CD Games on a 1982 Micro - Codemasters CD Games Pack

Following on from last weeks adventure in early CD Gaming today we test out the Codemasters CD Games Pack. How does it work, what's on it and is it any good!? Let's take it for a test drive.
● Support RMC
Time is the most valuable thing we have. Official Cave Dwellers create a reliable monthly income that allows me the time to dedicate creating content. My goal is to be able to do it full time. You can support this dream here: / rmcretro
If you'd like to leave a one off tip then here are some methods:
● Treat me to a Coffee with Ko-Fi: ko-fi.com/rmcr...
● Support the Sponsors of The Cave
MonsterJoysticks: monsterjoystic...
1ClickPrint: www.1clickprin...#RMC
● Chat with me using one of these:
Twitter: / rmcretro
Instagram: / rmcretro
Discord: / discord
● Episode Links
What were the first ever games on CD?: • What were the first vi...
● I have an RMC Shop where you can buy mugs, posters, records, books and more:
rmcretro.store/
● RMC Podcasts
Enjoy my Podcasts with your favourite app using the links here:
Retro Tea Break - audioboom.com/...
Retro Island Diskettes - audioboom.com/...

[@RMCRetro]

Did anyone actually buy this thing? Let me know if you have any memories of seeing this in the shops or if you bought it, and what CD player did you hook it up to? As always if you love what we do in The Cave and would like to support the channel then head on over to patreon.com/retromancave - Thank you for your support. Neil - RMC

[@TheKayliedGamerChannel-YouTube]

Hi Neil. Never heard about the CD 8bit home computer stuff until you put it in your other video. Fortunately a TurboDuo console (PCE Duo USA version) - grey import - was my first CD based gaming gear - good times and many HuCards are still among my collection today :-) That poor old CDRom Rom... fancy it being subjected to 'Spectrum' data lol

[@DaveF.]

The only reason I didn't ever get this was because I couldn't afford a CD player. By the time I did own one, I had brought a disk drive and forgot about the concept

[@Dextrovix-42]

My best mate had a Speccy and his parents had a (very expensive) Pioneer stereo stack system too, and the 6 disc CD changer in it also had a single caddy cartridge so the Codemasters CD he got for his birthday in November went in there. He had to use a converter on the joystick jack lead, as that Pioneer system used the larger (older?) headphone jack standard. As you've identified in your video, it wasn't usual to have a CD player at that time- my parents certainly didn't, and I was therefore happy to spend time around his place with all his stuff, the lucky sod! But I remember we were around 13/14 years old at the time, and were more fascinated by the technology side of things, like faster loading and the fact that the loader stayed resident in memory, rather than the actual games themselves. We're both working in IT as adults, you'd never guess would you...!

[@sierraboney1394]

Yep, I did, still got it as well in a box in the loft along with the rest of my Spectrum games! I had a ZX Spectrum +3 (which I still have and use with a Zaxon SD interface), I think I got the CD Games Pack for a birthday or Christmas, I can't remember now. The only place in the house I could use it was in the living room, as that's where we had a Sanyo DCX891 (just found that model number!) all in one CD stack system (still got that as well!) that my parents had bought not long before along with the Mitsubishi 21" Nicam Stereo Fastext TV. I used to get the old TV from the living room when it was replaced so I had the 20" colour TV (that the Mitsubishi had replaced) in my bedroom, which was great, especially when I later got a NES and later still a Megadrive - still got both and all the games as well, although I have SD interfaces for both! :)

[@GamerSpencer]

You do know the Sinclair Spectrum 128k exists right? Before Alan Sugar took over...

[@TheRetroArchive]

Remember seeing it previewed in Amstrad Action.. The problem is by 1990 those of us that were still using our 8-bit machines for gaming were probably not the ones able to afford CD players.

[@RMCRetro]

Very true!

[@gi7kmc]

Yes I remember seeing it advertised at the time but I didn't have a cd player so I never bought it for my spectrum+2

[@andyukmonkey]

Not only that but we probably had most of those games already

[@lucasRem-ku6eb]

CD players became very cheap, Amstrad Argos was 120 pound sterlings, after 1986 even cheaper, family set was 300 incl CD and all... Only the PC was too fancy, some C64 too, Vic20 ??? mad times, Electron for 100 pound in 1984, with german book, lol ! We hated Amstrad and Argos here ! Sony, National, Yamaha !

[@8_Bit]

I'm impressed they were able to make that tape loader resident with such a wide range of games. I would have thought no matter where they stored it in RAM, some of the games would have overwritten it. And how would the code for the QUIT key sequence continue to be executed while those games are running? Pretty much every game I've ever disassembled and examined (admittedly, mostly on the C64) overwrites the interrupt vectors and provides its own keyscan routine, which would disable a resident program like this. My only guess is that Codemasters went through and patched all these games to play nice with the loader. Quite a bit of work!

[@munro12345]

This has blown my mind! How did I never know about this? I feel like someone has gone back in time, introduced this in 1989 and I’m the only one on the original timeline where it didn’t exist... Excellent video btw, your enthusiasm was infectious!

[@BollingHolt]

Similar to loading "tapes" from smartphones these days, but decades ago! Same principle! There is just something so cool about anachronisms, seeing older equipment working with newer technology for which it was not designed, like this, and like hooking up those WiFi32-style "modems" to put older machines on wireless networks, SD adapters, etc. Good show, as always, man!

[@Mamiya645]

I am in eternal awe of the Speccy visual charm, it aged uniquely and I sat and smiled watching the clips of the games. What a beaut.

[@Th3OmegaPoint]

Seeing those Codemasters games sure brought back some memories!

[@MorganJustGames]

Never seen this boxset before. Got some really nice games and its nice to see other versions of them, as ive played most of them on C64. I will get a Spectrum one day. Nice video Neil.

[@Lirio2u]

🔥Great tunes at 4.18 and 14.35. Tough to go from seeing you nearly everyday back to just once in a while. 😭

[@Mind-your-own-beeswax]

‘ I met him on a Monday and my heart stood still, cd rom rom rom, cd rom rom’

[@ro63rto]

Only ever had the temperamental tapes. Still got my Spectrum with the official memory upgrade and a DKTronics keyboard.

[@meetoo594]

@Goliat eXperience 16k to 48k maybe? Sinclair sold the chips if you wanted to solder them in yourself or you could send it to them and they would upgrade it for a fee iirc.

[@evertonshorts9376]

Some say he was in a Spectrum game, all we know is he's called The Stig...

[@shelby3822]

Brilliant solution that using CD tracks

[@stockicide]

Using a console from 1988 to load games for a microcomputer from 1982 is a special kind of retro madness, and I dig it.

[@TheTurnipKing]

2:25 Common practice to put 48k/128k to help indicate that the game was at least tested with the 128k. Early days, older 48k software sometimes had compatability issues with the 128k models, and some games were later fixed and reissued with the packaging updated to reflect that new compatability. And eventually it just kind of became the standard to list the all the models it worked with. 5:05 Should use the DivMMC to load an image of the CD loader tape

[@AmstradExin]

....well, until someone found out you just type USR 0 in 128K basic...

[@Celcius1]

I had to like this just cause the setup looks so awesome, and true for the period, how I wish I was 8 again

[@10p6]

Interesting Video. I think Codemasters should have made a Spectrum expansion with 2 joystick ports, extended ROM for the fast loader and CD cable built in. That would have allowed them to use it for single games on CD too, and also license it out to companies who were making the big popular 128K games that took a long time to load.

[@hjalfi]

I was looking forward to seeing the loading screens appear incrementally and comparing that to the tape --- but they don't! Without that, loading seems like a very soulless experience. It looked really cool on the Microdrive.

[@Colin_Ames]

I never owned any of this stuff, so it is fascinating to see it in action.

[@antonjoly9601]

I like this monster you created ! Congratulations, my favourite retro computing channel for sure.

[@RMCRetro]

Thanks Anton

[@alynicholls3230]

speccy/zx81 users who were into electronics too were building "crash loaders" in fact there was a niche fanzine, mine was based on a reel to reel deck, basically you record at one speed and load in at a faster one. and it works(sometimes), its not the same as this but mine would load the128k version of kwik snax in 2mins, which was great and about a 3rd the time the cassette took.

Damn I remember this! My parents got this for me back in the day (about 6 months when it first came out.) I had a portable CD player then, and used that. Mine was second-hand and came complete with a kempston joystick interface in the box which, I never realised until now, wasn't part of the original box. It was amazing to me to see games load so fast and no, "R-Tape loading error," messages, either. Disappointed you didn't use a TV (on channel 36 (ish) of course,) in the demo. Oh well. Thank you cave-dweller for the memory flashback!

[@johnknight9150]

This is actually one of my favourite bits of tech on this channel so far. I would've used this tech loudly and proudly!

[@jaseman]

I bought my Amiga 500 in 1989 and the games for that blew away anything the spectrum could do. People that were into computers had either moved to Atari ST or Amiga by 1990. It helped that I had an income to be able to afford it as my parents probably wouldn't have been willing to pay out the £425 for it (400 for the Amiga and £25 for the TV modulator).

[@CoolDudeClem]

I thought I was watching and LGR oddware episode for a moment here!

[@PerpetualTiredness]

I was just thinking that.

[@bazza5699]

the background music in your videos is always a pleasure to hear.. i'd love to own a rubber key speccy again.. *wistfully remembers being nine years old and playing bombjack*

[@KevinJones-bt7ib]

I don't remember this coming out, or seeing in the shops. I found this video quite mind blowing

[@jcardboard]

Amazing to see that there's not that much difference between ATV sim and the Trials games.

[@bcbock]

I wonder why they didn’t just put the boot loader onto the CD and an extra cable. The boot loader wouldn’t be compressed like the games, but it could still be loaded directly from the CD to the audio jack.

[@inwedavid6919]

A CD compilation has already been done for the MSX but CD readers where rare at the time and expensive. No tape inside the CD was used in audio mode directly as was the tape.

[@DarkStarr9999]

Loading speed was tied to how long I played (play) games. When I had to wait 5+ minutes for a game to load I would usually give it a good go and play for quite a while. Now if I load something in seconds if I’m not hooked in a couple of minutes I usually try something else.

[@wisteela]

It's great to see a video about this.

[@AstAMoore]

The biggest oversight with this release was the fact they didn’t include the loader on the CD itself. They obviously shot for the lowest common denominator. The +2 machines didn’t have an audio input port, so loading from an external audio source was out of the question. At the same time, most 48K/128K owners probably had a third-party joystick interface of some sort, and so could take advantage of the new loading format. Ironically, if Code Masters had put a slightly modified version of the loader on the CD (it only needs to read from the Spectrum’s standard audio port instead of a joystick port), all games could have been loaded from a CD using a standard audio cable-no need for a cassette at all. It really wouldn’t have cost Code Masters a single penny more to do that. Oh, well.

[@pablorai769]

Yes, you're right, though the loader can be the same as the tape version, no need for modifications, I think they were just lazy...

[@FranzFamicom]

I am impressed! You really are the MacGyver of retro gaming. If I may I would really love if you can make a video about MSX flash carts with SD card readers one day.

[@tommik1283]

On the box it says 48k with Kempston... Maybe the cable was made just for that and +2 Sinclair port (which obviously has different pinout from Interface 2)?

[@root42]

The CD waveform had an interesting wobble to it. Kind of like an AM carrier signal. I couldn't see that in the tape version.You mentioned you asked A. Oliver about the loader. Could he shed a bit more light on how the encoding works?

[@marcuslundblad6977]

Impressive the recite is still readable still :D

[@cdigames]

Honestly, from a money saving standpoint.. The biggest surprise is that CodeMasters didn't include the audio track for the cassette loader program on the CD itself so you would have to dub that to cassette first before even thinking about loading games.

[@pablorai769]

You could have loaded it directly from the CD then, the problem was they were lazy, since the tape was needed for the +2 Spectrum, which lacked an audio input, they didn't include the loader on the CD as well

[@steelpatriot3683]

Really interesting episode this Neil, thanks. Lovely to see BMX Simulator in your top 3. I lost endless hours to that in my youth, a brilliant game. I couldn't believe it was £2.99 when other shocking games were being dropped at £7.99. Good old Codemasters 👍

[@pablorai769]

Actually it was £1.99

[@DobryakDobreyshiy]

I had Spectrum cassetes with alternate "compressed" games on the tape - looks like, its used similar way to load games (with built-in loader) - way faster than normal. Its was made by local Russian coders here, in Russia. Each cassete had more games on it, but requires good tape player to load without errors. I still have such cassetes somewhere, but I not sure about their current state - aside from not having any cassete player to check them anyway.

[@simonralfe3683]

God, I had that. I worked in a computer shop so got it at a big discount given it was £20. It was relatively reliable attached to my Laskys own brand CD player. I remember being impressed by the ability to load relatively quickly from CD, but less impressed with some of the CodeMasters filler. I think I still have the thing somewhere!

[@CorporalWobbly]

I had no idea that these were in the same time period.

[@JoeSteele]

I am curious as to exactly why loading via the joystick port was faster? It seems like the optimized loader could have been the first track on the CD and subsequent tracks would still be able to take advantage of the audio compression used. It would be cool to dig into whether the same audio compression could have been used over the audio port and skip the extra cable.

[@aguijon6]

Very exotic stuff from the era, thanks! I’ve missed some audio takes from the CD, I’m curious about how it sounds

[@aukondk]

That Computape brand cassette gave me a pang of nostalgia! Not seen one of those in years.

[@colinsdiecast164customs]

Amazing!, I had never heard of that system.

[@jengelenm]

This is oooooold school! Great stuff!

[@harrkev]

I do wonder why they didn't include the loader as audio track 1. It would mean swapping cables, but would be a nice backup.

[@Monkey_SK]

Great video, what a find.

[@aaaalex1994]

It would be interesting to see a comparison of the raw data transfer speed between this method, the cassette tape and a regular CD-ROM (which is 150 kB/s at single-speed)...

[@rpgspree]

Considering how notoriously slow the C64 floppy drive was, I wonder how that version of the CD compared to loading off floppies? While the floppy was faster than tape, there's a good reason "fast load" apps were all the rage on the C64.

[@discopot]

I had atv simulator back in the day

[@davidspencer7254]

When it came out I briefly flirted with the idea of buying it but three problems stopped me: I wasn't convinced any other software would come out on it. The only software on it was Codemasters budget games. I had a +3, so not much advantage.

[@bennyalford]

For those interested in a bit more technical detail on how this worked, I wrote an article for the Spectrum For Everyone website a few years ago that goes into more detail: spectrumforeveryone.com/2017/06/inside-codemasters-cd-games-pack/

[@onlineamiga]

Wow I'd never seen this before. What a great idea, and in a way does put the spectrum/c64 as an early computer that would work with a CDROM drive. I do get the fast load idea. But was the cost worth it? Having a joystick adapter, having to run a loader program on cassette, and then swapping loader out with an actual joystick. I cant help but wonder if this would have done better if it had just been a straight load via the casette input. Maybe even with that they could get away with some faster loading. (i know i can increase the bitrate of a wav file on audacity to an extent and pump it into the speccy and it'll load it). The pack could have been cheaper without needing the adapter or cost of the loader. Also Im curious to know what the cd sounded like through speakers. Was it a similar sound to the tape?

[@sakisyoutuber]

what format was the games in the cd? (cdda,cd-da,mp3,mpeg)

[@pablorai769]

If it was a true audio cd, the tracks were just audio, you would've seen them as cdda in a computer, but it's just a convention, they are PCM encoded tracks

[@GerardKean]

I never see on youtube the speccy I had which was the ZX Spectrum+ 48k

[@RETRONuts]

When buying these some don't work cause of how old they are, the adapter does not work, I have the Commodore 64 version and it does not load, it never has but I did paid £21 for it on eBay, its up on eBay at the moment and over £200, I am still glad I got it because its part of history of Codemasters and the C64, the ZX version was better, that because that was made by the Oliver twins, I would not mind a version for that, I do have a ZX Spectrum too, or a copy of its CD, you can download the Cassette as a tap, the loader. In 1989 most users didn't have a CD player(I didn't), they were to expansive so the same kind of problem as buying a disk drive then, and the other problem is your not going to like all the games on it. I have the Rainbow Arts 1st CD-Edition too on the C64, that came out at the same time, that works fine, but it came out a few months the Codemasters CD, they both say on them 1989. Cause my Codemasters CD Adapter didn't work(I need to fix it) I took my adapter apart, it has epoxy that cover the amplifier board, this is my adapter... its on cpc site.. www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/File:Inside_the_adapter.jpg I did post about it on Lemon64 years ago but the site has been attacked by hackers so its down at the moment, Its here... the webcache version, I sheared my version as a wav file because I couldn't copy its CD with CD copy software... webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:0mgUuKEJ00oJ:www.lemon64.com/forum/viewtopic.php%3Ft%3D59620

[@pablorai769]

It was released in 1989, not 1982, some people misread the title

[@RMCRetro]

That's correct, the micro was released in 1982

[@ddniUK]

Produced by Dick Darling? Great name, I’m sure his school friends loved it!

[@FlyingSurprise]

Now I want to see the C64 version.

[@RobA500]

Quite an interesting idea if there were a better selection of games but by the time it came out I was moving on to the Amiga. I recon that multi load games would have benefited from something like this.

[@NickFellows]

Its weird that they didnt put the loader on the CD as well - is there a reason it had to be on cassette tape ? The loader could have been recorded at normal speed as the first track

[@moth.monster]

The good ol Zeddex Spectrum

[@catoblepag]

Ah, the good old Philips CM8833. Best "bang for the buck" retrogaming RGB monitor out there, in my opinion.

[@RCM442]

That CD looks like it's going through what is known as disc bronzing, only happened on discs made by PDO...

[@theoldar]

Wonderful as always.

[@simonllawrence]

Nec did a black cdrom , its the turbografx cdrom exactly the same as the white one but black

[@the_real_foamidable]

Why isn't it loading the loader or the games directly from a cdda track? Why you need a cassette player at all. Did I miss something?

[@pablorai769]

The +2 Spectrum lacked an audio input, the tape was necessary, but yes, they could've put the loader on the CD as well, I guess they were just lazy...

[@RMCRetro]

I guess you'd generally have a cassette deck hooked up permanently anyway, and as the CD uses a custom cable you'd need to unplug/plug cables for a loader and then the fast loading interface. So it was simpler to use a tape. The tape loader is pretty quick to load as it's very simple

[@pablorai769]

You're right Neil, but I still think they should've included it on the CD as well anyway, at least as a backup, if you'd lost the cassette or it would fail, you would've in your hands a nice coaster!

[@trewlove]

Can you make your own CD compilation of games and load them this way?

[@TheTurnipKing]

Yep, but MP3 solutions are far more common these days. TZXduino will actually take the .TAP or .TZX and turn it back into audio on the fly.

[@janhofmeier9427]

Why didn't they also put the loader on the CD and have a Y-cable for the cd player that goes to the audio input and the joystick port?

[@pablorai769]

The +2 Spectrum lacked an audio input, so the tape was necessary, sure they could've put the loader on the CD as well, I guess they were just lazy

[@schneil]

2:26 does the disc say made in UK by PDO? That's disc bronzing (rot) you've got there. You're lucky it plays, many of my CDs now have errors and are unplayable. 7:42 Perhaps when the Sinclair option is selected, it's set for the non-standard Amstrad joystick ports of the +2 and +3?

[@pablorai769]

If that's the case, a simple adapter would solve the problem, it'd be interesting to try it

[@Zeem4]

I was going to comment the same thing - the Interface 2 and the +2/+3 ports are software compatible, but good old Amstrad changed the pinout of the ports to try and force people to buy the SJS-1 joystick. So the joystick manufacturers just did that grey-and-black-plugs thing.

[@schneil]

@@pablorai769 Yes but the adapter would need to be reversed? As the CD is set for the Amstrad standard of +2 and +3, not atari. Normally +2 owners would have an adapter to convert the Atari standard joysticks to their machine. But with 48K owners the Kempston interface was the most popular. I think after a certain year, nearly all aftermarket joystick interfaces were Kempston compatble? So the CD's "sinclair" option shoud have only affected a few interface II spectrum owners by 1990.

[@pablorai769]

It'd have to be the reverse of the commercially available adapter, a simple soldering job

[@NickBFTD]

Can you not load from CD through the audio jack without the loader software ?

[@PaulinesPastimes]

I have just realised something. In 1990 I was 37, had never used a computer (not until 1994) and, not being a teenage boy, thought computer games were a silly waste of time. You guys would have simply been annoying teenagers to me but I can now see the world you experienced :-) Isn't it funny what 30 years can do? Now I am thinking of playing some of them just for kicks. Never too late I say. Cheers!

[@michaelelsy2209]

Never knew about this until I saw your first video about this, a pity it never took off.

[@eliotmansfield]

Good lord I had that exact tape recorder in the 80’s

[@jason_a_smith_gb]

I suspect what they would have done on the cancelled CPC version, is have the main program be the loader and each track be the game data. That way the track cuts out all the Speedlock delays/can be compressed and improves the baud rate! Without the loader, the track has no load mechanism to play a track to tape...

[@jason_a_smith_gb]

- Tried compressing a CPC game yesterday, by using Audacity, but the protection causes it to fail...

[@Asimov16]

Don't forget the original Spectrum + which also had 128k of ram and at the time still owned by Sinclair

[@AmstradExin]

Ehm NOPE? Where did you get that from??? It's easy to google.

[@Corsa15DT]

I learn something new about SPeccy in 2020, it could support CD. Funny how it couldn't load 40kb game in 3 seconds though.

[@BadManiac]

Local craftsmen and global delivery makes NO SENSE!?? I can't let this go any longer @RetroManCave, what the heck!? Everything is made locally somewhere, and most stuff can be delivered globally these days, Covid notwithstanding. Sense makes none. Fun video, as usual, great content, big fan, blah blah :P

[@pelgervampireduck]

wait, I thought the signal from the cd was going to be sent directly to the spectrum, replacing the cassette, loading it normally but using the cd as the source for the "screeching sound" signal. so... it's a different thing then?. have you listened to the cd on a regular cd player?.

[@TheTurnipKing]

That's almost exactly how it works: The only thing is you need a dedicated turboloader, but that's not uncommon. Most commercial games used some form of jiggery pokery replacing the ROM loader routines, which is why they often had weird effects, like different colours in the border. the first section would usually be some form of standard loader, which would then load another routine which would effectively supplant the ROM loader with more features. In this case the turboloader is loaded from tape, and is set up to stay resident and rather than listen to the audio jack for audio, uses pins on the joystick port instead, but the principle really isn't all that far removed at all.

[@imranahmad2733]

Couldn't they have put the standard loader on to the CD as Redbook audio instead of having it on the cassette tape.

[@pelgervampireduck]

it could have been track 01, and the whole thing would have been easier, "just plug the cd player instead of the cassette player".

[@TheTurnipKing]

@@pelgervampireduck except then it wouldn't have worked on most of the 128k machines that have a built in tape deck. There may also have been scheduling benefits. The Olivers were apparently still working on the Spectrum loader whike the c64 versions were in the shops, so it's entirely possible the game cd was already being pressed. Producing an audio cd back then was a new and expensive business, but knocking our a few tapes was something they'd been doing for years

[@randywatson8347]

Pair it with a Sony D50 Discman from 1984 😍 It's a shame the boxart looks more like a CD cleaning set.

[@lpseem3770]

Madness! Of course it is "Grand Pricks".

[@sethrd999]

Perhaps the twins could open source the gadget and the software that drives it for homebrew.. I am sure alot of retro'ers would like to backup their games onto CD and enjoy them that way .. Multi loaders would be an interessting challenge as many of them used fast loaders etc etc to speed up the loading process.

[@bonzobanana1]

Why did it need the special cable? Couldn't the loader of been on the CD as well and each games starts at normal baud and then goes to a turbo loader, i.e. 1500 baud then perhaps 15000 baud? Maybe I'm missing something but the special cable just seems like a copy protection system. I seem to remember there was an issue that some portable cd players didn't have geniune stereo output, they had mono output that would switch channels rapidly to create stereo sound and those cheapo cd players were not compatible with these game discs. Also while I'm writing does anyone remember the video recorder backup system for the Amiga. You could archive all your discs to video tape? I had that.

[@TrashfordKent]

Yeah I was about to comment the same regarding certain CD players not having stereo output as such. Well remembered 👍

[@pablorai769]

A mono output would have worked perfectly, I don't see any problem with that

[@pablorai769]

Besides, I don't think they ever made a cd player with a mono output, some early players had just one DAC (Digital to Analog Converter) as a cost saving measure, but it switched back and forth between channels to create a stereo output, not mono

[@bonzobanana1]

@@pablorai769 It didn't have mono output but could only generate 1 channel at a time and rapidly switched between each channel to create stereo. For some reason this effected these CD game discs which perhaps relied on a consistent audio track.

[@pablorai769]

bonzobanana1 Ok, but just some of the first gen CD players had a single DAC, they could've put the loader on the CD as well for the vast majority of users, it wouldn't have cost them a penny, I'm starting to think they just forgot to do so and had to put the loader on tape! But no, I had forgot that the +2 didn't have an audio input, so the tape was necessary, sure they could've put it on the CD as well, I guess they were just lazy...

[@meetoo594]

They could have included a 3.5 jack in the cable and put the loader on the cd rather than a separate tape and disabled (or told people to pull the jack out) it after it had loaded. They could have also put the normal slow loading game files in a block of tracks after the fastload ones for people who only had a single joystick port. Thinking about it, I recall seeing this in magazines and being more interested in the amount of games you got rather than how fast they loaded so maybe just having normal loading speed and ditching the cable would have been a better idea as im thinking most of the cost was that cable. If they sold this at 9.95 and you just loaded it through the 3.5 jack it might have been a bit more successful than it was. I guess it didnt help that most of the games were dreadful though.

[@TheHimble]

It's Alive!

[@AerinRavage]

I can't not smile at 'CD ROM-ROM'! =^.^=

[@MarkTheMorose]

I'm not clicking 'like' on a Codemasters-related video until they release Advanced Simulator Simulator 2.

[@ynotwalk7391]

soooo cooool

[@Clay3613]

Could you find the first game on DVD?

[@TheTurnipKing]

I am 99% confident that will be some flavour of Myst.

[@danaeckel]

Interesting concept, one of these for the C64 would have been faster than the disk drive.

[@MarkTheMorose]

I think it was Jeff Minter who joked that if you left a floppy disk on top of the C64, it would load quicker through osmosis than it would by loading it from the 1541 disk drive.

[@vurpo7080]

The C64 disk drive loaded so slowly, because the VIC-20 had a hardware fault that meant they needed to rewrite the disk drive to be super slow so the VIC-20 could use it. The C64 had to be backwards compatible so it also needed to use this slow mode despite not having the same hardware fault anymore. That's why "fast loaders" for the C64 disk drive were so common; it was basically low hanging fruit to just rewrite the disk drive software to use the full speed of the serial port.

[@DAVIDGREGORYKERR]

Some discs are prone to degrading which means that the foil flakes away and renders the disc unusable, Would have been nice if they had gone for the ZILOG Z800 chip that is backwards compatible with the Z80A or go all out with the ZILOG Z8000.

[@pancudowny]

Can't help think that if a personal CD-player with a true line-level audio output--like Panasonic later made--was used, the results would've been better... or, at least the cassette deck wouldn't be necessary.

[@th3d3wd3r]

Have you tried loading up a casette, removing the silence, burning to cd and trying the launcher with that?

[@kaitlyn__L]

Making a CD copy of a tape would work, just as people use MP3 copies of Spectrum games. This system used higher frequencies in addition to pulsing them for a briefer duration and removing gaps between the pulses, hence loading the fast loader first, so you'd need to do more tinkering to convert a regular game. Otherwise it'd be no different from copying the tape albeit digitally instead of dubbing to another tape. Now, I don't know if you can just speed up the entire audio file and be done with it, the ratio between lengths of the blocks between gaps did look the same to my eyes in both waveforms he showed. If your game tape had its own fast loader, that would probably interfere with this system. So it's not a definite no, but it's not a strong yes either. More experimentation would be interesting.

[@AJC508]

I used to have a 48K spectrum when I were a lad. Very curious about this, as I never even imagined it could exist at the time. The joystick port is bugging me though. If you were to connect the CD player directly to the MIC plug on the spectrum with a stadnard jack 3.5 cable, then LOAD"" and run any one of the CD tracks - would it work, or is the input speed too fast for the usual channels? Is the purpose of the loader to allow for joystick management, or just to let the user jump between games a bit faster?

[@kaitlyn__L]

Since the waveforms show the CD audio is much faster, I imagine a bare Speccy wouldn't know what to do with it. The loader almost certainly translates the new faster tones into the appropriate bits, since a bare Speccy uses distinct frequencies to represent one and zero. The CD cuts out the gaps and pulses each frequency for less time than a tape, but it's plainly obvious in the waveforms that it uses higher frequencies as well as a result. As stated in the video, the joystick adapter has some amplification circuitry inside. Does the Speccy joystick even accept analogue signals, or is it purely digital? If the latter, then the joystick connector is almost certainly also involved in translating the audio from the CD into digital data too. However, if it is piping in analogue audio directly through the joystick port, then it's possible that loading the loader and then simply plugging the CD audio in lieu of the tape audio might work. After all, other tape games came with fast loaders too, which would start out in Speccy standard tones on the tape and then move to their own higher frequency schema once their loader was loaded. This method was probably meant to be more convenient in allowing you to keep your tape deck hooked up at the same time, at the very least. And I suspect that it is doing funny business rather than sending audio directly into the Speccy through the joystick port, but that part is just a hunch.

[@AJC508]

@@kaitlyn__L Indeed, and hence my question - I see that we think along similar patterns. Those were, although possibly not quite as well structured, my thoughts on the matter. Hopefully the cave master may be able to clarify what magical things go on therein.

[@kaitlyn__L]

@@AJC508 I would certainly be interested for somebody to do more experiments with this format!

[@TheTurnipKing]

@@kaitlyn__L It's also likely the games are sightly rejigged to allow for the loader remaining resident.

[@one_b]

Why didn't they just make the cable have two ends and use track 0 on the CD in place of the tape? One for the mic port and the other for the joystick port? Skip the tape entirely.

[@pablorai769]

+2 Spectrum had no audio input, the tape was necessary, but they could've put the loader on the CD as well, I guess they were just lazy

[@one_b]

Ah I see... I've never had a Spectrum (In the US, Dad was a Vic-20 and C64 guy) but I have been very interested in what I've been seeing in some of the indie games scene recently.

[@RWL2012]

Don't usually watch your videos after the whole "you sound like Nostalgia Nerd" "No I don't, you must be in North America" "Yes you do, and I'm in the UK too" thing, and I didn't really watch this one either. Skimmed through it.

[@finkelmana]

I miss Shovelware. Lets throw a games that came on one floppy onto a CD!

[@pablorai769]

Here you can find out how to make your own cable: spectrumforeveryone.com/2017/06/inside-codemasters-cd-games-pack/