all the newer bow, but some of us have older bow, great videos

[@reddawng43x91]

Twist /untwist the yoke

[@sorenjackson4768]

i’ve always had this question about moving the cams/shimming, etc. and wheel lean: what do you do when the cams ultimately need to have significant wheel lean in order for the bow to tune through paper? For example, my Mach 34 shoots great through paper, shimmed at, .140 on the right and .080 on the left. But in this configuration, with the spot hog laser tool, my wheels, both lean toward the cable rod about 3/4 of an inch off of each other. I can decrease that lean by shimming the cams in the opposite direction but then I get a terrible paper tear, of course. Shimming to get the good paper tear, I could then use the yokes to change the strain on the cams, but they don’t move the cams very much on this bow. In this situation, I often ask myself: What would MFJJ do. I’ll resist the temptation to start selling those silicone wristbands with WWMFJJD while I… pray for an answer?

[@Ben-sn4cn]

Same question!

[@hoganfan2006]

Same question here too. Lots of cam lean, but bullet holes.

[@reddawng43x91]

Move ur rest

[@adamhalcom1608]

Would like to see a video on using the new pse system and see what difference it will make in comparison to the bowtech system

[@critter852004]

There is a reason I own multiple bowtechs. My shops in the area (2), won’t assist with tuning at all. So, being able to do it on my own with deadlock system.

[@tillotzd]

As long as you have the correct spine arrow and your bow is is correctly tuned, does knock tuning really matter? So I understand that if you buy spine matched arrows, All the arrows will flex the same way. But if you buy just standard arrows off the shelf that aren't spine matched, can you still get good paper tuning if all the bow is setup perfect?

[@pfv3462]

Hi Josh, Can you clarify for me in which cases you are going to adjust the arrow rest of the bow? After you have adjusted the cam lean.

[@jhoch3346]

Id b interested in watching a video on how you made your paper tuning set up. Looks a lot better than most peoples. I have used a buddy's paper tuner n it sucks

[@bfittock]

thanks for sharing could you do one tuning with split buss cables like the pse or Hoyt hybrid. Yoke system thanks

[@thegun8240]

Make a video on how u would adjust the cams for bare/Broadhead tuning.

[@aaronhall765]

Ok you playing with my emotions 😊. No mention of bow giveaways? Are they still going? You mentioned August.... I'm still waiting on that phone call.... You could bring it to Oahu Hawaii, stay with us and go to the beach after we set the bow up🎉😊😊😊😊

[@gmatthewpaul]

This is why I have 2 new bowtech bows… I own a press but this is best way to tinker.

[@the_atomic_punk487]

Do you always adjust both cams or is there an instance when you would only adjust one of them?

[@MrKawasakirider10]

If you are looking for more video ideas. Showing how to build a draw board for your bow press would be a nice bit of info

[@mattsoutdoors7757]

Ok I am having issues with my sons bow. It has a 1" - 1 1/2" tare to the right and down. I had to change the cables and the cable gaurd. The oem gaurd was taring up the cables. This bow is a bear and has a top y cable only. I had never had any issue tuning this bow until now. Any ideas besides driving 5 hrs to your shop for you or your guys to look at it?😊

[@falconsjavlin]

with the cams to e.g. to the right, so is the string relative to the centre shot at full draw? Does that mean the nock travels from full draw to brace from the right to the centre, and then the nock continues to overshoot with that momentum to create a tail left tear?

[@soundsofhope711]

Can you explain cam shimming bows with the split yoke like older Hoyt PSE and bowtech? Yoke first then shims? Shim and yoke together? I tried to add some twists to my right yoke and got bullethole but I had to still keep rest out of center . I would like to know best way to shim cams once yoke adjustment has been maxed.

[@MegaElkaholic]

IS wheel lean the correct terminology, should it not be position left or right of the cam in relation to the rest.??????????

[@chengsterboi07]

I think doing another video for broadhead tuning for the deadlock system would be a great video.

[@brianmalick2946]

Wont you still have to move your rest for up and down adjustments?

[@jeffallen4013]

I just fletcher 6 arrows with only 2 blazer vanes 180 degrees apart. They are flying true at 60 & 80 yards. I get 10 fps better and save a few yards on sight tape. Should I stay with 2 vanes or 3 vanes.

[@stevepav8604]

Can you do a video on how to move a PSE EVL wheels ?

[@5jjt]

Should we tune for a bullet hole that will occur at any distance from the paper?

[@Rabbitslayer257]

Could you please do a video tuning an Elite bow?

[@jarredrush9544]

For a minor tune on a Mathews would you do the top, bottom, or both cams?

[@drmitofit2673]

I drew myself a tuning guide with illustrations on how moving the cams left or right effect the cam lean and bowstring centering and which direction to correct paper tears (arrow flight angle), as well as some simple rules on how to correct the various tears. It also explains how different dual limb stiffness and the asymmetric angle of the cables/cable guide effect cam lean. My PSE Evolve 31 benefitted from limb swapping more than anything. Included is how to move the arrow rest to fine tune. Up-down arrow rest adjustment makes sense, but left-right arrow rest tuning seems paradoxical to common sense and probably causes a lot of frustration. Also, instead of close-up paper tear tuning (in slo-mo arrows fish tail out of the bow, even in compound archery), I prefer down-range bare shaft tuning to where my bare shafts embed in the foam target parallel to my fletched arrows and group with my fletched arrows. The problem with paper tear tuning is that in slow motion the arrow shaft bends like a wet noodle at close range, so I question the validity of close range bullet hole tuning. Down range, a bare shaft oscillates much less yet does not straighten correct its flight due to lack of fletching. Therefore I think it is a better tuning method. This video skips over a diagram illustration of the effects of cam lean and limb torque and completely ignores up-down arrow rest tuning which is critical.

[@richardganz9318]

thanks again for a great video

[@joeditz48]

Okay so now how does this apply to tuning with broad heads. Im a lefty, shooting a bowtech with the deadlock cams. My fixed blades impact 4" left of my field points at 50 yds, which way do i go on the cams 😅😅

[@booomznooodle]

Please don’t think I’m stupid But as a lefthand archer do I have to move the cams still in the same directions for the same tear result? Or is everything in the opposite direction?

[@randyweaver3456]

Josh, Just curious; where do you set center shot on a Bowtech? Several people have told me that it's not 13/16...

[@afireinside33110]

My bow has a yoke system, I'm guessing by putting twists into one side or the other would do the same as shifting the cams?

[@Practice2Perfection]

When you say "POINT right" or "POINT left" is that the same as nock right and nock left, which is what I normally hear. Or how can I tell the difference of its not the same ? I would really appreciate any insight. Its driving insane.

[@BJC406]

@Podium Archer FMJJ, can you tell me how this method is done on the Bowtech 82nd Airborne that I am still shooting?

[@02LM7]

I have broadheads hitting low and left from my v3x. How do I know if my rest is at centershot? And also square to the string?

[@abdulrahmanbawazir7192]

Hey 👋...my bow's cams are leaning to the left. How should I move my shims?

[@steveirving1]

Is this the same as a cam leaning to the left or right?

[@SomeGuyFromOK]

Dude, what release is that? Is it a thumb button with a click in it? I NEED that NOW.

[@newteqcreations]

Great video

[@heathatkinson9491]

what bout a single cam bow with no real cam adjust ment would you turn yoke string to correct cam lean

[@Mac2118]

easy way to remember: lean the came in the direction of the tear. shim the cam in the direction of the tear. top cam will have more affect than the bottom cam Its the same for right hand or left hand.

[@maxstambaugh]

Could you do a quick video on how to do this on a Mathews Atlas please and thank you

[@Nowhy]

I am new to archery and tuning, someone might have a suggestion for my process? What can be quite a quest is paper tuning and bareshaft tuning coming together. It can be quite the either-or, especially if the paper tuning says one thing and the bareshaft the opposite - and then again, the arrow tuning and nock tuning.. I choose to use an arrow that is the straightest, nocktune my bareshaft so that both make bullet holes at 5 yards (standard 7/8 rest as said in the manual with the Elite verdict with limb/cam adjustment - I tried 13/16, but the visual method with a second arrow to the riser looks crooked), then go bareshaft tune both (via the rest) with multiple shots to be close to an inch at 18 yards and call it a day. I might go further away in the future, but then again, most of my arrows are not really straight (Skylon Empress or Empror)...

[@Nowhy]

I should add, after bareshaft tuning, I go check again for papertears and as long as the tear is just a tad nock left or nock high (Levi Morgan has an old video about that), all is fine, but if it isn't, which wasn't the case yet, I would go back to tinkering with the limb/cam lean stuff from Elite.. still working on my form and anker point anyhow...

[@bowbender5095]

Opposite for a left handed shooter?

[@speedjunky1321]

@MFJJ can you do a video on your drawboard and why its best to include the 2" drop from the arrow rest to the pivot point. I know the LCA drawboard is decent and Archery Dezigns makes an offset one that is similar to the LCA but has the 2" drop. Just curious if you could spread the knowledge of the drawboard to the community. I'm mostly curious as to how that 2 inch drop really effects the timing of the cams. Are we talking a lot or not a lot? My mind says that there a difference in timing for sure, but I'm just not sure how noticeable it is. I know you are way smarter than I am so I'm hoping you can help the community out and drop some knowledge bombs. Thanks in advance from a total noob.

[@taylorconlon144]

The Mathew’s score in the background. 🤣 0:21

[@robertduell4511]

Any chance you’d run through tuning a budget bow like a Diamond edge 320 hint hint.

[@50magz]

You should do a podcast with John dudley

[@davidfleer5307]

JOSH I hope you answer my question how do that to a prime black 9 I’ve got it shooting bullet holes now and I’m not changing it and I don’t know why it is alignment dots do not line up and the draw length it’s set on shows my arms shrunk a whole freaking bunch I’m thinking I’m stupid and need new eyes

[@MrSteal406]

Can you do this on single cam bows too like a PSE stinger max?

[@joshkeller84]

you can shim - or you can twist/untwist individual sides of the buss cable

[@justmeva]

Question - what if you don't have any of these bows or the options of adjusting the cams as freely as you demonstrated?

[@reddawng43x91]

Twist/untwist the cables

[@johndhead1]

Curious. For string/cable/limb life why would you not set your cams with no lean and just do a simple rest adjustment for perfect tear? Looks like a lot of effort when a micro rest adjustment is easier?

[@podiumarcher3447]

Most of the time when you set the wheel lean perfect on most bows it does shoot a clean hole with the rest where it’s supposed to be

[@Jaxd9795]

If your rest is out of center then your groups will deviate one direction or the other at longer ranges.

[@billjones9708]

Josh so I shoot bowtech as well and love them for the tuning capability. My question is, after I've paper tuned a bullet hole, I usually walk back or French tune. If I'm shooting a bullet hole but then need to adjust for right or left grouping on my vertical line, should I worry that it throws my paper tuned off or should I just go straight to broadhead tuning after walk back tuning?

[@joeditz48]

IMO, Paper tune is just a start. In the end we care about groups being centered no matter the range, not what paper looks like

[@ethanhiggins4268]

I waited until the end to ask to make sure I didnt miss it lol. On a mathews for example, do you need to change the top hats on the top AND bottom cam? In essence, whatever you do up top, you need to do to the bottom? Or are you just trying to get them to line up/create a bullet hole

[@hoganfan2006]

Good question. Do we pursue the paper tear perfection or should there be little or no cam lean then adjust the rest/cables/top hats/etc.?