[PoE 3.25] Should you league start Mapping or Bossing?

[@dirtymightmusic5239]

Pretty informative video overall! However I really want to stress this for the more casual audience... Bossing is likely not for you! (when it comes to making currency) Bossing in general in PoE is VERY hit or miss. You need (depending on the boss) a pretty big investment to account for rng since most valuable drops from bosses have a 2%ish droprate. There are pretty much 4 things to making a lot of currency bossing. 1. offering carries as mentioned in this video. This however means you need to actually be really fast to be able to offer those boss carries when the people that are willing to buy them hit red maps. This also means that you need to use stuff like TFT and know the bosses enough and have a strong enough build to do that consistently This also means you are competing (if using TFT) against other people. If you are new to this its quite likely buyers prefer carry services that already have a lot of vouches on there. And your main bulk of the profit is tied to interacting with other people constantly. I know this can be a big downside for some (me included^^) if you have to constantly open discord to make posts, chat to people and invite and trade 2. you hit bosses before everyone else Most bossuniques are worth something for the first few days of the league and drop like CRAZY day after day. And after a few days they are worthless. As an example legacy of fury boots from masgen were 85c at the start of the league and after one week it already dropped to 20c So if you are more on the casual/beginner side its REALLY hard to get through the campaign fast enough and then get enough currency to be able to boss super early on to capitalize on this. 3. especially for ubers you need A LOT of starting capital. As stated in the beginning since most valuable drops have a very low dropchance you will lose quite a bit of currency until hitting that item. Sure you can get lucky but you also can get unlucky. This league I lost 300div doing uber maven and uber eater/exarch before quitting the league. Last league I made 300div profit in 50 uber mavens The 3 leagues combined I am somewhere in the range of -400 to -500div doing uber mavens. Thats a lot of div lost ^^ You dont even need to think about trying uber eater/exarchs below 50div investment and mavens below 100div investment imo because chances are you wont be making your currency back. That said there are some bosses that are not that hit or miss which I talk about a bit at the end 4. speed is KING. Bossing is all about doing enough to hit those rare drops to make the bulk of your profit. And with bossing especially the difference in build makes the clearspeed very apparent. For bosses like eater and exarch that dont have phases you can literally oneshot them the second they spawn. This means if my build is able to handle this I can do a map in like 10seconds if you include all the loading screens and looting. If your build takes longer to kill the boss and you need to play the phases it takes you maybe 2minutes per bossfight. This means I will make 12x more currency than you are able to make (avg ofc) because the difference in clear speed is this big. All of this said there are still ways to make bossing profitable for a more casual or newer player! Eventho it is somewhat boring/you cannot speed it up a boss like shaper is insanely good to get into bossing and learn the fights and make some guaranteed profit. The regular shaper has a 100% dropchance for the uber elder fragment. It depends on the league but its usually around 30c profit alone and it is never worth less than the guardian fragments you use to run shaper. So every single shaper is guaranteed profit with not too much investment so you are always going out positive and making progress while being able to affort more boss fragments. the flask is a big drop that can be worth multiple divines the gloves are usually fairly cheap but those are gloves with multiple highly sought after corruptions. So its always worth to corrupt the shapers touch gloves because some outcomes are over a divine, up to 10-20div depending on the corruption and current meta It is somewhat similar with uber shaper. the fragment itself with the new system now is a slight loss, but the belt which is fairly common makes up for that and usually nets you a positive profit in your average runs. this way you can sustain the fragment cost to continue running uber shapers the uber shaper also drops starforge and sublime vision as big drops which you can sell for a really good profit if it drops. So here you have a consistant income that lets you keep going and still some bigger drops to spike that profit elder and uber elder are somewhat similar but slightly more rng. they both drop watchers eyes that i highly recommend to sell unidentified. an unID watchers eye which drops roughly every 3rd map usually covers the cost and sometimes a slight profit for the fragments. This way its no guaranteed profit since you can still have bad rng but its way less spikey than mavens or eater/exarch

[@dirtymightmusic5239]

@@mathewsmith8073 My comment went into pretty big detail on one small subpart of the topics from the video tho so it was easier to maybe explain it a bit more clearly ^^ The video went into a bit more of an overview of ups and downs of each strat and not too much detail, which is fine if you ask me ^^ My points were just important to me because I dont want newer players to have a terrible time and not understanding why they dont make currency. Bossing for casual farming (atleast for quite a few bosses) is in a really rough state atm. I actually do make some videos here and there on my other account but its more for fun showcasing things quickly and I only have 1 guide aimed at beginners from last league.. :D Not anywhere near the quality of this video and with no voice since I just upload some things for fun if I feel like it. Might upload my plan and progression on how I plan to farm Mageblood in week1 this league. Still debating on if I wanna take the time to make that tho :D Making videos takes quite a bit of work and time and especially on leaguestart editing every video takes time that I cannot farm :P

[@eddienash2095]

No way I'm playing a build that relies on TFT to earn money...

[@sourcecodewill]

No singular strategy "relies" on TFT, just makes it easier, and I haven't mentioned any specific builds only playstyles.

[@timh5910]

You can Play a bossing build, rush bosses with Destructive Play and just sell fragments and stuff for very good money early

[@athraxis]

reddit moment

[@dirtymightmusic5239]

you dont need to rely on TFT to make money its just that any content that is able to sell carries will make more currency if you actually sell that carry. Your profit margin will just be smaller if you dont sell carries, if thats okay for you thats completely fine ^^ I personally never sell carries when I do bossing because I dont like interacting with people all the time when I want to chill and farm ^^

[@kwstasduka211]

Which bow build u recommend it?😊

[@PlayerSalt]

good content great seeing stuff made for newer players , keep at it and doing the poe stuff you enjoy

[@sourcecodewill]

@@PlayerSalt Appreciate it brother 🙏

[@hypijump4159]

Bossing is cool but selling carry is such a pain ....

[@sourcecodewill]

@@hypijump4159 It’s certainly not my thing either, but that’s why it pays so well, nobody wants to sell it, therefore the money is there

[@astraldreamer84]

It's not when you are doing maven invitations. Also doing maven invitations is the best way to make currency with budget build(around 50 div max).

[@rutessian]

About alterations.. it's not true that they're more expensive at the beginning of a league, quite the opposite: at the start they're 15-20 per chaos, towards the end of a league they're 5-8 per chaos.

[@sourcecodewill]

I’ve been trading and flipping alterations on league start for around 2 years, I promise you it is

[@beasthaven1571]

@@sourcecodewillwhat do you recommend to flip for newbies then ;-; damn people that struggle to earn their few chaos outside of chaos recipe

[@sourcecodewill]

@@beasthaven1571 100%, but I would say it's more effective past week 1 when margins are a bit better, work on your character first.

[@sourcecodewill]

@@beasthaven1571 I would say currency flipping is probably the easiest but has lower margins, but other things (things in high demand) usually will have better margins.

[@beasthaven1571]

@@sourcecodewill I want to try and learn sanctum this next league or the one after (really depends how schedule lines up if I miss or play league sadly) if it goes well sanctum

[@MandruDuce]

IMO with the current state of the game players that are not very experienced should go for more of a bossing build (slower build with high single target dmg). Not necesarilly with the idea of being a dedicated bosser but because it opens up way more avenues of making currency than mapping. In order to succeed as a mapper you need to know very well what you are doing. You are constantly challenged to decide how much of your currency you use to buy materials to keep mapping and how much you invest in your build. You need to know exactly what upgrades to make at every point to get the max juice out of your character. You also need to have a good plan on how and when to upgrade to your next tier of farming strat and which mechanics are best suited for fast clear speed average single target damage. On the other hand, on a more single-target focused character there is way more leniency. Even if you are not very experienced on upgrading your character and you are not optimal in your upgrades you wil most likely still land in a very good spot dmg wise. You also have way more strats available to you (bossing, all varieties of destructive play, essences, sanctum, rogue exiles, etc...). Basically imo both dedicated bossing (reliant on selling carries) and dedicated deadeye mapping are very specialized ways to approach a league start and require a lot of knowledge experience and repetition. For the more casual or inexperienced players that land somewhere in between, I think rn having a more single target focused build that still has good damage even if you are not very efficient with your upgrades will produce an overall better playing experience and provide more variety in terms of what content you want to run

[@matthiskalble3621]

i choose to farm hillock for the oni goroshi

[@daruthebeast]

you can start as an heist farmer and a sanctum farmer too.

[@beasthaven1571]

I’m trying to figure out if a sanctum farmer is worth it … cause I’m thinking of going that route sinc I’ve neveeerr done it before so it would be new and I can be doing my own thing and progressing plus relic hunting looks fun. Just don’t know which to practice as it takes me 10-12 hours to finish campaign …. Play time as a noob so maybe I’m too slow to try it?

[@nicholasfigueiredo3171]

Sanctum farmer is just a bosser with extra steps and heist farmer is just a mapper with MS and sometimes tankyness

[@nicholasfigueiredo3171]

@@beasthaven1571 12h is fine if you are planning sanctum farming, most people try boss rushing if they are fast. I would just practice reaching act 6 if you wanna get faster with the build you wanna play

[@yahim0568]

@@beasthaven1571 don't rely on sanctum alone for early profit it's a huge gamble, I've been playing in sanctum league and had a lot of fun ,but right now the mechanic has been rigged in some ways so early builds may struggle, also depending on how greedy you are might lose everything in a blink of an eye.

[@beasthaven1571]

@@yahim0568 lose everything?

[@aeristheangelk2556]

quant does change on higher tier maps. The mods can roll higher numbers = more quant and u have more atlas completion aka more atlas passive points = more quant/league mechanics.

[@jbaris]

Another option is a good all-rounder. I feel like my best league starts were pretty balanced.

[@sousukeaizen1299]

forgot to mention..if u want bossing..still need to be skill enough for boss fight..since most of the time..the gear maybe a bit less optimal for the fight..boss fight when overgeared is far easier..imagine fighting maven while undergear and need to do memory phase like 6-7 times..meanwhile mapping is braindead zooming

[@dirtymightmusic5239]

most builds that are focussed on bossing have a pretty insane amount of damage on basically 0 gear so maven memory game wont be happening that often :D You can get like 10m dps on a day 1-2 char which is more than enough to clear every boss fairly fast. But sure if you go in with a regular, undergeared build you need to know the mechanics and actually play the fight but you can argue exactly the same the other way around. If your build is not made for zooming you will have a pretty bad time with an undergeared char maybe more focussed on bossing/allrounder in juiced map content. I plan to do t16 oppenheimer expedition on day1 with a sub 1div budget as my farming strat because my build is made to do it. Try that with the same investment with any build not made to handle content like expedition and you will have a pretty rough time ^^ its all about what you wanna do and to use a character that is good for that content ^^

[@kamilmcki8631]

Depends what you run, people dont run the feared anymore because everyone is losing money on it

[@PeterLustig80]

Hello, what is better for me if i dont want to craft and dont use TFT?^^

[@gehirndoper]

Are there any resources that talk about how to set up bossers and how to actually kill with them? I'm struggling to get 4 void stones with meta progression builds with decent gear, let alone clear ubers. I have no idea how people can succeed with just a few div worth of gear.

[@user-ne2zx3nd2k]

If you are asking 'should i go bossing on league start?' means you are not ready for bossing on league start. It is profitable only for the absolute fastest campaign speedrunners who are extremely good at the game and reach those bosses much faster than everyone else. For average Joe who doesn't know what strategy to choose let alone how to execute it perfectly, bossing will be quite a sad experience on league start. Mapping is a default strat majority of people resort to, because its the most obvious - you push atlas, select some mechanics and rerun maps to gain profit. Not the most profitable but almost impossible to not make some profit.

[@sourcecodewill]

@@user-ne2zx3nd2k people gotta start somewhere, the best way to learn is to do the thing, you don’t have to execute things perfectly to have a good league start, I understand your point though

[@ExileStrategy]

Thanks algorithm, that's exactly what I was looking! I still don't know which of these route choose, I'm really bad at bossing, mechanic speaking. Do you know any build for saboteur a little tanky? I could give a try...

[@sourcecodewill]

@@ExileStrategy I would recommend you one, but I don’t want you to get nerfed as soon as the league starts, I’ll let you know closer to the time!

[@noimnotnice]

Templar is not slow at all (??). It was one of the fastest builds to level. That's why it's getting nerfed in 3.25; Dark Arts is being moved.

[@Billy4321able]

Interesting take.

[@Qzzz84]

If by 'fun' you mean playing while watching netflig.. then I dont want that kind of fun

[@sourcecodewill]

@@Qzzz84 Do what you want I’m not here to tell you how to play 😂

[@99darth99]

if I find a reliably cheap bossing build that can actually get access to them from a league start... Then i'll consider maybe selling boss runs. EDIT: It has to be able to carry me because i'm also bad.

[@lookitzhansol]

W video

[@Valkaneer]

Seems more to me Mapping= average player, Bossing= high end player. The average player can't even kill a 10 maven. So what good is it to make a bosser. The other issue, You said mappers can kill bosses faster in maps, If that was the case they would be a bosser. So I would highly disagree, CF for example has one of the fastest clears and very slow on map bosses.

[@sourcecodewill]

This isn’t true in my opinion, mapping and bossing is as hard as you make it, 100% delirium maps is very different to beast farming, as well as shaper farming is very different to Uber Maven farming. With killing bosses quicker in maps, when you have damage as a mapper, you can reach the boss quicker and kill it, that’s what I meant.

[@Valkaneer]

@@sourcecodewill most people looking for the information is not going to fall into those categories though. Most people trying to find out if they should make a bosser or a mapper is not doing juiced maps because if they were they wouldn't be asking.

[@sourcecodewill]

@@Valkaneer I don't think that I'm targeting people who can't complete the atlas with this video, I'm not targeting complete beginners, if not most of the information in this video would be redundant.

[@GigaChadJecht]

I don't wanna map mindlessly or boss coping I'll get good drops

[@c-tothefourth4879]

Sanctum :D

[@neverhook]

5Head

[@neverhook]

I dont think you can make a bosser for 1d xdd

[@TheJregis]

Or you could play SSF and play the real game......

[@Moritz_269]

This video and especially the ascendancy slides are so cooked. Any knowledgable trade league player will know the answer to that question if you're solo and it's not a hard one.

[@sourcecodewill]

I understand what you're saying however I've been around top players who make 10s of mirrors a league for years and they go in between mapping and bossing. There's no "best way to make currency" in trade league, it's whatever you enjoy and are good at.

[@Moritz_269]

@@sourcecodewill Yes mapping is indeed a very viable strategy past week 1 as you are strong enough to wear mf gear and still run the highest tier content. It is nowhere close on the first few days of the league where most noticeably sanctum, bossing, and valdo farming destroy mapping in terms of profit. Sadly the vods are not available anymore but CaptainLance played half as much as Fubgun in their currency race in 3.24 and Fubgun was only barely able to break even because of him exploiting various mechanics that were soon fixed.

[@Fubgun]

@@Moritz_269 I wasn't playing as much week 1 because I was being despair about my endgame being nerfed at the time, I spent a lot of time just sitting in hideout on stream, thinking about what to do. I would say look at my currency next league rather then necropolis, as it wasn't a good example.

[@dennisbloomer7171]

@@Moritz_269 CATW

[@Moritz_269]

@@Fubgun sure, how about this time you dont abuse every single exploit and do beast rotas on stream tho? :)