Review: The Szell Box is Back! [Preview to the ClassicsToday.com feature of his 12 best recordings]

[@furdiebant]

This was great fun to listen to as a true Szellot!!

[@johnfowler7660]

When I was a teenager, I belonged to the Columbia Record Club - Classical Division. My earliest conductors were Ormandy, Szell, Bruno Walter and that upstart Bernstein. Luck of the draw.

[@RodneyWollam]

The first Wagner Ring recording is AMAZING!!! Also, everyone should know that when the recording say the The Columbia Symphony, it was the Cleveland Orchestra.

[@stuardyoung9721]

Dave, now this is the morning after watching your Szell Box assessment, and being awed by the incredibly consistent high quality of its contents over 100+ records! This morning, that awe remains, so I feel compelled to add more comment. You really nailed so much in your talk. So much miraculous playing. So many albums already in my collection - from the gorgeous reference Mozart Clarinet Concerto, through the Beethoven Symphonies and Plano Concertos with Fleisher (yes, best Eroica EVER!), Rossini Overtures, Italian Symphony/Rosamunde, Schubert “Great”, all the Dvorak and Smetana, Brahms Piano Concertos with Fleisher and Serkin, Bruckner 3 (!), to Hindemith and Walton. Fabulous all. My one DUD, courtesy of the Columbia record club, which I accepted, based on the Szell/Cleveland reputation, and that I already almost worn out the grooves of Ancerl’s Janacek Sinfonietta, was that sad traversal of the Sinfonietta, coupled with a worse Bartok Concerto for Orchestra. That Finale! If I had known only that, I would have never listened to the piece again. You did comment that the Bruckner 8 was just OK, and I agree. Around the same time that LO set was released (on Columbia), I had gone to Carnegie Hall to hear the Cleveland play it. Szell was ill, and he was replaced by Assistant (Associate?) Conductor Louis Lane. This was either late 1969, or the Spring of 1970. Szell died from cancer on July 30, 1970 (the same day as John Barbirolli and Jonel Perlea!), so it seems likely to me that this Bruckner 8 would have been more profound, had Szell been healthier. My memory of that Carnegie performance was that it was as beautifully played, but as emotionally lackluster as the recording turned out. (I had heard the Vienna Phil play Bruckner 8 at Carnegie, with Bohm, just three years before, for comparison). One other dud you referenced was a Mahler 6, recorded in concert, with the NY Philharmonic(?) I heard Szell’s post-Bernstein, Interim Advisor, concert performance of this, and it was dull indeed. A sick musician at the end of a sterling career can be forgiven a few missteps.

[@JackBurttrumpetstuff]

I love the inserted trumpet “Ho-Yo-To-Ho” in the Szell’s Ride of the Valkyries.. No other recording has it. Instead of two empty bars with just string tremelos, we get the Valkyries unison fanfare, played by the legendary Bernie Adelstein!

[@detectivehome3318]

I agree! Even I loved it each time I heard it 😉

[@RodneyWollam]

WOW!! I have been waiting!

[@davidransbottom8314]

David, Thanks for Previewing The Szell Box! Loved his Wagner!

[@jaykauffman4775]

Just got mine!!!!!!! weighs a ton and can't wait to start to listen

[@williamwhittle216]

My favorite box of all I own, which are not that many.

[@davidsilverman1741]

So glad you brought this to our attention. Was ordering it as I listened to your review! Just received it and it's fantastic, just like the Ormandy set is fantastic. Been enjoying pulling them at random - that Háry János performance is a knock out! Many recordings I recall from my parents collection, who were big fans of both these conductors. Thanks again, 106 times in fact!

[@stevenmsinger]

These recordings are absolute classics! Almost every one is essential. I'm surprised that this could be at all controversial. You're so right about the Posthorn Serenade. It is such a marvelous piece and so rarely played or recorded! I actually like Szell's recording of the Serenade better than his versions of the symphonies. He was wonderful with Mozart but I think he was better with Haydn. How I wish he had finished his survey of the London Symphonies! When it comes to Mozart, I think Bruno Walter had the measure of that music better - he was less stiff and made it all flow like oil.

[@ianng9915]

Live recording list coming soon? I remembered that a while ago I asked about live program performances that was recorded where I mentioned about the marvelous 1970 Sibelius 2

[@CortJohnson]

Thank the gods. Snatched it up last week 😎. Next on the wish list of expired boxes - the Salonen box.

[@hhk01]

Great to see this! A question - the Mozart Clarinet Concerto with Marcellus is followed by the Strauss Horn Concerto with Bloom, not Mozart? Fabulous both, but I'd love to find Mozart with Bloom!

[@GL-hk3xb]

I have following 3 sets of Maestro Szell recordings. Total 68 CD. Still considering if worth to get this complete set for the 38 missing CD and the nice booklet in my collection. George Szell -- The Edition [49 CD set of Columbia / CBS stereo recordings issued by Sony South Korea]. The Warner Recordings 1934-1970 [14 CD] Decca & Philips - Original Master 5CD

[@robthompson6804]

The Warner and Decca & Philips recordings are not in the big Sony box.

[@GL-hk3xb]

@@robthompson6804 Oh I see. Thanks.

[@brianwilliams9408]

If you are a Szell collector, in my opinion, you should sell The Edition and get this instead. The booklet is fantastic. And this has state of the art remastering which most likely is better than the ones in The Edition.

[@GL-hk3xb]

@@brianwilliams9408 Good idea 👍🏻

[@bumblesby]

So glad I am subscribed. I would have totally missed this (again). I will watch the episode on Classics Today!

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Hope you enjoy it!

[@classicrecordings]

Great to hear, but I really want the Julian Bream and John Williams guitar sets to be re-released.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

I'm in no hurry.

[@brianwilliams9408]

I bought it immediately when it was available again and in one week, it was sold out again. This box finally answered a LONG mystery for me. Will The Carnival Overture be in stereo? If you bought the Masterworks Heritage issue back in the early 2000's, you will notice it was mono. But how? It's late 1958? So to my delight, it's in true stereo in this box. I can only assume that the stereo master tape was missing when that version was issued. Along with a first stereo release of La Gaza Ladra. Hard to believe it was never issued in stereo until now. On the whole, very little disappointments. Szell was a genius. Only a few duds like Mahler 6, Tchaikovsky PC #1 with Graffman (the Horowitz is much better despite a few missed notes) and Bizet that is a little too tightly controlled as compared to Munch, Stokowski or Ansermet. A fantastic box, excellent booklet and improved sound. The Beethoven 7 sounds much better here than in the original Essential Classics issue. More bass and wider stereo spread. Very noticeable. Go out and get it if you missed it the first time!

[@dmntuba]

Uncle Dave's summer evening story time👍

[@robertkunath1854]

You are so right! I have the feeling that there are DH's Breakfast Club listeners (since he records so early), and his bedtime listeners, who sip from their bottle (gin or vodka) and say "Tell me another Munch or Szell story, Uncle Dave." And one heck of a story it is! DH can't pause for individual movements, but that Bizet Farandole from Suite #2, appended to Suite #1, converted me on the spot to classical music back in 1971 or so (from my Dad's "Spectacular Cleveland Orchestra" album). And, even in my early teens, I though that that Szell's recording of Mozart's overture to The Impresario was better than anything I heard on pop radio (though now, following DH, I would say it is a smoker!).

[@FREDGARRISON]

Hi Dave, Loved the video as always. How about a photo of you when you had hair?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

We'd have to go back to my Bar Mitzvah.

[@jensguldalrasmussen6446]

I don't envy David the impossible task to have had to choose from the cornucopia of splendid Szell-recordings! He didn't succeed in keeping himself within the self-imposed constraints of the 10 best recordings of Szell, but had to expand them to 12 (I suppose, there are still a few spare on the account after the only 5 Best of Celibidache!). If I had had to tackle the task with regard to Szell, I would feel no need to argue with a single of Dave's choises. I would instead have had to redefine the task under the headline '10 examples of the best Szell recordings' - and with the exception of the few duds, that David mentions in his critical run through of THE box. I'm afraid that I would come up with a formula somewhat like 'take away the duds and the rest is the best'... or something along the line of 'All Szell's Mozart recordings', 'All ditto Haydn', 'All Szell recordings of Strauss', etc. etc. Remember btw that Szell stood in for Strauß when he was delayed for a (acoustic) recording of his tonepoem, Don Juan. Szell at the tender age of 18 (ca.) at least deputized in prepairing the orchestra for the recording of the work. Many experts believe the first side of the acoustic recording of the published recording is in fact by the young Szell. But the jury is still out on the final verdict,, as the first side of the final product is so consistent with the rest and Strauß' overall conception of the piece!

[@alexd481]

I have this box set and it's an excellent collection. Szell was amazing in almost everything he did, so it's a shame, that he didn't leave behind even more recordings, like Ormandy did. The only gripe I have with this box, is that Sony left out the famous Tokyo performance of Sibelius symphony No. 2. Maybe there was some legal reason for excluding it, but it would have been a fabulous addition. Sibelius is my favorite composer, and Szell is my favorite conductor, so this cd would have been perfect.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Sony doesn't own the rights.

[@alexd481]

I assumed this was the reason, but thanks for confirming my suspicions. There was a previous cd issue from Sony Japan that had the Sibelius symphony on it, but it's unavailable.

[@robh6173]

It would have been good to see a bit more of the book.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Buy the set, then you can see it all.

[@r.l.666]

I recieved the "reissued" Szell box in May, however I just discovered disc #34 (Beethoven 7th) was missing! I've written Sony Classical via the pedestrian online contact info. Fingers crossed for a reply.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

It's not missing in my box.

[@abrain]

I had so many of these records on Odyssey LPs that had beautiful cover art--better than the original issues. I am pretty sure that on one interview disc that I think came with the Mahler 6, Szell was asked if there was any worthwhile music being composed at the time of the interview and he said that if there was he wasn't aware of it. Or was that Casals on a similar interview disc?

[@davidrichardstanhope]

"It has not been brought to my attention!"

[@garycohen1806]

Thanks for the overview of the reissued Szell CBS/Sony box. I agree almost uniformly with your views about the strongest and weakest of the performances. The recording of the Janacek Sinfonietta is certainly unfortunate, but I am wondering whether the short ending of the last movement of the Bartok Concerto for Orchestra which Szell played may actually be the original ending which Bartok wrote (or close to it). When Bartok revised the work in 1945, he composed the longer ending which is commonly played. One can compare Szell's version to the recording of the original ending which Leonard Slatkin included as an extra track on his RCA recording of the Concerto for Orchestra with the complete Miraculous Mandarin made in St. Louis.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Ozawa did the original ending also, and you can hear it some very early versions too, but Szell's is Szell's--although closer to the original.

[@jfddoc]

Supposedly, Szell ran his revised ending by Walton who agreed that it was fine??? Of course, Walton still wanted Szell to perform his stuff....

[@robj7386]

if i had that box set i would buy a cd player

[@ewmbr1164]

If there is a Special Reason to limit 10 to 12, then the ony thing to do is to celebrate it :-)

[@claytonfarmer437]

My second comment now: Wow, I just got to the part where you talked about Szell never having the chance to do a full Ring Cycle. My view is that on the famous Decca Ring Cycle, the weakest link is actually Solti. If they could have gotten someone like Szell on that (I know, I know, Szell wasn’t with Decca, but come on!), then it would have been a 100% perfect Ring Cycle. Oh well, I guess we will have to use our imaginations.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

But Szell did make recordings for Decca--that wasn't the issue, I understand.

[@bbailey7818]

There is a 1944 complete Walkuere that the Met released. It's incredibly exciting and lyrical as well but if he'd recorded the Decca Ring it would have required a couple fewer LPs judging from his propulsive tempi in the live stage performance.

[@thejils1669]

Does anybody out there know what other conductors have box set re-issues like Szell?

[@thejils1669]

@@poturbg8698 so was there a first Szell box set re-issue that was incomplete?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

There was a Korean box that came out several years ago that was incomplete.

[@thejils1669]

Thanx...

[@brianwilliams9408]

Yes, Mitropoulos has one just like Szell, Reiner, Barbirolli, Munch, and many others. You can see them on Amazon.

[@richardwilliams473]

Was Szell the chief conductor for the Cleveland Orchestra?

[@richardwilliams473]

@@poturbg8698 Thanks, Peter

[@petejilka968]

I had to buy my Szell box from Germany.

[@chihamats]

Sorry if I’m wrong, but didn’t you review the exact same box on KZbin around 3 months ago?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

No, you are correct. I just wanted to do a "best of" video for ClassicsToday subscribers, and I thought that the big box review would be the ideal "preview." Unfortunately, KZbin does not allow you to re-run or reschedule videos--you have to make new ones, so I figured, "Why not?" It's a great set (one of the greatest) and so another plug couldn't hurt. But thanks for noticing!

[@jaykauffman4775]

Now if the Reiner would be re-issued!!!!!

[@1984robert]

I love the big Szell box and fortunately I was able to buy it because of the Sony reissue this year. This topic is about the best recordings but I will mention some problems first. Mozart piano concertos: the mono and some of the first stereo recordings are lifeless routine performances in my opinion. Slow movements usually good but rushed tempos in the last movements. There are no soloist who could follow these. And even if one could, the musical lines are blurred. Pointlessly fast tempos appear in some other concerto recordings also. Mendelssohn violin concerto is the same. The stereo Brahms 1st piano concerto with Fleisher contains some very strange pich fluctuations in the slow movement and again: too fast last movement. I also could not see what is the fuss about Brahms concertos with Rudolf Serkin. Serkin is soulless and he just hits the keys without any feeling. Later Mozart piano concertos and the violin concertos are great. Just as other concerto recordings. There is another problem with Szell's dynamics especially in Mozart. Clarinet concerto is nice but dynamically flat. Eine kleine nachtmusik is the same. Compare it to Végh's live recording on Orfeo. While Végh and CA plays with infinite dynamic levels, CO under Szell plays almost everything with one dynamic level in this music. Interestingly I found the same in Széll's own Mozart violin sonatas recordings. His piano playing is dynamically very flat (almost like Glenn Gould). Apart from these problems, I'm glad that I bought this box. My special favourites are: stereo Till Eulenspiegel: that is blowed me. I think this is the absolute reference version. In this case bass is very good also. Firebird suite: beyond words. Shame that Szell didn't record more Stravinsky. Hindemith: Metamorphosis. This contrapunctual music is ideal for the line guy Szell. Dvorák: mono slavonic dances: everything is just perfect. Perfect rubato. I loved symphonic works also; Beethoven, Brahms, Mendelssohn, Schubert, Mozart, Haydn and Schumann are all glorious in my opinion. Yes, I miss more prominent timpani but I can used to it.

[@papagen00]

Szell's Beethoven 3rd is the best.

[@markmiller3713]

When is Decca going to give us the Grumiaux box? I mean, actually make it and sell it so people can buy it? Unlike last time when they put it on the market for what, 5 minutes? That made me angry.

[@bigg2988]

Well this box seems heavy on the "mainstream" Classical repertoire (a dozen or more Mozart piano concerto discs speak for themselves), but then, before - or after - branching out, the modern audience needs certain benchmarks of quality to return to for all those Classics, and that is what Szell's recorded legacy certainly provides. There must be something other than advertising or fame to make the legend perpetuate for 70+ years! Not all famous recording artists have fared as well, not at all. So, while I admittedly do not have the first edition in my possession, I will probably be getting the reissue - for those seminal recordings. "Feeling with the mind" will tell you that having what, 6 weaker ones out of 106 is a level of excellence practically impossible to equal. In some repertoire Szell possibly did not feel quite at home, but I guess he knew his forte better than anyone. :)

[@Music2Die4]

I guess we have opposite opinions on Szell's Mahler Six..... I personally think the live Szell/Cleveland was the best Mahler 6 to make recording..... Sure it is flawed interpretively (the final movement got a little too "autopilot" in the mid/late slow bars for my liking), but I think the orchestral playing makes up for it.... Although I do agree that the sound quality of the recording isn't exactly stellar.......... (The remastered recording actually sounds worse.)

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

So, it's interpretively flawed, sounds like hell, but it's marvelous. Whatever...

[@SoiledWig]

The orchestral playing is clear and precise, up to Szell's standards, yes (especially the very last chord, it's like a clap of thunder). However, the fact Szell doesn't take the repeat in the first movement pretty much butchers it, or at least takes it out of the running as a reference recording. It kind of goes to show how much patience he had for Mahler's style. The record was issued after Szell's death, and i would hazard a guess he wouldn't have wanted it issued as long as he had a say on the matter.

[@frankgyure3154]

Ok. I just ordered the Szell box off Amazon. Here we go again. Amazon said only 15 units left. Szell keeps on selling(for the pronunciation anal-ysts). $175.00. I’m going to have huge duplication. I still feel The Mitral box is overpowering. I’d buy it in a heartbeat at 175.00. OMG,,,now we have the Paul Paray/Detroit Symphony/Mercury Living Presence being released by Eloquence Australia. I’m going to be broke.

[@claytonfarmer437]

Of all Szell’s German stuff, the Schumann has always felt weakest to me, and that’s only because I purely hear Schumann as an unabashed romantic. The Bernstein approach is what I much prefer for that music. With someone like Szell, it just seems underwhelming to me. Szell isn’t underwhelming in Wagner or Strauss, so he can definitely pull out the right type of gush!

[@detectivehome3318]

I completely agree with you

[@Music2Die4]

Szell tinkered with the scoring with the Schumann symphonies..... Especially the final movement of the 2nd..... It kind of took the "starch" out of the finale..... Szell's Schumann 3 I thought was excellent..... (The second movement was definitive.) But his Schumann 4 was too "rushed," and lacked "heft"...... Listen to Klemperer/Philharmonia Schumann 4, it almost sounds like a totally different work.

[@JackBurttrumpetstuff]

No question Szell was a great conductor. But he didn’t create the CO out of nothing,. It was already a great orchestra, in many ways. Listening to the orchestra before he arrived is really quite astonishing. For ex. Scheherazade w/ Rodzinski. In spite of the crude recording quality, you can hear the orchestra’s trademark clarity, technical perfection, and transparency - All the hallmarks of “Szell’s Cleveland Orchestra”. What I find just as impressive is how the orchestra has maintained his musical thumbprint for some 50 years since his passing. Can’t say that so much about Ormandy’s Philadelphians or Karajan’s Berliners…

[@JackBurttrumpetstuff]

@@poturbg8698 absolutely.