Cruelty is not Sadism: Narcissism, Not Pleasure

Cruelty is not the same as sadism. Sadism is the art of pain: gratification, pleasure, creativity. It is often coupled with masochism which is self-punitive (bad object). Cruelty is self-regulatory and narcissistic:
In the wake of mortification (public shaming and humiliation)
Intended to restore grandiose, inflated self-perception because it is unnecessary and excessive, a choice, an expression of dominance and control (coercion). It causes elation (Grunberger), but not pleasure.
Sustains a narrative of retributive justice (quid pro quo, eye for an eye (lex talionis): competitive, grandiose, entitled victimhood
Requires the cooperation of the victim: an admission of vulnerability, hurt, damage, pain. A kind of shared fantasy.
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[@mariagomes8981]

Isn't it what Israel is doing to Palestinians?

[@samvaknin]

Yes. Both parties are committing war crimes and crimes against humanity.

[@Seibellagiugiu]

Look at the definition of war crimes. Israel didn’t go into Gaza raping women and parading their naked bodies wearing GoPros. Israel didn’t burn people alive. I challenge you to show me one instance in the past 10 years of Israelis doing this to Sunis. Btw, did you realize that Hamas is backed by Shia. Shias DON’T like Arabs. One less Arab to a Shia is good for Islam to them. They hate each other. So, why do the Shia pay for Sunis to sacrifice themselves. Ah, because they aren’t sacrificing their own people. I was married to an Arab. They teach their kids to hate the Jews in primary school.

[@Seibellagiugiu]

@@katzefeli7959 No, people who confuse the two have no historical or cultural understanding. In Book 54, Hadith 103”…a stone would say: Muslim, here is a Jew behind me, come and kill him.” The purpose of Hamas and Iran is to eradicate the Jews. What did Nazi Germany want do? Try to Eradicate the Jews. Do you believe in the Nazis should have killed Jews in the Holocaust? Arabs don’t even believe in the Holocaust. They believe and are taught it is a hoax made up by the West. Do the Jewish texts in the Torah, Tanakh, Mishnah, or Talmud have any statements that say go out and kill the Arabs or Shia?. NO! Because the Muslim religious texts say you will be blessed by God and erase your sins to kill a Jew, of course people want to kill Israelis.

[@gneggisje6503]

@@gracemissouri1146 What? When are you born? Yesterday? check your sources. No one knows exactly when it all started. The problem has existed at least since the collapse of the Roman Empire.

[@yyc246]

@@gneggisje650375 years Israel is torturing Palestinians and taking away lives, their land, rights, and freedom of movement. It’s an open air prison. In this day and age we’re watching a live genocide taking place and yet the UN still refuses to condemn Israel act.

[@webclips9117]

"The fear of losing loved ones makes us human." Narcissist always say to us, they don't fear losing anybody.

[@14jemima]

Even when mortified, I've never ever dreamt of revenge. My only reaction is an impulsive urge to disappear. Yet, it is accompanied by the thought that the world doesn't deserve me, which, as you said before, is a narcissistic defense mechanism (meant to restore self-esteem, the way I see it).

[@samvaknin]

Watch my videos on mortification. There are two types of reaction: internal and external.

[@SEThatered]

I never gave a thought about the difference between the two. But it does make sense. Both inflict suffering and/or pain, but: Cruelty stems from anger and seething. Sadism stems from twisted enjoyment. Thank you Sam. You helped me explain me to myself.

[@SEThatered]

@@beachlife4346 oh absolutely. They are not mutually exclusive.

[@leahj361]

Thank you, professor, for providing this enlightening information. A narcissist I was in a relationship with framed the abuse (degrading/berating me, controlling my every movement, including when I could eat and use the bathroom) as a “solution” to the “problem.” He is a self-styled “male feminist,” who attended support groups for rape victims after I left him. He recruited many flying monkeys there, including female academics, to aid him in his smear campaign wherein I was defamed as his abuser. I lost all faith in institutions that were supposedly set up to help someone in my situation. This was actually good for me in the long run, as I did not make a spectacle of my suffering, defended myself only when absolutely necessary, and quietly moved on. This video confirms what I felt at the time, which was that the only way out was to play dead, give as little response as possible. He eventually left me alone, and was later sent to a mental hospital for stalking another woman.

[@Loloy587]

Aka the true nature of my parents’ relationship and its subsequent effect on me. Thanks Sam for bringing this distinction to light.

[@Loloy587]

@@RebeccaJane-yb1uw Thanks! I can say that listening to these talks regularly has sped things up quite a bit!

[@chrystalcognition200]

I wish you all the best, down in the epicenter of the World right now. During to this conflict I m, "just" a Swede. I can't tell or choose, between onces evil or griefs, for whom its worse. To me, you all humans, that lives during dark times of our time, and I would love to see, a peaceful solution in the best way for all. We need you all, apart of nationality, nor religion, for all reasons. I wish, the best to you, prof Vaknin, and all of all others, whom shares the same holy grounds of The holy Land.🙏

[@davekumarr]

Thank you Samaharishi, for yet another informative & enjoyable presentation. I take the difference you brought up here to be important. Ironing out this interesting subject properly for myself is useful. Report: Im still having difficulty in definitively distinguishing the two - Sadism VS Cruelty. Question / Request: Could you please follow up this presentation with another one - in order to clarify this subject further - with some solid examples/ real event examples / or hypothetical examples to help highlight / point out the actual differences definitively? Id really appreciate it very much. Thanks again Sir.

[@dilfuzakhaydarova2859]

Thank you so much Dear Professor Sam Vaknin ❤

[@vandolmatzis8146]

Fascinating as always Prof.I was wondering about martyrdom?Is it masochism or a kind of inverted cruelty.

[@samvaknin]

It is grandiosity-driven externalized aggression. A reaction to shame or humiliation, in most cases.

[@user-ex2bo1wy3s]

God bless you ! I pray that you stay safe 🙏

[@evelyngarrison6007]

Where is the line between restoring "grandiose"moral order and wanting to stop war crimes and atrocities (killing of children/civilians)? Also, when it comes to smear campaigns, would you say that short of an unequal revenge fantasy, restoring justice is only human (therefore undeserving of the term "grandiose")?

[@stigmarus]

Cruelty… The Master (the Victor) and The Slave (the Vanquished)..

[@sonjabreuer1470]

What would you say about cruelty to animals in order to eat them?

[@carlosmunoz3089]

better than sadism related to sport hunting

[@sonjabreuer1470]

@@carlosmunoz3089 I am not sure about that. Because cognitive dissonance about the mass concentration camp life conditions of the animals extends much further than the joy of killing (if that exists, probably does - but it's beyond me). In theory, skilled hunting would entail a happy life and dropping dead at the end. That's the case made for slaughtering units to come to the farm and avoid the horrendous animal transports into slaughter houses, even aboard sometimes to the Middle East. Can you imagine traveling like that and for what? But the problem with hunting is injury, blood thirsty chases, and hunters coming close to the house and killing domestic animals (in Spain anyways). The Guardian wrote an article that mass farming is the worst crime of this century. You need to look into detail into the animal food chain to understand this. The world population has doubled since the 70ties. We kill 8x the animal population for our food (most of us do). The appetite for meat is an addiction. There is not enough vegetable feed to feed these animals and it's very inefficient to feed the veg to the animal and then eat the animal. Better to feed the human directly with the vegetables. So to solve the problem vegetables are made GMO which kills and ruins the planet as the eco system of the soil is depleted and requires pesticides and fertilisers which run into the waterways (as they are water soluble and don´t stay in the ground as with ecological production). But GMO vegetables cause cancer in laboratory tests. There is a EU law that if GMO then Label, but the fines are low and don´t extend to GMO fed meat (fluffy animals, dead state) and to animal feed. So your pet food for fluffy doggy and lovely cat also contains GMO and hence the vetenary industry benefits. Actually there is a percentage decrease in cancer for vegetarians, I think it was 15% and I would say vegan its even higher. Apart from that, it's more than heart breaking to see innocent animals who are supposed to be free by design get enslaved, mistreated, abused and slaughtered. One wants to jump out of this world, but then that doesn't help anybody, does it?

[@sonjabreuer1470]

In fact, it should be argued that eating flesh of animals for pleasure is quite selfish, plus add all the appropriate psychological terms - when other food grows and is available.

[@brentwood7660]

Maybe you could point me to an answer but can you contrast Narcissistic elation from idk universal elation? Thanks for the topic.

[@samvaknin]

Narcissistic elation is related to narcissistic defenses and behaviors such as obtaining narcissistic supply or restoring or buttressing grandiosity.

[@snezanajuricevic1000]

Hello from Serbia🇷🇸 🇷🇸 🇷🇸❤❤❤ Thank you dear Sam Vaknin for everything, you are so clever and brave to tell the all 🌎 your opinion about global situation on first place, the second, for opened our minds about this topics, thank you so much ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤be blessed 🙌 Bravo 👏 👏 👏

[@Dorotea0111]

In the enumeration of the many war horrors and the suffering of civilians mainly in the 20th century, the crimes in the Independent State of Croatia against Serbs, Jews and Roma stand out especially for their sadism. The Germans in their concentration camps developed a gruesome and brutal industry of death, but the Croats in their camps, the largest of which was Jasenovac, in addition to the enormous number of murders, developed an extremely sadistic way of killing their victims that was incomprehensible even to the Germans.

[@MrHermanndagerman]

Great

[@gneggisje6503]

23:44 🤔Someone who suffers from traumatic amnesia will usually deny being a victim of a grievance, the perpetrator will there fore not stop being cruel, or ...? I don't understand that and another thing I do not understand: persons which broke with their whole family to escape their torturer will never be able to coexist with her /him but a masochist coexist with the sadist. Or is sadomasochism complete different?

[@diederikmajoor1019]

Very interesting😢

[@5EmBem]

Yes, I feel really guilty about some of the things I said to the malignant nex during reactive abuse. I said them so he would leave, it didnt work and he wouldn't leave even when I asked all those times either. I don't believe the cruelty he inflicted on to our children were part of a shared fantasy. Some of what he did however seemed pre-meditated and thought out so only he knows if its sadism or cruelty 🤔

[@trekker3468]

Can a simple physical smile on the part of narcissist represent narcissistic elation after an event?

[@samvaknin]

It could.

[@trekker3468]

@samvaknin Thank you sir.

[@dlzn.5146]

Thank you so much for the clear words on the terrible atrocities that the terrorists have brought over the jewish people, our hearts are bleeding... We must take sides!

[@user-uc1oy3zk4t]

I hope that the only people left on the holylands are those seeking their holy wars, for it's in their identity to keep that war going forever, like a happy sadomasochistic couple. I feel sorry for the peace seeking Palestinian and Israelis trapped there. You are welcomed to join the Muslim and Jewish communities of Latin America that have no trouble coexisting peacefully, because Latinos are semitic by blood and culture.

[@Accentric_jewellery]

Erm, no