PRE-WASH: NEW Answers: Real World Test (PART 2)

[@Detailing_Dogma]

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[@autowerkesexclusive]

We've been using snow foams in our shop since '93 so have a lot of experience with them. If I can make a suggestion, when using any snow foam/ pre soak / whatever you want to call it, 1. don't allow the foam to dry - try rinsing off after about a minute while the foam is still sitting on the panel ( we basically foam the car, remove the bottle and replace the tip and then rinse ) and 2. rinse from the bottom up. Pre soaks are designed to grab the dirt and suspend it off the paint using the sharp stream of water to remove it from the paint. When rinsing from the top down, you're rinsing away the detergent before the sharp stream of water can do its job properly.

[@XxIvanAnatorxX]

Rinsing from bottom up would only toss what dirt is still left on the vehicle up and create more work for you when rinsing. All/most presoaks are made differently, as far as chemistry is concerned, so while rinsing off after a minute might not be a big deal, some say on the directions to let dwell for 3-5 minutes. If you’re mobile, working in the sun, yeah for sure, rinse after a minute, but if you’re in a controlled environment, allowing to dwell the full time as directed/recommend by the chemist/manufacturers should lead to optimal results

[@MartinBennett-rs6thrasher]

The best explanation of why to rinse from bottom I have read. As you describe, it's the water pressure and the product combined that works best. The foam (or other prewash) won't do much by itself.

[@ZacharyPerezIsZacchuu]

Presoaks also emulsify dirt, water just pushes dirt and that increases your chance of marring/scratching the paint.

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Good point, well said. 🙏 Thank you

[@מדינט]

Indeed and that is why I always use prewash soap before anything, it's a gentle way to remove dirt before using water.

[@whitegoodman7465]

Pre wash is king, always will be. Most important part of the wash.

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Thanks for the feedback cheers my friend.

[@laurapalmerTDGE]

Correct! Always pre-wash. I mainly use Nerta Carnet Jumbo and let it soak for +- 5 minutes.

[@BillyJohnson-s2h]

Love to see videos like this. Much better than the other Canadian who does nothing but push product. There is a difference no question. However, the question is not whether there’s going to be a difference. Rather, is the difference enough to justify the expense of a presoak foam. I’m not so sure there is. I hand wash my vehicles. I will get all that off regardless of whether I use a presoak. Therefore my question is does the pre-soak remove excess substances that would cause me to scratch the car on a hand wash? I find that to be a very very negligible difference. Especially for those of us who don’t live with that bad of weathered streets. Therefore there are so many other variables on a case by case situation it’s not just yes or no Great video!

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Hey man, thank you for your feedback. I totally understand where you're coming from, pre-wash can be a good insurance, depends on level on OCD as well, I always soak the car in some kind of stronger soap before rinsing for peace of mind, it goes in every nooks and crannies too. I agree the difference isn't crazy when you use a pressure washer but it removes more dirt, then a 5L of superfoam would last you for at least 2 years washing weekly this isn't that expensive insurance in the end. I'm not sure if the difference in dirt or film remaining would equal in less scratches but I have had success so far in my paint finish, not perfect but pretty damn good for a daily in Canada harsh environment. Cheers

[@uphilldrop]

Salt can be removed easily with just a pressure washer. It’s all the other junk from the Canadian roads that requires a solid prewash soap. Thx for the video. Keeps the trashy wintry Canadian roads in perspective

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Thank you!

[@BMan100]

..yeah I'm waiting to wash my challenger(white as well).. I haven't yet with our ontario winters and salt... and the temperature swings...with my cars PPF though, I think the prewash I use only goes so far. since it clings so much.

[@Detailing_Dogma]

you should be fine! I'm not sure, Is your challenger in storage or you haven't washed this whole winter?

[@BMan100]

@@Detailing_Dogma .. she's my daily... Scat pack 6 spd, just haven't had a chance to wash it all winter with the temp swings.. I do have it undercoated with Corrosion Free so ..

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Okk..As soon as we get temperature above 1 or 2 degrees during winter you should be able to wash it outside :) if not then probably not a bad idea to pass through a touchless car wash once every 3 or 4 weeks. @@BMan100

[@BMan100]

@@Detailing_Dogma yeah…I’m glaring at my own active 2.0 with my autoglym stuff and just waiting for other baited breath…

[@hammertimee777]

The main reason many people avoid using prewash is because a prewash with an alkaline or acidic soap can quickly degrade wax/sealant or first generations ceramic coating. As such, people used pre-wash using a ph neutral soap. But today’s ceramic coating can easily withstand harsh soap, more people are doing it. I have avoided using harsh prewash and reserved them just for before polishing and coating jobs.

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Thanks for watching, appreciate you leaving your thoughts here!

[@RojohII]

Prewash soap for me - always, but I use the Koch Chemie Msn instead of Sfn when the car is dirty.👍

[@Detailing_Dogma]

I need to get some of that MSN at some point. Thank you

[@atalk143]

@RojohII How do you prewash with KC Msn - Do you use a foam cannon, IK foamer (or similar), or do spray it on? Also, what ratio(s) are you using? I am have been looking at high-alkaline soaps such as Msn, Sfn, and the Bilt-Hamber twins in preparation for a Spring full decon/detail of all our cars.

[@RojohII]

@@atalk143It depends on how dirty the car is and how lazy I am :) But all methodes work well. If the car is moderatly/medium dirty, I'd use foamcannon and with PIR=2-3% (or 1:50-1:30). The downside with using a foamcannon is that you use a lot more product compared to a pumpsprayer/IK foamer for the same dilutionstrength. If the car is very dirty, I dilute Msn between 3-5% in a pumpsprayer and I'd also put a layer of foam (doesn't have to be mixed that strong) on top if it's hot/sunny to keep the surface wet.

[@Detailing_Dogma]

hey man check out KCX website for MSN it's meant to be used a pump sprayer at around 50:1 and rinse fairly quickly. I havent tried it yet, just looking at the general info. You could use an APC the same way would work fine for a couple cars it's good enough. I'd 10:1 green star and spray away @@atalk143

[@eric_blouin]

Thx for the video. Keep it up. Have you tried a pre soak with SaltsGone and hot water? I use it for with a ik e multi pro 12 before wash. Great way to neutralize salt before pushing it in all the nooks and crannies. Hand wash after. Cheers.

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Hey Eric, thanks for letting me know, I'll definitely look into it, i've never used any dedicated salt remover type product before, I was always a bit skeptic but i'm willing to give it try now that you are telling ling me about it.

[@spikestern3237]

Alkaline is good and sometimes necessary to revive ceramic protection. I like Koch Chemie products but have not tried this Sfn. However, I use their AF, which is a little less alkaline on the scale. It's good, smells good, cleans well. Also uses their Gsf which is neutral in PH. They claim that if you put little GS alkaline in Gsf, it will be like their AF? I have experimented a bit with it and say that it is correct. Gsf for more regular washing when the car is not too dirty. There are many good agents, even Bilt Hamber's both their pre-wash agents are strong alkaline. I haven't tested their new recipe for Touchless, it made them more powerful. Bilt Hamber they do good things, their fallout remover both Korrosol and Auto Whell are the best I've tried and I've tried many. As well as Bilt Hamber Surfex HD is the best alkaline I have tested it is better than Koch Chemie GS which is also very good. The Bilt Hammer cleans better and uses less product and less work to get it clean, so it will be cheaper in the long run. I recently bought a 5 liter of their Surfex HD on offer. It's been a few years since I last used it. It was much better than the others I had at home. I gave away my other alkalines to a farmer. Remove dung on a tractor, they are good for it. 5 liters of surfex HD is enough for a few years for me as you dilute it very much. Then it contains some rust stopping as well. Pre-washing with foam is a must, first some cold petroleum-based degreasing against salt, tar, asphalt. Or Saltex against salt in the winter, you also put a little in the windshield washer fluid to remove the salt.

[@Detailing_Dogma]

love hearing your thoughts thank you for writing them!

[@Brutusofbaine]

Great review. Real world test. Keep up the great work. Much appreciated. Subscribed.

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Thank you my friend, appreciate your encouragement. Stay tuned

[@miguelnavarro907]

Prewashing king , even if doesn’t clean all but what is left behind will be easier to wash with the mat

[@Detailing_Dogma]

agreed, cheers.

[@alain2409]

Bonsoir Frank, merci pour cette vidéo au final c'est quoi la différence entre koch chemie Gsf et koch chemie Sfn ?

[@Detailing_Dogma]

GSF c'est plutôt pour ton lavage avec contact du gants de lavage et SFN c'est un shampoing hard pour le pre-lavage a PH éléver pour retirer la majorité de la saleté avant ton étape de lavage traditionel. GSF tu peux le moussé au canon mais c'est neutre donc c'est pour ton lavage avec contact.

[@AbigailFrancisco]

Great video! It really proves that pre-washing really works. I'm just curious if pre-rinsing with pressure washer would cause some scratches? Thank ao much!

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Very good question! It's hard to tell, if it does it would be very light in some situation, to avoid that possibility, the pre-wash would soften and encapsulate the dirt particles then rinsed with a pressure washer more gently in a sense. hope that helps. Cheers my friend and thanks for watching.

[@XxVendetaxX1]

I personally couldn’t get super foam to work for me and my car. Every time i used it, it would leave bad soap stains in any weather at low dilutions.

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Hey man, that weird that you experienced that, I'd say bad batch but coming from KCX that would surprise me. I used SF in every condition and situation and never once left anything unusual. Do you use wells water or city?

[@XxVendetaxX1]

@@Detailing_Dogma City water, don't know why i had these problems personally but i never blamed the product or the company. I'm just happy others are liking it and funnily enough, i used the rest of my super foam as laundry detergent and i fell in love with it as the best laundry soap i've ever used. lol.

[@Detailing_Dogma]

haha never heard so such a thing! Car soap turned into laundry detergent!@@XxVendetaxX1

[@MlleVB]

But after this im going to use 2bucket method? Is just rinsing with power washter is SAFE ENOUGH? If afterwards im gonna use 2bucket method?

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Yes after pre-washing with SuperFoam. do a rinseless or your regular wash process. The pre-wash wont clean 100% of the paint but will do a large portion of the job and reduce the chance of scratching. Hope that helps and thanks for watching!

[@kxld03]

How does carpro lift do against superfoam?

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Hey man thank you for chiming in, I haven't compared the 2 side by side, I used quite a bit of Lift in the past it's not as powerful for sure, carpro made it in with coatings integrity in mind is my guess, still a good product for moderate dirty cars though, it just won't remove the last bit of film as much.

[@bigmario7065]

Great video 👍 👍

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Thank you! Cheers!

[@ArthurMSoto]

Have you tried Koch Chemie Active Foam?

[@Detailing_Dogma]

Yes, wasn't a fan, not very slick either for a bucket wash with proper dilution.

[@ArthurMSoto]

@@Detailing_Dogma Damn, was hoping to hear good things. I have a big thing of Super foam but looking for something lower in pH for certain vehicles

[@Detailing_Dogma]

you can still give it a shot for a pre-wash it's good but the smell is overpowered imo the bucket wash isn't very slick. @@ArthurMSoto

[@ArthurMSoto]

@@Detailing_DogmaHave you mixed GSF & GS together? They say it produces same results as Active Foam. I plan to test it soon

[@Detailing_Dogma]

@@ArthurMSoto I have not but I have both gsf and GS. Its economical in the long run to invest in superfoam if you're serious about prewashing. Btw I love kcx but not a huge fan of GSF. Cheers

[@asymptomatic84]

i do 10:1 with super foam, which is probably overkill 😂

[@Detailing_Dogma]

10-1 in the cannon or end dilution, remember once it goes through the foam cannon it gets diluted once more 10-1

[@alexk5157]

If you wash a car every week do you still need pre wash?

[@Detailing_Dogma]

yes and no, assess the situation everytime, if you use a pressure washer it is not necessary to pre-wash. Do you have a paint corrected paint? Are you willing to go an extra step to have a safer and easier wash? The prewash will soak and emulsify dirt and debris so you can remove them easily with the pressure washer or any water source.

[@alexk5157]

@@Detailing_Dogma I don’t have a coating but I do use spray sealer like wet coat or new one Koch chemie so.o3.

[@skicrave1]

What kind of monster rinses from the bottom up?!?

[@rafaelsanchez7224]

👍🏽✌🏽💪🏽🇵🇷🇵🇷🇵🇷

[@Detailing_Dogma]

cheers brother