V language - First Impression [Programming Languages Episode 2]

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►Lesson Description: In this lesson we do a tour of the V programming language (pronounced as simply 'V'). We'll install and walk through some of the documents and look at the language features. This is a first look -- hopefully you enjoy it, and maybe it will inspire you to take a look at this language!
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[@donnacasterr6223]

It seems like a very practical language. No weird syntax or symbols. The language is not overly hard with a steep learning curve. Its also not overly simplistic like Golang. Really rooting for it. Well designed language

[@bruno-zl9qn]

i was very enthusiastic when I started to play with Go after I watched your first video. Then comes V, which i had NEVER heard of. And V seems like an improvement from Go, and it seems quite easy to do shell scripting, graphics, games, low-level, C interfacing, web programming with it. I wonder what other language you're going to come up with to surprise us next. Thanks for opening up our minds :-)

[@MikeShah]

Cheers, thank you for the kind words! Many languages like V have lots of potential as they continue to mature -- so this is really an exciting time in systems programming. As mentioned, it's nice to look at many, and sometimes we learn new techniques that we can apply to our favorite language of choice.

[@bobweiram6321]

V is a vendetta against C.

[@MikeShah]

😅

[@pookiepats]

Thanks Mike, watching you have fun with these has inspired me to learn/create in the same fashion; appreciate you!

[@MikeShah]

Cheers! Let the community know what you're investigating!

[@MikeShah]

Cheers, let community know what you investigate!

[@SirLoon]

I use V for parsing files and cherrypicking needed info from logs. To me it is faster than any other languages with matter of maintainability (updating, building, porting etc.)

[@MikeShah]

Very cool -- I imagine that's how many folks will start getting familiar with the language with smaller projects like you are using.

[@BryanChance]

I really like v-lang. I've played around with it comparing to Go, Zig, Chai, Python, Odin, Vala, Vale, Haxe,Dlang and others. Familiar and concise, syntax, no crazy indents, no crazy constructs, sensible error handling, optional manual memory management, generics, easy interop with C, vsh (shell scripting), GUI and graphics libs . It's a very sensible, modern language in m opinion. My only pet peeve is that I wish the fn and pub is spelled out like function and public. It makes the code easier to read. "public" and "function" is easier to spot when you just glance over the code. -;)

[@MikeShah]

I was pleasantly surprised with V as well!

[@user-fr1no2ir3r]

I'm happy if you make first impression videos for odin programming language

[@MikeShah]

It's under consideration :)

[@GaryChike]

Amazing that EmberGen, a commerical fluid/smoke/fire simulator was written fully in Odin - it being such a young programming language and all.

[@MikeShah]

Yes! That's where I first heard of the language -- was quite impressive

[@casper64]

Great video! You made me think of an older mr robot

[@MikeShah]

Cheers!

[@machelOApps]

Great content, thanks. Like your attitude 👌

[@MikeShah]

Cheers!

[@lockbert99]

Seems like immutable variables should be called constants.

[@MikeShah]

I think DLang (which is one of the languages I think in) actually gets it right having 'const' and 'immutable' as different qualifiers. Both are transitive (correct decision), but immutable ensures data that you point to can never change, whereas 'const pointer' for instance points to one location, but underlying data could otherwise change.

[@bsdooby]

Cool, that you also consider more „niche“ languages…

[@MikeShah]

Yup, there will be a mix -- even some languages that are in production!

[@ylluminate]

Good news is that V is not niche, but is a general language that can even be used to develop across the spectrum from operating systems to web apps.

[@MikeShah]

Looking forward to further developments in the langauge!@@ylluminate

[@bsdooby]

@@ylluminate niche in the sense that V is not (yet) super popular. And it had its history…

[@ylluminate]

@@bsdooby sadly people don't know the history. I've been following it since before it was publicly released and the problems have entirely stemmed from people not having context or understanding language and cultural barriers. It's a shame really and hurts my heart since technologists should try to keep the drama (ie, purple penis wars, etc.) out of such things.

[@kodosunofficial]

Looks like Rust married with Go and having a child.

[@bsdooby]

ADT, or algebraic data types, e.g. sum and/or product types are concepts mostly found in Functional Programming; ... Therefore next wish: F# 😊

[@MikeShah]

OCaml episode has already been recorded :)

[@GaryChike]

@@MikeShah F# is based on OCaml .. so you're set!

[@GaryChike]

Vlang's syntax, like D, Nim and Crystal , is very clean and easy to reason about. I was able to submit some Vlang code to Rosetta code after a weekend of pouring over the very helpful documentation. Some languages have lack of adequate documentation and/or lack of learning resources which can make them tough to learn.

[@MikeShah]

Vlang I found to be somewhere between Go and DLang -- clean syntax inspired by Go, with more features :) Considering Crystal and Nim in this series as well -- Crystall specifically I am curious about.

[@GaryChike]

@@MikeShah Crystal is one of my favorites. You remember my 'series' of writing an IO console application in multiple languages? Here it is in Crystal: Q = "Q" # First capital letter designates a constant puts "Press to exit.." loop do print "> " user_input = read_line next if user_input == "" break if user_input.upcase == Q puts "You wrote '#{user_input}'" end puts "Goodbye!" sleep 2 ------------------------------------------------------------- Terse!

[@GaryChike]

Here's the 'equivalent' I programmed in Zig which is definitely made for low-level systems programming. I'm sure the code can be optimized. I appreciate the programmers who can do this - but it's not really for me. const std = @import("std"); pub fn main() !void { const stdin = std.io.getStdIn().reader(); std.debug.print("> Press to exit.. ", .{}); while (true) { std.debug.print("> ", .{}); var buf: [100]u8 = undefined; const line = (try stdin.readUntilDelimiterOrEof(buf[0..], ' ')) orelse { break; }; if (std.ascii.eqlIgnoreCase(line, "")) { //continue; } else if (std.ascii.eqlIgnoreCase(line, "q")) { break; } else { std.debug.print("> You wrote \"{s}\" ", .{line}); } } std.debug.print("> Goodbye! ", .{}); }

[@MikeShah]

@@GaryChike Your IO console applications should be a KZbin series.😁 Crystal looks incredible clean

[@GaryChike]

@@MikeShah Ah .. shucks! ☺

[@bsdooby]

…and Nim.

[@ghulam2545]

No semicolon!

[@liteal]

Lets implement an own lang! with llvm backed for example :))

[@MikeShah]

That would be fun :)

[@ylluminate]

LLVM was avoided for V due to a lot of problems and baggage it can bring to the table.

[@MikeShah]

V was perhaps one of the easiest installs -- very lightweight!@@ylluminate

[@0xfadead]

​@@ylluminate I mean is an entire C compiler really more lightweight? It may be when you're using tcc as a backend, but that's basically like using `-O0'

[@leffivanov3127]

Oh, THE memleaklang)

[@bsdooby]

can you elaborate?

[@leffivanov3127]

@@bsdooby it's a joke. When V was started out they were saying that they gonna make automatic memory management without GC, like borrow checker in Rust, or @live in D, or ORC in Nim. But for quite some time compiler just generated code with memory leaks. Didn't check the latest version, but it looks like they decided to give up and just use GC or something?

[@MikeShah]

I think John Carmack had a famous tweet some time ago about not bothering to call 'free' if all of your allocations happen at the start -- perhaps an ode to that philosophy (if V is used for game/media applications where allocations may happen at the start)? (Note: I am joking :) ) @@leffivanov3127

[@ylluminate]

@@leffivanov3127 autofree is still coming, but BDWGC was inserted with incredible and surprising results. Currently GC is being used with incredibly low impact. Autofree is about 90% or so done, but there are some edge cases, etc. that need to still be addressed. Of course manual memory management is also an option, but thanks to how efficient V is with memory handling it makes the BDWGC much more lightweight and less impactful than expected.

[@machelOApps]

@@leffivanov3127 as far as i know performance of their GC surprised even creators. They have like 3 or 4 modes (including manual) of memory management, one of them is autofree which should auto handle mem management during compile time, remaining 10% would be handled by GC. Seems that for now autofree is not much more performant then GC alone.