D Bit Grinder Modification for Easier End Mill Sharpening

[@Preso58]

Just as a side note, many people have correctly identified that you can use the feed screw as a sort of hard stop and feed the cutter to be ground from the outside of the wheel towards the centre of the spindle. However, I find that there are a number of issues with that approach. Firstly, there are no degree graduations on the workhead tilt that allow you to accurately set the primary and secondary relief in the downward tilt position. Secondly, you cannot see the cutting edge as it is ground because you will be looking at the trailing edge of the cutting lip. Thirdly, there is a strong spring which you have to hold against as you rotate the collet and end mill around to the next position for grinding. You sort of need three hands to do it safely. Both methods have their drawbacks but on balance, I think feeding the cutter from the inside of the wheel is more user friendly.

[@andrewdolinskiatcarpathian]

It’s interesting (at least to me 😂) that you speak of a spring, the pressure of which you need to overcome. I’ve heard of others mention such a spring yet my machine, and other variations of the Deckel clone do not have the spring. Therefore without that spring I don’t think your idea of feeding from inside out using the depth stop feed screw would work on my machine. Definitely much food for thought and has made me re-evaluate my machine.

[@DavidHerscher]

Dang i came here to make that very comment. As an aside, the knob is indeed intended as a means to set the stop position, and not as a feed knob. So i believe that is indeed how the machine is intended to be used, for whatever that’s worth. Either way, great problem solving as always!

[@johnjewell219]

Just found your channel I have the same machine ,I didn’t like the heavy spring .did a lot of grinding on dekel grinder and I don’t remember a spring .I bought some small 25mmx.5mm diamond wheels that fit the dremel arbors handy if you need to make centre cutting end mills. Regards john

[@VoidedWarranty]

yeah I took my spring off, I set my stop by doing a test cut on one flute, a tiny bit at a time, and retract to see how close I need to be. Since the center of the cutter is the last to engage the wheel, it's not too difficult to use magnification and adjust the stop until the center is just barely touched by the wheel. Then I don't touch the stop and pull the head back towards me to clear the wheel and switch to another flute. Can go through all flutes really quickly. Additionally that stop isn't a precision surface, moving the work head left and right along it will slightly change how much infeed you have, so I try to only make cut depth adjustments using the wheel feed rather than the work head left and right feed knob. The deckel manuals show coming from the outside, and while yes these clones don't have the full scale going the other direction, a protractor on the wheel works fine. If you haven't calibrated the scales they're likely off by a few degrees anyway. On my machine I can loosen a screw and rotate the scale to be in whatever position I need. Its quite handy.

[@AmateurRedneckWorkshop]

Good job on the resharpening. A couple of weeks ago I did my first end mill sharpening with my D bit grinder. I worked from the outside of the wheel in though. I used to give things away on my channel but I got tired of the many who would win and never come back to claim the prize.

[@Preso58]

Harold, I did watch your video on end mill sharpening. You and I both know how difficult it can be. So much to learn and so little time! Regards, Mark

[@whatupg1]

I have the same model grinder, no expert for sure but I always use the knob as a depth stop then by hand swing the collet holder in and out with the spring tension it has. Thankyou for your videos

[@larryschweitzer4904]

I do the same but it is easy to make the swing go too far with just a bit too much hand pressure. The relatively sharp edges on the wheels also get rounded over too soon.

[@bikefarmtaiwan1800]

Great stuff -lovely to hear someone know the difference between a slot drill and an endmill !

[@blfstk1]

Good Show Mate: Salvaging that which was broken. Modifying stuff. Happiness. I'll almost certainly never have a D-bit grinder but it was fun watching you solve the problem. Definitely needs a better knob.

[@Preso58]

The upgraded parts are almost done. I just have to anodise them tomorrow and I will show the result in a follow up video. Regards, Mark

[@Bristoll170]

Great stuff as always Mark. Brilliantly simple and well executed prototype. Nice to have all the toys to help as well 👍. If and when you do the final fit, it'll be a work of art that those of us on the outside will be enjoying with a beer 🙂. Take care and that's as always for you time. Cheers Pete' N.Z

[@Preso58]

Thanks Pete from Aotearoa. My wife finished off our photo book from our last trip to NZ. Such a lovely place! I am still designing (in my head) how the upgraded stop will look. I do want it to look pretty. Regards, Mark

[@Bristoll170]

@@Preso58 Cheers Mark. I'm quite sure whatever you come up with will be brilliant. So glad you enjoyed your trip over this way. Yes, it's a lovely place 👍.

[@CreaseysWorkshop]

Hi Preso, interesting stuff! If you cut on the other side of the wheel you can just pull the cutter back against the spring with your hand and use the black knob to set the depth. I've never had much luck sharpening end mills. The diamond wheels are pretty coarse compared to the incredible edge you get on a new one. Take the end off that broken one and by the time it's gone your wheel will be dressed true. (maybe get your wife to do it so you don't have to breathe the dust). You can also buy a rod of molybdenum for dressing diamond. I tried that and it didnt really impress me that much. You can clean them up with some carborundum paste on a flat surface. Stefan has a video on that. Oh, looks like I am the ten millionth person to make this comment. Oh well. It's good for your algorithm.

[@Preso58]

Thanks John. I am very much a novice at grinding end mills. I bought the D Bit grinder last year and it has been sitting in the corner of the shop waiting for me to use it. I made some jigs for sharpening HSS lathe tool bits and I think I sharpened a HSS slot drill but until I ruined that carbide end mill I didn't really have to use it. I did use that same bit yesterday to hog out a 22 X 18 slot in some malleable iron and it went like a champ. My son sent me an article on the dangers of carbide dust. He is the WH&S guy at his work and he was concerned that I was breathing the dust. Apparently it's the cobalt that builds up in your liver. Regards, Mark

[@MachiningandMicrowaves]

Nice! I have a G H Alexander Deckel copy. I'm building a small collection of wrecked slot drills and end mills if I ever get round to learning how to grind them. My father was a tool and cutter grinder in a gas turbine plant and I never had to grind anything myself while he was alive.

[@Preso58]

It definitely requires good eyesight and careful setup. Once underway that grinding itself is pretty straightforward. I didn't realise how toxic the carbide dust was though and although it gets mentioned in passing I didn't realise that it's the cobalt content in the dust that builds up in your liver. Regards, Mark

[@misterfixit1952]

Nice video. I will use this information as I learn to use my new D-Bit grinder. One tip I would pass along to you is when cutting aluminum, Stephan Gotteswinter recommends using isopropyl alcohol as a cutting fluid. The alcohol cools the aluminum and keeps it from welding chips to the hot flutes preventing burrs and provides a better finish. This is especially important when milling softer aluminum. Also, alcohol evaporates quickly and doesn't leave a mess like other cutting fluids. Thanks for the video.

[@Preso58]

I did see that video by Stefan and I have since been using IPA but ordinary methylated spirits works well too. IPA used to be difficult to buy in bulk but since COVID the manufacture of IPA seemed to go into overdrive. Regards, Mark

[@musicbro8225]

As you were saying, you should learn something new every day, I thought; maybe not something new but a refinement of something already being learned would be acceptable. You know that feeling when you pick up a new tool (in particular a hand tool, I have a chisel in my mind) and try to use it for the first time. After 5-10 minutes you declare to yourself, "Bah, this is impossible!" 1-2 hours later, still frustrated and still making a mess but you're getting the idea. 5-10 weeks later and you're thinking, "Hey I'm a master..." 5-10 years later, you've finally got the hang of it and can't understand what all the fuss was about. Simple things often have a wealth of different 'ways' that get obscured by the neon sign in the mind flashing "Simple". Learning can be a humbling experience :) Cheers Preso, Another Pete from NZ :)

[@Preso58]

Strongly agree. Learning is a cumulative experience. Often it is a case of one step forward and two backward. I think I can learn a lot more about sharpening end mills. I am happy that I have given my abused cutter a second life though. Regards, Mark

[@musicbro8225]

@@Preso58 Two ways of looking at it; a) I have gone backwards 1 step, b) I have experienced 3 steps on the road to an uncertain destination... I agree, you have saved that end mill learned some things and are still smiling. Win win! Peter :)

[@lloyd4768]

Great idea Mark! I have one of those grinders and I'm definitely going to upgrade mine.

[@Preso58]

I will post a short video on the upgraded upgrade soon. Regards, Mark

[@claymileson6456]

I had a small milling job, no milling machine and blunt second hand end mills. I converted my tool post grinder with a cup grinding wheel, mounted on a bracket to fit the cross slide of my lathe and with some fancy guess work, and a protractor level, successfully sharpened said end mills. I then set up the work clamped on the tool post, the endmill in the chuck and voila, mission accomplished.

[@Preso58]

I would call that a win! Well done. Regards, Preso

[@didieryvron149]

Hello from Brittany, France. Mark, I have the same D-bit grinder. Very smart improvement, I will do the same I think and modify the two verniers with indexing collars for accurate set up. I like verry much your videos and I am looking forward to the next. Please forgive my mistakes, I try to write correctly english but some times it's hard ;-) Cheers - Didier

[@Preso58]

Didier, I have a follow up video coming out soon showing the upgraded parts for the feed mechanism. I think they look a lot better and they are easier to use. That video should be out in a week or so. My wife and I travelled to Brittany a few years ago. We caught the train to Brest and drove right across the north coast to Luxembourg. We especially loved the beaches around Perros-Guirec. Morlaix was lovely too. Your English is quite good. Way better than my French! Regards, Mark

[@didieryvron149]

@@Preso58 Hello Mark, what a little world, I live near Morlaix (25 km) in a little vilage named Berrien

[@IanSlothieRolfe]

The good side to this modification is that if you have more confidence you're not going to stuff up your bit, you're more likely to sharpen your bits so you'l get more practice and have bits in better condition. It is surprising the sharpener doesn't have this facility as you said since it seems otherwise a good bit of kit.

[@Preso58]

It is a nicely made machine in all respects except for that one adjustment screw. I think that I can get better results with more practice. I do need to get some more 5C collets for it though. Regards, Mark

[@howardosborne8647]

Hi,Mark. This is a great proof of concept and I'm sure the new index wheel you make will look superb as usual. One thing I can see is that a larger diameter indexing wheel will make it easier to achieve repeatable accuracy of indexing the cutting depth each time. Perhaps an indexing wheel to match the satin finished end indexing wheel in size and finish would be nice to achieve....great modification all the same.

[@Preso58]

Howard, I actually started work on the new index screw today. It will be larger and I have been able to single point thread a screw with a much better fit. I will post a short update video soon. Regards, Mark

[@howardosborne8647]

@@Preso58 I'm sure the new one will be the 'bees knees' as you always produce.

[@melgross]

Very good Mark. The only thing I’m wary about it that wobbly diamond wheel. I don’t understand why it’s so off, but you would have less problems with your center on the mill bit if it were running true. The face is also moving in and out and not cutting all along the face. I want to add that all machines change positions once started. So there will be a slight movement of the grinding wheel in or out, and side to side from the off position once you turn it on. It’s just a tenth it two in a very good machine, but could be a thou on many other smaller ones such as D bit grinders. That could be another reason why it’s hard to get it set exactly where you think it is. Generally, you have to touch the part with the wheel running.

[@Preso58]

I have been reminded of a video done by a New Zealander called Cliff on the KZbin channel called Thread Express. He has successfully dressed the same diamond wheels that I have to rectify the runout of both the grinding surface and the aluminium wheel body. I think I will try doing the same. The runout on these Chinese wheels is really bad and it should be possible to make them to a higher standard without increasing the cost too much. Having an accurate grinding surface would make the grinding much more predictable. Regards, Mark

[@pebrede]

I think that the stop you have is to limit travel in 1 direction not necessarily an angular movement device. I believe from memory that Stefan modified his to have 2 angular work stops. Still what you have done works, and that’s the important thing. Take care.

[@Preso58]

I did watch Stefan's video and I think Robin Renzetti did an extensive video on modifying his D Bit grinder clone. I was looking for a solution that didn't take too long to implement and on reflection, there are better ways to arrange a hard stop on that machine. I will do a follow up post on how the upgraded upgrade turns out. Regards, Mark

[@andrewdolinskiatcarpathian]

Hi Mark. Having struggled trying to see what I was doing sharpening a carbide end mill on my D Bit grinder, working from outside in, I’m now eager to try your approach, inside out. Thank you for sharing such an interesting idea. I suspect I will be copying your modification.👏👏👍😀 Andrew

[@howardosborne8647]

What you mention is interesting because as I was watching Mark grinding I was thinking that cutting from the outside diameter of the wheel to inward direction would have produced a better result and perhaps less of a noticeable pyramid in the middle of the cutter.

[@andrewdolinskiatcarpathian]

@@howardosborne8647 I think Mark has pinned a post this morning which answers your comment better than I would. It’s the inability to see clearly grinding outwards in that is the real issue for me. My grinder does not have the restrictive spring which Mark mentions, so I can well imagine having to overcome both the restrictive view and fight a spring at the same time would be very difficult.

[@Preso58]

I have almost finished a follow up video on this machine and the upgraded parts. I was able to demonstrate the alternate method and why I don't like it. It's not that it doesn't work, it's just a little more difficult for me. Regards, Mark

[@andrewdolinskiatcarpathian]

@@Preso58 Hello Mark. I’ve been playing about with my machine. It does not have the spring which yours has. Therefore your “better” solution of grinding inwards - outwards, is sadly not available, unless I fit a spring. In any event, I will definitely add a graduated adjustment screw to replace the “sloppy” hard stop screw at the front. Looking forward to seeing your follow up video. Many thanks for sharing your ideas. 👏👏👍😀 Andrew

[@jimsvideos7201]

Thank you for the insight; I have a bin of cutters that need some love, a similar grinder, and not enough knowledge in its use yet.

[@Preso58]

I would start by checking out the video I gave the link to. He makes it look easy. I haven't yet summoned the courage to grind the spiral flutes though. Regards, Mark

[@mrc1539]

Nice video mark, since I don’t have a D Bit Grinder I have been experimenting with using an indexing plate on my Lathe and a tool post grinder with a diamond blade, along with lots of rags . I have had some success but not quite there yet.

[@Preso58]

I thought long and hard about buying a D Bit grinder and I sort of regretted it when I finally got mine. It sat in the corner for a long time and I really only sharpened a few lathe tools on it. However, when I ruined that carbide end mill I knew it was time to bit the bullet and learn how to use it for more serious purposes. They aren't a cheap tool and they are fiddly to set up but it's gratifying to resurrect tools that would otherwise be scrapped. If you do have a toolpost grinder you are off to a good start though. Regards, Mark

[@_bodgie]

Just in case anyone is wondering I did get in contact with Mark. I'm looking forward to receiving my new toys ,er tools. Thanks Preso.

[@brandontscheschlog]

Great job! I will definitely be doing this to my D bit grinder. Maybe add a hand wheel to the new knob to speed things up?

[@ccbproductsmulti-bendaustr3200]

👏👌great recovery and superb episode , been looking at those D-Bit Grinders Cheers Chris

[@pacobelmonte]

Great Job Mark, regards from Barcelona, Spain.

[@ianbertenshaw4350]

The way I do it is to use the knob as a depth stop feeding from the outside in , the weight of the machine is sufficient that it doesn’t move when I rock the tool out by hand and while holding it with one hand I index the tool then hand feed it back to the stop . For gashing I have used a thin cutting disk in an angle grinder but it lacks precision . On a previous set up ( Harold Hall grinder ) I did use the same cut off wheel mounted to a small bench grinder to gash and as the wheel and cutter were held rigidly it worked well and was very predictable .

[@Preso58]

Ian, I did sharpen some HSS slot drills using the machine the way you described and in some respects it seems safer to feed the tool from the outside in. Working the other way around means that if you don't lock the workhead properly the tool can pull downward suddenly and jam up against the wheel. I have a Quorn tool and cutter grinder with a reversible motor so that you can always grind in such a way that the cutter is trailing off the wheel surface. Unfortunately the manual that comes with the Chinese clones is woefully inadequate and it glosses over the sharpening of milling cutters big time. Regards, Mark

[@MattysWorkshop]

Gday Preso, I’d be stoked with a result like that, great modification to, brilliant video as always mate, Cheers

[@Preso58]

Even I was surprised at how well it cut after my less than precise sharpening. I used it again today to hog out a lot of aluminium and it worked great. A little WD40 helped with the burr issue. I was actually making a replica of a moulded plastic clamp that goes on the underside of the Bridgeport ram to hold a coolant hose. I have decided to reinstate the coolant system on my mill. I have the Hangsterfers concentrate and the coolant pump but I never did finish off the plumbing. Regards, Mark

[@ab-shop]

Ciao Mark !! A very professional jobs !! I grind my end-mills with a suppor that i made from Harold Hall drawings, Uk, books: you can find his videos on KZbin but he is very old now and no new videos from 4-5 years, but his system works well !! I want to buy your machine before or later in the near future, also because the dimensions are perfect for my garage and maybe my wife will not see the difference (😂) because i can put on the lathe basement side....thanks Mark, i will use your video like a tutorial too !! Ciao !! Alberto.

[@Preso58]

Thanks Alberto. My D Bit grinder was a bit of an extravagant purchase since I already had a Quorn tool and cutter grinder. The Quorn has some good features but it is not so easy to set up and the graduated dials are quite hard to read. The Deckel clones are mostly well made though and they are a very heavy machine too. I think it is one of those things that you have to use a lot to get the most out of it. Regards, Mark

[@ab-shop]

@@Preso58 Thanks Mark, i think so, it remain in my mind for the near future...it will be a Xmax gift for me and from me !:) Ciao ! Alberto

[@JoseSilveira-newhandleforYT]

Very interesting video! Clever solution for indicating the stop point. I was wondering if you could use a dial indicator against the work head, to tell you when you reached the limit. About the burr, in the aluminium, maybe you need to sharpen the flutes too. Anyway, great job!

[@Preso58]

I am sure the flutes on that end mill are probably worn or blunt. However, I haven't summoned up the courage to start grinding flutes yet. Stefan Gotteswinter has said that the D Bit grinder is not really up to the task due to a lack of rigidity. The cost of solid carbide tools from China is quite low but the shipping time is a bit excessive. If I can resharpen a tool it saves a lot of down time. Regards, Mark

[@JoseSilveira-newhandleforYT]

@@Preso58 Yep. Flutes are a very tricky task. But what you achieved is already very good, and if you can recover an end mill that fast, it's worth the effort 🙂

[@jonedmonds1681]

Most people use that dial as an end stop only, if you nod the work head down 12&5 deg, rather then up, then you can cut the back flute outside in, rather then inside to out. Your way works & gives good control though.

[@bobuilt10]

I was about to say the same. I ground quite a few end mills early on in my career and was taught to set the "rocker" stop and swing towards it. Never had an issue with grinding past centre following the initial setup.

[@Preso58]

I have done it that way but I find you get a better view of the flute being sharpened working from the inside towards the outside. I also find that feeding the cutter with the screw adjustment gives a little more control, especially on the centre cutting type end mills. Regards, Mark

[@gangleweed]

I had a Deckel a few years ago but as I seldom used it I sold it on to a lady who did jewelry.....then I rebuilt my bench top mill and wanted a Deckel again.......too much money for new or look alike so I bought the tilt mechanism part that swings on the rocking shaft on REBAY for A$380 and am building one similar but different etc, using a .2 HP 3 phase motor as the grinding head......now 3/4 finished. Grinding the helix of slot drills and end mills is quite difficult on a Deckel unless it's custom made to achieve that, also Deckel collets are hugely expensive so I'm using ER32 collets instead.

[@Preso58]

That sounds like an interesting project. I'm planning to make something similar but as a dedicated 4 facet drill bit grinder. That will be a video series for 2023. It will also use standard ER collets to hold the drill bits. The D Bit grinder I have uses 5C collets but it's almost impossible to get imperial 5C's here. I have yet to summon up the courage to try grinding the spiral flutes. I think I will practise on some of the larger cutters first. Regards, Mark

[@ligius3]

Was thinking that maybe a rotating sleeve on the knob with an inside thread and another rotating sleeve, fixed horizontally, coupled with the first one, for the zero. So you bring the knob into position, rotate the outer sleeve on the thread until it touches the grinder and rotate the end sleeve to mark the zero position (similar to the dial on the compound).

[@terrycannon570]

Thanks Mark.

[@rok1475]

If you start with grinding a fairly large gash there is much less chance of damaging the next cutting edge and you can get decent results even on small cutters with just counting the turns of the knob, although having a collar with reference mark makes it easier. As you pointed out removing a portion of the center (even fairly large) has no effect on cutting performance. Some end mills with coolant channel through the core have the a small counterbore in the center of the bottom.

[@joesam9094]

Great way to start with "viewer discretion is advised". Better than scrambling with attempts at voice-over editing!

[@Preso58]

That's what happens when you realise that you have screwed up big time just as you are about to publish the video. It's better to 'fess up that to answer a million comments about how you don't know anything about sharpening end mills 😁 Regards, Mark

[@Scottforyoutube]

I thought it was intended to work in the other direction as other commenters have said using that knob as a stop? You got great results though and actually will get me working on my Chinese deckel again!

[@Preso58]

I believe there are many ways to achieve the same result with this tool. I still have a shop made Quorn tool and cutter grinder which had an adjustable stop but I found it much harder to set and use. The spring on the D bit grinder traverse is quite strong and I find it to be a bit disconcerting to be fighting against the spring. I did use the sharpened milling cutter today on a piece of aluminium and had to take some quite heavy cuts with it and it worked surprisingly well. Adding some WD40 during the cutting helped to solve the burring problem. Regards, Mark

[@Scottforyoutube]

@@Preso58 Thanks Mark! I appreciate the reply and the explanation. I bought this thing and have yet to figure out how to do this and really want to. Your video really helps and I am going to try this method to get me going! Thanks again!

[@billstanley4819]

@@Preso58 I repositioned that traverse spring to be more neutral in resistance forward and back. To make this work the end of the spring that is mounted to the casting needed a new place to anchor. I drilled through two vertical walls of the casting for a 10mm linear shaft (because it’s very stiff and I had a short length handy). The free end of the spring will snugly fit on the shaft as you push it through. Some of the electric wires had to be repositioned so as not to be in the way. I like your tilt mod and I will be adding this feature to my machine soon. Cheers from WV

[@markfoster6110]

Great more input! Ah those d bit grinders keeping us all on a learned curve... Have you tried the drill bit attachment it has me stumped . I'd there a videl about your cutter . Now that's looks like a great addition

[@Preso58]

Mark, there is a very good resource on how to use the drill bit attachment but it's not so easy to follow and it recommends a lot of modifications to make it work well. The channel I recommended does have a video on using the attachment too. It is really only good for large drill bits though. I am planning a video series on a dedicated drill bit grinder for small bits (2mm and over). It will be some time next year. Check out kzbin.info/www/bejne/rKKlanyIdrOsmKc Regards, Preso

[@markfoster6110]

@@Preso58 thanks that's just the shot .

[@damienmiller]

Nice work. One question: why a zero and not a hard stop that you could engage or disengage?

[@Preso58]

Damien, a hard stop would be better and would take less concentration to use. I was really looking for a quick and dirty solution to get me out of trouble with that broken end mill. I am sure there would be a way of making a good and easily set hard stop. The only issue is the very strong spring that allows the workhead to move outboard as you unwind the feed screw. You would need a stop that was strong enough to hold against that spring

[@HM-Projects]

D bit grinders aren't cheap, though can be handy to have one around. The dedicated 4 flute end mill sharpeners are around the same price, I wonder if you can make fixtures that will feed endmills at the correct angles like those endmills grinders do.

[@Preso58]

I have seen those dedicated end mill grinders. At the rate I dull and break bits it would almost be worth it. As soon as I ruined that 12mm bit I ordered a new one but given that it can take weeks for shipping, it is nice to be able to get the broken one back into service within an hour or so. I used it again today and if you didn't look too closely at the end of it you wouldn't know I had abused it. Regards, Mark

[@wyliemacbean1157]

Interestingly, there is NO plate on the Deckel with a mark or a mark on the wheel, old or new models or restored models. I had a pretty good look around the internet, so that is a major improvement for your machine and one I will be implementing asap. Cheers Wylie

[@Preso58]

I was wondering if the genuine Deckel had a better system of stops on it. It has been pointed out that the method I am using is unconventional. I know you can feed the tool in from the outside of the wheel and use the screw as a hard stop but it could be done either way if there was a graduated ring on that knob. Regards, Mark

[@wyliemacbean1157]

I am not sure if they had a better system of stops but seeing how good the German and Swiss machinery was back in the day and in the present, I would assume so. In saying that, I know that if someone comes up with an idea that can make things far more accurate in 2 or more ways, then it is a success. I was taught to "Measure 3 times cut once". I know that if this system you are thinking of making works it may well help on those pesky strange jobs where you need 5 hands, 3 feet, some multi grips and sticky tape. Bottom line is, "I like it". Cheers Wylie

[@rlferv]

Hi. Thank you for the video. it takes a great deal of torque to tighten my work head on the main shaft. It is clean and I dont see any problems with it. any ideas?

[@TorteTS]

Beautiful design. What type of laser did you use for cutting out the sheet metal?

[@Preso58]

The small index plate is actually a two ply laser engravable plastic sheet. My laser is a 40W CO2 laser and they are not capable of cutting metal. Regards, Mark

[@benrasmussen9878]

very cool , thanks

[@mce1919A4]

Thank you.

[@robertwalker7457]

Great work thanks.

[@RepLicanT00100]

“Stay Calm. The sun will still rise up tomorrow” 🙏🏻

[@einarlodin4352]

How long is it from underside of casted chassis up to "lamp deck"? How long is it from underside of chassis up to lathe shaft that is 25 mm or 1"? Will both 25 mm and 1" fit? Either one? How long is it from underside chassis up to grinding axle? In a diagram? like yours on video? -------> What is distance between verticals of lathe shaft and grinding axle senters? I wish I had a blueprint diagram with meassures and angels of all this from both side of the grinder? How long is the open part of the lathe shaft?

[@Preso58]

The diagram that I made for that video was for illustration purposes and not really accurately modelled on the original. I would try searching on some of the 3D model databases to see if someone has made an accurate 3D model of this tool. Regards, Mark

[@rlferv]

Hi and thanks for the video, Very helpful. The clamp on my work head takes a great of torque to lock it tight. It is clean and I do not see anything relay wrong with. any ideas? Thanks.

[@Preso58]

Possibly just poor quality control at the factory. I have noticed that you do need to crank the locks quite hard but they seem to unlock very easily. That was one reason I stopped using the Quorn tool and cutter grinder that I made. The locks weren't reliable and if they loosened off during a grinding cycle you had to start all over again. Regards, Mark

[@Rustinox]

I would call this "IT WORKS" 🙂

[@Preso58]

Thanks Michel. However, even I was surprised at how well the reclaimed cutting edges worked! Regards, Mark

[@kimber1958]

Very good job

[@localele1]

How about putting the cutter in the lathe and the diamond burr in the tailstock to accurately relieve the centre of the end mill? Possibly mount the Dremel in a toolholder for more burr speed but slowly rotate the end mill. With a small diameter burr it should be nice and predictable if you take it slowly.

[@Preso58]

I do have a pneumatic die grinder and for some time now I have been meaning to make an aluminium casting to hold the body of the die grinder on the lathe centre for that job. The die grinder has much better bearings than the Dremel and you can really crank up the speed. That's another job for the foundry list. Regards, Mark

[@localele1]

@@Preso58 I enjoy toolmaking and it helps make the workshop time more enjoyable.

[@chillipowers447]

You say primary, I say secondary. Primary, secondary, let's call the whole thing off!

[@harlech2]

Man, that knob setup from the factory is a carpal tunnel nightmare. Why on earth, with the expense of those things didn't they put a better knob with a with a handle similar to the compound on a a lathe. Anyway, excellent job!

[@Preso58]

I know! The rest of the machine is quite well made for the price point. That factory knob seemed like a cheap afterthought. Regards, Mark

[@Radiotexas]

Learned something! Thanks, mate!

[@TheBuggerboy]

Hey Mark after that nail heals you'll have to get another pedicure... LOL

[@Preso58]

It looks really gross but I got sick of covering it up with bandaids that soon got soaked in cutting oil and fell off anyway. Regards, Mark

[@growellyfilm]

Hi Mark, Very interested in your laser cutting aluminium. Can you share some specs on that machine? Cheers

[@Preso58]

I use a 50 watt CO2 laser of unknown Chinese origin for most of my laser cutting and engraving. It won't cut aluminium but it can engrave anodised aluminium. The clip in the video shows the CO2 laser engraving some two ply plastic sheet which has a shiny aluminium like top layer and a black substrate. The top layer is very thin and can be oxidised from the heat of the laser but in practice, it won't touch solid aluminium sheet stock. For that you would need a fiber laser which uses a different wavelength of light to mark metal. Regards, Mark

[@jlippencott1]

You should be approaching your grinding wheel from the outside. It is so much easier to see what is happening without the wheel’s edge being in the way. I have been a tool and cutter grinder for many years and have never seen anyone using the inner edge of the wheel.

[@Preso58]

Thanks. I know the method I used is unconventional but there are some advantages. If I owned a dedicated tool and cutter grinder I am sure there would be better ways to sharpen an end mill. Dbit grinders are a compromise at best for this type of work. Regards, Mark

[@sblack48]

What power laser is that? Impressive.

[@Preso58]

My laser is a 40W CO2 with a water cooled glass tube. They recommend that you don't run a glass tube at it's full rated power. It shortens the life of the tube if you do run them too hard. I generally run mine at no more than 85% of full power. I should add that the material I was cutting was a two ply plastic with a fake metallic surface. CO2 lasers won't cut metal at all.

[@sblack48]

@@Preso58 ah ok I thought you were cutting stainless. Had me fooled!

[@russelldold4827]

Don't know if you can fool yourself like this: Try renaming your "Shelf of Shame" to "Academy of Learning" - you learned something from every piece!

[@Preso58]

Ah, yes. I do like that better. Regards, Mark

[@7duser10]

Hey Preso, why didn't you try a dial indicator on the work head?

[@Preso58]

You can absolutely do that. I am not sure that carbide dust would be good for it though. I have been considering some sort of hard stop instead of a graduated dial too. The Quorn tool and cutter grinder has such a hard stop but it only works when grinding from the outside of the wheel to the inside. Regards, Mark

[@zumbazumba1]

I dont think there is a man on earth that can do this by hand an get all 4 flutes perfectly aligned.Put endmill in lathe and drill the middle out a little bit with diamond burr in a tailstock? Or maybe use one of those ceramic tile diamond hole saws ?

[@Preso58]

I will eventually make an aluminium casting that holds a pneumatic die grinder in the tool post of the lathe. This will make it much easier to fixture the cutter and hold the diamond burr in whatever orientation you want. The die grinder has much better bearings than the Dremel and therefore less chatter. Regards, Mark

[@charlesmiles9115]

😊👍👍👍

[@jsteifel]

just a different idea of the same thing.. you could make a clamp that fits on the polished bar, and a stop that is setable for the finger attached to the clamp on the bar. you can keep going by making the stop with graduated markings to know how far to the stop.. that way you can redefine it using the graduations if necessary. of course your way is fine and it works. I'm just offering a different concept

[@Preso58]

I have a Quorn tool and cutter grinder that has a similar option but I found the Quorn to be difficult to set up and it's very difficult to see the graduated markings on the head tilt and rotation. However having a hard stop would be great. I actually started making the more refined version of the feed screw today and I will try to do an update video soon. Regards, Mark

[@watahyahknow]

might be better to start with the relieve cut in the center m that way if the bur or stone shoots away from the center you can still cut the edges as long as the relieve is deep enough to alow or the damege to be ground away

[@ydonl]

It seems like if you angle the tool 12 degrees down rather than up, you could cut from the outside rather than the inside of the cup. Then just use that knob as a stop, rather than a way to push the tool around during grinding. Maybe that's in the "Think it all the way through before cutting anything" category. :-) (Ask me how I know...). Unless I'm missing something. Again. :) Still, nice work! :) Though I might consider returning that nail to the manufacturer as being insufficiently cabinet-incident-proof...

[@Preso58]

I have done it that way too. I think you get a better view of the edge being ground working from the inside of the wheel. Unfortunately the manual with my machine was startlingly brief in it's description of how to sharpen milling cutters and there doesn't seem to be a lot of resources on KZbin on this particular topic. Regards, Mark

[@ydonl]

@@Preso58 Gotcha. Learning is the fun part, eh? Beyond the manual... there be dragons! I wonder if you might enjoy some of Stefan Gotteswinter's older vids on D-bit tool grinding techniques.

[@bmalovic]

Hmmm... I think that carbide do not like to be grind in "away from the edge" direction. It will microchip.

[@ydonl]

@@bmalovic Interesting!

[@Warped65er]

👍 Thx for the vid.

[@trottermalone379]

What kind of guy has a CNC lazar in the corner of the garage, but has to go shopping for a 10mm tap? I obviously need to up my game!! 😉

[@Preso58]

Interestingly, I do have a 10 X 1.5mm metric fine tap. 10 X 1mm pitch is an odd size. I did end up single point cutting a new feed screw on the lathe and after the third attempt it fits perfectly. Two more items for the shelf of shame! Regards, Mark

[@trottermalone379]

@@Preso58 Great to see you back online Mark. Your videos are consistently amongst my favorites. You have a wonderfully approachable style. To that end, a quick discussion on metric thread standards… I believe the pedigree goes something like this; the basic metric thread profile is specified in ISO 68. ISO 261 reports to ISO 68 and provides the general plan for size/pitch. ISO 724 identifies the standard course thread size schedule under ISO 261 and does indeed specify 10MMx1.5 as the preferred general thread size. For more specialized uses, perhaps applications like your grinder’s vernier adjustment stop, ISO 262, also under ISO 261, provides for a fine thread pitch standard and identifies both 1.25 and 1.00 pitches for the 10MM base (nominal) diameter. Summarizing; 10MMx1.5 is the ISO standard course thread, 10MMx1.0 is a standard ISO fine thread for more specialized applications. That you don’t have a 10MMx1.0 tap to hand is not surprising. But the real value of your channel is that you produce videos showing the wit and confidence to overcome deficiency. Keep producing. I believe that you have truly found your niche. Also, I have a video request for you to consider. One that I believe you might be ideally positioned to produce. CNC machine tools are becoming increasingly “home-shopable”. Unfortunately, the CNC transition passed me by (I was busy developing new technologies and designs, not turning them into hardware…). Would you please make a video(s) that starts with a CAD design (2D, 3D surface, 3D solid, whatever), translate that into a CNC format (whatever), translate that into a machine controller program (whatever), then go through the details of setting up the machine, running the program, and inspecting the part. Seems rote for you but black magic to my cohort. If helpful, I would be more than happy to work with you on the specifics (i.e. script/syllabus).

[@ericfeatherstone]

Looks like the mod works well! Robin Renzetti used the pad at the far back right of the main casting as his stop, with an adjustable stop on a long arm on the rocker shaft. Specifically he made the stop at an equal radius from the shaft centre as the cutter being ground ot make quantitative adjustments easy. His video probably describes it better than I'm doing: kzbin.info/www/bejne/e323fWynia-aY9E

[@camillosteuss]

Isnt that supposed to be a nonproblem, as you tighten the screw until it maxes the lever within, you loosen the fixture head clamp on the shaft, allowing the head to be put where you need it with a light and the endmill, then clamp the head so the head can not grind into other tooth, as it can only be pushed out with the screw to that point at its furthest extent of travel... You can set it up more precisely with an indicator and a gauge pin with a sheet of gauge stock... you touch the wheel with the wrapped pin, and set the indicator, thence you put the head precisely at half the diameter and lock it again, again allowing you to this time ``perfectly`` stop at the end of your travel(infeed)... i think blondie explained it and stefan likely... probably robin, but im sure i saw that method showcased and its perfect... i have a true deckel s1, and she can use that setup to marvelous extent, but she also has a 5axis ``post`` for a rotary fixture, which is even more convenient to set up precisely... I agree that the bolt there is disgusting, but even the deckel s1 has just a fancy large headed, knurled bolt there with a much better fit of threads, but still its just a bolt, not a dial, as no matter what you set it to, if you loosen the clamp of the head on the rod itself, the markings would have lost their 0 completely... So an elaborate dial there is just not of use... it dials in a rod angle, but on the rod the head can be moved as you will it, so what good is the indication of where the rod is, as it would not indicate the head, but rotary angle of the rod itself? that is just used to rotate the rod, the setup is done with both rod and fixture lever for the clamp on the rod... Cheers and all the best!

[@Preso58]

I have almost completed a follow up video which shows the upgraded parts and also an alternate method for grinding which uses the screw as a hard stop. It does work but it still has some issues. I guess there are lots of ways to achieve the same result. Regards, Mark

[@camillosteuss]

@@Preso58 Nice, i will be glad to see it, but i just had to ask, as its the way i am introduced to the machine and seeing this had me question like last 5 years of thought... its like old math and new math, once you get used to one, the other is in no way logical, but this i get, i too thought about the same thing when i first got the machine, as i wanted to replicate the original shaft infeed knob and replace the knurled knob on my deckel, but the more i used it, the less i thought about it, and more about how i would like to bore that hole out, and put in a hardened steel threaded sleeve and a hard bolt with a constant oiling method, as i dont like using machine castings as threaded or precision bores, i like them sleeved in bronze or hard steel with good lube path to make the area serviceable and essentially beyond actual wear...

[@klw141]

Mark, to correct the runout on the diamond wheels, I made an arbor to mount the tapered wheel adaptor to and turned the aluminum wheel carcass true in a lathe. Then followed a process from Cliff at Threadexpress on truing the diamond substrate, worked like a champ! kzbin.info/www/bejne/naHFfqFvadunqM0

[@mathewritchie]

Yes having that happen to a nail is unpleasant .It has happend to me twice and the finger was sensitive for weaks,bloody safety officers are a health hazzard they always have a brilliant idea to make things safer and it never is.

[@Preso58]

Once the pain had died down it was then an issue just to prevent the lifting remnants from getting caught on clothing and the inside of pockets. It could have been worse though! Regards, Mark

[@billbaggins]

Good stuff Presso👍 I have a much easier method for sharpening end mills, his name is Craig 🤣

[@Preso58]

Craig's the man! Regards, Mark

[@Preso58]

Craig's the man! Regards, Mark

[@clivehaynes2183]

AS an ex tool and cutter grinder this is the wrong approach. Angle your cutter downwards for the relief angle and come in from the outside edge of the wheel not only can you see what you are doing, the machine has an adjustable stop for inward travel.

[@bmalovic]

Am I missing something, or that edges that you just grind, cut just a tiny bit in this two examples? That material is cut 98% by helical edges, not by that 4 straight edges at the bottom of the mill. If you plunge cut, it will be the opposite, straight edges will do 98% of the work and helical edges just a tiny bit.

[@Preso58]

No, you are correct but if you chip all four sharp corners it will place excessive load on the end mill. It also produces more heat in the part and the bit. I was probably fortunate that I only destroyed one cutting edge which is why I could continue with the job. If the helical edge doesn't extend all the way to the bottom edge of the bit it won't cut at all in that area. And yes, plunge cutting would be very difficult if the corners or the straight cutting edges are damaged. Regards, Mark

[@bmalovic]

@@Preso58 Of course... Just.. for quick and dirty... You probably can pass with just sharpening the outher part of bottom edge, and just rough releiving or just grinding away all of the center part. So you do not have to care about hitting the center point exactly. Of course.. if you do plunge cut, then you must sharpen entire bottom edge.

[@rlferv]

Hi. Thank you for the video. it takes a great deal of torque to tighten my work head on the main shaft. It is clean and I dont see any problems with it. any ideas?

[@Preso58]

I am not sure. Perhaps the mating surfaces just aren't as flat as they could be. I think Stefan Gotteswinter did a video of dismantling and inspecting his Deckel clone. He made a number of improvements, mostly to do with fitting mating parts. Might be worth a look. Regards, Mark