Prologue to Stormlight Archive 5: What's Really Going Down? (Besides Gavilar)

Analysis and speculation surrounding Brandon Sanderson's prologue to Stormlight Archive 5.
Art credit Link: docs.google.co...

[@dalemason8418]

There arent just three options for Ishar to be a Bondsmith. You have to remember, hus posession of his own honorblade gave him the power of a bondsmith unfettered. Unbonded. Just like Szeth had the powers of a Windrunner with no bond. You see this in RoW when Ishar confronted by Dalinar. He bonds the stormlight in the Windrunners to the ground and nearly steals Dalinar's bond to The Stormfather. All without a spren bonded.

[@nathangarza8911]

We know that no herald except nail joind their order of knight radiant... and therefor needed no spren bond. Also that bomdsmiths existed bofore the destruction of ashen and that ishar was one of them. Additionally, the stormfather would have had MANY bondsmiths over the times that the radiants existed. Ie, therefore, ishar was most likely NEVER bonded to ANY spren, much less the storm father. Also... whether this is THE stormfather or not, he obviously has the ability to show the visions...

[@leechalmers1588]

But not the same ones though I don’t remember Dalinar having a vision of the abandoning of the oathpact

[@nathangarza8911]

@@leechalmers1588 I think that's the vision of aharietiam (the one he takes navani and jasna to, as well as the azish emperor ) that vision shows all the heralds blades in a circle.

[@shragamildiner8472]

Alright you convinced me

[@misha49ish]

IT'S GONNA BE A GOOD BOOK

[@parkermm]

I’m seeing a lot of comments shooting down the idea of Ishar having ever bonded a Bondsmith spren, citing an in-world text written after the recreance that claims only Nale joined his respective Order. Now besides the possibility of that text being mistaken, it is a common theory that various Bondsmiths of the past, such as Melishi, were Ishar in disguise. Now, it’s true that Melishi was bound to the Sibling, but if the theory is true, that would add a precedent for him having made bonds to spren before.

[@parkermm]

But I’m also half convinced the Stormfather is just the vestiges of Tanavast’s cognitive shadow trying to hide his true identity 😅

[@crockettcast2702]

@parkermm I love that theory too

[@crockettcast2702]

I believe the world text, but I don't believe that all bonds have to be within the confines of an order. Ishar formed the knights radiant. So no bonds existed before his specific organization? He is called the 'binder' of Gods. He convinced all these knights radiant (and probably more importantly all the spren) to form bonds when he himself didn't have one? I'm also a subscriber to the theory of Melishi being Ishar in disguise. The way the knights talk about him knowing what to do echoes how the other heralds talk about Ishar.

[@macmay3042]

I find it amusing that the only comments this guy Likes or replies to are the ones telling him that his assumptions are definitely correct... he just ignores anyone who points out when he's saying something that isn't true. He's literally not willing to engage with anyone who doesn't think exactly like he does. There's no such thing as a valid viewpoint which isn't his own assumptions.

[@smosmo4617]

The art at 9:12 is awesome

[@pojorobo1]

to piggy back off your thoughts with the real Stormfather coming in to bid Gavilar goodbye, it takes place after the Stormfaker feels a herald die, I could see a condition to the Stormfather finding a bond being that he had to try after a herald returns to braize, in order to prepare mankind for the desolation. It would make sense that he would immediately look to the king of Alethkar one of the most powerful people on Roshar to take up the defense.

[@crockettcast2702]

Nice point. Definitely in line with my thoughts.

[@kylepollander940]

just to add to your "the heralds are now synonymous with the 10 fools" in whitespine uncaged (WoR Chap 56) Kaladin says "Honor is dead, but I'll seee what I can do". Right after he jumped in Adolin asked him what he was doing and he specifically said "Playing one of the 10 fools" which I'm assuming he was playing Honor.

[@picivyvortac2641]

Sorry for the spam but I keep thinking about this subject: the storm father bondsmith is able to open a singularity because more of Honor is condensing back into his shattered pieces. Dead spren are waking. Bonds are forming. And the largest piece of honor will collect the most of his essence as it coalesces. It is worth noting that spren existed before honor died too so his full essence (at least enough to be considered alive) could coalesce into the bondsmith that has bonded his largest piece without all spren having to coalesce into one entity. $5 says that Dalinar becomes a shard or something close, possibly like an autonomy avatar but for honor, especially if he ends up being the champion.

[@thekwjiboo]

Perpendicularity. Singularity = everyone on Roshar is immediately dead lol.

[@picivyvortac2641]

@@thekwjiboo lol yea. Basically an investiture singularity. But yea, wrong word.

[@bryanmcclure2220]

I'll take that bet. I don't think Dalinar will become a chart at all. It's too predictable. I think you will become a fused. And serve as a sort of mediator between roshar and odium.

[@picivyvortac2641]

@@bryanmcclure2220 prediction 2. Odium will be shattered. He's the big villain of this arc but he's not going to be the villain of the scifi arc. I think the nightmares and other black goopy Bois are part of the next big threat. They're showing up in too many places in almost the exact same form for that to be a coincidence.

[@bryanmcclure2220]

@@picivyvortac2641 How exactly? No one has the power to shatter him.

[@macmay3042]

...So you think it has to be Ishar, because no one but the person who makes a thing could possibly be looking to find its replacement? No, that doesn't make any sense. I feel like you missed the part that the Stormfather is lying. So you trying to figure out who could have meant the lie is pointless; no one means a lie, cuz it's a lie. Ishar isn't looking to find someone else to become the Heralds any more than the Stormfather is. Kay I made it about ten minutes into this video but I'm done. You have your ideas, great, you can present them... but the fact that you're trying to present your own assumptions and impressions and state, because this was the first thing I thought, it means it has to be true, nothing else might be the case... The only think you're saying here, for more than 20 minutes, is that you came up with an idea, you decided you like it, and now you won't consider any alternative. And you think that means you get to tell other people they're wrong if they don't think like you and share your opinions. This could have been an interesting video if you'd presented it as, here's an idea, it's based on a lot of speculation, but let me walk you through it. You trying to present it as, my assumptions are always right, is very off-putting to anyone who doesn't already agree with you.

[@jacksonskinner7879]

4:27 we are explicitly told that none of the Heralds joined their order except Nale. That means no Nael bond. Their powers come from the honorblades.

[@danielbroome5690]

I have a feeling that some of the inconsistencies will be ironed out in rewrites, so I'm not sold on this yet. It seems a little late to be adding yet another setup this late in the first half of the series. I think in terms of stormfather, it will probably be rewritten a bit from draft 1 to make it more clearly the stormfather, but even as written it's not necessarily out of character for anything he does - even lying. Cause Stormfather is dodgy as fuck about the time around Honor's death. He clearly knows something, but is holding it back pretending he was "just a spren of the wind" at the time. I think Stormfather got really annoyed by Gavilar and swore off his family and was probably forced to share visions to Dalinar because of that splinter of Honor in him that seems to direct his actions broadly - like accepting Dalinar's oaths even though the stormfather seems surprised they're accepted.

[@Bronimin]

I think its funny, earli on in Way of Kings, the Stormfather is said to BE Ishar or Kalek, and it turns out maybe he was XD

[@crockettcast2702]

I love this. References, please?

[@macmay3042]

...Wait, why does "survive the Recreance" mean he was specifically bonded during it? Couldn't it just mean, he was around before, then he was around after?

[@oswinhull4203]

I think you are correct on this. I'm pretty sure the spren that turned into deadeyes is specifically related to the breaking of oaths. If the bonded human just dies the spren doesn't become a dead eyes. Also Ishar apparently has the ability to create and take away bonds based on his chapter in RoW. So Ishar could have been bonded and either not broken any oaths or just undid the bond using his unchained honorblade powers. Or he may not have been bonded during that time.

[@spaceybun]

Alright, you have me convinced!! When I first read it, I just thought “wow, we can see how much this experience with Gavilar burned the Stormfather because he’s so different by the time he starts communicating with Dalinar.” I didn’t think much more about it. The theories about the Stormfather (Stormfaker) being Odium have never really sat well with me; I’ve never been very convinced or thought they were strong arguments. But this here-you’ve got me!!

[@picivyvortac2641]

Didn't the storm father SAY he showed the king the visions?

[@doubletee9000]

Well im convinced. This was really well put together. Thanks dude!

[@crockettcast2702]

Yeah, we'll see. It's getting closer!!!

[@macmay3042]

Something like 90% of your evidence is people not finishing a sentence, and you just saying, I assume this is the rest of the sentence, and then going forward like that's what they actually said. Are you a Sharder?

[@gravity000111]

Yo also the herald that dies is shallan's mother. I am convinced

[@crockettcast2702]

I'm glad your convinced. I have a whole video on the Shallan's mother theory : kzbin.info/www/bejne/b2bGnGaAp8lop6s

[@jordanthomas5635]

I think it is the Storm Father but the voice did feel off. Probably because it's the draft version

[@warlord733]

Okay, I felt like the stormfather was fake the first time I read it, but this is wild. So wild it might be true

[@kaceekakes]

Yeahhhh, I was definitely someone who came into this video thinking you (and all others who held this theory) were reaching a little too far. But, I leave a believer with an insanely new perspective on everything else that I thought I knew. - Bravo, sir. I. Am. Shook.

[@crockettcast2702]

I wish I could take credit but we have Brandon to thank for that.

[@willbfriend7187]

Scrub

[@aldan7812]

These... words are accepted.

[@crockettcast2702]

Well said.

[@Kestrel990]

There are not 3 options, there are at least 4, honor blades are a thing that exist

[@irock1929]

You had me up until the font change. That just seems far to convaluted of an explanation. But the rest was strong

[@crockettcast2702]

Thanks for letting me know. Glad I had some good points. Brandon could certainly just be messing with us. What do you think the font change is for?

[@Betadel]

Great video, you totally convinced me that it's Ishar!

[@crockettcast2702]

Yay!

[@markodonovan9770]

If it is a StormFaker, I think the StormFather was giving visions to Gavalir as well. I don't know if the StormFather was actively encouraging Gavilar and interacting or just playing the visions as he did for Dalinar. But it is very probable the Stormfather was more engaged with Gavilar, thinking Honors plan could work. After Gavilar I think he gives up and initially goes through the motions with Dalinar

[@covertdrummer]

The storm faker says that "journey before destination" wasn't even close to the right words. It's definitely not the stormfather

[@crockettcast2702]

I feel very similarly

[@Tempest_4444]

Where do i get that wallpaper in the bvackground

[@crockettcast2702]

The art credits are in the video description 😀

[@hiiamsam4808]

18:50 if heralds and 10 fools are exact same, from were came 10th fool if Talenet was on Braize? Anyway great video!

[@crockettcast2702]

I'm working under the assumption that this was a title they had for themselves before Aharietiam but that became more widespread later.

[@animalia5554]

@@crockettcast2702 Honestly, I kind of like the idea that there is no difference between a wise man man and a fool and it’s simply a matter of perspective.

[@emgee0312]

Totally convinced

[@animalia5554]

Do you think the Nohadon Dalinar sees is Ishar?

[@crockettcast2702]

Only the Nohadon in chapter 103 of Oathbringer, which I definitely think is Ishar. It's of note too that there is no Highstorm like other visions. Dalinar also has a high recollection of Gavilar's funeral after he wakes which could be related to storm faker (Ishar) being there as well.

[@animalia5554]

@@crockettcast2702 Not gonna lie. I’m worried that Ishar may pull something similar and try to hijack Renarin’s visions in the back five. Or if not, the fear of it happening will scare Renarin who already has major issues with self-confidence.

[@antonisloussidis8476]

I was skeptical at first, but you totally convinced me. This must be true! Great video btw!

[@crockettcast2702]

Glad you enjoyed it.

[@thekwjiboo]

Has SLA ever said if the Heralds bonded spren? I can't recall either way.

[@alakifan98]

Just Nale as far as we know

[@picivyvortac2641]

Hyyyyyyyyype

[@dittrich04]

Ouch. Shade thrown at mom! Lol

[@crockettcast2702]

She knows it and is unabashed.

[@nathnaeltsegaw7263]

Excellent analysis bruv!

[@crockettcast2702]

Thanks, I was excited about it...obviously.

[@Degrad21]

I think you are making things up. nice stuff you told, you put a lot of work into this. BUT I think most of your conclusions are just wrong. (Also I would not like if this was true) for example: when has the stormfather ever talked about searching new heralds. he has not, but what does that tell us? nothing. he could also not say it because it went so wrong the first time he tried it

[@CNNBlackmailSupport]

It is Ulim. (Edit: Or the being known as Ulim, who is no simple void spren or singer soul) 1) "close to the right words, but not the right words"- Ulim treats Venli the same exact way. 2)Stormfather has an appearance that extends toward infinity in every version but the Gavilar one. He has unlimited storms in his eyes, but HE doesnt extend to infinity. 3)Spren cam change color 4)Ulim blurs and gets spiky carapace poking out of his skin when he gets sper angry, and he always appears as a human. He cant be a Singer, yet he is a spren. 5)He travels around in lightning form. 6)Ulim knows the way around the Alethi Capitol, up to and including guard movements, and tells Venli he has MANY contacts in Gavilar's circle. 7)Ulim is a liar that switches from commanding to subservient, and back, instantly 8)Ulim knows all about getting to and from Roshar, even things that only very important world hoppers know. Knowing all this, I believe Ulim attempted all this first with Gavilar, failed and got punished hard, so he had to go after Venli on his own time to redeem himself. When you compare how they talk and what they say, its too close for coincidence.