The Blunder of London's Bendy Buses

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Attempting to replace the venerable AEC Routemaster, the Mercedes-Benz Citaro articulated buses, or Bendy Buses, were thought to be the answer of providing a vehicle of far greater capacity in order to answer the challenge of London's unique public transport environment.
Unfortunately, what resulted was one of the worst buses ever employed in the British capital, as while their capacity was indeed far greater than the Routemasters, their physical dimensions were too large for the narrow streets, they were prone to fare dodging, and they had a dangerous tendency to overheat and catch fire, leading to their rapid fall from grace and withdrawal within a decade.
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References:
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[@Grisu1805]

Curious how London is the only city in the world that had those problems and how the bendy bus Citaro is a staple in bus fleets in a lot of other cities with congested, narrow old roads just like in London.

[@neiloflongbeck5705]

@@Grisu1805 it's probably a "not invented here" issue.

[@christiand4630]

Well, At the time London wasn´t the only city with those issues. Berlin had in the 2000s a very similar issue with 12m standard Citaros frequently burning down. They were even grounded in 2009 and thoroughly inspected and it came out it was due too infrequent and faulty maintainance. Especially the idiotic idea to use cheaply made non-manufacturer plastic fuel tubes instead of metal ones caused leakes and therefore engine fires. After that was done the badge was reentered into service and had 9 years of fire free duty until being retired in 2018.

[@Mariazellerbahn]

Did you even listen to the video? They took up twice as much road space as a comparable double decker.

[@Grisu1805]

@Mariazellerbahn Sorry that I didn't go into a single problem out of the myriad of supposed problems and that there might be one single problem that... other heavily congested cities that use bendy busses instead of double deckers don't have then I guess?

[@Gaming-Legends007]

Curious why your curious 👀

[@nupnorth]

I drive bendy buses (Man Lion's City) in Norway. For the most part, bendy buses are as good as standard ones. Tight maneuvers are no more difficult, and the "blind spot" issue is something you get used to. We've had ours for years, and never a single fire. However, you need long bus stops, otherwise the rear section doesn't meet the curb (a problem for less-able-bodied passengers). Also, the driver must be sure he can completely clear a crossroads before committing, lest he block the entire intersection! Drivers don't check tickets here anymore- we just employ lots of inspectors. We also have a problem with jacknifing in heavy snow, if the driver accelerates while the bus is still bent (especially on adverse cambers). That's on the driver, though. So, bendy buses are fine for most European cities (even the cramped, snowy ones). Pleased I don't drive in London, though!

[@thomasohare8552]

I think Ruairidh was aiming to emphasise the biggest problems being the traffic levels in London - bus mostly operate in the 0-11mph window, constantly accelerating from stationary (causing the fires) and the length of the bus in such traffic meaning junction clearance was terrible meaning long waits I think the phrase "vehicle length per passenger carried" was used. What I don't really understand is why we can't have them out in the suburbs, I'm guessing as you say, bus stops need to be really long, and here still that's a big problem.

[@stevenmacdonald9619]

You shot your own comment down. Thank you

[@onlinefriend3889]

@@stevenmacdonald9619 how so?

[@wendigo53]

While cycling, I got "trapped" between the curb and an articulated bus, maybe in 1990 in Toronto. Not fun. The driver pulled past me, then stopped at the curb to pick up a passenger. I think he thought his back end passed me, but it frigging didn't.

[@kuttispielt7801]

@@thomasohare8552 Standardization is probably the main reason for not having them in the suburbs. It's just easier to have a lot of the same busses.

[@mikepowell2776]

Of course, Leicester, Liverpool and Malta don’t have any narrow streets, difficult corners or historic centres. Same must apply to Zurich, Vienna and all the hundreds of Continental cities which seem to use articulated buses fairly successfully. I’m pretty certain that the demise of the RMs was influenced as much by the necessity of carrying two crew members as by the exigencies of level access and many of us managed to survive travelling on them for decades without falling out of the back. The real danger, on all double-deckers, are the stairs. The new Routemasters look like a decent bet, though.

[@lillywho]

I live in Essen where the Citaro busses have to navigate some very narrow streets on some lines, which are also very hilly to boot. They manage just fine, and even the ones remaining of the older generation don't burst into flames or get stuck so I don't see what the fuss is about.

[@BernardSamson-hf6fc]

TFL (under Crooked Khan) had to employ 1,000's of "Revenue inspectors" all cronies of khan - look after their own.

[@grassytramtracks]

Add Bath to that list, the roads are a nightmare here but bendy buses still managed to work quite well on the university route, which went on some of our fairly steep and narrow streets with parked cars on both sides, though admittedly they didn't take the worst of our streets

[@noelht1]

Malta’s bendy bus experiment was a total disaster. Due to the narrow streets

[@ktwashere5637]

does Leicester have anywhere near the same population as London though? Its not about the buses, its about the fact that we would have 3-4 buses arriving at a bus stop in central london at the same time. there isn't space for all these super long buses to fit.

[@jonathanamadio-heal494]

As a kid I thought bendy buses were weired but thought the best idea ever was a bendy double decker

[@leylandlynxvlog]

Neoplan Jumbocruiser.

[@jimtaylor294]

That at least would make some sense, as a niche filler 🤔 .

[@kingkonut]

DOUBLE DECKER BENDY TRAMS!!!!!!!

[@michaelbujaki2462]

Neoplan built eleven of these, but cities were not interested as there wasn't enough demand for them yet.

[@MrDannyDetail]

I feel like the bending action would be at risk of tipping over the rear section (and thus ultimately the entire bus) if the centre of gravity was higher up due to it being double-decker. Unless only the front section was a double maybe,

[@davidsmith9566]

I drove ex London citaro bendy buses in Stansted airport and they were by far the best built and most reliable, driver friendly buses I ever drove outside the coach category… in fact I’d take them over some coaches. Really amazing buses. Compared with Dennis dart rubbish they were amazing

[@lordatkinson2046]

Leave it to the German to make something actually good and not a rattley mess.

[@stevenmacdonald9619]

London never got the best buses due to hating the idea that they were made in the North. They much preferred the cheap crap from Europe. £200,000, isn't half a double decker. Leyland were scoffed at in London, so they stuck with AEC, until AEC got bought out, then they didn't even want AEC anymore, sticking Volvo engines instead. Then Volvo paired with Alexander, so they didn't want Volvo anymore. Are you getting the picture?

[@mattkaythetimelord]

My local company retired their Citaros a few years back, replacing them with a fleet of Enviro 200s. The comparison when I first went into the 200 compared to the Citaro, so cheap, tacky, sounds horrible, everything rattles, seats more uncomfortable, no space in the drivers cab to put your bags etc.. And I actually don't think one ever broke down when I was onboard. I miss those things :( They are indeed amazing buses, the fact that they were first produced in the 90s and are still going is testament to this.

[@stevenmacdonald9619]

@@davidsmith9566 You fail to mention there have been several generations of Citaro and none of those first generations have lasted since the 90's at all. Clearly some people are totally blinded by the Manufacturers badge. Mercedes have been making cheap and rattley cars since the 2000's and selling them to people with more money than sense, who see the badge and don't bother to check. Yours sincerely a former Mercedes employee. You are their target market 👍

[@DonalMcMonagle]

@@lordatkinson2046 The Citaros are very rattley in comparison to the Volvos but still nicer to drive.

[@martinda7446]

Talking about fare dodging, The Boris Bus was called 'the free bus' by the dodgy South London lads. ''It's OK we can get 'the free bus'....

[@philtucker1224]

If it gets more cars off the road it’s worth it.

[@melvyncox3361]

The irony is that they had to bring back the Routemasters while these buses had their problems.Shame the Routemasters had to go though,as it really was the ideal bus for London,the operation it was primarily designed for.

[@airingcupboard]

They invented a new bus, with the idea of selling it to other countries, that no one would buy, were expensive and lacked hop on hop off. Cramped as per every routemaster. Lovely if you don't take a bus, have children or need to haul a lot of stuff.

[@melvyncox3361]

@airingcupboard So true mate!What a waste of time........'New Routemaster' is not the right name for it!

[@jimtaylor294]

The OP is correct. The Routemaster is an icon of London for good reason, while the Banana-Buses were loathed. It's almost like the Routemasters were forced out by myopic government ""disability"" legislation, which just led to a decrease in regular Bus passengers UK-wide as low-floor buses typically have a rough, crashing ride compared to high floor alternatives.

[@davidsterry786]

I worked for TfL London Buses (LBSL) one of my roles was to manage the alteration and design of Bus Stations to accommodate bendy buses. Once the teething problems were resolved and the alteration made to road junctions and Bus Stations the bendy buses worked very well and LBSL did not want to lose them. In particular the 207 and 73 were seen as a solution to the lack of capacity cased by no rail routes in these parts of West and East London. The desire being to introduce a tram in West London and a Chelsea-Hackney rail line to the East. Similarly nothing could compete with the bendy buses on the Red Arrow routes. It was seen that the bendy buses reduced congestion as one bendy replaced 3 conventional buses. The reason of their removal was purely Johnsons political games to get into power, he sacrificed money and efficiency for his own gain, a pattern he was to repeat. Then London was saddled with the totally waste of space ‘Boris Bus”.

[@stevenmacdonald9619]

How much did the bus station alterations cost?

[@davidsterry786]

@ To be honest I can’t remember but it was not cheap. We often had to extend the island and sometime reprofile them. The one in the video looks like White City Westfields and was the last one designed with bendy buses in mind.

[@poppyland74]

What was the fare evasion like on the bendys? I think TfL said 3 x conventionals? And the plan was to save £5M in fare evasion. £1.5M was saved on route 149 alone according to a TfL press release at the time (2010). I get you don't like Boris but maybe give us the full picture.

[@jimtaylor294]

Nah. The Bendys were a bad idea from start to finish. The Routemasters should have had a like-for-like DD replacement from the start.

[@Korschtal]

This doesn't surprise me. London has always seed very parochial under the metropolitan surface, and I think a big part of it was an emotional reaction from some Londoners that British buses were being replaced by German models.

[@anthonywarrener1881]

The withdrawal of the articulated Citaros was a complete nonsense. They operate very satisfactorily in so many European cities, and don’t catch fire ! The withdrawal was purely political, and how ironic that the Red Arrow services have now been withdrawn !

[@peterdavy6110]

As a London car driver I say they were awful. Incapable of managing tight corners and a cause of serious traffic delays. They were a bad idea that wasn't properly thought through.

[@jimtaylor294]

The various chaps from Manchester, Berlin & more stating on here that the Citaros are a firey nuisance there too disproves your claim. In London they were a disaster, and predictably so. The Route masters should have had a DD replacement to begin with.

[@Jaymac44]

Yep, these buses were sold to companies across the uk and some are still operating til this day

[@richard--s]

​@@jimtaylor294oh no, they work fine in every other city, it was just political.

[@jimtaylor294]

@richard--s Factually and grammatically, you're just wrong 😆🤣 . The only political dimension was Livingstone's lot being daft enough to waste money on a type of Bus London'd never used nor needed in well over a century, while DD Buses had been successfully used since the days of horse traction. (and Tony Bliar's lot as well for the nonsensical meddling legislation that precipitated it all) #AnotherEpicLabourFail 😂😂

[@lazrseagull54]

Bus lines using double deckers are slower because the longer walk to the nearest doors can add a lot to the dwelling time at each stop. Some of the Citaros in Hamburg have 5 sets of doors so you're never much more than a seat away from an exit.

[@alanmurray4201]

The Citaro articulated buses were not introduced as a replacement for Routemasters. That they are unsuitable for London's streets is a fallacy. Articulated buses operate throughout the world without problems. Adjustments of stop locations were made, just as was done all the time in the past for other bus types, including Routemasters. With a higher capacity than shorter buses, fewer drivers were needed, making the services more economical to operate. When the articulated buses were withdrawn, 50% more drivers were needed. On route 38, some 72 double deckers replaced 48 articulated buses. The withdrawal of the attics was ordered by an ignorant Mayor, name of Boris, who claimed that they were dangerous for cyclists, despite a total absence of deaths or serious injuries being recorded.

[@GARDENER42]

You mean apart from the at least 17 deaths & hundreds of injuries caused by bendy buses which are easily found in a few minutes on Google?

[@anthonyxuereb792]

That man Boris has ruined many things.

[@ag4871]

I really liked the bendy buses. They were quick to load and could go places a double decker couldn't. Their main problem was Boris who basically watched the first episode of Yes Prime Minister and replaced the Eurosausage with that nasty foreign bendy bus.

[@poppyland74]

Did you ride for free like so many others?

[@51WCDodge]

@@poppyland74 Boris Johnson is the only London /Mayor who got tough with TfL and told them shape up or ship out. Labour Mayors use London Buses as political sweeties, free travel if you vote for us.

[@memediatek]

@@51WCDodgei believe they were referring to the fare dodging capabilities of the original routemaster. TfL's worst financial state was during Johnsons time who increased the burden with gadgets like the cable car without increasing subsidy for his political point scoring

[@BigMoTheBlackDragon]

Just do what we do in Chicago -- run 4 standard buses in a convoy. They leap frog each other as they get full, & you get to run nearly 30 meters as you look to see which one has space left on it to get on. Fun times.

[@mburland]

😂

[@Dexter037S4]

This is Ottawa too.

[@tjroelsma]

Narrator: "The open rear platform is considered too dangerous" Me: "Yes, because heaven forbid that modern day people should actually use their brain, a trick that their ancestors had mastered decades ago....." Also: I wonder why they chose the Routemaster to navigate through London........ It's almost like they knew back then that a shorter, double-decker bus could navigate the narrow streets much easier than a long, articulated bus.......

[@JesterJukebox]

Aye, jumping on and off buses and trams was fun, fun, fun!

[@MannyAntipov]

IIRC the conventional buses would've stood at bus stops for far too long picking up passengers in central London and end up "bunching up" (multiple arriving at once) whereas a Routemaster would've had the conductor perform ticket purchasing duties as the bus was moving, speeding up journeys. Of course when these bendy buses came along, additionally the advent of Oyster card and later on the cash ban, allowed the RMs to be withdrawn entirely and bus journeys to be matched accordingly.

[@kubaszymkowiak]

"Oh, how stupid modern day people are, yadda, yadda, yadda..." Or, maybe, just maybe, the health and safety regulations were not that strict back in the 60s and the accidents caused by open platforms did not bother many people.

[@tjroelsma]

@@kubaszymkowiak Or maybe, like I said, people were more used to use their brains and figure out that jumping on or off a moving bus is a bad idea and were smart enouh to wait for the next bus. There were surprisingly little accidents caused by the open platforms, simply because people figured out the dangers. In my opinion a large part of modern day people are surprisingly stupid, clearly visible by the ever-expanding nanny-state that has to take them by the hand and guide them through life, because heaven forbid that they have to figure out for themselves that accidents can happen if you don't pay attention to your surroundings. And yes, obviously there were stupid people in the past as well. but they either figured out that they were stupid and changed their behaviour or Darwinism took them out. My point is that back then those stupid people were more the exception, whereas now they are much more the rule.

[@marcbeebee6969]

​@@kubaszymkowiak yeah. You are right. But i am sticking with brain guy.

[@ianhenderson4560]

The three door boarding arrangement really did help operations, and resulted in some very quick stop dwell times.

[@AndreiTupolev]

Main problem I think was that the bus stops in London are arranged so that there are several stops in one area for different routes, and some of those stops are close to corners, so that if a longer vehicle than a standard double decker (these stops were designed for RTs and RMs) occupies them it can block the corner. They even tried to argue that regular 11 m single deckers (Volvo B10Bs) were inconveniently long for London's streets, which was nonsense as coaches up to 13 m seem to be able to negotiate it satisfactorily. Really I think the artics were a victim of politics: first because they were seen as being Mayor Ken's gimmick to replace the beloved Routemasters, and then when Boris came along and insisted that the only bus possibly suitable for London was a completely new design, designed by him, that would bring back the cheery conductors. The spate of fires only helped to exacerbate prejudice against them. The Citaros were actually very good buses, quiet and smooth

[@leylandlynxvlog]

And much better built than the New Routemaster, where the swithes on the dashboard disappear into the dashboard and they overheat and refuse to move, and don't even tell you on the dash when they need water, just light up like a christmas tree. Not to mention Citaros are more comfortable with air strung driver's seat as standard (they are optional on most other UK market buses but never specified by London operators due to cost).

[@smada36]

Ah, the 60 foot accordions. I was a commuter coach driver back then, and these were a massive pain in the back side. The reason why they didn't work in London, but do work elsewhere is the prolific queue jumping that happens in the UK capital. It happens in many cities, but it is a completely unpunished traffic infringement in Greater London and the South East that has become a standard driving practise. So many road users squeezing up along side these vehicles to use the wrong lane at junctions when they should be holding back meant that bendybus drivers had no choice but to take up the whole road or block junctions to counteract the problem. This lead to suboptimal approach vectors to negotiating obstacles and the resulting damage of collisions was astronomical.

[@rjjcms1]

Yes,driving in London is another level altogether of aggressive and impatient.

[@Lodai974]

Try Paris....The chaos of individualism. Especially bikes and motos However, there are bendy buses on quite varied lines like the 91 on its own site, or the 80-95-31 which run on small streets (sometimes barely wider than the bus itself). And we have the same problems as elsewhere, although they work and are generally loaded. There are also some in the suburbs.

[@jimtaylor294]

Paris, Rome & most Russian traffic begs to differ 😂😂 . London is difficult to drive in, but nowhere near as bad as Paris or Rome, where crossing the road is safest in groups, most cars have low speed crash damage and road markings mean nothing 🤦‍♂️ .

[@christopherhunter2892]

I quite liked the bendy buses. The fact you could board at all 3 doors was a plus and the engineering of the 2 rear doors was amazing , very rapid in action. However they were largely unsuited to London Streets. The original Routemaster along with the RT were the best buses London ever had.

[@warmike]

On fare collection: the easiest solution is not always the best. Single-door boarding wastes a lot of everyone's time. Such a system was removed in Moscow a few years ago and more inspectors were added, and this decision boosted both ridership and fare collection. Boarding speed comparison (all doors boarding is more than 4 times faster, video in Russian): kzbin.info/www/bejne/pKWulqmphtp5m5I

[@jimtaylor294]

Ironically the Routemasters were pretty good at keeping fare evasion down, as they had an Inspector. Their successors though all lump the driver with that duty, because it "saves money" 😅 .

[@jwhite5008]

To be fair, in Moscow people who wanted to ride for free would just duck under the retrofitted turnstiles, And near metro stations it severely slowed things down as people were not too keen on packing into the whole length of the bus. So often the drivers just opened all the doors, resulting in many freeloaders entering from the back. Honest people alse had trouble paying because payment terminal was only at the first door, so in very packed buses they sometimes didn't. And drivers quite understandably couldn't care less - they were not paid to fight unruly folk instead of actually driving in very congested Moscow. And so ticket instectors were reintroduced anyway. Then new bendy trams were added instead of conjoined trains of two trams. They had no chance of loading enough people through first door so they just removed turnstiles and placed payment terminals near every door. The number of freeloaders probably didn't change that much. So this system was gradually introduced everywhere. Today some routes employ fare inspectors at most popular stations, some only occasionally or just don't. I think introduction of 90-minute fare helped a lot: A typical ride is bus+metro+bus. A single fare is about 60% (~$0.6) of the cost of 90-minute fare (~$1). So if you cheat on 1 bus trip of the three you get nothing. If you cheat on two you only get a small profit (~$0.3). This barely gets you a loaf of bread. Metro has turnstiles on all stations, they can be cheated by slipping with another person but it's precarious. To get sizable profit (~$3) you need to cheat on all three. It's too much work. So people who have any money just resign themselves to paying. Another thing is that cost of living in Moscow increased dramatically in comparison to fares. For instance, /rent is typically $800+ per month. That eats away most of the salary. In comparison, fares are manageable. Freeloaders are going to cheat anyway here, running from them in suburban trains is considered by some an unofficial sports discipline.

[@drstevenrey]

The Citaro bendy bus has Zero point zero problems anywhere in the world except in Britain. Hence, maybe the problem is Britain not the Citaro. Would you believe that Davos, Switzerland, 1600 meters above sea level, 6 Month winter with snow everywhere uses Citaros. And they sit in traffic a lot and don't burn out. I think London is just way too old to handle busses at all.

[@connectorxp]

The same for Bucharest, using Citaro buses since early 2000s and currently using some newer hybrid variants.

[@DuskHorizon]

With snow everywhere it's cold enough that their inadequate cooling systems can cope...

[@BombayMolotov]

The issue isn't necessarily the country because there are other buses in use that do not catch fire with the propensity the Citaro did. The Enviro series for instance works very well here. Quite simply the Citaro was not the right bus for the job, it was hastly employed as a cheap and quick solution.

[@robtyman4281]

London doesn't have wide boulevards like many other big European cities, or cities in the US. Its streets are both narrow and quite winding. That's why we have double decker buses - because they suit London's street layout and width much better than long single decker 'bendy' buses. There is indeed nothing wrong with the Citaro buses. But they should never have even run in London to start with, because they are ill-suited to London's roads. They work best in cities with wide, straight roads. London is about the worst kind of city for such buses.

[@deezelfairy]

Not sure what 'London is too old for buses' is supposed to mean. I'd agree nothing was wrong with these buses, London was just the wrong application for them.

[@Threetails]

I was a student in London in the mid 2000s. I rode a number of RMs while there. I don't think there was a single bendy bus on any route I ever needed to travel, it was all the unarticulated and double decker versions of the Wright buses and of course the RM. No. 9 from Hammersmith into Central was an RM. Fond memories of those buses.

[@SuperNoviceDriver]

The routemasters really look quite cute and it's impressive that these old vehicles are so long lasting

[@Bob_Burton]

I am old enough to remember when the Routemasters were new !

[@airingcupboard]

Horribly cramped to use.

[@MrWombatty]

@@airingcupboard Same as the double decker AEC's we had in Sydney, Aust., in my early years at high school when they still used them, I shot up in height to 5'11" and as a student I was expected to stand downstairs when they were full, often with my neck bend to avoid banging my head on the ceiling!

[@Bruce-h8w]

@@airingcupboard But wider than the darling RTs. That's why the RTW was eventually introduced. A long struggle to get 8-foot wide buses on to London's streets.

[@jimtaylor294]

One of the few Buses that had Drifting as part of the driving qualification 😌👌

[@S.e.t85]

I got hit by one of these in 2008.. and as a motorcycle courier I'd be the first to admit if I had any incidents, 99% of the time it was because I was either somewhere or doing something I shouldn't have been.. but this time I was just waiting at lights and the front end passed way to close to me.. and the back end took me out. Plus side is It was the fastest resolved insurance claim I've had to go through, my broker told me (so no idea if actually true) that was because both sides had bendy bus teams because it happened so often.

[@LJ07EBP]

I am dearly sorry you had to go through that. You did not deserve that at all mate. But you are a strong guy for battling all of that well done never back down in life

[@jimtaylor294]

Kudos for pulling through all that. Speaks volumes about why the public call to get rid of the Bendys was so loud.

[@S.e.t85]

Oh I was fine.. I've had much much faster crashes racing motorcycles.. I was back at work the next day on a courtesy bike.. because it hit the motorcycle pannier it just pushed me forward and over to the left.. thankfully clear of the bus that hadn't even realised they'd hit me.. my motorcycle only needed new panniers and rocker covers.. if I had been a cyclist or on a smaller motorcycle/scooter and it had hit me instead.. I can imagine it could have been worse as there's a bigger chance I wouldn't have been pushed clear..

[@jimtaylor294]

@S.e.t85 Kudos on your swift reply, and aye that was relatively lucky 🙂👍 . By contrast, the back of my bike got hit by a red light runner in 2018 (the car [German hatchback] ran a red light at over 70mph); smashed the bike from under me, sent me flying over the roof, and left me with a broken femur and ankle (+ plenty of black bruising & issues with my left hand); took over a year to return to the workplace 😑 . (as it was a hit & run driver and the Police didn't bother to investigate it properly, compensation was non-existant) Taught me two valuable lessons though; never presume that all cars stop for red lights, and following the letter of the highway code (instead of the spirit) as a Biker just get ms you mangled or worse 😑 . (and cameras; having them in all four directions is increasingly a must these days 😅 )

[@S.e.t85]

The worst one I had {on the road} was as I was waiting to turn right on to a minor street; I got rear ended by a van who was still doing 30mph. Apparently he got distracted by a lady in a short dress.. yes that was in the police report.. again I was very lucky and he had swerved at the last second and I had head tyre screeching, looked in my mirrors and released the clutch/brake.. the bike was knocked through my legs and ended up 100yrds up the road, the van mounted the pavement and through someone's front garden wall and I was stood, uninjured in the spot where I was waiting to turn! On the track however I tore all the soft tissue from my shoulder and had to have it all reattached with surgery.. Back to the buses though.. I think the main issue was that the drivers, even if they were experienced drivers, were not used to having an articulated end on the back that behaved differently than the rest of the bus.. it's this coupled with the narrower and windier streets which people usually point to first meant they weren't suitable whereas in Europe they've been around a lot longer and the roads where they're used are more suited.. you know there an issue when on the first day of bring a courier you're told things like the BBC/Harrods goods in/out will be different than what's requested {and they will shout at you if you turn up to the actual address}, the city of London police that are stationed at their border posts are bored, grumpy and bad at their job {and are looking for any reason, even if they're wrong, to make you as grumpy as themselves} and look out for the bendy buses..

[@SamLowryDZ-015]

They were not 'removed' they were on a fixed term lease and were never intended as a long term solution as it was known from the start that the length was limiting factor as to which routes they could be deployed on. It was also known that the issue of fare dodging was going to be rampant, the 25 soon earned the nick name the 'East London free taxi service', but this was not a major concern as they fulfilled one important function. They got thousands of commuters from A to B efficiently. (ex TFL)

[@stevenmacdonald9619]

They were removed. Get over it.

[@SamLowryDZ-015]

@@stevenmacdonald9619 There is no need to be rude just because you have some irrational views, I was just giving an inside view from my time working at TFL. I am sorry you have a problem with reality and historical facts.

[@leylandlynxvlog]

Do you agree that the fare dodging was partly TfL's own fault for not either fitting turnstiles as some European buses use (you can't enter without a ticket) or only allowing boarding at the front as they do with the NBFL/LT?

[@stevenmacdonald9619]

@leylandlynxvlog They never thought that far. They just pictured London looking E.U cosmopolitan. Something that Manchester manages without effort. Because in Manchester residents aren't segrated on where they come from like in London. London is a faux City.

[@stevenmacdonald9619]

@SamLowryDZ-015 Nothing irrational about getting someone to accept truth. That's as rational as it gets.

[@NeoCawte]

I remember going on bendy buses as a kid and I absolutely loved them,

[@orly-carrasco]

7:33 Engines of the London Citaros were too weak to tackle the hilly topography (6,4 L engines/279 hp instead of 12,0 L/299 hp). This doesn't apply for the second batch for route 453, which were far more reliable.

[@leylandlynxvlog]

More cost saving measures no doubt.

[@jaysmith1408]

They’re only getting 279hp out of a 6.4? And 2999 out of a 12? There’s your problem. Our 6.7’s are clearing 300, and our 11.7’s make over 400. Daggumed Mercedes. Rubbish engines they are.

[@leylandlynxvlog]

@ what engines get the figures you’re referring to?

[@orly-carrasco]

@@jaysmith1408 Rather rubbish operators in the UK. Until 2012, artic Citaros could also be fitted with a 12,0L/354 hp engine.

[@jaysmith1408]

@@leylandlynxvlog The 6.7 is a Cummins B series, Volvo’s 10.8L D11 makes 420. The 13L D13 makes 500. All our buses, barring hybrids, have 360hp 8.9L Cummins L’s in the back. No issues. Well, except the transmissions, but that’s the fault of Allison.

[@johnjephcote7636]

The so-called hazard of the open platform was ridiculous. I lived throughout the reign of the RT 1948 to their (and the RM) demise early 1970s. I never wirnessed or heard of any accident.

[@rjjcms1]

Perhaps its critics watched that madcap Frank Spencer scene and thought "oh no!"

[@PerCPH2200]

Well, accidents DID happen... a former co-worker of mine did fall-off an RM. However, it was a risk - and everyone were aware of it, and took proper care (well... almost always). And mind you, also the trolleybuses had that open platforms, and they accelerated and ran even faster. I'm not sure how it would work today, with too many constantly distracted by their mobile phones! At the end of the day, it was Johnson's cheap sentimental song of a new Routemaster - expensive to build and expensive to maintain, and of course the 'conductors that were needed added even more cost - remember that the savings from ending the conductors as RMs were retired had already been 'spent' before the Borismasters arrived.

[@BAT039]

Reflectieve Vests required in UK for Many jobs … for safety. Open platforms on buses is no issue in Britain. Why did Britain forbid cars without doors ? 😂😂 Most buses in Europe can only start rolling when all doors are closed. Pretty sure that double-deckers are more expensive then artulated buses.

[@drstevenrey]

Another note: Bendy busses exist is two main sorts. There is the London version, pusher, and there is also the puller. The pusher has the engine all the way in the back and drives the last axle, the puller has a underfloor engine in the front section driving the middle axle and pulling the rear as a trailer. Both work here in Switzerland (on tight streets that even London doesn't have) like a charm. Even on snow there is little difference where the engine sits, it still works nicely. It seems to me that London Transport is just inept at busses.

[@lillywho]

A low floor bus cannot have its engine mounted underneath the floor due to spacial concerns. While you can transfer traction to the front section via a drive shaft, or use an electric motor in the case of the dieselelectric hybrid Citaro2, a full diesel engine cannot fit there.

[@kilianortmann9979]

@@lillywho Moder pusher designs either have a standing engine in a rear corner, making them completely low floor, or the engine under the rearmost row of seats, in this case everything ahead of and including the rearmost door is low floor. With travel limiters on the articulation joint a lot of the drawbacks of the pusher design have been eliminated, so they are much more common. The puller design can also be low floor from the rear door of the middle section forward (like a lot of regional busses) and the towed rear section can be entirely low floor. I don't know if London is truly too tight for bendy busses, but double decker busses have long passenger exchange times at stops, that is why they are slowly being replaced in most places.

[@lillywho]

@@kilianortmann9979 drstevenrey was talking about having an engine in the front, you're talking about completely different things.

[@kilianortmann9979]

@@lillywho There is no bus with an engine mounted in the front, the most forward it can be, is as the rear axle of the front section i.e. middle axle.

[@MrOpenGL]

@@lillywho Take a look at the VanHool NewAG300. It is 100% low floor and has the engine mounted in the forward compartment, between the two forward axles. The rearmost axle is unpowered.

[@hypergolic8468]

Those that are saying "not invented here" as a failure reason, and why did they fail in the UK and nowhere else need to consider a couple of things. First off, in Europe many of the cities listed have trams, so corners are *generally* longer in turn radius and generally the stresses are less between units, as they are not running such tight turns. Then in most "historic" cities, there is only a small historic core, for the most time (especially in rebuilt post 1945 cities) the buses run on excellent roads with a good chance to cool and run with longer radius turns outside the city, and again don't put systems under stress as they turn. In London, as it's a huge amalgamation of villages, come towns roads which buses move between, slowly with acceleration and breaking, on a frequent basis. Each village has congestion, things to go around etc. As there are many large fleets of Mercedes buses and trucks in the UK which seem to do well and gain repeat orders year-in, year-out it would seem odd that it's down to "not invented here".

[@jimtaylor294]

Yup. Those commenting such blarney reek of apologism for the Banana-Buses, and their firey flaws 🤦‍♂️ .

[@rennohokwerda]

A minority of European cities have trams, and those that do have them, it's not like every single street has two sets of rails. Trams stick to certain routes, so every other street and crossing can be tight. Numerous European cities are amalgamations of villages, I dare say every big city is incorporating neighbouring villages in its expansion. Some cities buldozed boulevards through them, but so did London. I live in a city in the Netherlands (bike country) where curves are as tight as in London. Some pre-planned suburbs even had very tight corners designed on purpose (to slow down traffic) where the bendies do just fine. We even had double-articulated buses for a while pushing right through the heart of the historic core, no problem whatsoever. There were talks of a tram, for which some buildings on corners needed to be demolished, because the trams were to have a larger turning radius than the double-articulated buses. And I don't need to remind you that London itself had a blossoming tram network until after WWI.

[@hypergolic8468]

@@rennohokwerda Ok a couple of things, yes not every European City has trams, but then cities without tram's tend to be smaller (or have undergrounds) and again my point that buses are not running sizable distances with a high workload as they do in London. And yes, if only we'd kept tram systems and rail lines open, it was a great, great mistake in closing them. Most Dutch cities are very well planned (and have long term, plan lead strategies - the City of Rotterdam has had a zone plan for nearly a 100 years now) and the point is, there's good stretches of realigned roads going into most centres and suburbs with bus lanes too. And from experience on the Continent the routes tend to be planned as very much more direct, suburb to city centre, in the UK our bus routes tend to deviate frequently as they are set up to hit as many revenue points and not offer the speed of service you have offered. Engines on a London bus that are constantly cycling between acceleration, slowing down, stopping etc, for very long periods, I really do notice a difference between German / Swiss bus driving vs the traffic to London. So again, yes you may have tight corners, but, it's not the whole route. London is colossal, and yes it has improved roads, but if you look at them, the are not bus routes, they cut across or parallel to the actual bus routes. Again most the Dutch cities I can think of just don't have that problem, the some of the new roads are the ones used by the buses. As I say, I refuse to believe the "not invented here" argument, there is a major difference in what we ask buses to do, and I've stayed clear of how many hills London has on routes. If you really stand back and look at it, we import trucks and buses from across the World, as we're open to buying the best, but sometimes, some designs just don't seem to work. Maybe if we had better long term planning, a desire to fund public transport, or at least plan for it, in twenty year stretches rather than election-to-election, we'd happily run bendy buses and have the systems in place to make them work.

[@purplebrick131]

​@@hypergolic8468Consider Hamburg. Big city if you include the larger metropolitan area, long bus routes, no trams, and they also have tight turns. There's no reason these couldn't be properly implemented in London with more time for adjustments in stop design. They didn't give it enough time, that's my opinion. Also Bologna. Even tighter turns, no Tram.

[@PaulJaYmes]

I lived through this in London, and the commentary here is not entirely objective. Some of the issues mentioned were contrived or exaggerated when the bendies became a political football in the mayoral election of 2008. Many people didn't like them, that much is true, but they were cost effective and fast with short dwell times at stops - double deckers have to stop for longer to give passengers time to get off. The detractors were largely not bus passengers and many weren't even London residents.

[@karstent.66]

This bendy bus should be employed for the No. 20, Hemel - Watford. This route used to have a double decker, and is now often filled under the roof with people, so that the driver often can't stop anymore because the bus is full.

[@wainber1]

Bendy buses are surprisingly common around the world, at least in municipal public transport systems. It’s too bad the Citaros once used in Greater London didn’t survive more than a decade there, but still found new life elsewhere in the British Isles.

[@EuroDC1990]

Personally i quite liked these, i have fond memories of using them on the 73 to get between Kings Cross and Victoria. I'm not sure that London's streets were really to blame. As many others have said, they work perfectly well in other cities throughout the world with similar challenges. Perhaps the issue is that London has significantly higher levels of traffic than those cities, possibly it was wholly financial concerns or perhaps it's something else. Whatever it is though, i wish bendy buses were more common throughout the UK. They're much higher capacity than a standard single decker, and much more accessible than a double decker. Seems to me they should be highly practical in most situations.

[@mdhazeldine]

Let's face it. The "failure" of bendy buses in London was nothing to do with any inherent fault about bendy buses. I'm not even sure it was down to their unsuitability for London streets, because they operated just fine in other old city centres like Bath, and I've seen them work great in many European cities like Florence (which is VERY narrow). The fare evasion issues are offset by very fast boarding, and the new routemasters also have multiple doors, so I think that is just a non-issue (or one of implementation). The reliability seems like an issue with those particular models, and could have been overcome if we had bothered. I think the thing that really killed it was the media, because they jumped on it and kept putting out newspaper headlines about all the issues. Boris came along and saw a PR opportunity to do "something British" and get a replacement routemaster back on the streets. People just liked them for nostalgic reasons, and so it was an easy PR win for Boris to bring back the double-deckers.

[@captainevenslower4400]

Those darn foreign busses!

[@mdhazeldine]

@@captainevenslower4400 that could basically be a Sun headline. lol

[@poppyland74]

How is fare evasion 'offset' by faster boarding - presumably charging no fare would be even faster still? Does TfL not need money so long as its buses run to time? 8% evasion (as was quoted by TfL in 2010) was not sustainable and just on route 149 £1.5M was saved when it went back to standard operation.

[@mdhazeldine]

@@poppyland74 I didn't mean financially offset. I just meant faster boarding is a big pro, vs the con of fare dodging.

[@purplebrick131]

Thanks for saying this, because speaking from a continental perspective, this very much seems like British, or rather London exceptionalism to me. They work fine everynwhere, but can't work here for.. reasons. Those reasons also apply to like every other place on the continent, or could be avoided with some operating changes.

[@ErikssonTord_2]

Ive been driving bendy buses in Sweden for many years, and now we have those with two joints, thus around 24 meters long. They mainly drive on separate roads, with only trams interfering at certain points.

[@lillywho]

4:24 Correction on the photo used: what you pictured here is the Citaro2, a generational upgrade released about 20 years after the Citaro generation that was operating in London. The upgrades to the Citaro are thus: Original Citaro ↓ Citaro Facelift (a mild refresh) ↓ Citaro2 (often abbreviated as C2)

[@setusername8275]

Correction to your correction: The bus depicted at 4:24 is actually a Capacity L, which is technically a Citaro C2 G, but with 4 axles and more overhang between axle 2 and 3 at an overall length of 21 meters. But yeah, I'm nitpicking here.

[@lillywho]

@@setusername8275 Very much missing the point here on the generational misdepiction.

[@leylandlynxvlog]

Not to mention showing everything but a Fusion in London when talking about them.

[@davedear929]

This shows what an amazing bus the route master was. A brilliant financial investment for the capital.. hats off to the makers.

[@samcourteneyofficial2469]

Defiantly an iconic bus for sure, I loved travelling on them in the middle as it went around corners but not suited for London or Malta. One good use of them was in my home town of Norwich where they were employed on Park and Ride 604 which only stopped at limited places and could withstand the passenger numbers to and from the city center!

[@johnfletcher1036]

Having been a driver for TFL it was interesting that the bendy buses had to have a different diversion to the standard two axle busses

[@jackmartinleith]

Ah yes, route 622 - Oxford Circus to Erskine North Barr. What an epic journey that was!

[@leylandlynxvlog]

Would be fun in a Citaro G though

[@uingaeoc3905]

What I detested about these was the sheer lack of seats, not 49 but just 36. The capacity of 140 meant that you had a 2.5 out of 3 chance of standing for the entire journey.

[@darren25061965]

Similar problem where I live (also a bus driver), in an attempt to go "Green" many 44 seat single deckers were replaced with electric busses. They were about 1 Metre shorter but only had 28 seats. They were fantastic to drive when everything worked as intended, but it was rare to be able to complete your shift without taking the bus out of service and substituting a diesel vehicle.

[@tnetroP]

Let's face it, apart from disability access, the Routemaster was a brilliant design for London.

[@paultaylor7082]

The first place I saw Bendy Buses was Sheffield, then we got them in Manchester around 2005. They were only used on major, straight roads. However, they only lasted around a decade there, also they were a nightmare to overtake in traffic, due to their excessive length. They were obviously much dearer to buy and had poorer fuel consumption, as well as being more awkward to drive in city centre, due to their size.

[@eannamcnamara9338]

It's so odd I grew up in paris but now live in london. The Bus route i used most in Paris uses bendy buses with all door boardings and it's great! Weird to think it just didn't work in london

[@robt2151]

I worked with TfL at the time, introducing video technology for bus lane and yellow box junction enforcement. (One of 'my' cameras is visible at 01:09, below the destination board.) There were several busy locations where the bendy buses could not clear consecutive junctions, thereby adding to delays and congestion.

[@matthewrees4449]

I loved these buses as I rode the 521 route. They seemed so much more user friendly for the mad loading rush at London Bridge.

[@piers995]

Fascinating. As a Leicester lad though, I never saw any bendy busses here in the 2010s. There had been a couple of a different type trialled in the early 1990s. I don't think the ex London bendy busses ever made it into service here.

[@BrettCook]

They appeared on the University shuttle to and from city campus and Oadby Halls of Residence. Not sure when they left?

[@cyrilio]

I've visited Edinburgh many times in the past few years and can say I love how they've implemented and enlarged their tram network over this time. Don't know if a tram would work in London, but it certainly does in Edinburgh.

[@surii867]

There are trams in South London.

[@jimtaylor294]

There used to be Trams across most of London. It also had the only tram tunnel in the country that could handle DD Trams.

[@williamknighton727]

Ah the nostalgia - the bendy bus of the 29 used to be my chariot back to my digs in my student days! I greatly appreciated that payment was optional...

[@reddwarfer999]

Thief.

[@keithmcwilliams7424]

We have bendy buses in sydney they are great no problems we have small streets lots of hills and tight bends i love them regards from australia.😊

[@lordmuntague]

I've used the 501 between Liverpool South Parkway and Liverpool John Lennon Airport. The bendy buses were also used on some other fast routes between the city and the airport, and we still have the 500 as a double deck service today.

[@stuart2151]

I remember on the Shepherds Bush 207 route there used to be frequent arguments and frustration on the bus when paid passengers were so angry with the gits that never tapped when boarding and rightly so

[@macjim]

I remember (with affection ) when Stagecoach brought in the bendy buses on my route into Glasgow, from Cumbernauld. These were high floored buses due them being bases on coaches rather than those shown in this video. They did last long though as they, like the coaches, were difficult to access for the elderly and infirm (almost impossible for wheelchair users) so got replaced by low floored double deckers. I don’t think there’s any operator now, in Scotland, that use bendy buses now… all conventional buses or EV single and double decked buses. 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

[@GEODUCK9]

First in Aberdeen may well still do

[@fbezembinder]

Well i have to correct you there. Most of the time you are right and correct in your information and videos. The big problem with this batch is that they were underpowered because of wrong engine choice. A bus that is produced 70000 times and sold says something about the bus. The problem (as almost always in the UK) is that everything was done the wrong way and influenced by bad choices. 🤣🤣🤣

[@lupilu4567]

I remember, in 2009 outside Ilford Cineworld, one drunk man got stuck in the rear door and was dragged dead for a mile before noticed by the driver.. Those buses were huge and difficult to drive safely

[@leylandlynxvlog]

That is driver error though surely. Also they could have specified automatic doors like Berlin to alleviate such issues.

[@poppyland74]

@@leylandlynxvlog I hope it was driver error and not driver intent.

[@wendigo53]

8:00 That is a feat - bus completely burned, but nobody was injured. That's a safety superstar.

[@jonb3311]

It wasn't a Hollywood film with dozens of panicking extras.

[@jimtaylor294]

A real safety superstar never catches fire to start with 😂

[@katrinabryce]

In vehicle fire, there is a fair bit of time between the fire starting and it becoming dangerous, so there is plenty of time to get everyone out.

[@TheHoveHeretic]

The ex-London Citaros were employed in Brighton & Hove, on routes 25/ 25A (University - A270 Lewes Rd - City Centre - Palmeira Sq Hove). This is one of the straightest routes in a city initially built for a dirty weekend 250 years ago, which had issues with horse traffic. The principal issue with them here was the danger to cyclists and pedestrians within the vehicles' blind spots. It should be noted that the cycle lane 'network' here during the period Citaros were operating was most kindly described as 'embryonic'. It's improved *slightly* since, but until someone bites the bullet and does something about the manifold safety issues affecting roads, ain't going to be approaching standards found in The Netherlands any time soon. So far as successful operations in other historic cities, that throws up something I've commented on in other contexts .... the UK effectively has *no* standardised guidelines for urban highways (and not much better for anything below motorway standard). In my home city of Brighton & Hove (several old council fiefdoms knocked into a unitary authority a couple of decades ago), there is no rhyme or reason to junction (intersection) design and many are downright dangerous for cars alone, never mind HGV / PSV traffic. Perhaps look in that direction for explanations? I've become an advocate for adoption of Dutch style national guidelines to ensure best practice becomes the norm and I'd suggest the failure of 'bendy buses' lies within the appalling road 'design' employed across the UK. Not "law" as such, this Dutch initiative represents *guidelines for road design and road layout* (published by CROW) and enjoy a similar legal status to the UKs 'Highway Code', in that they can be cited as 'best practice' in legal scenarios. Anyone in the UK could identify any number of locations where roads are dangerous, with or without the presence of articulated buses, cyclists or even pedestrians. I'd urge anyone in the UK to check out the effects of standardised guidelines. There's much on KZbin alone, on 'urbanist' channels like 'Build the Lanes' and 'Not Just Bikes' which will serve as a great introduction, though I should warn you, it's very easy to become extremely annoyed with the glaringly obvious shortcomings of the UK's current approach, which is costing lives.

[@admiralateran2135]

As a HGV Driver myself I couldn't agree more, and the roads are getting even worse with these housing associations being allowed to make alterations to main A roads that are completely unfit for purpose just because they want to save money. One example on the A43 which is a busy trunk road has multiple lanes which cannot fit a vehicle larger than a car and suffers from a camber (which many of the roundabouts on this road around Corby suffer) which is dangerous for large vehicles if not navigated correctly.

[@finn6513]

@@TheHoveHeretic I can assure you as a Brighton & Hove driver who started out on the Artic Rota back in 2021 and drove them more or less until withdrawal here, bendy buses worked in Brighton very well. They used the same amount of road space as a 12 metre bus did even when turning, made the job a lot quicker and from a drivers point of view were some of my favourite buses to drive! The Citaro was built with drivers in mind for sure. I’ve taken them around some pretty interesting turns with not much more hassle than a double decker, (the time I did left hand turn from Roedean Road into Wilson Avenue in a bendy comes to mind) and artic training runs often were spotted in the wider Sussex area (I met a bendy bus on training in Hurstpierpoint High Street once, it had no trouble getting through!). I never had an issue with blind spots, I felt the blind spots in a bendy bus was equal to that in a double decker. However seeming you mention cyclists, there are a minority that seem to have no road sense and put themselves into dangerous situations, however they do this with double deckers as well as the bendy busses, so I feel it would be unfair to hold this against the buses. And again the majority of takeaway delivery moped riders also seem to be so focused on their delivery they often put themselves into some really dangerous scenarios with large vehicles when wizzing through traffic, so the problem is certainly not just limited to the bendy buses but people’s attitudes when driving in general. We were told the reason the Citaros were being withdrawn was due to the decline in ridership as a result of Covid-19, how wrong they were! The majority of the bendy buses were withdrawn in the August and come the new term in September the double deck replacement couldn’t cope (and I believe still doesn’t!). The other reason was fuel consumption. Double deckers could manage 8-10 miles per gallon fully loaded where bendy buses couldn’t manage more than 4 miles per gallon, however with the withdrawal of bendy buses the amount of double decks used has increased which has most likely offset that saving alongside the wage costs associated with extra bus drivers to drive them. Ultimately, just as was the case in London, the reason for their withdrawal was political. Just like Johnston, the boss of Brighton & Hove buses was said to be against them, and therefore got rid! In the right scenario bendy buses are a perfectly good option such as the 205 in London or the 25 in Brighton, however politics has got in the way.

[@oojimmyflip]

The bendy bus lives on in York on the park a ride system and it's streets are just as narrow.

[@tonymcmahon_historybear]

We called the 436 bendy bus the "free bus" because nobody was paying their fares in south London. You could literally see people ignoring the 36 and 185, waiting for the 436.

[@SteveReggie]

It should be noted that Routemaster double decker buses required two employees per bus, a driver and a conductor. Bendy buses eliminated the conductor. But you need occasional fare inspectors to make sure riders were paying before they entered.

[@ModMokkaMatti]

If only Britain had a transportation design and manufacturing industry of its own... 🤔

[@senseofthecommonman]

Having driven these for a while I must say having 140 passengers onboard used to make me very aware of the responsibility I and all psv drivers have.

[@angelsone-five7912]

I was driving a Routemaster in London one night and was accosted by a bendy bus driver who was lost, I offered to lead him but warned that a certain part of my route was tight, "Anywhere you can go in that I can go" , he said - he got stuck!

[@robpalwrites]

I used to live in London between 2004 and 2011, so took the bendy bus regularly along the Unthank Road, as I lived along the 207 route. I never knew of these problems, so only have good memories about this bus.

[@highpath4776]

The Red Arrow Route Artics worked very well , biggest change needed was access to stops - of which they had fewer on the road than most routes of similar length

[@NJRD977]

I used the 521 route from London Bridge and Chancery Lane pre, during and post their service - they were great for that route bringing better capacity, fast entry and exit, and key for rush hour transport - plenty of places to hold on while standing. Outside of rush hour, they were always comfortable to ride on while seated. for a while I would see them on the route 25 down here in Brighton and Hove and still found them to be a nice bus to ride on.

[@john1703]

The Bendy-bus is not suitable for old cities with narrow streets and sharp corners. Manchester made the same mistake. Like many rear-engined double deckers, not having the radiator at the front (like the Titan or Olympian) is a mistake which leads to overheating.

[@lukfi89]

Other cities use rear-engined buses in heavy traffic and they do not overheat. When a bus catches fire, it's not because the engine overheated, but because fuel pipes were leaking fuel onto the hot engine. It is either a design issue or a manufacturing defect. And when it happens, it affects both standard and articulated versions of the same bus.

[@jaysmith1408]

They’ve certainly gotten the hang of rear engined buses, i can’t think of a front engine bus that’s not on a truck chassis. Also figure these are daimler buses. I’ve never driven a daimler product except for freightliners, but they run very hot, and built fairly cheaply. No self respecting driver will pick one, given a choice.

[@Driftbus.Productions.official]

Matstuff: lean and bop lean. And bop aughhhhhh bus.

[@Alfiebusvideos]

Great video. It helped me with a bit more context regarding the citaros. Ct plus in Bristol had a fare few ex London citaros that were gone by 2017 but all those ones still survive alongside some more ex London citaros, scanias and Wright streetcars in Filton Airfield. I saw an ex London bendy citaro in September.

[@davideddy5877]

Southampton had bendy buses for a short while but traffic-calming humps apparently disagreed with them

[@nupnorth]

We had the same problem in our city. If the humps are in the right shape, they slow the cars without damaging buses. Our council have sorted it out now.

[@danangus9]

Some corners also. Burgess Rd junction with Hill Lane I remember was one that got clipped more than once!

[@IBlameHR-z9p]

I miss them. There was something fun about getting on a bendy bus and sitting at the back of the bus. There were bendy buses in Manchester from 1999 to 2017, similarly York had them in the 2000s upto 2023. It seems quite a lot of UK cities had them in the 2000s. Shame they're gone but it is understandable why... frequent breakdowns, difficult manoeuvring, quite slow, and expensive maintenance to keep them running. It's not just corners but these things struggled on hills as well.

[@reddwarfer999]

We had them in Leeds in the 80s for a short while. Definately a novelty to sit at the back and watch the front of bus disappear from view.

[@batman51]

I used to catch the 436 from Paddington - I liked to sit in the front seat and admire the drivers' skill. Happily mine never caught fire.

[@eddiereece1827]

Ended up being recycled to Brighton as the route doesn’t have much curves

[@jace8118]

They were only ever used on one route, and all eventually retired in October 2022.

[@Gideonsmythe]

The problem wasn't the buses themselves. They were unpopular because they replaced the much loved Routemaster, had fewer seats and were wholly inappropriate on some of the routes they were placed on. The 207 for example was perfect, as were many trunk suburban routes. But political short-termism meant that instead of reallocating them away from unsuitable routes, the Mayor decided to remove them all because of his beloved new Routemaster, thus making "the Bendies" a total waste of money. The new Routemasters have thankfully settled-down and are popular with commuters but they are also slowly being moved out of central London to be replaced by electric vehicles. This is how our taxes are wasted. On politician's good ideas that no amount of warnings from experts can stop. See the omni-shambles of Boris' Brexit for further details.

[@stewartclark2137]

I once sat on the rearward facing back seat of a new routemaster. When stopped at the Elephant and Castle one mid afternoon more than twenty people took the rear stairs with only one tapping in. It took a long time to restore 'pass the driver. The unsolvable delay problem in big Citys is the single stairway double decker when at all crowded, with the need to accomodate all comers. One of my last regular 'bus trips is by 36 between Peckham and Paddington. Twice recently the journey has been in excess of 90 minutes, plus waiting. Being not very mobile the through journey is best for me, but in times past and cutting off the corners I could have walked in that time. The 'bus passenger deserves better.

[@williamcater6271]

I recall riding on these buses all the time, especially the 453 from Marylebone to Deptford and back again (I was working in a pub at the time). I always paid my fare with my Oyster Card, but so many people never did. Pulling up after midnight on Oxford Circus or Trafalgar Square, everyone at the bus stops would run for the middle or rear doors as they were driver operated only, and at that time no ticket inspectors would dare to board a bus with over 90% of the passengers who were fare dodging, especially on a weekend after the pubs had cleared. My favourite journey though was a lunchtime journey on my way to work. I jumped on the bus on the Old Kent Road, tapped my Oyster Card and sat down. The bus must have had about 50 people on it. Two stops after I boarded, I noticed the card readers all switched off. As we came into view of the next stop, the Police and Transport for London had set-up a small tent/gazebo structure. All but me and a woman with her shopping trolley, started trying to tap their Oysters against the now non-operating card readers. After the bus pulled away, the bus was missing around 48 passengers. It was just me and the woman with her shopping trolley on the bus.

[@cesarchoya6961]

Red Double Decker buses are a symbol of London and always should be.

[@NewCityMedia]

They were nice vehicles for passengers, except I recall their ability to get very warm. They should never have allowed boarding from the middle and back doors though. Fare dodging was rife and yet Tfl did not learn from this mistake and the New Routemasters suffered in the same way for years until front door only boarding was introduced.

[@orchidhouse297]

York City , in Yorkshire UK……😂 worked well except where unthinkable stupid parking took up road space essentially needed on corners.

[@Weegiegreek]

Only reason these went was because everyone bunked them

[@highpath4776]

more specifically Boris Johnson

[@Weegiegreek]

@highpath4776 exactly

[@BCrossing]

They are more risky for cycles it's true. But so are trucks and they're allowed. Everything is a balance I suppose

[@GreatSageSunWukong]

I loved the free buses

[@Alan-ln3ls]

The open rear platform could certainly be a safety issue: twice I have seen somebody come to grief trying to board after the bus had started moving; both fell flat on their faces, one on the bus platform, the other on the road. Alighting was also hazardous: at Morden somebody jumping from a still-moving bus (an RT, not RM) slammed straight into a concrete bus stop post, the result being a jammy mess. Yet most people behaved responsibly and got along just fine with the open platforms.

[@cassesque]

Lots of people here saying they 'worked fine' elsewhere. They didn't. They were still hazards to cyclists, took up road space, and reduced throughput at tight junctions. They were withdrawn from Leicester and in Malta they caused an absolute nightmare. The Maltese public transport network took years to recover. This should be immediately obvious to anyone who has ever driven in Malta and has seen a bendy bus.

[@marychapman6553]

I used to ride route 25 on these when I was working. One morning there was a terrible accident in Leadenhall Street and the police asked the driver of the 25 I was on to divert. He said he couldn't as the bus would get stuck in the narrow streets in the City of London. So we drove past , in full view, where a moped driver had collided with a John Lewis van, and was being attended to. The other incident was by Holborn Tube station, where four roads meet. A bendy bus had got stuck trying to turn on the junction going up Southampton Row. The driver was in a panic and everyone was sounding their horns, which didn't help. A black cab driver got out and helped him by giving directions and the bus eventually moved off. Those buses were completely unsuitable for central London, particularly in the City of London as the streets are narrow. When they pulled up at the bus stop they would tilt towards the pavement and on a wet day, with a slippery floor, it was quite hazardous boarding, especially if the bus was full. One last point they were a fare dodger's paradise.

[@imjusthereeatingpopcorn5234]

I think a double deck bendy bus with a slightly shorter wheelbase could be quite viable one day in the future

[@georgH]

There are plenty of smaller and tighter cities that use them successfully

[@mewosh_]

Meanwhile goddam Bratislava, Slovakia has double articulated bendy buses

[@leylandlynxvlog]

What kind?

[@CFRTrainSpotter]

​@@leylandlynxvlogSolaris Trollino 24 i believe. a version with Škoda electric equipment runs in Prague from the airport to Veleslavin station.

[@keahnig164]

Many cities in Switzerland use double-articulated HESS buses

[@radicaledwards3449]

So they create the congestion charge, then they bring in a bus that takes up double the road space........

[@MichaelBurggraf-gm8vl]

I'm living in a rural part of South Germany with a couple of towns and villages along a main route. The articulated buses are used on some main lines because the lines with more difficult topology don't have enough passengers and actually there are some streets which are a serious challenge for such a long vehicle. However they pass the centres of both, Ravensburg and Weingarten - but certainly not through the more narrow streets. That kind of busses is in use here for several decades now and I've never heard of issues with burning vehicles - despite South Germany experiencing quite a few very hot days or even weeks with temperatures well above 30 Celsius degrees from time to time.

[@drstevenrey]

And another one: Enter at the front, pay fare, exit in the back. How hard can it be. Oh, it's Britain, so very very hard. You really are the only ones who can't bus, worldwide.

[@poppyland74]

Dwell times would then be much longer. Fine if you are in a regional centre but not efficient if you are running a transport network in a capital city. Plus those living in London no longer know how to line up so it would be a scrum at the single entrance door.

[@RANDOMZBOSSMAN1]

My childhood there living in SE London had a lot of experience with Bendy buses in London with the 436 453 12 and even the 149 Loved standing in the middle lol

[@rjjcms1]

I've never been on a bendy bus,but that would have been the interesting place to sit/stand!

[@RANDOMZBOSSMAN1]

@ they were so fun as a child I loved to stand in between the two buses the centre circle would move during turns and that was so much fun The 453 was nicknamed the four-five-free due to how easy it was to dodge fares on bendy buses I used to see inspectors in Peckham/Camberwell Green/Elephant and castle and Westminster all the time specifically for these buses (this wasn’t an issue for me as I was using the 11-16 Oyster card at the time unless I forgot my Oyster card at home then those buses were my best friend lol) my sister who used to come home from uni during these times used to love the 436 for being great value (free lol) for money

[@pontiouspilotman]

Yes and then the IOM transport were stupid enough to try them out with the restricted roads on the Island!

[@demonx995]

Interesting how Citaros are a staple of many cities in Germany and bendy buses are absolutely normal in cities everywhere in mainland Europe... many of them would seriously struggle without them...

[@AdrianLee-ho1ds]

Many of those cities have wide avenues and boulevards. Few of them have nearly 8 million residents, 10 million commuters and many millions of cars and trucks using the roads daily.

[@jonb3311]

Many German cities have the benefit of being rebuilt recently. London has had much the same roads for hundreds of years.

[@MonopodMan]

Here's one for Jago Hazzard to cover on his channel

[@musicbyimpulse]

I thought this was a Jago video when i first saw the thumbnail and title.

[@RealMagmaDash]

jago is better because he actually talks instead of using an ai voice

[@MonopodMan]

@RealMagmaDash I’m pretty sure that is Ruariadh’s actual voice

[@musicbyimpulse]

@RealMagmaDash Its Ruariadh’s real voice, I think he just compresses it so it sounds more like a old documentary, there are videos where his voice sounds less compressed.

[@RealMagmaDash]

@musicbyimpulse oh. it's really jarring imo but i guess it's not that bad in that case

[@MrJimheeren]

Amsterdam has been using Citaro busses for years and somehow they always run reliable and never burn down randomly (we now have electric VDLs) so maybe English maintenance crews are just bad at their jobs

[@TheAviationChannel]

There was a citaro bendy bus that went on fire on its delivery trip. I think london’s bendy bus were slightly modified and shorter than the default bendy buses from Mercedes at the time. Probably didn’t test the vehicle properly before selling to TFL bus companies

[@CheeseAlarm]

I never had much cause to use the bendy buses, I had a train/ tube commute at the time. But going back a few years I used to hate routemasters, and never understood the fetishisation of them they were so uncomfortable, and being so old they were always breaking down.

[@leylandlynxvlog]

Try driving one. Some what fun on a clear road, but compared to modern buses the brakes aren't as good plus it's freezing in the winter. Great in the summer I'd imagine (but I only drove them in winter).

[@ReplayButtonMolester]

Sometimes, I'd like to think the ability for passengers to sneak into the bendybus was ruined by this one guy who shouted it was the 'worst free bus ride he's ever had'.

[@anthonykoller4459]

I used to ride to work on a bendy bus and being on the back of the bendy bus was an experience when the bus driver was in a hurry 😮

[@rjjcms1]

Could just imagine it being like that in one on a skid pan?

[@jamest2401]

I think we need some of the “Big Bus” models from the 1976 eponymous ‘disaster-flick’ genre parody film. If memory serves, the behemoth bus was named ‘Cyclops’. Naturally, she was nuclear-powered, she had a piano-furnished cocktail lounge, a swimming pool, a bowling alley, a squash court, a sushi bar and, of course, a kitchen and full-service dining room with maître d'.😂🤣 It was an absurd concept for a ludicrously silly movie, but I think 1976’s “The Big Bus” does actually have the distinction and honor of being the very first comedy ‘disaster film’ spoof. The “70’s Disaster Flick” genre was kicked-off in 1970, with the first film in the ‘Airport’ franchise, so, by 1976, it was about time someone began to poke fun around their edges.