Pono Player Teardown - What's Inside

In this video, I take apart the new Pono Player and discuss the battery and chips (including the DAC). For more information: mikebeauchamp.com/2014/12/pono...

[@poorjudjement]

Great layout, Neil & Charlie really knocked it out of the park! It sounds incredible!

[@EvendimataE]

made the shape like that so they could use the cheaper battery size

[@James7995]

Nice caps and battery. Digital audio is still about the analog stage and that looks very strong.

[@James7995]

Everything between the DAC and your headphones is the analog stage and is often the difference between a good DAC and a great one. Great sounding DACs typically use discreet components to drive the output. Cheaper DACs often use chips that incorporate an opamp on the chip. The chip itself doesn't output the voltage needed to drive headphones and/or speakers. How a device handles those low level signals is critical in how it sounds, especially if your headphones or speakers are revealing in nature. With cheaper equipment it doesn't matter as much I suppose.

[@ezrazski]

goatstaog that's really ignorant of basic signal chain concepts. digital is able to perfectly transmit and duplicate whatever data has been converted. the key is the 2 conversions, coming in as analog, and playing back as analog. a DAP can't control what files you have loaded on it, how it was sourced or processed is up to the artist/producer. come playback time the DAC has to convert from digital to analog, then that analog has to be amplified and transmitted to the speakers. Most of these devices skimp on all parts of this, or get a nice DAC with crappy analog, or the crappy DAC before good analog like some brands. PonoPlayer gets it's right, with a good DAC then outstanding analog amplification and output.

[@PigeonDesign]

Correction: 128GB Samsung Chip was $1.09 more, putting price to $400.09

[@genuineuni]

That's a lot of money. I still say Neil Young is a shyster.

[@maniacaudiophile]

Thank you for the teardown. I'm wondering is the capacitor they have there for the power rail or is it for output coupling of the headphone amp? Thanks

[@ayreeltube]

+/- Power rails. Outputs are direct DC coupled.

[@Scott__C]

This popped up on YT and I watched it, so I dug out my old Pono. It asks to be plugged into power and when I try to power it on, the splash screen comes up then back to the plug in power icon. Is this just the battery needing replacement?

[@ulf5968]

Can I take the Battery off, and Use the player electric currant?

[@phil-hunt]

Hi, I am trying to clean up an old broken Pono player, and I can't quite tell how to pop the ribbon cables off. Do you know how to remove these by any chance?

[@stijndries7832]

+David Wei It's for the headphone amp!

[@techguy348]

using this player as an introduction to audiophile flac players. Works well but since the software is gone there are some workarounds that can be done for some specific features...

[@A.nasierkhan]

Sorry but its perception, perception, perception. I have two electrical engineering degrees, owner of recording studio and musician. If you record a passage at 16bit 44.1 kHz (CD) and the same passage at 24bit 192kHz and observe the two on an oscilloscope while subtracting the voltage signals from each other (180 degrees out of phase with each other), guess what’s left . . . Nothing. There could be artifact from the clocks, i.e. jitter, alias . . but not stuff left over from a better recording. The scope doesn't lie, it displays it all. And a speaker creates sound by converting an electrical current to sound. There is nothing else that makes that speaker move, just electrical current. There is no big or lush electrical current leftover, no spaciousness, no openness signals, sorry but its all in your head. Yes 24bit has more dynamic range, actually more that vinyl. But as a listener you can’t hear that. In the studio I use 32bit, WHY, because the process of mixing, applying EQ, reverb, etc. works much better as it’s all math, and 16bit math causes mathematical round off error. But once I’m all done mixing, 16bit plays back the same. But hey if spending lots of money sounds better, then go with your brain, but its not your ears hearing anything, because its just not there . . . . sorry I know so many of you are trying so hard to believe. Maybe the real bonus is that we've been getting Starbuck's all along at instant coffee prices.

[@gadjox]

Does the hardware justify the high price? That battery looks ugly as sin in this case.

[@piszi83]

Gadjo X Not at all. Especially if they mass produce it, because that lowers the manufacturing price. And I think its funny to call a portable player hi-fi or audiophile because if you travel than the noise of the enviroment makes it impossible to hear the full dynamic range. And if you see it as a home player than are much better ones. Oh and I think and amp so thiny with a small power supply as this has will never produce audiophile quality.

[@gadjox]

***** I gave up listening to music when commuting for this exact reason. Too much noise and I don't hear anything properly. I read on my phone and on my kindle to pass the time.

[@mikebeauchamp3867]

Hi Faroek, I'm planning to do another video soon testing the actual audio output of the Pono vs a few other players. Maybe you can help by suggesting some ways I can test this stuff out. I have access to a good scope and some other tools. I was also thinking about doing some blind listening tests as well.

[@piszi83]

***** I would like to see, how it preforms after intensive usage at high volume, how heat effects the output, or how the battery holds up under pressure, is it enough to support the whole system without compromising the output, or how it preforms with different impedance loads because some high end headphones are pretty high impedance and as I see on the pono webpage they didn't specified the impedance range than we should assume you can use any type of headphones with it. :)

[@socratesthecabdriver]

yes but can you vape on it ?

[@ericcindycrowder7482]

The Pono uses the same 32bit DAC of that the highly regarded OPPO 105....ESS Sabre32. Granted the Oppo is not portable, it's an audiophile grade bluray, CD, SACD player which also plays high def audio files from a hard disc, flash drive, or attached PC. I would like to know how the sound quality compares between the two products:

[@vladlashing]

the DAC chip itself is Extremely cheap in bulk. You realize this right? Whats important is the circuit not the chip. You can find this chip in many CHEAP units and in expensive units. You can buy this chip right now at Mouser. If buying just one its cheap. Buy 1000 and its really cheap.

[@rodmunch69]

vladlashing - you can buy just a single unit from China for $5 via AliExpress (google it, not exaggerating), so they're not even that expensive when bought in non-bulk. In bulk they're easily down into the $1 range I'd imagine.

[@michaelbarrett8803]

I have 2 Oppo 105Ds and the Pono sounds much better. The Oppo's Dac is nothing to wright home about. the PS Audio Direct Stream is my main system DAC and is fantastic. The Pono is a full music server, DAC with ballanced outputs all in one. It is a very respectable unit in my opinion.

[@gonigeena]

this teardown shows that the toblerone shape is completely unnecessary

[@ezrazski]

+gonigeena no it shows the opposite. the big standard battery can be popped out and upgraded. no other DAP has that. also the headphone jacks don't take stress like on a slab shape.

[@ezrazski]

+gonigeena it's a perfect shape, regardless of the innards. my list is above, i'll repost why the shape is perfect, or at least way better than a slab: 1. no stand needed. works in all directions. viewable angle is great even with bad screen. 2. no case needed. rugged and won't slide away. 3. no headphone plug killing. headphone plugs are never torqued. 4. feels perfect in the hand and very easy to drive with one hand. in the dark. even with the screen off. tactile buttons and shape work perfectly to your senses.

[@raffaelepassarelli6444]

I guess you are an happy customer, right?

[@michaeldavis9422]

That has one of the best DAC's and highest end capacitors in the business. The sound would be fantastic with good headphones and real 24bit 192KHz content.

[@BlueSoulJim]

What are those tiny soft black squares? One of em fell off

[@elijahmodnar1]

Thanks for this tear down. Always thought its shape/size was overkill. Now we know for sure! It's a shame the battery is not long and flat. Then it could be taking up all that space. Cue planned obsolescence and a 128GB version out with larger battery/display. Smaller form factor within 6months :p I still want one tho, for the balanced output to headphones such as old trusty sennheiser hd25 or newer Sony z7 (and z5, h2, h3, a2, a3, 1r as well as older ex800/7550, ex1000)

[@JohnStefani]

I don't think most of us would be brave enuf to start prying it apart so thanks for the look inside! Wish I had $400 to drop on one. Looks first class all the way. But how does it sound?

[@elijahmodnar1]

hmm what about a slimmer 3D printed case to replace the triangular case...

[@vladlashing]

Great video

[@littlejon64]

HEY MAN NICE JOB QUESTION IS IT POSSIBLE TO GET THIS LARGER MEMORY CHIP AND HAVE IT REPLACED OR IS THE CIRCUIT TOO SMALL ? THANKS

[@mikebeauchamp3867]

If you can unsolder a BGA chip, resolder in a new one, and possibly tweak the firmware - you should be sweet. So unless you're a robot, you're stuck with the 64GB of internal memory.

[@littlejon64]

***** Thanks man I am not a robot so I am ok with an external card

[@phpART]

littlejon64 prove it

[@christianbrossette]

My pono player gets warm around where the display is, if I play high res music on it. Did you noticed a similar behavior with yours? I also though of taking mine apart to take a look, thank you that I don't have to do this anymore :)

[@mikebeauchamp3867]

Hi Ein, yeah mine gets pretty warm even while playing 16/44.1 FLAC files.

[@christianbrossette]

***** Ok, tanks. I was that mine could be broken.

[@RemX405]

It's not about the file you're playing, it's most likely how hard you're pushing the amplifier (volume).

[@wokeil]

Shouldnt have bought it

[@christianbrossette]

Çerastes I payed for it. Why would it be a trash player? It does everything it should, so it can't be trash in that sense.

[@Nukle0n]

Wait, where is the cpu?

[@femaledeer]

I would wait for version 3, if there is one. Also, if you are not running it through a home stereo, what is the point of this thing as it doesn't have enough power to power high end headphones. Sony's high def player sounds more intriguing albeit at a much higher price. But even the Sony only has 128 gb of internal memory which is inadequate to store uncompressed music. The flash memory market can't seem to get to 256 gb at a good price point for some reason.

[@ezrazski]

+femaledeer i run it through everything and it makes everything down chain sound better. it's the perfect portable player because you know nothing out there sounds better, at least nothing that won't cost you a mortgage payment or 2

[@PhilXavierSierraJones]

Audiophile tarpit: Pono player is snake oil Loseless audio and good lossy copy is basically indistinguishable MP3 is just another codec Golden Ear is a placebo effect packaged in silk

[@jamrug3472]

Pono player is one of the best sounding players on it's price. Loseless audio and even good lossy copy is not that hard to distinguish (especially when you're musician). Feel sorry for you if you can't hear it. So NO.

[@PhilXavierSierraJones]

Łukasz Jamrugiewicz I'd like to hear your music though.

[@jamrug3472]

Check out my chanel for lossy copy, PM for lossless

[@shahriarhaque915]

That doesn't look like $400 equipment.

[@fahqfassebookman5157]

Shahriar Haque Yet it sounds like $20k equipment. Which is more important to you?

[@jaaasgoed]

Jodin Ravia Yeah, I bet It sounds just like a McIntosh setup

[@ezrazski]

jaaasgoed ponoplayer sounds better than mcintosh gear i've heard. Ayre's approach to feedback (short version - they don't believe in "good feedback") makes his analog circuit design unlike anything mcintosh is doing. Mcintosh in fine stuff, no doubt, but there are fundamental differences in the basic signal design between an Ayre amp and other makers. This is the first time Ayre has tried something under $1k, as far as I know, and to my ears they hit it out of the park.

[@rodmunch69]

This thing clearly isn't worth the money compared to other products out there, but that is the miracle of mass production. If this thing was actually designed custom for them, and they had to create custom software, they'd need a lot more sales than they got for the mass market to dramatically lower cost. But say they sold a million of these, then that price could be down in the $99 range, including a large profit, very quickly. If they sold 10-million, the price could be in the $49 range, still with a large profit. So comparing a mass market item to a custom product like this, you're not going to get value, so it has to make up for that elsewhere... and clearly this product doesn't do that.

[@redriverhautbois]

Looks fairly well built and that's a very good DAC. I'm excited at the possibility of having high fidelity audio reproduction on the go, rather than just at home with my stereo or a headphone rig. For all the bitter people who seem to always chime in to naysay anything resembling quality, have fun with your McAudio.

[@fahqfassebookman5157]

redriverhautbois I've used mine almost everyday for 5 months, it lives loose in my bag and my car, my desk, my dresser, my living room..... it's amazing. I barely ever listen to my phone anymore. I've deleted gigs of mp3's too.

[@redriverhautbois]

How exactly has it been "proven"? It's got a good DAC, are you saying there's no difference between DACs? Because that's a ridiculous opinion.

[@fahqfassebookman5157]

redriverhautbois PP has got a lot more than a great DAC. It also has Meridian's 'negative-feedback' analog circuit design, it has Ayre's proprietary filters between DAC and analog, it has discreet power, it has separate analog and digital boards, and it has no radios, sensors, or other interference on the board. These are all critical components to great sound. Finally, it has balanced output. No other device offers this at this price point. Driving true-balanced outputs with discreet cables really takes you to another level in audio.

[@ovonisamja8024]

No wonder the unit is so bulky. They could have easily fitted a flat battery and make the whole unit more compact. Also those big ass capacitors could have been fitted more optimally. Who in their right mind would want to carry this thing around?

[@ezrazski]

+ovo nisamja best gadget i ever bought. i don't carry it around in my pocket too often, it's always sitting on the stereo or in the car or in my bag. sounds amazing. portable perfection. no hassle, no distraction.

[@ovonisamja8024]

I had a car stereo with a USB connector so, that's more convenient for me. As far as the quality goes, if you include external noise, I doubt it's worth going down that road. For me, mp3 at 256kbs (good converter is mandatory here!!!) is the top quality one needs to go if he's going to listen to music in a car, or on the street with ear buds. That's just my opinion. But than again, I have nothing against other people wanting different things, so, yeah, just go for it. And if you're happy about it, all the better. Edit: I forgot to smile. :)

[@ezrazski]

cool. i think once you have full quality in your ears you won't want to go back, no matter where you are, mobile, driving, on the bus, wherever. our ears are amazing at filtering background noise and still determining quality. it's like someone offering you clean water and you don't think you deserve it, dirty is good enough for you. the compressed mp3 files were transitionary tech, necessary 20 years ago but definitely not now. but yeah, no one will get rid of the compression, you can keep those mp3 forever. i can't go back, since about 2012 i've gone all lossless and my mp3s all sound like paper bags now.

[@ovonisamja8024]

Well if you put it that way kinda makes sense.

[@ezrazski]

Anirudh Rao i get the complaints with the shape but IMO it's way better than a slab. it sits, stands, and stays put all by itself. it doesn't need a case and it doesn't put stress on your headphone cables. overall i love the shape, it's perfect for a media player.

[@ph0sgene967]

where the hell is the cpu?

[@jfandersson3223]

There isn't any

[@PhilXavierSierraJones]

Pros: - Lossless audio support - High quality stutter-less audio - Two outputs - Long battery life - Simplistic design Cons: - Sets off snake oil alarm - Bulky and cannot be carried in a pocket that easily - Most audio players today supports FLAC anyway (high-end ones) - Slightly problematic touch screen - Rubber coating would literally disintegrate and discolored if used vigorously - Ugly shape for portable players, good for integrating into Bluetooth speakers and such p.s. I was talking about using a mid-range headphone to listen to some high quality music. If you care so much about lossless audio, go for WAV! Those are basically indestructible and can be played on any decent audio players and converted to literally any format. Go with ridiculous sampling rate like 1954032Hz. I know you want it.

[@Momonga-s7o]

Really? Discrete transistors, like, REALLY?!

[@X3RUBIM]

Yeah, Kalmah kicks ass.

[@terrymackamckenzie6865]

Look at those dirty big caps! This is why they made it look like a Toblerone haha.

[@randallmclaren]

I'm going to save for one of these.

[@freesoftwareextremist8119]

Buy a Sansa Clip+ and an SD card and be happy. The Pono is scam.

[@user-xg6zz8qs3q]

Get the FiiO X1 for 99$ on amazon. It's better than the PONO.

[@randallmclaren]

Listen, I am a very proud Canadian, and Neil Young is pretty incredible, so i'll buy anything he sells.

[@user-xg6zz8qs3q]

Just because he's Canadian? Now I can clearly see how Tim Horton's is still in business selling stale bagels and awful coffee.

[@randallmclaren]

Comparing Neil Young to Tim Horton's simply doesn't work there buds. But seriously you're a really funny guy.

[@michaeldavis9422]

No. Too much guess work in 16bit 44.1KHz. 24Bit 192KHz is much more accurate and detailed, with so little guess work you couldn't tell the difference between digital and analogue.

[@endofword2012]

SURPRIZZZ...TOBLERONE Chocolate bar inside !!!!

[@ezrazski]

amazing how many people judge an audio device by how it looks these days. or how it makes them look. fools.

[@khandarwilliam5439]

Pono Player - What's Inside? mp3 player

[@ezrazski]

+Khandar William what's inside khandar william? ignorance. mp3 is just a file format. just like flac, wav, dsd. this is a player with a great DAC, great analog stage, great filters, and plenty of on-board storage and output options. if you choose to play 10% files (mp3) that's up to you. you can eat food with 10% of the flavor, that's your choice.

[@rareblues78daddy]

So... they *could* have put 128GB of storage in this thing and didn't? What the Hell? Price be damned. People still would have bought it. Heck, they're already spending $400 for this thing... what's another $100 or so? What a gyp.

[@ScottNeelan]

The simple fact is that, while the Pono Player uses some pretty good kit, it's not going to blow anyone away with audio quality. You could get similar enough results with a cheap MP3 player, high enough bitrate encoding, and a half-decent portable DAC/amp solution. You'll spend less, and feel like less of a chump when you move that DAC/amp over to your computer as well. That's added value the Pono will never have.

[@ezrazski]

ScottNeelan Not really -- I'm not being snotty, I think you are wrong. Nothing you build is going to be as portable or durable as the PonoPlayer, it's one device with what you would need 3 for. It's a better shape than any slab, and it's a tough little bugger that requires no case, no stand, and no concerns. 128gb expandable MicroSD is nice too. Why would you need to move the DAC over to the computer? That's marginally important to me. The analog in the ponoplayer smokes any computer anywhere, and you only need 1 good music player when it's so portable and has so many output options. I listen to ponoplayer while I use the computer, I don't need to move my DAC around if it's sitting on my music library. I'd like wireless sync if they could be sure of no interference. Part of Pono's good sound is no radios or sensors whatsoever, and a discreet power supply and analog board.

[@ezrazski]

Unless it's one of the expensive Fiio's or A&K it's not sounding as good as the Ponoplayer. Getting Ayre amplification battery powered for $400 is the real value of the device. This is the world of analog, (like your ears and the rest of the real world). 2nd best feature is the flexible output, including balanced, line, headphone, and dual headphone. The DAC, memory, android, and general feature list can be found on other devices. The form factor is perfect for both mobile and stationary use. Everything is open standards. The store pushes provenance and HD remasters. What's not to like?

[@xnamkcor]

I'll hold out until someone makes one that supports 64-bit files.

[@NonsensicalSpudz]

+xnamkcor X ermm 64 bit audio? are you confused?

[@xnamkcor]

NonsensicalSpudz en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_bit_depth

[@NonsensicalSpudz]

xnamkcor X fair enough but i think well just music and the like are recorded at a max of 24bit, the 64bit may be used for some serious stuff

[@xnamkcor]

NonsensicalSpudz It's used for editing, mastering, etc. Not really something you play back, like 48 and 64-bit color space images.

[@NonsensicalSpudz]

xnamkcor X wait wait, were talking audio not display dude

[@AuralVirus]

Comes with an 18650 - stick a 510 fat daddy on there and a dna evolv chip (or sx3 series if you like spilling juice) & it'd make a sweet mod box :) afterall it's a shite mp3 player....

[@cybervision_1]

I've lost all respect for Neil Young

[@ezrazski]

+cybervisionbritney you clearly had none to begin with or you wouldn't attack a man over the product his company sells, especially with everyone who owns one loves it. you are just a hater in disguise.

[@lm6036]

Please don't hate me for asking this, I am by no means an expert on audio. But what makes this thing sound better then plugging my headset in phone? (GALAXY Note 4) I mean I can tell the difference between playing from my phone and from my soundcard but that ain't worth 400 dollar. Shouldn't you rather spent 400 dollar on a good headphone?

[@ezrazski]

+Eternal Genesis basic answer - signal chain. the source file quality is the first thing in the playback chain. the first makes it by far the most important. you can't fix it down the chain. source is everything. assuming it's the best you have, then you can improve down the chain -- amps, speakers, cords, chips, etc. so even if you play the same file from your phone that's on my pono player, it's rendered differently by the different links in the chain: DAC chip, filters on the digital output, analog preamp, then analog output amp and wiring. your phone has parts made for voice and gaming, entirely printed into 1 integrated circuit complete with radios sensors and other interferences, and purchased from a supplier for around $3. my pono player has the same type of parts but each is specifically picked and tuned for professional audio, designed and built by audio experts to sound the best they can sound with critical listening. total cost of those parts might be $100 as opposed to $4. the rest is memory, case, screen, and battery cost., which your phone might be similar or better than the ponoplayer. but none of that has to do with sound quality. the ponoplayer is a single-purpose digital device. not that many exist, which is partly why it gets heckled. also neil young speaks his mind and often times is liberal (canadian) so he gets attacked and so do his projects. the thing sounds great. better than your phone, i can guarantee it. that's it in 4 words, or lots of words.

[@humorss]

the layout of the board actually look good (I'm a noob at electronics btw). but the chassis and everything eles is just terrible. for $400 any asian designed player would f this over.

[@fahqfassebookman5157]

10shot9miss I think the form factor is perfect for a music player. Far superior to the slab shape in many ways. I'd like a better screen, battery, and wireless sync wouldn't be bad, as long as it doesn't interfere with the audio.

[@raffaelepassarelli6444]

next KS: Porno Player

[@s0nnyburnett]

So cheap and nasty. It's bad enough on the outside. Next level of awful on the inside. Just shameful Neil Young. Wouldn't wipe my ass with this if I ran out of toilet paper.

[@ezrazski]

+s0nnyburnett then you are an idiot. until you hear it you can't comment on it. it's a sound device. it's only purpose is to sound as good as possible at that price point. and they accomplished this. so you are an idiot, judging an audio device by what it looks like.

[@s0nnyburnett]

ezrazski mine didn't come with a placebo, maybe that's the problem.

[@ezrazski]

the placebo syndrome is you. when presented with better quality you don't even notice it. you've accepted the placebo (bad mp3 audio) as being as good as it gets. if you can't explain why a fender strat sounds better than a $50 guitar I can't help you. please don't try to bastardize science to disprove quality.

[@s0nnyburnett]

ezrazski Are you Neil's son?

[@ezrazski]

s0nnyburnett not that i know of, haha. my mom was a fan though...

[@yuser1993]

What a joke of a product lol