PWM vs MPPT Charge Controller for Solar Panels: Which one is best?

[@cleversolarpower]

🎁Get 7 FREE diagrams to kickstart your Off-Grid journey! View and get them here: cleversolarpower.com/free-diagrams/ 🎁

[@christophertadeo6120]

I've decided!!😀... I ain't got no money... Pwm for me... 😀

[@freshengineers1806]

On long run you loose more money As ROI for any solar investment is 5 years

[@kaosickkaos5398]

I feel you bro

[@christophertadeo6120]

@@kaosickkaos5398 I just got a module that was way cheaper.. 😁

[@ca-dz9vb]

Ha HA. THANKS FOR THE HUMOR. !!

[@samthecreator10]

😂

[@mrainaandroid8208]

Oh! I do not like long videos but yours is amazing and straight to the point. Thanks a lot.

[@cleversolarpower]

Couldn't make it any shorter 😄

[@mervynwilson6013]

That is absolutely brilliant advice & so easy to listen to. Thanks so much.

[@PhG1961]

Indeed I liked the video! I've been using a PWM controller with a small 100W PV panel in combination with a SLA 12V batterie (10Ah). It's meant to power some small garden lights. It goes on forever! Cheap and care free power.

[@cleversolarpower]

The solar panel could charge the battery in one hour 😄. How many watts of lights do you have?

[@rodrigorafaelpacheco]

Great video! Simple but well explained. Keep it up.

[@Stevef-sk3jc]

woops your out on your calcs, when the 100w panel is delivering 5 amps the 20v drops to about 17v this is voltage under load, so 17v x 5a also the battery is being charged at 14.4v not 13v so only a loss of 2.5v. not 7v. this small loss suits as you say pmw, you can see this on your volt/amp meter

[@daveulmer]

Series panels are more suseptable to cell shading problems. MPPT doesn't help when your batteries are full. I have tried 3 MPPT controllers and haven't found one yet that works right with my LFP batteries.

[@SirBobbyDuncan]

No matter how much I try to understand this it is trigonometry to me😂... That's why I stick with harbor freight and the thunderbolt brand. I'm also struggling with parallel. Do I parallel my panels or do I parallel my batteries ?...tv, Xbox & possibly a "dorm fridge" is what I'm trying to power (Earthship meets studio apartment)

[@cleversolarpower]

It's easier to take it step by step. Focus on the solar panels first, then how you can wire the batteries. Checkout my video that is coming out soon about calculating your off grid solar power system.

[@MaritimeUnprepared]

I'm currently living off grid in Atlantic Canada and my low budget system keeps a mini fridge running, runs coffee maker, and other light electronics no problem. Total cost is under 2k Canadian

[@crazycrab8578]

I use three 10w panels with a PWM, INTO ONE LEASURE batt, good vid, like it

[@Stevef-sk3jc]

looking at 2.09 minutes along there would be a voltage drop from 20v to 17v so not 20v and 14.4v going into the battery not 13v so no on 7.5 amps the increase is much smaller than shown, so 85w from the panel because volt drop - mppt effeciency loss = 82w into the battery... 82w divide 14.4v = 5.7 amps however it will be less than that because the mppt device has more loss than 3% that you and i have shown

[@TurboElectricLtd]

A PWM controller is basically a buck converter so it's not true that it wastes power because it doesn't. The difference between the PWM controller and an MPPT is what controls the charging. In a PWM controller it's just the output voltage, but with an MPPT is the solar panel power. The MPPT will get slightly more efficiency (like maybe 95%), but a PWM/buck converter will be 90% efficient, and if you just use an actual buck converter (without the charge controller function) then the system will work fine without a battery. It will still charge it too if it's set to the correct voltage, i.e. 13.8vDC for a lead acid.

[@cleversolarpower]

I don't agree. A PWM controller is not exactly a buck converter. A buck converter actively reduces voltage while increasing current. PWM controllers, on the other hand, rapidly switch the connection between the solar panel and the battery on and off to control the charging process. PWM controllers regulate the charging process from the solar panel to the battery by rapidly switching the connection on and off, which helps maintain the desired battery voltage and prevent overcharging. They generally have lower efficiency compared to MPPT controllers, typically around 70-80%, as they do not optimize the power output from the solar panel, leading to some power wastage. In terms of voltage regulation, PWM controllers match the output voltage to the battery voltage but do not convert excess voltage into additional current. This makes them less effective at utilizing the full potential of the solar panel, especially when the panel voltage is significantly higher than the battery voltage.

[@TurboElectricLtd]

@@cleversolarpower So a PWM output to a battery is not a buck converter? I'm not saying a PWM charger IS a buck converter (for those who can't interpret the phrase "is basically" and later the phrase "an actual buck converter"). The point is it does not waste power as is suggested in the video. It loads the panel and reduces the panel voltage based on average load. It does not optimise the load for the panel as an MPPT does, but I did not say it did. During the mark it charges the battery at full current and reduces the panel voltage, during the space the panel voltage recovers for the next cycle. This is how both MPPT and PWM chargers work. The frequency is usually quite high (like 150kHz) so the mark and space are very short, hence it's the average power/voltage/current you see. I presume you have dismantled a PWM charger and seen the diodes, inductors and capacitors inside? Do you think they are just something to make the PCB look pretty?

[@Electrondemon]

PWM is not buck converter its only regulate overcharging not increase current because it doesn't have any magnetic coil inside

[@jacquelineMeyers-is1zz]

Not just good but very good. God Blessings.

[@lperezph]

Accurate.. I got 2 100w solar panel in parallel.. Does only 136 watts

[@crocop2o12]

I think is bettter like i did, no Pwm and no mppt, because i only use a grid tie inverter with mppt which injects anything is produced into the grid and i use a smart 220v charger which starts itlself if i produce more than i constantly consume in the house and stops when there's low production, or i can control it and monitor over the internet, costs = 215€ inverter , 35€ charger (70€ normal price) and 2 wifi conected smart plugs 15€

[@cleversolarpower]

Yes, a string inverter is cheaper. But when the grid goes down you won't have any production anymore. Depends if your area is prone to outages.

[@robertstafa6100]

I saw a few videos of you and i see that you have a talent to make very simple things to very complicated one.

[@cleversolarpower]

Thank you very much!

[@236vic]

Hi, thank you that was a great explanation!! I have a question how do I calculate the time period it takes to charge a 12 volt battery knowing the amp hours of a battery, watt, amps, volts of solar panel with a mppt control. How is the time affected to charge 1 12 volt battery compare to charging 2 12 volt batteries in parallel?

[@cleversolarpower]

Calculate the battery watt hours: 12V*100Ah=1200Wh. If your MPPT charges at max 10A and 12V, then you charge at 120W. If you recharge the battery from 0 to 100% you will need 1200Wh. Divide battery capacity by charging power and you get the amount of time it takes to recharge the battery. 1200Wh/120W=10hours.

[@yoandre5185]

What about the charging bottom voltage. Isn’t it so, that a PWM controller will start charging the battery immediately when the voltage of the PV will be higher than the voltage of the battery, whereas MPPT will start charging while the voltage difference between PV & accu will be somewhere around 5V? In other words saying, the MPPT will preform always better but in ideal conditions, but will deliver hardly anything at low PV voltage. Eg. PV V = 15,0 V Accu 12V = 12,3V Voltage difference: 2,7V At the difference of 2.7V MPPT will no deliver/charge, whereas PWM will charge de accu with 15.3V

[@ariboboopara8615]

This is wonderful and short thanks for the information

[@martincarbonell7032]

Great explanation. Thank you

[@frankdearr2772]

Great topic, thanks

[@owolabiadeteye5919]

Thanks boss

[@Dc_tech386]

Well am sorry to tell you this we us pwm controller in bms for each cell at high volt 48 to 160 volt to match the cell voltage if the mppt buck is converter 100 vdc to 52 volt a pwm volt regulator is required for each cell to switch 1 or 12 mosfets per cell or a switching halfbridge converter is use and and pnp transistor with ziner voltage sensor to switch of the pnp that’s two stage bms

[@MYMUSICCHANNEL-db4ky]

Thank you but it does not answer 8 x 405 watts panels 20 amp per panel does not answer which to choose that would work on gris and off grid UK what size controller and inverter

[@cleversolarpower]

Check out my video about sizing the charge controller.

[@leesahcage3297]

Great video, thanks for the information.

[@tuneryclassic8749]

I love your video

[@Desertphile]

Thank you.

[@Electronzap]

Good info, thanks.

[@uzochukwumadubuobi3793]

Nice video, bro i hav 600 wat panel and 200ahm battery, 3000wat small inverter.....pls which control is good for this MPPT or PWM and is 30ahm ok, i want it to power small hisense fridge,fan, television and lighs ?.... pls i need your help

[@cleversolarpower]

Anything over 200W, I recommend mppt. Depends if you need to have the whole 600w available though. Check my other videos where I go in details about charge controllers, sizing and fridge power consumption.

[@eivis13]

In short, apart from all the safety features, what's the difference between an mppt controller and a buck/step down converter? If the power output isn't high(

[@cleversolarpower]

If you have a 100W solar panel, then a pwm is ok. If you go over that it makes financial sense to use an mppt.

[@javiercoronel1169]

So 58a for 12v batt is standard? Or how did you get that num

[@cleversolarpower]

700W of solar /12V = 58A

[@chrisvamvas7]

Ευχαριστούμε!

[@cleversolarpower]

Thanks for the support Chris! 🙏

[@MYMUSICCHANNEL-db4ky]

Hello I have 8 x 415 watt solar panels what do I need next what size of battery what size of controller what size of inverter ?

[@cleversolarpower]

You are in luck! I made a video on how to size your solar system. Check it out on my channel page.

[@MYMUSICCHANNEL-db4ky]

@@cleversolarpower SUBSCRIBED THANK YOU

[@MYMUSICCHANNEL-db4ky]

@@cleversolarpower WHICH ONE IS IT ?

[@cleversolarpower]

Right here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/pZ7Qpn18osaYoqc

[@wktodd]

Thanks

[@stevew3978]

I read an advantage of PWM is it can charge a lead acid battery more fully than MPPT. This prolongs the battery's life by preventing it from being constantly undercharged and getting sulfated prematurely.

[@cleversolarpower]

No, not at all. The only way this is possible is that the PWM has a higher charging voltage than the MPPT.

[@rathnamalasp1097]

How does MPPT converts the remaining voltage into Amps?

[@stupidscruff5794]

​@@cleversolarpowerbut lead acid batteries respond well to a slow trickle charge, so wouldn't it be down to the slower charging?

[@cleversolarpower]

@@rathnamalasp1097 By converting the voltage into current. A PWM cuts it off which is lost.

[@cleversolarpower]

@@stupidscruff5794 Charging at the recommended C-rate is always better than charging at a higher current than the C-rate. Check out my video about C-rate.

[@Akum12345]

@clerversolarpower, how can I use a 24v Lithium Ion battery with a 550W - Vmp=31.6v, Imp=17.4A solar panel ? should I use a PWM or a MPPT(seems Vmp is NOT sufficient to use a MPPT effectively) ? OR is it better to use a 12v Lithium battery with a MPPT with this Solar panel ?

[@cleversolarpower]

Yes, to be sure you need a 12V battery or even better, another similar panel. Pwm and mppt need 5V+ difference. So 29.2V+5V=34.2V and your panel is only 31.6V

[@Akum12345]

@@cleversolarpower thank you.

[@perfectcs9759]

hello, Can I charge 12v 7Ah 20hour battery with 18v 50w solar panel ? should this work or bad for the battery, do you have any suggest also I use pwm controller for it

[@MrVidlak]

use PWM regulator and is ok

[@perfectcs9759]

@@MrVidlak okay

[@MrVidlak]

@@perfectcs9759 I think when sou use for 50w solat pwm and mppt all is okey to use

[@user-qr5dp4dp1k]

I have 100w solar how many ah of controller do i need to use ?

[@cleversolarpower]

If you have a 100W solar panel and your battery is 12V, then you need a 10A charge controller.

[@coturnix53]

Read the definition of mppt (wiki). This explanation and the conclusion is not correct!

[@cleversolarpower]

Please explain to us what is not correct so we can all learn from your valuable input.

[@808pathfinder]

You sale your book on Amazon?

[@cleversolarpower]

Yes, it's on amazon.

[@patrickstarnes2355]

Even with a small set up 100 W to 12v batterys I will get more power from MPPT? 🤔

[@cleversolarpower]

If you only have a 100W solar panel , then the power to your battery doesn't justify the extra cost. You can just use a PWM. Make sure you get a 18V solar panel to get the best efficiency.

[@twocommastv]

​@@cleversolarpowerI have one that is 18v 210watt one that is 20v 200watt and one that is 43 volt 370watt?Yeah I know I got them separate before learning how voltages worked on charge controller!Seems I will be getting 3 different controls to get the most out of them!Should j get pwm for the 18v and mppt for the other 2?

[@cleversolarpower]

@@twocommastv You could series connect the first two and parallel connect with the third to an mppt. That will be the cheapest option.

[@PirFarhanMustafaDaiwalSharif]

Good

[@victordike5248]

can i use a 24 volt pannel to charge a 12 volt on pwm

[@cleversolarpower]

That is not recommended because the PWM cuts the voltage off. A 24V panel is typically 36V you will be losing 23 volts in the process. Let's assume it a 200W panel at 5.5A and 36V, then 5.5Ax13V=71.5W (theoretically). So a loss of at least 65%. I recommend using a 12V (18V) panel or a 24V battery instead.

[@DroneFlyPL]

Ive got 20w 12v panel from alliexpress with cheap controller, connected to 20ah 12v battery but we have a cloudy summer this year in Poland and its not able to fully charge the battery, it hardly keeps it at the same charge level. I use it to power 16w pool filter (idea was to keep it runnig all the day ) Can switching to mttp controller help with it?

[@cleversolarpower]

The Voc will be 13.5V, this is too low. Normally a 12V panel should have 18V Voc. So you need to upgrade your panel or place two of these in series. Better get a 100W 18Voc solar panel. 16W pool filter? WHich one do you use? Contact me on my website for further information.

[@DroneFlyPL]

@@cleversolarpower This is stock clearflow 220v cartrige filter (swapped for filter balls). I use it with 12-220v inverter.

[@RK-nl1hn]

Hi, i own 2 60v 50watt solar pannels I would like to connect those to a buck controler and than to a pwm to charge a 100 amp 12v battery do you think this could work? Is i buck the voltage to 18v? Is a 20 zmp controller enough? Or should a use a 20 amp mppt?

[@cleversolarpower]

Are you sure it's a 60V panel? That is highly unusual for a 50W panel.

[@RK-nl1hn]

@@cleversolarpower yes it is e mpv panel

[@infohub3709]

Life-saving video. Wish I could have a direct contact with you. It could mean a lot to me.

[@cleversolarpower]

You can contact me on my website through email if you have questions.

[@bernied9415]

Waarom, zijn die controllers niet voor 24 volt ?

[@cleversolarpower]

PWM is for 12 and 24V. MPPT can be used in 12,24, and 48V.

[@CroftGaming1]

That is not accurate, you only described a DC to DC buck converter not mppt, the maximum power curve of a solar panel changes with heat, and the mppt controller tracks that to extract maximum power from your solar panel.

[@cleversolarpower]

If i was talking about how an mppt solar charge controller works i would lose 99% of the people watching. If you want to know how it works, then i suggest looking up a paper about it. I explained the bare essentials here so all people can understand.

[@CroftGaming1]

@@cleversolarpower you don't need to explain it in details, but you should not give wrong information.

[@cleversolarpower]

@@CroftGaming1 it is not wrong, its is simplified so everybody can understand. If you want in depth workings of an mppt, then my channel is not for you.

[@CroftGaming1]

@@cleversolarpower i built my own mppt with arduino, i understand how it works, that's how I can say what you said it's about any DC to DC buck converter not mppt controller.

[@cleversolarpower]

@@CroftGaming1 As I previously said, it's a simplified graphic. Can you make a video and explain how it works? Then I can send people to your video if they have questions about it.

[@lllAstridddlll]

👍

[@krishx007]

👍👍👍👍👏👏👏👏

[@RPSTiger]

If you care about the life of your batteries, there’s never a reason to use PWM…. Pulse width modulation does nothing to protect your batteries from over voltage…. MPPT regulates the voltage coming from the panels to match the voltage required to charge batteries without subjecting the batteries to pulses of higher voltage…. It doesn’t matter how quickly the PWM turns the power on and off it’s still pulsing the batteries with direct panel voltage…. And if it’s a cloudy day then the voltage may be too low to charge anything, whereas with MPPT the panel voltage on a cloudy day can ( and should be designed to) be significantly higher than your battery voltage and the MPPT will regulate to the required battery voltage…. I’ve had a 18V panel on PWM destroy a 12V battery but I’m currently feeding 90V into a MPPT into a 12V battery…. It starts charging early at sunrise and can continue all day regardless of cloudy weather or rainy days and will charge right up to sunset… MPPT for the win…

[@cleversolarpower]

Indeed, thats why I recommend using a PWM only in low power applications. These usually have an AGM battery which is less sensitive to the voltage. However, the voltage depends on the temperature while the irradiance (sunshine) influences the current.

[@peterearle6394]

To start with...what the hell is PWM and MPPT?

[@cleversolarpower]

Check my article on my website about it 😉

[@techguy9023]

Pulse width modulation

[@user-kl8ii8fb4k]

Oh! I do not like long videos but yours is amazing and straight to the point. Thanks a lot.