Reading through the PCgamer battle content interview (And sliding into Mr. Ozma's DMs)

[@StormierNik]

Well chaotic didnt even up being midcore anyway because midcore isnt "yeah struggle to find 24 players repeatedly over and over again trying to clear the fight"

[@LightSummoner84]

Let’s break it down simply before categorizing content as casual, midcore, or hardcore, as these terms are subjective and depend on each person’s skill level. For example, a player who clears Ultimate content might easily consider Extreme-level content as midcore, and from an experienced player’s perspective, they’re right. However, the majority of FFXIV’s player base isn’t made up of highly experienced players. That doesn’t mean they’re bad-it just means they’re not willing to invest the time and effort needed for content requiring group strategies, such as joining a Party Finder group for Extreme content or higher. To explain further, FFXIV’s baseline content, such as the MSQ, is so easy that it could be classified as "Very Easy. " This is essentially the difficulty level for most accessible instances. Some recent 8-man and 24-man raids could be considered "normal," meaning just slightly more challenging than MSQ content. What players want is normal content that’s a bit more demanding-similar to the Orbonne Monastery at launch, certain Bozja bosses, or the Baldesion Arsenal at release. In other words, content that is a step above the standard difficulty but doesn’t result in 20 consecutive wipes. Most importantly, this content should be accessible in a relaxed way through matchmaking, like current dungeons and raids, without requiring the hassle of forming a Party Finder group. The reality is that most people use Party Finder to coordinate strategies and clear Extreme-level or higher content. What they really want is mechanically engaging content that doesn’t require Party Finder, offers good replayability, and has rewards substantial enough to keep players engaged during the long four-month gaps between patches.

[@akirablackheart6811]

This exactly.

[@nastharl]

Your first paragraph was spot on, and then you proceded to disregard it for the rest of your paragraphs and tried to speak for everyone.

[@LightSummoner84]

@@nastharl Hello, you interpreted it this way, but I am not speaking on behalf of everyone. I am fully aware that very experienced players enjoy getting high-level and so-called intermediate-level content because, given their skills, intermediate-level content will remain relatively easy. The issue with the term "midcore" is that it is highly variable in meaning, which means it’s a term that will never bring all players to agreement. However, when I talk about what people wanted, I am not saying it randomly; I base it on comments I’ve read across various platforms-on KZbin, Reddit, and even official forums. I am not speaking on their behalf, and this perspective doesn’t come out of nowhere. I am merely pointing out that the term "midcore" will never be interpreted in the same way by everyone. During the Endwalker expansion, when players complained about the lack of so-called "midcore" content, they very clearly imagined a difficulty level similar to what I mentioned. This was what came up in the majority of cases, even on videos from other content creators. This type of content doesn’t require using a Party Finder to clear but can be done through the simple Duty Finder without too much hassle and without being as easy as MSQ content or recent 8/24-man normal raids. I am well aware that chaotic content, for example, will be considered "midcore" by experienced players. There is a clear paradox in the perception of difficulty between average players, who do not engage in content requiring Party Finder or static groups, and experienced players who use PF or have a static group to clear content. This is precisely what I pointed out.

[@miatomi]

@@LightSummoner84 You're talking about NA as if it is the entire community. You're using forums and methods of communication used primarily in NA to base your opinion. And then you're speaking very confidently about something that affects the whole playerbase. Perhaps NA needs a PF culture change.

[@LightSummoner84]

@@miatomi that the same for the occidental region so NA and EU, the interactions with Japan are really limited, so that obvious I don't mention the JP communauty because I don't understand Japanese. I don't speak every languages in the world, so I don't know what the japaneses community ask for. But yes the Japanese community is totally different and ask for different thing.

[@MrSloth92]

I think the difficulty of chaotic is fine being tuned to a 1/2 turn. The problem I've noticed is there is no barrier of entry to attempt it. So you'll have those that have cleared those floors of savage with others that have not and it creates a lot of frustration getting the half that don't normally do these kinds of mechanics to learn.

[@bolladragon]

Exactly!

[@davidbernardino8109]

I think it's good that chaotic doesn't have a barrier to entry. There have been so many people who haven't tried anything harder than an extreme, try chaotic, and that's very very good imo. It's good in the long run to have more people try more challenging content.

[@Klefth]

"Why do these people think the content is too difficult?" Because they put a hairstyle behind it. It brings me back to when E12S came out and they put a cute mount behind it; the casuals absolutely LOST they shit because suddenly there's no instant gratification. Suddenly there's something they want that they can't have within 20 minutes of its release, and they can't stand that. Also the perceived difficulty of it at the start was low enough that they went in headfirst, and these are people that have not yet bothered learning to actually play the game because NONE of it has demanded that they learn; disaster ensues. This game needs to gradually increase the difficulty of normal mode content as you progress through the story. This shitshow around chaotic, and the mentality that anything that cannot be facerolled is excluding a large portion of the players or meant just for "elitists" only exists because this game has created an environment where effort is not required anywhere to progress, so when there's finally any resistance at all, these players just splat onto a wall. Rebalance normal content and scale up the difficulty gradually so that players are actually encouraged to learn and engage with the game. Please. I don't understand how they wouldn't see how harmful that mentality actually is to the game's designs and longevity, they've had a whole decade at this point to see it.

[@Raionhardt]

I don't really know how FRU is too easy. TOP is pretty disliked and DSR had the most time to cook. PCT is the issue with FRU, not FRU itself

[@VForceWave]

I think FRU is marginally harder than TEA at launch, which is a good spot to be in. The devs have just forced the players to become far too good at the game because of DSR and TOP, so even a harder ult like FRU is cleared much faster than TEA by the average group. Took me 3 weeks in pf, even with the break during Thanksgiving.

[@Raionhardt]

@VForceWave how many hours to do 3 weeks in pf

[@moofy69]

Too many people are having issues in chaotic because their usual prog lying isnt working. You cant carry sandbags in it and so people have no patience. Ive cleared a few times and i was trying to scalp some bonus currency by joining brambles/swaps prog or enrage to clear groups. I spent 20-30 hours doing it in the last week and not gotten a single clear. Most of the time its 1 or 2 wipe then disbands. I refuse to use food in chaotic now because ive wasted more than ive ever done just sitting in pf after a p1 wipe disband

[@komimisliar]

but did mr ozma reply?

[@dragonmares59110]

I really feel like the devs are disconnected from the player bases. 90% of the play base want something between normal dungeon and extreme. They want something with challenge but without having to bang you head on a wall and wipping for hours. EW was already a disaster for this and once again DT is only focusing on hard core raiders and forgetting the 90% left of the player base. And in this video Arthars really show how he too is disconnected from reality and he only know now how to think only for hard core raiders

[@Kairax]

Ye, i wanted bozja 2 in ew... and in dt... but we got chaotic glitterpoop instead

[@MahalGC]

​@@Kairax We are still getting Bozja 2 in a few months, but honestly it was p bad that they couldn't have it ready for 7.1 already

[@miatomi]

you surveyed the entire community to know what 90% of them want? that's just what you want. and it's not even really what you want, because when bozja was actually released NA hated it. when eureka was released, NA hated it. NA just likes to complain

[@Kairax]

@@MahalGC where was bozja 2 in EW? Also your thought of "Bozja 2" is not confirmed, it was just "vaguely mentioned". It might become another mistake.

[@Joppheimer]

If you have problem learning its a personal problem. Dont expect everyone and everything to meet your needs. You should be the one working towards meeting those expectations. FFxiv have too many softies who to be spoon fed

[@xierotron]

The problem they will have with difficulty is always "omg game too easy" -"ok we've made it harder". "oMg ThIs Is ToO hArD iM qUiTiNg". healers strike good example where it was easy for them and tanks (not DrK) could do everything so M4S get healer check and then they go "omg tanks LB" and us tanks be like "are you for real??*

[@Jahkrel]

its a mit check on top of it. It's pf people don't mit. Therefore just LB. If the game had a way for people to see available mits of allies easily then I'd agree.

[@TactiSmolKoko]

shit like the M4s transition is an awful example of a heal check 🤣 cycles of faith back in e11s is more like the heal checks that they should go for, mechanics happening rapidly that deal damage with a raidwide in between every fight basically having harrowing hell would be boring af

[@xierotron]

@@TactiSmolKoko yes its an easy heal check and yet they still want tank LB

[@SRFAA]

I'll just speak for myself. When it comes to difficulty in the game, even though I enjoy difficult content I don't think I'd ever participate in something like at release Savage or Ultimates in general due to how they're designed (especially the latter). I don't enjoy having a few difficult bosses and having to figure out and memorize each step in the dance (with seven other people doing the same). I prefer the content that is easy to pick up and go if it requires several other people, and then if I want difficult content that I can either solo or do in a group it'd be Deep Dungeons. Group content that requires everyone to be amazing isn't that fun to be in.

[@unixtreme]

You'd probably like wow then, the community sucks but I enjoy the content in wow more, it's more about reaction and moment to moment skill than memorizing some arbitrary set of positions to stand on based on your debuffs like say FRU.

[@SRFAA]

@unixtreme Nah, not interested in playing that game for several reasons. I'm on a break from 14 to let expansions pile up so I can play for awhile without running into current cap limitations, and just playing regular console games that have piled up.

[@Millet117]

@@unixtremewow raiding at high lvl it’s the samething. It’s just require less brain. If you do one of the end boss in mythic. After like 100 wipes. You always hit the same button on your rotation at the same point of time. You always dodge the same things. Maybe a bit of variation about where to dodge. It add a bit more chaotic to some mechanics like dodge puddle. But over all. It feels the same. It’s just require less preciseness. And less Brain to think. Ff14 raid is better for me because you need to train your brain on how to think. Like when you have 3 things to do in a mechanic. You need to check where do I need to check on screen and how to remember a mechanic so I can differentiate the position I need to go faster. I’ve come up with all kind of mental exercise to help me remember things. Which I never did in wow.

[@Millet117]

@@unixtremealso the community suck because the game suck. You can’t play any non meta jobs in keys because the game will punishing you really hard in fail. Why would I bring a class that do 20% less damage when I need to time a key. Why would I invite someone who might be able to do say lvl10 keys but having a low ilvl when all the other ppl who apply have more ilvl? Why would I invite someone don’t have achievements on this boss when I can invite someone already have 5kills. Why would u play the game when I can just buy gold and buy boost. It’s not the players fault. It’s the game push ppl into these things.

[@HalcyoNighT]

@@SRFAA Extremes are actually like that: less of a choreographed dance, and more of a 'random bullshit go' where you mostly just react to stuff and there's less strict body check mechanics

[@oEXTRA]

I don't think people are saying the fight is too hard. I think they're saying it's too hard/frustrating for newbies to prog (particularly when it comes to P2). Not in the sense of it being unbeatable, but that it's very discouraging for them (and vets when it comes to helping them). If P2 wasn't so hard to recover in, didn't have body checks, and swaps weren't random, I think this fight would've been perfectly fine for newbies/PF. Then again JP seems to have no problems so maybe everyone else is just that bad lol.

[@mx4690]

Who spread the rumor that JP have no problem with this fight?

[@oEXTRA]

@mx4690 well it was a bit of a joke on my end, but apparently the number of people that cleared this fight over there eclipses NA and EU combined. They make up like 60%+ of the total players that cleared. Mr Happy did a video on it and that's why I joked about it.

[@Kairax]

​@@mx4690those cheating jp players

[@davidbernardino8109]

Newbies trying the fight is a good thing even if there's a bit of frustration. The problem is, of course, there isn't much patience in pf, and that's compounded in a 24 man.

[@oEXTRA]

@@davidbernardino8109 yeah a bit of frustration is a good thing but P2 is definitely more than a bit. But yeah PF only makes this worse with the impatience. Though I can't blame anyone for leaving after 20 or so minutes of getting nowhere. It's the ones that leave after a single pull that are a problem.

[@user-wf9hl6gu6x]

first

[@Kairax]

Ex3 is such an abysmal shit. Endsinger looks so much better in comparison.

[@bankai7623]

Lol you just trolling 😂

[@Kairax]

@@bankai7623 Come to pf, we have meteor memes, ice bridge memes, healcheck of phase 2 memes...

[@TactiSmolKoko]

endsinger was dookie ass cheeks, bad bait