Butler Performance-built Edelbrock D-Port Heads for the GTO's Pontiac 461

[@butlerperformancepontiac]

Awesome video, we're looking forward to seeing this beast in the GTO !

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks guys, we really appreciate all your help throughout this build! You have made the whole process go as smoothly as possible, and you really do top notch work! The heads look amazing!

[@LucoreAuto]

Great guys all, every interaction from Pontiac Nationals to phone calls with you all has been great. Even with all this stuff going on you all are staying right on top of your service which we all really appreciate. Have our new Poly engine mounts from you guys sitting on my desk waiting for install next week.. had them in 2 days from order! Keep up the great work and supporting the Poncho folks!

[@butlerperformancepontiac]

@@LucoreAuto Thank you!

[@timsharpe3498]

Those E heads are beautiful. They should come 3 to a set so you can keep one just to admire.

[@TheMrmmkkpro]

I'm running a 1972 455H.O, it has old school TRW L2394 pistons, they take a special thin top ring, if I remember correctly. I actually found them at Butler. Spoke with Jim at length about these old pistons. I know there are better options these days, but this engine came into my family in 1973. It also had a General Kenetics cam, old school again. I plan on a refresh soon, the 7f6 heads will go up on the shelf and be updated. Will keep all the old parts. Nice work you are doing, I always enjoy seeing young guys working on Pontiacs. They are torque monsters, and sound amazing. Good luck, will be watching. 👍👍🏁🏁

[@HughS-n6t]

A buddy of mine was the second owner of a 72 455 HO ram air TH400 with 3:08 posi (if I remember correctly). Still think it is the fastest top speed car I have ever been it. Epilogue: He crashed the car & the engine ended up in a 69 Lemans.

[@oldschooltwist18]

Jordan, I'm glad you repeatedly say for your application. Doing what's best for you

[@CJColvin]

That 461 Stroker should be a monster when its all done.

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks man, we can't wait to see what it'll do!

[@CJColvin]

@@RamblinAround Sounds awesome brother I bet It'll make over 600 HP.

[@cbr1thou]

Whats the block? Anyone know more details?

[@jeffpowers2916]

i cant wait to see that car back together, love what youve done to it. that gto is awesome

[@RamblinAround]

Thank you, I appreciate that!

[@rogergreene2272]

Awesome content. Been enjoying it for years. I called Butler Performance about 12 years ago, kinda late in the day, and Jim answered the phone. The only thing I needed was a timing cover. By the time our conversation was over, I looked at the timer on my phone and we had been talking about Pontiac’s for exactly 1 hour and 18 minutes. I think they’re probably the best and most reputable Performance company in the world.

[@gerwin2943]

I too used to call for tech questions years ago and Jim would just give loads of info - absolutely awesome family business. Gotta love Jim's southern accent too!

[@williamwintemberg]

No one knows everything. But! You have your brain wrapped around the idea of flow matching. Good for you! I'm sure the paybacks will be there. All too many just throw parts at an engine expecting it to run well and it doesn't happen for them. Good job Jordon!

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks William, I appreciate that!

[@not2fast4u2c]

Just got my coffee and cranked the volume full blast through my headphones for the intro...I am now awake....

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks for watching Jim, just wait til we get this thing dropped in there...then, we'll really wake you up :)

[@LucoreAuto]

Good to see another update on your Pontiac project, definitely a HUGE upgrade for a stroker Poncho build! One of the most painful parts of building big power with these guys is the cost definitely not a cheap set of heads but will really give your beast another boost in power. Excited to see you getting to enjoy this thing once it's back together and out on the roads. IF GoodGuys happens in Columbus in July, you better bring it! Edit: "As good as I can do it on the budget I set for myself, which I have since blown!" Uh huh, yep, welcome to Pontiacing ;)

[@RamblinAround]

The heads really do make the engine. It would be to go to Good Guys, but we'll have to see how all this stuff plays out. Thanks for watching, we appreciate it!

[@LucoreAuto]

@@RamblinAround Can be the biggest baddest motor on the block, but if it can't breath, it can't run ;) Always a fan of seeing you guys bring this thing along. A few more episodes about this project and we might even get motivated to get back on OUR '68 Pontiac project ;)

[@stevengibson2892]

Awesome Video and update RamblinAround."Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks Steven, we always appreciate the support!

[@TheFormula350]

Lol u don't gotta worry about traction with those nittos it's a Pontiac motor! Great fuckin job ur putting together a combination I've wanted for a long time. Just hold onto the wheel son!!!

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks man, I appreciate you taking a look!

[@jamesanderson83]

Looks like a good recipe for what your after👍.

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks James, I think it should be a fun setup.

[@althauswagen]

Sweet performance! Very impressive. I am drooling! Congratulations on your build and progress.

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks for watching, we appreciate it!

[@danheaton2522]

That is going to be one sick screamin goat when it’s done, looking forward to seeing the beast in action. Thanks for sharing.

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks for watching Dan, we're definitely getting anxious to hear this thing run.

[@tomsettles6873]

I realize this is from a couple years ago, but the flow on your head at .3 is 196 cfm. The Kauffman D-ports flow over 225 cfm at .3 in their stage 1 - 295 cfm port and 228-230 cfm in their 310 cfm port. Ported iron d-ports with valve unshrouding flow over 210 cfm. I think the Kauffmans are the better choice for max horsepower on street-strip applications. I don't think Edelbrock put their best design effort in the Round port or D port Pontiac heads.

[@70sport37]

Pretty hard to obtain what you got there nice job !

[@rogerharrelljr1935]

Flowing 299 at 600 lift!! Nice man!!

[@retiredispose8980]

Looking good like everyone else I can't wait for the start-up.

[@RamblinAround]

Thank you, we appreciate that. We hope to get it fired up by the middle of next week.

[@dalepritchard3335]

You got yourself a awesome build going on there for sure.

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks Dale, we always appreciate you watching!

[@shane3498]

THe 1.66 valves came latter in the run for Pontiac heads. 1.77 was the standard for years.

[@xim83]

Now you probably don't sleep before your goat is running😂

[@RamblinAround]

It really is hard to sleep knowing that it's so close to running again :) Thanks for watching, we appreciate it!

[@tombankwel4822]

Magician Jordan at work 1 class mecahnic thanks jeff and Jordan for this video i 🤟 love it

[@davegentry2380]

Good job. Love Pontiacs

[@blainesnider9089]

A 12 bolt rear end should be strong enough especially if you do c clip eliminator kit

[@1992Hoffman]

Looking good fellas looking forward to more content on it!!!!

[@billyjarratt9100]

If you're a street racer, 3:73 is a better ratio to play with. My 68 bird and 69 Judge ran 3:73.

[@markh4767]

Nice stuff!👍

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks Mark, I appreciate you taking a look! I can't wait to get this thing back together.

[@tombankwel4822]

My 1'8 ltr engine i polished the intake and made the comprison very high about 13 too 1 but I ruined the motor but it Was fast so i rebult it 😎 cool car thanks jeff and Jordan

[@josiahg2]

Thanks for the info!!! Any videos of you putting it together?

[@rogerharrelljr1935]

Hey man, wouldn’t want to get rid of the top end on thenGTO would you! Id LOVE to put that in my 1975 Formula 400 Firebird!! That’d be awesome!! It’s actually a street/strip car! That would be totally awesome!!!

[@paceta80]

Awesome video. How much horsepower can I make with using a Edlebrock Performer intake. I have a '80 Trans Am with a shaker hood and want to use the original air cleaner for my build.

[@sullie35]

I bet your super excited,, i have a Butler engined 69 firebird with the tremec tko600 5 speed with 3.73 yukon differental 275 40s on the rear and OMG is it Fasssst. 325cfm B/P Edelbrocks 2.11 1.77 valve springs are good to 600lift, I'm also running the Big Voodoo hydraulic roller cam and lifters with Harland Sharp rockers setting on a 71 455 into 462 using JE ultra light weight balance pistons and ohio crank shaft Hbeam rods 1000hp capable, flame thrower 3 bilit aluminum distributor with built in rev limiter at 6300rpms 850 Holley ultra double pumper. World of difference between a torker intake and the edel rpm. The rpm will provide lot more range in rpm. I had it was either David or Rodney port match my rpm intake to my heads. I'm pump gas still as well a I will say this...its between 600hp and 800....see if you can guess Hey good luck and congratulations on getting you a Butler built engine Mine was with most Butler parts and built by one of the best pontiac guys in indiana and that's Flynn's Garage facebook.com/Flynns-Garage-100156258063672/ Very professional, very knowledgeable, He's not a lier like alot of people can be.....he is a straight shooter. He's built pontiac drag racing engine all his life. Very good at what he does.

[@w41duvernay]

Hope you got a RAV air 4 style oil pump in there. Other Pontiac weakness is the oiling system

[@RamblinAround]

I ended up going with a custom blueprinted Pro-series pump from Butler.

[@w41duvernay]

@@RamblinAround how many psi is the pump rated? Specs on camshaft? .050s duration ? LCA?

[@davegentry2380]

How about Mellings? Oil pump. I always use Mellings. My 400 + .040”. Carries 60-70 psi.

[@justanobserver530]

I'm baffled as to why Butler leaves some hp out of the porting work they do on edlbrock heads. Obviously the head flow/hp calculations can be off, depending on the cam you use but ideally you would have at least 75% exhaust to intake air flow. These "only" have 70%. I believe everyone knows that the formula for hp per head flow is (0.25714 x intake flow x number of cylinders) . Those of us that have built several engines, and put them on a dyno, know this formula is very good. It also seems that most people forget the rest of the formula and are stumped when they don't get what they expected. The last part of the formula is ( x percent exhaust flow to intake flow). So these heads are capable of ( 320 x 0.25714 x 8 = 658.28 hp x (220 ÷ 320) = 460.8 hp i.e. 658.28 x 70% . As I've said, you can always squeeze more or less hp as this formula is not 100% accurate but it will depend on the cam. To get anything around 600 hp from these heads however, the car would be nearly impossible to drive on the street and forget about producing any vacuum for power brakes and you would have to use mechanical advance on your distributor. I've been watching your videos and I don't doubt your getting over 450 hp and you seem to be very happy with your results, as you most certainly should be! I think you might be surprised if you put on a dyno however.

[@RamblinAround]

It really was only making a true 440 HP....based on e.t. and trap speed, so your calculations are correct. I decided that really wasn't good enough for the money. It was very torquey and fun to drive, but not near the performance I expected. I have since decided to swap to a turbo LS engine. Just a lot more HP per dollar....and much lower replacement cost should it blow up. I ran a 125 shot on it, just to get it where I originally wanted it to be naturally aspirated.

[@justanobserver530]

@@RamblinAround I live in Central Illinois and really hope to see you guys sometime at a car show or something. Love your videos! Back to Pontiacs, I went with the same 400/461 stroker you did in a 65 GTO. I went with Kaufman heads, for the intake to exhaust ratio I mentioned ( much better velocity/volume also). I hate to see that you won't be sticking with Pontiac for your GTO but I can also totally understand. New tech/power is much cheaper than converting old school Pontiac into new school

[@puddleduckist]

Looks good, this will be a beast of a motor when done! Jim Butler is awesome, my dad and I went to the first Pontiac Nationals in Leoma Tennessee and met Jim and his sons, very nice people! Good luck with it! I would love to drop a set of these on my 69 goat's 455! I have #96 heads on mine that are ported with the center heat xover filled with aluminum and arp studs. I have a torquer 2 intake as well and it's a great intake and I have a nitrous cheater kit on it as well. Your goat should run great and do more than adequate burnouts, keep up the great work and looking forward to seeing it running and smoking those tires! How much did those heads cost you plus the butler work? My dad's 67 lemans 474 had butler edelbrocks as well that flowed 330 with a victor intake and a 1050 domiontor, was a fun car and ran 10.80's at 125 plus in the quarter, had 13.1 and a 710 lift roller cam in it, it was a beast and fun to drive, too bad he sold it through a car consignment place and it ended up going to a collector in South Africa!

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks, we appreciate you taking a look. All of the people we've dealt with at Butler Performance have been awesome. When it comes to Pontiac's, the Butler's really know their stuff. The heads run around 3 grand with the porting and everything, but I think they're worth every penny. As I'm sure you know, the heads really can make the motor. Thanks for watching!

[@francoisfleury6206]

Hi , where do you find a 7$ buck plastic spacer for the carb ? Thank

[@DuffusMonkey]

What max RPM are you planning on running. I am planning on adding a turbo to a Pontiac 400 this winter and I want higher RPM just for the sound. I know I should just call Butler but I hate wasting a vendor's time until I am actually ready to buy. I Love your car

[@RamblinAround]

I was told to keep this engine under 6200 RPM. The long stroke creates too much piston speed at anything higher. Pontiac's were not intended to be high winding engines. The limit of stock Pontiac 400 crank and rods is more like 5800 RPM. It's not like a Chevy. Not saying it's impossible to spin one higher, but it's not generally recommended. Big Chief, from Street Outlaws, spins his Pontiac to 8600 RPM....but it's aftermarket everything, including the block.

[@justinsharratt7282]

once again awesome video. Just curious what kinda diff and gear ratio was in it before you rebuild the rear end?

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks Justin, I appreciate that. It's an 8.2 BOP 10 bolt...before, it had the original 2.93 gears. I swapped in the larger carrier, the Yukon 3.36's, a mini-spool, and the TA Performance billet aluminum cover. Like I said, I'm going to need to go to 9" Ford soon, but hopefully this rear end will hold on for a bit.

[@justinsharratt7282]

RamblinAround also curious that carrier the old one was a posi right and if so would you be looking to sell it?

[@markschafer8275]

Kick ass

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks for taking a look Mark. We hope to have it up and running sometime next week.

[@stude1953]

Really looks good Jordan! Have you decided what color you're going to paint it yet?

[@RamblinAround]

It won't be getting painted for a bit yet, it's going to take time to set aside the funds. It may go all black for a while, until I decided what to do next.

[@byrontalley6934]

All black with an orange stripe on hood around air intake and doors and sides royalbobcat look

[@oldschooltwist18]

I didn't see, but did they put the turtle in your plenum? My stuff I did isn't from Butler as I did a lot of my own but I did talk with them a few times and you are 100% correct. They are great people to deal with and they will definitely take the time to talk to you whether you're a customer or not

[@RamblinAround]

We didn't do the turtle insert yet, but we probably should. It really can make quite a difference. Yeah, we've had nothing but great experiences with Butler so far, they really are top notch people. Thanks for watching, we appreciate it!

[@johnbecay6887]

thanks for the informative video. where are you located? i'm in Aurora, CO. i run a '65 street/strip gto.

[@RamblinAround]

Thanks for watching, we're in Southern Illinois

[@johnbecay6887]

@@RamblinAround i bought my '98 S-10 from a dealer in Pekin, IL and drove it back to CO. i took it easy, seeing the sights. it was one of the best road trips i ever had. have you got your '68 to the track yet?

[@jeffreyjohn2037]

Have you ever built a S D 455 that has the beefed up lifter valley?

[@123gmoreira]

Been following every video doing the same exact thing for my trans am ...would love to pick your brain .....one question is can you install the mega braces with an assembled shortblock?

[@butlerperformancepontiac]

You can if the cam is out.

[@johnkennedy8452]

Hey Jordan, I have a 56 Pontiac Safari 2 dr Wagon . basically a Pontiac nomad body style. My goal is to do all the assembly myself and After watching your video's I am leaning towards a butler 461 . my Question is can you give me a rough ballpark figure on how much you spent on the rotating assy. Heads and headwork and trans. Cost.

[@RamblinAround]

Butler has prices on everything on their website, but you're looking at around $2000 to $2500 for the rotating assembly, $3600 for the ported heads, and then whatever the machine work on the block costs you. Turbo 400 transmissions are fairly inexpensive to build, because they are so common. You should be able to do that for around $1500 or less. Building a Pontiac engine to this level isn't cheap, but it sure is a blast. Butler Performance is definitely the only place to call. They are great people from top to bottom. They are happy to answer any questions you have along the way. They always double check your parts orders to make sure everything is right for your build.

[@RamblinAround]

Here's a link to the latest GTO video, if you want to see how it runs: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rqDcgourj8tlfpY

[@stevenlynch6605]

What do these heads flow stock out of the box?

[@ThunderAppeal]

You bought the heads directly from Edelbrock or from Butler?

[@RamblinAround]

Normally you would just buy them straight from Butler. In my case, I bought the bare heads from Edelbrock, then sent them to Butler to be machined and built.

[@seanjohnson386]

What are you running for a cam?

[@RamblinAround]

Comp Cams XE284H hydraulic flat tappet. Although, that was partially to save a little money. Butler actually recommended that I go with a roller cam.

[@johnkennedy8452]

What was your budget

[@123gmoreira]

I am building the same motor almost got some questions if you’d be willing to help 👍🏻

[@RamblinAround]

We're always happy to help if we can. Feel free to ask right here, if you think of something.

[@123gmoreira]

RamblinAround I know you probably installed those mega braces before the shortblock was assembled but do you have any tips on installing them? My shortblock is already together waiting on my heads and cam

[@billyjarratt9100]

Go EFI before thinking about a tunnel ram.

[@chrismichael5016]

Hey guys cant wait to see this beast run! You should absalutley get ahold of my buddy max on facebook at max air carbs he does amazing work and knows how to make power he will custom work a carb for you that costs allot less and out performs a new holley xp carb no joke its worth a look

[@RamblinAround]

Let's for letting us know Chris, we'll definitely check him out.