Rivian Wire Harness Whirlwind

[@vermontsownboy6957]

I never knew how much I cared about wiring harnesses. This was a fascinating, clear, transparent, and thoughtful presentation. Also goes to show how difficult it is for an OEM to eventually get it right, and how well the BEV leader continues to execute. More, please!

[@BumbleBeeJBG]

You should check out the wiring section of Apetera's June call, you'll really appreciate that car.

[@vermontsownboy6957]

@@BumbleBeeJBG Link to the presentation? Thanks for heads-up!

[@GeorgeRow]

@@vermontsownboy6957 my guess he is referring to the 2 minutes starting here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/infPZHqYf7yDnJIm16s

[@BumbleBeeJBG]

@@GeorgeRow That's it, a few good gems in there. They talk about reducing the majority of the wiring and experiencing significant weight savings and reduction in complexity as a result. All aces across the board for the product, the manufacturing and the servicing.

[@23billd]

As a former Manufacturing Engineering Manager for a division of Hewlett-Packard in the mid-80s, I truly enjoy these videos. I used to teach "Design for Manufacturability" and I think we'll soon see a lot of manufacturing coming back to America. Munro is doing a great service to the Auto suppliers by doing these videos. You guys Rock! Thank you!

[@LunarNebulae]

Can’t believe this content is posted for free. Bravo to you guys

[@MunroLive]

Thanks for watching!

[@mattbrew11]

Its not free. You either pay youtube or you pay by being forced to endure scumbag ads. Either way munroe & google get paid.

[@jonnieinbangkok]

It's not "free," you're the product 🤭

[@raddaks2039]

I found this wire harness overview really fascinating. Thanks for the clear, concise descriptions!

[@MunroLive]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@dougimrie9009]

,

[@shortaybrown]

This guy is very good. I cannot imagine someone explaining the intricacies Of Rivian wire harnesses, and car industry wiring in general, better than this guy. A great video with amazing amount of information in a short period of time. Thanks!

[@billstevens3796]

I think Sandy's genius is in his hiring. Every single presenter blows me away with the depth and breadth of their knowledge.

[@hat39]

Chris is explaining this really clearly. The background he gives adds a lot of color.

[@GiovanniEsposito5]

Super video, thanks! Fast, direct, straight to the point! 👍

[@bradenruggeri2108]

Flexing all those years of build experience Munro...great listening to all the sharp folks talk about builds at your firm. I hope these new American startups work with you guys to help get these builds dialed in.

[@normangebhardt2092]

Thanks Chris for this look at the Rivians wiring harness and pointing out improvements that could be made. A bit like looking inside a tv set from the 50s. Cant help but think that Monro will be an improtant force in improving electrical design in the future.

[@mattbrew11]

From the 50s?! Get real. Half the techniques employed are state of the art

[@Johnny2Feathers]

Rivian has alot of redesign to do .. otherwise they ain’t gonna be around for long

[@Cloxxki]

@@Johnny2Feathers Are they contracted to consult?

[@normangebhardt2092]

@@mattbrew11 Thanks Smarter for your comments. You are correct when you say half of their techniques are state of the art. Cars are becoming more like computers on wheels with all the electronics that are packed into them now days. Was trying to say that sooner than later engineers will probably find a way to eleminate much of the wiring cables just like they did with computers. Worked with a huge Univac computer in the early 60s that filled a room. All the cabinets were connected with large conduits full of massive cables. Now a small laptop that you can hold in your hand has over ten times the computing power and dosent take 30 people to opereate. Technology is advancing now at a fast rate so probably the car manufactures that are more forward thinking will come out the winners. Thats the idea I was trying to express.

[@CharlesPare]

You really have an amazing team, another great contributor

[@pablopicaro7649]

Aircraft have extremely strict standards (especially last few years) to prevent wiring faults and failures long into the future. for instance Abrasion of harness on other surfaces will wear a hole over long periods of use. Slack in cables, drip loops, moisture ingress, and many other factors need great attention to detail.

[@ligius3]

Unfortunately this is a recurring theme in the automotive world. A lot of hatchbacks (breaks) have issues with the harness going to the trunk lid to the point they fail wirhin years. Doesn't matter if it's BMW or Honda, they never get it right. Granted, for the Rivian it's not mating with a moving part, but still, why add more points of failure. I have not seen the harness for the hinges, but, if the what I've seen so far is indicative, it doesn't look good for longevity. This stuff should have been figured decades ago: abrasion, bending radius, coax routing, wire flexing, corrosion, ... Thank you for posting the video and raising awareness, it makes for a better world.

[@1472fred]

Unless you’re Boing they seam to be missing QC

[@arthurmoore9488]

@@1472fred The joke is McDonnell Douglas purchased Boeing, not the other way around. The company was being driven into the ground to the point Boeing purchased them. Then, all the senior leadership at McDonnell Douglas were given high level positions at Boeing.

[@Travlinmo]

This video, particularly the pyro in the dash, did more to talk me out of a Rivian than any video I have seen from anyone anywhere. I hope Munro can address whether it should have pushed me that much or, without reference to other cars, if the concerns were overblown? Good luck to Rivian with all these hints!

[@c_fox7396]

@Charlie Fox I would not say it should push you away from Rivian. These defects are mostly indicators of new OEM growing pains. And if you order a Rivian now, by the time it is delivered, Rivian should have addressed these issues. If not, they are likely covered under warranty.

[@isthatatesla]

Canceled my reservation when they told me they stood by their support of the Marxist, leftist, racist, anti-racism, among other things, agenda.

[@arthurmoore9488]

@@c_fox7396 Given that it's a Pyro that was not declared, I expect an updated safety manual or a recall. That's a major documentation failure.

[@rje613]

If you care about the wiring harness of a vehicle you're buying, when you're not going to even see it or interact with it 99.99% of the time, you weren't interested in buying the vehicle from the get-go. It's like saying you were talked out of moving to Greece because 1 person out of the 10M that live there went 5 miles into the ocean, far away from anyone else, and crapped in the water.

[@FelixTheCat69]

That was a really great presentation. Hopefully Rivian’s waterfall method of production doesn’t prevent them from making necessary changes quickly. They seem to be off to a good start though

[@david.e.h.]

I care about wiring harnesses, especially good ones. I owned a couple 80's/90's Saabs , they had horrible wiring harnesses, made with wire poor quality insulation that became very brittle over time , to the point that when you changed headlight bulbs, the insulation would fall off and the wires would short. So I appreciate a well made, high quality wiring harness, thanks for the walk through and insight!!!

[@heathwirt8919]

Great overview and analysis Chris Fox, well done!

[@erwin-franz]

Awesome presentation! it was sincerely, very interesting and insightful. Thank you so much

[@MunroLive]

Our pleasure!

[@jp12x]

I am interested in harnesses. I worked at a company that made them. I also had a VW that had a bad driver-side harness and did not see any benefit from the class-action lawsuit. So far, I think the Munro opinion is "Rivian produced vehicles and it is clear they are their first production vehicles. They did some innovation. In the future, it may be better."

[@rogerdodgerblunt2955]

I LOVE THE WAY YOU GUYS THINK KEET IT UP

[@r.a.monigold9789]

Nice job. Thank you for sharing.

[@markfrombriz]

This is a goldmine for manufacturers to get this analysis for free

[@kennyobrien]

Well that was more fascinating than I thought it'd be. Thanks for the great breakdown, Chris!

[@Show-me-how-now]

Great Job Chris. I love seeing new faces at Monroe. Now I know why when a vehicle has an electrical issue, I just trade it in! LOL

[@patrickkenny2077]

Thanks, really enjoyed that. It is amazing just how complex the wiring harness is and how little it seems to be optimized for mass productio (to my untrained eyes).

[@budgetaudiophilelife-long5461]

🤗 THANKS CHRIS…for sharing this With Us and we HOPE RIVIAN can make use of this… AND STAY IN BUSINESS 👍 Also for giving Eric 🤔 a workout 🏋️‍♀️😁😍😍😍

[@FFlyDDrum1]

Never would I have looked for this, but since it showed up ….I found it so interesting.

[@AuburnElvis]

The detail about the sealed connectors at the end was fascinating. Seems like manufacturers would model the wire paths with angles so the wires pointed towards a common, bundled center point.

[@TheDisgruntledMechanic]

Thanks! When an electrical gremlin shows up on my Rivian I'll know where to look! HA! Oh yeah and more future nuggets needed!

[@ferchizzle]

Chris - You Are WRONG. This just became my favorite topic!

[@williamelkington5430]

Thanks for this. Very informative!

[@w4rg3rm]

Very interesting. Thank you.

[@jeffreyhampton9130]

Excellent content.

[@sunsetlights100]

Nice teardown! 👍

[@henrybrandt1057]

Thanks for a very informative video!

[@MunroLive]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@icare7151]

Well stated. Big Concerns 1. Harnesses Lacking Proper Abrasion, Chafing & Rattle Protection. On large bundles suggest an 16 to 32 carrier over braided design; suggest a polyester Cordura Nylon yarn blend or Nomex which is fire resistant. 2. Too Tight of Bend Radius and many Pinch Points; cause damage to wires, abrasion etc. 3. Fuse Orientation: Difficult Accessibility

[@antoniopalmero4063]

Much more interesting than anticipated at the start .👍🇬🇧

[@batchint]

hi five to chris for such a creditable chase down

[@PavlockProducts]

Great design logic and explanation

[@MunroLive]

Glad you think so!

[@markoverton5858]

Lots of info here, love these strip downs 👍👍👍

[@charleshaggard4341]

Wow, what a huge, bulky wiring harness and 2 12 volt batteries. Good thing Sandy wasn't there, he might have passed out like he did with the Mustang Mach E. LOL

[@DarkHawkk]

Lol exactly 👀😂

[@mattbrew11]

The 2 batteries are there for a planned jumped in case case of 12v failure and the share the load of a winch.

[@MrFoxRobert]

Thank you!

[@MunroLive]

Welcome!

[@thelifeaquatica]

GREAT JOB CHRIS!

[@D-Khaz]

Wow, this is the best advertising to any manufacturer of why they should hire you guys! Great work

[@drnebel]

As a Rivian owner. These videos are so cool.

[@ScrewThisGlueThat]

OH Yeah.... Monro Live. I am going to be late to work today.

[@MunroLive]

You should just call in sick and binge all of our videos pool side!

[@ScrewThisGlueThat]

@@MunroLive I will print this and supply it to my employer as permission.

[@soroushjavadii]

"No one's favorite topic, wire harness" ... Turns out it IS my favorite topic!

[@maxomatic76]

Hilarious intro, “no one’s favorite topic” 😆

[@blakechinn5792]

Go Munro !

[@bradweinberger6907]

Wiring harness is my favourite part

[@AustinFerguson]

Few things I would like to see go away asap at this point is the dual lead batteries and fuses and shrink down the overall package. This alone would shed least 100-125lbs of weight out of the total process and make for less complication. Lot going on in the wiring of this rig.

[@icare7151]

Totally agree! Also the location of the dual wet acid batteries to me is a safety risk in an accident.

[@AustinFerguson]

@@icare7151 they could use a VCFRONT and VCBAT configuration like Tesla, integrate a smaller higher power lithium pack up front (VCFront/VCBAT) would give them the mosfet integration for electronic to replace fuses. ultimately would yield a smaller footprint and less weight and add back that glovebox that was ???? to most people.

[@carholic-sz3qv]

They could still put two lithium ion batteries at the place of those two batteries. A lot of European cars and even 4x4 have two batteries

[@AustinFerguson]

@@carholic-sz3qv your speaking on the pretense of a ICE vehicle that needs it for cranking and 12v accessory. You have a huge battery that through a dc to dc converter and a single lithium pack can achieve the same function. They could literally reduce the electrical foot print and make it easier to work on and reduce complexity by just eliminating it altogether. These batteries literally just run accessories.

[@carholic-sz3qv]

@@AustinFerguson lol……. Where is the complexity in two batteries!?!? Wtf!!!!! Millions of vehicles and trucks have been using that for decades, they know why they put the two batteries there, why can’t you go ask Rivian why!?!?!?

[@Passions]

7:05 Excellent pronunciation! 👍

[@larsparrington]

Any chance you guys are planning an analysis of the rivian's corrosion resistance (to road salt)? Would love to see that.

[@morrisg]

Hey Chris! Please let us know what this entire wiring harness weighs in at when it's completely off the vehicle. Seems like there is a lot of point to point wiring that is the old way, rather than a few high speed CAN buses with software in the connected components to decode the comms.

[@justlisten82]

@4:20 would it be possible to still use the power windows on the half that is still connected? If so, it could be one reason behind it, for emergency use edge cases.

[@Teslavangelist]

Harnessing the power of wire.

[@ExploringCabinsandMines]

Cool I knew nothing about wiring harnesses before this video except I don't like dealing with them !

[@MarcFireHart]

First time I hear Hyundai pronounced correctly! 👍

[@SCWgreg]

Thank you Munro and Associates! Great breakout and explanations. Without you Tesla, Rivian, and others would have taken years longer to learn and improve. Let’s hope Rivian can move and execute quickly to address their myriad of overbuilt, inefficient build quality. They’re losing a ton of money on every vehicle built right now, and it’s taking them way too long on every build.

[@nel_th3rd224]

Would love an updated video

[@kevin8420]

Wow a lot more people work there than I had originally thought.

[@MunroLive]

We have phenomenal talent.

[@draco_2727]

I hope Rivian is at least subscribed to Munro's patreon or gives in some $$ for all the great feedback coming off of these videos 👏

[@JonWieskamp]

I'd be willing to bet that more than a handful of those choices (like the brown to teal connection) were a result of having to choose between rolling trucks off the line sooner and waiting for the correct parts to make it through the supply chain

[@TobyCostaRica]

3:04 that’s the largest ergonomic keyboard I ever seen! 😀

[@fredbloggs5902]

Considering how quickly they put it together, I’ve been pleasantly surprised. The big question is how fast can they iterate improvements.

[@legacytesla]

How quickly they put it together? Hahahaha

[@4literv6]

@@legacytesla right? They started on these in 2017, first complete driveable prototypes debuted back in spring 2018. 😀 That's like giving Ford credit for the lightning beating the cybertruck, when the chief engineer of the lightning said it started in Sep 2018. So in 44 month's to the first delivery Ford managed to deliver an ice based ev conversion truck. I mean so much wow there. 🙂

[@BacaraBuffalo]

Agree, with my date in 2023, I'm hoping they iterate quickly. Getting rid of traditional fuses, moving to lithium 12v and cleaning up some of the wire misses. Electrical issues in 2 years could be a huge cost and impact to their currently fragile business. Hope they come out the other side and I think the best way to do this is iterate.

[@legacytesla]

@@4literv6 Fred has a ton of ignorant comments across the Munro Rivian teardown. It's like he has no clue. I love the R1T. I wish I would have ordered one. But Rivian has made a ton of mistakes and a lot needs to be done to make sure this company can even make it. Still if someone gave me 25k and an R1T I'd trade them for my 2022 Plaid S

[@4literv6]

@@legacytesla you'd give up a plaid for an r1t and only 25k? That's high praise imo.

[@antoniocarrascopic]

Please a video about HV harnesses! That'd be awesome!

[@realrayra]

Look! There's a bunch of people at Munro!

[@yorkchris10]

Still amazed that, even with CAN, there are so many wires.

[@gtjack9]

CAN, FlexRay, LIN are still limited, you can’t send video over any of these, you still need dedicated coaxial for antennas as well as airbag systems and also signalling equipment that needs to be redundant of a data network failure such as door locking and lighting. The list goes on

[@thepupev9621]

One of the most interesting things is the unused coaxial cable. I wonder if they were planning an underbody camera? The cable length would seem appropriate for an underbody location.

[@elschumi]

Trim specific extra but only one harness for all?

[@thepupev9621]

@@elschumi Or it was jettisoned during development. It would be interesting to see what would happen when a camera is plugged into it.

[@DarkHawkk]

What? 😂

[@PhotoHoag]

Yeah maybe that or a dedicated side car selfie camera for reliving rock crawling.

[@lemongavine]

I had a Toyota years ago with a very loud valve tap from day one. Turned out it was a wire that was too long hitting against the firewall.

[@robertaugur2873]

Hello! Thank you for your video showing the wiring of the Rivian R1T. I’m hoping you can help me with an issue I’m having with my R1T. I started to have a brake light/ trailer light fault, followed by a gear tunnel open warning that limited my speed to 13mph. The next day I had a headlight warning. When Rivian looked at my vehicle, they said that water came in through the mounting hole for my EVSportline soft tonneau cover in the passenger side rearmost mount and then got down onto the wire harness and caused this failure and now they will not warranty this repair. I asked what the rating of this harness and connector is and they did not know. I asked if this area is water tight and if this was the only way water could get to the harness and they did not know. I didn’t see this part covered in your video. Do you know of this wire harness should be water resistant or water proof? I find it hard to believe that they would design this with a wire harness that runs through the body on the side of the bed that is not at least water resistant. I believe this is due to a faulty or failed harness in some way. Anyways, I understand if you are busy or if you don’t want to answer due to your potential affiliation with Rivian but if you can help it would be greatly appreciated. Just for context, I am a manager of Plant operations engineering for a medical device manufacturer and before that I spent 20 years in the us Navy nuclear power program and a mechanic and operations and maintenance manager. My strength is in mechanical, fluid and air systems but I have some understanding of electrical systems. Thank you so much for reading this and I hope to hear back! Robert Augur

[@edcastle9821]

Can't never have enough of these videos! Keep'em coming, I've learned allot. Question: Would you eventually put the truck back together and drive it or does it stays at the shop dismantled for future references? Thanks!

[@MunroLive]

Stays disassembled

[@paullester2535]

employee of the month gets to reassemble it and take it home

[@johnbuchman4854]

If it is still under warranty, box it all up and send it to Rivian with a note saying "Dear Rivian, your truck was fine but then parts started coming off. All the parts are here. Please assemble it again (and maybe use more adhesive this time) and send it back to me. Thanks!"

[@mackebest1995]

im really surprised on how many thick wire harnesses they use i tought car manufacturers wanted to minimize the use of wires by sending as many signals as posible over can bus systems and use as much shared 12v power feed as posible that is the trend i have seen as a mechanic on most newer cars i have worked on.

[@cengeb]

48V systems are the answer, thinner wires, less weight and mass Audi is already there of course....all these hobby makers have a lot to learn

[@mattbrew11]

This is pretty minimal for the feature-set

[@curtisbme]

What they want to do, vs where all the suppliers and dependent tech are, is a notable gap. Chicken or egg situation.

[@gtjack9]

@@cengeb 48v systems as far as I know are only really being used for A.C, mild hybrid e-motor, anti-roll bar and starter motor. It makes little sense for lighting, comfort systems and entertainment as the 12v standard is so common and cheap to implement for automotive equipment. I was actually surprised by how narrow the main harness was. The cars I work on at a luxury VAG manufacturer are at least as thick as your forearm in places.

[@HelloImAWESOME7]

Are you planning on doing a video about the cooling system of the Rivian?

[@randolphtorres4172]

THANKS4GIVING

[@DoingthingswithDAN]

5:00 anyone who works on Hondas will know that tightly wound wiring will cause speakers to pop and crackle and the audio unit to not turn on

[@wtmayhew]

Didn’t Tesla put a 12 Volt disconnect cut-loop in the passenger side C pillar of the Model 3 similar to what Rivian has done here? I was scratching my head after the previous video over locating the 12 volt pyrotechnic disconnect on the underside of the dash top cover. I still can’t develop a justification for not mounting it with the batteries. (Other than ‘Oops, we forgot!’)

[@helloandrewc]

Yes and first Model S had it in the front fender I believe

[@hunati31]

Within 3.5 minutes I am convinced to go with the CyberTruck. Thank you Munro Team...

[@ScrewThisGlueThat]

@14:28 A simple injection molded grommet would have been a perfect solution... I don't see how this won't eventually abrade after vibrating on the pierced edges.

[@dusselElite]

Recall?

[@BacaraBuffalo]

@@dusselElite Expensive recall at that. Lots of parts to take apart unless they do some kind of split grommet solution.

[@MTNRanger]

Tesla is going through a recall on Model 3s for the trunk harness failing due to chaffing on metal. Mine actually failed in December. I've been waiting over four months for the replacement with a new design.

[@mattbrew11]

@@MTNRanger 100% typical tesla service

[@gtjack9]

@@MTNRanger This is actually common across the industry, it’s difficult to get the tailgate loom across such a large moving joint with stressing it. BMW have failed multiple times in this regard.

[@laloajuria4678]

if its not sandy, we like.

[@GriffinPearson]

Quote from Elon in the interview today with Tesla owners club “Rivian is headed for bankruptcy if they don’t get their cost down” “a compelling product doesn’t matter if you price out most of the market” Hopefully Rivian can get the cost of their design down, this truck is awesome

[@rhiantaylor3446]

We are going to see more and more Chinese-made cars in US & Euro markets and, while reviews will tell us how they drive when new, they don't tell us how well they will last. It took our familiar brands many decades to produce cars that withstand adverse climates without rotting but I would love to hear Sandy's views on the durability of e.g. Toyota's BTD-made cars, Volvo/Polestar's Geely-made cars and SAIC's MG brand - let alone the BMWs now being made in China. Do they use Galvanised sheet steel, seam sealer, inner fender liners etc ?

[@JW77]

7:40 I hope the hole is accessible. I'd add some rubber myself if that's my truck.

[@AWESEM0]

Let just hope the upcoming recession won't kill off Rivian before they even get started

[@ohger1]

It's going to be a whopper that's for sure.. Buy gold..

[@AWESEM0]

@@ohger1 Doge !!! :)

[@mattbrew11]

@@AWESEM0 lol @ crypto

[@GlitterGuru]

I wonder if the 2 12v batteries have anything to do with the gear tunnel accessories, like assisting the pull-out kitchen stove?

[@robertlinder6414]

Still waiting for the 42v system

[@autarchex]

If a pyro charge disconnects all power in a collision, that would inactivate the remaining undeployed airbags, right? That could really suck in a highway pile-up accident where someone collides with you moments to minutes after a first collision.

[@cgamiga]

Yup, and also means might be harder to tow away.. tesla has tow mode for this, leaves 12v on

[@chrisdenicola4336]

what is the output of each dc-dc converter for the 12v system?

[@dustinhenderson7507]

Is the cut loop in the c piller also for a "jaws of life" application?

[@c_fox7396]

Yes it is. A hydraulic cutter like the jaws of life is the only way to access it.

[@mattbrew11]

Exactly right. Its designed to break if jaws of life are used. Its not like first responders have safety diagrams

[@bbya2201]

who is the wiring harness supplier?

[@Romtronic631]

I am a manufacturer of wire harnesses and cable assemblies from China.

[@Cloxxki]

Can the Rivian limp home when one 12V circuit dies? Power steer, controls, lights? Can it even limp home with one corner taken off the vehicle, even when it's on the side of the still working 12V?

[@alexgoudz]

Supply Chain constrains = Use blue masking tape :-)

[@mikepetersen5024]

More info on why they have 2 lead acid 12v batteries.

[@mattbrew11]

Jumper to get you going home from middle of nowhere and to bridge the load for a winch.

[@mikepetersen5024]

@@mattbrew11 Not likely for a jumper because it wouldn't even turn one of the motors. Could be for accessories like a winch, inverter, and air compressor etc... Good point.

[@mattbrew11]

@@mikepetersen5024 I don’t mean to power the motors I mean to jump over one dead battery to energize the hi voltage system

[@alphaseinor]

I'm wondering about the coax cables. Maybe they don't have production of that cable in house, or can't rework the cable, They were only able to find cables with pre-fabricated ends at a specific length. Very strange problem to have.

[@carholic-sz3qv]

It’s not a problem! They can very easily change that, they are the ones that designs the harness or makes the specifications and works with the suppliers

[@alphaseinor]

@@carholic-sz3qv agreed, I'm more exploring why this particular build was made this way

[@aayotechnology]

Really surprised by these mistakes you show in your videos. Hope Rivian listens to this free advice. Perhaps also they’ll see your company’s value and hire you for consultation!

[@DarkHawkk]

Rivian does the Tesla's way.. So definitely even though its hard for them to accept their flaws, Rivian will hear to these videos.. If not, they are gonna go bankrupt for sure and Amazon takes over!

[@nickvanhorn681]

I think that RJ(Rivian CEO) has already met with Sandy about the build quality of this truck. I bet there are already little things that have been changed, before production. Sandy has said he has met RJ in the past and everyone knows Tesla used them for redesign of the model S. This company has helped enormously already and hopefully cars will only get better and better

[@mikedx2706]

Those extra long co-ax cables are adding weight and cost to the vehicles. In addition, using 2 separate 12v systems adds cost and weight as well. He never explains why two separate 12v systems would be a good idea from an engineering standpoint.

[@mattbrew11]

This is leap-years ahead of the first teslas

[@Johnny2Feathers]

Rivian has alot of redesign to do .. otherwise they ain’t gonna be around for long

[@strykerace]

connectors that aren't color coded together? big fat no no. Seems like an easy fix though. Lead acid batteries should be ancient history.

[@jameshancock]

Why don’t these companies break out each section to a microcontroller and only have 2 Canbus wires and 2 dc wires running to each? You could virtually eliminate 70% of the wiring and improve reliability. And you could orchestrate these from a higher power computer. And if you put 12v batteries front and back and further limit wiring. And by doing this you eliminate any long runs of vfd motor drives that generate noise and if you use the right microcontrollers you can drive all of those motors directly from the microcontroller instead of having more vfds. It also isolated systems and simplifies updates to specific isolated areas and gives you the ability to use PCBs in lots of places to eliminate wiring entirely.

[@theslimeylimey]

How is having a light bulb that needs a computer to decode a canbus signal more reliable than just a lightbulb? All these modules are prone to failure over time but a piece of wire isn't.

[@jameshancock]

@@theslimeylimey 1. the lightbulb isn’t a light bulb anymore it’s a led flip chip that’s on a board inside the “bulb”. 2. There are normally many bulbs together or other things too. So as an example a driver’s seat has every control and the bldc motor(s). Right now these are controlled with a massive harness of wires going back to a central processor. In my scenario 4 wires go to the seat and a single board controls the whole thing and the buttons are directly on the board where they lay on the left side. That same stm32 microcontroller can easily control all 3 axis from there and the noisy variable frequency AC is isolated to that spot. Same in a door. Instead of tons of wires, a single pcb where the buttons are with a microcontroller can drive all of the buttons, and the window and send a can signal to all of the other doors as needed too. All on 4 wires instead of the massive loom. 3. Putting all of the stuff on PCBs makes them vastly more reliable than floating buttons and leds in a given area (and everything is clustered anyhow so putting them together makes sense) 4. The time it takes to plug a 4 pin Canbus connector in and run the shielded 4 wires in prepackaged pvc insulation to a given pcb and then snap it into a plastic extrusion is VASTLY less than doing every single button and led one at a time. I could cut 70% of the time it takes to wire these cars on top of 70% of the wiring while making them vastly more reliable. 5. Using microcontrollers one clustered areas creates a hub and spoke architecture where each spoke has its own mostly isolated code that controls only what it’s tasked with an nothing else. For all inter spoke communication it goes to the hub which doles it out (or can go to a spoke directly if needed but this makes things more complex for little benefit. Computer programmers long ago realized that this architecture is VASTLY more scalable and complexity can MUCH more easily be contained and simplified. 6. It also means that you can roll updates to a single mcu as needed without full regression testing of all systems, only the hub that it communicates with if it actually sends back which means unit and integration testing of the software gets much easier and you can be more nimble. Your argument held water when there were 10 bulbs in the dash and 2 buttons on a door and the seat was manual. That’s no longer the case and all of these companies are designing their low voltage electronics like a mainframe from the 1970s instead of isolated systems with inter-communication carefully managed. And the consequence in ICE is pretty obvious. The software in these systems is buggy and UI is horrible. The reason is specifically because of all of the stuff they’ve hung off of massive wiring looms instead of isolating the systems. I’d go so far as to kill off Canbus and use Ethernet and IP virtually everywhere (which most mcus support now) and use Power over Ethernet for all clusters that don’t have motors on auto rated shielded cat 6. And with the ones that do have motors, there is cat6 + 2x 16 awg that will drive 10 amps at 48vdc easily. (And the low voltage should go to 48v). This would integrate a much more robust and FASTER communications system with error correction, provide power over the data lines and allow for complete systems isolation while eliminating most of the wiring (think a single wire to the back of the car from the front switch just like Ethernet in buildings) and vast simplification and shortening of time to market. And yes, we’re at the point where it’s cheaper to run POE for lights in homes than Romex because of the cost of copper. So there’s massive cost savings here too just from materials to say nothing of all of those discrete switches, buttons and lights that can be integrated into PCBs and made way cheaper and more reliable too.

[@patreekotime4578]

The comments are becoming a tr@ll farm around here. Do yall not get that this is Rivian's *first ever vehicle*??? And an early production example at that? Also, do yall not get that minor criticism from Munro analysts is actually major praise? It is their JOBS to be critical, but when the criticisms are so minor and nitpicky, that means the overall product is fantastic. Its called context people. And Rivian has really done some impressive work here. The overall picture is of a vehicle massively OVER built. And isnt that what you want? If its overbuilt, there is plenty of room for cost and weight savings without sacrificing quality, safety, or performance... in fact it could get better on all three. Thats great news for Rivian and anyone interested in their potential.

[@Passions]

RJ Scaringe you aint fooling anyone 😂

[@patreekotime4578]

@@Passions tr@ll elsewhere.

[@Resist4]

Wow Rivian, I'm not very happy where you put that pyrotechnic power cut off. It will be such an inconvenience having it go off and then your truck is dead in the water from a minor fender bender that you could have driven away from. Now you'd have to get it towed to repair center and be without it for who knows how long. And, they have to rip open the dash. So many scratches and dings will happen when they do that and I'd be so pissed if they nicked my wood dash. Please Rivian change the location of that power cut off part! Really disappointed a Rivian worker taped a broken connector back together. But I hope companies like Rivian and Tesla watch the Munro videos and actually make some changes.

[@jm100368]

I'm sure it will only take first responders 5 years to get on the same page about where that c-pillar cut loop is.